/vt/ - Virtual Youtubers

>>1204499
Mito is the only niji worth watching and Sora is good but nowhere near as good as her kouhai

>>1204499
Yagoo actually wants better talent.

Yay more tribalism I love it. Do you even lift?

>>1204499
Ichikara doesn't know how to scout better talents

>>1204612
Who's being tribal, you imbecile? I like both Mito and Sora, and I really do want people's perspectives on this.

Mito is the most subbed Niji, Sora is the 24th most subber Holo. There's just 24k between them LMAO

>>1204612
Cover has gotten better at getting better talent over time, so Sora ended up being overshadowed by her kouhai, she was alsonmore focused on the idol side of hololive and barely collabed with her kouhai.

>>1205388
Whoops, meant for OP

>>1204499
Change in VTuber culture.
The initial VTubers were all Seiso type idols. Tokino Sora was essentially created for that era.
Mito was one of the early ones that started shifting the culture from idol to comedian (I think the first one was Kaguya Luna) and many of the vtubers that followed her contributed to that cultural shift (as well as desire by the audience).
Ironically people like Fubuki, Marine and Korone have more in common with Mito, than they do with Sora.


That being said you are heavily underestimating Sora's success. First and foremost I want you to look at this video https://youtu.be/OXW-_3w7dc8
Notice that Sora was the most subscribed Hololive for two years. Two years. Without counting the Nico Nico numbers.
Second thing to consider is that the Idol VTuber is basically dead, everyone who used to do that schtick is either gone or has transition into more of a comedian type content (Kizuna AI for example). Sora is still standing.
Lastly Sora never declined, the other girls have had more expolisve starts and much better growing rates, but Sora has been going slow and stable since 2017.

>>1204499
Tazumi got really lucky with Mito, she’s the best Nijisanji has to offer.

>>1205690
Thanks for the explanation. So in your opinion, what's the next step in the cultural evolution you described? Idol -> comedian -> ? Because it's hard for me to believe that comedian is the endpoint.

>>1205782
Hey, if I could answer that question I'd be paid big bucks. I don't want to waste your time with rrats.

>>1205731
Consider that she was considered as one of the New Heavenly Kings

Sad to think if this is the best Niji has to offer

>>1205690
Subs are nice but money is what really carries your company and that was mainly FBK and Aqua.

>>1205894
How is it sad? Mito is legitimately a great catch. She would be a top vtuber in any company.

>>1205942
We can't really know who brought how much money. Sponsorship wise FBK and Aqua did miracles, but Sora has been doing ticketed events and selling a lot of merch.

>>1205942
>>1206056
Also Coco and Rushia regularly being top superchat earners.

Sure, those may not bring in as much as a good sponsorship deal, but it's still a nice chunk of money on a monthly basis.

>>1204747
She's also about to lapped by Kuzuha in about a couple weeks and he mostly just plays Apex.

>>1206056
We will never know how much each individual brings in for the company.
Yagoo said in an interview that Cover brought in around 100 million USD in revenue last year.

>>1205956
It's sad that a Vtuber that was touted to be the "one of the new faces" of Vtubing wasn't able to ride the Vtuber boom of 2019-2020 and has basically plateaud

Most VTubers right now are still trying to catch up to Kizuna Ai - Kaguya Luna - Mirai Akari or have them as the bar to reach despite 1 of them effectively being retired

But the "soon to be faces of Vtubing" Mito-Sora-Hinata are now just faces in the oversaturated crowd

>>1206056
I know, we just operate with what we know. Not that it matter that much. Good thing that Hololive works so that even the weakest members contributes somehow.

>>1206323
That's just sort of to be expected in any entertainment field, nobody really lasts forever with people's attention spans being shorter than ever. I think what should be looked back on more than anything is the kind of impact they brought for their respective scenes/companies, and whether or not they're still respected for what they did though.

Imagine all the sex Mito has with her kouhai by using senpai sexual harassment.

>>1206185
>revenue
Important qualifier.

>>1204499
quality vs quantity

>>1204499
Sora was designed to be a Kizuna Ai clone
Mito was designed to be a vtuber

>>1204499
They're like, 25k subs apart and Sora's channel is growing three times as fast as Mito's. She'll be ahead next month.

>>1204499
it depends. she got many gigs and commercials, as many as the 'popular' talent like aqua, marine, fubuki.

>>1205782
porn star

>>1206323
I don't think Mito has necessarily plateau'd. If NijiEN becomes a hit, it's likely she could have a second wind of some kind if she does something to appeal to the EOPs.

>>1207006

>>1207055
>NijiEN becomes a hit,
Hah!

>>1207111
>Hah!
Reminder that everyone said the exact same thing about HoloEN, don't get your hopes up (or down?)

>>1207164
>HoloEN
That's the very elephant in the room anon.

>>1207226
Why do you think Niji is still competitive vs Holo in riceland? More carefree approach of management, ability to collab with anyone, better tech... they just need to play their cards right before 2nd gen debuts.

>>1207371
The way you wrote that sentence assumes Hololive is doing better than Nijisanji in Japan when it's the opposite.
If anything Hololive making progress on catching up to Nijisanji shows how much they dropped the ball by not caring about their international branches.

>>1207534
I was making a comparison, NijiEN hasn't debuted yet and I meant to say the market isn't a problem, people dropping a functional alternative for what they consider a better one is why the first generation of vtubers became irrelevant.
And I think even Holofags admit EN was a hit because they jumped in an untapped market at the right moment, and now they'll have to try harder with their new gen to stay relevant, both Cover and the streamers themselves.

>>1207371
competitive huh. sure.
meanwhile the most superchat they get is only through tokyo ghoul.

>>1205782
Judging from Sora's recent monetisation stream, full blown GFE.

>>1204499
Content?

>>1205782
Political Activist.

>>1206185
https://signal.diamond.jp/articles/-/527 is probably what you're referring to. Unfortunately whoever google translated the article got the number wrong, it's >$10m revenue, and google translate is the only one that incorrectly counts it as 2 digit billion instead of 2 digit hundred million.

>>1204611
that's actually one thing i don't get, which is how hololive manages to scout and promote so effectively.
it's generally super incompetent in a lot of areas (videos taken down, talent lost do to harassment and all that) but their scouting is top notch.
iirc a lot of the girls that ended up in hololive actually audianted to niji first and weren't accepted, like suisei and such.
something about the way they hire is just wrong.

>>1204499
popular or not I kinda like how all the girls have that senpai-respect towards Sora, and hold her to such high regards. I mean, without her we probably wouldn’t have Hololive.

>>1207877
oh niji got them already.
Hana and Noor.

>>1208400
Give me an example of Noor being political

lmao get it through your heads that not everyone on the planet is a fucking weeb

>>1205782
>Idol -> comedian ->
Leech

Uto love

>>1208120
>iirc a lot of the girls that ended up in hololive actually audianted to niji first and weren't accepted, like suisei
Suisei said she tried to join Niji first? Do you know in which video she said this?

