/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.8510906]

Is using game guides cheating?

[Anonymous No.8510907]

>>8510906
>can't even post a retro guide

[Anonymous No.8510909]

Yes, now repent zoomer.

[Anonymous No.8510910]

>>8510907
Sorry I didn't have a guide for posting images :(

[Anonymous No.8510913]

yes, but nobody cares. the point is to have fun.

[Anonymous No.8510948]

>soulful published print guide
No
>internet guide printed out
Yes
>Internet guide from your cell phone
Extra yes

[Anonymous No.8510962]

>>8510906
No of course not.

[Anonymous No.8510973]

>>8510906
It's not a "real" cheating because you don't broke the game's rules but you broke your experience from learning the game's secrets on your own.
Basically, you've just repeated after somebody's else (a better player's) playthrough, you didn't use your own thinking to overcome the game's challenge (only mechanically). It's certainly something that is not worth to be proud of.

But, considering that some games offer pretty unfair challenge and force you to use game guide, it may be okay. Nobody have to keep up with the developers bullshit.

[Anonymous No.8510981]

>>8510906
Any console game - yes, it's cheating
Any PC adventure/RPG game - no it's not cheating these games are retarded

[Anonymous No.8511001]

>>8510906
I think it's fine because you're still the one in control who has to put in the right inputs and play right to win, with some titles a guide will only get you so far. However, there is a matter of you spoiling yourself from the experience, especially when finding secrets is one of the keys aspects of the adventure you're playing. I feel that you should avoid guides in your 1st playthrough, and then maybe use it after that to see if you missed out on anything.

Still, let's say you're stuck, in that case I don't see much of an issue, sure, try to solve it by yourself before using a guide, test things out, experiment and maybe you'll figure it all out on your own, but if it doesn't work out and especially if you feel like you're about to give up, then just use it, I think it's much better to use a guide and somewhat spoil the experience than refuse to use it and end up having no experience at all, don't feel bad about it.

Now, another thing that's important to remember is that a lot of retro titles were made with something in mind, and that is that most kids would only have a few cartridges at best, so they'd play the same thing over and over again to the point where they'd figure out everything there was to see at some point, nowadays we have less time, or just more options in our backlog that we'd like to play, so we don't like spending to much time finding out things.

[Anonymous No.8511092]

>>8510948
What about print guide but read on your phone?

[Anonymous No.8511104]

>>8510906
Not necessarily.

[Anonymous No.8511121]

>>8510906
They are soulful supplementary material for games you are already well-acquainted with. Like bigger instruction manuals but with even more soul. But actually needing them to beat the game is shameful.

[Anonymous No.8511170]

>>8510906
Frankly it depends on the genre and anyone saying otherwise is stupid. Using a guide for something like Zelda is much different than say something like Gradius

[Anonymous No.8511171]

>>8510906
Depends on the source
>Manual or pack-in guide
Not cheating
>Video game magazine
Not cheating
>Game-specific guide/strategy book
Only cheating if used on the first playthrough, otherwise not cheating
>Cheat code book
Cheating
>Text or Picture guide on the internet
Cheating
>Watching a video of the game and using it as a guide
Spoilers, cheating, and at that point why are you playing the game if you're just gonna do this?

[Anonymous No.8511178]

>>8511092
Double cheating

[Anonymous No.8511182]

>>8511171
>using an official guide on a second playthrough isn't cheating
>but using any kind of third party guide is regardless of context

[Anonymous No.8511198]

>>8510906
I like to refer to guides for the map if it has one.

[Anonymous No.8511208]

>>8510906
if the entire game can be beaten without any effort by reading a guide it's not a good game

[Anonymous No.8511223]

>>8510906
No, but you will ruin the experience of discovering and exploring the game yourself.

Just use them when you are really stuck in a place and can't continue

[Anonymous No.8511378]

>>8510981
What about RPG on console?

[Anonymous No.8511854]

>>8510948
>>internet guide printed out
>Yes
Bullshit, dude, nothings more soul than carrying 30 pages of half-baked guide to Don Corneos mansion or some shit round to a friend's place after school so you can both try to dechiper what the fuck some baked gamefaqs contributor is talking about.

