/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

>>8532286
Kronii doko?

>>8532090
>variety
>gook Mori
>red Pekora
>ASMR slut #19485
>2view horoscopes
>another boring artist

>>8532286
home sweet home

ccv + sc
>https://piyo.chats.ninja/
>http://ikioi-ranking.com/
>https://overseas.live-ranking.com/
>https://live-ranking.userlocal.jp/total-ranking/youtube
>https://www.dousetu.com/daily_ranking/
>http://v-ana.com/
>https://playboard.co/en/

Hololive
>https://holo.poi.cat/
>https://twitter.com/holo_data
>https://trackholo.live/en/

Nijisanji
>https://niji-mado.web.app/stats/hourly
>https://twitter.com/2434rankings

>>8532286
Cutting out Kroni stream to make Gura #1

>>8532431
At least it's not Apex

>>8532620
>Kroni
Wasn’t showing, so I got this: >>8532642

>>8532286
>4 Nijis plus Maimoto got 20k
>solo Maimoto got 19k
Fucking embarrassing. Nijisanji is literally nothing without Maimoto and Kuzuha.

>>8532620
>>8532691
Piyo resets at 6am JST

80k-110k. top stream of today tik tok holokeks

dokuzuhonsha
>20/01/15 dola 27,121
>20/02/28 himawari 33,080
>20/03/21 kuzuha 42,009
>20/06/13 yashiro 53,821
>20/08/01 kuzuha 55,800
>22/08/22 himawari 88,479
>21/03/21 himawari 53,678
>21/04/12 yashiro 48,989
>21/08/11 himawari 60,621

>>8532620
>Cutting out
This is how piyo works

>>8532397
>>8532620
It's funny that I predicted this would happen the moment Piyo started doing the daily ranking with a properly defined cutoff and history.

Pic fucking related.

>>8532397
>>8532620
Piyo's day loop starts at 6am jst, it's the same reason why Mumei and the rrat's debut stream had the list to their own yesterday

>>8532926
>22/08/22
I don't even know Himawari is a time traveler

>>8533047
>no pic
Did I get rangebanned along with all those people or did I fuck up my uploads?

>8532926
Wonder what epic comebacks he will come up with when the stream won't reach those delusional numbers.

>8533086
>8533263
falseflagger

>>8533263
He's probably gonna samefag and say Kuzushit is declining since he didn't got those numbers. Playing both sides is too easy in these threads.

>>8533263
He's probably gonna samefag and say "Kuzushit" is declining since he didn't got those numbers. Playing both sides is too easy in these threads.

>>8532926
The only semblance for numbers in Niji is just tagging Kuzuha into everything

>>8533263
>>8533375
Meant for
>>8533086
>>8533263
>>8532926

8533375
stop embarrassing (you)rself

>>8533923
Meant for
>>8533375

>>8532926
Uh, no it will get ~50k. Himawari is sick and Chaika may be based but it kind of upsets the family dynamic. It's a 3D stream so maybe it will get 70k but 100k? No. Also, Himawari's recent stream was after 4 months of no Dokuzuhonsha
I'll eat my words if it does but you're overestimating.

will any holoENgen2 girl stream today besides Mumei

>>8534431
>100k
but they have Kuzuha!

>>8534431
Lets be honest here, all we really need is for it to break 35k~ so we can start shitposting about the recline of Holo and how people are starting to realize that Gura is boring and Niji is the better and more entertaining company

>>8534533
>>8534712
I'm gonna start numberfagging in Arabic to filter you faggots ابن الكلب

>>8532926
who is hosting this? if its kuzuha it might break 100k. Dude has been extremely buffed lately.

>>8535098
It's Kuzuha but Apexfags frpm Hal's tourney are not going to show up to his 3D stream with friends.

>>8534712
kek

>>8534712
Well, at least you're honest in your shitposting intentions, but fuck you anyways we need less of that garbage shitting up the thread.
Looking at what's up for the JP side of Hololive so far, I don't see anything that's gonna pull amazing numbers (20k+) today, but it is still early.

>>8535007
>I'm gonna start numberfagging in Arabic
HELL NO! I'm going to petition my congressman to ban Arabic numerals!

>>8534712
Niji just copies Hololive, though.

KEK, Sana didn't have a save file, her game crashed and she's back at fighting the trash mobs

>>8535842
Meanwhile the rest of the girls lost twice against the final tutorial boss (Choco Sensei Sub)

Hello. Just leaving it here.

>>8535942
These numbers are so wrong that it makes me want to rape you

I want to see hajime 3d numbers so bad

>>8534431
>I'll eat my words
Only words? Are you a pussy? Be like that one guy the other day and take a bigger risk!

>>8535799
>No they don't
Completely coincidence their new red girl has semblance to marine and even has shark theme and plushie. It's also part of the lore they copied their own EN model.

>>8535942
Gura has a lot of buff games this week, so she'll hit that 20k median. Idk about the last two weeks, she could be spamming nitendo and retro games and tank her numbers again.

>>8535799
Can I have an extensive list of things Niji copied from Holo? Or if you don't want to, 5-7 biggest ones would be enough. Then I'll try my best to debunk at least some of them.

>>8536281
>inb4 effortposting in response to bait
You know you don't have to whiteknight Niji or Holo or any of the girls right?

>>8535942
Have you hovered on the "i" sign? You know I could do this any other month in the year right?

>>8536313
please do.
reddit shark will never outnumber senchou and pekora.

>>8536306
But I am curious of what proof they can provide.

>>8536343
why are nijiniggers like this?

>>8535942
>doesn't have Gura's outfit reveal numbers
is this a troll?

>>8536564
But that's true, shark's fanbase is dispersed internationally. That's why she doesn't have the best live viewers, but has the best vod views (usually).

I like how OP posts viewers when Hololive is leading and copes with SC ranking when Nijisanji is leading.

>>8536629
Make your own thread then retard.

>>8536629
Otaku viewers are worth more than normieshit

>>8536695
hololive is all about normieshit, they have 500k on reddit ffs, shark is at 3 millions.

>>8536617
Not a troll. Iirc Playboard only takes in the last 7-14 days (not sure). So Kuzuha and Maimoto are buffed because Hal Apex Tournament and Baseball respectively and Marine because back to back concerts while Pekora and Gura are just doing the same things.
Marine normally loses to Pekora and Gura, although I do think she has started to uptick in the recent months and it's been a while since I bothered to look at Playboard numbers because of the above.