>>1204499
you want to troll Sora, but you fail miserably in a ridiculous way, you can't compare them, Nijisanji will always lose.
https://socialblade.com/youtube/channel/UCD-miitqNY3nyukJ4Fnf4_A
https://socialblade.com/youtube/channel/UCp6993wxpyDPHUpavwDFqgg
In 3 weeks Sora will surpass Mito in subs, she already wrecks her in views and SC

>>1207371
if Kuzuha ever decided to leave, Nijisanji would basically be dead. Heck, he was apparently an indie before getting hired into Nijisanji Gamers, depending on his contract, he might be able to just take Kuzuha the character and go off on his own, he's big enough to not even need Ichikara anymore.

>>1204499
Mito sure is talented but she's already in recline. She gets tons of projects and other business opportunities but that's because there's hardly any competition talentwise. The problem is exacerbated by the fact that she's not proactive in helping her low performing colleagues and the rampant bullying in their company.

>>1207006
this
as soon as the tech becomes cheaper, less uncanny valley

>>1207793
digital souse, friend or family

>>1210584
Difference in company culture.
Nijis all tend to do their own thing or within their clique while Holos try to promote the group as whole.

>>1205782
I'm actually looking forward for a theatrical vtuber. Haachama's loreposting has raised the bar on what vtubers can do.

>>1210721
Shame that the genre will be neutered down until it is uninteresting due to "new rules"

>>1210721
there is one, Amemori Sayo, her content consists of singing, zatsudan, and short skits with literature, movies, and various cultural references
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKGTSXHS56E

>>1210721
what she's doing is literally the bare minimum for a normal youtuber

>>1207708
I really like Nijisanji but no matter what happens, this is gonna be an uphill battle to level the field, they are basically incursioning on an already saturated market, late by a year and with little to no EOP crazy fanbase to feed and shield their group, maybe they will get their fair share of Japanese Niji Gachikois who will subscribe and throw money for a while at the start but they really need to catch attention to compete with even the indies, also, if one of them goes political in anyway, it is over, doesn't matter if the mob embraces them or he/she embraces it, in fact, getting embraced by the mob could theoretically start the end of Nijisanji or the "Seventh Trumphet" type scenario in which multiple graduations start to take place in the long run.

Scary stuff.

>>1211688
And depending on when they debut, they have at most a few months to grow before Holo EN Gen 2 tries to take their momentum.

>>1206185
the article you read that in was mistranslated, its 10 million.

sorry but things will normalize and western weeboids will just flock to shit like vshojo or quit vtubers entirely

>>1210721
>>1211223
one that comes to mind that breaks the usual mold is Kongou (kongouvtuber on twitch)

He goes 24/7 kayfabe, chants japanese poems and explains them, and his core content are lectures on various themes, from the nature of melancholy, to the appeal of monstergirls.

>>1214579
It's already been proven that 100% kayfabe isn't popular.
People like some reality mixed into their Vtubers

Here's a translation of a July 2018 essay about how Mito's thin kayfabe appeals to the audience at that time. Honestly it's an interesting read as a vtuber fan.
https://vtubereview.wordpress.com/2021/02/05/tsukino-mito-drinks-water/

>>1208120
Suisei is very adamant about keeping her Hoshimachi Suisei character and not reincarnating, so that would instantly get her rejected anywhere. Even Cover could only accept her because Inonaka a new thing they were experimenting with.

>>1210172
it goes both ways but the only confirmed cases i know about are haato and hoshikawa auditioning for hololive together, hosikawa didnt pass and went to niji, the other is luna that started in niji then retired and auditioned for hololive.
About suisei she only said that she applied to many agencies although she never named then, but it's quite possible niji was one of them, in the end she went harder on hololive because her admiration for sora.

>>1205782
>there will be a Down the Rabbit Hole : VTubers at the end of this decade

>>1216772
This is a lot of words to say something that anyone who played .hack back in the day already knew: the juxtaposition between a character and the person playing the character is pretty interesting.
>>1218153
>so that would instantly get her rejected anywhere
Except S:gnal, amirite?

>>1207534
To be fair, nobody expected how much JP fans latched onto holoEN. Gura is a runaway hit and JPs adopted Kiara in a similar fashion to overseas and Towa. Cover probably expected holoEN to help weebs discover the main branch but not JPs loving EN and strengthening the main branch too

>>1208120
For me the first thing that comes to mind is that each company has really different standards, from what i have seen most nijis are pretty normal streamers with at least an average level of competence in the games they play, while there are exceptions they are very few.
On the other hand most of hololive talents have a noticeable gimmick or hook and are able to work in different venues of entertainment. then we have the fact the holo designs are made with said gimmicks in mind while most nijis don't have that benefit and are just able to choose from a set of premade models

>>1205690
>The initial VTubers were all Seiso type idols
???? No they weren't. Some of them only later turned to that once they figured out they could get money with songs and concerts.

>>1218772
Wasn't S:gnal just a bunch of indies getting together and not a company?

>>1218538
Hoshikawa never auditioned for Hololive, She said she thought about applying, but ended up not.

>>1222891
Why would she apply for a smaller, less significant company to begin with?

>>1206090
Why do nips love Apex?

>>1208603
she's gay

>>1225375
Her thought process was roughly the same as Nui's; at the time, Hololive was still quite serious about the virtual idol concept, and Hoshikawa felt it wasn't for her. She opted for Nijisanji because she wanted more freedom in her content and characterization (the whole cute slut act).

>>1225589
It just happens to be the top stream game there, like Fortnite is in the west.

>>1225589
its only popular among streamers.

>>1225680
So is Miko.

>>1204499
sora is more of a virtual idol not a virtual entertainer. shes similar to azki. in fact shes still dedicated herself to singing and dancing. although now shes changed her activity is starting to try vtubing the same way others do.

>>1225825
Checking the previous entries of the blog posted above, it was more on Sora being forced to adapt in 2020 due to COVID and growing into it. It is noticeable how bad Sora is with technology and her natural "passiveness" holds her back but the growth is still noticeable

https://vtubereview.wordpress.com/2020/12/01/a-second-concert-before-her-eyes-hololives-idol-vtuber-tokino-sora-talks-about-the-year-of-change-2020/

>>1204499
Being a top tier talent in Nijisanji doesn't really mean much if you're a Holo. Any chuuba from HoloID could easily reach that status if they switch over now to Niji. And it's really not surprising at all since this is just another case of quantity vs quality kind of thing.

>>1204499
>Nijisanji hired less talented people as time went on.
There you go. Mystery solved.

>>1225375
Nijisanji is far bigger than Hololive. And still big even now. Don't let those number in Youtube page blind you.

>>1226167
He meant the state of things before Hoshikawa's debut. With Hololive being the smaller company at the time.

>>1226220
Oh yeah I'm blind. Sorry.