[Anonymous No.8511896]

>>8510906
Can’t anyone decide anything for themselves any more?

[Anonymous No.8511904]

>>8511896
um, sweetie, we don't do that anymore. it's the 21st century now. go outside and touch grass. also have sex incel

[Anonymous No.8511926]

>>8510913
/thread

[Anonymous No.8511936]

Guidebooks are a huge part of gamer culture. The SMB guide book shown here was the #1 selling book in Japan (all books, all genres, including manga, it was the #1 selling published book of any kind) for that year.

In the west publications like Nintendo power worked as lesser substitute for a while. Less depth and only went into multipage guides on bigger games. Third party guidebooks were still huge though.

[Anonymous No.8511940]

>>8511936
Also pic related, Nintendo's official 1987 guide book was the origin of a lot of the school yard lore for the early NES titles. If a kid didn't have this book he knew someone who had it.

[Anonymous No.8514136]

>>8510906
You shouldn't follow a strategy guide, but you can reference it for info.

[Anonymous No.8514484]

>>8510906
How the fuck would you beat Tomb Raider 3 without it? Don’t ask stupid questions.

[Anonymous No.8514675]

>>8510906
>guide
>cheating
Do you even know the meaning of these two words

[Anonymous No.8514864]

>>8511121
>no single pokemon type has a distinct advantage over all other

Heh

[Anonymous No.8514867]

It's not cheating; it's just depriving you of the real game.

[Anonymous No.8514884]

I’ve found that this board (or at least one tenacious poster) has a disdain for “consuming” games as a means towards an end rather than experiencing them in a more meaningful, contemplative way.

In my opinion, there is no right or wrong way to enjoy a game (as long as you are actually enjoying it) and when you [inevitably] reach a point where moving forward becomes an exercise in nothing but sheer frustration, to not use a guide is as unhealthy as it is insane. Guides exist for that very reason, and plenty of retro games were notorious for hiding content or mechanics from the player as a means to get them to buy guides, which were also published with a great deal of polish and refinement. Plenty of guides were just as entertaining as the games they sought to help the player with because they were intended for use by everyone, not as shameful documents used only by weak-willed morons.

Guides have helped me “consume” a huge portion of my backlog and have also satisfied the OCD aspect of the completionist in me. I’m glad for them and no amount of shaming by elitists with WAY too much time on their hands will ever make me think otherwise.

[Anonymous No.8516515]

>>8510906
It's not cheating in an action sequence (although it's an odd way to git gud), it is cheating if there are puzzles because the entire gameplay of a puzzle is supposed to be thinking it through, but most of all, >>8510913

[Anonymous No.8516560]

If you're playing a PS1 RPG without a guide then you have to accept that you're going to miss stuff. A lot of those games made the guide essentially a requirement if you want to access everything because they'd hide shit behind rare drops from rare enemy spawns you might not ever encounter unless you grind for hours in every spot or plot points that require you to return to a far out of the way town at a very specific time and that you have no other reason to revisit.

[Anonymous No.8516565]

>>8510906
no

[Anonymous No.8516586]

I think a lot of games don't need guides. Especially a lot of the games that zoomers claim "require" guides to beat like Dragon Quest or Zelda.

A lot of those games are made in a way that you are supposed to crowdsource tips at school, but even then, they don't need guides.

But some of them do. Good luck catching all the pokemon without knowing some of the retarded specific ways they evolve or where they spawn.

Is using them cheating? Yes. But it's harmless cheating. I think it's fine to use them unless you're literally following them step for step. Guides are pretty soulful, unless you get a shitty off brand one that isn't allowed to use official artwork and has the screenshots in black and white, and ant-sized.

[Anonymous No.8516649]

>>8510907
3DS is ten years old

[Anonymous No.8516675]

It's subjective.

[Anonymous No.8516678]

>>8510906
Yes but who cares.

