/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.10017637]

Why was the N64 so blurry?

[Anonymous No.10017638]

Nintendo overestimated how much people would hate dithering and aliasing.

[Anonymous No.10017639]

>>10017637
>playing quake on the shitxyfour
>playing quake on the sharturn
I can't imagine being a console retard and stomaching these dogshit ports while feigning superiority.
>inb4 le heckin solvrino PS1 quake 2
All these games suck.

[Anonymous No.10017642]

>>10017639
the only one feigning superiority superiority here is you you fucking loser

[Anonymous No.10017643]

Hardware level bilinear filtering AND anti aliasing.

Small texture cache and memory space so textures where often very small and had to be stretched out and so blurring them make them look better.

Take a look at what ocarina of time looks like with no filtering and nearest neighbor textures for example. It looks atrocious.

[Anonymous No.10017645]

>>10017639
Both were cheaper than a Pentium cpu not to mention a pentium with a 3d accelerator(to play in 20 fps anyway i.e same as the saturn).

[Anonymous No.10017646]

>>10017642
Back to fuckin reddit and go circle jerk over your faggot saturn you cocksucker

[Anonymous No.10017658]

well it's not a /vr/ thread without an enraged manchild or three crying for literally no reason

[Anonymous No.10017661]

>console shit
I need to throw up.

[Anonymous No.10017667]

For better or worse it did give N64 games a unique look.

[Anonymous No.10017682]

Disregarding the graphics and the awful framerate, half of the fun with quake was making maps and the LAN multiplayer.

[Anonymous No.10017689]

>>10017661
Now show looking up and down in Duke Nukem 3D on PC and Duke Nukem 64

Oh no no no no pc bros!!

[Anonymous No.10017701]

>>10017637
Because idiots back then literally said
>if you can see the pixels then it means it looks bad!
and they didn't even realize how dumb this sounded as the only way not to see pixels is to turn off the screen.

Anyway that is why devs and console makers would blur their games on purpose. Thankfully pixels are hip now.

[Anonymous No.10017708]

>>10017701
devs still blur their game with fxaa, dlss and fsr for that n64 nostalgia.

[Anonymous No.10017716]

>>10017701
All the fancy expensive 3D cards offered bilinear filtering on pc which made games look "more realistic" by being smoother and less chunky and pixely and videogamey.

But in the 30 years since we've all done a 180° on that

[Anonymous No.10017723]

>>10017716
I actually always hated that. I always thought 3DFX was shitty because of the blur.

[Anonymous No.10017724]

>>10017639
DOOM ruined PC gaming.

[Anonymous No.10017730]

>>10017639
>playing quake
pc cope

[Anonymous No.10017732]

>>10017645
3D accelerators easily play it at 60 FPS. Even raw Pentium in software mode can do 20.

[Anonymous No.10017740]

>>10017701
>Thankfully pixels are hip now.
They're back and bigger than ever

[Anonymous No.10017745]

>>10017732
A 3D accelerator cost more than a N64. Not that you needed one for Quake, though. I played it in software on a 90 mhz when I was a kid.

[Anonymous No.10017753]

>>10017716
Really depends on the game, here's an example of a game benefitting from lack of filtering (character models don't look great though). With smooth, realistic style "artists" get lazy and just use stock photos for textures.

[Anonymous No.10017765]

>>10017740
If a pixel art game has less than 240 lines of pixels I won’t even consider it. Hate that shit.

[Anonymous No.10017773]

He's coming. The n64 quake autist is coming

[Anonymous No.10017775]

>>10017753
That looks horrible. Those textures definitely should be blended

[Anonymous No.10017778]

>>10017745
15 fps gang rise up (fuck saturn and its up to 30fps)

[Anonymous No.10017781]

>>10017773
He's already here: >>10017661 pretending to be a PC elitist circa 2010 reddit

[Anonymous No.10017782]

>>10017778
>saturn
>up to 30 fps

On what? menus?

[Anonymous No.10017785]

>>10017782
He's here

[Anonymous No.10017843]

>>10017689
Now let's see the N64's level design.

[Anonymous No.10017852]

>>10017843
The same exact levels with some minor cosmetic changes

[Anonymous No.10017882]

>>10017637
>thread is about N64 blur
>devolves into mustard rice shitflinging immediately
kek

Anyway, there's a lot of reasons. First of all, the textures all tend to be really low resolution in general. These textures are then filtered using a primitive version of bilinear filtering that only uses three sample points as opposed to the normal four, which in itself doesn't make the textures blurrier per se, but it does make them look somewhat jagged-looking and asymmetrical. Next, the N64's output resolution isn't great to begin with. With some exceptions, the vast majority of games are only 320x240, and some don't even manage that. Then there's the anti-aliasing, which is more or less effective, but it does introduce some inherent softness to the polygon edges. And now the biggest offender: the fullscreen horizontal-only bilinear interpolation. Regardless of internal rendering resolution, before final output to the TV, all games are horizontally stretched by the N64's Video Interface to a width of 640 pixels using bilinear interpolation. This is just straight-up blur, which is why even if you RGB mod an N64 and output to a BVM, it will still look blurry.

There are methods to get rid of these extra bits of post-processing minus the texture filtering, and a few games (including Quake II IIRC) actually allow you to do so in-game. Also, games with high resolution modes obviously suffer less from it.

[Anonymous No.10017897]

>>10017882
They all look exactly the same

[Anonymous No.10017917]

>>10017882
Thank you for this post. It's always great to see something informative in threads like this one.

[Anonymous No.10017929]

>>10017724
>Doom ruined a bunch of flight simulators, sub-par platformers, and RPGs you could fall asleep playing
Doom is a timeless classic that practically invented PC gaming, quit being a contrarian.

[Anonymous No.10017938]

SGI prioritized the wrong things and Nintendo didn't know any better, I would trade bilinear filter and AA for additive blending and bigger textures. Also a sound chip.

[Anonymous No.10018018]

>>10017882
>stretched by the N64's Video Interface to a width of 640 pixels
>This is just straight-up blur
Have you checked on your own post?

[Anonymous No.10018025]

>>10017689
Very clearly a limitation of the engine, though.

[Anonymous No.10018030]

>>10017716
Yup this is what I remember. Everyone played with filtering when they got their fancy new Voodoo card. There's been some weird retcon now that no filtering is the "true" way to play quake, but that's BS.

[Anonymous No.10018040]

>>10018018
I'm not sure what you mean by this. Are you saying there's no visible blur? The last shot is indeed blurrier than the others. Check the edges of various 2D assets on the screen, particularly the edge of the door. It looks visibly smoother than on the other shots. Or are you referring to the fact that all the shots are 640 pixels wide? Because I did that purely for pragmatic reasons, unless you want to see screenshots for ants.