>>1226167
Source? If they're really big, why are they struggling right now in comparison to Hololive in virtually all the metrics currently available. Is it because of Sony money?

>>1226318
What metrics? Just subs count? Lmao. Call me when Hololives collab with Lawson. Although I wouldn't be surprised if Hololive will reach it. But until that happen, Nijisanji will always be the biggest.

>>1226839
>Call me when Hololives collab with Lawson

You mean like they did last month?

https://www.lawson.co.jp/lab/campaign/hololive/

>>1226167
>>1226318
Nijisanji are only big in Japan, maybe a bit in Indonesia.

In the rest of the world Hololive absolutely dominates.

>>1226869
Did you really expect him to check before he talked out of his ass?

>>1226839
Man Nijiniggers are so embarassing

>>1226072
I can't see GFE dolls doing all that well in Nijisanji. They'd be surrounded by people who actually know how to do things like sing without autotune, play instruments/compose music, perform on stage, be genuinely funny, game competently, coexist with male vtubers etc. If they're not shoehorned into the same mold by Cover, they end up lost.

>>1227192
Anon, hololive isn't GFE experience, it's religious experience
You don't give them money so they suck our dick, you give them money as tribute
Instead of recommending it like most things to others you try to get others hooked on it
Stuff like this

>>1227186
This.

Hololive is simply more competent. They have understood that there's a market for virtual idols and are pandering to that demand. Nijisanji lacks direction. Singular individuals like Mito stand out due to their original content, but that's certainly not thanks to their management but due to their own ability.

>>1227192
>I can't see GFE dolls doing all that well in Nijisanji.
>implying
I bet you also think Niji can't do seiso.

>>1227263
Makes sense. You really only ever see Hololive fans evangelizing on other boards and platforms. It's pretty clear they're primarily fans of the brand, and would drop their oshis like hot potatoes if the girls ever left the fold.

>>1205782
>Idol -> comedian -> ?
Action Fighting

>>1227283
>but that's certainly not thanks to their management but due to their own ability.
that's the whole point though, that should be on the talents. The less managers get in the way or direct, the better. It's the thing nijisanji and vshojo do better than Cover.

>>1227283
>there's a market for virtual idols
But other virtual idol groups are not nearly as successful as Hololive?

>>1227340
There are two threads up for dead holos rn.

>>1227415
Because they're not as good at it.

>>1204499
We don't talk about Nijiniggers here.

>>1227430
They have even less visibility than Nijisanji. How can that happen?

>>1227340
Anon that's niji you are talking about where people are fans of the brand
Holos are closer to Greek pantheon where you respect and know of them all but focus only on few at most

>>1227437
I suggest you start to cope. Seething can fuck a man's soul.

>>1227454
Platform capitalism has a monopolising property where those that are already big develop a gravity of their own. Ultimately it's a matter of not being as good though.

Also: it's not like Nijisanji didn't have its own niche, e.g. pandering to fujoshits and trannies.

>>1227340
Holos are the first one to throw Cover and Yagoo/Management under the bus.

>>1227336
Hoshikawa is kind of the exception that proves the rule. She's more or less the only one there who heavily relies on it, and even then she turns it around and acts like a slutty heartbreaker and a gold digger instead. That wouldn't fly elsewhere.

I don't think there's anything they can't do, their whole idea is to go have a versatile talent selection. Not everyone needs to be the same kind of virtual idol.

>>1227595
>and even then she turns it around and acts like a slutty heartbreaker and a gold digger instead
So Nijisanji panders to the cuck audience?

>>1227340
>You really only ever see Hololive fans evangelizing on other boards and platforms
Because you can't speak nip and Niji is irrelevant outside of the japanese speaking net.

>>1227595
>then she turns it around and acts like a slutty heartbreaker and a gold digger instead
The true GFE experience.

>>1226318
The only metrics they lose in are sub count, views:member, and superchat.

Press releases for revenue only happen yearly, so it's hard to keep current numbers, but we can still use pretty recent ones + interviews. Still, the vtuber world is growing super fast. In terms of revenue, Yagoo recently said they did >$10m revenue in 2020. As of 3/2019->3/2020, they already did $7.3m revenue. This is all prior to HoloEN, their live concerts, China stuff, etc.

As of 4/2019->4/2020, Niji had been doing $35m in revenue. This is also prior to baseball, permissions, concerts like SitR, albums, and their series B investment. There's no way to know what their revenue is currently, since last years was just released, and we have to wait till 2020. But either way, in order for Holo to have kept up, Yagoo would have to be super generous when saying >$10m, and Niji would have to have either gotten smaller since last year, or stayed constant, both highly unlikely.

Also someone already did an estimate of Hololive's profit to superchat back when they released their 2019-2020 profits, http://blog.livedoor.jp/eientei/archives/51892518.html, and if playboard's numbers aren't screwed, they make around 3-4x more from merch/events/sponsors than superchat. The thing is, compared to Niji, they kept a lot of the profits. In the same year they did $7.3m in revenue, they did $1.8m in profits instead of reinvesting. In the year Niji did $35m in revenue, they had a grand total of $320k in profits.

There's a lot of things that went on post March 2020, so it's harder to tell the current situation, but I hope to god Yagoo has been wising up and reinvesting his money instead of sitting on it.

>>1204499
cute feet

mito is a dork though so they probably smell

>>1205782
haachama

>>1226839
lets also forget about holo colab with noodles

>>1227614
I see that being more of a Hololive thing, where the vtubers pander heavily to the audience, but they're all already taken. Hoshikawa is up front about her shtick, so you can handle it however you want. Being a cuck is really only a desirable thing among americans, others are capable of healthier mindsets.

>>1227626
Why is that relevant when we're talking about the western scene? It doesn't change the fact that in here, holofags are everywhere, proselytizing even in threads that aren't made for them. They even think it's smart to go make Hololive threads on /v/ of all places, thinking the tards there don't see them as neo-bronies.

>>1227637
You could say that she's yet another case of someone outdoing Hololive at their own niche, I suppose.

>>1226869
nijiniggers on suicide watch

>>1227948
>they're all already taken
Their personas aren't and that's what attracts people. If you worship a slutty persona, you're even less than a cuck since it's your own choice.

>>1227486
You're a bit off, but if Hololive is all you know, it's understandable. Console wars, numberfagging and schizo rrats are something unique to holofags and not really found in other threads until they pay a visit. There's no point in being a fan of the Nijisanji brand itself when there's so many vtubers under it, anway. You just go with your favourites. In that way, your pantheon comparison is pretty healthy, except for the fact that at the end of the day, these are both just corporations, and they're not entitled to viewers' respect or loyalty.

>>1228248
>worship a persona
Sounds pathetic, really. I seek entertainment, not a pretend girlfriend. Hoshikawa's cheeky antics are amusing, but really I find a few other nijis far more interesting yet. For example, Chaika has a knack for physical comedy in 3D streams, while Chima is an amazing singer with the occasional interesting twist to her singing streams.

