/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.7828384]

you guys like any of the console ports of doom? the third game on the original xbox featured splitscreen, i like those features, they'll never be outdated

[Anonymous No.7828548]

if your console doesnt have doom. it's not worth of my collection. simple as

[Anonymous No.7828680]

Oh yeah, I love my ps1 doom games. Anyone who says doom is easy hasnt pistol started every map. Totally different game.

[Anonymous No.7828692]

>>7828680
you fucking legend

[Anonymous No.7829101]

The ps1 version is so spooky, it's like a proto doom 64 where they were testing what aesthetic they wanted. love the colored lighting

[Anonymous No.7829508]

>>7828384
Yeah, console Doom can be fun. Some are just straight ports, and some of those are done well, some offer more though.

>>7829101
The Playstation versions have a nice and comfy spook-factor to them. Don't care for the music all that much, and the sound design is kind of meh, but just the colored lighting and sound reverb is a cool addition. With Doom 64 though, the all new music and sounds go very well with the all new levels and graphics, so it comes into its own, and the resulting game is very good.

>it's like a proto doom 64 where they were testing what aesthetic they wanted
I don't think they had a lot of that in mind, Doom 64 was originally going to be an enhanced port, like the Playstation version, same soundset, same basic level set, but with a couple of added levels. One of the levels in Doom 64 actually goes back to that time (Map 12, Altar Of Pain), when it was still just a normal Doom 2 level, it even had an Arch-Vile placed and all (so perhaps it was made for PC initially, or perhaps they expected the N64 to be a bit more potent than it actually was)

Then the direction changed (for whatever reason), and they decided to basically make an all new game on Doom's foundation. They wanted to have all the demons from Doom and Doom 2, including the Arch-Vile, Revenant, and Spider Mastermind, but time and cartridge constraints prevented this, sadly. They did well with what they managed to put together though.

[Anonymous No.7829761]

>>7828680
When I started playing Doom properly about a year ago, I just assumed pistol-starting every level and no mid-level saves was what everyone did. Game took me a good while to get through. It honestly feels like cheating yourself out of properly experiencing the level of you blast through it with saves or with weapons you've saved up. But Perfect Hatred E4M2 completely broke me, had to start saving.

[Anonymous No.7830032]

>>7828548
based chad

[Anonymous No.7830037]

>>7828680
I like to do this with a lot of shooters. Every new map i purposely get killed so i start over with nothing, and beat each level alone on what ammo, weapons and health that level gives me.

[Anonymous No.7830078]

>>7828384
>the third game
When was Final Doom released on the original Xbox?

[Anonymous No.7830082]

>>7829761
Pistol Start Vs. Continuous is all about preference, both make sense.
The level designers make their level so that if you start fresh with nothing (which you'll do when playtesting your map), you will have the means to actually beat the level. That way, you will get the best challenge the level designer had intended.

However, Doom will straight up just play progressively (and you can save, which the manual insists that you do often), so you have to go out of your way to Pistol Start, either by dying, using a cheat to warping to the same level, or using the command-line. 99 times out of 100, the game will be easier that way, because you're carrying shit over from the last level, weapons, ammo, armor, the backpack, etc. However, there are odd occasions where it will actually make the next level harder, like getting your ass spanked raw in E4M1, and then walking into E4M2 with close to no health or ammo, Pistol Starting is actually a little easier that way.

At the same time, the game will also give you really nice shit in secret areas which can often be straight up superfluous in the level it's in, like the secret rocket launcher in Map 01, there's just imps and zombiemen in this level, those two rockets you get are practically pointless. There definitely was SOME thought towards rewarding the player early on for exploring, and giving him stuff which will help him later. Doom 2 should probably have been divided up into episodes, like the first game, resetting progression at Map 10 and Map 20, to make the game a bit more challenging, but it still works, I suppose.

I like the feeling of a continuous adventure, so mostly I play progressive, but 2048 Minutes Of /vr/ made me appreciate Pistol Starting more, it makes the levels a better challenge.

[Anonymous No.7830089]

>>7830078
He means Doom 3. Final Doom is almost like an expansion pack to Doom 2.

[Anonymous No.7830328]

>>7830078
collector edition of Doom 3 came with a second disc of Doom 1 & 2 and i think the expansions

[Anonymous No.7830438]

>>7828384
I wish John Carmack wasn't such a turbo-autist about texture warping, if so the Saturn port of Doom might not have been such a shitshow.

