[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / g / ic / jp / lit / sci / tg / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports / report a bug ] [ 4plebs / archived.moe / rbt ]

Due to resource constraints, /g/ and /tg/ will no longer be archived or available. Other archivers continue to archive these boards.Become a Patron!

/tg/ - Traditional Games

View post   

[ Toggle deleted replies ]
[ERROR] No.74206255 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Will his tv show help cure the cancer that is meme-only secondary fans?

>> No.74206304

It will increase the number of meme-only secondary fans, and you know it.

People who only get into the setting via the TV show will get most of their lore from One Mind Syndicate or some other easy listening youtube lore-tard.

>> No.74206329

What counts as a meme-only secondary fan? I've read a lot of the BL books but never played the tabletop game.

>> No.74206350

If you've read something GW published themselves, you're safe.

Meme-only secondaries are the ones who only get their info from wikis and youtube.

>> No.74206355

You are precisely one of those cancer fucking secondaries. BL books arent lore. Lore is in the rulebooks and codexes.

>> No.74206379

I've never heard of this being the case. None of the BL books are canonical?

>> No.74206389

Gaunts Ghosts is canon. Fight me.

>> No.74206398

>Black Library is the problem
>When 1d4chan has this much influence over the community

>> No.74206415

I assume it's the principle of the primary product being the most canon. Like Star Wars its movies, Star Trek it's the show and movies, and LotR it's books. Stuff like that.
As for any official statement of the books not being canon, I dunno, I don't follow stuff like that.

>> No.74206481

40k has really simple rules for canon.

If you like it it's canon.
If you don't like it it's not canon.
If there is a contradiction between these two canons.... the warp did it.

>> No.74206534

Why is he so bald?

>> No.74206749

There is an actual official show in the works?

>> No.74206791

fuck off lorefag

>> No.74206815

Yes. It's pretty far out into the future though.

>> No.74206841

Don't know, don't care really. Hoping the show is gud, Eisenhorn was my intro to 40k

>> No.74206857


>> No.74206880

How far? About 40000 years or so?

>> No.74206917

I don't know how long it takes to make a tv show
GW decided to drop the announcement the second the deal was signed, instead of the usual "drop a trailer once you've made sure something will actually come of it," so the timeline is up in the air

>> No.74206919

The secondaries are going to call it non canon because abnetts version of 40k doesn't conform to their ideas of 40k

>> No.74206925


>> No.74206941

>BLfags opinions mattering
Fuck off secondary

>> No.74206954

I have more points painted than you.

>> No.74206991

He starts off with a full head of hair in Xenos.
He's bold as a coot in The Magos.
He's fucking old you numpty. He's also had a rough life. By the time he gets to Thorn wishes Talon he's well on his way to his 200s.

>> No.74207092

Don't worry, this show isnt ever coming out.

>> No.74207233

I would be ok with this. It's my fav 40k book series and I just know they'll fuck up Tobias.

>> No.74207242

Well we will know if you stop posting.

But on a serious note getting ulcers over shit you can’t help isn’t going to make anyone feel better

>> No.74207417

When is it coming out though?

>> No.74207444

It's GW. I'm prepared only for disappointment.

>> No.74207557

Haven't they cured baldness in the 41st millennium?

>> No.74207664

It's the Imperium. They can cure anything if you're important enough, but almost nobody is important enough for basic medical care

>> No.74208575


This was from may. Showrunner doesn't know anything about 40k. Talks about how he sees the show as a modern, 21st century star trek.

Its gonna be shit.

>> No.74208623

Well. Expectations lowered.

Hard to believe he'll be allowed to mangle it too much though, given how autistic GW are about making sure their licensed works are on-brand

>> No.74208666

You assume it's going to be a faithful representation.


>> No.74208680

Honestly, that's why I think it'll never get made.

What I'd hate, and what I think is the most likely, is Star Trek: Discovery: 40k. I've seen too many things I like get turned into bland gray paste in the last decade, I'm fine with the books staying books.

