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[ERROR] No.76333964 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Dapper Edition

>UA: Subclasses, Part 5
https://media.wizards.com/2020/dnd/downloads/UA2020_102620_Subclasses05.pdf

>5e Trove
https://thetrove.is/Books/Dungeons%20%26%20Dragons%20%5Bmulti%5D/5th%20Edition%20%285e%29/

>5etools
https://5e.tools/

>Stable releases
https://get.5e.tools/

>Resources:
http://pastebin.com/X1TFNxck

>Previous thread: >>76328896

Players: does your character have a fashion sense?
DMs: is there any fashion in your setting?

>> No.76334000

If your Noble isn't constantly showing off, you're doing something wrong.

>> No.76334030 [DELETED] 

Fashion is the most important part of any setting!

>> No.76334058 [DELETED] 

Why would I ever pay actual human money to use pic related when I can just write everything down on a piece of paper free of charge

>> No.76334064

>>76333964
>thread pic
Very muscular body under that suit.

>> No.76334077

>>76334058
Because, Kyle, I already paid for it and this is the fucking 8th fucking page you've printed out in colour tonight

just use your damn phone man

>> No.76334092

>>76334058
Because good goyim always pay.

>> No.76334154

>>76333964
Yes, my character grew up as a noble so he is keenly aware of how to be and stay fashionable. The problem is he doesn't care and is only now trying to be a decent noble, instead of just the third son that gives everyone something to gossip about, because he has to.

>> No.76334207

>>76334058
>use it
>write down my "homebrew" class
:^)

>> No.76334208

What Wizard Spell best can fit for a blade of light? Scribe Wizard can change only wizard spells damage types.

>> No.76334228

>>76333964
Hey Fred. You're a fucking faggot.

>> No.76334229

So as a level 10 levistus tiefling fathomless warlock with feytouched and shadowtouched I would get 7 spells per long rest along with the two spells per short rest and fifteen additional warlock spells known.

Why was Tasha's such an awesome book?

>> No.76334233 [DELETED] 

>>76334077
>8 pages
Tf are you on about, character sheets are three pages tops, and none of them colored

>>76334092
But I'm not a good goyim, I don't use D&D beyond and only pirate book pdfs illegally. If WotC wants my money again, they better remove all that tumblr tranny shit from their books

>> No.76334242

>>76334208
Shadow Blade would work with Scribe's feature, though it would require getting a spell that deals Radiant damage of the same level

>> No.76334263

>>76334092
Reminder silver/gold dragons are basically Happy Merchants.
>Yes we are good it is illegal to say we are not of good alignment
>Shapeshifters
>control governments whenever they feel like it
>All the benefits of being a dragon, all the benefits of being a human, all the benefits of whatever the fuck they want to be
>Bow down to them in hopes they give you money and support
>Don't forget Tiamat!!! If you're against us you're with Tiamat!
>Have their own god to worship
>Fuck around like we wouldn't find out

>> No.76334287

>>76334229
>Tasha's
>an awesome book
Pick one and only one
And you cannot pick 'an awesome book' because they can't afford a writer to make an awesome book.

>> No.76334309

Why do you hate this book?

>> No.76334314

>>76334287
Why are you so mad, anon?

>> No.76334323

>>76334228
Do you say that because he posts thread early or because his affinity for muscular men?

>> No.76334326 [DELETED] 

>>76334309
You cannot blend lovecraftian horror with over-the-top cinematic fantasy action

>> No.76334327

>>76334242
Right! They do get Shadow Blade, shame I can't use it with int, but thats okay.

>> No.76334345

>>76334323
The answer is quite evident anon. If only you'd use your brain cells. Both Fred. The answer is both and that you're a fucking faggot Fred.

>> No.76334360

>>76334233
Man, I remember when this gem was released.
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/diversity-and-dnd

Had been ranting to my friends/players for years about how wokeness was going to ruin everything, and they just dismissed it as "you spend too much time on the fourchins"
Then that happened, and CoS is very dear to us as our first ever ran campaign which introduced us to D&D.
The bit about it in that post, with the addition of the "racial bonuses are problematic" bit made the realize I was exactly right.

We've agreed to vet anything else from WoTC that has anything related to the above before implementing it, because fuck them it's our world and our rules.

>> No.76334373

>Playing with a group
>DM insists only one player can be a caster for his setting, and only cleric or wizard
>Pick up a supportive wizard
>Last minute removes the restrictions and everyone changes to magic classes
>Encounters are an awful experience to balance, but the DM doesn't have the heart to kill anyone off
Are martials just that unfun for people?

>> No.76334391

How many daggers would you allow your rogue to carry around for throwing purposes?

>> No.76334392

>>76333964
Gronk no care about fancy clothes. Gronk have fur.

>> No.76334395

>>76334208
Literally just the light cantrip. Bonus points for >>76334242 and fire damage

>> No.76334396

>>76334360
>wokeness was going to ruin everything
It very clearly hasn't. I'm sorry that innocuous change scares you so much. You'll see in time that people's differences aren't the issue, but unrestrained corporate greed under the free market system.

>> No.76334401

>>76334373
More likely it was the "he told us no!"

>> No.76334408

>>76334391
Well, depends on how strong/big the rogue is, but I'd allow 10 per bandolier/tool belt.

>> No.76334410

>>76334327
You'll need decent Dex as a Wizard anyway. That said, the trickier part will be finding a Radiant spell that you can use to alter it. I don't think Wizards get anything prior to Sickening Radiance at 4th and Wall or Light at 5th that even mentions Radiant damage. That not only delays how soon you can do it, but also prevents you from using your lowest level slots to do so.

Of course, you could always ask your DM to just let you homebrew a Radiant version of Shadow Blade, since Radiant and Psychic are both fairly unresisted damage types anyway.

>> No.76334411

>>76334396
>Implying we actually live in a free market system
Ha

>> No.76334429

>>76334000
Well, first of all, he's not the type to show off. Second, he's kind of in hiding, so he couldn't go flaunting his nobility even if he wanted to.

>> No.76334444

>>76334360
All rules are just suggestions, and inherently evil races are a terribly lazy trope anyway.

>> No.76334485 [DELETED] 

>>76334360
God, the whole "how dare you imply that there's a difference between an orc and a halfling, racist!" thing makes me so fucking angry. I guess the good thing is that WotC can never truly control which rules we use and what sort of content we put into our home games.

>> No.76334506

I'm still angry at ToA for just existing in general.

>> No.76334508 [DELETED] 

>>76334506
Why, anon?

>> No.76334517

>>76334396
I'm not bothered by change, I'm bothered by the reasoning behind the change.
If you feel the need to change the roots of orcs because the original is """problematic""", you're the one with problems.
Not once did I see orcs and think "ah yes, niggers".
Or the need to change racial bonuses because that's somehow "elitism", and the alternative being completely bland, non-unique playable races.

But sure, keeping making assumptions that fit your narrative out of my post. I'm sure you're totally right.

>>76334485
Indeed. It's almost as if the resources are meant to be tips for ideas for the players to develop and not outright guides on how you should "view the world as we view it".
In my CoS the Vistani weren't some gipsy fucking stereotype, I made them interesting and integral to the story without the need of WoTC's moral compass to tell me how to run my game.

>> No.76334536

Teammates sold 1 lvl 2 spell slot and a couple of spells known permanently to a mysterious spirit just so they can learn the history of an area some items and an ancient language, and mysterious mystery... They are a cleric and an artificer, and the ghost said that not even a miracle could reverse this effect. Fuck, thats stupid.

>> No.76334545

>>76334517
There's other things that can make a race unique beyond ability bonuses. You could also always play the game however you wanted to play it, everything there is optional, this weird rebellion thing is just childishly bizarre. Wizards isn't at your table forcing you to play a certain way and they never have been.

>> No.76334546

I let the aasimar PC sacrifice her bond to her deva guide to resurrect an NPC she came to adore like a little brother. Should I offer a way to regain that bond later on, or would that belittle the sacrifice?

>> No.76334563

>>76334545
>There's other things that can make a race unique beyond ability bonuses.
Which is why when they added the new rules in Tasha's that made ability bonuses not matter, they also made sure to double-down on unique racial traits to really distinguish the races that way.

>> No.76334573

Shall we spitball some ideas?

So, noble background for an enchantment wizard. Neutral evil with controlling tendancies. Give me some flaws and personality traits for this ignoble ice queen.

>> No.76334576

>>76334508
Meatgrinder campaigns don't really have a place in the kind of game that D&D has become, where players are expected to get attached to their characters and their stories.

Hell they didn't have a place in the original D&D, Gygax made the first one because he was pissed off that his players were doing too well.

>> No.76334577

>>76334546
Could let her eventually get in contact again to have the Deva explain she doesn't need a guide any more. Maybe throw in a parting gift as a token of remembrance.

>> No.76334586

If you had a party of four of the same mono-classed characters with different subclasses, which class and subclasses would you choose?
Hard mode: Fun from levels 1 to 20

>> No.76334594

>>76334545
> Wizards isn't at your table forcing you to play a certain way and they never have been.
That's exactly the point I tried to make.
But the post about "diversity" makes it seem that's what they're gonna focus on instead of developing the existing system, or making it better. And attempt to tell their players what is right and what is wrong. Again take the CoS re-write for example.

Why focus on morally correct style of writing instead of making better systems of play?

>> No.76334598

>>76334563
WotC are lazy hacks who only take half steps in doing anything. Just homebrew racial shit like the rest of us do instead of being a whiny faggot.

>> No.76334600

Would a half-tabaxi be a catgirl?

>> No.76334619

>>76334586
>Lore bard
>Sword bard
>Valor bard
>Glamour bard
Simple as

>> No.76334626 [DELETED] 

>>76334545
>>76334545
>There's other things that can make a race unique beyond ability bonuses.
But ability bonuses still help to capture the feel of a certain race's biology and culture, and removing them encourages people to play a race for aesthetics only, and make characters with no interesting qualities except for their outside appearance.
>You could also always play the game however you wanted to play it, everything here is optional,
That's literally what he said in his post.
>Wizards isn't at your table forcing you to play a certain way and they never have been.
That's literally what he said in his post.