The Saturn had better performing versions of Duke Nukem 3D, Hexen, and Exhumed than the PS1 and N64 did, and the Saturn version of Quake pushes significantly more level geometry than the simplified levels that were in the N64 port. If the Saturn had gotten a good port of Doom it could have been the go-to system for 90s PC to console FPS ports (it also had solid ports of Alien Trilogy and Space Hulk: Vengeance of the Blood Angels).

Not really an issue now though, since Doom has a port on fucking everything.

[Anonymous No.7830470]

>>7829508
>One of the levels in Doom 64 actually goes back to that time (Map 12, Altar Of Pain), when it was still just a normal Doom 2 level, it even had an Arch-Vile placed and all (so perhaps it was made for PC initially, or perhaps they expected the N64 to be a bit more potent than it actually was)
source? never heard this before, that's crazy

[Anonymous No.7830787]

>>7828384
PSX Doom is based as fuck, played the TC on my phone during a plane ride, the master levels are really good in PSX Final Doom unlike their PC counterparts, and are fixed in both layout and monster placement as well as their overall aesthetic and music choice since Hodges made an original composition for all ten of the ones included with the game.

[Anonymous No.7830792]

>>7830328
played xbox doom earlier today, its only doom 1, 2 and master levels, plus e1m10 and map33. Doom 1 uses the phobos sky for all 4 episodes kek

[Anonymous No.7831039]

>>7829101
Doom 3 makes a lot more sense if you think the evolution is PS1 -> doom 64 -> doom 3. That said i'm still salty that carmack was a whiny bitch and refused to let any of the ports use hardware acceleration as it would surpass the OG PC release in areas.

[Anonymous No.7831042]

>>7830438
Oh God it's this fag again. Fuck Saturn Quake.

[Anonymous No.7831048]

>>7830438
Exhumed looked better but ran way slower than the PS1.

[Anonymous No.7831163]

>>7830438
>Saturn Duke and hexen
>Better performance
>Than the 64 versions

Cope

[Anonymous No.7831202]

>>7831042
>>7831163
I was about to say something, but thanks to you i don't have too. Surely it was bait?

[Anonymous No.7831223]

>>7831042
>>7831163
>>7831202
No port gets people more in a twist than Quake on Saturn to the point there's a dedicated autist who cries at every opportunity about its advantages over the n64 port while hiding and denying the flaws of said n64 port.

[Anonymous No.7831579]

>>7831223
Coming from a Nintendyearold who gets massively assravaged whenever someone mentions the fact that the N64 ports of many games sucked shit

[Anonymous No.7831581]

>>7831579
see: resident evil 2's different colored blood

[Anonymous No.7831587]

>>7831163
confirmed for having never played either N64 port

[Anonymous No.7831637]

>>7831587
I own both on cartridge and on my Pseudo Saturn set up

[Anonymous No.7831808]

>>7830438
Jim Bagley is bullshitting, the entire port is a complete mess because he didn't know how to work the Saturn, it's not just problems with graphics, the audio is fucky as hell. There's zero chance that they were getting the claimed consistent 60fps without the texture warping being really obscene.

>>7830470
I tried looking yesterday, and couldn't find it, but I'll go and look for it again.

[Anonymous No.7831889]

>>7828384
ps1 doom 1/2 is decent. Some maps are downgraded or missing, but theres also some new maps not found in the pc version, and the lighting effects are pretty neat.
ps1 final doom feels very thrown together, however. Missing a LOT of maps to the point where I would not even be surprised if the inclusion of the Master Levels was purely because of how much levels they had to cut from Final Doom proper.

[Anonymous No.7832057]

>>7831808
No he wasn't. Carmack even admits to this too.

[Anonymous No.7832081]

>>7828384
>ou guys like any of the console ports of doom?
no because playing on controller sucks dick

that said, the ps port is the only good port

[Anonymous No.7832083]

>>7831889
The mapper who worked on Final Doom's maps said it was basically a cashgrab, but imo I still love PSX Final Doom for how unique it is.

Source: https://www.doomworld.com/forum/post/1956696

[Anonymous No.7832148]

>>7832057
Carmack admits he should have allowed more experimenting for graphcs, he never admitted that the engine was fantastic, which given how shit the resulting Saturn port is overall (not just in graphics), it most likely wasn't.

Go look up how the Saturn port of Doom is actually put together, it's a complete shit-heap, slowdown and poor framerates isn't its only problems.

[Anonymous No.7832159]

>>7832081
Doom plays better than you'd think with a good controller and control scheme.