>> No.74208683

Literally his next sentence is "It's NOT star trek" you doomsaying faggot

>> No.74208724

As much as I like books, GW needs to move into the low-effort media space.
Right now they're letting random youtubers reading wiki pages dictate a large portion of people's perception of 40k, with no ability to filter if for example one of these people go on a cringe political rant

>> No.74208743

I fail to see how a bad streaming show will help that situation?

>> No.74208748

GW's stance is everything is canon, nothing is trustworthy. Although some things are almost set in stone of course, there is some leeway for contradictory bl books (and codices for that matter).

>> No.74208764

If it's bad, it won't help. If it's good, it beats youtube wiki readers by being even lower effort to find.

>> No.74208776

He sounds like he hasn't even read a Wikipedia page. He sounds like someone gave him a single page primer 20 minutes before the interview. The fact that the closest thing he can give to a touchstone is that "its like a 21st century start trek, but its not star trek, obviously," is fucking telling.

>> No.74208801

I seriously doubt one will have any effect on the other, I doubt the show being good even more.

>> No.74208880

And the sentence after that he explains that he meant it embodies lots of themes of the world we actually live in. It was clumsy but he's correct that both settings draw heavily from our politics and philosophy to make a metaphor of it in outer space. It's a three minute interview targeted at normalfag audiences, what would you have rather he referenced?

>> No.74209029

Everything with the 40k logo is canon, if you don't like what someone writes, customise your canon bruh. And don't even think of calling my retcons shit, because you can just customise it away freeing me from any duty to write quality.

>> No.74209053

>Secondary fan
Is this some new buzzword for "anyone I don't like" or something?

>> No.74209136

it's the opposite of that. They've cured male hair in 40K. Except for Space Wolves. Have you ever seen a space marine without his helmet on?
It's hard to imagine that they'd get Eisenhorn right. It'll probably end up cargo-cultish.

>> No.74209167

It means someone who isn't invested in the source material, but still thinks they're fans of the property.

Secondaries are usually harmless but 40k in particular has an issue where the memes portray it so differently from the actual source material that you can convince them that current 40k is some corrupted, bad version caused by a hostile takeover by outside forces.

>> No.74209169

>that both settings draw heavily from our politics and philosophy to make a metaphor of it in outer space.

What exactly does this mean, to you? Because we've seen what this shit means to the people in charge of star trek right now, and I don't want that for Eisenhorn.

It *isnt* sci-fi. Its fucking gothic fantasy in space. The fact that he can't seem to convey that isnt great.

>> No.74209206

Star Wars is the most famous "sci-fi" in the mainstream mind. It's also not sci-fi, but fantasy in space.

If the interview is for mainstream audiences, you speak the language of mainstream audiences. "Gothic" to mainstream audiences means dressing up like an emo kid, not huge ostentatious cathedrals covered in skulls and spires.

>> No.74209234

>Its fucking gothic fantasy in space
The woman says that at the beginning of the segment

>> No.74209245

Nope, you're right. I should be super excited they got someone who obviously doesn't know anything about 40k as the showrunner for their streaming show! I will gladly consoom product! Hurray amazon! Hurray games workshop!

>> No.74209292

He spoke in very general terms for less than five minutes and 40k isn't difficult to learn. This guy has done lots of high profile stuff in the past and he's adapting a work by a very experienced black library author, he's not some amateur clown.

>> No.74209315

There's a huge difference between failure to understand a thing, and having the social awareness to simplify things for unfamiliar audiences so you don't come off as a huge autist.

>> No.74209531

Anything written for 40k in terms of lore has a shelf life before fading into non-canon, regardless of who wrote it.

The long life stuff is core rulesbooks and codexes. The lore there tends to stand for a substantial longer time before being considered retconned.

Black Library books, though official, have a much shorter shelf life before being retconned/considered no longer cannon.

Horus Heresy fags will screech otherwise but they know it to be true. There are White Dwarf articles that have stood the test of time better than Black library stuff.

>> No.74210464

what if I get info from wikis, youtube, here, codexs, and BL books?