Since it likely won't be long until the new Holo EN debuts get monetized, here's a little comparison for monetization streams from this year and last. Looking at it, more often than not it correllates with long-term success, but definitely not always (Polka...). Eden-gumi really raised the bar and I'm interested to see if these girls can match that, EN1 certainly did very well for their time but I'm not sure if there's the same amount of hype for this group.

>>8536691
Why are you so disingenuous?

what d (you) forgot in numbers thread, moron?

Even Youtube kneels to Kuzuha
https://twitter.com/YouTubeJapan/status/1429789289857040388

>>8536629
tbf the past two days are all Holo wins. Hal won, but he ain't a niji.

>>8536808
JP vs JP
EN vs EN
Wait for JP 6 to arrive so that you can compare them to Eden. JP 6 would still lose in numbers for first SC stream though because $60k for first monetization is unprecedented and may not be topped.

>>8536343
I'll post it when shark goes 3D, one big number for 1 stream alone can carry the avg.

>>8536203
>shark theme

>>8536959
by the time she gets 3d she will rot at 5k median ww

>>8536629
Yesterday's SC chart was won by an indie and the rest was pretty much evenly balanced between holo and niji, not enough to shitpost about

>>8536720
is this what they call nijicope?

>>8537129
>gets called out
>COPE

>>8537129
hololive is built on reddit eop pandering. thats a fact. no matter what, cant get more normie than that

>>8537145
>stupid shit = call out
the absolute state of nijiniggers

There's a new vtuber magazine coming out soon. I just hope they only do events and notable projects though, not numberfagging. Although I'm pretty sure they're gonna put Kuzuha's 1M numbers for next month.

>>8537120
>23 days ago
Well? She inclining lol. Stop living in the past and that's not even Gura's worst numbers.

>>8537226

>>8537282
Speaking of Botan - any chance she will be participating?
https://rainbow6.jp/pc/news/572

>stop living in the past
>WHY YES GURA GOT 200K FOR AN OUTFIT SHE USED ONCE LONG AGO

>>8536934
EN1 correlates with the growth rate of JP Holos and Nijis though, there's no reason to separate their successors from the overall trend

>>8537354
My nihongo isn't good but what are those? New Vtuber companies?

>>8537386
I don't think so. There's not that many Holos that are into r6s even though it's a good game unless botan is part of a team herself in either Enako or Walnut. Surprised team ibrahim got in, they don't play a r6s so what gives? Kuzuha might bring in numbers, but those are all apexfags. They'll get destroyed either way from AA's team.

>>8537553
EN only correlates to the growth rate of JP/ID holos. Are there any instances that EN1 boosts the numbers of Eden or the whole of Niji? Their audiences are pretty different, and EOPs don't watch them.

>>8537431
>Bring up Gura's outfit numbers
Kek you do live in the past. Imagine taking the tribalfag shitpost between niji and holo seriously, outside of shitpost it's only bought up when someone asks for her highest numbers.

>>8537226
I also noticed that there's a VT topic on twitter now, although, most of it is populated by Holo tweets

>>8537971
I just love calling out hypocrites that mostly happen to be holonigs.

>>8537971
nice try nijinigger
i will tribalfag ur black faggot company untill all of ur talentless normiebait livers graduate amd die

>>8537995
its always been there

>>8538037
I only noticed it now honestly

>>8538000
>hypocrites
This will NEVER not make me laugh

>>8537120
Why does Gura do so bad with Ina collabs?

>>8536808
Meiro would've been a superstar...

>>8537226
Why are these only coming out after Hololive has mogged the rest of the competition. Imagine the articles that could have come out during Coco's graduation or when Gura hit 3 mil.

>>8538322
Chink ofc, its always them

>>8537226
The absolute LAST thing this hobby needs is "journalists" writing about it from outside.
Much like game journalism and celebrity journalism, these parasites add no value, they only vest themselves in a mantle of "credibility" while pushing whatever agenda or bias they have at the moment.

There are already plenty of "insiders" doing their own journalism about their favorites, both in Hololive and, I assume, in the other fandoms.
The correct course of action is to tear a new one in any company or individual trying to pass themselves as "journalists" in this community and push them as far away as possible.
>pic related
A weekly magazine edited by random retards and translated in 5 or 6 languages already.

>>8538521
Pic related as an example of good thing done by insiders, I surely mean

>>8538521
this isn't journalism, it's a hobbyist magazine.
You do know what a hobbyist magazine is, right?

>>8538593
See >>8538556, I re read and saw that it was ambiguous.

>Hobbyist magazine done by the community = OK
>"Serious business" magazine done by professional self annointed retards = cancer

>>8538593
If it's done by a company it's cancer, doesn't matter if it's hobbyist, Dengeki Hobby was a cancerous font of """journalism""" passing off agenda-filled opinion as fact

>>8538521
Holonews tend to ignore or downplay EN accomplishments but over-exaggerate JP/ID. Heck, Gura hitting 3 mil was "just another milestone" for them

Almost 100k difference between clock and nig

>holonewfags think vtuber magazines are a new thing

>>8539486
Holonormies found out about vtubers with HoloEN1.

>>8539206
Yeah because holonews is plugged into the subreddit which basically explodes every time an en streams

>>8539486
Sir this is the numbers thread not the shill your indies thread

>>8539448
Finally. Numbers.
This doesn't surprise me, Kronii hit up a prime EN timeslot with a solid game choice(that Kiara often wastes by playing jRPGs). Now that there's someone else able to stream in that slot, hopefully dead hours are less. Especially now that wfh is going to probably be one of the major things a lot of workplaces have to offer to compete. IMO she handled having to repeat bullshit over and over pretty well, and tard-wrangling chat fits her character personality well enough that I'd say it's a plus.
I'd give it a few more weeks to see if she ends up running away to Mori levels of growth vs her genmates, or if Hakoz is able to unify the SEA+JP audience to give her similar levels of growth.

>>8539486
>latest Volume was Jan 2020
We meant an actual magazine that's alive and hopefully up to date

>>8539601
While I agree that r/hololive is basically HoloEN at this point, that doesn't mean you ignore actual milestones.
Also, as we're on the topic of milestones, it seems like the Reddit mod never bothered to put up a pin of Gura hitting 3.25m and it seems the only post talking about it was also deleted.