>> No.76334644

Tomb of Horrors is legitimately a terrible book, it's like LEGIT bad unironically.

>> No.76334654 [DELETED] 

>>76334576
Wasn't the first one made for a tournament?

>> No.76334655

>>76334323
Everyone knows Fred isn't into muscular men, he's into traps

>> No.76334665

What's the best level 3 one shot?

>> No.76334671 [DELETED] 

>>76334665
Death House

>> No.76334688

>>76334600
Here's your half tabaxi bro

>> No.76334690

>>76334594
>And attempt to tell their players what is right and what is wrong. Again take the CoS re-write for example.
They felt they misrepresented the Romani people so they're going to rewrite it. Literally how is that a problem?

>> No.76334698

>>76334665
I liked the SKT mini adventure

>> No.76334703

>>76334586
Cleric.
Pick any 4.

>> No.76334712

>>76334654
It was made because Gygax's players weren't being 'challenged' enough.

I can appreciate the game the man built but still acknowledge he was kind of a shit dm.

>> No.76334715

>>76334665
Might be a bit big for a one shot but Sunless Citadel is good

>> No.76334728

>>76334517
>Not once did I see orcs and think "ah yes, niggers".
>Or the need to change racial bonuses because that's somehow "elitism
That's the point. Institutionalized racism is insidious and affects how we view other people without realizing it. Calling different humanoid creatures "races" and giving them concrete racial bonuses amd penalties causes the player to practice that thought process, so when they here people talking about other racial stereotypes in the real world it sounds much more plausible when people claim that the majority of asians genetically have high intelligence and or physically weaker or that black people are genetically stronger but less intelligent.

It's a game of imagination, but the designers are holding themselves responsible for any real world issues that they might be reinforcing through their mechanics.

>> No.76334760

>>76334314
Shit book based off 'wokism' and power creep

>> No.76334767

Yes, one of the girls in my group is mega into fashion, dresses, etc, and she sends me pictures of really cool high fashion pics of crazy dresses, suits, etc, and that's what the nobles of the setting tend to wear. Different countries have different fashions etc too, usually based on climate and culture, but some of them have weird crazes that players have started, such as a bard bringing cowboy hats back into fashion.

>> No.76334785

>>76334728
>Institutionalized racism is insidious and affects how we view other people without realizing it.
This. Much like how playing Call of Duty will turn you into a school shooter, the existence of orcs will turn you into a klan member

>> No.76334801

>>76334760
>wokism
Just because you made a buzzword for "Cultural Sensitivity" doesn't invalidate its importance in tabletop culture and the larger culture as a whole.

>> No.76334814 [DELETED] 

>>76334728
Let's correct the record here: institutionalized racism is BASED and so it misogyny and homophobia.
Orcs ARE stand-ins for NIGGERS and the writers SHOULD be complimented for this brilliant social commentary.

>> No.76334832

>>76334801
There is no place for cultural sensitivity in tabletop. It's a fantasy world. Orcs and Drow are not "black people." It's not offensive to real people to say that Orcs are brutes fueled by rage in their blood, because Orcs are not real people. Moreover, there are no real people who share qualities similar to Orcs to argue that Orcs are some kind of parody or caricature of that real-world race.

>> No.76334846

>>76334728
>>76334728
Idiot. People are not equal, people will never be equal, this is a very low IQ take, and reality does not conform with your retarded worldview, and I feel for your players if your imaginary setting is full of retarded shit like this. If you even play ttrpgs at all.

>> No.76334855 [DELETED] 

>>76334728
Normal people can tell the difference between fiction and reality.

>> No.76334862

>>76334785
Nice strawman. No one is telling you how to play your game. If you and your group are interested in playing with inherently evil races and are able to separate the fiction from fact then you should do that. You also can't blame WotC for shifting their mechanics in the direction that a growing base of players are calling for. I don't imagine that I'm going to change any anon's mind about racial issues so I'll get off my soapbox, but just like you're free to claim that "Woke" culture is ruining the game I am free to claim that it isn't.

>> No.76334864

>>76334573
>Neutral evil
Ir's automatically shit.

>> No.76334878 [DELETED] 

>>76334832
This. You can't be racist toward a race that doesn't exist, and different ability scores for elephant people and goblins aren't gonna have an impact on your real life view of real life people.

>> No.76334885

>>76334410
Radiant Wizard Spells
>3rd Level: Spirit Shroud
>4th Level: Sickening Radiance
>5th Level: Dawn
>6th Level: Sunbeam
>7th Level: Crown of Stars
>8th Level: Sunburst

>> No.76334886

>>76334862
What strawman anon? I'm agreeing with you. Any sort of depiction of any sort of negative act or emotion in media will immediately poison the viewer's mind irreparably. How else would the human brain work?

>> No.76334904

>>76334864
Evil PCs are fine as long as they aren't cartoonishly evil; ie I steal from the party, I kill part members while they sleep, "You meet the noble and-..." 'I STAB THEM' etc

>> No.76334910

>>76334846
>People are not equal, people will never be equal
Burden of proof is on you. Are you saying that the races are inherently different? Is it naturally occurring genetics? Was it shaped by their history? You're saying some passionate things, but it's not clear what you're actually stating.

To stay on topic, which custom lineage is the most fun?

>> No.76334916 [DELETED] 

>>76334728
yeah, just like killing dire wolves in a fantasy game will make you want to randomly attack people's dogs in the street. How the fuck can you people be this retarded

>> No.76334920

>>76334862
The difference is that one point of view is based in reality and based in general (its not yours). We have to collectively agree what way we want to live, and actual people who actually interact with minorities know that you're talking complete nonsense.
We know the CR trannies are clamouring for this shit, but this happens to all companies who try to appease these loud minorities - they'll regret fucking off their core players in years to come. I've been playing 5e since the playtest, and I haven't paid WOTC for any of it, I refuse to until this shit stops.
Also stop bringing this bullshit to 4chan man, this is /tg/, go to /pol/ if you wanna soapbox.

>> No.76334929 [DELETED] 

>>76334814
BASED

>> No.76334930

>>76334910
>which custom lineage is the most fun?
Half tabaxi custom lineage!

>> No.76334940

>>76334910
Yes, to all, no two people are even slightly equal. People are uglier, fatter, stronger, faster, taller, shorter, etc, as a base minimum of physical variance. If we flatten the economic and social/cultural curve, people still aren't equal. It's impossible, an absolute pipe dream at best and a nightmare at worst, where people are dragged down to the average to keep us all equal.

People aren't equal, nor should they ever be. I don't know why we hold up equality as something to push for, equality is death.

>> No.76334959

>>76334910
>To stay on topic, which custom lineage is the most fun?
Making Humans with weird physical traits like cat ears is pretty much it. I wouldn't want to make anything that is more than that. This is literally just "My Human looks a little bit different from other humans".

>> No.76334966

>>76334000
My noble would only get out of his chariot as a last resort or to go bathe in peoples' water sources and made his retainers/the party fetch him everything.

>> No.76335006

>>76334760
That image is why I don't allow feats.

>> No.76335017

>>76334959
Except it's supposed to be literally anything. These are the stats you use to be a gemstone person, or a moth person, or a plant person. They're all the same: +2 to a score, a Feat, and probably Darkvision.

>> No.76335021

>>76334930
she looks familiar

>> No.76335024

>>76334920
>go to /pol/ if you wanna soapbox.

No thanks, this is related to tabetop games. There's a lot of hate in you. Do you think black people weren't culturally fucked over by centuries of slavery and the colonization of Africa? Are you familiar with the term "cultural trauma" or even "Cause and Effect"? To say that the races are different, but then to deny that they weren't socially influenced if not altogether socially created is being willfully ignorant of history and how bad things in the past affect things in the future.

Is Ice Maiden an enjoyable campaugn book?

>> No.76335025 [DELETED] 

We could remove all these fags and trannies from our hobby if /tg/ was willing to do regular, old-school-/b/-style raids on their breeding pits, such as tumblr or twitter.

>> No.76335043

>>76334940
Stereotyping based off race acceptable then?

Which wizard subclass is the least fun?

>> No.76335063

>>76335025
I've been posting on tg since 2010. This is the reason I still get on 4chan.

Did Tasha's fix the ranger?

>> No.76335065

>>76335024
Tell me about how wonderful africa was before colonisation, anon

>> No.76335066

>>76335043
> Least fun
Abjuration.

>> No.76335068

>>76335024
This seems like a weird way to say "you can't make generalizations based on race, but All Black People have shared cultural trauma that affects how they exist in the world." Like come on, you can't have it both ways like that.

I still don't see how that relates to Orcs, though.

>> No.76335075

>>76334930
What I like about custom lineage is that it really is close to perfect for half-humans. You get the human versatility represented by the extra feat, and the nonhuman biology represented by darkvision. Would like if they added more things to choose aside from a skill and darkvision, but as it stands it's quite elegant, if a bit bland.

>> No.76335080

>>76335065
>>76335068

>respoding to it.

>> No.76335086

>>76335063
more or less, yea. The class is a lot more fun to play

>> No.76335093

>>76335024
Ice Maiden is ok desu, i've never ran it but reading it? It seemed fun, especially the alter dungeons.
Also sub saharan africa is a disaster and would not have left the early bronze age if not for western intervention.Even with all our help, they're still retarded. So yes.

>>76335025
I wish brother

>>76335043
Absolutely, stereotyping is based in reality too.
I think evoker is actually the most boring wizard subclass, blasty isnt as good as tactical.

>> No.76335099

>>76335043
Probably Enchantment, a single target charm with a bunch of caveats is kinda crummy and Instinctive Charm is a lame defensive reaction too, at 10 it starts to pick up some but that's the Danger Zone (TM) for many a GM.

>> No.76335107

>>76335080
>respoding

>> No.76335117

>>76335099
Just abuse Geas. Make an army of faithful thralls and every encounter becomes cheddar.

>> No.76335146

>>76335017
Yeah, that's boring and I'd sooner reflavor something else rather than just play a reskinned human. If I want to play a Moth/Plant/Gemstone person I'd actively want some racial traits, not just +2 to a score, a feat, and maybe darkvision.

