DOS Doom

[Anonymous No.10117869]

So I decided to play the first Doom

How to set up the DOSbox version of the game to get the most vanilla experience, as if playing in 1993?
What are the best Crt shaders/filters to use and what is better to use to emulate the dark bluish color palette of early 90s Crt monitors? (PalPlus and Jovian palette make the picture dark, but far from the palette of Crt monitors)

I'm playing on an old LCD 1280x1024 monitor and the picture seems too pixelated and low quality (picrelated is my screenshot) compared to other Doom DOSbox gameplay videos
How to adjust the resolution and graphics in order to get the highest quality picture? (At the same time, so that the image took the entire (or almost entire) screen)

Also, what utilities to use to fix all the possible bugs of the DOSbox version?
And any other tips to make the experience as vanilla as possible
Sorry for my bad english

[Anonymous No.10117876]

>>10117869
Just play the game bro :I

[Anonymous No.10117886]

>>10117869
Doom was a linedoubled game so the "scanlines" would be very faint, and you can't replicate that look at your resolution. I also don't think that CRTs looked "dark-bluish" unless you set their color temperature to cool. Just use sharp-bilinear, or even bilinear if the former is too sharp for you.

[Anonymous No.10117923]

>compared to other Doom DOSbox gameplay videos
you sure they werent using mods and actually played dosbox? because that's how doom on dos supposed to look, it's 200p but upscaled literally. even boom source port is like that
i do know build engine games later did let you increase internal resolution in setup.exe, but afaik doom has none
you have to under that doom was technological marvel, people struggled to run it as is. when duke3d and other more advanced games came out, you had better hardware already (yes in the 90s, just one or two years meant massive technological progress than today)

[Anonymous No.10117962]

>>10117869
There shouldn't be much of a difference. Every CRT monitor I ever used was as sharp as an LCD. CRT TV's on the other hand...

[Anonymous No.10118050]

>>10117869
>picrelated is my screenshot
Looks exactly the way it should look.

[Anonymous No.10118180]

>>10117869
>>10117886
this, you'd want thin double scanlines. An easy way to do this offhand is Retroarch with a CRT shader + a normal2x filter.
You're kind of being a giant autist though. 31khz PC CRTs don't have all the crazy artifacts and shit 15khz TVs are known for. The main different between old computer monitors and your LCD is the difference in contrast and motion clarity, which can't be fixed. Get an OLED or a CRT off FB marketplace.

[Anonymous No.10118204]

>>10117886
>>10117923
>>10117962
>>10118050
This is a complete and total LIE. PC monitors were sharper than TVs, yes. But they still melted away the pixels. Doom on a LCD looks nothing like it does on a CRT. These posters are LCDfags coping.

[Anonymous No.10118256]

>>10118204
>melted away the pixels
lol

[Anonymous No.10118274]

>>10118256
>they intended games to look like this
You can't actually bel- actually, nevermind, you got it...

[Anonymous No.10118285]

>>10117886
Correct. Pic is about the level of blur you would get with a mediocre VGA monitor. VGA's native resolution is 640x480, and scanlines were usually not visible at that resolution. 400 line mode (Doom runs in 400 line mode, with 200 lines doubled to 400 in hardware) stretched the image vertically but did not change the beam focus, so faint scanlines were usually visible, but it's impossible to even approximate them with a shader at this resolution because of the non-1:1 pixel aspect. And SVGA is older than Doom, so some rich people would have played it even sharper.
>>10118204
False. Pretty much all DOS games had distinct pixels.

[Anonymous No.10118313]

>>10118285
Nice LCD pic. Why are LCDfags so dishonest?

[Anonymous No.10118319]

>>10118313
It's fitting that LCDfags are dishonest considering it's the only reason their tech is still around. Plasma was better but LCD companies did a Goebbels-tier propaganda campaign against plasma, fearmongering about burn-in.