>> No.74211470

Despite what the grogs will claim, that's about normal. 40k at its best isn't a coherent setting and it's not a story where the characters are massively important. The setting gives you a shit tonne of plot hooks, building blocks and cool ideas to run with.

The Space Marine video game broke the lore all over the place. Captain Titas couldn't be the Captain of the Second Company, as that's a named character in the lore...... but who. the fuck. cares. It was a cool story. You read the lore/books/wikis until you get a general idea of the tone that's expected and just do your own thing. If it breaks the lore..... fuck it... in verse there was an Ork Warboss who canonically met himself due to the warp screwing around with the flow of Time. The Warboss killed himself in order to get a second copy of his fav custom-shoota.

>> No.74211521

bad unless it's from my posts
good if they're from editions I like
>black library
good if they're authors I like

>> No.74211768

>One Mind Syndicate
I had to fight not to fall asleep during those videos. Unironically recommend Luetin09 and Baldermort though.

>> No.74211798

Most likely the opposite

>> No.74215332


1d4chan is fine. The problem is that people take it like it's the word of god and not as a joke wiki.

>> No.74215348

Why would you think it will?

>> No.74216687

I always saw it as going to a hobby store and asking about lore. True but colored through personal bias.

>> No.74216736

I'm optimistic. Out of sheer despair and boredom, lets go.

>> No.74216751

Books 2 and 3 of Eisenhorn fucking blew

3 especially, lets take the best part of the story (gregor and pontius glaws relationship) and complete abandon it so Gregor can fuck his ex girlfriend on a luxury train and then kill glaw in the last 5 minutes

>> No.74217151

Are you the autist whining about Dan on /v/ a few weeks ago? The sweaty /pol/ fag? If so, Straight Silver, suck a dick

>> No.74217241

Bequin 2 + 3 WHEN, Abnett? Please, I'm dying here.

>> No.74217468

ts like AI, causes daemonic possession most of the time.

>> No.74217544 [DELETED] 

My fear is that when normies enter the hobby, they'll push to get rid of the 'problematic' elements.

>> No.74217578

Yeah, I kind of wish it never comes out.

>> No.74217586 [DELETED] 

Oh fuck, I can actually see them trying to pull that shit. Remember the people who claimed that a black Eisenhorn would be 'more popular'?

>> No.74217601

I think Abnett's a great writer, but I wish he'll lean more heavily on the grim and dark aspect. The Gaunt's Ghosts novels, near the end, are kind of more like superhero novels.

I particularly dislike the pro-feminism rant in The Warmaster. Just make Gaunt's 'son' a son, Dan. Shit isn't difficult, you already retconned Dalin.

>> No.74217704

Yeah, pretty much this.
Secondaries wouldn't be a problem if they weren't retarded screeching benders with no idea what they're talking about.

>> No.74217707

>Thought secondaries were just a myth seething AoS paypigs tell themselves to cope with playing a dog shit game
>One day get a new coworker
>Has warhammer tattoos all over his arm, deff skulls, khorne rune, night lords icon.
>Chat with him because I figured we could be pals
>he has no models
>He doesn't play the game
>He just talks to me about arch warhammer's latest videos.
>Gets fired a few weeks later for no call no showing and generally being an awful employee.

I won't even mention his OC chapter idea because it was so fucking cringe you would believe my story even less.

>> No.74217729 [DELETED] 

I'm pretty sure it was /tg/ trolling

>> No.74217732

>The Space Marine video game broke the lore all over the place
Yeah it was shit. Gameplay was shit too. I don't know why anyone defends that garbage game. Probably secondaries who didn't know anything about 40k before they played it.

>> No.74217743

>Everyone who likes things I don't like is a secondary

>> No.74217750

>t. butthurt secondary
Coming to the setting from a video game is one of the literal fucking definitions of "secondary".

>> No.74217756

I want to hear it anon
I get hating it if you also hate gears and doom(2016)

>> No.74217764

Anon, you're retarded, sorry to say.

>> No.74217765

Nice non-argument, secondary. Now fuck off.

>> No.74217768

He wanted to make a hedgehog themed marine chapter called "The Hogs of Hedge"
He was going to glue random blades to their armor.
This was not a joke.