[Anonymous No.7832179]

>>7832083
>>7830470
Here's some: https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/103938-early-and-unused-doom-64-level-designs/?tab=comments#comment-1955043

[Anonymous No.7832189]

>>7832159
not if you grew up playing on PC
id play it on ps with my friend and it was fun, but it definitely didnt compare to the real deal imo

[Anonymous No.7832221]

>>7832189
tbf it's a step up from keyboard-only Doom, but doesn't compare to kb+m Doom. The modern Bethesda port for PS4/Xbox controls the best of all the console versions I've played.

[Anonymous No.7832332]

>>7832221
Mouselook doom is for idiots that don't understand the original vision of doom and act all superior when they butcher the game with it. Mouselook for doom is on the same level as brutal doom.

[Anonymous No.7832371]

>>7832332
Kill yourself keyboard warrior

[Anonymous No.7832432]

>>7832189
I grew up with mouse and keyboard, and I use a mouse for playing Doom, but a good controller setup still works.

[Anonymous No.7832592]

>>7832332
Never said mouse-look doom, I said KB+M Doom. Two different things.

[Anonymous No.7832754]

>>7832332
dude youre dumb as hell
you could play doom w m+k back in the day just fine
no it wasnt modern mouselook

and desu idgaf how anyone fucking plays doom so long as they play it cuz its fun
what an asinine thing to bitch about

[Anonymous No.7832882]

>>7832332
Doom had mouse support on launch, you faggot retard.

[Anonymous No.7832903]

When I started playing Doom, I had that feeling that the fanbase was going to be ultra-hardcore puritans and nothing would be good enough for them. I'm so glad to see that those people get constantly dunked on by the rest of the fanbase lmao

[Anonymous No.7832910]

>>7832903
It's actually quite varied, which is great, there's lots and lots of good shit to find whether or not you want it strictly vanilla or want to mod it out the ass.
The adult fans, at the least, mostly seem to be of that understanding, so there's not a huge amount of bickering about it.

[Anonymous No.7832934]

>>7832903
Dunked on how? Those of us who give a shit have chocolate doom and an endless stream of vanilla compatible megawads to play (and it couldn't be easier to make it yourself too). Seems like heaven to me. Everyone else gets their fair share too, with limit removing mods etc, and consolefags get unique stuff to each port. Not sure where you got that impression.

[Anonymous No.7832958]

>>7832934
Maybe he meant grognard types who hate it when people play it a different way from them? Some will complain a lot about purists as if they're made to play Doom in DosBox at gunpoint, and some will complain about GzDoom even existing as if Graf retroactively deletes fragments of classic Doom with each update he makes.

[Anonymous No.7832971]

>>7832958
The only things I hate about GZDoom are the use of bilinear filtering by default, and its abysmal multiplayer support with constant desync compared to Zandronum. Other than that idrc and my favorite port is Chocolate.

[Anonymous No.7832994]

>be me
>be dumb FPS-loving kid with a PC and SNES
>see SNES Doom at Blockbuster
>oh wow more DOOM!
>rent it...
>...and it's just a shitty version of the PC game. Fuck me.
At least N64 Doom was a very happy rental.

[Anonymous No.7833018]

>>7832934
I mean guys that shit on everyone else for not being as puritan as them. Doom fans generally have the attitude that you can play whatever way you want, which is what I like.

[Anonymous No.7833041]

>>7833018
only Doom Eternal's fanbase does that really, never heard of any other subset of Doom fans doing any puritanical shit liks that

[Anonymous No.7833232]

>>7828548
is the 32X worth it, then?

[Anonymous No.7833236]

>>7833232
32X doom is actually kinda based

[Anonymous No.7833237]

>>7833041
>brutal doom

[Anonymous No.7833242]

>>7833236
>port of a game with legendary OST to a console with access to the well-loved YM2612
>they make it sound like ducks and farts

[Anonymous No.7833246]

>>7833242
like I said it's pretty based

[Anonymous No.7833305]

>>7833242
programming FM algorithms is hard an shieeet

[Anonymous No.7833306]

>>7833232
32x is worth it for knuckles chaotix desu
best sanic gaem imo

[Anonymous No.7833313]

>>7832994
At least you just rented SNES Doom. Doom 64 was worth a buy though.

>>7833242
The soundtrack is really shit in the 32X port, because it was just kind of thrown in and basically not adapted at all. However, the port RUNS very well, good framerate at all times, little if any slowdown, good controls (with a sixbutton gamepad), and good audio quality, so if you can look past the bad music, and the fact that it cuts a bunch of later levels, it's not too bad.

