/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

[Anonymous No.]

*doesn't get the Matrix'

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
Didn't they retcon it so it was supposedly about trannies now

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
rural shork brain too small plz understand

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
I had some issues as well, though I was battling my internet connection during the first half of the movie. Think I got it and so did Gura.

[Anonymous No.]

The movie was a lot better when I watched it 20 years ago...

[Anonymous No.]

ngmi

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
I also didn’t get it in my first time
If you were in /ggg/, I was the anon who asked what was so bad about staying in the Matrix
Watching it a second time and asking the thread, I understood everything

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
>tranny directors come out as trannies however many years after the movie's release
>however many years later, hates that RIGHTWINGCHUDINCELS are using the movie's theme(s) as a lodestone for social commentary
>uhh, uh, th- the pills are actually hormone pills!
Mental illness.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9153835
Yea, sometimes the authors change too much and we too unreliable for their own works that, as much as I hate to use it "death of the author" is a reasonable thing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9153835
the red ones change you though

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
it's not a simple movie..
people are still debating about it over 20 years later. it doesn't help that even the tranny writers don't know what the fuck they wanted.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9153835
>>9152904
>>9153944
>>>/pol/
Fuck off to your containment board.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154204
>people are still debating about it
The only thing debated are the shitty sequels. The first movie is pretty straight forward.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
It was intended to be a Jesus allegory at the time

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
It's stupid for a director to go "this is what my movie was about btw", but the interpetation does work. The point is about escaping a false reality even if the real world is painful, and that at least fits how trannies think about themselves, although it also fits a lot of other things.
Helps when there's stuff like how Switch was originally intended to be female in the matrix and male outside it, which is a pretty heavy handed metaphor (hence the "not in this body" line when they die inside it), or Neo getting angry about being addressed by his birth name instead of the one he picked.
Basically: it's always worked, but a director has no right to control people's interpretations (nor do any creators. People get out of your work what they get out of it.) so if you read it differently then good, that's your interpretation who gives a shit what the creator said outside the movie itself.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154211
>>>/lgbt/

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154211
/lgbt/ is the containment board.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155622
/pol/ was directly made to contain far right shit after any other news/politics board ended up devolving into it anyway. That's basic site history.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9153835
lol, why are they so hypocritical? they're alike, unhappy with this shitty reality.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9156166
'Other people arent allowed to be unhappy with this shit reality because its their fault that it's shit'

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155991
>basic site history

The only type of person who would dare to say this is someone who is literally looking up a fucking article on ED assuming it still exists lmao. Shut up and lurk, newfaggot.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155991
Also

>telling trannies to fuck off
>far right

You being a fucking weirdo doesn't make what was the normal viewpoint of 99.9% of humans 10 years ago into a far right view, you fucking deranged lunatic.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9156510
I'm not the anon you're replying to and I didn't say transphobia was far-right, just that /pol/ was made to contain far-right shit. Obviously far-right is going to contain most moderate-right views and some centrist ones as well.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9156826
Not all people who hate troons are right wingers though. I am left on most issues and troons fucking disgust me on every level.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9156953
I mean sure, no issue is actually categorized along stark lines like that. There's trans right wingers too who are fine with that and agree with right wing points on everything else. The main point was that "you don't have to be far-right to hate trannies" and "/pol/ is objectively a containment board for far right views" aren't contradictory.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155016
Based and Barthespilled.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
To answer your question before the thread gets nuked, Gura is dumb af please understand.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155016
thank you sane and reasonableposter

[Anonymous No.]

>>9157358
>4chan right wingers hate trannies
>/pol is containment board
>tits or gtfo
>mods are asleep
>doxx
>faggots
>niggers
>(you)
Do you even understand how gatekeeping on a free anonymous imageboard works?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9157489
tbf a lot of women don't get the movie. Girl I watched it with way back didn't get it either, neither did my mom and sister. They thought it was some sort of dream sequence or cyber magic. My dad and friends immediately got it.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155016
It "works" in the same way you can say Jurassic Park was really about the failures of Capitalism.

[Anonymous No.]

/vt/ - LGBT

[Anonymous No.]

>>9157757
I haven't seen that since I was a kid, but doesn't it have multiple plot points that boil down to "corporate greed leads to problems that fuck over everyone, including the greedy themselves"? Sounds like it could work to me.
The only thing that matters in my eyes is if you can have the text support it (which includes that the text doesn't contradict it, of course).

[Anonymous No.]

>>9157989
No, the movie is about don't fuck with nature or it'll try kill you, your friends, and your family.

[Anonymous No.]

>there are those born after the Matrix

[Anonymous No.]

A shame it killed the action genre by being too good.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9158043
everything was going great until nedry fucked everything up

[Anonymous No.]

