Forgot how punishingly hard the original Quake was

[Anonymous No.5833985]

So I'm on my first replay of Quake in about 20 years. I'm making a point to complete the game on normal difficulty without any cheats, as this will be my first time doing so (only ever played on Easy with occasional cheats). Damn this game is hard!! Being able to save wherever you want is a great feature, and it's the only thing keeping me going. There are sections of the game that I've had to repeat over a dozen times because I'll just get surrounded by insanely powerful enemies and ripped to shreds in seconds. Thankfully I've only got three more dungeons left, but jeez! If anyone on here is looking for a challenge, it's a great one.

[Anonymous No.5833989]

Quake is most fun when speedrunning. Even survival is easier when going fast.

[Anonymous No.5834085]

Quake has a surprising level of arithmetic at the higher difficulty levels, this is even more the case at multiplayer. It's not a bad thing or anything, it's just strange how evil monsters start turning into numbers a bit, and you have to work out a plan of what you're going to do.

[Anonymous No.5834106]

>>5833985
I was never able to beat this game. Not as a kid, nor as an adult.

[Anonymous No.5834131]

>>5833985
Ever since I found the path to Nightmare difficulty as a kid, I feel like choosing anything else is wrong.

[Anonymous No.5834143]

Hard is easily doable. Nightmare is doable until you get to the more difficult Shamblers areas and you get assraped in 0.1 seconds

[Anonymous No.5834290]

>>5833985
Quake wasnt that hard after I realised that the Nailguns and Explosive launchers were more powerful than the shotguns.

[Anonymous No.5834357]

I found it easier than some Doom 2 and Plutonia levels.

[Anonymous No.5834932]

>>5833985
I think the game is kinda easy on normal (and way too easy on easy, but that's the point), hard is the most fun as it throws you the best challenges.
The expansions up the ante some.

>>5834085
Isn't that all games, really?

>>5834357
Yeah, Plutonia is far more of a ballbuster, particularly with fast monsters on.

[Anonymous No.5834981]

>>5833985
Easy - Normal for every standard playthrough
Literally no point to pick Hard as there's little difference between Nightmare and Hard so you might as well pick the former
Nightmare is easy once you learn how to skip levels by bunnyhopping and rocket jumping, unless you are sadistic enough to kill all the monsters the way you were meant to

[Anonymous No.5834985]

>>5834981
I'm sadistic enough

[Anonymous No.5834990]

>>5834985
I am clearly not because I find that dropping a Shambler on you in E1M3, a time where you aren't equipped well enough is just fucking bullshit so I discard Nightmare entirely

[Anonymous No.5835029]

>>5834981
I think you mean masochistic, sadistic is you like others' pain.

The one criticism I have about hard/nightmare is that there are occasions when it seems like you have to find secrets and use Quad or the Pendant to get through it. Secrets are supposed to be optional to completing it.

[Anonymous No.5835036]

>>5834990
2 shamblers, and it's fucking amazing. You already get the nail gun at that fight. It isn't that bad

[Anonymous No.5835112]

>>5834990
Nigger what, you get a nailgun right before it spawns. They're weak to nails. Literally just git gud fggt.

[Anonymous No.5836953]

Quake wasn't that hard, IMO.

[Anonymous No.5837356]

>>5836953
Yeah it's not hard if you've been playing it for 20 years, no shit Sherlock.

[Anonymous No.5837362]

>>5833985
Git gud. I'm a bad player and I easily cleared it on hard with no mid-level saves.

[Anonymous No.5837419]

Mid-level saves in this game is cheating.

[Anonymous No.5837468]

>>5833985
>normal difficulty

It's not that hard, dude. Maybe on Hard, or at least Nightmare, but below that is only hard if you're comparing it to modern games.

[Anonymous No.5837487]

>>5837419

[Anonymous No.5837565]

>>5837356
I've hardly played Quake compared to other 90's shooters.

[Anonymous No.5837581]

A game that can be speedran in less than 20 min, cant really be that hard. Get good OP.

[Anonymous No.5837647]

What is the best source port for single player. I plan on playing mods.
I want a software-quake look with uncapped framerate and the option to disable monster and weapon interpolation.

[Anonymous No.5837670]

>>5834981
Nightmare is just wonky, some enemies become stupidly easy because they'll just stand in place.

