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[ERROR] No.74948802 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

>From a D&D FB group I’m in, posted by a DM complaining about a problem player. Cue spit take when we all looked at the player’s sheet. The DM is now getting dragged for allowing it to ever get this bad. And I thought I’d dealt with problem players... this is NEXT LEVEL

Would you allow this character sheet?

>> No.74948890

>>74948802
>barely legible
>Clearly hasn't read the rules
>XP
No. Maybe if they fixed LITERALLY EVERYTHING WRONG WITH IT.

>> No.74948960

>>74948802
>Would you allow this character sheet?

It's a DnD character sheet, so no. DnD players are damaged goods and actively drag down everyone's fun regardless of the system.

>> No.74949044

>>74948802
Literally not permissible stat array listed. PCs have a semi-hard cap of 20 on ability scores which can only be overcome through specific class abilities. This is clearly a bait character sheet.

>> No.74949182

>Since this group is about horror STORIES and not just shitty characters, I’ll mention some of the context that the DM gave.

>They have been playing this campaign for 3 years. Sounds like all the other players have reasonable characters created using sourcebooks, but this player... dreamed big... and no one had the balls to say no to them. So instead of ever confronting this player that seemingly has no idea this isn’t how D&D works, the DM and other players have just complained about the player behind their back for 3 years. The DM and other players have finally reached a point where they realize it can’t continue like this, and the DM is trying to figure out what the next steps should be. Unfortunately it sounds like they may scrap the whole campaign and start fresh, effectively punishing everyone and losing 3 years of story building and character development.

>To me this is not only a horror story for the party and DM, but also for this poor player. They may be a narcissistic OPer, or they could just be a new player that isn’t all that familiar with D&D and doesn’t know what’s considered realistic for their character’s level. Either way, now having to make a realistic level 8 character sheet will likely ruin the game for someone that has been playing like this for so long. Imagine going from never failing at anything to falling on your face as often as most of us do in a campaign. That’s rough. I don’t envy anyone involved in this situation.

>> No.74949232

>>74948802
Is that dudes name Zane? I bet it's fucking Zane. He was always pulling shit like that.
>"Hey DM can I use my character sheet from another game?"
>"I rolled the stats legit I promise"
>Nothing below 16
>Fuck off Zane.

>> No.74949339

>>74948802
>28
>26
What the fuck

>> No.74950320

>>74948802
>level 8
>425 HP
>Race: Dragon-human
>Dragon stat block attacks with not one, but TWO breath weapon attacks
>80ft flying speed ayylmao
>Proficient in five saving throws
>Proficient in nine skills
>Those fucking attributes
>28 STR, 26 CON. Lowest stat is a fucking 16
>Proficient in Animal Handling (WIS) for a skill total of 6; Proficient in Perception (WIS) for a skill total of 15, giving him a passive perception of 24

WHAT THE FUCK. WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK? OH SHIT, WE'RE NOT DONE. I JUST SAW THIS NIGGA GAVE HIMSELF LEGENDARY RESISTANCE. LITERALLY JUST COPIED AN ANCIENT DRAGON STAT BLOCK. FUCKING CR20+ WITH PC LEVELS.

>> No.74950412

>>74950320
>Dragon stat block attacks with not one, but TWO breath weapon attacks
That's normal for metallic dragons.

>> No.74950438

>>74950412
No it's not.

>> No.74950452

>>74950438
Yes it is. Metallic Dragons have two breath weapons, go check the MM.

Metallic Dragonborn do not, so if you got them confused thats fine I won't make fun of you but other people might.

>> No.74950554

>>74948802
Is this even D&D character sheet?
He didn't even read rules

>> No.74950600

>>74950412
This is some Berenstain Bears shit. I would have bet money that you're wrong, but you're not. Even metallic wyrmlings have two breath attacks.

>> No.74950625

>>74950554
They played like this for 3 YEARS.

>> No.74950660

>>74950600
most people overlook this, if you go back to AD&D they have two different breath attacks. It's just one of those quirks about metallic dragons.

>> No.74950674

>>74948802
So did you ask the player what was the deal with his character sheet? Because it's more then just trying to bump up his stats by a couple points, I mean did he think it was okay? How old is he? How in the world did someone go "hmmm dragonborn means just tiny dragon" and how did no one notice this entire time? So many questions...
Story time if you could Anon, I need more context then just this >>74949182.