>>9158073
>There are people here who were born after Terminator 2

[Anonymous No.]

>>9158687
>There are people here who were born

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
That's because Gura has a good head on her shoulders. There's nothing to get, it was always just puddle depth western anime.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154211
No left snowflake

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154317
there were literal books written about it before the sequels came out and gave us a bunch of shitty answers. the chosen one story line was simple and easy for causal viewers to eat up but he lore and mystery behind the world was really revolutionary(at least in the pop sci world).

[Anonymous No.]

>>9158043

There is literally a cliched greedy lawyer character who spends all his time talking about how much money they're gonna make before he abandons children to dinosaurs and then gets eaten while crying on a toilet

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
To be fair, neither do the Wachowskis.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
What was there to even get? It explains everything that's happening at all times.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9159386
>Nature doesn't care about your lawyerings

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
Based MacFarlane did a whole bit about about how the brothers who did The Matrix are ladies now.

You practically need an ID to play games made before 2000 if that bit of pop culture trivia was pre you.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9159301
Yeah they threw a lot of easter eggs in there, but I think people confuse that for depth.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154211
>hating trannies automatically makes you /pol/
Kill yourself, retard.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155016
Switch doesn't say it quite as explicit as "not in this body", she says "Not like this". I still kinda wonder about the truth of Switch's character, because by all means it sounds like something which would've been done, which just makes you wonder who exactly told the Wachowskis "no" on that idea, it's not like it would've been the most controversial thing in the world, nor is it like The Matrix isn't already kind of an adult movie.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
Although there's a lot of messiah symbolism, much of it is vague enough to be applicable to lots of groups.
I mean, it's basically a reverse isekai: boring cubical drone is taken to another world where he realises he has amazing powers, except the other world is the real one and he'd been living in a fake one all this time. It appeals to any demographic that feels disenfranchised or alienated by contemporary societal norms.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9159386
>>9158043
it can be both

[Anonymous No.]

>>9159927
"Not like this" could've as easily have meant wanting to die fighting and not in a way that makes them feel helpless or betrayed by their own kind.
Plus it just feels weird if one person does it and no one else does. Cypher has no problems living in a fantasy world experiencing the best it has to offer and yet when given the opportunity to have any body he wants he decides he wants to be portrayed as a scrawny bald guy?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9153835
My friend has been a big matrix fan since it came out, and based on these tranny declarations did an investigation about it. Don't lump the "sisters" together. Besides the dominatrix thing (look it up), Lana was the actual brain of the movie. Lilly always leeches of the capabilities of Lana. You can see on extra content interviews how Lana discusses philosophy while Lilly goes like "uhh yeah" and shit like that. He also found that Lilly is connected to urban radical leftist associations financed by Rockefeller and other such things.

tl;dr: Lilly Wachowsky is the cancer killing matrix

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160221
Yeah, that's exactly what I mean, the actual line Switch does give is more generic, and the way you described it is always the way I interpreted it. Morpheus does outright say something about how the way you appear in The Matrix is your "residual self image" and is a mental projection of your "digital self" which is why when they go into The Matrix, they seem to have different haircuts and no holes etc. Theoretically it would be possible for someone with a residual self image totally different to what they actually look like in the real world to appear completely different in The Matrix, but that's just theoretical because as far as I know no character actually explores that concept that far. Perhaps Switch was supposed to be that exploration, but it's impossible for us to know if that "Switch was originally a genderswapper" story is actually the truth or if there's more to it than that.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160298
The retcon is bad because it doesn't explain anything and actually makes the movie worse in that context. It would've made more sense if they said it was about slave rebellion. It takes a movie about breaking free from systems of control to be outside of the system and using/bending its own rules to control the system back and instead turns it into gender transitioning. It's like saying Superman is about a gay man hiding his homosexuality from the world.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160562
Death of the author anon

[Anonymous No.]

>>9154211
you will never be a real woman

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160562
Watch the interviews in the extra materials. Matrix depth clearly was a philosophically work, mostly inspired by Ken Wilber (buddhism), goa trance culture and psychodelics, Plato's cave, antirrealists like Derrida, goth scene,works like Ghost in the Shell, Neuromancer...

Lilly said the tranny shit for clout and virtue signaling, "she"'s a mediocre bitch that tries to replicate Lana's success and also poisoned her mind along with the dominatrix thing

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160360
>>9160562
If they had been more apparent in the Switch theory, Cypher could have hilariously been painted as a traitor because he was CIS (comfortable in skin), sabotaging their "freedom" simply because the world was acceptable to him as-is.
But it really narrows the story from the struggle of humanity as a whole seeking freedom and self-determination, to people fighting against themselves again. And the Matrix itself doesn't really have much of a point in that story, especially not as much as it played into the sequels. Don't need to punchfight Agent Smith when your struggle is against another human.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155016
You do realize this logic fits with you faggots, right? Escaping reality?