>> No.76335151

>>76335117
Yeah but you don't really need the subclass to do that, Split Enchantment at 10 is the only trait that will help you with that tactic, letting you hit two at once which is nice but I feel like there are better ways to go about it.

>> No.76335158

>>76335146
Yes, that is exactly why Custom Lineage is dogshit.

>> No.76335169

>>76335068
Well then I can go into more detail if you'd like. Racial differences are currently really. Beyond superficial aesthetics, black people in america are more likely to have health conditions, are more likely to be incarcerated, and are less likely to be educated. Some of these differences are because of echoes of slavery and segregation, some are due to how they are viewed culturally because of these differences caused by slavery or segregation or the echos of racist stereotypes in media, and not all affect every black person in America equally. Sometimes class plays a part in racial inequities and more often it's the other way around. Racial history in America and globally is complex and too long for 4chan posts. Look it up thoroughly if you actually want to disagree with it.

>>76335065
The richest man in history was African.

Do warlocks fall behind after 10th level?

>> No.76335170

Before convincing the rest of my group to change to another game, is it worth it to switch from player to DM? Had a bad experience when I tried a one-shot the first time, but monster options seem more interesting than player ones even if that means running the show.

>> No.76335171

>>76335080
>not fighting this retardation everywhere you find it
I bet you don't even play paladins

>> No.76335186

>>76335170
>is it worth it to switch from player to DM?
Honestly, beyond the perma-dm memes, always. Just be wary that whatever group you do this on will probably want to keep you there.

>> No.76335192

>>76335169
Mansa Musa made his fortune off slavery and gold mines, did not build anything or leave any legacy and is only remembered for throwing money away on a pilgrimage

>> No.76335216

>>76335170
As long as you can handle getting together all the resources, maps, statblocks, and more than a few alternate paths in mind when the players go off the rails, the actual DMing part isn't so bad, you are generally presenting a scenario and reacting accordingly.

>> No.76335217

>>76335170
Everyone should DM at some point, it's honestly not as hard as it seems and the players pretty much run the game until they bump into a problem and need to ask you. Get used to making rules calls on the fly, you'll be fine man.

>>76335169
Maybe we should stop kicking the political football around and return to 5e discussion, but as my closing point, I'd like to call you a total faggot and question your intelligence. Racism is based and high IQ, and it makes for a much more realistic and engaging setting.

>> No.76335252

>>76335158
The thing is, all they had to say was make a small mention in the whole "Customize Origin" section of Tasha's that said "You are a humanoid. You determine your appearance and whether you resemble any of your kin." so you can apply that to all races. You want a cute little mouse person? You can now reskin a halfling. Want something more specific? Homebrew it.
Custom Lineage didn't need to exist.

>> No.76335253

>>76334373
what does he consider "caster"? if he meant literally everyone has to play fighters and rogues then yes that's unbelievably fucking boring. if Paladins, Rangers, Artificers, Monks, and Warlocks don't count as casters since they don't have full spell progression then being upset you're limited to one cleric/wizard is a little much.

>> No.76335257

What is the appropriate response to a player character attempting suicide?

>> No.76335275

>>76335192
I'm in no way defending slavery, but historically slavery that predated the africa slave trade was far different and had more in common with indentured servitude. Also Mansa Musa built loads of shit, so that is just flat out wrong. He built centers of worships, universities, and was considered the main force that brought city structures to northern Africa

>> No.76335283

>>76335257
Ask them what kind of dramatic beat they are aiming for here - are they are rock bottom, and this is a chance for their friends to show them they have something to live for? Is this their darkest hour, when perhaps a powerful demon approaches to offer them a way out? Ask them what they wanna do with this, and play it out accordingly for maximum drama. Make it into an adventure, that's the answer to everything players do.

>> No.76335288

>>76335275
That would make a way doper not!Africa setting than just the "jungles and also egypt" tropes.

>> No.76335297

>>76335257
Check that everyone's cool with it because that can be some heavy shit, but if they are and the player just wants to make it a story point then I don't see a problem.

>> No.76335301

>>76335275
Can you quantify that? How many is a loads? How many of those left now?

>> No.76335310

>>76334586
Four barbarians and punch problem

>> No.76335312

I keep trying to case Conjure Animals by summoning 8 1/4 CR or lower animals, but my DM keeps making the animals summoned 0 CR because the rules say "or lower". I even tried casting 1 rating 2 beast and he gave me a 1/8 rating animal because "it says or lower".

>> No.76335333

>tasha's makes it so you can play the race you want to play without gimping your stats
>somehow people manage to complain about this.
I don't get it, more options is always good

>> No.76335339

>>76335297
btw im trans if that matters

>> No.76335354

>>76335283
>>76335297
Character has been captured and is a previous victim of heavy torture, so it's basically a fear response.

I hadn't considered a dark deal, that's actually a really great workaround.

Its perfectly reasonable for this pc to try to take their life in this situation, but I like the idea of a demon coming in and fucking up some evildoers under contract.

>> No.76335358

>>76335333
I'm surprised people even waited for tasha's to fix this, don't most other DM's allow a little bit of come and go with racial stuff? I don't even enforce the class skills, you get 2-4 from your class and 2 from your background, pick whichever ones you want. Why limit choice for such basic stuff?

>> No.76335374

>>76335257
If it's some edgy shit or done for melodrama tell them to fuck off, if it's a natural conclusion of their character then let them have it. the muh honoraburu samurai killing himself so he can be with his family and lord after vanquishing the BBEG is fine and maybe even expected, same if there's someone playing an old dying character and this was supposed to be their "one last job"

is there a narrative reason behind why they're killing themselves NOW as opposed to after the campaign? D&D has other planes and concrete afterlives, killing yourself to avoid asmodeus stealing your soul and dragging you to hell for a million years of anal rape is a perfectly logical choice to make as an informed decision

>> No.76335377

Piggybacking off how cool the Scribe + Shadow Blade combo is, Battlesmith could make Int attacks with it, and also gives you Heavy Armor so you need less Str/ Dex and can have more Con instead.

I'd also personally grab Dragon's Breath, Protection from Energy etc. at all times as a scribe, because being able to manifest a fire sword this fight and a lightning sword the next seems dope. Blade cantrips obviously, and your Defender can really help your survival too, as well as Enhanced Defense infusion.

It's far from optimal of course, but it's definitely something I'd want to play. 2 extra levels if you wanna go all-in with Extra Attack, otherwise you get more spells.

>> No.76335381

>>76335333
>he's so entitled that he thinks the lack of a free bonus is a gimp

>> No.76335398

>>76335253
Caster being bard, druid, cleric, wizard, sorcerer, and warlock. Any of classes whose concept is based solely on magic usage.
That leaves anything else with only half casting, like paladins, or subclass casting, like trickster rogue.
My complaint wasn't that we were limited to one caster, but that no one wants to take up a martial class and it becomes a balancing nightmare.

>> No.76335403

>>76335333
Try overcoming the autistic need to start with perfect stats. 14 is perfectly functional for anything other than a Monk, and Monks suck even with two 16s.

>> No.76335408

>>76335377
>Blade cantrips obviously
How do we tell him...

>> No.76335423

>>76334576
The module even suggests having a naked clone come running to the party should a member ever die. The whole point is to see what your players will die to.

>> No.76335438

>>76335408
Wait what happened to boomer blade and world of warcraft blade?

>> No.76335443

I thought stats rolling was supposed to be balanced?

>> No.76335459

>>76335438
Component has a cost now, so you can't use it with a Shadow Blade.

>> No.76335464

>>76335438
The blade cantrips have a cost requirement now for the item, Shadow Blade doesn't have a cost, so you can't use it with these spells anymore.

>> No.76335466

>>76335438
Tasha changed the components to a weapon worth sp, so technically you can't use edge blade with the cantrips anymore.
Any decent DM would allow it, though.

>> No.76335468

>>76335443
it is

>> No.76335476

As a caster warlock is it bad if I don't get to +5 CHA until level 12? I've been taking +1 CHA feats at 4th and 8th level, but I want to make sure that missing that extra point isn't going to totally bone me in the later levels.

>> No.76335477

>>76335443
I'm sorry that you had to learn it this way, but you're mentally deficient.

>> No.76335495

>>76334644
>wrong entrance
dead
>wrong path to correct entrance
dead
>check out that weird thing
dead
>later on,
>don't check out that weird thing
dead

It's a huge fuck you to anyone whos not the DM

>> No.76335497

>>76335476
totally bone is a big word, but depending on Feats it very could've been a poor decision
If you, say, DarkSight with EA, that's a better Feat than a +2 CHA.

>> No.76335504

>>76335312
Just quit the game it's not worth playing your DM sucks

>> No.76335506

>>76335476
I mean it won't totally fuck you but you will be 1 lower on all attack and damage rolls and lower on every spell save DC until you max it

>> No.76335525

>>76334801
I am black and offended because they felt the need to change orcs.

>> No.76335534

>>76335497
The feats are Feytouched and Shadowtouched, so I'm getting a lot of bang for my buck, but most of my spells are attack or save roll focused.

>> No.76335544

>players complete 80% of a mystery quest
>figure everything out, find out the big cheese, who they know is a pretty powerful character, is stationed in the basement of a tower they've been working through
>clear almost all of it out
>get to the final stairs that lead to him
>decide they're too weak and head back to town to long rest, deciding he'll stay put and they'll deal with him tomorrow
>mfw there's no way he doesn't just book it now that his hideout has been trashed, his minions slain, and views the party as a formidable force
They seem convinced they're going to come back and he's still going to be there when he comes back, and I can't find a single reason to keep him there. It's super anticlimactic to come back to the very end of the quest and I simply say there's evidence that he took everything he had stashed and left in the several hours they were gone, but what villain is stupid enough to stay there in that spot? Or even leave meaningful traces of his exodus with that much time to leave?

>> No.76335560

>>76335476
The game is balanced around starting with a 16 in your main stat and increasing it at 4th and 8th level without feats being accounted for, so depending on the feats you're getting it could be a great choice or a bad one.

>> No.76335564

>>76335339
We're half way there! Woah!
Livin' on a prayer!

>> No.76335566

>>76335544
Maybe he left in a hurry upon realizing people knew where he was and left one trace for the party to follow.