>>8539833
They never pinned milestones so I don't know what you're talking about

>>8539779
STOP kicking them in the guts!

>>8539833
>3.25m
That's an arbitrary milestone. isn't it? Makes sense to stretch the "celebrations" for those who take almost half an year to move from 1M to 1.25M but for Gura?

Niji collab right now about at 37k. Didn't look for long, just saw the sponsored stream tag and that poker chase was a recently released game. Not that I care, but I don't really play any sponsored games.

>>8540318
>celebrations. anon, we are so tired of celebrating Gura's milestones.
as nijishitters will say:
>only legitimate milestone in vtubeer world is Kazuha's 1 mil subs

Seems like I'm gonna watch anime today since it's a niji win with the collab. Both sides are slow, with Pekora playing a kusoge.

>>8540431
This is Hololive without Coco. Hololive is nothing more than a soulless husk of itself. Without Coco, almost all Holo Vtubers except for Ina has been outed as untalented and unentertaining hacks.
That's why Nijisanji has been mogging them ever since Coco left, and why most burnt out Holofans have moved on to Nijisanji instead

fuck off, offtopicfag

Why is it getting less than the collab on Hima's channel though?

>>8541094
Kuzuha is reclining

Yesterday's Top 20

>>8540431
>>8540689
>3D shilling collab with 3 people only 50k
On no no no no Kuzushit not looking good
Pekora fucking mogged you

>No.26's 1M vtuber
Lol no one cares anymore

>>8540689
Who are you and what did you do to Coco Gonzales?

>>8532926
>80k-110k. top stream of today tik tok holokeks
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

Yesterday Superchat
>one of these is not like the others

>>8541576
>20/06/13 yashiro 53,821
>20/08/01 kuzuha 55,800
>20/08/22 himawari 88,479
>21/03/21 himawari 53,678
>21/08/11 himawari 60,621
Himawari mogged him
Yashiro mogged him
Even past Kuzuha mogged himself
Where all the tourists buff go after the celebs collab?

>>8541321
Pekora + Subaru + Aqua results in a much higher number than Kuzuha + Dola + Chaika + Yashiro if we take their averages into account though. Maybe it's the Chaika + game debuff since the previous with Hima got 60.5k: https://playboard.co/en/video/j9RA0b3pBeU

>>8541576
>>8541710
They're shilling a kuso game

>>8541710
Sponsored stream. Still mogged anything of today.

It looks like whatever initial boost Mel would have with her Vampire cover has mostly worn off by now. Within the next week or two it will be getting less daily views than Aqua's, Shion's and Polka's versions.

Even with the meme factor of THE Vampire covering Vampire and the blatantly obvious extra effort she put into her version compared to others; it seems like she can't overcome disinterest in her.

>>8541920
YT algo is a harsh mistress. Once you fall out of favor it's hard to get picked back up. Not impossible, but you're pretty much back to "square one" if you fall off too hard.
Which is why the number one best and surefire way to grow once you're in a corp setting with enough eyes on you is to keep. On. Streaming. Consistently.
It's not impossible with Mel, but she's got a lot of work cut out for her in her future.

>>8542015
>to keep. On. Streaming. Consistently.
This cannot be stressed enough.
Here is an anedocte: me and my SO share one youtube account in the living room TV. She watched some very new channel and subscribed.
All of a sudden half the suggestions and recommended in the TV were either recent content from that one channel or from their associated channels, most of then not 2 weeks old.

I am sure that, if they keep publishing videos, every single one of their new videos will be on the TV recommended. But if they skip even a week they'll disappear completely never to be sugggested again unless I manually look for them and watch a few in succession

>>8541920
She just needs to stream consistently. Wished I could slap some sense to some of them who doesn't treat streaming too seriously (Risu). Just a fixed schedule of 3 hours per day and 2 days break per week could do wonders to you. They really need JP 6 now to fill some dead hours, Pekora, miko and marine can't carry them every day.

>>8542141
>Just a fixed schedule of 3 hours per day
That's way more than enough. Hour long streams plus 20 mins for SC in the end, on a FIXED schedule (both in days and in time slot) and the streamer is good to go

>>8541576
Absolutely nijikeks

Barring another cull, TimeGirl will beat the tutorial by tomorrow and all but GyaruGirl will beat it by the day after.

Gyaru girl tho...

>>8542141
Problem is that most of Gen 6 will just stream when everyone else does. They need some kind of clause in their contract that says "you want into Hololive, you're on probation for 1 year, you are obligated to stream X number of times per week at X uncovered time slot". Relying on self-interest to motivate people to opportunistically stream doesn't work when most of them just think "eh I got enough money I'll do whatever I want".

>>8542264
She seems fairly well received on /vt/, are normalfag vtuber fans just racists compared to 4chan vtuber fans?

>>8542312
Her design is just shit desu not even because she's brown, she just looks like a low budget indie tuber

>>8542312
Her design is kind of awful and her voice is hard to understand, especially for ESLs, it's hard to entangle that from "people that are just racist". She's not even really black, as in African, and IRyS really isn't white but it didn't stop her from getting an enormous amount of subs immediately.

>>8542312
>are normalfag vtuber fans just racists compared to 4chan vtuber fans?
Not really, she seems to be well received everywhere that cares about the hobby.

Casuals tho, her design is the least "japanese style" of them all but in physical appearance and in clothing.
I wouldn't discount the cross over the rest of them benefit with the Fate franchise while, in her case, even with a slim connection it is not as apparent as it is for TimeGirl.

Also what >>8542367 said and maybe (long maybe) some 10% /pol/ audience debuff

>>8542312
/vt/ likes her because she's unpopular, there's a lot of hipster faggots here

>>8542367
>>8542405
Kinda true, if she looks something more like Jahy or Nagatoro I would smash the subscribe button.

>>8542436
Speaking for the /pol/ audience, I like her.

>>8542494
One thing I maintain that they fucked up was not making her gyaru-thicc. Nips obcess with cup size but it is more than obvious that thicc thighs appeal to the western world otakus at very least as much, if not more (given the rarity)

>>8542549
Yeah, I was afraid they would try to pull a fat one with a "beautiful black woman that needs no man" but she's OK and gyaru girls will never be black anyway

>gyaru
That's interesting damage control. But gyaru without makeup?

>>8542586
Look up Kuro Gyaru. It's "Jersey Shore", japanese version

just got told to fuck off from a certain general, is this a buff game?