>>1218772
>>1218948
Yeah, S:gnal was never a company, just a random indie group that died shortly after it was created.

>>1210425
Why do people think this just because he has bigger numbers than the rest

>>1229174
>Hoshikawa's cheeky antics are amusing
t. watches for the pretend girlfriend experience

>>1230495
He's their top earner and the only one really growing in popularity.

>>1205782
Vtuber ARGs, maybe some sort of interactivity between viewer and actor/ress

>>1231859
Not really, funnily enough thanks to him a lot of people have discovered and started watching the others as well

>>1231859
Top earner in superchat. You make it sound as if Kuzuha alone is responsible for 90% of Nijisanji's revenue when it's more like less than 10%.

>>1232154
If one person is responsible for ten percent of their earnings in a company with 100 earners, then there's a huge problem with that company and their loss would be a monumental issue.

>>1232205
Which is why I said less than 10%. You're also overstating the actual amount of members that don't just stream once a week.

That said, it's also not exactly uncommon in talent agencies. If you go to talent agencies, one person making it big can usually carry nearly the entire company.

>>1232205
It's the same in Hololive though? If you take superchat as a microcosm of how well their merch sells proportionally, both Coco and Rushia make 11%-13% of Hololive each.

>>1231859
>>1232154
Different guy. I haven't watched any of his videos, but what's not-Tokyo Ghoul's appeal?

>>1232848
Maybe watch to find out?

>>1205782

>>1232848
He's just riding hard off of Apex which is super popular. Also pretty entertaining, and I guess some people like his neet streamer feel with how regularly he streams.

>>1232004
Ichikara's doing something like that with Yumenographia. It's a VR service where you talk to and interact with virtual actors in a variety of environments. A merger of ARGs and vtubing is certainly a possibility down the line.

>>1232205
You probably don't have the numbers or a grasp of what Nijisanji is to Ichikara. Kuzuha earns big, but if you're building your company solely on superchat revenue, you're not going to get much of a company put together. Certainly not something on the scale of Ichikara or Cover. You'll need other venues for income.

If Kuzuha leaves, Nijisanji will keep trucking on. It's Ichikara's marketing arm for their AR, VR and 3D mocap solutions, they're not going to get shuttered over one graduation. You also assume that Nijisanji is stagnant or shrinking, even though they're steadily growing. Just because everyone's not making Kuzuha (or Hololive) subs doesn't mean they're not doing just fine. Subs aren't a perfect gauge of your fame and profitability, as subs can be dead. I've been one for Roboco for months.

As for Kuzuha himself? He may own his character design, but not the models Nijisanji has commissioned for him. He'd have to at least roll back to an older L2D. He'd also miss out on collabs with his friends, 3D streams, performing on stage etc. all of which he seems to enjoy. All he'd have left is Youtube, Apex and fujobux 'til the end of time. All things considered, he might consider his lot at Nijisanji pretty cozy. I figure that he'd only quit if he got tired of vtubing/performing in general.

Though maybe there's a spot open for him in Hololive gen 6.

>>1205894
Mito is great but she isn't the best they have to offer at all lol

>>1207713
Because only superchat matters. Not merchandise that Niji fans in JP buy in tons. Have you ever tried to see their store? How much stuff there are? Matsuri which is a hololive vtuber has tons of their stuff.

>>1208120
I don't know where you heard that Suisei tried to do that for Nijisanji. She only tried it for actual idol agencies.

>>1204611
If only Kuzuha wasn't scouted as an indie.Aside from that, scouting doesn't happen for each company since 2018.

>>1210584
Lmao rampant bullying culture. what the fuck are you even talking about. It's ridiculous how you guys believe on those narratives. That's why it's impossible to discuss nijisanji in 4chan.

>>1231642
I'd actually rather go for Furen, if I had to choose someone. I'm a sucker for a good, hearty chuckle.

>>1233549
>but not the models Nijisanji has commissioned for him
As if that matters. It's not like someone else can just take over his character.

>>1227283
Saying things like that shows how you don't know anything about Nijisanji. Mito isn't even the most talented people in Nijisanji. Others taht came after her are much more talented.

>>1233759
You misunderstand. I was talking about Kuzuha's personal situation in that paragraph; it's at least a temporary setback to his presentational quality and recognizability, and a hassle to get new models commissioned.

>>1233742
>That's why it's impossible to discuss nijisanji in 4chan
You gotta fling the shit in equal amounts. It's actually kinda fun, there are so many holofags swarming in these bait threads, and none ever really know what they're talking about.

>>1232848
He's an autist around women and he's good at shooters.

>>1234515
>He's an autist around women
This isn’t even really true and it’s not why people like him

>>1234555
I know he heavily plays it up for his character, I just want the autistic anons to feel good about themselves.

>>1227755
The next step in vtuber evolution, Homie Novis.

>>1234626
>I know he heavily plays it up for his character
Eh it's not even that, it's not just women he's shy with at first, but people in general unless they share a common interest with each other or their personalities instantly mesh
He does play the antisocialism up a little though as it is a part of his character but it's mostly genuine and lately he's been opening himself up more

>>1207006
Towa...

>>1207877
Destiny to hololive pretty soon.

>>1230495
>Kuzuha's 2020 earnings: $524,000
>Tomoe's 2020 earnings(top earning female in Nijisanji): $251,000
Even among men Kuzuha dominates the others, 1/4 of Kagami's earnings(the only Niji to come remotely close to him) is from his 3D debut and even then there's an over $100,000 gap

>>1239211
Hololive is known for having high superchats, and even there >>1227711 it makes up less than 25% of their revenue. Why would you ever use superchat as any indicator of earnings for non-indies? Even just from Tomoe's earnings you should've realized how insignificant superchat is.

>>1239211
Yeah, SC is just showing how hard simps can spend money on them, not popularity like how some small gatcha game can survive with a small group of whales, and you have people like Mayuzumi who only turns it on once for shit and giggle to see it climbs up and then turns it off for the rest of his streams

>>1204499
Mito's specialty is zatsudans and story telling. So it's best to compare her with Marine if you want a similar hologirl. Both are basically the best at that in the vtuber realm, and make their 3d showings very entertaining. Mito can dance though so she has the leg up.

>>1233698
Considering that Toko is a niji, Suisei definitely applied as well. If she did qualify, ichikara is definitely big enough to refuse her self-insert, which was a dealbreaker

>>1205690
>The initial VTubers were all Seiso type idols.
>kizuna ai, the first big vtuber became so due her sailor mouth and being open in her materialistic dreams
she is cute but seizo?

>>1227192
GFE will never do well in nijisanji because the fans are sexless https://youtu.be/eZfBesWFFc8

>>1211533
so the rest of holos are below minimum?
wew

>>1204499
what a retarded question. Here's a better one, why is Hololive so successful and Niji such a failure?