[Anonymous No.10118321]

>>10117869
Just use Chocolate Doom

[Anonymous No.10118334]

>>10118313
You apply a Gaussian blur (good approximation of CRT blur) to OP's pic and show us how blurry you think it's supposed to look. State the X and Y size.

[Anonymous No.10118339]

>>10118334
>You apply a Gaussian blur (good approximation of CRT blur)
LOL

[Anonymous No.10118346]

>>10118339
So what function do you believe best approximates CRT blur?

[Anonymous No.10118348]

>>10118346
None. It's impossible to replicate a CRT on a LCD screen. The tech is just too incompatible. Trying to do it on a LCD is basically just digital blackface.

[Anonymous No.10118367]

>>10118348
I didn't ask you to replicate a CRT. I asked you to show us how much *blur* specifically. I don't care about geometry distortion, scanlines, halation, phosphor patterns, persistence, etc. All I want to know is how blurred you think the image should be.

Also, the most important aspect of the CRT look, and the most difficult to replicate on other technologies (the line-by-line low persistence) is not particularly relevant to Doom, because Doom is capped at 35fps, and in practice very few people played it that fast in 1993. Only games where frame rate matches the refresh rate take full advantage of it.

[Anonymous No.10118371]

>>10117869
imo the classic Doom experience is massively improved by enabling mouseaim, unless seeing enemies vertically squish once in a while is that much of an issue. I'd also turn off autoaim so rockets are more likely to go where you aim them but that's whatever.

[Anonymous No.10118375]

>>10118371
You don't need vertical mouseaim and the original game doesn't support it. Horizontal mouseaim is intended by the devs and recommended in the manual.

[Anonymous No.10118454]

>>10118375
who cares about the original game, OP's probably gonna end up playing a sourceport anyways. You don't need it but it's just way more enjoyable to be able to play it like a typical FPS instead of relying on vertical autoaim

[Anonymous No.10118509]

>>10117886
> I also don't think that CRTs looked "dark-bluish" unless you set their color temperature to cool

This is a comparison of the colors of the tittle screen on CRT and LCD monitors - https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/10228056/53074813-a4495280-34e3-11e9-9928-6748120f38b6.PNG

A lot of OG Doom players say on the web that the palette when playing on CRT monitors was darker and the colors did not have such a red and yellow tone .
To get closer to the old visual, custom palettes such as PalPlus were created by community.

[Anonymous No.10118516]

If you want to play DOOM as originally intended, download Chocolate DOOM. If you want an uncapped framerate and rebindable keys, Crispy DOOM offers those conveniences without changing much.

[Anonymous No.10118557]

>>10118319
>Plasma was better
My parents bought a plasma TV in the mid 00s and sure, it looked good but the burn-in is real. I've never seen burn-in this bad on any display in my entire life

[Anonymous No.10118559]

>>10118509
Oh I see what you're talking about now. That's more to compensate with LCD's inferior black levels but I guess the distinction isn't that important.

[Anonymous No.10118714]

>>10117869
You can play the DOS version natively on PC now with sound using freeDOS and SBEMU.
If that's too much trouble just play Chocolate Doom

[Anonymous No.10118731]

>>10118367
I wonder why no CRT retards have responded to this. Is it because they don't know anything about CRTs and it is just nostalgia larp from people who didn't even have CRTs and don't know why people moved on.

[Anonymous No.10118756]

>>10118180
Thanks for a reply.

Any info on which CRT shader in Retroarch would work for my old 1280x1024 monitor?

[Anonymous No.10119228]

>>10118367
Blurred enough so that all the dithering in >>10118274 turns into a seamless gradient.

[Anonymous No.10119371]

>>10117869
DOSbox emulates Doom perfectly. Chocolate Doom also exists if you absolutely must play Doom like you're on a shitbox 386 in a nicotine stained office.

[Anonymous No.10119847]

>>10117869
>How to set up the DOSbox version of the game to get the most vanilla experience, as if playing in 1993?
Use chocolate doom.