If you were at the time where retailers had realized that 32X as a huge flop and were hurriedly clearing them for cheap, being able to score one for a couple of bucks and then a copy of Doom, was actually not such a bad deal. Just turn off the music and put on some heavy metal in the background.

That said, if you want to hear what 32X Doom COULD have sounded like, listen to this: https://youtu.be/FehpU0sjXrQ

[Anonymous No.7833331]

Let's talk about the computer ports instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNjBX_TvNDQ

[Anonymous No.7833359]

>>7830089
Except it isn't. At all

[Anonymous No.7833578]

>>7833331
>SGI
what the
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sY3LI8NQsHg

[Anonymous No.7833645]

>>7828384
Considering I worked with iD and was part of the team that worked with Doom 3 on the original Xbox, I have good memories of that. I also have good memories of calling Tom Hall at like three or four in the morning while pretty drunk and asking him about aardwolf as well. I use to have part of the call recorded on a flash drive thanks to the magic of speakerphone- if I find it I can post it on here if anyone wants. It's pretty muffled because I was laughing like an idiot, and the recording quality was pretty bad.

[Anonymous No.7833685]

>>7833645
Do you have any info on Sewers and Betray, the maps which David Calvin and Michael Bukowski hid within Doom 1 and 2 in the Xbox version of Doom 3? Their history fascinates me. Also, was it an oversight that all 4 episodes in Knee Deep in the Dead use the phobos skybox?

[Anonymous No.7833689]

>>7833645
Yes we want that, that sounds amazing

[Anonymous No.7833828]

>>7833041
What does Doom Eternal's fanbase do?

[Anonymous No.7833830]

>>7833685
1/2
I do wish to point out before people get too excited that I was not employed by iD, but was subcontracted to work with iD and other studios by Microsoft. They would send whatever so-called employee "action team." that seemed like it might be useful for a project to various sites or studios where we would essentially assist as needed. Underpaid and overworked, but I got to meet some cool people. My action team worked with iD for maybe a month, I want to say Feb to the first week of March, and for the most part the coders were in a legeue of their own when it came to the job. Since Doom 3 was being published by one of the big publishers part of the subcontract contract was that the action team was not allowed to work with what was considered protected parts of the engine/code. For the most part my six coworkers and I sat around on absolutely shitty company laptops that were still running Windows ME, kept the devkits from burning up since the kits that action teams had to drive around were painfully bad component quality-wise, and helping with any hardware issues. John Carmack was pretty awkward but polite and helpful and I got to see and even handle some of the original models used in Doom.Sadly I was not some sort of hardware of software wunderkind for iD, but I can share what I remember from working with them.

[Anonymous No.7833835]

>>7833685
>all 4 episodes in Knee Deep in the Dead
All 4 what in what, now?

[Anonymous No.7833840]

>>7833830
>>7833685
2/2

To get back on track I was unaware that there were hidden maps in the port to be honest. To be honest I have yet to be part of a project in which some secrets are not hidden away in the code, I've added quite a few myself. At one point Wolf 3D was hidden and capable of being played if you held down the white, black, left and A buttons when that cool iD heart logo screen showed up in game. I'm not sure if it was kept in or not, but the game itself was used for debug purposes by the porting crew. As for the phobos skybox, I would say it was an oversight. It might not look like it now, but the Doom 3 Xbox port as well as Halo 2 were and are phenomenal due to the fact that they used the Xbox at almost 100% of its capabilities. The collectors edition ports of Doom and Doom 2 were afterthoughts, because the main issue was getting every possible bit of power and memory that could be found in the OG Xbox. Activision also kept throwing out really petty demands and complaints about the entire project and the port was nearly cancelled. I do wish I could give you all these grand details and stories but I was a twenty two year old barely functional alcoholic who was abusing ritalin and living out of my Datsun at the time, so things are kinda fucked up both when it comes to my life and memory at the time. I will say that iD was in the top three best companies I subcontracted for while working for MS and the Xbox devision. Worked with Bungie before the Halo 3 launch, and they were absolute cunts. Had their heads up their asses due to how popular Halo was. Anyway, long live the Zune, hope I gave you something interesting and educational to read and hopefully I won't get doxed for mentioning the places I worked with at specific times.
>>7833689
I'm looking for it as we speak. If I find any iD memorabilia or my signed guest id I'll post it with my name censored out, of course.