[Anonymous No.8516803]

>>8510906
No, but watching some play a whole game online is the reason diabetes was invented, to punish these cunts.

[Anonymous No.8516818]

>>8510907
I think that was the point, this autist has been doing it for years
he posts thinly veiled non retro threads starters
he was doing GBA threads well before the rule change too

[Anonymous No.8516852]

But, what if it was an official strategy guide? Is it still cheating when Nintendo says its OK to cheat?

[Anonymous No.8517402]

>>8516852
Frankly guides like this were more like functional art books. Really great stuff.

[Anonymous No.8517670]

>>8510906
i mean i try not to do it myself if i can help it but really a lot of stuff in retro games were made to sell guides but overall, >>8510913

[Anonymous No.8517839]

I find that if I play through a game with a guide I don't retain anything about it. Its like being on autopilot. The same way I can't remember any phone number after getting a cell phone or I can't remember directions somewhere if I use navigation.

[Anonymous No.8518396]

Is using game genie cheating?

[Anonymous No.8518417]

>>8510906
No. Then again, I think "cheating" only matters in the context of records or competition (including like casual online play, unless everyone else is OK with whatever mods are being used).

[Anonymous No.8518441]

>>8516649
so are you

[Anonymous No.8518692]

>>8510906
I had a copy of the Nintendo Power Player's Guide for Ocarina of Time as a kid. I liked it enough that I'd carry around with me to school for leisurely reading.

I use player's guides for the occasional game, BradyGames, Prima, etc. Eventually I realized I didn't need guides anymore and quit buying them.

[Anonymous No.8518998]

If it's a retro game, yes. You're supposed to ask your friends for tips for the TRUE retro gaming experience. You think they're going to take you seriously if you beat the game using a guide?

[Anonymous No.8519295]

>>8514136
Go fuck yourself buddy. There are some games literally designed to sell strategy guides and you will never ever find some of the shit needed to fully complete the game or get the best ending without a guide.

Zodiac Spear in FFXII is a great example of hardcore bullshit. Suikoden is another example. Suikoden 2 is literally required because unless you download the modded fixed version, you can quite literally fuck yourself into a softlock due to bugs in the game. There are many other examples I'm sure.

[Anonymous No.8520140]

>>8519295
>you can quite literally fuck yourself into a softlock
kinky

[Anonymous No.8520153]

>>8510906
Really only acceptable in "where the fuck do I go???" games, but it's honestly fine so long as they don't hinder you from enjoying a game imo. I wouldn't call it cheating either, so long as you're stuck and tried any option you could think of to progress.

[Anonymous No.8520162]

>>8510906
There are some games out there like point and click adventure ones that are notorious for their moon logic puzzles. For things along that line I think it's okay. And sometimes you want to 100% a game but you don't want to go over every nook and cranny to find the two missing collectibles you missed out on.

[Anonymous No.8520173]

>>8510906
I remember having to look up a GameFaqs guide to Bomberman Land 3 because a miniquest required a written answer and well, the entire game was in japanese and I was already pretty far into it. Couldn't get past Rainbow Land however.

[Anonymous No.8521490]

>>8518417
Well yeah but if you're at the point with a game where you want to competitively speedrun it then you're beyond even needing a vanilla guide and should instead be looking at the crowdsourced and optimized speedrun routes/guides.

[Anonymous No.8521497]

>>8519295
In Star Ocean 2 you can trigger the last boss to be effectively impossible if you aren't fucktardedly overpowered yourself. Its unlikely to happen by accident but of it does then you're probably going to need a guide just to know how to build your party up to compensate.

[Anonymous No.8522204]

Guides are a necessary evil for games that have missable content that can only be acquired again by replaying the game. Fuck that shit.

[Anonymous No.8524046]

>>8510910
This is not Nam. There are rules to /vr/

Good strat guides exist. Assist versus spoon feed. Depends on the title. Sometimes they are rare and cost some bucks. It can be worth it though. Again, depends on the title and system.

[Anonymous No.8524057]

Who cares? It's your game. Play however you want.

[Anonymous No.8524147]

>>8518396
Objectively no.