[Anonymous No.]

What did Gura not get about the movie? If she had trouble with it for whatever reason, I can't imagine the reaction she'll have to the sequels that actually do get at least a bit more philosophically challenging.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160986
It'd also make Switch's character kinda strange, like their desired self only exists inside The Matrix, a form of control meant to pacify and chain people, while their true undesired body is in the real world. It makes Switch sound more like someone who would be a traitor to try and re-enter The Matrix and stay as their "true self", or even anti-tranny in Switch learning to accept their real body above the false Matrix one.

[Michlan No.]

>>9152758
The fact that I was born before the Matrix and still watching vtubers makes me sad.
Also the fact that Calli and Gura are probably younger than me

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161050
OH GOD, Cypher and Switch could have been secret lovers and Cypher was betraying everyone in order to give Switch a paradise and happiness within the Matrix. A tragedy, easy. One dying in another's arms, selfish plans fueled by love and good intentions causing the other to realize the situation and doing their best to save it all.

What could have been, -IF- that was their intention. Which it wasn't, evidenced by the existence of the sequels and their continuation of the messiah story. Would have been a great side story in the Animatrix.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161044
"Not getting it" is polite speak for "thought it was shit".

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161226
That's even worse, what is there to not like about The Matrix?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161044
At least Reloaded is full of dumb kung-fu flick fight scenes which you don't need to understand anything to enjoy

[Anonymous No.]

So you became a namefag as a way to cope? You're just digging yourself deeper.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160562
>It's like saying Superman is about a gay man hiding his homosexuality from the world.
Haha, yeah......At least I still have old comics.

[Anonymous No.]

>switch calls neo "coppertop" in the bug removal scene
that's clever, i didn't notice that before.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9153944
That's not what death of the author means, it's just what people seem to think it means.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161390
>death of the author of the death of the author definition
I chuckled

[Anonymous No.]

>>9160787
Death of the author is and always has been retarded. You can't just interpret my post however you want without taking into account what I, the author, wants to convey with my writing. It's just an excuse for fucking pseuds who have no ability to actually perform proper textual exegesis to come up with whatever bullshit they want.

The people who think death of the author is valid are the same retards who buy modern art that is just random splashes of paint on a canvas.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161422
Your cheekiness aside, Barthes was explicitly postmodern and created the concept of Death of the Author as a post-structuralist argument to effectively say "most writers are not as smart as you think they are, don't assume that everything they're saying actually contributes to their intent". It's not that authors don't have intent at all or that the intent should be discounted. While discussing a story by Honoré de Balzac through a very close reading, Barthes simply noted how in the act of writing a complex work, Balzac's voice as author diffuses into multiple planes, so that one cannot know from reading closely if the narrative voice, character voice, and plot voice truly expresses the author's perspective; one cannot necessarily extract insight into Balzac's own thoughts, viewpoints, and beliefs from the work through such a reading, especially considering that Balzac had been dead for over a century. For Barthes, the act of writing allows the author to lose some of his conscious self and that for a work to be enjoyed, a reader has to project some of his own thoughts and views.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161429
Death of the Author is perfectly valid, everything someone puts out has 2 faces, intent and reception. Especially with shit like movies/books/art, anything with lasting presence (which is everything), the author/creators intent at the time of it's release is it's state in time, and how people view it as well. And if the creator wants to cry and scream that other people got it wrong, then maybe the shitbird should have made a better work in order to convey their statement.
More creators should be like David Lynch. "There is a right answer, but I ain't gonna tell you what it is. Go have fun with it."

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161517
You shouldn't care what Marxist shitheads have to say about anything anon. Derrida is rotting in hell and so is anyone who followed his garbage mangling of Heideggers phenomenology.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161517
I get the potential mismatch between the intention of the author and their works, but the pleb death of the author usage is also a valid phenomena, it's kind of a similar thing to how our perceptions don't actually match reality itself. Everything is open for interpretation, every work is at some level an abstract work that interactions with the viewer's mind so it signifies different things for every person. That's not to say a given work's meanings are unlimited, but more like it has a "field" of potential meanings you can take from it. The most clear example of this being tarot cards.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161601
Anon, nothing Barthes said there is incorrect. If the creator is straight up dead and they never openly talked about their intent in a work, it's hard to know what their intent was when more than one voice they use.
Also, Roland Barthes had completely disassociated himself from Marxist thought by the time he wrote the Death of the Author essay because in the end it was just another ideology to him and he was anti-ideology, he read and studied works in his own words for the sake of hedonism, for his enjoyment and pleasure.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
based

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161720
>he was anti-ideology
Sure sign of a brainlet. He should've read the greeks

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
it's just worse GiTS tBh

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
Most of her age wouldn't get it, because they grew up after popular rhetoric made it about robots and trannies, because Hollywood didn't like its anti-establishment warning getting too popular.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161226
Do Burgerclaps really...?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161044
She liked it but needs more time to wrap her head some of the aspects of the simulation and Zion/real world.