>> No.74217778

>it also isn't sci-fi
You dumb nigger, sci-fi is just shorthand for "fantasy but with enough technobabble to convince the reader it's plausible given sufficiently advanced technology." It's all fantasy just like LOTR, but just plausible enough if you turn your brain off that it's considered cooler for being 'realistic.' ST: TOS is almost pure sci-fi right down to asking questions about the nature of mankind and proceeding to answer them as best as the writer can.

>> No.74217795

You were right I believe you less now. Still a good story.

>> No.74217798

It's not an argument because you're just a retard with no reading comprehension, so I'm just calling you a retard. Reread the reply thread and try your best.

>> No.74217807

Was...was he also a Sonic fanboy during the 90s? Yknow, one of "those" types of sonic fanboys?

>> No.74217813

I love Abnett more than I love 40k retard. I don't think the secondaries who have a skewed meme version of 40k will be happy with a story that has actual human elements in it.

>> No.74217823

Fuck if I know, I stopped trying to talk to him after he regurgitated Arch warhammers opinion about the new boxset for a game he doesn't play to me, and he got fired so quickly I hardly had time to learn anything else about him.

Wouldn't shock me at all though.

>> No.74217860

Abnett's human elements often feel misplaced within the setting, though. The best example I can think of is the relationship between Eisenhorn/Ravenor and their direct boss, the Inquisitor Lord dude. They're way too buddy-buddy with each other, as if they're all well-adjusted men with a healthy supervisor-employee relationship.

>> No.74217910 [DELETED] 

didn't you get told the last time

>> No.74217913

The characters being human makes it meaningful when the grimdark thing happens to them. Eisenhorn being well adjusted and having friends means it emotionally registers when he becomes corrupted and loses them all. If he was a a cardboard cutout lunatic I don't think I would care very much when he switched sides to continue being a cardboard cutout lunatic.

>> No.74217936 [DELETED] 

Didn't you get BTFO?

>> No.74217960

this right here brushes up against on of the biggest defenses you can give to GW and their policy of "things are inconsistent but everything is still canon" and that's because two things that are often in opposition are trying to be done at the same time. 1) the game developers and lore writers are trying to make a SETTING that has a particular FEEL to it and 2) the novel writers are trying to write a STORY and need to be able to use all of the tools available to them to make their stories interesting, satisfying, what-have-you

>> No.74218068

Baldermort is based as fuck.

>> No.74218555

I agree and this leads back to my problem with people who primarily consume 40k through wikis. Having an encyclopedic knowledge of 40k ingredients doesn't matter if you have no idea how to put them together to make a decent dish.

>> No.74218692

Daily Reminder that the Lorefag-Meme is a psyop, altough I have no idea by who. I don't like selling my kidneys to buy armies, so I just play the FFG Games. Their stuff is more fun than like 65% of Black Library anyway. Only interacting with the setting through Youtube and Wikis is cringe tough, atleast write fanfiction or do something with it.

>> No.74220278

Not to mention the wikis and Youtube have a terrible track record of highlighting whatever makes for the best clickbait, not represent business as usual in 40k

Daemonculaba for example. That was one time, but you wouldn't believe it from listening to the meme secondaries

>> No.74220516

I fucking hate that dumbasses infected this board with that retarded /v/ buzzword, especially because it obfuscates and delegitimizes what could otherwise be (somewhat) more meaningful discussion about stupid assholes who only watch youtube lore videos and think of themselves as fans of *insert thing*

>> No.74220561

>”embodies lots of themes of the world we actually live in.”
Fuck, he might as well compared it to fucking The Royal, or literally fucking anything.

>> No.74221587

how different is the source from the memes. what misconceptions do they get from them?

>> No.74222099

What is it about secondaries that is so annoying? it is hard to put my finger on.