>>8542651
no

>>8542555
I don't mind the thiccness but her face just doesn't fit, need something more slutty.

Did someone post this before?

>>8542681
thanks for a decent reply atleast

>>8542752
They're still getting culled. Fuck you susan

>>8542752
The Susan rollercoaster

>>8542752
those culling

>>8542752
Based Youtube culling Cover Inc™ sub bots

Weak prime time today

>>8542651
>>8542681
Hold on, you sure about that? It's baseball, even if it's not the big event it would still be at least considered a minor buff game no?
>>8542752
Ah fuck here we go again.

>>8542752
God I hate susan so much

>>8543113
Yep

>>8543119
The event is what makes it a huge buff game.

>Pajeet hands touched this
You can pinpoint when something started going wrong when they announce changes and the ensuing bugs

August 10, something changed and from that day on streams started to lag or drop, videos started to disappear and CCV started to get stuck in certain thresholds across the companies

>>8543250
Yes, I get that. How do their numbers do when they play it outside of the main event though? Am I mistaken? Does it offer 0 buffs even though the event happened not too long ago? (I'm not familiar enough with Niji numbers)

>>8543317
YouTube needs to hire real programmers. They won’t but it’s a something I wish for.

>>8542752
Nooo not my heckerino boterino!

>>8541321
>>8466766
You wanna talk about videogame promotion streams?

>>8542752
How do you know they're being culled and people aren't just unsubscribing because their first streams have been pretty shit?

>>8543490
Because when that happens you see a gradual drop, not a sharp drop that keeps going up after the drop is over

>>8542752
Sanig...

>>8543490
It takes something truly phenomenal to cause mass unsubscribes. We're talking utterly scandalous like being found out as an abuser, a complete corporate sellout, or a sex abuser.
The fact that all 5 were culled on the same way indicates it was done by YT systems as well, not natural unsubbing behavior.

>>8543490
It wouldn't be synchronized like that.

>>8543490
The growth curve on the top 4 is basically the same, you can see the tepid reception to Sana as being legitimate, outside of the cull she got alongside everyone else. That's what a poor reception would look like, not instant mass unsubs. Even Artemis didn't get mass unsubbed despite a bunch of people figuring out he was a dude and boring a shit on top of that. His growth and views just fell off a cliff.

I was surfing LSF and saw hololive clips there now. Will this bring the twitch kiddies in this fandom?

>>8544273
No idea what they is but they're more likely to watch Vshoujo aren't they? Twitch and Youtube audiences have a pretty hard separation.

>>8544273
Wait what? Ah fuck it's Gura clips.
That's just gonna make Gura's already messed up fanbase worse if anything, I doubt it gives any real traction to anyone else. Also I'm pretty sure Gura awareness on forsen's fanbase is present already seeing as she brought him up a while ago.

Well, what're predictions on Mumei's first steam post debut? Journey is interesting and fits thematically, but I'm not sure her numbers are going to be greater than 25k on that game in that timeslot.

>>8544514
15-16k for Mumei. People in the US are working during the time she's streaming so it'll be up to the other smaller audiences.

>>8544273
>LSF
What’s that?

>>8544514
Journey is a slow game honestly. Her pc rig doesn't feel right atm so I doubt it'd be an enjoyable stream. 12-20k.

>>8544592
Livestreamfail on Reddit. It's just clips for livestream related stuff, mostly for drama but sometimes for funny moments and shit.

>>8542015
You know I never thought about other meanings for it and took at face value whenever Marine discussed her fears about her fans forgetting about her if she was away for too long.

Former Black Company OL is alot more attentive then I ever imagined her to be.

>>8544592
https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/

>>8544592
It’s a subreddit. It’s where all the twitch kiddies go to catch up on drama or funny clips.

I did predict that Gura might get a live view increase from Gen2 influx, but still uncertain that will happen yet because I can’t base everything on her JP server game.

If Gura does drop a bit, she will still be fine. I think the other Gen1 (probably expect for Ina?) are going to have tough competition. Even if people bitch a lot here, Gen2 actually seems more skilled than Gen1. The difference is just that Gen1 got a free ride without much competition. So even the crap floated to the surface.

>people admitting to browsing r*ddit in the thread
go the fuck back and never return

When are THE FAGGOT MODS going to unblock me from posting files, I can't contribute to noombering that way

>>8544867
I'm sort of dubious on the whole "more" skilled thing. Like half of them were literal whos. The biggest one was just a store brand Gura. If some of these people had ended up in Niji EN no one would have been surprised, or if they were surprised, it was that they managed to make it into Niji EN in the first place.

Someone explain why JP declined?

>>8544685
25k is probably a bit high yea, but I'm banking on some euros really wanting to catch her live. 20k is probably more realistic.
>>8544736
It's why Aqua was having nightmares of being forgotten when going on break and why so many of the Holos push themselves to the point of burnout. They've experienced what happens to small indie content creators and don't want to risk falling into the same situation again. One of the benefits of being part of these larger corps is that your coworkers and friends still talk about you, and you can make guest appearances even when on break to maintain Mindshare amongst the wider audience so you don't fall off too hard when taking extended breaks.

>>8544867
Holoen is NijiJP of the west. Full of tourists that only watch if theres an event like costume reveal, debut, 3d, and drama.

>>8544908
You'll kick out 80% of /vt/ you know

Why is Sora such a midget compared to Mito?

>>8545040
I have to wonder whether the market is close to its saturation point. People can only watch so many streams no matter how hard you lean into the nolife lifestyle. Are new gen debuts actually introducing new viewers or just leeching from the existing streamers? I can understand why the older gens would feel antsy about all of this.

>>8532563
>https://holo.poi.cat/
why is ayamy listed there? is she affiliated to hololive?

>>8544975
>I'm sort of dubious on the whole "more" skilled thing
I think if the Gen2 Rat was in HoloEN Gen1, it would’ve been very big. Giant boost in her subs. Even Space and Time would probably have done better than Mori IMO. I think it’s difficult to access though, because we have our bias and the ones we prefer, and wonder why others like who they do. Even when I try to account for that as best I can, the Rat in particular seems exceptionally talented as a VTuber.
>If some of these people had ended up in Niji EN no one would have been surprised
That’s so wrong. I honestly watched all from NijiEN in hopes of finding something I like because Holo EN was becoming boring. It just didn’t work out for me. If the Rat was in NijiEN, that would make me watch.