>> No.76335578

>>76335534
You'll probably be fine. The extra spells per day should be enough to offset the slight delay in your casting stat. If you start with a 17 in Cha you won't even be that far behind.

>> No.76335603

DM: You are ambushed and surrounded by a TROLL!!!

>> No.76335614

>>76335603
how can one troll surround something

>> No.76335617

>>76335377
I'd try and go the elemental mage route as well as I can. Scribe Wizard makes a good generalist. Its not Lore Wizard levels of generalist power but its the closest we got.

>> No.76335642

>>76335021
Fire Emblem 9 & 10

>> No.76335653

>>76335006
Those poor martials

>> No.76335654

>>76335617
Exactly. The flavor is endless with it. I'm fine with it not being LM tier broken, I don't care about being the strongest guy on the team, I just blast shit with elemental magic. It's also just a good subclass for anyone who wants to specialize in a damage type that has otherwise mediocre spells like Cold, without needing to ask your DM if you can have Iceball.

>> No.76335659

>>76335564
wym by this my nigga?

>> No.76335666

>>76335544
Actions have consequences, anon, or your world is meaningless.
I say remove loot based on how quickly he fled.
>almost everything is still there.
>he ran as soon as the party left
He's much further away and has had time to begin rebuilding strength
>things obviously missing
>he took an hour or so to pack once he was sure the party wasn't around
He's much closer and may have not made contact with his network yet
>he took every second to clean the place out
>nothing of value is left and all useful information is either with him or destroyed
He could still be close by! Quick, Ranger, track the villain and you could catch up to him.
Your party does have a ranger of course.
ALTERNATIVELY
>evil guy stay put
>he called for reinforcements
More enemies who are smarter and maybe stronger guard the boss. Also, now he's preparing something much worse in case the party reaches him again.

>> No.76335668

>>76335377
I'm really digging the prospect of the combo. 3 levels in Wizard is enough to snag the Scribe feature, Shadow Blade, and Dragon's Breath for a variety of damage types to switch to, along with being able to pick up a decent selection of cantrips and 1st level staples.

Multiclassing it with Artificer, Eldritch Knight, or even Arcane Trickster seems like it could be an extremely fun combo and really let you play around with a very Gish-style spell, since you can pretty easily conjure up a sword of various elements on the fly. And of course, you can always have a standard weapon with the Blade cantrips to fall back on.

>> No.76335685

>>76335659
He means the tranny is dangerously close to %40

>> No.76335692

>>76335666
Based Satan. I agree with the alternative - he can easily refill the entire dungeon and then some, and when he's alerted they're there prepare a Fireball the moment they step out that door.

>> No.76335699

>>76335666
This
My players once did something similar, and the only plausible outcome is for the world/creatures to adapt to their actions.

>> No.76335704

>>76335544
There could be a reason he's unwilling to leave, like a source of power or some tools that he can't move. Or maybe he's been tinkering/casting/whatever for some time, and now has upgrades that's he's confident will help keep him alive. Or the next day he restores the tower and there's new tougher enemies.

>> No.76335705

>>76335464
>Range: Self
That breaks its interaction with Warcaster, right?
Well, fuck Clerics "melee clerics" I guess.

>> No.76335710

>>76335544
Have him assume that the party was simply taking a short rest or otherwise just casting a few healing spells, and thus he bailed in a matter of minutes, rather than spending hours being meticulous about it. After all, would you stick around to check?

>> No.76335723

>>76335692
How evil is your guy? Maybe he's in the process of selling the corpses of his previous employees to a necromancer.
Now the party has to fight through everyone new and the reanimated corpses of the ones they killed before.

>> No.76335735

>>76335654
You absolutely would need to get a ton of money for scrolls and borrowing other wizard's spell books. But yeah its great for just being an elementalist.
>Personalized Spell Scorching Ray into blasts of energy. Change the damage type and now you've got elemental bursts.

>> No.76335740 [DELETED] 

>>76335685
The 40% who just stay as attractive, fuckable femboys until they age into twunkdom, or the 40% who commit sudoku?

>> No.76335746

>>76335705
No, it still works with Warcaster. It just doesn't work with Booming Blade/GFB, Spell Sniper, Twinned Spell, Shadow Blade, and Distant Spell.

>> No.76335753

How would /5eg/ stat a skinwalker?

>> No.76335815

>>76335746
Hmmm, you still "cast the spell at the creature", as per warcaster wording, even if the spells range is self, is that the logic behind it?
Is that an official reading?
Thank you for the answer by the way.

>> No.76335868

>>76335735
Yeah, you'd be down pretty much 25% of your spells to grab a spell just for its Scribe purposes, one every two levels, but if your DM is willing to work with you on finding at least some spells/ selling some scrolls and you're cool with not having literally all of the "Wizard Classics", I think it's fine. It's hard to fuck up a Wizard to begin with, and at least you don't need downtime to grab said spells.

>> No.76335870

>>76335753
For a character or as an encounter?

>> No.76335923

>>76335642
oh yea, with ike

>> No.76335924

>>76335815
>https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/1326598236937674752

>> No.76335948

>>76335868
>Wizard Classics
You can still get all the wizard classics. I like that you don't have to prepare the spell to change the damage of others. You just have to put it in your spellbook. So after you get say Spirit Shroud in your spellbook, any wizard spell you cast at 3rd level can automatically be changed to radiant. Its going to take more money and hunting but its worth it imo.

>> No.76335975

>>76335924
Oh, dope, GFB works too.
Thanks anon!

>> No.76335987

>>76335975
No problem!

>> No.76336015

>>76335975
Yeah, ironically all the gishfag were concerned about War Caster+BB no working anymore, but now both BB and GFB work with it unlike before thanks to the changes in the GFB text.

>> No.76336025

>>76333964
Devotion Paladin is extremely flamboyant and show-offish, with "magnificent" armor topped with a tabard that bears his holy symbol
Conquest Paladin has Admantium Plate with platinum sigils and trim engraved on it as the least expensive thing he wears
Ancients Paladin quite literally just looks like a farm boy in a thick t-shirt, some peasant pants and boots/gloves, and is wearing a +1 Mithril Breastplate under his clothing that he received which carries Ubtao's blessing
Chainlock couldn't care less about fashion and just wears stock armor with a set of robes to disguise themselves as a member of a church

Every other character I have isn't worth mentioning in terms of fashion.

>> No.76336043

>>76335312
That's meant to be an option, not an excuse to gimp your character. I'd have a talk with your DM about this- it sounds like he's really salty about summoning spells.

>> No.76336079

>>76336015
I was mostly annoyed about it not working with twinned metamagic and my whip build.

>> No.76336083

>>76335870
Encounter

>> No.76336091

>>76335740
the former don't exist, so the latter

>> No.76336104

>>76336091
Based

>> No.76336120

Telepathic or Telekenetic for a 12th level non-GOOwarlock?

>> No.76336123

>>76335312
Your DM is being pointlessly antagonistic, and he probably knows it and should stop being passive agressive and talk to you about it, but have you broken several encounters up to this point with the spell? Summoning 8 wolves breaks most combats in half at that level by the action economy alone.
It's like Animate Objects - sure, you can make a bunch of tiny ones as a wizard the second you get it, but you're probably going to piss of the table by both taking a billion years to play out your turn and by massively skewing the power levels between characters with an obviously overtuned spell.

>> No.76336130

>summon fiend
>pixie familiar
What else do I need to play Santa?

>> No.76336131

>>76336079
>sorcadin and whip memebuild don't work like before
And nothing of value was lost

>> No.76336141

>>76336120
Telepathic. More fun to use and you probably have enough bonus actions already

>> No.76336158

>>76336131
Fuck you memebuilds are food for the soul

>> No.76336163

>>76336091
> the former don't exist
My boyfriend says hello.

>> No.76336166

>>76336025
>+1 Mithril Breastplate
anon, i...

>> No.76336177

>>76336120
Telepathic feels redundant with a tome or chain pact, so I would say Telekinetic.

>> No.76336179

What pointbuy do you use? 27 points capped at 15 seems quite low

>> No.76336188

>>76335692
Our first campaign, we entered a swamp castle relatively unhindered the first time. Our second attempt, we went back through the same entrance and nearly got trounced, as they had put up traps and a considerable force to block our way. We retreated rather than force our way further and snuck in up a tower by the back wall instead. Made for a great scenario.

>> No.76336200

>>76336179
Standard array.

>> No.76336202

>>76336179
>points capped at 15 seems quite low
Why?

>> No.76336205

>>76336163
>why don't i see my boyfriend when i take my pills

>> No.76336206

>>76336177
How so?

>> No.76336215

>character starts trying to negotiate with enemies who are openly attacking us
Fuck off with this shit. Put down your sword all you like but if a bandit wants to jump me for refusing to pay a toll I'm smiting his ass. To hell if he has a family he's trying to feed.

>> No.76336217

>>76336179
that lets you hit two +3s with racial, it's not low

>> No.76336222

>>76336158
Memebuilds are fun because you have to work around how the game is supposed to work to make them function, with all the new stuff there will be some new idiotic thing to create.

>> No.76336224

>>76336179
27 points, 16 for the cost of 11 points, under 8 for 1 point each, usually minimum 6

>> No.76336229

>>76336179
>pointbuy
>not rolling
NGMI

>> No.76336242

>>76336222
Yeah for example sling Crusher builds.

>> No.76336245

>>76336215
Here is an example of RP leaving the characters and bothering the players

Talk with the dude, also why does this even bother you?

>> No.76336256

>>76336166
Now, normally you'd have a point because he's an AL character, but the breastplate in question is from an event that will never be run again and the item (along with a few other problematic pieces of equipment from that Open) were specifically permitted as exceptions to the AL's new rules in exchange for them becoming untradeable.

It's pretty fucking dope.

>> No.76336266

>>76336242
GWMSSTB longbow attacks

>> No.76336271

>>76336215
>get hired to stop thieves from robbing a museum
>thieves obviously break in
>say they don't want to fight us, just take stuff we were hired not to let them take
>one of the players refuses to fight them because 'objects aren't worth killing someone over'
Then why did you accept the damn job

>> No.76336282

>>76336206
With tome you can get Message as a cantrip and Rary's Telepathic Bond as a ritual, also with the new invocation you can spam Sending to specific individuals.
With chain you get a telepathic helper, with limitless range telepathy(as long as you're in the same plane).
All of those options are way cooler than the Telepathic feat, and if you're down on invocations you can buy one with Eldritch Adept.