[Anonymous No.7834040]

>>7833835
i retarded and was typing while busy, contextually you know what i mean. KDITD, Shores, Inferno & Thy Flesh all use the E1 sky.

[Anonymous No.7834053]

>>7833840
Ive never heard of Wolf3D being in Xbox Doom 3, Im sure it wouldve been datamined by now, but damned if Im not tempted to try this

[Anonymous No.7834363]

>>7834053
Again, this was when the game was still being made, so it might not be there in a retail disc. Considering the amount of revisions that happened during the brief stint MS had my action team in Texas I am pretty curious of how many total revisions the game had throughout development. As I posted earlier, Activision was a fickle publisher. They wanted multiple micro builds of Doom 3 from the start of the game until reaching the marine command with the only difference being that they wanted Super Turbo Turkey Puncher removed and different Activision related games put on the cabinet instead. They outright said that they refused to let Capcom get any sort of publicity from the fact that the machine had a Street Fighter homage name. I'm glad the port was not cancelled, and not just because it would have looked bad for my action team. A ton of blood, sweat, caffeine and tears was involved in the Xbox ports development, and it was an honor to be even a tiny part of the process.

[Anonymous No.7834693]

>>7834363
In for more if you decide to share.

[Anonymous No.7834821]

>>7828384
32x is good for being an addon. I don't like the ps1 because it has dirty looking textures, I think its because it has so much dithering. Jag is real blocky, gba is ok but a little slow. Snes good for what it is.

[Anonymous No.7834829]

>>7833828
i guess they play doom eternal and claim it's the best one

[Anonymous No.7835216]

>>7834693
Well the entire iD office/building was constantly blasting the AC to the point that some staff would come in from the sweltering Texas heat and put in full fledged winter coats and sweaters. While not game related I always had a laugh at that since I'm originally from cold weather country, so it was like a gentle, cool breeze to me. There also was a small room dedicated to storing nothing but cans of coffee and pallets of Jolt Cola, which if I remember right was what Robert Duffy lived on at the time. Vicarious Visions who were also working on the Xbox port had sent some staff to iD to deal with part of the Xbox porting and the more secretive parts of the games source code (Because Activision was paranoid that sending the entire source via e-mail or physical media would be hacked/stolen, so these poor programmers from I think it was New York had to come to Texas) and they ended up taking some of the iD staff and the action team out for sushi at a local place, where most of the folks at dinner, myself included got absolutely tanked and went back to the iD office and played Doom 3 MP until the wee hours of the morning. John Carmack was not happy about it, but morale improved greatly once we collectively sobered up over the next day or so. There were and might still be at least two, possibly three entirely different versions of Doom 3 story-wise that were in various levels of completion, with a fourth that ended up being used as the Resurrection of Evil expansion. That's all I can think of after wracking my brain for now at least.

[Anonymous No.7835219]

>>7834821
>gba is ok but a little slow.
GBA is running on an entirely different non-iD made engine, Doom and Doom 2 in fact.

[Anonymous No.7835676]

>>7835216
>There were and might still be at least two, possibly three entirely different versions of Doom 3 story-wise that were in various levels of completion, with a fourth that ended up being used as the Resurrection of Evil expansion.
Know anything at all about them, like even just vague concepts or descriptions?

[Anonymous No.7835707]

>>7835676
Well, one was a lot like System Shock or the Arkane version of Prey. The touchscreen lockers were actually taken from that version. I did not play it, but I had it shown off to me by an iD employee when he was telling me what iD had wanted to do with the game. Come to think of it, it was very Dead Space in some ways. It also had a vehicle section similar to the tank parts of Quake 4, with an upscalerd sentry bot model as the vehicle placeholder. The other versions were more like test runs of basic game mechanics and environments, and not nearly as grand in scale. All in all while that version of Doom 3 was cool, it was not really a Doom game in spirit, if that makes sense? That and hardware limitations were the main reasons it was abandoned. I suspect that Raven was given access to this version of the game, and that it might have influenced aspects of Quake 4.

[Anonymous No.7835726]

>>7835707
To clarify this was essentially a tech demo and I'm not sure how much the story team had to do with the content. Very much a work in progress and unfinished with missing textures and placeholder text and stuff. Wonder how much of this conversation is breaking the NDA I signed at the time, kek.

[Anonymous No.7835730]

Not retro I guess but revisiting Doom on the Switch was a joy.