[Anonymous No.10120258]

>>10117869
Not entirely as barebones as OP is talking about, but a nice 'middle way' between playing the original DOS executables and a more modern Windows port is MBF 2.04 for DOS(Box)

It has double the resolution of the original (320x200 to 640x400) and some additional things such as option to play with a sidekick (marine or dog), also received many bugfixes

It comes preconfigured with the vr dospack: https://mega.nz/folder/3t8nzSIS#947kyMN6Z80f8HS7q2XlqA/folder/KwkAQRQa

As stated by others, the most barebones without using actual DOS is Chocolate Doom for Windows

[Anonymous No.10120371]

>>10118516
>if you want the vanilla experience then play chocolate
I can't believe it took me that long to get the joke

[Anonymous No.10120718]

>connect CRT to PC
>download DOS version of the game
>scan with Retroarch
>play
At least that's how I did it.

[Anonymous No.10121101]

>>10118756
If you want to try to play it with RetroArch with shaders, Guest-advanced works well. Load the game with DOSBox-Core, and make sure the video card is set to VGA so it line-doubles the graphics. You'll have to fiddle with the shader parameters to make it look right, though. First, you have to disable the interlacing, since the line doubling will trigger it otherwise. I've also found that at resolutions lower than 1440p or so, you pretty much have to disable the scanlines (which a period-accurate VGA CRT probably wouldn't have had, anyway, or at least not to any appreciable degree), so turn on the No Scanline parameter. For the mask, I like either Mask 0 with mask shift/stagger set to 1 or Mask 10 with shift/stagger set to 2 IIRC. Both will result in a pseudo-shadow mask, with the latter being coarser.

[Anonymous No.10122167]

>>10117869
>How to set up the DOSbox version of the game to get the most vanilla experience, as if playing in 1993?
You could do that, but honestly it's really not worth bothering with DOSBox for Doom. Chocolate Doom is designed to give you the proper authentic feel, replicating everything perfectly, down to the bugs, all while running exactly like it should on modern systems, no need to tweak anything. It's the gold standard of faithful videogame source ports.

If you enjoy tinkering though, by all means set up DOSbox, it'll work too.

>I'm playing on an old LCD 1280x1024 monitor and the picture seems too pixelated and low quality
You won't ever really get away from that, you get way up close to sprites and textures all the time so you're going to see big square pixels no matter what. If you want a CRT shader, just go with whatever you think looks best to you, this game ran on a million different setups (even on TVs), there's no single fully authentic one.
Personally, I think Doom is one of those games which transitioned well to sharp and clear LCD screens because of the blocky sprites and textures already being really evident at all times anyway. If you're not playing on higher resolutions like most do today, it's gonna be even blockier as things get resolved away at a distance.

>and the picture seems too pixelated and low quality
Looks about right to me.

>Also, what utilities to use to fix all the possible bugs of the DOSbox version?
If you want to fix some bugs, then you actually don't want DOSbox or Chocolate Doom. They're not a huge deal because they seldom apply to the original levels (such as an Intercept Overflow), but many bugs were just never fixed. If you want something close to vanilla but with improved comfort and quality of life, you'd want the Crispy Doom or Woof sourceports.

>>10117886
Shut up, you retard.

[Anonymous No.10122197]

>>10117869
>And any other tips to make the experience as vanilla as possible
This isn't exactly what you're asking for in words, but based on other things you said, you may find that this approach is best for you.

>DoomLauncher
Add your DOSbox setup or chosen sourceport to this program, and then the .wad files. This program makes it extremely easy to handle files for Doom, and you're going to want to, because while the base game is still a damn good time almost 30 years later, one of the best parts about Doom is that anyone can make levels and stuff for it, and some people turned out to be absolute artisans at that. You're gonna want to check out some custom stuff, and a program like this helps with handling the expansions and stuff, Plutonia, Sigil, and No Rest For The Living being particularly worth it.