>> No.74950763

>>74949182
>>74950674
>The DM claims to have never seen the player’s character sheet until now, and that’s what sparked the current search for a resolution. Hard to believe they didn’t pick up on it a LOT earlier though, I mean cmon. 1) DMs should always review a player’s sheet, at least once, but preferably at every level-up just to make sure everything was done correctly 2) I would have been pretty suspicious as a DM when I asked for passive perceptions AND THEY SAID 24

>> No.74950791

>>74950763
>2) I would have been pretty suspicious as a DM when I asked for passive perceptions AND THEY SAID 24
Or the two breath weapons, or asking for the enemies to make wisdom saves by being in his presence, or the fact that he was duel wielding 2d6 weapons and had an attack bonus of +12.

>> No.74950815

>>74950791
oh yeah don't forget
>banjo

>> No.74950850

>>74950815
Banjo?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h39CmJdvMi8

>> No.74950885

But really, how deep does this rabbit hole actually go? What ANCIENT dragon possibly has:

>Strength 28
>Dexterity 20
>Constitution 26
>Intelligence 17
>Wisdom 16
>Charisma 20

There is no way at all that the 8 levels in ranger give enough ASIs to cover this.

This warrants an investigation.

>> No.74950966

>>74950885
The closest fit looks to be an Ancient Brass but even that doesn't work out right. Ancient Brass is 27 / 10 / 25 / 16 / 15 / 19. Now we apply the +1 to all stats from the Human racial bonus because of course we do and his race is listed as Dragon - Human. So that takes us to 28 / 11 / 26 / 17 / 16 / 20 which right on the money except for DEX. He's level 8 so we drop 2 ASIs into DEX bringing it up to 15 which is still 5 points short of his listed DEX. Not sure where he pulled that from.

>> No.74950978

>>74950966
The Dex is because he's a ranger, and rangers are agile. Of course he'd have a +5 to Dex.

>> No.74951072

Clearly the DM is at fault here for allowing him to play Dragon-Human.

>> No.74951316

Lame fucking bait.

>> No.74951406

>>74948802
I'm honestly having an existential crisis over how fucking lame it is that everyone is pretending this lame ass bait is real.

You people are the worst.

>> No.74951463

>>74950763
>>>The DM claims to have never seen the player’s character sheet until now
lmfao what, is everyone involved here 12?

>> No.74951494

>>74949044
Or the magical books which for some ungodly reason allow the effects to stack

>> No.74951502

>>74950966
>5 points short of his listed DEX. Not sure where he pulled that from.
Hybrid vigor.

>> No.74951512

>>74949339
He's literally playing a buffed ancient brass dragon. How the hell could anyone allow this for 10 minutes let alone 3 years.

>> No.74951526

>>74951406
Come on anon, don't be such a scrooge.

>> No.74951538

>>74951406
Let us have our fun cunt

>> No.74951562

>>74948802
This is either a bait sheet, or the DM is a literal retard who should never run a game again. /thread

>> No.74952456

>>74951562
It's the latter.

>> No.74952763

>>74951316
>>74951406
Where have you been? Since the 5th edition D&D has become more mainstream and has had plenty of new people come in. People who don't have any experience of roleplaying games. This sort of fuckery happened even before, so it's completely plausible.

>> No.74953425

>>74952763
How shit are 5e DMs really?

>> No.74953541

Why are people acting like it's a big deal, this is just your average 12yo character sheet

>> No.74953620

>>74953541
This is /tg/, most of what all these fucks have is threads like this where they can flex and show off.

>> No.74953700

>>74949182
>>74950763
>>74950885

But wait, there is more. How did this person reach only 8th level in a 3-year campaign?

>> No.74953854

>Proficiency bonus : 3

>> No.74953962

>>74948802

He might as well handed as sheet that just says "I can do whatever the fuck I want".

>> No.74955248

>>74948960
shots fired

>> No.74955965

>>74948960

spbp

>> No.74956020

>>74950763
well, you can feasibly get like 30 passive perception with a combination of expertise, observant, and some magic item granting you advantage, so 24 isn't that crazy

>> No.74956144

>>74950320
How did they not notice he was playing a fucking dragon with dragon stats?
That's not the player being a problem (no one told them they COULDN'T play a creature from the MM), it's everyone else being retarded.

>> No.74956288

>>74953854
He's level 8.

>> No.74956303

>>74956144
>(no one told them they COULDN'T play a creature from the MM)

That's not even RAW in the PHB.

>> No.74956326

>>74956303
You know full well players don't read the rule book.

>> No.74956449

>>74953425
In my high school D&D club one of the "5e DMs" had literally never opened the rulebook before. I wish I was joking.

>> No.74956952

>>74956449
That's pretty normal.

>> No.74957044 [SPOILER] 

>>74950850
Banjo.

>> No.74957052

>>74956449
When my schools dnd club was made one of teachers mentioned it so me and my friends went to go join it, the club "president" was a guy who never played dnd before. In fact when we started to play I was pretty much the only one who was willing to dm and became the forever dm. The funny part was the president left within a week because "dnd was different then what I thought it was" leaving me become the president and do the paper work to even get the club official. Good times.