>>8545143
Clippers also have an enormous influence on popularity it seems. For the life of me I can’t understand why Hololive doesn’t hire a handful of translators so they can post their own clips.

>>8544994
Flare is literally nothing without Minecraft, wow.

>>8545143
New EN doesn't affect JP at all, instead boosts them when their collab ban is over. Once they've cultivated their audience, they can move on to step 2 and collab with a JP member seeing how EN 2 is fluent in Japanese. EN fans would be introduced to the JP member while the JP fans would be introduced to the EN member. That's the most optimistic answer.

For JP, the problem is that timeslots they could commit to is from 6-1am JST and most of them have to compete while Pekora gets best results in her primetime slot. What JP needs to do is get someone who could stream outside of that slot, and comes in only if the other members aren't streaming that day, say pekora takes a day off, aqua or marine could fill in. The problem is that the managers are doing a bad job coordinating with schedules. Lamy, Mio and Fubuki is doing a good job streaming outside of it. Subaru already cultivated fans who would watch her streams in the mornins while Miko is being experimental and trying out the 12pm timeslot. All in all, it feels like they're testing the waters for JP 6 and playing on different timeslots.

>>8545118
That doesn't seem like a bad thing.

>>8545329
Why would they need to? Look. There's a pretty big difference between organic clipping, and official clipping in terms of how it's viewed. If it's the chubba themselves hiring someone to clip? That's fine, but if corporate is involved it's viewed as 'aritfical' and less people are going to be willing to click.
Also factor in costs of having to QC, paying for translations at official rates etc the costs add up, so why do that when you can let clippers get paid by YT, and you get free algo hack+ advertising?
Just strike down the bad apples (otakamori or whatever really needs to get the boot imo). If you had to pay for the mind of reach clippers have given Hololive on YouTube, I'd probably expect it to be a multi-million advert campaign, possibly up to 7 digits or more.

>>8545118
I don’t understand the appeal of reddit

>>8545692
There is no appeal but if you want to numberfag you need to understand the audience and a huge part of the audience is there.
All social media is cancer, Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, Instagram, TikTok. It doesn't prevent a numberfag from venturing there and counting heads

>>8545692
The appeal of Reddit for me is to occasionally have a cynical laugh at the absolute state of the internet and western culture.

>>8545067
>tourists
At least they subscribed to the channel.

>>8545283
>why is ayamy listed there? is she affiliated to hololive?
She's Mel's mama. They have a "affiliated" section with streamers with "affinity" with Hololive. It is more an artifact of when Holos collabed a lot more outside the branch (because there were only like, 15 of them or so)

>>8545283
She designed Mel.

>>8545293
What's special about the rat? I watched her debut, the collab, and half her talk yesterday and didn't really get any feeling that she's some amazing hidden diamond of a vtuber or anything. Seems just ok.

>>8546023
>What's special about the rat?
Only the design. They were expecting
>Gura design meets Haachama's chaos

So far she's a cute pie but not chaotic at all.

>>8545781
I go to reddit from time to time to see what they’re saying (Hololive Reddit), but it sort of creeps me out a bit. Mainly because they have very few if any criticisms. You could give them a giant turd and they would find ways to praise it. Also it seems like it rewards group think a lot by the voting system. So it becomes worse; they praise the turd, and the rest are being conditioned to follow. Cover management is blindly worshiped as well.

>>8546023
Debut week is surface-level stuff. Keep your judgement first for a week at least before picking someone to commit your time with. My money is already on Kronii because her voice is sex.

>>8546023
The anon you replied to is riding the hype and likes shiny new things. HoloEN2 has streamed like once or twice by now, and we haven't even seen everything about them. We haven't even seen what will be their niche that garners a lot of numbers (besides that we know that the nature girl is into ASMR).

>>8546104
>Mainly because they have very few if any criticisms
DUH! Next you'll tell only people that praises the boss wife cooking will get invited for the next dinner.

Social skill is something learned from maturity. The place to badmouth the boss' wife cooking is not IN THEIR FUCKING HOUSE but behind their backs, in the locker room of the buddies soccer game.
People that insist in "transparency and openness and honesty above all thing" just get ejected from the social gatherings never to be invited again.

>>8546104
Cover runs the subreddit and deletes negative comments.

Don't let Astelschizo holobrony make next thread with superchat number. Post the KING's kusoge shilling number for me since I can't post files.

>>8546104
Reddit is moderated, the fags there knows this board exist so unfiltered discussions goes here instead of that place.

>>8546240
Shut the fuck up seanigger

>>8544994
No big event, or buff games. Pekora knows how to capture the tourists from big events like streaming bait content and buff games before or after those events. And about bait, I mean something like "Will ends stream if" or Gacha.

>>8546240
I would just use yesterday's number, here: >>8541209.

Unless this thread lasts to 6AM JST (7 hours from now) but it won't. Who the fuck is "astel schizo" and why the fuck are you giving names to the voices in your head?

>>8546340
I'm not, but I'm pretty sure the Astelschizo iToddler is.

>>8546364
Challenges/Speedruns/Endurances would always get big numbers aside from big events but they have long cooldowns. Pekora knows her audience, therefore streams game that her viewers might like while also alternating her buff games once or twice in a week. She could always play MC every day, but that's counterintuitive and bad for growth. Best solution is to mix games (debuff and buffs). Gura, Marine and Pekora knows this.

>>8546023
>What's special about the rat?
More entertainment focused (attempts at comedy), very talkative which is needed for viewer retention, smart and self aware which is needed to know what to say (and come up with things to say), humors the chat, seems like she will many creative ideas, working on appealing to a larger audience, etc.

In Holo Gen1, I think Gura is special too, even if a lot of people here hate her and can’t understand why anyone would watch. In my opinion, Gura would’ve done well even without being a loli.

I’m sure many will disagree.

>>8546735
I don't think being a loli matters much. Obviously Cover doesn't either as they didn't bother to put one in Gen 2. I feel like people here vastly overestimate the number of pedos in the general population.

>>8546868
Truthfully, loli char is super hard to pull off. Gura is the perfect being/storm to play as a loli because of her irl sass. Evem if the debut a loli, it'll just get overshadowed by Gura anyway.

>>8546868
>I don't think being a loli matters much
I mentioned it because many here seem to think Gura got big because of it.

>>8546023
Nothing. She's a former 2view that turned special now since she's a part of the brand.