[Anonymous No.5837675]

>>5834990
You get a nailgun and plenty of cover, nevermind that it's actually pretty easy to do a Shambler with the shotguns in the right circumstances.

[Anonymous No.5837678]

>>5835029
I think the assumption with hard is that you've already played it once so you know some secrets.

[Anonymous No.5837683]

>>5837356
I played Quake for the first time in like 10 years back in spring, it's not a cakewalk on hard but it's not insurmountable.

[Anonymous No.5837685]

>>5837647
Quakespasm

[Anonymous No.5837695]

>>5837685
how the fuck do I save my config? Just set it up and lost everything.
There's no writeconfig command.

[Anonymous No.5837701]

>>5837695
there's either write-only on your config, your OS settings prevent game from writing due to privileges (run as admin), or you exit game in an inapropriate manner (alt-f4 or pressing cross) not allowing it to save config.

[Anonymous No.5837702]

>>5837695
Save it in the ID1 folder (as well as the Hipnotic and Rogue folders for the expansions).

[Anonymous No.5837758]

>>5837675
Yes, because the first thing I think about when playing Quake is having to constantly take cover instead of zooming through the level gibbing people with a RL

[Anonymous No.5837794]

>>5837758
Guess you thought wrong then.

God forbid you would have to take cover sometimes on the highest difficulty levels.

[Anonymous No.5837826]

>>5837758
How the fuck do you think you're meant to fight Shamblers, dipshit?
They take only half damage from explosions and their ranged attack can only be avoided by breaking their line of sight, so a Super Nailgun and a good pillar or corner is very suitable for fighting a Shambler. Use your goddamn head.

The idea that using cover, or certain situations demanding you to, somehow is inherently bad, is a retarded reactionary take by slackjawed faggots to shitty coverbased shooters of recent years.
Doom is similar, cover is useful in certain situations, the Arch-Vile requiring you to break his line of sight to avoid his powerful attack.

[Anonymous No.5837829]

>>5837758
>zoomers

[Anonymous No.5837836]

Final Doom is way worse.
I even finished Quake on Nightmare on N64.

[Anonymous No.5837894]

>>5837794
>>5837826
>>5837829
Y' know what, FUCK Quake. Uninstalling.

[Anonymous No.5837902]

>>5837758
I think I have a solution - all you gotta do is switch god mode on and sure as shit you'll be zooming through the levels beating all the bad guys, they won't stand any chance, the only thing in your way is finding the keys which I have faith in. Good lad.

[Anonymous No.5837992]

>>5833985
>>5834106

I don't understand /vr/ anymore. This is almost certainly an intentional of some previous thread (that I haven't seen) -- but why is this? Why does someone intentionally make a false thread which is similar to a legitimate thread. It's clearly some sort of commentary or judgement, but who is the audience for this?

[Anonymous No.5837997]

>>5837992
* intentional satire of some previous thread

[Anonymous No.5838083]

>>5837894
Too hard for anon.

[Anonymous No.5839186]

It's not that bad to be honest. Just use cheats if worst comes to worst. 90's shooters had inbuilt cheat codes for a reason you know.

[Anonymous No.5839771]

>>5839186
I can't even imagine using cheats for Quake, it's never hard enough where it'd make any kind of sense to me.

[Anonymous No.5839784]

>>5839186
quake is a game where you skip half the level by aiming rocket at your feet

[Anonymous No.5839803]

>>5837695
Check that the ID1 directory and ID1/config.cfg is writeable. Once you have your config set up either quitting from the main menu or typing 'quit' in the console should write the config before terminating. Putting lines you know you want every time in autoexec.cfg is a good idea too.

[Anonymous No.5839902]

>>5839784
Not everyone speedruns. Though admittedly Quake allows a lot of fun maneuvering with its physics, which means one can make a fairly entertaining to look at speedrun.

[Anonymous No.5839940]

>>5837826
>The idea that using cover, or certain situations demanding you to, somehow is inherently bad, is a retarded reactionary take by slackjawed faggots to shitty coverbased shooters of recent years.
Fucking this. Having to use cover to break line of site from a hitscan attack is something that's been in Shooters since Wolfenstein 3D.
Sorta related, but I fucking hate the "hitscan is inherently bad" meme, too.

[Anonymous No.5840775]

>>5837826
You've just played so much Quake that you're blind to its flaws.