>>1225690
Retardchama Hololive didn't start as idols, it wasn't until late gen 2 that they rebranded as virtual idols. Hoshikawa saw the ad for Aki Haato but didn't like the character setting.

>>1241101
Because you only browse this board

>>1241158
clipwatcher

>>1229174
You type like a faggot. Is this really the average nijinigger?

>>1241206
? He's right though. Besides branding Sora as an idol and Suisei as self-branded, they didn't advertise being idols until gen 2. They had planned on debuting idols, but gen 1 was most definitely not idols.

Hoshikawa never said she changed her mind because of the idol thing either, only Nui did.

>>1241321
Depends, are you the average holowatcher?

>>1227340
People followed Aloe after she went indie, well those that know she continued anyway and have money to get her fanbox

>>1240429
Mito is not as marketable though if her superchat numbers is any indication. In terms of the value that they contribute to their respective company, Marine is known as a team player able to provide the needed collabs to her lower tier colleagues. The lack of controversies surrounding Mito may also be considered as another indication that she is no longer as relevant as she once was two years ago.
Mito has had much success in the past but I don't think she can be put on the same pedestal as Marine right now. But if she ever transfers to Holo, she could easily be at the mid-tier to high low-tier status wise.

>>1227340
>>1241504
New Aloe has in fact already surpassed most of the Nijis' latest gen talents.

>>1241639
Mito doesnt really turn supacha on. Its a false metric for her. Like YT sora memberships before she turned it on

>>1241639
Marine is not as marketable though if her superchat numbers is any indication. In terms of the value that they contribute to their respective company, Mito is known as a team player able to provide the needed collabs to her lower tier colleagues. The lack of controversies surrounding Marine may also be considered as another indication that she is no longer as relevant as she once was two years ago.
Marine has had much success in the past but I don't think she can be put on the same pedestal as Mito right now. But if she ever transfers to Niji, she could easily be at the mid-tier to high low-tier status wise.

>>1232004
We've had a few already. Izumo Kasumi already wound down her channel after completing her ARG "storyline"; Mayuzumi Kai still works elements in. There's also stuff like Project;Cold's murder mystery.

>>1241639
first of all, mito has her donations turns off most of the time. Second, she's too fucking japanese and her jokes lose all nuance when clippers even attempt at translating them

Sora is fucking boring

>>1227192
All that "talent" and their most popular livers are a fujo vampire that plays apex for 6+ hours every day and a NND shitposter, while a lot of their livers struggle to break past 1000 viewers.

>>1228284
Nijifags in vyt shat on Ai-chan when she was on top, they like to act innocent when they go out of their way to shitpost/bantz outside their thread.

Niji defense force in full force today.

holorats not used to people correcting them outside of their bubble

>>1240993
you know what they say, you're seiso if you say so

>>1241791
>>1241899
Do nijifags even watch mito?
https://playboard.co/en/channel/UCD-miitqNY3nyukJ4Fnf4_A/videos

>>1242122
>nijifags
>watching streams
lol

>>1204499
Unlike Mito, Sora wasn't the reason why Hololive became popular. It only started gaining popularity two years after her debut and on account of other members. Sora just was the first the same way Roboco was the second without much else to it.

>>1241975
>implying that popularity=talent
Clearly you think annoying orange is the most talented vtuber.

>Nijifags in vyt shat on Ai-chan when she was on top
Nice pretending. Here, why don't you go look at the archives and point out where you see any significant amount of shitflinging towards Ai from Nijis.
https://yuki.la/search.html?boards=jp&startdate=2008-02-02&enddate=2021-03-06&sort=descending&subject=virtual%20youtubers#page=30

>>1241899
Not saying Mito isn't talented but an important part of marketability is being able to cater to a wider audience. I think if she wants to stay relevant, she needs to reinvent herself like what Sora is doing right now. Vtubing landscape changes so fast with the introduction of the western audience

>>1242122
She has a higher view to stream length ratio than Marine. What do you think?

>>1242699
muh sub numbers, muh supa chatto bla bla

>>1242699
30 seconds on Playboard proves this is a load of BS.

>>1248124
Maybe if you spent more than 30 seconds it wouldn't look like such BS. Marine's views per minute streamed in the past month were 2226.07. Mito's views per minute streamed in the past month were 3051.24. The difference gets larger if you count back to January, and slightly smaller if you go back to Dec. The longer you go back, the slightly larger it gets since Mito rarely does long streams for non-events while getting consistent amounts of views.

>>1249390
Since this is the spoonfeeding board
Can you tell me how to check these statistics?

>>1249390
Yes, it's almost like Holos stream more than Nijis.

Shocking.

>>1251631
man I never thought I'd see a holo fan invoke the quantity over quality from their side.

>>1205782
All my favorite tubers are comedian.

>>1241975
>Nijifags in vyt shat on Ai-chan when she was on top
Oh, so you are that schizo and still trying to force your narrative huh?

>>1208120
It's no secret that Yagoo has always sold holo to the overseas market before the domestic one. Niji doesn't have bilibili only streams for example. It's why niji has a far stronger presence in Japan vs holo. No matter how much you show evidence to the case holofags pretend it's not true. From the perspective of a foreign viewer it might seem the case niji has no marketing behind it, but it's more that foreign viewers are barely being catered to up until recent.

>>1207534
This too though.

>>1249390
Can you explain to me how the youtube views are calculated? Fubuki had like 6k live viewers when I checked her stream, stream ends and the view count put the total at 58k. The fuck is going on here? I believe some anon also mentioned that Towa was getting less live viewers then some girl she was collabing with but then the stream ends and her total views are blowing that girl out.

>>1256419
>Fubuki had like 6k live viewers when I checked her stream, stream ends and the view count put the total at 58k
Not him, but I wondered this yesterday myself after Deron's "ASMR" stream, she hit about 4k live viewers but after the end her total view count was ~40k. I figured it could be the turnover rate of viewers. Plenty people visit but don't stick around for very long, and still get counted towards total views. Some follow the streams but lag behind real-time, so they may not be counted towards live views.

Wasn't there some kind of a Youtube bug that caused people who run ad blockers to not be counted towards live views, too? I'm not at all sure on the specifics.

>>1256471
Idk, some anons in the other thread were saying that along with the holotools/embedded links not counting as viewers.

>>1256236
>Niji doesn't have bilibili only streams
Some of them do.

>>1256419
Youtube hates hololive

>>1256419
Worse is when EN streams, gets 8k live viewers and the stream ends 1-2 hours later with 150k+ views.

>>1256419
Live views = how many people are watching at that moment (minus spam viewers and supposedly adblock users / third-party viewers)

Total views = how many unique valid users that watched for X minutes over the lifetime of the stream / video

>>1258883
The adblock would make sense with Towa seeing as half her audience is western.
I've noticed the viewer "bug" mostly affects EN while JP tends to be fairly accurate.