>>8547422
Some special people just need the spotlight for a moment, and from there they can then sustain themselves. They just need to get noticed, and Cover provides that.

>>8547528
Yet Nijisanji gets criticized for doing exactly same some reason.

>>8545614
Plus official clips can gather rrats about favoritism and neglect. Even Hologra has gotten some of this with people straight up asking Pekora why she didn't appear for months and Coco not appearing as evidence for Cover trying to force her out.

>>8547661
>Yet Nijisanji gets criticized for doing exactly same some reason.
You can't possibly post a single link of said criticism.

Horny highschoolers.

Oh no, it's that Nijifag again, be careful with what you say or he'll keep quoting you across multiple threads out of butthurt.

>>8547728
>n < 1000
US election tier garbage samples

>>8547728
Prank/Comedy channel at the top, not surprising.

>>8547887
Zoomers are the same no matter where you go

Seanigger here, i have never spoken to an aussie before so i have a hard time understanding her accent. I figure that is a big debuff for some people. I like her though.

>>8548059
Who the fuck you even mean? Haachama? GyaruGirl? RatGirl?

>Sora 2,6k Minecraft
She's officially NijiEN tier

>>8548113
Sorry was referring to sana.

>>8548137
You do know most of her fans are in NND right?

>>8548113
Sana. Rat is easy enough to understand, Kiara even mentioned she was suppressing her accent in streams and it's stronger on their private discord. Sana meanwhile has some weird mushmouth provincial accent.

>>8548137
Unless she's interacting with someone that's her usual MC number. She usually peaks 2, 3 hours in the stream after everybody went to sleep or if she's in someone else's POV

>>8548214
>NND
You know she gets absolutely destroyed by Mito there, right? Why is she such a midget compared to her?

>>8548304
Here is a typical Sora MC stream
>Sora is doing her thing, only her audience is tuned in
>Someone shows up in her POV or vice versa, she picks up some curious cats

>>8548313
Because she's just being carried by a brand. Like the aforementioned rat.

>>8548430
>pero pero pero pero
Do I detect a strong hint of salt?

>>8548529
No? Just stating the obvious. Unless you were licking yourself.

>>8548674
Explain in 17 words of less what is wrong with being associated with a strong brand that helps the talent to reach a wider audience.

So whats up with all vtubers having lower numbers than usual tonight?
>>8546099
Good. Haachama's "chaos" got stale sometime last year.

>rent free

>>8549112
>whats up with all vtubers having lower numbers than usual tonight
No more baseball buff, debut buff, HC MC buff or other buffs.
What you see is just the strength of each streamer, except for the Kuzuha collab which somehow managed to debuff him

>>8542141
Some of them don't care about further growth

>>8549112
>>8549173
Even then here is all Holo streams over 9.5k today (EST today)

>K-KIZUNA AI...
What went wrong? She's debuffing fucking Tamaki, who got 16k with Hoshikawa as a guest

>>8549296
Just Shigure alone should boost her to at least 10k. Something is seriously wrong there.

>>8549598
Hoshikawa's one of the stronger Niji girls.
>>8549173
>>8549296
Nah, I don't mean about buffs and shit. The numbers for everyone are lower. Last time people said numbers were normalising from the super hype last year. Are vtubers declining further?

Nijibara peak 32.5k

Impressive numbers for a premiere.

>>8550259
Unfortunately for Nijisanji, premieres don't count.

>>8550259
Anything with Toya in it is guaranteed noombers.

>>8550258
so the usual number?

>>8549598
>Maimoto isn't there
Well, those whores are literally worthless, and Kizuna Ai might actually be worse than worthless, she's a debuff. Tamaki and Ui can only get big numbers when they collab with Maimoto.

>>8549598
anon is right. no hypeman maimoto - goodbye numbers

>>8550816
>>8551625
Maimo-who?

Numbers update

>>8551750
hypegod. lowkey the strongest V, he just hides his actual power.
despite having 10 times less subs, he gets better numbers than gawr gura
>>8535942

>>8549972
What's the status of the lockdown in Japan?

Any predictions for exhibition matcha tomorrow? Won't be surprised if it will be able to break 100k this year.

>>8551823
When was the last time Pekora has been number one? Lately it feels like even a top 3 placement is impossible for her.

>>8552585
luna collab iirc
she's playing a game no kid would watch atm

>>8552585
When was Pekora ever known for being the highest peak? What makes Pekora different is that she clocks 20k+ most days regardless of special, buff or debuff day, that's why her median is 22k

>>8552585
she'll be at the top when the monthly watch hours compilation comes, pekora is consistent top 10 without relying on buffs or events.

>>8545329
see
>>7511140
Tldr:
Someone ran the numbers awhile back and assuming it's done all in house, they'll need to pay two people, an editor and a translator, at least 70k a year, that's 140k a year not including materials like software licenses and stuff.

They would literally be putting themselves in a hole to do a service that the community already does for free and probably far better than what they could pay people to do.

>>8552585
People are stacking buffs like crazy while Pekora just do her own things. Those people are gonna go down eventually when they run out of idea.

>>8542752
what the fuck

>>8546104
It does happen, not often but there are times when shit got bad enough that reddit does respond and that's when you know they've really fucked up. See pic related

>>8552585
do you know how many V-Tubers would die for this.
While she doesn't get absurd numbers although she can (Luna Peko collab) She has a steady 15-30k fanbase who will watch her play anything and not be stuck in for example the APEX jail or Minecraft jail.

>>8545329
>For the life of me I can’t understand why Hololive doesn’t hire a handful of translators
Assuming you are doing the transcription yourself and hiring a decent translator you are going to be paying
>25 yen per CHARACTER
to transcribe something from Japanese to English, and I don't mean translate as in understanding the context and doing funny puns like Hologra, I mean boring literal translations.

There are things that are given for free that can't possibly be bought. Clipping is one of those things.

>>8551823
>51k
Rip that tribalist who said it would hit 100k

>>8553019
>tribalist
You surely mean
>falseflagger

>>8546206
true and so sad, humanity needs a cleanup asap. 2nd coming of Christ when

>>8553019
>>8553103
He was either being disingenuous or didn't know they were shilling kusoge. Maybe 80k+ would be possible if not for that.

>>8553283
>Christ
kek, no.

>Youtube

>Ask a question.
>Receive cope.
I guess it was my fault for expecting something more.