>Doom Sprite Fixing Project
Since you mentioned bugfixes. Doom has great spritework, but they implemented it a little sloppily, many frames don't have appropriate offsets, making some animations look choppy, and one or two have some stray or missing pixels and other errors like that. This mod fixes those imperfections, and what you get is the original Doom art design but the animations will look as smooth as originally intended.

>Crispy Doom
Vanilla gameplay and behavior and all, but there's few handy and nice optional features. Fake 'brightmaps' (selective parts of graphics being brightened in the dark, sorta like in DN3D), aren't truly vanilla, but it fits very well with Doom's look and you might like it. Crispy also fixes limitations and 'bugs' like visplane overflows and what not, which you'd want for playing the expansions, and has options for higher resolutions, other HUDs, little cosmetic things like fixed blood colors for some monsters, etc.
The Woof sourceport also does this, but it can play many more kinds of levels.

[Anonymous No.10122206]

>>10118367
murdered em

[Anonymous No.10122226]

>>10118731
He didn't get a reply because CRTs have an exceeding amount of variation compared to panel displays, far more than is worth explaining to someone that is fully capable of learning about it themselves. He thought the only draw is refresh rate, which is so incredibly naïve that most people won't bother correcting him.

[Anonymous No.10122228]

>>10117886
Tired and misread this, ignore the other reply.

>>10118204
Doom is sharp and blocky even on a CRT monitor, at most the display smooths this a little but it's never not blocky unless you use a hardware accelerated port with a smudgy smear filter.

>>10119228
Smoothed it, yes, but I've seen plenty of screens where that didn't come out as seamless.

>>10118348
>Trying to do it on a LCD is basically just digital blackface.
MAMMY

[Anonymous No.10122229]

Not op but I have a question
I have sound and music just fine in windows 98 but if I reboot to dos, I have nothing.
Is this a doom configuration problem or is it a hardware/driver problem? There's a bunch of options in setup.exe for audio but idk what they do

[Anonymous No.10122246]

>>10118557
Remember the black strips when the cables came loose? First couple of times you really can just bang on the TV, but after that you either call a technician, open the TV yourself, or buy a new one. I'll give the CRT guys the point that early LCDs were crap, but anything made after 2010 shits all over plasma

[Anonymous No.10122247]

>>10122226
>CRTs have an exceeding amount of variation compared to panel displays, far more than is worth explaining to someone that is fully capable of learning about it themselves
Which is why I think it's really stupid when people argue with religious zeal about how X or Y game was supposed to look, or how devs totally intended shit, when on average most CRT screens (and outputs) which people played the games on back in the day deviated from the exact ones which the devs used and worked around.

The only metrics which matter are "close enough" or "that looks good to me."

>>10118319
They were called plasma because of how the fuckers would get burn in, lmao. I can imagine better display technology than LCD screens, but plasma isn't it.

[Anonymous No.10122305]

>>10117869
Why on earth would you play in dosbox. Its just going to run like garbage. If you want an authentic experience there are source ports that do that.

[Anonymous No.10122330]

Setting aside the smoothed weapon animations, take a look at the brightmaps in action.

[Anonymous No.10123891]

there was an attempt

[Anonymous No.10123920]

>>10123891
Looks ok enough overall, but ditch the screen curve effect.

[Anonymous No.10123927]

>>10123920
Indeed, was just trying it out for shits.

[Anonymous No.10123973]

>>10122228
Looks beautiful.

[Anonymous No.10124076]

>>10122229
Have you tried sbemu? it does what it sounds like and emulates sound blaster hardware. It's relatively new.

[Anonymous No.10124286]

>>10122247
It makes sense when it comes to composite blurring, there's quite a few devs who've said they used that. But then you have people putting composite filters on PC games and it gets a little silly.

[Anonymous No.10124301]

>>10124286
ACKSHUALLY, people did use composite for CGA PC games.