>>1258919
The only things that are sure, are that youtube views won't count if you use any form of blocking cookies, the user must watch for at least 30 seconds even if they skip around for videos longer than that. If you're logged into a google account, you only need to watch for more than 30 seconds. Youtube definitely counts embeds, just not if the embed code is broken, or the video plays on autoplay. Adblock is a bit more iffy, since some of them use a form of embed and are broken, while some block cookies. Usually they make completely blocking cookies an opt-in though. Also at the end of the video, they always audit views if your view count is higher than 301, which is why the view count might go down after a stream ends if someone was botting/spamming it.

Basically, adblock will not always count, but usually it does if nothing broke with your browser version and the plug in. Incognito will never count unless you are logged into a google account. Whether or not there's a viewer "bug", it has nothing to do with adblock. Or well, it could have, but it has nothing to do with youtube's side. You also only see any mention of the bug from Holo-related stuff, but it's possible that most don't really have a huge subreddit that does numbers.

Discrepancy in live viewers vs view count at the end is usually because people rotate in and out very often. Each view also doesn't necessarily have to be from a unique ip. Youtube supposedly checks your ip to make sure you can't watch again in a short time frame, but I can go to a video right now and increase it's view count multiple times, so it's most likely not true.

>>1260187
Oh right, also incognito doesn't hide you for a live viewer count, but your views most likely won't count at the end of a video either. It doesn't really make sense for youtube to use cookies for a live viewer tracker.

>>1226318
Because that is how the west see it but in reality they are doing better than the Holos...but only a bunch of them.
Niji has a bigger roster of livers compared to Holo but the thing is Hololive boost is affecting all it's livers, indeed some of them are inclining more than others but their grow is in groups (Even Mel and Choco are slowly inclining after youtube being autistic with them). While on Niji only a few, but very few are inclining from the big roster they have. And with Holo catching up due their western boost those nijis that were left behind are now way far on the back while the ones on top are even bigger than all the holos in Japan...but nobodies outside of it.
So the nijis are doing fine, but only the ones that were already doing good (the fact that the lastest generation of Niji got overshadowed by Holofive despite them being overshadowed by Holo EN is already a sign Holo was catching up) while the rest are literally being devoured by the holos, even by their ID branch. (Ollie alone managed to beat the fuck out all the ID generations of the Nijis).

>>1267117
>ollie is now more popular than nijis worldwide
it is such a weird feeling
>>1260187
i think tanother rat is the one about youutbe not counting or taking time to process oversee viewers depending on the channel location. So live viewers for high EOPs or EN streamers with high JOPS are kinda lower than normal now.
Yesterday Nui was streaming FFXV for 3 hours and Mori streamed Gulty Gear for 1 hour.
Nui had 6k average wile mori had 5k
yet mori views at the end of ther stream were double of what nui had after triple the lenght.

>>1267117
>the lastest generation of Niji got overshadowed by Holofive
I wonder if this is the last time we'll see a HS generation?

>>1267406
That's the thing I also noticed, Nijis VOD numbers are extremely low compared to the Holos despite that some of them manage to get more live viewers than the holos while streaming.
Stuff like Kanata getting her ass whiped out by Sans on Undertale VOD getting one million views despite being 11+ hours and during the stream she topped around 20k on live viewers show me either youtube bug is not a schizo rrat or Holos talent as streamers are good enough for replaybility.

https://youtu.be/MP99yErC_PM

Yeah. I like the hentai that do about her.

>>1256419
>>1267406
My theory is that multiple viewers have a higher chance of having the same IPv4 thanks to CGNAT if they're all from the same region, and IP addresses could factor into whether or not a view will count in the final tally.

>>1267822
>>1267406
High view numbers compared to concurrent live viewers usually means more people are jumping in and out of the stream rather than staying or leaving the stream open. It's impossible to know whether the people watching are unique viewers or not, only the streamer themselves and youtube have access to that metric. The only way to tell is comparing view to stream ratio to generally get how many times someone might jump in and out per how many hours or whenever youtube publishes total hours watched divided by stream time, but there's so many other factors like whether it's a special event, whether it was promoted somewhere, what type of content, the time it was streamed, whether youtube takes time to audit the views, etc.

One example is this >>1267406, Mori currently at 88k for a 101 minute stream, Nui at 89k for a 240 minute FFXV stream. Both sides can rrat all day about whether it means Nui's viewers stayed to watched while Mori's jumped in and out, or whether it means Mori has 4x the regular amount of viewers/reach than Nui, but no one knows unique viewer numbers. You always have to consider whether a game they're playing normally has people coming/going, has high viewers or not, etc. which is why it's always better to look at a trend instead, or look at multiple factors. For example, 2 hours compared to 4 hour is pretty significant, Mori isn't streaming it for the first time compared to Nui, it's unknown whether GG or FFXV should be counted as a buff or not, but GG theoretically should have people leaving and coming back less. Still, you can easily guess that Mori most likely has a higher number of unique viewers, even though it's to be expected since she has 4x the subs. You can also probably make the guess, that there's a considerably higher amount of dead subs on Mori's channel, at least for GG content, compared to Nui's view:sub ratio. She also does enough streams so that covers don't impact that too much, besides RIP.

One example you can take about why you don't cherry pick videos is >>1267822. Sans endurance is known for having people check back over and over to see whether they've finally beaten Sans or not. You can see multiple people punch way above their viewer numbers. Undertale is also getting popular among Hololive as a whole, so initial/eventful streams might get a slight buff, along with post stream views for people checking in. This isn't her initial stream, but you can see Sans doing his work here.

She's done 8 undertale streams, totaling 3571 minutes, with 3.597m views, averaging 1007 views per minute streamed. The thing is, the N routes also either had people stay for a long time, or people just weren't interested in the N routes, the latter being more likely if you compare to her other streams. Genocide is doing a lot of heavy lifting, not just for Kanata, but a lot of streamers too. If you only looked at one video, you would end up drawing the conclusion that Kanata was as popular as Pekora/Korone/Kuzuha.

>>1268760
You can test this yourself, just go to any video under 300 views, watch for 30 seconds accepting cookies, and then do it again right after. Your view is clearly counted again. Whether live viewer->views afterwards discards views from the same IP is possible, but you can test just by setting up a stream and viewing it twice from another IP. You would also be implying that the amount of views right after the stream ends is the number of unique viewers which seems highly unlikely for some highest concurrent viewer vs video view discrepancies, especially on low length streams.

>>1204499
Sora is an idol. I pretty much only watch her music videos.

>>1239211
>Tomoe
This is a massive surprise for me. I guess the dyke audience pays somehow.

>>1218861
>from what i have seen most nijis are pretty normal streamers with at least an average level of competence in the games they play, while there are exceptions they are very few.
You only say this because you only know hololive well. Without rose tinted glasses it's easy to see how someone like Fubuki, for example, is mediocre.