>> No.76336289

>>76336266
Explain how that works, please?

>> No.76336291

>>76336205
Kek. He's nice, though. Plays 5e with us. Pretty sure he lurks these threads when i'm not around. Though he insists on never multiclassing and berates me for my lorebard/tomelock - despite being a divine soul sorc.

>> No.76336296

>>76336271
nonlethal damage exists and whether a player realizes this or not shows they read the book

>> No.76336309

>>76336271
This shit pisses me off to no end dude. I once played with an Eladrin Druid who was a hippy that hated violence. Playing with passive characters is the worst

>> No.76336323

>>76336271
Killing is different from stopping. You don't have to kill someone to stop them from stealing something. Beat the shit out of them or convince them to stop, then throw their ass in prison.

>> No.76336325

>>76336309
> Eladrin druid
It's just a phase. Next millenia, he'll probably be a blood hungry murderhobo.

>> No.76336329

>quickened spell now allows you ignore the restriction on casting leveled spells
did I just fix sorcerer?

>> No.76336334

>>76336329
Nah, they still have a boring spell list.

>> No.76336343

>>76336296
>>76336323
nonlethal damage isn't always an option, it's a melee specific thing and if you're a bunch of casters and archers and your opponents are trying to murder you, you're not obligated to go out of your way to keep them alive at your own expense
sure not everyone has to die, and we ended up leaving as many alive as possible, but i'm not going to go out of my way keep a bandit alive that's trying to stab a shiv in me and wear my guts for garters

>> No.76336345

Rolled 12, 10, 5, 6, 10, 4 = 47 (6d20)

>>76333964
My Half-Orc Bard is as fashionable as can be.

>> No.76336355

>>76336329
now expand their spell list and move their level 20 feature to level 4 and give them a new level 20 feature
then they'll be fixed

>> No.76336362

>>76336329
Make it a class feature and not meta magic and yes

>> No.76336374

>>76336343
Some deaths are unavoidable that's true, but if you actively want to perform a non-leathal option and take that route that exists. Its nothing to get mad over.

>> No.76336376

>>76336215
I do this when we're the ones being the bad guys. Being a gentleman highwayman asking people to drop their weapons in order to remain unharmed is a lot easier on the conscience than just butchering them, and it also removes combatants from the fight if you succeed so you're still helping the party.

>> No.76336392

>>76336345
Living delusions of grandeur, I see.

>> No.76336402

>>76336329
I think Origin Spells is good enough. The new subclasses gave the Sorcerer a really neat option in getting bonus spells that can be changed. That's unique and leads to a more fun time for the Sorcerer.

>> No.76336410

Why do wizards, a class that study magic and warlocks, a class that get their powers from pacts get the ability to gain innate spellcasting
but a sorcerer which is canonically an entirely magical being born of the weave itself does not?

>> No.76336418

>>76336374
>nothing to get mad over
It is when the people you've partied with to do a specific job refuse to do that job because someone might die as a result, potentially leading to your own death instead.
I don't care if someone wants to perform nonlethal attacks, that's fine and dandy as long as the job we're hired to do gets done. It's when they refuse to fight at all, putting everyone else that relied on them to help do what they were hired to do in a precarious position that anger is justified

>> No.76336424

>>76336355
>their level 20 feature to level 4
This breaks a few subclasses but would be fine for shadow draconic and maybe storm

>> No.76336426

>>76336402
the origin spells don't solve the biggest problem the sorcerer has, they suck. They are outclassed by every other spellcaster in both social situations and combat. It's not enough.

>> No.76336432

>>76336424
gaining 4 (four) SP on short rests wouldn't break anything

>> No.76336458

>>76336410
Because fuck you that's why
t. Wizard of the Coast

>> No.76336461

>>76336355
Sorcerer's at level 18-20 should be able to turn their sorcery points into 9th level slots

>> No.76336468

>>76336222
Monks can make an improvised weapon their dedicated weapon. Alas you can't do it for improvised weapons in general and you can't make it your kensei weapon, but still you can pick up a random object and say "This is a highly lethal weapon that I am trained in the use of, on par with a an actual word"

>> No.76336470

>>76336410
because uh....uhhhh....... SHUT THE FUCK UP STOP ASKING QUESTIONS JUST PLAY THE FUCKING WIZARD
WIZARD IS THE GOOD CLASS YOU'LL GET NOTHING AND LIKE IT

>> No.76336471

>>76336426
I think that depends on the spell options and did you forget that Sorcerer got Magical Guidance? In the case of something like the Aberrant Mind this is the only class I know of that can cast and Twin Suggestion using only Sorcery points and it be completely undetectable.

>> No.76336472

Man I can't wait to play my punching bladesinger and go full super saiyan

>> No.76336473

>>76336432
Your point?

>> No.76336475

>>76336432
moving the 20 feature to 4 would allow Sorcerers to actually live up to the "font of magic" class aesthetic. a wizard needs to sit and study for extended periods of time to get their spells back, while once the sorcerer is squeezed dry they just need to rest a little bit and they've got more magic juice to continue adventuring.

warlocks already get their slots back with every single rest while not even needing them to do damage so I don't think it would break sorcerers desu

>> No.76336485

>>76336131
The memebuild was fun, and the twinned nerf hurts my pure melee sorc build even more.
If anything I'd argue that with this change nothing of value was gained, we only lost interesting builds. As for the whip memebuild, it could also be done with a glaive and PAM as early as level 6 on an EK, and were all perfectly viable builds.

>> No.76336490

>>76336475
>while not even needing them to do damage
true but they do need them for fun
you can only cast eldritch blast so many times

>> No.76336503

>>76336472
Enjoy getting bellypunched into unconsciousness like an anime elf, anon.

>> No.76336506

>>76336471
>twin suggestion
do retarded people on this board even play the game? suggestion is the worst spell in the game, imagine wasting your limited resources to cast a worse version of a persuasion check

>> No.76336514

>>76336410
Innate spellcasting? What do you mean by that?

>> No.76336519

>>76336475
yes but then sorcerer would actually be fun and be a viable alternative to wizards and that's simply not allowed

>> No.76336523

Why do Tomelocks and Chainlocks get completely unique abilities and invocations but almost everything bladelocks get, including the pact itself, is playing copycat and catch up to martials?

>> No.76336525

>>76336514
At will, buddy

>> No.76336527

>>76336490
oh I completely agree that being a blastbot isn't fun, but thankfully Warlocks get a bunch of other stuff to do thanks to their pact abilities and spells. they're probably the favorite class in 5th edition for that reason, especially chainlocks with investment of the chain master

>> No.76336532

>>76336506

>> No.76336538

>>76336485
Honestly I have a profound hatred for the two blade cantrips, they're just antithetical to the design of everything else in the game. The change to Bladesinger's Extra Attack makes them even more idiotic and out of place.

>> No.76336545

>>76336329
What >>76336362 said, quickened spell is already good and doesn't need to be even more crucial to take.

>> No.76336546

>>76336506
> worse
I have suggested that people just hand over their prized possessions for no potential gain and asked them to forget the encounter after I left. Literally free shit. Try charisma-shilling your way into the queen's bedroom without magic; I guarantee it's going to be that much harder. A bad workman blames his tools.

>> No.76336553

>>76336523
Because bladelocks are wannabe martials who need that help for melee shenanigans.

>> No.76336554

>>76336461
>not casting twin wish
NGMI

>> No.76336559

>>76336523
Because Martials don't get complete unique abilities either, whereas Warlocks already have spells to differentiate themselves. If you want to do consistent, resource-cost-less damage on par with a martial, the opportunity cost can't be light on a spellcaster.

>> No.76336562

>>76336506
Persuasion is limited by if the creature would want to do it, Suggestion they will do it if it is within their power to. You cannot persuade a King to give you money for free, you can cast Suggestion and make them do it for free.
And I do play the game, I have seen the parties Wizard get us out of a few bad spots with Suggestion and even ended a few encounters with it by having foes leave the battle. The fact that there is a Sorcerer that can do it without a single spell slot cost multiple times a day and have more spells prepared than the wizard is very good!

>> No.76336568

>>76336289
>Before you make an attack with a ranged weapon that you are proficient with, you can choose to take a -5 penalty to the attack roll. If that attack hits, you add +10 to the attack's damage.
like a longbow
>Before you make a melee attack with a heavy weapon that you are proficient with, you can choose to take a -5 penalty to the attack roll. If the attack hits, you add +10 to the attackā€™s damage.
a longbow is heavy
>You are proficient with improvised weapons.
unga bunga stick

>> No.76336571

>>76336503
Nah, my DM is a pushover so I'll be fine

>> No.76336573

>>76336490
Warlock spell slots are for outside of combat, desu

>> No.76336578

>>76336562
you play with bad dms

>> No.76336584

>>76336525
...You mean spell mastery, a feature people get at the end of the game (Later than even Wish), and a few invocations to spam low level spells like jump and detect magic?
This doesn't sound like a real problem..

>> No.76336586

>>76336553
I don't mind being a martial wannabe but I'm a wannabe martial that lacks uniqueness, the main benefit is I can spend an action to summon my weapon and it can be any one I want, but that's super situational, especially if you're not Hexblade.

>> No.76336591

>You can use this weapon as a spellcasting focus and as the somatic component for spells you cast.

>> No.76336593

>>76336559
>If you want to do consistent, resource-cost-less damage on par with a martial, the opportunity cost can't be light on a spellcaster.
Yes, I'm glad that Warlock can't get an attack that scales faster than the Fighter's with a very low opportunity cost.
Retard

>> No.76336603

>>76336568
It loses all its properties when used as an improvised weapon

>> No.76336619

>>76336593
Then don't take improved pact weapon and grab a cool invocation instead. Instead of being ahead of the fighter at level 5, you can be slightly behind and do the cool unique things you wanted to.