[Anonymous No.10018051]

>>10018040
I'm saying it may not be "straight-up blur" and can be considered to be simply stretching.

[Anonymous No.10018064]

>>10018051
Indeed, which is why I called it interpolation. Nevertheless, bilinear as a stretching/scaling algorithm does result in blur, though I'm sure they construed it as "smoothing" or some such at the time. Hell, I remember a time when some emulators would call fullscreen bilinear filtering as "screen smoothing" or something similar, and always as a feature.

[Anonymous No.10018229]

>>10018030
no filtering is the true way to play quake, filtering breaks too much and gl quake came out months after the game did.

[Anonymous No.10018243]

>>10018229
>gl quake came out months after the game did.
Yeah and everyone who could afford a 3d accelerator switched and didn't look back.

[Anonymous No.10018251]

>>10018243
Yep, making the false way of playing quake popular until the early 2010s, when people started to look back at all their weird ass graphics mods and rediscovered what it looked like in the first place, documenting numerous broken effects and trade offs in clarity of detail.

[Anonymous No.10018274]

>>10017638
in retrospect aliasing is sovl

[Anonymous No.10018323]

>>10017753
That looks awful

[Anonymous No.10018326]

>>10017637
soul

[Anonymous No.10018447]

>>10018030
you think the art was made with a filter on top?

glquake was retarded. it broke the lighting and water effects

[Anonymous No.10018467]

>>10017637
>NES: needs expansion chips in every single game to even function
>SNES: 2.68 mhz
>N64: blurry vaseline
>GameCube: terrible lighting and particles, tiny discs
>Wii and everything newer: not even trying
Nintendo has never made good hardware, and the games on Nintendo systems have always suffered as a direct result.

[Anonymous No.10018705]

>>10017740
>pixel art
>1280x720
>.jpg
i seriously hope you guys don't do this.

[Anonymous No.10018775]

You can only fit so many pixels in 64 megabytes.

[Anonymous No.10018918]

>>10017642
eat shit millennial bitch

[Anonymous No.10019267]

>>10017740
Fixed

[Anonymous No.10019285]

I think blurry N64 looks 10x better than pixelated Saturn and PS1

[Anonymous No.10019307]

>>10019285
>I think console I grew up with looks better than console I didn't grew up with
no shit sherlock

[Anonymous No.10019320]

>>10017637
SOVL vs soulless

[Anonymous No.10019325]

Always despised how N64 games looked. I could never stand any kind of blurring.

[Anonymous No.10020072]

>>10019325
Same, it was specially worse in PAL as we couldn't do the RGB mod and playing on a CRT only made the blurriness worse using the A/V cables.

[Anonymous No.10020075]

>>10017637
low res textures I guess?

[Anonymous No.10020097]

>>10017778
I’m pretty sure I read that the Cyrix processors are flawed and can’t run Doom properly.

[Anonymous No.10020098]

>>10017778
Never forget. People weren't playing Quake at release or even in 1997-98 at 60 FPS, let alone a steady 30 FPS. And out of all the people replying in those threads, only a couple every realize that.

These threads just show how out of touch people are and either how much they've forgotten or how much revisionism applying modern logic is going on (because 60FPS is the norm *now* they think PC games were always like that, this mentality is as out of touch as zoomers who come crying about "bad design" at the first life they lose in a game)

[Anonymous No.10020102]

>>10018030
>Everyone played with filtering when they got their fancy new Voodoo card.

I seriously did that when I bought my Voodoo 4 4500 new. 2x anti aliasing was neat and made a difference at 640x480 resolutions.

[Anonymous No.10020113]

>>10017938
>SGI prioritized the wrong things and Nintendo didn't know any better

Both the AA and (de)dither add a lot of softness to the image which does not work that well when games are limited to 240p.
And Nintendo pushing these features hard didnt help either.
Drop the AA & Dedither (can also be done with gameshark or in an emulator) and games look vastly different.

[Anonymous No.10020416]

>>10020113
dedither? wtf? so like digital vaseline?
I thought nintendo were big fans of dogshit "flicker filters" on their consoles, but I wasn't aware of dedither

[Anonymous No.10020464]

Good 3d graphics with texture filtering and AA just wasnt ready at an affordable price in 96. Nintendo was just too early implementing new technology

[Anonymous No.10020473]

>>10020416
>dedither? wtf? so like digital vaseline?
Pretty much, fortunately not every game uses it (f-zero x, shadowman, rogue squadron) and that shows for crispness. Disabling that is something I prefer in general

[Anonymous No.10020482]

>>10020416
480i is already pretty shit but viewing it without some sort of filter is pure eye rape.

[Anonymous No.10020504]

>>10017637
smaller cartridge size and lower ram

[Anonymous No.10020532]

>>10017897
what do you get out of making posts like this and pretending you don't have eyes?

[Anonymous No.10020541]

>>10020482
guess whose consoles still have a flicker filter with progressive signals

[Anonymous No.10020542]

>>10020541
The Gamecube doesn't. I checked, you can too by forcing vertical filtering with Swiss. You'll see it's quite noticeable when used in progressive scan and not how it looks when set to auto.

[Anonymous No.10020548]

>>10020098
John Carmack himself said 20fps is fast in his readme for Quake. The delusions of mustards have rewritten history and they need to be pointed out as the disgusting 2010 reddit pcmr goons they are.

[Anonymous No.10020563]

>>10020548
animation speed is not framerate anon

[Anonymous No.10020565]

I'll take N64's blurriness over PS1's ugly ass dithering covering the entire screen any way of the week. That being said, the PS1 is still the superior machine.

[Anonymous No.10020592]

>>10020542
>force it off with swiss
>the gamecube doesn't have it
are you well?

[Anonymous No.10020597]

>>10018467
BASED

[Anonymous No.10020601]

>>10020592
It's disabled in 480p by default, it needs to be forced on for the non interlaced mode.

[Anonymous No.10020604]

>>10018467
>gamecube
>terrible lighting
compared to ps2? in what way?

[Anonymous No.10020680]

>>10017938
>>10017882
Something soulful about those blurred pots and similar 64 cg

[Anonymous No.10020683]

>>10017667

[Anonymous No.10020690]

>>10020604
https://youtu.be/HcqeLApWi9U?t=5190
https://youtu.be/GpYnl-YlDt4?t=294
https://youtu.be/WZo-yYStg3A?t=107
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYqk-yDOTrQ
The PS2's far greater fillrate allows it to breeze through lighting and post processing effects in general, whilst the xBox had a GPU with pixel shader support, allowing it to do the same lighting effects in a different way. The GameCube has neither. Even the most oftenly touted "impressive" GameCube games do not have anything more than simple pre-computed Gouraud lighting.
>but Resident Evil 4!!!!!
This is the ONLY game that was programmed poorly on the PS2 compared the GameCube, and countless other examples of the PS2 performing lighting and post processing effects that the GameCube can only dream are indicative that it is simply a poor port and not hardware limitations on the PS2's behalf.