[Anonymous No.10124323]

>>10122330
Is this a crispy doom feature?

[Anonymous No.10124342]

>>10117869
Anyone else utterly fascinated by early 3D? (1991-1998)?

It looks more interesting than modern 3D. Like something from an alternate dimension.

[Anonymous No.10124348]

>>10124342

[Anonymous No.10124362]

>>10124348
I love the aesthetic of arena and daggerfall too. But arena is like being in a lucid fever dream. Exploring the wilderness is fascinating.

[Anonymous No.10124382]

>>10124362
Exactly and the music is dreamlike too.

I like how the graphics look more like toys instead of realistic like a movie. Sprites are awesome too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYOjmg1DHHk&list=PL-ACqe7xAdNjgUTQ579C-J7WPGszZWdU4&index=10

[Anonymous No.10124442]

>>10124323
Crispy Doom and Woof can do that, yes. That there's also a DeHacked version of the smooth weapon animation mod for non-ZDoom ports, if you're into that.

[Batowl No.10125049]

I have doom 1 and 2 for ps3

[Anonymous No.10125081]

>>10117869
Just use Chocolate Doom you butt fucking faggot

[Anonymous No.10125273]

>>10124076
Is that going to run on a 486 tho and not slow it down as hard as windows does?
As it is I can play with no display shrinking but at low detail with win98

[Anonymous No.10125297]

>>10124382
I often get the music for arena and daggerfall stuck in my head. Arena has been growing on me a lot lately. I was looking into the limitations of the map being g directly tied to memory in dos. im guessing ems or mms or whatever. I think it would be fairly easy to give arens much more available memory for maps. I know you can allocate more memory through memory addresses, but I have no idea how that works on dos... I'll probably head to /hbg/ at some point. It would be an endless procedurally generated wilderness. Hopefully it's not too hard.

[Anonymous No.10125426]

>>10120258
>As stated by others, the most barebones without using actual DOS is Chocolate Doom for Windows
well one could argue that DOOM95 exists

here, have it preconfigured with the mouse patch for NT-based windows and dgvoodoo to solve the bug with rendering spectres on modern gpus
it includes the shareware IWAD but you can just drop any other IWAD in the folder
double click on DOOM95.CMD to launch the game (a prompt will appear if any other iwad is detected)
https://www.mediafire.com/file/xe6jk2tl4agzn2s/DOOM95.ZIP/file

I've also activated the CRT scaler (picrel) so let me know what you guys think about it

[Anonymous No.10125491]

>>10117869
Just remember that people used the mouse even back then, you don't have to use the arrow keys for turning to be "pure". Although WASD specifically was a later invention (Quake players came up with it), but some people probably used it or a variation of it before it became a common control scheme anyway.

[Anonymous No.10125626]

>>10117869
There’s nostalgia and then there’s the attempt to make things as shitty as as possible.

[Anonymous No.10125654]

>>10117869
Try using retroarch with DOS core. You'll have to spend some time setting up controls, but retroarch gives you possibility to slap crt-royale filter, which will solve "pixelated" problem. Also don't listen to mousefags, everybody originally played Doom with tank controls.

[Anonymous No.10125662]

>>10125491
>Just remember that people used the mouse even back then
Proof? Post at least two pictures from 93-95 with guys unrelated to id using the mouse to play Doom.

[Anonymous No.10125676]

>>10125654
>everybody originally played Doom with tank controls
based arrow key chad I did the same
the source ports with modern shooter controls make the game too easy imo and I'm not even good at it

[Anonymous No.10125737]

>>10117876
This is /vr they are never satisfied with anything because of the extreme autism

[Anonymous No.10125747]

>>10122330
The reason I kept playing these games was because it was funny to me how it was still more creative than most new games. I didn't really know there was this much love for the game everywhere else. I don't think it's autism to want to play it on a crt. That's just being a purist. Nothing wrong with it

[Anonymous No.10125753]

>>10124342
It was before everything got taken over by whiney obnoxious pop music. It was there back then too but not EVERYWHERE like it is now. Back then, it was more half and half.