>>8552690
Thanks for a proper answer.

>>8554317
https://socialblade.com/youtube/channel/UCO_aKKYxn4tvrqPjcTzZ6EQ/realtime

>>8554317
is it really bots or what? not necessarily by cover, but by some retarded fan

>>8554596
I'll answer this question with another question: if it was bots would people be complaning about having been force-unsubbed from these accounts?

If you don't care enough to re-sub afterwards your sub doesn't matter and it's just another dead sub anyway, so it evens out.

>>8554596
>is it really bots or what?
This never happened to Gen1 or IRyS to this degree, and we know Cover has enough people to where their subs should actually be higher. Especially after launch. I guess their accounts seem to still be marked by YouTube AI or some shit. I wonder if a change in AI is effecting new channels more.

>>8554761
It matters as it unfairly targets specific people who have to compete with others who are not targeted at all.

>>8554434
You received a proper answer with context for what was arguably a dumb question, equivalent to
>when was the last time the Patriots reached the playoffs with a 16-.0 record
The only proper answer to that would be
>2007, but reaching the playoffs undefeated is not what the Patriots are known for

>>8554855
>A fucking handegg analogy.
Lmao.

>>8554317
Based Susan. Now do it with Gura.

>>8556188
Probably already has. The growth has outpaced the unsubs

kuzuha mogging schedule:
8/25 baseball exhibition matches
8/26-8/27 apex matsuri scrims w/hikakin and shibuhal
8/28 apex matsuri real match
soon:
1 million subs celebration
song cover
new costume reveal
new 3d model reveal
3.0 reveal
Chronoir full live they promised since last year

TOP FUCKING KEK
>Choco Sub putting the hell of a fight
>Sana still tangled with the trash mobs and losing life bars

>>8556880
-It appears that your cheat "Brand Power's has been deemed illegal by the admins. Please stand by while corrective action is undertaken.
Jokes aside, what in the bloody hells is going on with this horrid algo? 1million+ views and still flagged as a bot account by YT? It's just dumb.

>>8557094
kek, it is not affecting just Holos but across the board.

Here is some 10k subs small time creator complaining to Youtube, and the canned answer that actually means
>suck to be you for getting caught in the crosshairs of our bot
https://twitter.com/TeamYouTube/status/1429997128223543298

>>8557171
yeah youtube goes into a phase like this every few months, last time was around when Noel hit one million. It should go away in a couple of weeks.

>>8557171
Here is what they say at the linked url (https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/6051134))

>We regularly verify the legitimacy of the accounts and actions on your YouTube channel.
>We also may make corrections to site metrics in YouTube Analytics to fix consistency issues across different sources.
>These processes make sure that our site metrics are free of spam, abuse, and closed accounts to keep YouTube fair for everyone.


>It’s important that subscriber numbers stay accurate to make sure you’re organically building your audience.
>Closed accounts and subscribers that are identified as spam won't count toward your total number of subscribers.
>They also won't show in your subscriber list and they don’t impact views or watch time.

It is what people here already know for long: some bot check an account to see if it is "legit" and simply drops it from the count if not. The thing is: the false positive ratio must be absurd for all these complaints from real people

>>8557171
>youtube bot responds about the problem of their ai bots wrongly removing assumed bots
I've had my subs removed from matsuri, shion and mel by the way

>>8557325
Someone probably did bot a fuckton, and the abnormal activity might have triggered a cascade effect where any account that was even remotely similar, in the same way a duck might look like a crow if you squinted hard enough, and thus lots of innocent people and accounts started to get their subs slashed to hell.
Once marked, it probably takes a while for the system to work your account off of whatever internal lists are used to keep track of suspicious accounts, so this good to be rough for the gals for the next few weeks.
Fortunately twitter and community posts should help alleviate some of the effects , but gods this blows for them.

>>8557399
LIES!
https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/7280745?hl=en#zippy=%2Cdoes-youtube-automatically-unsubscribe-viewers-from-channels

>Does YouTube automatically unsubscribe viewers from channels?

>No.
>However, we’ve seen some conversations about viewers being “automatically unsubscribed” from channels.
>When we get this type of feedback, we take it seriously.
>The Subscriptions team performs full investigations into the data submitted to see what's going on.

>In every case we’ve looked at, we've verified that there's no issue causing viewers to be automatically unsubscribed by YouTube.
>Here is what we've seen:

>Most of the time, we find that the viewer is still subscribed to the channel.
>Some viewers were unsubscribing from channels by accident.
>We've since added a confirmation pop-up when unsubscribing (this feature isn't currently available on iPhone and iPad devices).

>Many people thought they were unsubscribed from a channel because videos were not appearing in their Home tab.
>When we looked into these cases, we found they were still subscribed to the channel and had never been unsubscribed.
>The Home tab is designed to show you videos that we think you're most interested in watching.
>You’re not guaranteed to see all videos from your subscriptions on the Home tab, but you can find a complete list in the Subscriptions feed.

>Some creators assumed that specific viewers had been unsubscribed because the subscriber didn't show up in their channel's Subscribers List.
>This list only shows subscribers who have chosen to make their subscriptions public.
>Subscriptions are private by default.

gura is a leeching whore, she is leeching off JP micra now

>>8557763
>Someone probably did bot a fuckton
It's not that.Pajeet hands touchjed the code recently. See >>8543317

My bet is that in August 10 the rolled an update that triggered it

>>8551823
Gura’s dead subs are waking up now? lmao

>>8557773
>youtube removes my subs
>youtube denies it to my face

>>8557792
A leech is something that lets go of the host after having their fill, like Miko and Subaru.
Gura is a parasite.

TOPPEST OF KEKS, TeamYoutube not only knows what's going on but they're clearly monitoring keywords related to it.

Here are them replying to some 100 subs faggot that didn't even tag them in and didn't even spell "losing" correctly.

>>8557792
This kind of cope is hilarious to see

I can see why Holos don't sweat about it, what's 10k subs between friends.
But it is sad and funny at the same time (in a "sad clown" sense) to see all these minuscule youtubers working their asses off for some 600 subs only to lose six months worth of incline in a second.

And TeamYoutube just laughs at them while saying "nah, it's just your imagination"

>>8558323
i bet she is considering to join(leech from) usaken

>>8558325
>>8558164
>>8557773
>>8557325
>>8557171
I just read back @TeamYouTube (based on some searches) all the way back to the start of August. Whatever issue causing this started August 10.