[Anonymous No.10020703]

>>10020690
so gamecube even had trouble with vertex lighting? or how did they do the lighting coming off projectiles in metroid prime? I think that was a thing people said was missing from the switch remake

[Anonymous No.10020728]

>>10020690
another good example is baldur's gate dark alliance ps2 vs gamecube btw

[Anonymous No.10020734]

>>10020690
the cube had nearly equivalent pixel shaders to the xbox, just with slightly different details under the hood.

https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/the-tev-on-the-gamecube.1040/#post-15747

[Anonymous No.10020736]

>>10020690
>>10020728
>games made for one console often are unable to port graphical effects properly
It's almost as if consoles weren't just PC's back then

[Anonymous No.10021180]

>>10020736
great contribution to the thread
may god have mercy on your soul

[Anonymous No.10022054]

>>10017637
I was going through some of the Nintendo leaks yesterday and I think the N64 was rushed to market. There was the FX2 with many cancelled games being made for it, the failed disc system, etc. StarFox 2 is the perfect example, as the game was entirely completed, and then canned just before hitting market so it wouldn't cannibalize N64 sales.
I think around ~1994, Nintendo's plan was to continue support for the SNES for another 4 years or so instead of moving to a new console so soon. When the PS1 came out, N panicked and had to slap some real 3D hardware together instead of relying on FX2 or other expansion chips. In my gut, I think that's at least part of the reason why the N64 was such a mess.

picrel, cancelled SMK sequel.

[Anonymous No.10022069]

Exhibit A)

[Anonymous No.10022073]

>>10017637
built in Anti-Aliasing

if you have a gameshark, you can turn it off. it makes some games look better and others worse

[Anonymous No.10022081]

>>10022054
Are you forgetting that Nintendo and Sony created the Nintendo PlayStation?
And when that entire thing fell apart they had to start from scratch again? You know they actually found a working unit some years back? So it got the stage where the fucking thing had manufactured units? Sony obviously took what knowledge they gained from that and went on and did playstation and Nintendo had to start from scratch with the knife in their back over optical drives they absolutely were not going to partner with another company like Toshiba/Sharp/Philips/Panasonic/Fujitsu etc etc to provide optical drives so they went and did cartridges and planned their own disc drive. That fucked everything up and probably set them back a long ass time.

[Anonymous No.10022095]

>>10022081
Not forgetting, I directly referenced that.
You okay there big guy?

[Anonymous No.10022104]

>>10022081
>Nintendo had to start from scratch with the knife in their back
Also you have this part backwards. Shameful tendie.

[Anonymous No.10022109]

>>10022081
>Nintendo had to start from scratch with the knife in their back
You have this part backwards. Shameful tendie.
You're also wrong about WHY they refused to use disc-based media at launch.

[Anonymous No.10022885]

>>10017637
normally they'd release a console revision outside of Japan that removed the squint compensation necessary for asian eyes but the n64 was already too expensive

[Anonymous No.10024915]

>>10024850
great contribution to the thread
may god have mercy on your soul

[Anonymous No.10024952]

>>10017637
SGI style rendering was hard to do on a budget, and the port sucked. Lets talk about Sat-Quake's framerate though, hmm? Not like either one of these are ideal.

[Anonymous No.10025031]

>>10020734

That's not entirely true. While the TEV could roughly approximate what an xbox pixel shader could do, there are some things to consider:

-Xbox had four pixel shaders vs the one TEV unit, letting it do a lot more shader operations.
-Xbox had its vertex shaders, allowing for complex effects like the shadow volumes in Doom 3 and Riddick.
-Shadow buffers gave you a good way to do dynamic per pixel lights on the xbox, most notably used in the Splinter Cell games.

The GC was a really well designed console that punched quite well above its weight, but the Xbox was an absolute monster when you stood them next to each other. I think it's a lot of really phenomenal artistry that helps the games stand next to the Xbox heavy hitters.

By the end of its life, you really see a bunch of games that the GCN would have no hope of running show up on Xbox. Chaos Theory, Jade Empire, Ninja Gaiden, Half Life 2, Thief 3, etc... games that showed what direction graphics were going to go in the next gen.

[Anonymous No.10025040]

>>10020548
Citation please.

[Anonymous No.10025046]

>>10020548
https://fabiensanglard.net/quakeSource/johnc-log.aug.htm
Are you referring to this? The tic rate? That's not the fucking same you fagaloon.

[Anonymous No.10025058]

>>10025031
good post aside from the redditspacing ans also that you're underplaying the Gamecube's strength. RE4 GCN was the best looking game of the gen. Xbox had some admittedly next-gen looking games, but so did GCN. the problem was that nobody prioritized the platform so it got mediocre ports and 1st party titles that emphasized cartoonish visuals. when given the opportunity though, it could produce some impressive stuff.

[Anonymous No.10025063]

>>10025058
>RE4 GCN was the best looking game of the gen.
Hard disagree. It's a pretty good looking game, but put it against XBOX Chaos Theory and the gulf in quality shows.

[Anonymous No.10025069]

>>10025058
>RE4 GCN was the best looking game of the gen.
Hard disagree. It's a pretty good looking game, but put it against XBOX Chaos Theory and the gulf in quality shows. Or stuff like Riddick, which looked like a 360 game in SD. Webm related is the PC version but the XBOX version looked similar at 30 fps.

[Anonymous No.10025086]

>>10025069
>Riddick
i've played the OG Xbox version, PC and Dark Athena on PC. it is way fucking grainier and slower than that webm on Xbox. regardless, while impressive, the tech is geared in a totally different direction. riddick doesn't have the size and spectacle of RE4. it's a very small, claustrophobic game without much going on in terms of scenery. RE4 has larger environments with dozens of entities and a slew of special effects. riddick has style, but in terms of realism, it doesn't come close to RE4, especially when taking into account RE4's far greater scope.

[Anonymous No.10025094]

>>10025058
MGS2 still better looking title than most of any console that gen, and I’m a huge Xbox fag. I’d need to see Gcn RE4 side by side w my Xbox, but it was a gorgeous game. Even w weaker hardware it all comes down to how much u can get out of it I guess.