>> No.74222517

The absolute confidence that they have while saying things that are just wrong, like the millions of people going "X behaviour could never happen in the Imperium, it would be blammed immediately" while ignoring that chaos cults literally exist and operate in secret on Terra itself

>> No.74222583

>people take it like it's the word of god and not as a joke wiki.
jesus do they. i got a friend into 40k at the end of 8th and he keeps telling me about how iron warriors are the most reasonable/ logical of csm and how dark eldar are actually worse than chaos

>> No.74222598

best ones are those who say that blacks wouldn't exist because they would be abhumans and get shot or at least be shit on

>> No.74222642

BL Writers write the lore for the rulebooks. Is 40k no longer canon to itself?

>> No.74222667

It's a meme.

>> No.74222676

Ah yes, the heroic /pol/ secondary, bere to save us from the evil left wing bringing politics into warhammer. How will they save us? By bringing even more fringe politics into warhammer.

>> No.74222679

Never has been. Customise your hobby.

>> No.74222929

And pig-like

>> No.74223228

and then they go on to brag about how warhammer can steamroll every other sci-fi setting which just shows the only sci-fi they know is ones youtubers have made videos on. warhammer is a strong sci-fi universe but its easy to tell that it having super strong characters is the only thing they care about and not the settings themes and shit.

>> No.74223248

The picture is kind of odd actually. It's his facial expression, if his facial expression doesn't come across as "out of character" for him, you've not read the books.

>> No.74223278

The pictures were made before the book.
Abnett said he went through the dark heresy materials and just decided to write a book about those characters in the pictures.

>> No.74223482

Aaw now I feel bad for that remark. Sorry Anon. Yeah, I could agree. I basically grew up on his books so I'm admittedly a bit defensive about GG and such.

>> No.74223531

More or less. Meaningless drivel from neckbeard autists.

>> No.74223555

huh, interesting, every day's a lurnin' day.
I had always assumed the character came first.

>> No.74223623

No, he’s right. Coming from a video game might be the most normal form of introduction to the game if you don’t have friends in the game already. Being a faggy cunt about it certainly doesn't give you authority

>> No.74223933

No, and I bet that they'll blackface or stick a bunch of secondary and supporting characters in dresses to show their support for "diversity, since Midas and Medea won't be enough for the quotas. Aemos and Maxilla are probably the most likely candidates.

>> No.74224027

Imagine needing to gain self-worth from the fact that the fiction you enjoy has a higher power level

I mean Correct Media Preference confidence is already fucking stupid, and then you add something that isn't even a measure of quality

>> No.74224051

>being excited for a 40k series
>being excited for a 40k series with how other fantasy properties are being treated

>> No.74224139

Yes, I'm sure there will be secondaries complaining that the 40k series doesn't have enough raping in it. It's not a faithful representation of their idea of 40k if it doesn't have at least five rapes per episode, because as we know warhammer 40k is all about the constant raping.

>> No.74224187

zoom zoom

>> No.74224319

why dont you eat my CUM?

>> No.74224367

Are people like these capable of making any point that isn't, not just a strawman, but an obviously hyperbolic strawman?

>> No.74224453

I'd love to see him do more lore stuff, tho

>> No.74226850

yeah its really sad. I saw a vs battle video where it was 40k mechs vs halo and starcraft mechs instead of something equally matched like 40k vs transformers and the comments were full of secondaries replying with cringy memes.

>> No.74226904

1d4chan is bad too, le khornate grey knights and Matt Ward hate in 2020.

>> No.74229242

>Will his tv show help cure the cancer that is meme-only secondary fans?

Not at all. All it will do is create more content to be recirculated and inspire OC which will then be recirculated.

>> No.74230240


I'm glad it's still 1995. I had the most terrible dream that it was 2020 and boy were things shitty

>> No.74230264

p based that incels are about to get run out of yet another thing they loved

>> No.74230759

Bleh at least wheel of time isn't that great of a series to begin with. Don't know what he's on about adding more feminism into it, felt pretty feminist every time they kept complaining about men and how aes sedai (women) were the only ones to hold magic without going insane for several books.

Nynaeve tugged her braid

>> No.74232647

That didn't happen and you know it.

>> No.74232665

No, they're lefties after all. Everyone they disagree with is literally the worst person in the world according to them.