[Anonymous No.5840945]

>>5837826
>their ranged attack can only be avoided by breaking their line of sight
you can jump in and out of range, prompting an attack then taking zero damage from it
rarely practical since it requires space and no interference from other enemies, and using cover is still easier, but it's fun to mess around with

[Anonymous No.5842219]

>>5840775
No, I've only just begun playing it a few months ago and the rules instantly clicked, because I have a frontal lobe and I'm capable of problem solving.

How the fuck is "resistant to rockets, and can get in automatic hits on you if you don't break line of sight" a flaw? It makes him stand out from the other monsters, he's a miniboss who requires different tools and methods than usual, which is why he's a perfect addition to the enemy roster, hell, he's distinct from most typical FPS enemies.
It doesn't take much imagination to create a lot of good encounters based around him, particularly if you combine him with other monsters to force you into a complex fight.
This is the kind of shit you will not get in COD and other cookie cutter shooters these days.

If Quake has any flaws, it's certainly not its bestiary or its combat.

[Anonymous No.5842225]

>>5839940
Yeah, it grinds my fucking gears.

>>5840945
I've only played the base game, the expansions, and DOPA, yet, I don't think I've found myself in a spot where I outranged a Shambler, that something you see in Arcane Dimensions more? That's next on my list.

[Anonymous No.5842260]

>>5842225
Maybe anon's talking about baiting his melee attack? Shambler is one of the few enemies that do melee but don't have a running or leaping attack so he can be cucked exactly like Revenants in Doom. In fact, I've found it much more practical than using cover.

[Anonymous No.5842289]

>>5842260
Oh, yeah, I've done that, which is where the super shotgun actually shines (next to playing bullfighting with fiends), because you can use a very common ammo type and save better stuff for hairier situations where you might not get to do a move like this. You gotta be in a place where you can close the distance without getting zapped.

Incidentally I once jumped away just in time to avoid a pit trap with a shambler in it, which gave me the opportunity to whittle him away with just the single barrel shotgun, which goes faster than you'd think due to how fast it shoots and how tight its spread pattern is.
I felt cheap about that one though, because it felt like shooting fish in a barrel, a very angry fish that tried to throw numerous thunderbolts at me.
People shit on Quake's shotguns because they aren't quite the powerhouses that Doom's are (which have that absurd and pleasant quality of excess pellets continuing past a monster if less than all of them killed him), but they're actually pretty good if you accept that they're different animals, particularly given that Quake will actually give you Quad Damage powerups fairly frequently.

[Anonymous No.5842341]

>think the post reeks of reddit
>google
>it literally is reddit

huh

[нαςkεямαη No.5842360]

>>5833985
>PUNISHINGLY HARD
I fucking beat Quake without a guide on NIGHTMARE and on DOSBOX while using the original music for my first playthrough. It was pretty fucking easy.

[Anonymous No.5842375]

>>5842341
Buh? What?

[Anonymous No.5842379]

>>5842360
Because that difficulty is fundamentally broken and id never cared.

[Anonymous No.5842460]

>>5842379
Having played it through recently, Quake isn't too hard on Hard either. My only problem with it is the entire fourth episode, which is really bland and kinda lackluster and just lazily throws a bunch of slimes and quads your way. It's also the only one where I haven't found the secret level.
I just checked the levels list because of the secret level thing, and every single map except the first one is by Sandy Petersen.
I wish jokes stopped writing themselves, I really do

[Anonymous No.5842479]

>>5842379
Maybe they treated it like they did Nightmare for Doom? Where it was just added as an afterthought/joke and there wasn't really much thought to make it balanced.

>>5842460
Sandy's levels are good tho.

[Anonymous No.5842493]

>>5842479
>Sandy's levels are good tho.
I disagree. I know these things come in waves, like it used to be trendy do hate on Sandy and then recently it became hip to be a Sandy apologist and so on, but I really disliked most ep4 levels, in fact they're so forgettable that I can hardly remember anything other than the last two. They have very simple geometry, they have rooms filled with the same type of enemy and tend to have this really bad practice that's found in some lazy slaughtermaps nowadays, where there are lots of monsters but also lots of high tier resources placed in a map in a rather thoughtless manner. And don't get me started on his Doom "city" levels.

[Anonymous No.5842534]

>>5842493
I find them fun and memorable.