[Anonymous No.10025106]

>>10025094
>MGS2
it isn't a bad looking game, but you're kidding yourself if you think this looks better than RE4 or Riddick.

[Anonymous No.10025110]

>>10025069
>tiny bathroom
>vin diesel arms and legs are N64 tier
nah sorry brah. cool shadows though.

[Anonymous No.10025548]

>>10022054
>N64 was rushed
SGI and Nintendo started working on it in September 1993, under the name Project Reality. It later was given a christmas 1995 release date but was delayed multiple times, to June 1996.

[Anonymous No.10025560]

>>10022069
Why did the textures have to be this small? Was there no other option at the time?

[Anonymous No.10025564]

Couldn't the N64 be a PS1 with perspective correction? How hard would that be in 1996?

[Anonymous No.10025693]

>>10025560
There was a small amount of memory for the texture cache. But in Rare's games they often overlaid textures to make them more interesting. If you look at late N64 games they tend to have more clever use of textures so that they don't look so stretched.

[Anonymous No.10025710]

>>10025106
it's a crisp, clean, coherent look, with a lot of attention to detail, transparency effects, particle effects, all running at 60fps

[Anonymous No.10025721]

>>10025693
They were in grayscale with vertex coloring, Rare also blended two textures together.

[Anonymous No.10025923]

>>10025086
That's like, your opinion, man. Feels like you're stuck talking more about the artistic merits of a game, which has no bearing on which console can output better graphics. XBOX could probably run RE4 in hi-res. Rallisport Challenge 2 could run at 720p/60FPS on XBOX and it was a pretty graphically impressive game to begin with. XBOX was leagues ahead of PS2/GC and I'm not willing to admit the contrary. I say this as a long term linux user who thinks Microsoft is evil.

[Anonymous No.10026003]

>>10025923
>That's like, your opinion, man
in other words you don't know what the fuck you're talking about (which is probably why you thought posting a webm of a PC game running at high res and max settings is a fair representation of an Xbox game). nothing i said has anything to do with "artistic merits", you don't seem to understand how having bigger, more detailed environments with more special effects and 10x as many entities is just as, if not more, impressive than tiny environments with flat scenery and some admittedly good lighting. if you tried creating environments with the size and detail of RE4 using Riddick's engine, the Xbox would not be able to run it. Riddick looks good but only because it had the cut corners to achieve the style it went for. between the two, RE4 looks more realistic and has a higher poly count with vastly more going on in terms of particles and moving environmental elements. it's a more impressive game, and it holds up a lot better compared to Riddick which, beyond its lighting, is DOOM 3 tier ugly.

[Anonymous No.10026025]

>>10026003
And this is why I hate arguing with tendies online. RE4 having massive environments? what a joke. Try Halo 2. A much superior game graphically as well.

90% of people know the XBOX was the graphics powerhouse of the gen but blind fanatics still argue otherwise because they'll never admit they had something that wasn't the absolute best in everything. I had all consoles of that gen. Shut the fucking fuck up you fanatic retard. Stop embarrassing yourself and the rest of your ilk. Go compare Chaos Theory GC vs XBOX. Retard.

[Anonymous No.10026029]

Chaos Theory comparison

https://youtu.be/CQePBrnlep8

In b4 cope "t-t-the devs were biased against the cube! they didn't care!"

No. GC can't run the real Chaos Theory. So shut the fuck up.

[Anonymous No.10026041]

>>10026025
>muh PC webm
>muh jew movie quote
>muh tendies
I don't own a single Nintendo console and I'm not going to read anything else you wrote because now you're clearly too buttpained to have a rational argument. You got blown the fuck out. Stay retarded.

[Anonymous No.10026051]

>>10026041
>I'll ignore the evidence here >>10026029
>tee hee I win the argument!
>Nintendo always wins baby!
This is why everybody hate Nintendo cultists. Worse than Applefags.

[Anonymous No.10026057]

>>10026025
>>>10026025
>RE4 having massive environments?
RE4 has much larger environments than Riddick, nobody said it had "massive environments" or that it compared to Halo 2 you disengenuous goalshifting kyke
>much superior
oh, it's just an ESL.
>90% of people
>blind fanatics
lmao
>Shut the fucking fuck up you fanatic retard
holy reddit
>Go compare Chaos Theory GC vs XBOX. Retard.
>proceeds to get mad and post a comparison himself before anyone else even responds
bro you are fucking fuming right now lmao
also comparing multiplats has always been a terrible measure of graphical capability. by your logic, if i can find a GCN multiplat that looks better than Xbox, then the GCN is more powerful? you're an idiot. reply to this post and you admit you have a tiny penis.

[Anonymous No.10026058]

>>10025094
>>10025106
MGS3 looks even better than 2, but the way that 2 keeps super smooth 60 fps in 99% of the gameplay, by carefully controlling the camera, makes it look just that much more impressive in action.
As for RE4, a lot of that is opinion. Personally, 4 is a drab looking game, while MGS2 has a lot of visual variety for only taking place in 2 locations.

[Anonymous No.10026071]

>>10026057
anon... you might be the esl here

[Anonymous No.10026118]

>>10026071
i bet you think "i did good" is grammatically correct, too

[Anonymous No.10026137]

I just wish people stopped pretending that pointing to the existence of non-native English speakers is some sort of gotcha or "I win argument" button.

Also the usual modern fixation with taking pride in ignorance. Learning language is bad mmkay?

[Anonymous No.10026143]

>>10026137
I just wish you would stop redditspacing, but sadly, we don't always get what we want.

[Anonymous No.10026145]

>>10026118
lmao what a self report

[Anonymous No.10026152]

>>10026145
>the brownskin legitimately believes this is grammatically correct
embarassing!

[Anonymous No.10026153]

>>10026143
I wish you stopped thinking reddit invented paragraphs. Also preferrably, it would be ideal if you could discuss video games instead or arguing against evil foreigners or something.

[Anonymous No.10026158]

>>10026153
>muh good old days
Yeah, believe it or not, even before reddit there were pseud retards who never figured out how to properly convey their thoughts on a basketweaving forum. Thankfully, reddit gave us an explanation for their behavior.

[Anonymous No.10026164]

>>10026158
>reddit reddit reddit reddit reddit
Video games?

[Anonymous No.10026167]

>>10026164
>xir finally stopped redditspacing
This is progress.