>>8558415
absolutely hilarious

>>8558415
If you would have spent the time to watch the stream or even a clip, then you wouldn't be making an ass of yourself about things that you don't know about.
Keep being salty about the shark inclining lately. You don't have any recent numbers to post about anyways.

>>8558415
>>8558623
>>8557792
Here, have some capital letter to properly disguise your samefaggotry

>A

>>8558724
dude

>portal opens
>guess who's the desperate one rushing in first
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbKyk-EqL_g

>>8559032
>portal opens
I know you're eager to shitpost, but at least know what you're shitposting about. The portal is not open.

>>8559032
>ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXY

>>8559032
Thanks for boosting my oshi's name in the algorithm by watching. uwu
>>8559128
Fucking kek. That anon is really trying to make his own reality

You would think people watching vtubers want to see anime girls but in reality Sana, Baelz and Petra who speak Japanese well happen to be one the least popular.
Did they filter EOPs, burgers and dubfags?

>>8546735
>even if a lot of people here hate her
uhh i think you are wrong bud

>>8559194
>what is copy link address

>>8558526
Another anon posted it earlier but the pajeets touched YouTube code on that date.

>>8559232
I don't think that's a proper correlation. IRyS is a good counterexample. Baelz is still doing well in her gen. Probably other reasons to explain them not being at the top

>>8557868
We don’t know yet. Gen2 might bring more people to Hololive, who then prefer Gura, or simply the renewed interest can bring her old fans back.

We need time to find out. That Minecraft JP server stream isn’t proof of anything yet.

>numberfags BTFO
Rosemi numbers TO THE MOON!

>Astel BTFO

>>8556880
>>Choco Sub putting the hell of a fight
>fighting
>0 subs gained
ARTIFICAL DIFFICULTY

>>8560794
>0 subs gained
You’d think so but even among the Holostars only
>Roberu
>Izuru
>Astel
>Shien
Inclined faster than Choco Sub in the last 30 days. She also outgrown Aoi Nabi and Ayamy, even with their collabs with Holos

Owl girl opening to 21k

>>8562811
23k now actually

>Owl at 25k
Not bad, I guess.

25k now. Still not getting her appeal but numbers are numbers.

>>8563327
She's the chill streamer, a new Ina. No art buff tho so we'll see if she can keep the number 2 spot of her gen like Ina.

>>8559232
If people could speak Japanese they wouldn't be watching the EN branches most likely. I dn't think speaking Japanese in and of itself is a debuff. Speaking a LOT of Japanese on an English stream or doing a lot of dedicated Japanese streams is. Sana has a crappy model and is hard to understand and Baelz streams at awful times. Petra is the only one that really is hurt by catering to JP, by streaming at their time and doing a lot of JP streams.

>>8564141
>Petra is the only one that really is hurt by catering to JP, by streaming at their time and doing a lot of JP streams.
Isn’t Anya doing the same to a certain extent?

>27k and then a 3k cull in 10 seconds

>>8563327
She's cute and dumb, it's like EN Aqua. All she needs is the gamer skills.

>>8565021

>>8565021
It wasn't a cull. She buffered and people tuned out.

>>8565021
>>8565116
The stream bugged, I think one of youtube's regional servers crashed

OwlGirl and TimeGirl could take turns and make this their regular time three times a week.
There is usually nothing on and clearly there is an audience between late JP owls, primetime EU and afternoon burgers

>>8564866
Anya doesn't seem to do as much JP stuff anymore or talk in JP during streams (unless it's with JP Holos). She did a lot when she first started though. All these girls have delusions that they'll be able to get a sizeable JP fanbase when the reality is these Japanese have ten thousand of their own vtubers to watch, they don't care too much about some foreigner than can speak it but has no real special talent outside of that.

>>8565436
This is tako hours normally, starting like 2-4 hours earlier might be a better strategy, when it's only Kiara or no one streaming.

so it's safe to say either EN2 is a dud or holoEN is in decline.
>nepotism
>hiring your art friends instead of the best talent
why?

>>8565439
They fell for the “日本語上手!” meme

>>8565693

Even irys didn't decline this fast, these girls won't take views from EN1.

>>8565693
Here anon, have some capital letters for you to blend in
>ABCDEGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ

>>8559232
>Baelz is least popular
It’s too early to make such claims. She simply chooses to stream at odd times likely to find a spot, then people think “it’s over” for her once the first numbers come in. Sana we don’t know yet, because of her timing during Gura and Ame’s big streams.

I think after a few weeks we will have an idea of where they stand. The problem is people declare something the moment one stream is seen. We really don’t know. Even when subs are lower, it cannot say much until people see enough to know who they prefer to sub.

The Owl isn’t as bad as her debut. But if she’s only judged by that debuy, it might not be an accurate picture of her in a week.

>>8565839
compare irys post-debut to EN2, she didn't tank as fast. also, low subs.

>>8565919
read the thread

Current slot

>OwlGirl: 26k
>Chihiro: 4.6k (very good btw)
>Shizuka Rin: 1.8k
>Selen: 1.5k

It’s safe to say OwnGirl is doing OK

>>8565919

>>8566352
wait 3 weeks. Irys started at like 30k too. She's dull.

>>8566352
Ok, yeah. But she's 10k lower than Kronii got playing a meme game yesterday. We'll see what kind of hit she takes from the TTRPG too.

>>8566352
It’s almost 6AM in Japan and almost 5PM in the East Coast of the US btw

>>8566455
Well dipshit, Leos hit 7-8k today and Lain was at 4k today, They don't last forever it's called the rookie buff you newfaggot.
IRyS numbers are actually decent.

>>8566603
the only 2 people growing right now are ShibuyaHal and Kuzuha.

>>8566469
Kronii is, IMO, the breakout success of this gen. AMAZING design, best rig of the gen, a voice without comparison across the Holos and very good in keeping the audience entertained. She’s EN2 Botan, easily

>>8566671
what the actual fuck are you talking about?

>>8566756
Hal is a self made streamer who had a 130k Apex tournament, and mogs both companies regularly. Kuzuha breaks 100k all the time and networks with idols/celebs and keeps growing. They are the 2 big dogs in the scene right now.

>>8566671
That’s only true if you o ky look at the top range of the numbers. Shibuya Hal event had such an impact on the down wind even high three digits like Astel inclined in what seems a permanent fashion