>> No.76336620

>>76336559
>If you want to do consistent, resource-cost-less damage on par with a martial, the opportunity cost can't be light on a spellcaster.
Uhh... Anon... You realise we're talking about warlocks right?

>> No.76336624

>>76336586
there's no reason to ever go bladelock if you're not a hexblade, but if you are there are some pretty good benefits. adding your CHA twice to damage on two attacks is a giant power spike at level 12 when you get Lifedrinker and combined with hexblade's curse and maddening hex means even with absolutely terrible RNG you will output very consistent damage every round

>> No.76336635

>>76336578
Says here, in me book o' grudges - ye be a faggot!

>> No.76336660

>>76336624
>level 12
Waiting until level 12 to do something cool? What do I look like, pact of the Talisman?

>> No.76336671

>>76336620
Yeah, and weaponlocks do more damage than EBlocks at the cost of a few invocations (and they don't need Agonizing blast so yeah). That's a fair trade, if damage is what you want.

>> No.76336681

>>76336584
It thematically doesn't make sense, sorcerer's are born of magic and should get some form of at will casting
Also at will mage armor is op

>> No.76336705

>>76336660
>>pact of the talisman
what the FUCK were they THINKING?
if you want to do cool shit starting at level 3 the obvious choice is Chainlock. every round you use a bonus action from your pixie to shoot something and make them roll against your spell save DC or be poisoned, and if they fail the roll badly enough they fall unconscious.

>> No.76336707

>>76336603
point me to the part of the book where it says that

>> No.76336730

>>76336671
>Yeah, and weaponlocks do more damage than EBlocks
Barely so.

>> No.76336732

>>76336660
You do cool shit from level 1 onward on the Hexblade. At level 5 you have extra attack, more to hit than the fighter, two 3rd level slots and if you want even devil sight for free advantage and defenses if you use all your invocations to style on the fighter.
They'll eventually get more than you, but you have high level spells that recover on a short rest, and matching a Fighter's damage on a spellcaster is already amazing. You still have more utility than you give them credit for- at level 5 already you have 6 known spells but only 2 slots; this means you have space to prepare situational spells that other casters wouldn't because you can cover what you'd do normally with those 2 slots every day easily with a few selections. And you keep getting more and more known spells.

>> No.76336764

>>76336591
Honestly, a sorcerer bloodline based on your ancestors being elven archers that mixes metamagicked spells with arrows sounds cool. I'm saying this as a guy that hates dex on principle.

>> No.76336773

>>76336471
>>76336426
Cantrip: Mind Sliver
1st Level: Hex, Hideous Laughter, Sleep, Dissonant Whispers
2nd Level: Hold Person, Suggestion, Calm Emotions, Detect Thoughts
3rd Level: Enemies Abound, Tongues, hunger of Hadar, Sending
4th Level: Charm Monster, Confusion, Dominate Beast, Evard's Black Tentacles, Summon Aberration
5th Level: Dominate Person, Hold Monster, Modify Memory, Synaptic Static, Telepathic Bond, Telekinesis

I have to stress: You get two of these from each level for free and can cast them using your Sorcery Points and they can't be detected. You can paralyze someone without anyone knowing who did it meaning no one knows who to attack or counterspell or dispel magic on. You can dominate person someone the same way. You can blow up people with Synaptic Static. You can read minds with detect thoughts... the list goes on.
This imo is perfect for how to buff up or help the other Sorcerer subclasses. Options.

>> No.76336795

>>76336591
based, this is what reflavoring should look like.

>> No.76336818

>>76336671
A non Hexblade Bladelock has to pay hefty taxes and more than 1 invocation to even catch up to an EB blastlock. The trade isn't really fair for them at all

>> No.76336819

>>76336471
does Tasha fuck aberrations?
she sounds like she got on that cthulhu dick.

>> No.76336827

>>76336681
>Also at will mage armor is op
Eh, Dragon sorcs have it from level 1 without even needing to cast it. Unless you mean for the exploit where people spam it on Abjuration wizards, because I agree that that's stupid.
Personally I always felt that sorcerers should get free upcasting for their lower level blasts, up to three levels at higher levels.

>>76336730
Please look into using feats to boost your combat capabilities. Sharpshooter and GWM work incredibly well with devil's sight, as do PAM and CBE. Your damage doesn't barely go up, it matches fighters, the weapon class that doesn't get to do cool spells.
Now if you think EBspam is enough, just do that. Weaponlocks can't be just better in every way than martial classes just because you feel like your damage isn't spiking hard enough.

>> No.76336835

>>76336818
Bladeblades need all the same invocations as other bladelocks. Hexblade with EB is still more optimal than stabbing.

>> No.76336841

>>76336764
I've been a fan of the whole "Ancestral Weapon" thing. A bloodline of Sorcerer's who get a weapon from their lineage that unlocks their powers or maybe when they unlock their powers they pull a weapon from themselves. Pull a sword from a stone get magic powers... A martial sorcerer bloodline has so many cool thematic options.

>> No.76336843

>>76336819
Nah, she has Graz'zt. If she ever want sum fuk, she can just let him out of her chastity gear for a bit.

>> No.76336850

>>76336818
If he dedicates feats and invocations to doing martial damage, I guarantee he will surpass EB blastlocks. Although a non-Hexblade doing it will suffer somewhat, because WotC are cucks that didn't give bladelocks proficiency in medium armor and shields.

>> No.76336864

>>76336732
>Hexblade
That's my major issue. The pact was pretty ass pre Hexblade, it shouldn't need a specific patron to work properly.

You also don't get a whole lot of spells known as a warlock. Not an awful amount, but considering you don't prepare spells I wouldn't be too keen on making my warlock spells situational. Wizards, Clerics and Druids are better fit for taking situational spells

>> No.76336867

>>76336835
Disagree, elrditch smite deals a fuckton more damage than an EB turret.

>> No.76336868

Are there any races, spells, classes, feats, or subclasses that are banned at your table?

>> No.76336872

>>76336795
That's not really reflavoring when you have actual mechanics backing it up. Still Weapon's as foci is always cool.

>> No.76336875

Jeremy Crawford sat on a bench in Kerry Park. He held a deluxe sugar cone topped with not one, but two, scoops of double fudge ice cream. As he went in for a lick, a droplet brimmed over the top and began to run down the cone. Jeremy, always observing, cocked his head sideways. The droplet continued to run.

Wizzy, smiling and dumb, sat next to him. He was busy stamping his feet up and down on the sidewalk. With great, loud emphasis, Wizzy was counting his spell slots for everyone in the park.

"One!"

"And one!"

"And two!"

A fast-walking reporterwoman approached them and, with no forewarning, thrust her microphone into Jeremy's face.

"Jeremy! Jeremy! The people want to know!"

Jeremy glared upwards from his ice cream, displeased.

"Jeremy, please, we are owed an explanation!"

Jeremy rolled his eyes and motioned for her to continue.

She leaned in closer and tapped her earpiece. "Why does wizard have the widest variety of spells while also having the strongest combat options and class features?"

Jeremy, as if remembering a dirty joke, sneered at her. Wizzy, who was only somewhat capable of following the conversation, began screeching. He pretended to cast magic missile in the air wildly, as if fighting an invisible foe.

"We prioritize fun and exciting gameplay at Wizards of the Coast" Jeremy said.

Then, he spat at her.

"Yes, yes, I'm sure you do, but surely you were aware of the massive and frankly-unnecessary bladesinger changes planned for the upcoming book? With so many tools available to wizard and only wizard, doesn't it all seem a little ridiculous ?"

Jeremy breathed deeply, as if preparing himself. An ooze of double fudge ice cream ran over his white-knuckled grip.

"At Wizards, we always look out for the best interests of our paying customers."

>> No.76336888

>>76336875
Tenacious and implacable, the woman leaned in still closer. "Yes, of course, but doesn't this just push even more people into playing wizard-- a color that, as you know, already dominates all gameplay situations both in and out of combat? Some people Jeremy..." she looked at him with a tinge of pity. As if about to confide a secret, she placed a hand on his shoulder. "Some people... want to play a different class."

The ice creamed cone exploded under the tremendous pressure of Jeremy's grip. He jumped up, crystalline and sugary debris everywhere. Wizzy began to cry.

"WHY DOES EVERYONE WANT TO PLAY A DIFFERENT CLASS? JUST PLAY WIZARD! WIZARD IS THE GOOD CLASS!! JESUS, I'M SO SICK OF "OOOOO JEREMY, PLEASE, I LIKE SORCERER, I WANT TO PLAY SORCERER! MY TERMINALLY-ILL MOTHER WANTS TO TWIN CAST FIREBALL!" KILL YOURSELF! YOU'LL GET NOTHING AND YOU'LL FUCKING LIKE IT! I AM THE MASTER, I AM THE CONTROLLER, AND YOU BETTER PLAY WIZARD OR SO HELP ME I WILL--"

The audio cut out and the reporter woman looked at the camera like Jim from The Office. Jeremy tossed his head back and screamed at the sky. In the background, Wizzy foraged for spell components..

>> No.76336893

>>76336868
The only thing I ban is variant human. Instead I give a free feat to everyone.

>> No.76336900

>>76336841
>fisherman bloodline
>cast spells through a net

>> No.76336902

I just wanna do cool combos and have sick armor while crushing my opponents under my godly power, is that to much to ask of this game

>> No.76336936

>>76336835
That's blatantly false now. GWM+PAM or CBE+SS on a Hexblade bladelock just has far bigger numbers. If you can't manage to catch up to 2d10+(6 or 8)+2d6 (And honestly, you also have access to Hex..) despite making 2-3 attacks per round with advantage on sharpshooter I don't know what to tell you.

>> No.76336947

>>76336827
Lv12 EBLock first turn
>ba: hex
>action: 3d10+3d6+15 = 42 damage
Lv12 Sharpshooter Bladelock
>action: 2d6+10+10+2+20 = 49 damage
>ba: 1d6+10+5+6 = 24.5 damage
granted, you're hitting a lot less, but it's over 50% damage increase

>> No.76336951

>>76336893
Does anyone play humans with vhuman banned?
Is there anything you do to the human to make it better to compensate for the removal of vhuman?