>Doom city levels
Well yeah, those were shitty, but he was under a tighter crunch then, and he did good levels too.

[Anonymous No.5842562]

>>5842460
>I wish jokes stopped writing themselves, I really do
How is that a joke? I assume part of his reputation comes from him writing those maps, don't see where the joke is.

[Anonymous No.5842625]

>>5842562
It's le epic Sandy is a bad mapper meme, which was a tired horse 20 years ago.

[Anonymous No.5842827]

>>5842493
I am actually the exact opposite, loving Sandy's maps while finding most of the other levels subpar. Romero's maps in particular tend to suck, they are all "climb to the top across multiple floors" which not only are the most exploitable with rocket jumps, but tend to feel like little progress is being made due to crossing the same thing over and over.

McGee, his main issue was making really small levels. Episode 3 is almost entirely forgettable as his levels are so quick that you are done with it as soon as you start.

Tim Willits? His levels mostly were clustered at the beginning of the game. While classic levels, they also never felt like anything special. I find E2M7 rather boring, as is the wind tunnels adventure.

Petersen offers giant open levels that allow for a lot of freedom with movement. This in turn makes them more replayable, since you aren't just doing the same route over and over. He was the only person using the Spawn, which I find a nice challenging enemy due to it promoting speed and quick reactions. He also was quite evil with the platforming, meaning you actually risk death a lot more, making the game more fun than the easy "spam rocket launcher" nature of most of it.

Simplistic geometry? Who cares what pretty stuff is in a level. I care about functionality, about playability, and Petersen's levels are fun. This tends to be everyone's gripe and it is sadly warped, aesthetic means little in terms of a game.

I find the graveyard of E4M3 one of the most memorable portions of Quake, alongside the healing pool of E4M4 and the window section of E4M5. I find it one of the most memorable episodes, E2 is far more forgettable.

>same type of enemy
And the rest of the game is more vivid? All I remember of E2 are the death knights. Endless death knights. Meanwhile E4 has the spawn, zombie hordes, and swarms of fiends.

>thoughtless manner
Not sure what was wrong with the placement. Quake often was high risk and reward.

[Anonymous No.5842831]

>>5842460
This. Quake being harder on Hard is a meme. Ogres spamming you but being unable to reach you? This only becomes an issue in a couple areas such as the start of E1M2, you generally find them on balconies raining death upon you (which makes Nightmare more relentless, as opposed to them running around their little box). Meanwhile, you can't bait shamblers or outrun vore pods, making both harder encounters.

[Anonymous No.5843427]

>>5842341
>reddit reddit reddit reddit reddit reddit
you are a worm beneath my foot
don't talk to me
don't contact me

[Anonymous No.5843558]

>>5842225
>>5842260
i could be misremembering, but i'm almost certain that it works against its lg attack too. i recall spending a decent amount of time dicking around with it, so maybe the timing is tight enough that you'd never want to bother.

hip2m2 on scourge of armagon was where i toyed with it - up the left stairs, in the large room, where the switch at the end of the newly opened area spawns a shambler at the other end. too lazy to reinstall to test it though (took long enough to figure out the level from flipping through youtubes). if there isn't enough room there then i'm probably wrong.

[Anonymous No.5843593]

>>5842493
You fail to understand. Downtown is a masterpiece.

What do I even want to convey.

You do understand that Doom1's Fortress of Mystery and Dis are supposed to be completed on pistolstart through infighting shit, right? That means infighting was a theme for Petersen, right? These aren't the only examples too, just two most prominent ones.

Now, Downtown pushes that theme of infighting to its logical conclusion, moreover, it has a point in doing that.

There are exactly two ways to complete that map, provided you pistolstart. The first, comparatively miserable, way, is, you spawn in, you see the arrow, you follow the arrow.

The second way is

COME THE FUCK ON DO I REALLY NEED TO SPELL IT OUT?!

Anyway, the point is, the map's semi-realistic theme is there specifically to make it so there is a sort of a mental barrier to overcome in order to see, that the map has a second intended progression route, to make sure that when things click in your head, they sure do click loudly enough. Them clicking is IN ITSELF the point.

[Anonymous No.5843609]

>>5842827
>I find E2M7 rather boring,
Now shotgunstart it on Nightmare.

Also, shotgunsarted E1M4 is a blast.