[Anonymous No.10026181]

>>10026152
lmao
I said it was a self report, but I didn't say how
please keep going

[Anonymous No.10026190]

Do people really think the GameCube was more powerful or remotely comparable to the Xbox? That’s such an insane thing. Sunshine, RE4 and Luigi’s Mansion look great and all. But even throwaway games just looked better on Xbox. Just look at True Crime, GUN, Simpsons, GTA San Andreas or Mercenaries. Mercenaries was an insane game on the Xbox that’s IMO still fun and very unique. There’s also stuff like Just Cause. There’s many many games that blow RE4 out of the water. There’s just zero comparison between the two systems. This is such a silly argument

[Anonymous No.10026194]

Waiting for the mass purge, this shit flinging is really pathetic.

[Anonymous No.10026220]

>>10026190
People often say Dreamcast was gen 5.5. But I genuinely believe XBOX could be defined as gen 6.5, it was a fucking beast. The only people who could doubt this never had one.

[Anonymous No.10026227]

>>10026181
>tranny is mad
sad!

[Anonymous No.10026235]

>>10026227
?

[Anonymous No.10026238]

>>10026220
It really was. I loved my GameCube and all. But like, playing Halo 2, Doom 3 or Ninja Gaiden was like an entirely different generation. There’s so many good looking games.

[Anonymous No.10026309]

>>10017637
Nintendo 64 games are ROM cartridge based. Cartridge size varies from 4 to 64 MB. so no space for big nice looking textures, just minimized ones

[Anonymous No.10026440]

>>10026235
>tranny is confused
sexually and otherwise

[Anonymous No.10026497]

>>10026190
Yeah, I don't understand that. It somehow became the retrospective wisdom that the Gamecube was the most powerful machine of its generation.

[Anonymous No.10026520]

>>10026497
Which is quite funny considering it is the weakest.

[Anonymous No.10026524]

>>10026440
damn imagine getting owned by a tranny on an imageboard and seething this hard over it

[Anonymous No.10026525]

>>10026520
why does the pic have that filename

[Anonymous No.10026580]

>>10026520
If you look at the specs on paper, xbox is ahead, particularly with its cpu, but I seem to recall the gamecube's gpu had some slight advantages, but only when used competently. A lot of games seemed to use xbox's potential pretty well, probably because directX was already familiar, and only a few games could max out the Gamecube, not that it had a lot of games. PS2 seemed to be complicated to program for though some games looked very nice on it. I don't think the case could be made that its raw capability, even when maxxed out, would have been better than the other two machines. The thing is, when either of the three machines are being used effectively, they'll be taking advantage of capabilities that the other machines don't have, so it's hard to do a direct head to head comparison, other than to say, in general xbox games looked better.

[Anonymous No.10026583]

>>10026580
PS2 is generally much weaker, but it can stream data faster than either of the two other systems.

[Anonymous No.10026595]

>>10026580
gamecubes strengths basically come down to the pre-caching RAM and high polygon throughput. Polygon throughput Xbox typically matches or surpasses. The precaching thing is also met on Xbox with the HDD Caches, 3 partitions where frequently accessed data sits to be quickly pulled into system RAM which speeds up all loading and can store much more data.

The precaching RAM on GC can be used to minimize load times which can usually give it faster loading than PS2 but PS2 does have a much higher speed drive and an option for even higher speed CD reads as >>10026583 mentions. Usable RAM on GC is actually closer to Dreamcast in size which does limit it in some key ways.

[Anonymous No.10027439]

>>10020690
You are so wrong in many things!

It's a common misconception that the Gamecube doesn't have fragment shaders. The GPU (called the TEV) is almost a straight implementation of DirectX's ps1.0, the same as a GeForce3, with a few extras added. The PS2 has no pixel shader support. Uses custom Vector Units to transform vertices by hand-written micro-code assembly. Really slow and confusing .

The GC is "fixed function" but really, it's a very flexible architecture that is almost as powerful as the xbox shaders, in some respects surpassing them.

You can achieve many of those effects with the fixed function Direct3D pipeline on some PC hardware going as far back as the Matrox G400!. Take a look at how EMBM style bump mapping works - it peturbs the pixels of one texture map based on the pixels of another. (It's in the D3D docs under "Bump Mapping"

Combine that EMBM with render to texture, dynamic textures which can be updated with the CPU very cheaply and way faster than the PS2 thanks to lots of flexible texture combiners/blend units (TEVs) and you've got a lot of possibilities for cool effects open to you

[Anonymous No.10027728]

>>10017637
Why was the PS1 so wobbly and pixelly? Why was the Saturn so dithery and framey? Early 3D hardware sucked my goddamn balls, simple as.

[Anonymous No.10027738]

>>10027728
Don't give me that shit. Both the PlayStation and the Saturn graphics have aged leagues better than the vaseline shit smear N64.

[Anonymous No.10027803]

>>10017637
Proprietary hardware always leads to disaster when developers try to make apps. The best developers at the time were using unix PCs. So you got masterpieces, or god what is that.

[Anonymous No.10027870]

>>10027738
They haven't, all those upscaled screenshots with PGXP and texture filtering you see here aren't representative of the graphics you got back then.
Also the PS1 relied much more on 2D and pre-rendered elements mixed with 3D, which are difficult to render at higher resolutions without everything looking like ass dildoes.

[Anonymous No.10027889]

>>10025106
Its blurry, look how blurry everything is. Ps2 is so blurry. Sonic Adventure on DC had such nice textures. Many ps2 games have n64 quality textures.

>>10017637
Saturn and ps1 use higher rez textures. Frigate on golden eye has good textures but if you look closely you can see mip mapping reducing the detail in the short distance. Super off road has worst road textures I've seen in any game. Another good texture are the rocks in mario 64, they look perfect with filtering.

>>10026497
Metroid 60 fps while halo is 20 to 30. Halo 1 looks like absolute crap too.

>>10026595
Bit of a waste having so many polys as there is not enough texture ram so you get blurry textures but the mountains have smooth curves.

[Anonymous No.10028003]

Devs saved the thumbnail

[Anonymous No.10028045]

>>10020098
You're talking out your ass. My fucking 4mb S3 virge in my parents off the shelf pentium ran Quake like a dream on release. Literally anybody who had actually put money and effort into their setup was getting well beyond their monitor refresh rate in 1996.

[Anonymous No.10028234]

>>10017778
>>10020098
Pretty sure these numbers are taken out of the ass
Pentium 133 with 4MB Voodoo was enough to play Quake at 30-40 at 640x480
Hell, it was enough to play Quake 2 at ~15-25
Here's an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcsxyhhfNTw

[Anonymous No.10028349]

>>10027889
>Metroid 60 fps while halo is 20 to 30. Halo 1 looks like absolute crap too
GT4 is 60fps/1080i, Forza is 30fps/480p. Going by your logic PS2 is more powerful than Xbox.