>> No.74957320

>>74948802
>Proficiencies
>Tool: banjo
Alright, you got me.

>> No.74958064

>>74957320
Whats's wrong with being able to play a banjo?

>> No.74958722

>>74957052
That's how you're supposed to play D&D.

>> No.74959367

>>74953541
Was the DM also 12 years old?

>> No.74960066

>>74949232
> >"I rolled the stats legit I promise"
This shit gets to me more than anything else, as I had to deal with a fucker that always did this.
We had session 0s to roll our characters together (we played stuff like 40 rpgs and WFRP) and form bonds with what we rolled up (we all agreed the random element made it fun as our characters felt more real than min-maxed fare) and then THAT GUY would come along with a totally finished character sheet and state he rolled his stats legit, never anything low and always managed to hit the prerequisites for broken shit.
One time he turned up with a pregen Mage in a WFRP game and had the fucking balls to ask the GM if he could play a vampire atop of all the buffs he gave himself.

>> No.74960459

>>74950438
>>74950600
It's always been that way. I assume because Gygax wanted good dragons to have a non-lethal way of dealing with parties.

>> No.74960841

>>74952456
it's the former.

>> No.74961317

>>74949232
One time I rolled stats in front of my group and got 18, 18, 17, 14, 11, 10. Felt damn good to get those stats legit and know everyone saw it.

>> No.74961502

>>74951406
I've literally met people that retarded. Nu D&D is honestly an entire different world.

>> No.74965539

>>74950966

Now, this player's character is based on the ancient brass, loosely based on the ability scores and the breath weapons. But think about that for a moment. If this player was interested in having a busted character, why did this player not just select an ancient gold? It cannot just be a matter of alignment, because the character is "true neutral" anyway.

Let that sink in. The player had to consciously say to themselves, "An ancient gold would simply be too much. I will limit myself to an ancient brass." That is completely mind-boggling.

>> No.74965880

>>74961317
I watched someone roll up all 18s, meanwhile I had only 2 stats above 10. Hardcore AD&D GMs can SUCK, it was fun, but my character died real quick.

I'd say the guy who rolled all 18s was using weighted dice, but he was 12 and the dice weren't even his.

>> No.74968444

>>74949232
You only roll stat dice in front of the DM
Even then the DM can say no to your rolls
New DM new character or reroll the stats
Thats the rule on our table

>> No.74968464

>>74950763
>DM claims this is the first time he saw this
Then its equally his fault

>> No.74968682

>>74968464
What DM even looks at character sheets?

>> No.74972302

I think I can beat OP.
http://web.archive.org/web/20041124060022/http://www.molatar.com/Roleplaying.htm

>> No.74972947

>>74972302
tl;dr: He was salty because his D&D group wouldn't let him play as a werewolf gold/silver dragon ranger evangelist emperor.

>> No.74973096

>>74949232
I wish it was that shit for my problem player. They're unable to cheat the rolls since we're online but they're also unable to perform basic arithmetic apparently. I keep seeing scores that are 1 or 2 points higher than it has any right to be at that level.

>> No.74974929

>>74972302
>Players have killed themselves when their best character, an imaginary friend who might be their only friend, gets killed by a callous DM. What a stupid thing to die for!

dis nigga thinks Chick Tracts are real!

>> No.74976785

>>74950763
i mean yeah in critical role one of the two cheaters in the group created a minmaxed character that has 20 passive perception

>> No.74976844

>>74972302
>FRPG's train the mind to think of everyone in terms of finite statistics. God isn't finite. It becomes very difficult to worship an infinite God when you limit him with numeric statistics. You begin to wonder if God could possibly be defeatable, which He isn't. You lose absolute trust because you no longer think in absolutes but in die rolls and bonuses.

I'm thinking based.

>> No.74977101

>>74948802
>Crazy-ass legendary bronze dragon hybrid stats
>Actually ends up handicapped by using the weaksauce greatsword and fucking pitiful longbow
Holy fuck I'm dying, 5e was a mistake

>> No.74977163

>>74972302
>Molatar Seth Pyrargent.
>Dragon, Evangelist, Ranger.
I'm inclined to believe this is an actual dragon. It certainly isn't self aware enough to be a human.
>>74976844
Based indeed.

>> No.74977328

>>74968682
A non-terrible one.

>> No.74977345

>>74977101
5e exists to fill an existing market niche.
In other words, hate the player, not the game.

>> No.74977424

>>74977101
Ancient brass dragon you midwit.