And Wind Tunnels is a stunning and one of its kind map. That stroboscoping corridor in particular.

[Anonymous No.5843624]

>>5842827
Also, Romero's levels are shotgunstartable as well, but they aren't all that fun that way. They just play like a cross between Romero's Quake's E3M1 and Perfect Hatred. Wizard's Manse in particular is quite anal that way. Moreover, shotgunstarting them makes you skip all the vertical combat simply due to lacking ammo to spare. You'll get those fuckers eventually, you think, and meanwhile you are just running back and forth under fire. E3M3 being the primary offender.

[Anonymous No.5843626]

>>5843624
>E2M3: Crypt of Decay being the primary offender

[Anonymous No.5843836]

>>5843609
In retrospect I'm kind of amazed that a hack fraud dipshit like Tim Willits made a level like Wind Tunnels

[Anonymous No.5843843]

I was too afraid to play these games as a kid and too afraid now

[Anonymous No.5844313]

>>5843836
Play levels 7, 9 and 10 specifically from raven.wad, see whether they remind you of anything. Then look up who made them.

[Anonymous No.5844332]

Quake on hard is NOTHING compared to Blood or Shadow Warrior on medium.

[Anonymous No.5844368]

Why are so many of you so bad at video games?
>>5834131
>>5842360
Based. Nightmare is literally the only way to play the original Quake. Been playing it for decades now and its my favorite FPS, doing 100% speed runs on nightmare is fantastic fun, its the game that for me, keeps giving

[Anonymous No.5844381]

>>5844332
>muh meme hitscan games
Go back to your containment thread.

[Anonymous No.5844506]

>>5844381
>>5844332
The thing with Blood and Shadow Warrior is that their hitscanners are "artificial difficulty" in a way, hitscanners in Doom, Quake and Duke aren't.

In Doom, Quake and Duke all hitscanner enemies have a bit of a delay built into their basic attack to give player at least a split second to take cover.
Quake 1/2 enemies even telegraph their attacks clearly and give yuou soundcues.
Doom zombies have 10 frames of delay before actual shooting, giving1/3 of a second opportunity to get into cover.
That's why hitscanners there are not unfair to the player, unless a mapper wants them to be.

Blood and SW have a quirk when enemy initial reqction time is entirely elimiminated in some(or most) instances. By default, there is no delay between enemy noticing the player and shooting at all. Lower difficulties introduce shot delay, but on anything above medium it is not present.
The delay on those difficulties comes from enemy AI deciding to take other action before shooting, like walking a few meters or something else.
However If an enemy faces direction of a player when player enters its FOV for the first time, there will be no delay at all and player will be shot instantly without any opportunity to counteract it. And many enemies face doors/down hallways in that game, making it impossible to avoid their first shots without having prior knowledge of their presense.

Hitscanners can be done right. Hitscanners can be done wrong.
Monolith can't do them right. The trend continues in Shogo and Blood 2.

[Anonymous No.5844507]

I'm digging through Ion Maiden scripts and finding all sorts of interesting shit.
For instance commands to allow flight, debug info, turning off AI etc.
Also spawning chairs.

Apparently there are cheats that can be input in the special menu that unlock all these debug features, but nobody found that shit yet.

[Anonymous No.5844508]

>>5844507
yeah same here

[Anonymous No.5844521]

>>5844506
also I'm pretty sure that enemies in IF actually shoot at where you were a few frames ago since when I'm on the move hitscan attacks land where I was moment ago, and very rarely actually hit me.
Running through environment seems to be safer than simple weaving side-to-side as you do in Doom/Quake.

[Anonymous No.5844550]

now this is pretty random

[Anonymous No.5844624]

discovered a nasty bug - if you are in a multi-map area, get to the exit and then come back to the other map, both maps will respawn.
Repeat multiple times for extra huge secret/monster counts.

[Anonymous No.5844627]

is RTX a good way to play through the game?

[Anonymous No.5844626]

>>5844624
They are working to fix that bug

[Anonymous No.5844756]

>>5844332
Probably true.

>>5844381
He's right though, those games are much harder than Quake.

>>5844506
>artificial difficulty
Stopped reading.