>>1278802
Fubuki is extremely likeable though. She may not have any particular skill or talent that stands out aside from zatsudan, but she's still a personality like the other Holos. Suisei is an okay singer, and Marine and Flare are legitimately good at drawing, but those aren't the traits we love in them.

>>1279057
I don't think >>1278802 was saying anything beyond how competent they are at gaming. Seeing something like there are very few exceptions to being an average level of competence to the games they play is such a redflag that this person has barely watched anyone for more than half an hour.

The only thing he said that was factually true is that for auditions, Nijisanji has a model in mind and auditions for that model, while Hololive will create a model specifically for whoever passed the auditions.

>>1279296
>while Hololive will create a model specifically for whoever passed the auditions.
Except this isn't true at all. We know for a fact that as late as third gen, Cover already had characters designed that people were auditioning for and there's nothing to suggest that this has changed for later gens. The talents are free to make suggestions for the character they choose, but I highly doubt Cover makes any character from scratch based on what the talents they hire want.

>>1204499
>Highest popularity and relevance in her company; still its strongest talent two years on
But thats tokyo ghoul

>>1279991
i think the talents still have an input on the character designs themselves to some degree. Gura is a big example of that.

>>1279991
Yeah, fair enough. I actually wonder just how much the artists have a say in the process. For example, Fubuki's mama (papa?) just churns out foxes for anyone who'll hire them.

>>1207534
>The way you wrote that sentence assumes Hololive is doing better than Nijisanji in Japan when it's the opposite
If nijisanji is more popular in japan why the weekly jump´s poll shows more hololive talents?

>>1207164
Kindly reminder that Hololive had a well established fanbase outside of japan before EN debut, nijisanji doesnt

>>1233679
I would actually like some proof about merch sales, nijifags always talks about merch but I never saw anyone giving clear numbers, at least you can compare SC

>>1280599
https://camp-fire.jp/projects/view/306908
One of the many

>>1280362
Maybe they just went off of sub numbers considering Akari/Luna/Shiro are still there? I mean, even Kaf is there. Or whoever designed the poll just looked up a list of vtubers in 2021 and went off that?

You could just as easily ask if Hololive is more popular in Japan, why are there more yahoo questions about Nijisanji everyday, or why does Nijisanji appear in google search trends more often in Japan, or why are there no Hololive members in MoguraVR's surveys? Because trying to draw any conclusion from only 1 irrelevant point is meaningless.

Why don't you respond to >>1227711 in a number that's actually relevant?

>>1280599
Not sure about the availability of precise data on merch income. Someone posted some general revenue/profit data for both companies at >>1227711, though, and it gives some insight into the impact of superchats at least.

>>1280816
maybe cause he is not giving any sauce about his numbers?

>>1280782
ok, show me the other "many"

>>1280599
>>1227711 Hololive did $7.3m in revenue from 3/2019 to 3/2020. Their superchat was less than 25% of that. Nijisanji did $35m in revenue from 4/2019 to 4/2020. Any more recent numbers either haven't come out, or aren't relevant. The most recent number is that Hololive's Capital Stock as of 9/2020 is $4.3m, while Nijisanji's is $26.7m, but it doesn't really mean anything in terms of popularity. Yagoo also said they did >$10m in revenue in 2020, but that doesn't mean anything when it can range from 10-99. Similarly, Nijisanji had a huge series b investment in April, and the vtuber scene overall has shown huge growth, even if Hololive leads in % of growth, they would need to have grown 5x larger than whatever rate Nijisanji grew at to match revenue.

>>1280816
>Maybe they just went off of sub numbers considering Akari/Luna/Shiro are still there?

That doesnt explain why people like Watson and Ina is not there but RBC is

>>1280915
Company press releases are public, so I thought people could easily just google them but I guess this is the spoonfeeding board and not /jp/.

Revenue releases
https://twitter.com/hamanaka334/status/1366013506877673476

Yagoo
https://signal.diamond.jp/articles/-/527

Capital Stock
https://p2y.jp/nijisanji-ichikara-the-capital-has-exceeded-2-6-billion-yen/

Superchat to profit, also in original post
http://blog.livedoor.jp/eientei/archives/51892518.html

Cover's profit, also in the previous link
https://gamebiz.jp/?p=271720

Ichikara's profit
https://gamebiz.jp/?p=289969

>>1280966
Can you give a source for this numbers pls?

>>1281058
I like to know where people gets their numbers since most tends to be bullshit

>>1281008
Just tossing out reasons, main point is that there doesn't seem to be any consistent reason for that mix of vtubers. For all we know they could have just done a random email for recommendations, just asked within the company who watches what, etc.

Why do you guys like numbers so much, just watch what you enjoy ffs

>>1281365
It's a Holo vs. Niji thread, numbers tend to come up. This has been impressively civil, in fact. There are plenty of holo threads on the board for holofags to choose from, and a couple niji threads for nijiniggers too if you just want to discuss your vtubers of choice.

>>1205690
>Kaguya Luna
Boys, will she stream again? ;_;

>>1281516
>six months since her last video
geez

>>1281516
Only her roommate is relevant and she was vtubing as a hobby, so no

>>1210206
Don't forget that Sora is invited to a lot of events to the point that she declined to appear in Bloom because she was already too busy with other events

>>1227614
Matsuri's dream all along

>>1240429
Yeah, from JK Gumi isn't Rin the more comparable to Sora?

>>1281177
that´s not how popularity polls work anon

>>1210206
On a monthly basis it doesn't seem so? Mito gained 4.4m, 5.4m, 7.7m, and 4.1m views in the past 4 months with only 4 videos in Feb., while Sora is consistently gaining 3.1m, 3.7m, 3.8m, 3.9m views for the past 4 months. This also doesn't even count the fact that Sora has nearly twice as many uploaded videos in the time frame, although both do generally stream as long per video. Sora is definitely gaining in subs though, to which the natural question is, are these subs actually watching her?

>>1233891
>>1233742
coping like always, that´s why you are the joke of the industry

>>1282432
Multiple popularity polls in JP often have choices just dependent on whoever making the poll deciding what to put on it. Just go take a look at the FGO, Cygames, or Famitsu surveys. Some of the choices to "which of x do you like" make 0 sense. The choices they decide to put on a popularity poll aren't usually decided from them hosting another prior popularity poll.

>>1256419
Think of it like this:

I have 10 viewers at the beginning of the stream, roughly each every 10 minutes a viewer leaves but another joins, I stream for 5 hours, my live viewers never surpassed 10 at any time yet at the end of the stream the view count is at 40

There's nothing wrong with that statistic and that is roughly what's happening with those streams that get such a boost after they end, after all not many can commit to watch an entire stream but can probably see 30 minutes or an hour

>>1282300
I really don't think any of JK Gumi is comparable to Sora in the first place. Rin is hardly an idol, and isn't great at singing either. Plus she just spams FF14 and other autist games, which obviously isn't Sora either. If anything Kaede might be the closest, as both are more focused on non-stream events, but even then Sora still streams like 3x the amount Kaede does, way more if you don't count Kaede's Apex spam either.