>> No.74977529

>>74950763
Of all the things on this sheet, the passive perception is probably the most believable, it's both common and easy to optimize

>> No.74978963

>>74977529
How do you get passive Perception 24 at level 1?

>> No.74978975

>>74977101
He's using a 2d6 kukri, not a greatsword.

>> No.74979247

>>74978963
Vuman rogue can do 10+5+2(2)+3 for 22, which is surprisingly close

>> No.74979292

>>74960066

>> No.74979880

>>74979292
My table deliberately rolls in a modified way to generate stats just like those

Not because it’s needed to survive, the encounters are still more lethal than higher stats could account for, but because it allows nobody to ever feel left out of any encounter. We use all the skills and tools saves fairly regularly to the point where a disguise kit or jewelers tools have been the difference between victory and the world being destroyed.

But we do a Super Heroic Fantasy Setting so it’s par for the course

>> No.74979915

>>74948802
Isn't this word for word from Reddit?

>> No.74979935

>>74979915
No it’s from 5e, you can’t tell by the character sheet?

>> No.74980047

>>74972302
The rest of this guy's website is amazing, he's a fucking pentacostal creationist who thinks he's a weredragon. I would say there's no way it's real, but...

>> No.74980099

>>74979247
How?

>> No.74980161

>>74980099
Double proficiency and Observant

>> No.74982744

I found an archived mirror of Molatar with the original illustration.
https://web.archive.org/web/20070609181259/http://someonewhogivesafuck.com/molatar/index.htm

>> No.74983055

>>74972302

>5. In FRPG's, players pass their God-given self-control over to a set of dice and some paper. Players have killed themselves when their best character, an imaginary friend who might be their only friend, gets killed by a callous DM. What a stupid thing to die for! And yet, I can sympathize with these victims because I too have had my best characters, in which I invested precious ideas and time, killed like cannon fodder.

Does he think Blackleaf to be a real story?

>> No.74984673

>>74948802
No. And yeah I would drag the DM as well.

>> No.74986243

Admit it: You'd rather play with this guy than your lack of a group.

>> No.74986696

>>74951406
Pretending stupid fantasy shit is real it's what this board is all about.

>> No.74986788

>>74986243
You know, I actually would, because at least Moly puts out.
>>http://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/70352544/

>> No.74988217

>>74948802
>425 HP
>16 is the dump stat
>24 passive perception
>bite +14 atk bonus 2d10+8
>Sleep breath DC 21 Con or sleep 10 minutes
>Legendary resistance
This DM deserves it if any one of these things made it onto a character sheet

>> No.74991917

>>74988217
The sleep breath is the least offensive thing here.

>> No.74991979

>>74991917
a 21 DC check to not become completely helpless for 10 minutes is pretty bad. I'm less offended by the 16 dump stat in and off itself, I've had players roll insanely strong characters. The fact that 16 is so much lower than all the other stats is what's really bad.

>> No.74992126

>>74991979
Have you read how it actually works for a brass dragon, brainlet?

>> No.74992137

>>74992126
Why would I, I have no reason to think Captain Copypaste didn't change buff it beyond recognition anyway.

>> No.74992194

>>74976785
it aint that hard. L1 vhuman observant thief with 18 wis. trained in perception, expertise in perception.
passive skill 10+2+5+5+5 = 27
crank that wis down to 14 and it becomes 10=+2+2+2+5 = 21 not even min maxing at that point.

>> No.74992708

>>74992194
>18 Wis rogue

Why are you rolling stats again?

>> No.74996092

>>74992708
Wisdoms a helpful skill. Perception is important and they might multiclass something else later, as rogues are a great starting class for multiclass builds due to 4 skills and expertise.

>> No.74996116

>>74976785
Which character/cheaters are you talking about? Also, aren't most of their character details and builds public knowledge? How are they cheating?

Also 20 passive perception isn't hard. 10 base, Expertise is at least +4 proficiency. Observant is a +5 I think, so that's a 19 without a wisdom score. It's investment sure, but that's hardly minmaxed. And if someone minmaxes perception they... see things? Let people have fun with their elven eyes or whatever dude.

>> No.74997239

>>74960066
I played a campaign with this 54-year-old lady for a couple years and she had pretty good stats off the bat, above average. It bothered me a bit but after that one wrapped up I had her roll in front of me each time in the future. Turns out she happens to be really lucky with the starting rolls, she's gotten multiple 17s and 16s on characters since then.

>> No.75001433

>>74948802
>Kukri with a 2d6 damage die, is it like three size categories bigger?
>bite with 2d10 damage die, not full str bonus to natural weapons
>little bitch longbow 1d8 damage die with dex to damage
>dex to longbow damage

>> No.75001569

>>75001433
Dex to bow damage is standard 5e.

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