[Anonymous No.5844759]

>>5837487
bruh get a life, the maps are clearly designed to be beaten in one go. I cannot IMAGINE being so bad that you have trouble beating it on normal with savescumming, to the point where I thought OP was a joke. Yes this game is hard on the higher difficulties but "good thing I can savescum" is not a valid argument. Can you imagine going through the whole map in your head and what your basic plans will be? If you can't then you haven't scratched the surface and don't deserve to beat it.

[Anonymous No.5844771]

>>5844759
Doom and quake fanboys are the most autistic people on this board

[Anonymous No.5844774]

>>5844771
G I T
U
D
scrub

[Anonymous No.5844828]

>>5844313
He ripped off his sisters' maps for Quake?

[Anonymous No.5844862]

>>5844828
I have a theory of what could have happened, but I don't want to share it here.
Let's just say she might've given a fair share of _educated_ advice on those Quake maps.

[Anonymous No.5844871]

>>5844862
Why not share it? We're anonymous here.

[Anonymous No.5844882]

>>5837992
>why do people lie on 4chan

[Anonymous No.5844892]

>>5844871
Game's mapping tool was on Nextstep workstations only. The game itself however was developed for DOS. Those are just facts, as far as I am aware of them.
Connect the dots however you like, if in any way, I've said more than enough already.

[Anonymous No.5844903]

>>5844892
Also, levels were transfered between Nextstep and DOS computers through floppy disks, due to which there was a restriction of 1.4Mb in regard to the size of the compiled level, due to which Romero's E2M6: Dismal Oubliette's beginning sequence got eventually cropped out. This is, again, simply a simplified recitation of a previously publicly stated (by Romero) story.

[Anonymous No.5844921]

>>5844892
I know those things, it doesn't tell me much.
You're not a secret agent, man.

>>5844903
... and?

[Anonymous No.5844929]

>>5844521
That's also how it works in Duke 3D, Enforcers won't hit you if you keep moving

[Anonymous No.5844938]

>>5844921
Level was created on Nextstep machine, transfered to DOS machine, what exactly for? Level is on a diskette, a physical object, where can that diskette, completely hypothetically, end up halfway between its intended stops? What are the bare minimal conditions for it ending up somewhere halfway, for it not to be entirely pointless?

[Anonymous No.5844967]

>>5844938
Tim took it home, or Theresa comes to their office for some reason?

[Anonymous No.5844976]

>>5844967
If I were to choose between those two possibilities, I'd find the first one far more likelier. As for the bare minimal condition for that to make sense. Oh, sorry, that was just me thinking aloud, on a complete hypothetical.

[Anonymous No.5845001]

I keep forgetting how wonderful it is. I want a new Quake game that involves blowing up knights in a Gothic castle.

[Anonymous No.5845005]

>>5843609
Is Quake even designed for shotgun starts? The Episodes seem designed in such a way that the weapons only show up once or twice. See the final maps of each episode, none of them even give you a weapon.

[Anonymous No.5845281]

>>5845001
Have you played these yet?
>Scourge Of Armagon
>Dissolution Of Eternity
>Dimensions Of The Past
>Arcane Dimensions

/doom/ also made a map compilation over a month in summer, and it's finally released after some stalling due to project lead autism.
It's called HUH

[Anonymous No.5845289]

>>5845005
I pondered this as well, you pretty much get the weapons as you go.
I'm sure it's still doable, but it doesn't seem like they were quite meant that way like with Doom's maps.

[Anonymous No.5845562]

>>5845281
Two of them. I will search for the others.

[Anonymous No.5846981]

>>5845289
Each episode outside of the first one was predominantly made by one person, meaning it quite likely they intended the levels to flow together. Unlike in Doom, where you restart with nothing, in Quake you always hold whatever you got from a previous level. There are plenty of levels with zombies without necessarily a way to kill them on the level. It would surprise me if they were designed with such a mentality.

Shotgun starting can definitely provide a different challenge. In a way, since it wasn't supported in the same way Doom's was, you end up with shotgun starts being more difficult in certain cases.

>>5843609
E1M4? That one is actually pretty simple to shotgun start, but I can agree about E2M7 on a nightmare shotgun start. Regardless, it is nothing compared to the real challenge maps such as E2M6 or E3M7.

[Anonymous No.5847106]

>>5846981
Nah, I meant E1M4 being Just Right on shotgunstart.