>> No.76336973

>>76336773
I like how you use phrases like "indetectible" as if that will somehow change the d6 sorcerer getting focused in combat anyway. Great, you can subtle cast a spell, something all sorcerer's can already do, subtle cast is useless because it's highly niche, there's a reason most people never talk about it
and great you can use spell points, a thing a sorcerer can already do by just turning them into slots.
You can do a trick like that once, maybe twice per long rest because of how costly it is. You don't have much sp. And at the end of it all, that's it, the wizard will still have more resources to control the fight, they will also out damage you
the warlock will also out damage you, the fighter will continue to view you as a twin haste bot because that's all the sorcerer is good for.
You're an idiot, they need massive improvements to even approach being good

>> No.76336976

>>76336795
>reflavoring
That literally modifies casting rules, he's using the weapon as spellfocus and somatic component.

>> No.76336983

>>76336888
>>76336875
based!

>> No.76336984

>>76336900
That sounds awesome! Net as a spellcasting focus is not something I'd think up, but it sounds funny to play and you might even get some cool experiences. Especially considering how this item would be so important to your PC as its where their powers came from. So you'd always have it and use it.

>> No.76336986

>>76333964
>Dapper Edition
Son of an Orc Chieftain from Shadow Marshes travels to Sharn. What would an Orc who wants to impress other races wear?

>> No.76336995

>>76336864
>You also don't get a whole lot of spells known as a warlock. Not an awful amount, but considering you don't prepare spells I wouldn't be too keen on making my warlock spells situational. Wizards, Clerics and Druids are better fit for taking situational spells
On the absolute contrary. You have less preparations than them, yes, but they need to prepare spells for 1st level slots, and 2nd level slots and so on and so forth. They are spread way more thin than you are. You're only going to cast two spells per rest at one specific level- that's very easy to account for with a fraction of your selections.
>>76336864
>That's my major issue. The pact was pretty ass pre Hexblade, it shouldn't need a specific patron to work properly.
Well I can't disagree there. They should have given bladelocks medium armor + shields at the very least.

>> No.76337003

>>76336951
sometimes I play regular human even if vhuman is an option because I hate having dump stats, playing human allows you to start with 2 16s and 14 in DEX while still having your other stats average

>> No.76337014

>>76336976
The somatic bit is mostly flavor if your using a bow nothing really changes with Somatic Components. You can just take your hand off the bow and cast the somatic component. The flavor is just your sending it through the bow for fun.

>> No.76337021

>>76336868
Tasha's Crockpot of Shit is not allowed near my table

>> No.76337032

>>76336868
Lucky.

>> No.76337034

>>76336872
>>76336976
It's reflavoring based on a mechanical change, but it's still reflavoring. Using X thing as a focus never actually changes how your spells look, and by "default" a Fireball cast with a bow will look the same as a Fireball cast with a shield or a staff.

>> No.76337041

>>76336986
Fantastic trousers.
https://youtu.be/UY9QD8vJQic

>> No.76337049

>>76337034
True. True.

>> No.76337050

>Bladepact only worth a damn if you pick Hexblade and copy the optimal martial damage builds
Who designed this

>> No.76337055

>>76337021
What specifically is bad in it?
Didn't it fix the ranger?

>> No.76337064

>>76336947
Yep. And you can precast something like Darkness or Shadow of Moil- you can really benefit from those with devil's sight. At those high levels you could even combine it with Elven accuracy. 18 Dex, CBE + SS, Devil Sight, IPW, extra attack, lifedrinker, eldrich mind and we still have a free invocation we can use for what we want (two if we have a +1 hand crossbow).

>> No.76337079

>>76336868
Elves
Gnomes
Firbolgs
Satyrs
Centaurs
Pixies
Glamour Bards
Archfey Warlocks
Summon Fey
Conjure Woodland Beings
Feytouched

>> No.76337099

>>76337079
Based, fuck Fey, and fuck Tieflings too

>> No.76337107

>>76337055
people are upset the subclasses continue being xanathar tier busted and eclipsing everything around PHB level while whining about the fact that custom lineage is shit (when we always knew it was gonna be lackluster at best, which is it) and also grognards that care too much about the idea of custom lineage/ swapping ability scores in the first place
outside of mechanics the book is cringe and tasha is a shit narrator

>> No.76337131

>>76337050
Blade, Tome, and Chain pact features are PHB shit from the start of the game, Hexblade and many of the pact specific invocations were released long afterwards to try and fix the fact most of the options were useless.

Investment of the Chainmaster from Tasha's finally makes Chainlock familiars work the same way as the actually good pet classes like Battlesmith, Drakewarden, and Wildfire Druid where you use a bonus action to make your pet attack instead of needing to sacrifice your entire fucking turn.

>> No.76337132

>>76337099
Tieflings are in, but they're red people with horns, tails, elongated maws and clawed hands & feet that get lynched if they step out of line once. They are not a peoples, they are a plague.

>> No.76337139

>>76337050
I played a decent bladelock before the hexblade came out, but I did it by MC-ing fighter

>> No.76337149

>>76337079
>>banning fey warlocks
>>still allowing druid
you can't stop me from fucking my wildfire spirit

>> No.76337174

>>76337149
I have no intention to, since it's an elemental.

>> No.76337179

>>76337107
What do you think of just doing Core + SCAG then?

>> No.76337198

>>76337099
>fuck Tieflings
Indeed

>> No.76337206

>>76337107
>xanathar tier
Most of them aren't even that strong

>> No.76337223

>>76337107
nothing wrong with making the player feel strong

>> No.76337231

>>76337179
I think it's boring and restrictive in the grand scheme of things, especially considering how SCAG is being retconned out of existence, but I wouldn't complain about if because there's plenty of enjoyable playable options. Doubly so if it's a Sword Coast thing and we actually delve into shit presented in the SCAG and the factions are utilized well.

I don't particularly see the point in disallowing x race or y spell on the basis of "not in PHB" alone, but I'm also not gonna be a little bitch about it.

>> No.76337232

WotC can't fix the Ranger. Because they care about their playerbase more than balance. People are shitting so often and so hard on the ranger, demanding reworks for their useless features and won't accept anything less than egregious buffs.
The issue however is that Rangers... are completely fine at lower levels. Easily comparable to fighters, doing the same damage (both get a fighting style, both get extra attacks, both have an even amount of feats till level 4, fighter gets action surge and ranger gets spells), and when fighters start outdamaging rangers, the latter flexes on them with sheer utility. So far so good. Until it doesn't- at level 9 Rangers don't get very good 3rd level spells, at level 11 they don't get a third extra attack.. they become pretty bad at around tier 3, because from then on they stop getting useful features outside of more spells. Which sure, is enough for them to be playable, but they are a martial class doing around the same damage, if not less, as EB warlocks now- they need buffs at those levels, not low levels. But if WotC does buff them there, people complain about favored foe and natural explorer, or primeval awareness, or the plethora of junk features that don't matter at all because their real features are spells. Tasha's only buffed them at low levels (Where they didn't need it, hence the UA was nerfed hard during publishment), but when they hit tier 3 they have the same exact problem as they always had and are shit like they've always been.
IMO they need better spells and features from level 8-9 onwards, but I've lost hope that WotC will give them such. Vanish is okay, but really not helping at this stage- I'd like something like paladin's improved divine smite, or something crazy like an extra free bonus action (which must be used for two different things) at level 11 or something.

>> No.76337248

>>76337198
>>canon harem end with a pair of tiefling twins
owlcat are based. reminds me of getting to fuck both Aribeth and Nathyrra if you had high CHA back in Hordes of the Underdark

>> No.76337250

>>76336888
I laughed

>> No.76337253

>>76337099
>fuck Fey, and fuck Tieflings
That's why I'm adventuring anon.

>>76337198
This guy gets it.

>> No.76337276

>>76337055
>Didn't it fix the range
No, the problem with ranger is that nobody uses the exploration rules, so everything the ranger does well is trivialized.
What would fix the ranger is exploration rules that DMs are willing to use.

>> No.76337283

>>76337248
What, really? I thought NWN didn't have a threesome option. I know Jade Empire did.

>> No.76337285

>>76337206
The sorcerer subclasses and the cleric subclasses are that strong. Peace is very abusable, Twilight is easily a top tier pick, and Sorc just got a ton of free new preparations they can swap out for powerful spells, Aberrant being able to really spam them.

>> No.76337303

>>76336888

>> No.76337371

>>76337232
Rangers should get the primal companion that attacks using their bonus action as a base class feature, moving Hunter's Mark from a dead target to a new one should be a free action
>>76337283
if you have good social stats you can get them to agree there's enough room in your bed for two.

>> No.76337451

>>76337371
See but those only buff in the early game and doesn't help much in tier 3 like >>76337232
Said

>> No.76337453

>>76337232
Yeah, Ranger needs a level 11 combat buff and better damage options for spells. Maybe they can add WIS to their attacks at 11?

>> No.76337465

>>76337131
The homunculus also works that way now.
There are some cool things you can do with your warlock familiar now, but I still think that outside of specific builds the pact boobs are still fairly meh.

>> No.76337473

>>76337465
the most important element of a pact familiar is getting a two and a half foot tall fairy onahole

>> No.76337526

>>76337371
I don't think all ranger subclasses should have a pet because it's not an idea that fits all the ranger archetype fantasies.

>> No.76337542

>>76337473
I'll admit I've had that exact fantasy before, but it's just so useless compared to the other familiars.

>> No.76337561

>>76337453
Level 11 would be an ideal time to give them the UA version of Favored Foe. Maybe even enhance it so it doesn't require a bonus action to cast either. If a Paladin is adding 1d8 to every melee swing, that's the point where giving the Ranger the ability to stop having their Concentration eaten up by a basic damage dealing feature makes sense.

>> No.76337565

>>76337526
I think the pet should be part of the base class as a variant feature: you either pick a bond with an animal companion, or with your friends (get bonuses like wolf barbarian advantage to allies near you).

>> No.76337579

>>76337526
And having either a pet, magic weapon or magic book doesn't exactly fit all Warlock archetype fantasies. That doesn't mean they shouldn't have them.