[Anonymous No.10028352]

>>10028349
>1080i
Output resolution is not the same as rendering resolution.

[Anonymous No.10028358]

This place is truly /vr/tendo.

I find it funny how on/v/ graphics don't matter according to them, but on /vr/ it's the most important thing and their laughably bottlenecked systems always win, isn't that an amazing coincidence?

[Anonymous No.10028362]

Also, if Dreamcast is gen 5.5 as they always say, then N64 isn't the most powerful system of its gen.

[Anonymous No.10028372]

>>10027889
>Halo 1 looks like absolute crap too
what the fuck am I reading

[Anonymous No.10028405]

>>10020690

Yeah the PS2 had amazing shading capabilities

[Anonymous No.10028414]

>>10028405
>I literally can't fucking read
lmao

[Anonymous No.10028546]

>>10027889
>Halo 1 looks like absolute crap too.
Looks significantly better than memetroid and doesn't have rooms the size of a kids shoe box.

[Anonymous No.10028587]

>>10020734

https://youtu.be/5TfcSBMhBh8?t=617

Nintendo kept most of the TEV documentation for theirselves, hence Factor 5 dropped the official devkits to make the Rogue Squadron Games, too bad the on foot sections had poor gameplay, the GC could have better Splinter Cell ports but in the end got a gimped direct PS2 version.

[Anonymous No.10028606]

>>10028587
>Nintendo kept most of the TEV documentation for theirselves
what was this big brain move about? do they understand they're trying to sell as much games and consoles as possible?

[Anonymous No.10028763]

>>10028606
They pulled the exact same shit with the N64 and its microcode. Nintendo have always been real cloak and dagger with their hardware for some bizarre reason, probably because they want their own games to shine above that of third parties or some shit.

[Anonymous No.10028880]

>>10028763
its funny because the comparative openness made games look so much better on PS2 and Xbox. I wonder if this is part of why true crime ny on gamecube is a total and complete disaster.

[Anonymous No.10028887]

>>10028880
>I wonder if this is part of why true crime ny on gamecube is a total and complete disaster
That game is a total distaster on every platform. The GCN version was an outsourced port to some no name developer, the same ones whose Xbox port is unbeatable without cheats due to a glitch.

[Anonymous No.10028893]

>>10028887
Looks great and runs nicely on both xbox and ps2

[Anonymous No.10028912]

>>10028893
No it does not.

[Anonymous No.10029025]

>>10028912
cherry picked and still looks better than the GC version

[Anonymous No.10029042]

>>10029025
The GCN port is the worst version but the game still looks and runs terribly on all platforms. It's probably one of the least finished games of that generation, practically an early beta build with the debug menu hacked out.

[Anonymous No.10029045]

>>10028912
>>10029042
Is this the 6th gen equivalent of when consolewarfags argue bitterly about whether a terrible looking and playing derivative mascot platformer is better on the SNES or Genesis?

[Anonymous No.10029049]

>>10029045
Yes. Only it's just one guy who brings this game up.

[Anonymous No.10029054]

>>10029045
It's weird how a basic question into whether or not Nintendo being open about the consoles tools could have helped a very troubled version out caused this console warrior to out himself but here we are

[Anonymous No.10029061]

>>10029054
A competent port of a broken unfinished game would still be a broken unfinished game.

[Anonymous No.10029072]

>>10028234
Quake was developed for the 66mhz version of the Pentium 1, which was still the most popular model at time of Quake's release.

[Anonymous No.10029098]

>>10029054
No it isn't. He's accurately pointing out that the game would have run like shit on GCN regardless of Nintendo's decisions, just like it did on other systems.

>>10028587
Factor 5 helped make those dev kits. I still don't understand why people don't get it by now. Factor 5 wasn't a game dev to Nintendo, they were a software library developer that happened to make games on the side.

>>10028606
It's to have control and make more money. If you were having problems with GCN development, then Nintendo would charge to help you overcome whatever development problem you were having. The only alternative is to find someone else who has made good software libraries for the GCN (that's why you see some games with stuff like the Bink Audio logo at the beginning). Factor 5 was usually the guys Nintendo would send to help in development, which is why Factor 5 is in the special thanks sections of some third party GCN games.

[Anonymous No.10029102]

>>10029072
Pretty sure in the later half of '96 all dedicated gamers got themselves a P133 at the least. P166 were not uncommon (my friend got his 166 two weeks after I got 133)

[Anonymous No.10029104]

>>10029102
Nope, a minority of people doesn't really make a difference. The game was developed for the 66mhz P1 and lots of people had weaker computers than that. This matters, Quake is a game that sold millions.

[Anonymous No.10029106]

>>10029104
>casuals matter

[Anonymous No.10029118]

>>10029106
Yes. We're not talking about casuals though, we're talking about the majority of gamers. Most gamers were still running something at least half as powerful as a 133mhz P1

[Anonymous No.10029129]

>>10029098
>just like it did on other systems
You don't seem to be aware of how much worse the gamecube version is

[Anonymous No.10029132]

>>10029129
Except that I do and for the last time, that is not relevant. The game would look like that if Nintendo told the dev entirely how the system works. The game runs like shit because it runs like shit.

[Anonymous No.10029139]

>>10029132
How is hiding tools from developers so they can make better versions of games irrelevant
>For the last time
Lmfao do something fat ass

[Anonymous No.10029154]

>>10029139
They're not hiding tools, dumbass. That developer had access to development tools and made a shit game regardless. There are enough free development tools to make a game and in any event the dev used other libraries. The game would look the same with whatever development tools used, as is obvious from the other versions of the game.

The GCN version is the worst because a dev that couldn't make that game competently in the first place put the least effort into the GCN version. This was a common development attitude, it's why games like Splinter Cell happened where there's an Xbox and PS2 version, made by different devs, and then the GCN version is based on the PS2 version, again made by the PS2 dev. The system hardware and development environment has nothing to do with why the end product looked like the PS2 version with corners cut.

[Anonymous No.10029181]

>>10029154
Right they're just not sharing best practices for their custom platform despite xbox and playstation doing it publicly lmao nothing is hidden here

Fucking retarded fanboy

[Anonymous No.10029183]

>>10017778
Cyrix processors were notoriously bad at quake. That's why the company went bankrupt

[Anonymous No.10029192]

>>10029181
>Right they're just not sharing best practices for their custom platform despite xbox and playstation doing it publicly lmao nothing is hidden here
No they don't. All companies have always operated with basic libraries being provided as part of dev kits (that's why the dev kit costs tens of thousands of dollars, by the way, there aren't actually free libraries) and you pay a premium for special libraries you might need. All three companies operate this way and all three versions of this game you obsess over had to pay for software licensing for PS2, Xbox, and GCN. Therefor the fact that it's worst on GCN isn't a hardware or development issue.
>Fucking retarded fanboy
No, you just don't understand why you're wrong.