I think that has something to do with it among other reasons maybe

[Anonymous No.10125770]

>>10125662
mouse support is mentioned in the manual for the original game

[Anonymous No.10125792]

>>10122330
Is it bad that I prefer the original chain gun animation? The lower framerate is like the muzzle flash blinding you and not being able to see it smoothly. The smoothed shotgun is pleasant though.

[Anonymous No.10125796]

>>10125792
why can't you just say, "I prefer the original chaingun animation"? why do you need to preface it with an estrogen-laden request for approval. "Ummmm like is it bad that I don't like thing haha". you're the same kind of queer that starts a thread with "CAN WE HAVE A SOMETHING THREAD?". just shut the fuck up faggot.

[Anonymous No.10125840]

>>10125796
It's called being polite.

[Anonymous No.10125851]

>>10125840
who taught you that speaking like a faggot is "polite"?

[Anonymous No.10125852]

>>10125851
What if the guy that posted that webm was the one that animated it? I can't be rude to him if he worked on it and contributed to the Doom community.

[Anonymous No.10126136]

>>10125792
Nah. I don't like smoothdoom personally.

[Anonymous No.10126140]

>>10125273
Will the win95 version run in win98?

[Anonymous No.10126192]

>>10125852
okay dude, i see that you have asperger's and are genuinely confused, so let me give you a small bit of advice: learn to make firm statements and say more with less. you could say "The shotgun looks great, but I prefer the choppier minigun, nice mod either way.", without any of the wrist-flicking fluff. if you talk like that on here, you talk like that in real life. nobody will take you seriously and you'll be the eternal nice guy that everyone will take advantage of. just say what you mean.

[Anonymous No.10126330]

>>10125654
> retroarch gives you possibility to slap crt-royale filter, which will solve "pixelated" problem

Will CRT-royal work fine on a 1280x1024 monitor?
I googled and found several sources that said that this filter only works fine on 4k monitors

[Anonymous No.10126342]

>>10126192
You wouldn't say any of that horseshit to my face. I would fucking massacre you.

[Anonymous No.10126343]

[Anonymous No.10126491]

>GZDoom
>I'm Too Young To Die
>Freelook, jump, crouch enabled

Yep, it's Doom time.

[Anonymous No.10126723]

>>10126330
It works fine on 1080p but Royale has been depreciated in favor of CRT-Guest-Advanced

[Anonymous No.10126995]

>>10117869
If your machine is able to handle it, you might want to install modern dos re-implementation as a second system https://www.freedos.org/ and play the game without emulators as it is, maybe even from a removable drive. For original game it's plenty fine to use original exe, you won't encounter any severe and experience ruining bugs.

As for further purposes: back in 1998 boom source port for dos was released, it covers major bulk of fan-made content still being made to this day with its raised engine limits and extra features. Also a fine option for original game.
https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/themes/TeamTNT/boom/boom202
https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Boom

For specific rare dozen mbf wads you may also either try Tartar or original mbf source port, but I can't vouch for the stability of Tartar as I haven't used it — scroll down for the list of its features.
https://gitlab.com/ludicrous_peridot/cod10mbf
https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/source/mbf

Whatever you decide, go with >>10117876 keen advice and keep it basic, don't let the heap of disparate opinions and mass of options waste your time. Choose what you're personally comfortable with.

>>10122330
I'm the original webm creator and prefer to play without brightmaps and smooth animations, recorded it for a curiousity. Many pwads use custom assets and weapons anyway, so it was a question consistency.

[Anonymous No.10127032]

>>10126995
>Tartar or original mbf source port
While boom has advanced yet practically negligible rng system https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttr7NxSQ5VE, I need to say that mbf has very funky monster infighting which makes the game overall harder — noticeable change from how the original was played. I'm not even sure Tartar fixes it.