See, I didn't test levels all that much on shotgunstart, and those I did, I did mainly in their beta3 versions.
E1M2-M5 were definitely made with shotgunstart in mind, in fact, E1M2 as a neat twist to it that ONLY becomes apparent on shotgunstarts (it doesn't have nailgun, but has nail boxes which are used to hint upon the optional content).

E2M2-M4 are also clearly shotgunstartable, but, dare I say, more anal and less fun, than on continuous play. E2M5 is also shotgunstartable, but balanced in PerfectHatred-like manner. Didn't shotgunstart either released or beta3/full version of E2M6. Left E2M7 for later because reasons.

I think E3M3 if I am not mistaken, either that or E3M4, definitely was NOT made with shotgunstart on mind, some critical weapon missing, due to which horrendous ammo shortage. Didn't try E3M6 and E3M7, beta3's M7 has no enemies anyway.

E4M2 was clearly shotgunstartable, moreover, you are supposed to use megahealth and duke it out with starting knights using axe, using one of the beams as a cover, in order to save up on ammo. Didn't test E4M3, E4M4 is clrarly shotgunstartable, E4M5 is clearly exactly the opposite of shotgunstartable, didn't replay E4M8 enough to have a confirmation, but it didn't seem all that shotgunstartable on the first glance.

Something like that.

I wonder whether E3M6 is shotgunstartable, seeing it's half-Willits, half-McGee.

[Anonymous No.5847116]

>>5846981
By the way, E1M2 was also interesting in that it sort of changed level geometry a bit between difficulty levels (the number of nail shooting traps in that one corridor). Any other levels in Quake's campaign, that did that sort of stuff?

[Anonymous No.5848431]

bump

[Anonymous No.5848432]

>>5847116
I never noticed that

[Anonymous No.5848570]

>>5847116
I never noticed that

[Anonymous No.5849274]

QHLAN is on now, biggest (so around 50 people) QW lan around.

4v4 is now sunday, best TDM Quake FPS.

[Princess Sevenleaf !IT2uZpX.Ic No.5850179]

>>5842360
>using Dosbox instead of Winquake, GLquake, or one of the countless source ports

why.jpg

But I agree. Like Doom it's actually pretty easy once you learn the enemy behaviors. In fact it's easier than Doom because Doom always has way more enemies to keep track of, in Quake you're rarely dealing with more than four enemies at a time.

[Anonymous No.5850194]

>>5850179
That's because Doom is more about plain running and gunning than Quake. Part of the fun comes from killing loads of enemies.

[Anonymous No.5850234]

>>5850179
But that's made up for by the fact that four enemies in Quake will kill you faster than you can say niggershit.

[Anonymous No.5850601]

>>5844771
I'd argue Blood fanboys are even worse.

[Anonymous No.5850615]

>>5850601
quite a shame since its a great game

[Anonymous No.5850694]

>>5850179
Enemies in Quake are a lot more dangerous individually though.
Compare a Pinkie to a Fiend, the Pinkie can mess you up fairly quickly if he corners you or you get stuck next to him, but just one Pinkie in a hallway is EZ/PZ, he doesn't even take that much punishment. The real dangerous ways to use him is in groups, combined with other monsters, or in specific areas designed around him.
The Fiend however can take more of a beating and he can do a LOT more damage to you in far less time, including with his leap attack, just one of him in a corridor can be a serious threat.

That said, Doom and Quake's monsters don't translate between each other 1 to 1, for instance the Shambler may seem like he could fit for the Arch-Vile but he actually doesn't, he's more like a halfway between an Arch-Vile and a Baron Of Hell; fast movement, line of sight magic, but no raising dead monsters, instead he's strong and resilient (even taking half damage from explosives) and hits like a steam locomotive in melee.

>>5850194
I'd argue Quake is still very run and gun, you're still real fast, and the game has way more verticality, complete with jumping and freelook aiming.
Doom is the kind of game that lends itself well to larger groups of monsters (and we're not even talking slaughter map genre), and it has a really well rounded bestiary with Doom 2, put to very insidious use in Final Doom.

[Anonymous No.5850701]

>>5844771
>>5850601
>>5850615
https://youtu.be/DxjBfzXFKo4

[Anonymous No.5851670]

>>5849274
thanks for the heads-up. catching up on the 2v2s now... some big names here. with 4v4s and brood war finals, tomorrow is looking good.