[Anonymous No.10029197]

>>10029183
They had a lot of other problems, especially how IBM was their benefactor and IBM changed their attitude towards exploiting Cyrix.

[Anonymous No.10029203]

>>10029192
It's worse on gamecube because of a nintendo obfuscation issue.

[Anonymous No.10029207]

>>10029203
It has already been explained that that is not true. It looks worse because of business decisions.

[Anonymous No.10029210]

>>10029207
a made up business decision with no substantiation based on things you made up in your head that don't add up with the fact that nobody wants to ship a bad game, especially a comically bad port that makes your favorite console look like a joke from brazil

[Anonymous No.10029221]

>>10029210
>a made up business decision with no substantiation
It's been substantiated in the thread already.
>based on things you made up in your head
What things? That dev kits cost money? That everyone has to pay for development tools? Those aren't made up, you just for some reason need them to be made up.
>add up with the fact that nobody wants to ship a bad game
Tons of bad games have been shipped, the businessman making the decision to ship the game doesn't give a fuck.
>that makes your favorite console
You keep doing stuff like this, I wonder why. You're obsessed over this game, obsessed over console differences, you need it to be somehow Nintendo's fault when really it's just the same development environment that every console has ever had, and you handwave when how things really work is pointed out.

[Anonymous No.10029229]

It's bizarre that someone spends an hour insisting Nintendo was supposed to pay to develop Def Jam instead of the people making Def Jam, but when Sony and Microsoft don't it's okay.

[Anonymous No.10029235]

>>10029221
>It's been substantiated in the thread already.
Link?

[Anonymous No.10029242]

>>10029235
lmao no, you don't get to whine. Pointing out examples like Splinter Cell is perfectly sufficient. Most GCN games got the least development attention because it was pretty much never the primary platform for any game.

[Anonymous No.10029252]

>>10029242
No link to it? Ok

[Anonymous No.10029259]

>>10029252
No link to literally anything you've said? Okay. You're a retard screaming about something you brought up and get upset when you're wrong. No I'm not going to link you to the apparent 50 articles it'd take to show you the basics of how a video game business works.

[Anonymous No.10029261]

>>10029259
Link instead of spamming ok

[Anonymous No.10029263]

>>10029261
No link to literally anything you've said? Okay. You're a retard screaming about something you brought up and get upset when you're wrong. No I'm not going to link you to the apparent 50 articles it'd take to show you the basics of how a video game business works.

[Anonymous No.10029268]

>>10017637
someone should look into making a new n64 quake port, I refuse to accept that's the best you can get of the console

[Anonymous No.10029271]

>>10029268
I just don't think people are interested in it, same goes for saturn doom which could definitely be done better.

[Anonymous No.10029290]

>>10029268
I'd make an entirely new engine or at least perfect dark with the new optimizations (it runs at 30 fps on hardware), also one should remodel every single level trying to hide the low texture repetition, looking into actually using 64x64 textures and abuse vertex colors

[Anonymous No.10029301]

>>10029290
N64 has a hard limit of 4KB per texture, increasing texture resolution and trying to still have color usually doesn't look good.

[Anonymous No.10029304]

I actually miss when each platform was a separate experience with it's own shortcumings.

[Anonymous No.10029306]

>>10029301
What was the limit for the Ultra 64 arcade hardware?

[Anonymous No.10029312]

>>10029301
Quake 64 is highly compressed too. Keep in mind it has load times (decompression of maps) longer than saturns and the textures were likely a victim of it too. I don't think it can easily do pc quality assets but definitely can be improved.

[Anonymous No.10029404]

>>10029301
that's why you use 64x64 black and white textures and color them with vertex colors, you can blend them too, shit would end looking like banjo tough

[Anonymous No.10029468]

>>10017753

MGS2 graphics will never get old.

[Anonymous No.10029763]

>>10029268
People have and the N64 quake port is considered quite good. It has very few cuts relatively and fits most of the original game into very limited hardware. No one trashed it as a port currently and at the time it was pretty impressive stuff. It’s just a game that plays to all of the N64s weaknesses. Smooth animations, smooth keyframing, high res textures, large chunk levels, complicated viewports. There’s a lot going on in the engine that people don’t give it credit for. That’s why games as recent as COD and HZD still use things from it.

[Anonymous No.10029768]

>>10029042
https://www.pcgamesn.com/emulation/dolphin-games-true-crime-new-york-city

GameCube Version got the worst hit, they litterary coded it dividing by zero.

By the end of the GC lifespan it got the worst development effort for the multiplats

[Anonymous No.10029773]

>>10029763
I think it can be done better, after looking unreal running on saturn even more

[Anonymous No.10029789]

>>10029773
The Saturn is straight up better suited to PC ports than the PSX or N64. It just does well with certain things. Checkout Powerslave on the Saturn for a really good example of what it’s capable of. The guy who did the unreal “port” is using an entirely custom engine he’s been working on for like 7 years. With all the benefits of modern dev cycle and testing.

[Anonymous No.10029793]

>>10029789
This seems dubious. Powerslave is best on Saturn because Powerslave is a Saturn game. Most PC ports are better on Playstation.

[Anonymous No.10029801]

>>10029793
I don’t know what to tell you. If you look at stuff on the Saturn there’s lots of good stuff ported to it. It has a very active homebrew scene. Either way that doesn’t change the N64s limitations. It’s a very limited console that’s good at very certain things. As the PSX and Saturn are.

[Anonymous No.10029803]

I think quake can be done better on n64 but with a completely different engine, a portal based one like goldeneye

[Anonymous No.10029806]

I don't think N64 Quake could get all that much better. But as with pretty much any game on the system, a bigger cartridge would certainly help at the very least by getting the whole game in there.

[Anonymous No.10029813]

>>10029803
Quake already has a portal based engine. The geometry in quake is just far more complicated as are the textures. There’s also way more variety in weapons, enemies and hazards. I’m telling you people have tried and failed because it’s not an easy task. The quake engine is very easy to work with if you want to give it a try.

[Anonymous No.10029816]

You're blurry.