[Anonymous No.7835752]

>>7835726
Interesting stuff, thanks for sharing

[Anonymous No.7835760]

>>7835219
Doom 2 uses a different engine, but Doom 1 is 100% just Jaguar Doom adapted to the GBA with a smaller resolution, green blood, ingame but out of order music, and a unique deathmatch episode. It's my second favorite port behind PSX/Final PSX for how impressive it is for the time and for the unique DM maps

https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Doom_for_Game_Boy_Advance

It contains tons of assets from the Jaguar still in the rom too: https://tcrf.net/Doom_(Game_Boy_Advance)

[Anonymous No.7835776]

>>7835752
Thank you Anons for listening. It has been a long time since I've had the chance to talk about working in the game dev field, and I have plenty of stories that are fun to tell. Few times I have tried to mention the job on 4chan though I've been called a liar even after providing proof at the time, so this is refreshing.

[Anonymous No.7835797]

>>7835776
The Xbox port still lives on! My brother and I always boot it up for a 100-frag deathmatch on Map01 and then E1M1 and some of the Master Levels anytime I visit my family. Pic related is on MAP33 Betray which we visit after Entryway

[Anonymous No.7835846]

>>7835797
Very cool! Glad to see that a bit of my past work is still enjoyed by others! Considering my biggest achievement ended up as a critical flop that's shovelware, and my title on the 360 was delisted, it gives me a warm and pleasant feeling to see that something still is around.

[Anonymous No.7835856]

>>7835730
Playing Doom 1 on the Switch is still retro tho

[Anonymous No.7835862]

>>7835726
Wonder how long an NDA binds you for? Anyway, don't tell of anything that could give you away or anything.

[Anonymous No.7835924]

>>7835862
I'm honestly not sure about the NDA. I imagine that Activision could probably ruin me at their leisure if they wanted to, considering all the paperwork the action team had to sign before we could start the job. No joke, I've worked with classified US government agencies due to my specialized field of work, and they don't need nearly as much as Activision demanded. I mean shit I had to do a piss test , and agree to not travel to blacklisted eastern European countries before I could subcontract for Activision. Probably signed away my firstborn and immortal soul as well.

[Anonymous No.7835929]

>>7835924
>worked with classified US government agencies
I should point out I'm not a glowie either. I just work in non-standarized logistics these days. Please don't dox me.

[Anonymous No.7835951]

>>7835924
>>7835929
Hah, interesting story. I'd ask to post timestamped proof, but then you'd have to kill me.

[Anonymous No.7835965]

>>7828384
keep it in the containment general, doomboy

[Anonymous No.7835975]

>>7835951
Hah! To be honest I'm not doing any cool or secret now unfortunately, currently contracted by the federal government and working with a ton of other folks in the US in the logistics community on the logistical side of keeping Covid vaccine shipments and the special and expensive freezers needed to keep the vaccines from going bad. If anyone figures out who I am with all this info and contacts me on linkedin or whatever I'll probably just send them a company hat or something, kek

[Anonymous No.7836001]

>>7835776
Since we've got your ear, what was working with Tom Hall like? I hear a lot of stories about Carmack (because of his famous personality and all), but not much about Tom. Big fan of Anachronox so I'm really curious.

[Anonymous No.7836090]

>>7836001
Tom was not at iD at the time, although I met him once at a Microsoft digital entertainment expo/charity function/party/gala, whatever you want to call it. Just a very brief introduction, shook his hand and told him I was a big Keen and Catacomb-2D fan, which was true - and right before he left I apologized for drunk dialing him and he kinda blinked at me before he laughed and said it was fine. Saw him around the party a few more times before I left, but did not want to intrude. John Cartmack seemed close with Hall when I was working with iD on the port, he had his number and some other folks on a whiteboard in his office, which is where someone found it and convinced drunk me to call him at. All in all drunk call from what little I remember and have recorded and at the in person meeting he was very polite, far nicer than Romero. Dude was an asshole the times I met him. While not iD and Doom related, I threw up on Warren Spector's really fancy leather loafers at the same party. Well, after the party. He was cool about it though, probably could have gotten me fired then and there but he just told my boss that I had been looking ill, and that they should get a taxi for me. I was fucked up on the expensive liquor and a bunch of different stimulants, and got lucky that he either thought I was ill, or lied to cover my pathetic ass.

[Anonymous No.7836105]

>>7836090
not surprised that Romero is a jerk to colleagues, but also a surprise to hear that Spector is really cool. nothing against Spector, just get the impression he might be uptight, glad to hear he can be understanding.