[Anonymous No.]

Is this board about cinema?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9165047
Don't call her a board, she's 'hydrodynamic'.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161044
Unironically, she's too nihilistic for the Matrix
She could soak up the idea that nothing is real and nothing matters, but then gets confused when the movie becomes about gaining power to create your own meaning and reality.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
Did you really expect this dumb zoomer to "get it"?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161517
haha ballsack

[Anonymous No.]

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
>>9160008
it is kind of weird they'd specify transgenders since the movie is kind of 'trans-a-lot-of-shit'.
>Transmaterialism
>Transcendentalism
>Trans-spiritualism

Technically the movie is one big Buddhist metaphor mixed with Plato's Cave. it all is summed up in the translated lyrics of Navris if I recall.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9170611
ah, here's what I'm talking about, and the song is Navras. But it's not even subtle about it, the lyrics are largely taken out of a Sanskrit prayer. Here's a translation I found:

From delusion lead me to truth
From darkness lead me to light
From death lead me to immortality

He who knows both knowledge and action, with action overcomes death and which knowledge reaches immortality.

In him are woven the sky and the earth and all the regions of the air, and in him rest the mind and all the powers of life. Know him as the ONE and leave aside all other words. He is the bridge of immortality.

Beyond the senses is the mind, and beyond the mind is reason, its essence. Beyond reason is the Spirit in man, and beyond this is the Spirit of the Universe, the evolver of all.

When the five senses and the mind are still, and reason itself rests in silence, then begins the Path supreme.

And when he is seen in his immanence and transcendence, then the ties that have bound the heart are unloosened, the doubts of the mind vanish, and the law of Karma works no more.

I think the Wachowski brothers once said "we wanted the song to basically be a flowery way of saying 'look! Here's The ONE! Look at what he can do!'

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
Do you need even the slightest excuse to post le tired shark?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9171106
shes tired because she was with me, her husband, all night

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
Nobody cares.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
>blue shark girl is blue pilled
Whodathunk?

[Anonymous No.]

>>9155991
youre confused. only far left people tolerate troon shit

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152904
Pretty sure that was a massive cope because redpill turned into a right wing/politically incorrect meme and the directors dont want it to be

[Anonymous No.]

>>9174835
this implies ollie and hakos are extremely redpilled

[Anonymous No.]

>>9174996
plot twist: they were forced to become trannies by the hollywood grand powers as punishment

[Anonymous No.]

>>9175101
ollie went ranted on stream about indogs, if thats not redpilled i dont know what it

[Anonymous No.]

>>9175141
jfc apparently i had a stroke while typing this

[Anonymous No.]

It's not a complicated movie. Yeah sure there's some symbolism that you could interpret may different ways but on the surface it's a pretty simple film. I never understood why so many people acted like it was confusing.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9152758
expected desu

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161050
I think the idea was that their body outside the Matrix would've been their preferred one. More metaphorical than "tranny brain so matrix gives them the genitals they want".

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161025
It fits with anyone that thinks there's something fake or superficial about modern society for any reason. Which is literally everyone.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161517
quite stupid though, sure you might not get it or at a first reading not fully understand "who" is speaking but thats the author being a shit writer who cant express himself. saying that its not possible is just throwing your arms in the air and screaming "i give up!" which is the worst thing about postmodernists, their defeatist behaviour and attitude

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161025
if you mean vtubers then yeah, kind of. Although given the nature of the movie something like "the simulation (i.e. vtubers for actual human relationships and more broadly escapism into fiction in general) might be nicer than the real world, but ultimately being fictional makes it less valuable and you need to get back to reality no matter how much it hurts" is probably more supportable. Not saying I agree with that interpretation, but I can see it being arguable if someone tried.

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161517
Okay, but when the author needlessly narrow the scope of their work and says to everyone that resonate in some ways to their work "No, you cannot relate in that way because it wasn't my intention" then I think you can safely discount their intent. The author present characters and situations, and it's up to the reader/viewer/player what conclusion to take. Even worse is attempting to prevent that and making the intent too blatant or outright telling the audience what to feel, that just come off as preachy and annoying, and it's the reason why "Go Woke, go broke" is a thing

[Anonymous No.]

>>9161429
>You can't just interpret my post however you want
Is that so?
What are you gonna do about it?