[Anonymous No.10029818]

>>10029801
There is, I'm just saying I don't think the Saturn is better for PC ports. CPU power counts so much for PC games. When a Saturn game is better than its Playstation version it almost always turns out that is because it was a Saturn game originally and the Playstation version is a port.
Saturn Doom vs Playstation Doom
Saturn Quake vs Playstation Quake 2

[Anonymous No.10029829]

>>10029818
There’s things the PSX is pretty great for that the Saturn isn’t. This isn’t a 100% general statement. But it’s pretty easy to develop for if you give it a shot. There’s lots of good tools these days. Also the Saturn doom was a port of the PSX version which wasn’t a PC port but fairly custom. There’s allegedly a 60fps version of Doom that was developed for the Saturn that Carmack didn’t like because he was autistic about rendering things in software because accuracy. Which the PSX just did better than the N64/Saturn.

[Anonymous No.10029839]

>>10029829
I believe that guy insofar as he probably had a much better engine. I don't buy the 60fps. Powerslave, which is a super impressive fps game made by devs who were masters of the Saturn for the time, does not run at 60 fps.
Anyway, not trying to shit on the Saturn, I like the system. It just seems to me that the Playstation was inherently good at PC ports compared to the other 2 options.

[Anonymous No.10029852]

>>10029839
Developing on the Saturn is way more analogous to PC dev cycle of the time. If you uses the Sega dev tools it was straightforward to concurrently develop both a PC and Saturn version. And 60fps was never really a target. 30fps was considered quite good. Why would you not trade some performance for better graphics? Does that make sense? I hope my explanations answered some of your misconceptions about game development. If you want to give it a try yourself go ahead. But the N64 is pretty maxxed out by devs early on. It just is not a very capable console nor is it easy to develop for

[Anonymous No.10029853]

>>10029816
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7FShqXAqGv4
wont ever forget this song

[Anonymous No.10030634]

>>10029806
sure it could, look how much smash remix runs better than the base game because it takes use of the expansion RAM

[Anonymous No.10030763]

>>10017637
This thread again?

[Anonymous No.10030764]

>>10017643
We are on an image board so next time post an image.

[Anonymous No.10030768]

>>10017753
Lol @ people hating on this. The wind and rain made it look amazing.

[Anonymous No.10030770]

>>10017938
>that water

[Anonymous No.10030776]

For me, it's turning off the filtering in PS2 games

[Anonymous No.10030778]

>>10017637
Art in quake and quake 2 was intentionally made for a software render without texture filtering

[Anonymous No.10030779]

>>10017882
>all games are horizontally stretched by the N64's Video Interface to a width of 640 pixels using bilinear interpolation
rofl, so is there any advantage to playing on real hardware over wii vc?

[Anonymous No.10030782]

[Anonymous No.10030783]

[Anonymous No.10031580]

>>10030779
Yes. The VC versions are not perfectly emulated and there's some emulation issues and incorrectly rendered effects. For example, in Mario 64, the Vanish Cap is supposed to have a sort of static effect, whereas in the VC version it's just a plain old transparency effect. Similarly, in OoT the boss Morpha is supposed to also have some sort of static effect around it, which is entirely missing in the GC/VC versions. There's also timing issues, where part of the ending cutscene in OoT desyncs from the intended musical cues and ends too early. For these reasons, if you don't have or don't want to play on real hardware, you're better off emulating on PC than playing the VC versions nowadays (though the aforementioned timing issue is also present on all emulators, unfortunately).

[Anonymous No.10032056]

>>10029852
N64 architecture is shit but it's disingenuous to say it was maxxed early on when the best looking games didn't come out till 2000s.

[Anonymous No.10032073]

>>10017638
But people did hate dithering and aliasing back then. The problem was the N64's solution was excessive hardware enabled smoothing.
>>10017637
You can actually remove some of the smoothing in quake 64, try that option.

[Anonymous No.10032078]

>>10017753
>benefitting from lack of filtering
You are mentally ill, the game was designed with filtering in mind, you're actually destroying the games look with this retarded shit.

[Anonymous No.10032105]

>>10025693
Didn't Rare learn how to use the cart as a type of memory to increase texture quality and level size or something along those lines? I remember reading something about that somewhere with some dev.

[Anonymous No.10032107]

>>10026520
No, the ps2 was and xbox was the most powerful.

[Anonymous No.10032117]

>>10030782
PS2?

[Anonymous No.10032183]

>>10017929
System Shock came out before Doom 2 and was in development before Doom.
Ultima Underworld predates Doom.
Then you had shit like Kings Quest, SSI Gold Box games, Dune, Dune 2, Star Control, Alone in the Dark, Civilization, and plenty more.

[Anonymous No.10032235]

>>10032078
It was developed during the transitional point between PS1 and PS2 and without filtering you can see all the detail in the textures that usually turns into a blurry mess. It has that delibirate design with its 90 degree angles and straight lines (present in high effort PS1 games), but texture filtering becoming a standard encouraged devs to be lazy and use stock photos for textures and so most of them, like MGS3, look like shit without it.

[Anonymous No.10032450]

>>10032078
Texture filtering always has, and always will look like complete shit. Unless the game has n64 tier textures, it will look better without filtering regardless of its intended design.

Back in the day I used to mod games to disable texture filtering, specifically by hooking calls to IDirect3DDevice9::SetSamplerState. Unfortunately it does not seem to work with modern games, when I recently tried it on a Directx11 unity game, changing the sampler state from anisotropic to point completely broke the shadows. Setting the mipmap level to 1, did work though, god I hate mipmaps, they are always to aggressive making the textures visibly blur with distance.

[Anonymous No.10032594]

>>10032450
Goldeneye in the Aztec level had very nice textures and as you moved towards the walls it fairly seamlessly transitioned to a more high res texture. It's just most of the time texture filtering was used to get away with low res textures rather than to do something nice. However, low res textures can be nice in that it allowed them to optimise other elements of the game.

[Anonymous No.10033869]

>>10032183
>Ultima Underworld predates Doom.

Ultima Underworld predated Wolfenstein 3D even.

John Carmack saw the game running at a tradeshow and thought that he could write a faster renderer, so he went home and did, but the reason the Wolf3d engine is faster is because the levels are completely flat with no slopes or geometry at all, everything is fullbright so there is no lighting to calculate, there is no inventory system, no spell system, no conversation system with NPCs, no bartering, no crafting, no floor or ceiling textures, no variable music system, no water/swimming, no character stats or experience/upgrade system, no variable melee attack system, no mapping system, and no cutscenes outside of a three second animation that is reused for the end of each episode.

It is absolutely insane how advanced Ultima Underworld was for its time.

[Anonymous No.10034596]

>>10029118
>>10029102
I had a P133 in '96. I certainly wasn't getting 70Hz out of that. 35, maybe. MAYBE.
Even with a voodoo you had a framerate that was all over the place. It really wasn't until the voodoo2 that glquake got relatively stable 640x480.