[Anonymous No.7836135]

>>7836105
Well, he could have just seen me as insignificant or barely noticed me. I was pretty out of my mind at the time, so I honestly can't tell you what he was feeling, be it pity or disgust or anything. He did speak in my defense though, so I will always appreciate that.

Romero though, Romero managed to be an absolute tool. I worked alongside him on a project that was scrapped, a planned Xbox 360 launch exclusive. The man was arrogant, rude and belittled enough people at Microsoft that six major staff members requested transfer from the Romero Project, or Romero Disaster as it was informally named. Dude was constantly changing everything about the project to his whims at the time. Went from a sci-fi shooter to a dark fantasy first person melee game to a few other things. He demanded a massive amount of both money and MS resources and it just was a clusterfuck. The dude brought an intern to tears not even ten minutes after meeting her, because she said she admired his work on Doom. He ranted and raved that he was the reason iD was successful and that the MS workers were just dirt compared to his hired creation cadre. I would also like to mention that he remodeled the fucking building we were working out of multiple times in five months, even taking a fucking fire axe and busting up a wall because "it had no purpose where it was at." Just remembering this shit has my blood pressure spiking. In the end he skipped contract, MS did not care to try to get him back on board and a lot of people grew top hate him in the action teams and current dev crew. He also would rage if you beat him in any game he was playing, be it multiplayer or beating his progress in a single player game, and would lord it when he managed to win anything.

[Anonymous No.7836176]

>>7836135
well, no surprise he doesn't get any work with mainstream AAA devs anymore lol

I do feel a bit bad for him, because of his status he'll probably never get the psychiatric assistance he probably needs. Reducing people to tears and acting like a retarded baby is clearly abnormal.

[Anonymous No.7836184]

>>7836090
>Dude was an asshole the times I met him
I haven't ever seen any good citations for this or anything, but I have seen an anon insist that in the 2000s, John Romero liked to do cocaine when partying, and he partied fairly often, and then after Dai-Katana and Ion Storm went as it went, that kind of stopped happening as that was a habit he couldn't keep up.

Is that true? Don't know, anyone can just say anything on the internet, but something like that could explain the petty and shitty behavior he was frequently engaged in at the time. On the other hand, he's always been kind of a childish guy, and been pretty good at praising himself, or bending the truth or lying by omission.

[Anonymous No.7836192]

>>7836184
cocaine users typically go out of their mind on ego-trips, it's part of their behavior on the drug

[Anonymous No.7836196]

>>7836105
Spector is actually a completely pretentious cunt, he's one of those guys who cannot stop fellating Roger Ebert, as if a movie critic should be a key figure of a different medium altogether.
IIRC he publicly complained that Lolipop Chainsaw was a horrendous sin against videogames because it wasn't serious and was too juvenile, shit like that.

Deus Ex may be amazing, but Warren's a cunt.

[Anonymous No.7836205]

>>7836192
Yeah, so that can make sense, but at the same time, Romero is well known to be quite childish and immature as a person, it's not really that out of character for him if you actually stop and think about it.

[Anonymous No.7836216]

>>7836196
that's funny to me, although Lollipop was an obvious ode to Buffy and other kitschy zombie shit; Suda51 is a good as it gets when it comes to a creative in the industry (see Silver Case series).

>>7836205
I know, but it's really disappointing when something as great as Doom is associated with someone like that.

[Anonymous No.7836225]

>>7836176
It is. I think in a non-meme way that both Romero and Carmack have mental disabilities/issues, or some sort of cognitive situation that shaped who are today.
>>7836184
I'm not sure about coke, but Romero drank almost as heavily as I did. Shit, he openly drank during work hours, in front of the staff at times. Admittedly I was sneaking booze and pills at work too, so I can't judge him really. His ego was horrible, drugs or not. He has tons of charisma, but it tends to not be as strong as his ego is. He also is a very destructive person, went through tons of keyboards, desks and even chairs. I know a while back he was selling stuff that he broke and autographed, which I thought was really pathetic and sad. https://www.pcgamesn.com/doom/john-romero-keyboard-ebay Like I said earlier, he was pretty manic in behavior and destructive to everything but the staff, as far as I know of. I can't prove he did it, but stuff like mirrors and sinks got fucked up when I was working with him, and it seemed like there were always scratches or gouges, and punctures in the walls. The walls were some shitty translucent, neon colored fiberglass (I think?) and after a few months they looked like they had been blanketed by an exploding frag grenade.