>> No.76337587

>>76336973
>and great you can use spell points, a thing a sorcerer can already do by just turning them into slots.
I do it faster, and cheaper than they do.
>You can do a trick like that once, maybe twice per long rest because of how costly it is. You don't have much sp. And at the end of it all, that's it, the wizard will still have more resources to control the fight, they will also out damage you
Depending on the level you could do it maybe 3 or so times and still keep your spell slots. How does the Wizard out damage the guy with more damaging spell options?

>> No.76337607

>>76337526
It should be the option between Hunter's Mark retooled as a feature, and a companion to dish out damage as a bonus action. It's almost at that point anyway where a bunch of ranger subclasses just have some bonus-action feature to deal extra damage anyway.

>> No.76337658

>>76337248
2 wives is not a harem.

>> No.76337663

>>76337579
In that case you actually get a choice between easily incorporated flavorfull options though.
And they even added a talisman in Tasha's.

>> No.76337667

Is there any reason a sorcerer couldn't twin Wish

>> No.76337690

>>76337667
Wish doesn't target a single creature.

>> No.76337703

>>76337667
Wish's range is "self".

>> No.76337709

>>76337658
By the modern definition it kinda is.
By the actual definition it could be a wife, and a bunch of other family members etc that you don't fuck.

>> No.76337711

>>76337663
How are they any more easily incorporated than a pet for Rangers?
Tell me two Ranger concepts where a pet really doesn't work and I'll agree with you.

>> No.76337717

>>76337587
>I do it faster and cheaper
no, you don't, you do it faster but the wizard has slots to spare, you do not.

>> No.76337724

>>76337658
No, but it's a start.

>> No.76337736

>>76337542
with investment of the chainmaster you don't need to feel bad about taking the sprite. 40/160 foot range, every turn you have them shoot someone with their bow. they have +6 to attack, on a hit the enemy takes 1 damage (and trigger any effects that trigger on taking damage) and have to make a save against YOUR SPELL DC to avoid getting Poisoned for ten rounds, having disadvantage on all attacks and ability checks.

if they roll a 1-5 on their saving throw they automatically fall unconscious for ten rounds, effectively removing them from the fight. They don't do anywhere near as much damage as an imp does but they can fly into the air and just pelt people with arrows forcing enemies to constantly save or suck. RAW you can have your familiar constantly give themselves invisibility on their own turn since they attack on yours.

>> No.76337754

>>76336973
I don't think you understand the conversion rate Aberrant Mind has going for those spells. Rather than a normal Sorcerer, which spends points according to the Font of Magic table to cast a spell using Sorcery points, Aberrant mind just spends points equal to the level. Thus, a normal sorcerer has to spend 5 points to cast a 3rd level spell, while an Aberrant Mind only spends 3. It's also a perfect conversion from spell slots to spell points in that way, since any sorcerer can expend a slot and gain that many sorcery points as a bonus action, but obviously that has a net loss if they then try to use those points to cast a spell.

Hypothetically speaking, a 6th level Aberrant Mind can immediately convert all of its slots into spell points and have a pool of 16 that are spent in a 1-to-1 ratio with spell level, for a total of 5 3rd level spells per day. And of course, all of those spells effectively get a free subtle metamagic on top of them, which absolutely can help to avoid counterspells and reprisal.

>> No.76337813

>>76337717
i'm talking about Sorcerers vs Sorcerers. Sorcerers's conversion rates to change sorcery points to spell slots is higher by 1 to 2 points per spell slot. Psionic Sorcery has an equal conversion rate. Their version is cheaper. This is at least when compared to other Sorcerers. Wizards have Arcane Recovery. Which is going to recover more for no cost, its going to be better in terms of recovery rate. The Sorcerer has more options those 10 extra spells add up.

>> No.76337814

FRESH BREAD
>>76337792
>>76337792
>>76337792

>> No.76337822

>>76335685
>>76336091
Based friend.

>> No.76337831

>>76337453
That does sound interesting, as most ranger builds dump wisdom unless they multiclass. Wonder how nuts it'd be to add that wisdom to to-hit as well.. As for ther spells, they really need to buff those Ranger-exclusive spells because Conjure Barrage, Conjure Volley, Hail of Thorns and Cordon of Arrows all unanimously suck. Many of these could receive the booming blade treatment where the ranger gets some weapon attacks as part of the spell. A lot of the features of the Arcane Archer could be applied to these kinds of spells.

>>76337561
Yeah, I'd even upscale it to do more damage on every hit- it's still restricted to one target per use after all.

I also wouldn't do all of these at once. The goal is to be able to match at least a fighter while using resources, but being able to fight with said resources for multiple encounters.

>> No.76337832

>>76337814
Amazing. One of these days, you might yet count to eight.

>> No.76337841

>>76337754
To be fair, that only applies to spells gained with Psionic Spells feature. So it's a rather limited list, including only those explicitly listed, or anything that is from divination or enchantment schools.

>> No.76337857

>>76337832
It's 10 pm. I need to go to sleep.

>> No.76337859

>>76337754
>counterspells
never actually happen in games which is why subtle spell is useless, most people homebrew their settings (which you would know if you actually played the game) so the consideration of enemies that can cast counterspell is never a factor and even among official modules they're near non existent. So, not an argument
>t-they can cast
they can only cast spells on their origin list with that feature which for the most part is actually really fucking useless, yeah you can have some effectively free spells like hunger of hadar but 9 time out of 10 the wizard casting force cage is gonna be more useful
shit the wizard using scagtrips is gonna be more useful
at the end of the day no matter what faggots like you try to do in your whiteroom autism sorcerer will remain dogshit with or without origin spells and it will always need massive changes and buffs in order to not feel like total shit to play. So just stop, stop pretending sorcerer isn't the worst class in the game next to monk. The class is so fucking egregiously awful that its only consideration is as a possible multiclass tool, that's how bad they are.

>> No.76337864

>>76337703
>>76337690
What about wishing for a target spell?

>> No.76337878

>>76337857
Then go to sleep, and let someone else make a thread at page eight, dingus.

>> No.76337882

>>76337864
Yes, you can wish for a single target spell. But you can't use twinned spell on Wish, since it has a range of Self.

>> No.76337930

>>76337859
They can swap those spells for other spells from the enchantment and divination schools. These are still considered to be from their Origin spells.

>> No.76337945

>>76337859
>never actually happen in games
I don't know what you're talking about, even the standard template mage from the MM has counterspell.

>> No.76337951

>>76337930
once again, stop trying to whiteroom an obvious shafting of sorcerer that happened yet again

>> No.76337962

>>76337711
Ranger != Wow Hunter anon.
Aragon and Van Hellsing did not have pets. Neither did Robin Hood, Crocodile Dundee or Alith Anar.
Could they have had a pet bird or something? Yes, but not in the same was as Rexxar. If you want that sort of thing then get find familiar.

If I have to explain why those warlock options are so easily incorporated into a warlock fantasy then I'd rather not even reply anymore.

>> No.76337977

>>76337831
The Ranger does have the advantage that they're more capable of using dual-wielding or ranged weapons, so relative to the Paladin they will be dealing that d6 more frequently per turn or from further away.
I also think still having it be a pool of uses by basically being X unrestricted Hunter's Marks per long rest helps set it apart.

>> No.76338000

>>76337859
>i can't read or count
Would have been easier if you'd started off saying that anon

>> No.76338058

>>76337951
I'm not the guy you were arguing with, but you can't possibly consider this to be shafting right? These are the two best subclasses for sorcerers now, one getting Wall of Force and a ton of free useful spells, outpreparing the wizard while still having metamagic + con save prof, and the other having the most castings out of any full caster (Yes, casting dissonant whispers for 1 SP is really good, as is blasting with synaptic static for 5, or using Hex or Arcane eye etc etc and Telekinesis is also a very good 5th level spell). The Sorc list is incredible and now they can use their known spells freely.

>> No.76338060

>>76337962
>Aragon and Van Hellsing did not have pets.
But they could have? Adding an Owl to Aragorn is completely inoffensive. It's very easily incorporated, just as much as a book for a Warlock.

Also, Aragorn, Van Hellsing and Robin Hood would not be Rangers in 5e. They'd be Fighters/ Rogues. The 5e Ranger is explicitly a nature-magic, divine-based spellcaster.

>> No.76338109

>>76337711
A pet is a living creature that follows you around that you have to feed, clean up after, and generally keep an eye on to make sure it doesn't scare the locals if it's a wolf or something. Even something relatively small and normal like a falcon is still at least as noteworthy as a familiar, except it can't be shoved into another dimension when you're not using it.

Compared to that, a weapon that you keep in another dimension, a familiar you can summon, or magic book are all far less intrusive. You could be a Blade warlock who just uses their pact to conjure up a spellcasting focus, since you can have it take the form of a staff. Or you can just use it as a dagger if you happen to be in need of a tool.

>> No.76338122

>>76337878
Anon, calm down. Here, have a Buggie.

>> No.76338225

>>76338109
My pet Dire Wolf feeds itself. And sometimes brings meat.

>> No.76338458

>>76333964
The sorc priest maybe, his vestments are already reasonably snazzy and he has a few nicer outfits if he needs to mingle in a social setting.

>> No.76338634

>>76335544
Why didn't you just tell the players this?
>Your characters would surely know that if you turn back now, he'll probably make a break for it, right?

>> No.76340348

Excluding battlemaster and including Tasha's, what's the most fun/interesting/tactically engaging fighter subclass to play right now?

Leaning towards rune knight as it takes a while for psi warrior to get to the good stuff.

>> No.76340449

>>76340348
Eldritch Knight will give you more options, though Rune Knight is a decent choice for variety. Psi Warrior ends up being very limited in how much it can achieve even once it starts to get more dice.

>> No.76340561

>>76336343
Having to trade off using optimal weapons/tactics in exchange for no casualties which grants you substantially more favor as a result of your merciful hand and perhaps some extra reward seems like a perfectly fine dynamic to me.

>> No.76340592

>>76340348
Cavaliers open up a whole new world of battlefield maneuvering while mounted and are still cool tanker-types when not, I think they're slept on especially if you want to be a small race on a giant wasp memer or the like.

>> No.76341382

>>76335614
Holds his arms out like a hula hoop

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