/vr/ - Retro Games

>>949817
While it is spot-on, I can't possibly imagine a reason for you to be asking this instead of playing the games yourself. Cross is no Trigger, but it's a unique game worth experiencing.

>>949817
>have stories that can be viewed as ones that clash with those of their predecessors. Is this correct?
As far as I'm aware the whole point of Chrono Cross is to address the time paradoxes caused by time travel in Chrono Trigger.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head.
That said, both are definitely worth playing.

>>949839
There's only really one paradox it explains, then creates a dozen more.

I'm actually like halfway through Chrono Cross and so far the only connections are some names. What's more frustrating is that the settings between the games clash so much. Cross introduces "demi-humans" and dragon gods, and for some reason everyone can use magical "elements" even though in Trigger magic really only existed in a certain time period for a specific reason.

>>949848
I didn't say they did a good job of it.

>>949854
Like they seem like totally unrelated games, setting-wise, gameplay-wise, and plot-wise. So far they share a few character names, but I guess I haven't finished it yet.

>>949858
>>949854
None of these blatant differences aren't even attempted to be addressed either. They make sure you know what's pissing off a random fishwife though by god.

>>949881
>None of these blatant differences aren't even attempted to be addressed either.
If what you mean is that they don't even try to address the demi-humans, the dragons, and the elements, then you somehow missed the whole final act of the game. They do explain this.

As for >>949854, where are you at? There's a big part where you end up in a Chrono Trigger related area. It gave me chills as a CT fan when I first played it. Little by little, Cross connects to Trigger in a very ingenious way, in my opinion. Way more interesting and fun than in a typical sequel fashion.

Some names, however, do remain that, only names. But make no mistake, the games are definitely connected. Keep playing and you'll see why.

>>949897
Oh right, I forgot they do address those things, in giant last minute dialogue dumps in the game's final areas.

Chrono Cross was a strange and astonishing game for its time, and really really enjoyable. The music and the atmosphere of the game are something I've honestly never felt so much enjoyment from in any other JRPG.

In the end, though, I don't think a lot die-hard Chrono Trigger fans would have been happy with Chrono Cross regardless of what was done with it unless it was a by-the-numbers copy of CT. The fact that they went in a new direction so dramatically interests me quite a bit, and left me pretty much hooked.

I thought Chrono Cross was like the CT world if Lavos never existed,

Chrono Cross takes itself far too seriously. Chrono Trigger is good in the same way as Back Too The Future. It's a fun, light-hearted game, that doesn't give a fuck about paradoxes or making any kind of sense. Just enjoy the music/graphics/character design and don't think too hard. It even avoids the common flaws of JRPGs by removing random encounters and having plenty of interesting gimmicks in the boss fights. There's hardly any grinding. It's a strong candidate for best JRPG of all time.

And then Chrono Cross is basically challenging you to think as hard as possible to solve the puzzle of the plot, and it doesn't work because there's no satisfactory solution. It still has great art (by 5th gen. standards, which means it's worse than Chrono Trigger) and music, but the characters are much weaker because there are too many of them, and the battle system hasn't advanced from Chrono Trigger. You have to suffer through CDROM load times too.

Trigger is clearly the better game.

>>949925
>puzzle of the plot
>"this was all part of my master plan, lol"

>>949912
>Oh right, I forgot they do address those things, in giant last minute dialogue dumps in the game's final areas.
Actually, the plot dumps were about other things. The dragon/element stuff is actually elaborated on the final stage of the game.

But yes, even while the pacing was poor and you had plot dumps, the game makes its story 100% clear. Criticize the use of the dumps, but don't criticize its lack of clarity because it's all clear.

>>949931
>but don't criticize its lack of clarity because it's all clear.
The ending was most certainly NOT clear. I agree with you about the other stuff, but I still don't know what to make of the fucking ending.

>>949925
On battle systems, I really liked the simplicity of Chrono Trigger's battle system. You attack an enemy, or use a cool magic attack and thats it. Im not op, but Im only like 2 hours into the game and I find Cross's combat somewhat convoluted, with it's whole "Field element" thingy, plus the percentages or whatever.

Im going to continue to keep an open mind with this game though. Hopefully there is enjoyment somewhere beyond the music (which is godly, by the way).

>>949925
I actually like Chrono Cross better because the story leaves a lot more room for thought, the setting feels a lot more personal, the themes are a lot more interesting (the right to exist, dreams and the sea, and so on) and the battle system doesn't involve waiting for a bar to fill up.

The gameplay is a lot better too thanks to the Time Shifter since you can speed up everything after your first playthrough, and you can actually skip every non-boss battle in Cross, and escape from every single one as well. Chrono Trigger only gave the illusion of avoiding encounters.

I played CT first, but CC just took everything and turned it inside out in such a way that hooked me and left me intrigued. I like it more both for gameplay and its plot. I know it's not for everyone, though. I feel just like >>949915 said about it.

As someone who never had Chrono Cross on SNES (but did have SoM, FF6) and never had a PS, I eventually played both games much later and with only slight nostalgia. I recall enjoying Chrono Cross a lot more. The battle system was more novel and the atmosphere pulled me in more.

It's unfortunate I didn't play CT way back in the day, though, because I can see why so many people consider it to be one of the best games.

>>949946
>It's unfortunate I didn't play CT way back in the day, though, because I can see why so many people consider it to be one of the best games.
As someone else who played Chrono Trigger well after the SNES era was over, I can't. Once you get past the novelty of TIME TRAVEL the game really doesn't seem like anything special.

>>949945
>only gave the illusion of avoiding encounters
You can dodge almost all of them if you know the patterns.

>>949920
No, Cross takes place 4 years after Trigger, same world, same timeline.

>>949962
I thought Chrono Trigger was 1000AD, and Cross was 1020AD?

>>949963
My bad, I just double checked. Serge was born 4 years after Trigger. The events of Cross takes place on 1020 AD.

>>949959
>if you know the patterns.
Exactly.

And there are many you can't avoid. It becomes obvious (and tedious) how many are unskippable when you do a New Game +.

You can actually skip every non-boss in CC, and you can run away from anything as well, while escaping almost never worked in CT.

>>949963
Yes, Cross is on 1020 AD. >>949962 is right and that it is the same world and timeline, but >>949920 is also right in that Cross is a world without Lavos. The CT timeline destroyed Lavos, and so Cross came to be.

>>949954
I agree that the time travel has a lot to do with it, but I can see that being pretty special back in the day.

>>949817
/m/anly men

I watched Diebuster first and thought it was retarded trite.

Then I watched Gunbuster and thought it was awesome.

Then I realized some of the stuff Diebuster did that tied it to Gunbuster and I thought it was even more retarded than before.

>>949954

It's Pacing is why it's so good. I seriously can't think of a JRPG that has better pacing than CT.

>>949954
Scenario design, it's pretty exceptional. This would include pacing, player-controlled points of interest, stuff like that.

I think CT can be praised enough for that alone, its historical context. I'm not too much of a fan otherwise, the combat/party thing just ain't my thing.

Cross is the perfect sequel to Trigger if you spent the time between the two games growing up normally instead of wanking to little animu gurls and staying a manchild.

I remember Cross just pissed me off after it came out because every gaming magazine I read at the time played the game up like it was going to have multiple alternate realities, like Trigger's multiple time periods, then the fucking thing came out and there were two realities. That's it. Just the two. One with you alive, and the other with you dead.
It really aggravated the hell out of me because I was looking forward to multiple universes and the game sounded so much cooler in all the magazines prior to actually playing it.