[Anonymous No.7836227]

>>7836192
>>7836205
Fun fact, John Romero's dad looks like a Mexican Tony Montana. This doesn't have to mean anything, but it's just something that occurred to me with the subject matter of cocaine.

>>7836216
I think Suda replied something along the lines of "I don't think all games have to be that serious, and it's rude of you to be putting people down like that."

[Anonymous No.7836239]

>>7836176
>no surprise he doesn't get any work with mainstream AAA devs anymore lol
Which is a shame, because he's legit a good level designer, I think it's probably his strongest talent.

He made an episode for Doom a couple of years ago, Sigil, and while it wasn't anything groundbreaking or awe inspiring or anything, it was still very competent, the kind of highly competent level design which you just don't see in modern shooters.

[Anonymous No.7836263]

>>7836225
I'd be willing to bet that both Johns are on the autism spectrum, each in their own ways, and both of them definitely had hardships in their childhoods.

Absolutely amazing talents, however, each in their own ways.

[Anonymous No.7837049]

For fans of Doom 64, there exists Doom 64 For Doom 2, which is a reasonable enough recreation of Doom 64's levels in Doom 2, and they're surprisingly well made.
Being Doom 2 proper, they do throw in the previously missing monsters at places, and actually do feature the Nightmare Imps.

[Anonymous No.7837109]

I hate final doom. Its way too
hard for some reason.
The fan made dreamcast doom could have been the best one but the controls suck and ruins it.
The mouse doesnt work with it.

[Anonymous No.7837114]

>>7837109
You can just play on HMP

[Anonymous No.7837118]

>>7830438
They play shitty werid music on the saturn doom.
Its all slow and depressing and scary.

[Anonymous No.7837221]

>>7837118
"shitty weird music"
nigga that's the fucking ps1 soundtrack by aubrey hodges
This better be bait I swear to god

[Anonymous No.7838178]

>>7830438
The Saturn version in the Quake shouldn't even be called a "port", "total conversion" would be a more accurate term, since it uses the same engine as Powerslave instead of the actual Quake engine. Meanwhile, the N64 version is actually a port, running on the Quake engine.
The whole reason on why there isn't a PS1 port of Quake is because they refused to do it the Saturn way, it was demanded that it used the Quake engine like the N64, but the console was just too underpowered, so they scrapped it altogether.
They eventually relented for Quake 2, allowing the PS1 port to run in a custom engine, while the N64 port reuses the Quake 1 engine.

[Anonymous No.7838198]

I like the snes version of E1M1 a lot, whatever they did to compress it made it sound weird as fuck and I like it. That's about all there is that's nice to say about the snes version of doom though.

[Anonymous No.7838405]

>>7837221
Not him, but his music only works in Doom 64, it's totally unfitting of Doom, Doom 2s, and Final Doom's levels and aesthetics.

[Anonymous No.7838710]

>>7838405
Imo it works really well since PSX Doom uses a more desaturated color palette for map textures given the Jaguar restrictions carried over, as well as the darker lighting and chunky pixel resolution. In full res like when playing the TC it doesn't hit quite right, but as some one's played all of both Doom and Final Doom in a dark garage at night on a CRT on an actual PS1, it hits perfectly.

[Anonymous No.7838721]

>>7838405
how can you make that call objectively, the music changes the atmosphere and tone so how can you declare it's unbefitting the game

[Anonymous No.7838748]

>>7835929
>non-standarized logistics
That sounds very euphemistic.

[Anonymous No.7839093]

>>7838748
You are correct.

[Anonymous No.7839175]

>>7838710
It does get darker, but it's still Doom, and Doom is better suited for either fast tempo rock themes, or slow tempo ambient themes.
Hodges' music has zero tempo to it, because it's all ambient noises, which doesn't fit any of the original levels, at least in my opinion.

Doom 64 has all new levels with an all new visual style, and to me it's way more suitable there.

>>7838721
>how can you make that call objectively
Just assume I said "In my opinion." God.

[Anonymous No.7839335]

>>7839175
Imagine thinking someone saying something retarded is retarded instead of just ASSUMING they meant something totally different.

[Anonymous No.7840156]

>>7839175
my headcanon for psx doom is that doomguy forgot his mp3 player and this is just what these environments actually sound like

[Anonymous No.7840541]

Probably worth mentioning that there's a reverse-engineered PC port of the PSX games out there now. Check out Psydoom.