>>1282510
Don't be such a nu-brony, we're not on /v/ here. I started off as a holofag myself (and still consider myself one), but slowly slipped towards watching niji and an assortment of indies because they tend to cater to my interests better. I still sub to Fubuki, Pekora and Suisei, even if I don't catch their streams all the time anymore. I just prioritize Chaika, Furen, Chima or Haru when stream times overlap. It's a better life when you give up the console wars.

>>1280816
> or why does Nijisanji appear in google search trends more often in Japan
Not sure about the queries, but there's no fucking way for me to remember all of the niji fags so I end up googling them pretty often unlike holos so I don't think thats a valid point.

>>1283125
No one calls themselves a holofag, stupid nijinigger

>>1283136
>I'm a retard so everyone else must be too
Don't think that's a valid point

>>1283349
>don't watch holos exclusively
>no longer allowed to be a holofag
I didn't know there was a one drop rule in place in this community, wew.

>>1283136
Well, it's specifically because those aren't valid points. You can come up with any number of reasons why they aren't, just like why it's pointless to use choices on a jump survey to try and surmise who the most popular vtubers in Japan are.

>>1267822
Because most of people who watching holo are EOPs, they come to stream, watch 5 minutes but can't understand Japanese then fuck off and another comes in and repeat for the rest of the stream while most of people who watching niji are Japanese, they will stay with the stream to an end

>>1280189
That guy has the sameface for age already, Fubuki's face is copy/paste face from his old work

>>1288188
Doesn't explain Mori being affected (EOP viewers, English streamer) >>1267406
In fact JP holos aren't even affected that much compared to Mori and Uto for example, so I think that anon's explanation might be right.

>>1280362
Thay take it from this
https://virtual-youtuber.userlocal.jp/document/ranking/
Very lazy editor if you ask me

>>1288288
Maybe EOP audience has lower attention span in general?

>>1288307
Maybe, but it seems like the US based Holo ENs aren't affected as much either, which is why I think it might be related to different location like what the other anon was saying.

>>1288318
It can be both

>>1288355
Yeah, probably multiple factors playing into it.

>>1204499
The idol act is behind the times and meant for an era of non interactive entertainment when media was not on demand. In short sora is too sterile as a form of entertainment, like a doll kept behind a glass display case, whereas all the other holos are like friends on a video call.

>>1288820
Saying this after Sora dialled up her GFE act by a lot comes across as bait.

>>1288820
>sora is too sterile as a form of entertainment, like a doll kept behind a glass display case
She's been making adjustments.

>>1288841
>>1288852
Yeah, that's what I'm kinda getting at, she needed to reinvent herself.

>>1288852
>>1288820
Yeah, Sora needs to get with the times and start dating Miko.

>>1281516
>kaguya luna
>streaming
????????????

>>1290408
Sorry anon, Sora-nee is already in an incestuous relationship with her imouto Loafy.

mito's stream today was fun.

>>1290455
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

>>1204499
Talk shit about Sora one more time and I will end you

>>1290541
Is...is Daisenpai eble to fit this much in her mouth!?

>>1256625
>Expecting the newfag niji autist to not talk out of his ass

Ichikara has been pandering to non JOP way before Holo decided to appeal to wetern market.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-JSeFfovhNsEhftt1WHMvg/featured

Their official english channel has been around longer than Cover's auditions for EN. Uploading official clips and still hiring people for clipping, translation, etc.
Yet still haven't reached the level of Hololive in terms of notoriety for non JOP. At best Ange Katrina, Gundou Mirei, Lulu and Mito managed to be noticed but still far from reaching the middle popular holos.
The thing is Niji current forte are it's ikemen and the western market still really not that interested on male vtubers yet. Holostars is barely doing baby steps with the Hololive boom and if you look at the western indies is always the female ones that get noticed (Code Miko, Vshojo).
So in a sense male vtuber market is still untapped outside asia but also a risky one since the streaming scene overall is dominated by males.
Once Niji En debuts, take for granted their female ones will be the ones to attract the public, at least the first gen.

>>1292087
>He doesn't know

>>1292376
Holostars are probably already more popular in the West than Nijisanji as a whole. Potential Niji EN males already have a competitor with bigger presense than them. Essentially the same situation as with females but on a smaller scale.

>>1292643
More popular is a stretch, enough to be a competitor? Definitely.

>>1292643
anon imagine begin this delusional when the nijisanji boys fucking shits on them, hell kanae trended in goddamn indonesia

>>1290534
Miko is the weakest Sora ship:
> AZKi was the newbie that had the courage to drop -senpai and started calling her Sora-chan, aimed towards being close with her from very early in her career and they formed SorAZ making concerts together, Sora personally called AZKi a partner for life in her 20th birthday
> Suisei admired her from the very beginning and asked Sora to notice her and not only Sora did notice her, she had a hand in making sure she joined Hololive, nowadays they are quite close IRL and have made a couple of incredible duets
> Iofi came out of nowhere, being the first overseas Holo girl in requesting a collab with her, not only did they end up discovering they have similar tastes and are nowadays considered sisters, they also have their own segment to talk about their shared interests


Miko watched her from the beginning like Suisei and cried once in her arms, that's about all there's to them, sure they got married in Minecraft, but they divorced within 5 minutes and their one song they sang together was for marketing, not to mention PekoMiko is the better Miko ship and Miko also goes on rants on how attracted she's to blondes, specially Haachama

Heck, I can even say Coco is a better ship for Sora than Miko:
* Early on Sora asked Coco for singing collab, she didn't care that Coco wasn't ready for singing streams, she wanted to sing with Coco anyways
* Sora was cheering for her in a tournament Coco somehow got in even though she lacked a Switch at the time
* Coco invited Sora to meme review, she said yes, during said meme review, Sora alluded at her believing so much in Coco that she thinks she'll eventually carry the whole company harder than Sora herself ever did

>>1292376
This is true actually, at the very least Ichikara is making some effort to pander to the non JOP audience for quite a while, they even had like 10 or so Chuubas fucking make some posts on their official Reddit and shit

>>1292643
Nah, even i as someone that likes Holostar have to recognize this isn't true, they are definitely starting to become potential competitors in the west but saying they are already more popular is quite a long stretch

>>1226318
> Sony money
Amazing, it always comes as if Hololive also don't have big investors.

>>1288820
Sounds more like you're behind the times? Idols being "non-interactive" was only true for 80s era idols. This completely flipped from the 2000s onwards with Hello! Project, AKB48, and seiyuu idol groups.

>>1296299
Cover investors are shit compared to Ichikara's ones.
Even worst now that they are on bad terms with the chinese market and even big companies like Asus had gave them the middle finger live.
Honestly is a miracle Hololive is on the top about vtubing worlwide after all the missmanagements they had done.

>>1267117
Few? Majority of their roster in JP are doing well.