>> No.74235997

Yeah, once I had hopes for many new fantasy series, but now....

>> No.74236421

As much as I hate to say it, not only will it increase meme-only secondaries, it will triple pol tourism and the shitty bait that comes with fighting their dumbass "culture war" in everybody else's boards.
>woman and minority!!!! hobby under attack!!!!1!! tranny in gamestore!!!!!11!!!1!!
>muh sjws ruin fordeekay
already get too many replies. It was annoying enough a while back when it was announced some 40k comics were going to be published under the Marvel name and people shat up threads claiming the Mouse was going to buy GW; imagine the shitshow when we get something more than just a vague announcement.

>> No.74236566

Grimderp is for retards
Prove me wrong

>> No.74236752

I hope you realize the irony in what you just said

>> No.74236779

GW embraces that fandom with their nu-40k take.
Things will only get worse from here on out since the company doesn't even care about their setting.

>> No.74236783

Describe nu-40k.

>> No.74236830

GW looked at the newfound fanbase and success in Age of Sigmar and decided that they need to make 40k reach a broader audience. This is why there are numerous retcons and a drastic change in art style. Compare the image to the left (nu-40k) and the Karl Kopinski classic to the right.
One of the hallmark aspects of 40k, it's grittiness, is leaving the setting.
With the rise of Guilliman the Empire has been given a tiny bit of hope, whereas previously there was exactly none. All of a sudden there is a voice of reason and a mysterious new army of superhuman space warriors with all new technology suddenly rose.
This change is more dramatic to the lore than most people realise and it's all made to reach a broader audience and make kids' parents buy them shit for them.

Now I don't particularly care about the story and if it's progressing. To me 40k is a setting, but GW's new approach is trying to make into more of a story that is progressing and I'm sceptical what they're doing with it.

>> No.74236843

With that being said, for 9th edition GW seems to realise their mistake and is hopefully steering back into what defines 40k. An example is this newly released art piece for 9th.

>> No.74236850


>> No.74236856

Given their track record with their movie it's going to be shit and bring more shit fans to the game.

>> No.74236857

I was about to post this as well, but I chose the one with Guilliman instead. I love this direction they're taking. It's great.

>> No.74236859

The Death Guard on the right was never well represented with models, though. The design works great in a big illustration, it reads poorly on a 28mm mini.

>> No.74236872

Sure, there's a big aspect of that. I'm just personally not a fan of the cartoony-styled-tentacles and bright colours, but it does appeal to lots of different folks which is their aim.

>> No.74237074

The choice to use a lot of contrasting colors probably has more to do with quickly directing attention to the details in a store, rather than any changing opinion on what constitutes artistic merit.

Left immediately makes you go "Oh shit what is that thing", while the right at 28mm scale would be more of a slow burn, a "Brown blob......... wait oh shit what is that"

>> No.74237213

99% sure that it will be shit like Witcher, but cattle will consume it

>> No.74237224

I don't think left wingers are the worst people in the world, I think they're just idiots.

>> No.74237441

I see what you're saying and I agree with you. It is hard but it is possible to paint that stuff to look good on models.
You just have to know what you're doing.

>> No.74241111

Wait wait, Eisenhorn is getting a TV show?

>> No.74241206

It's in development with the dude who did A Man in High Castle. I don't think anyone's actually picked it up yet.

>> No.74242879

Really cool if true, I loved that show, and I really like Eisenhorn.

>> No.74242976


>> No.74243168

so no, you didn’t recognize the irony in constructing a hyperbolic strawman in response to someone complaining about the construction of hyperbolic strawmen. I’m not even going to bother asking you to return to social media because this is the place for retards like you now, my own personal hell that I may never escape. Post more I love it.

>> No.74243266

the "secondary" thing started with touhoufags, so that just about tells you how much you should pay attention to people who use the term.

>> No.74243316

This is quality seethe. As a connoisseur of seethe, can I screencap your post sir?

>> No.74243326

>dark eldar are actually worse than chaos
...it's a pretty fucking meaningless distinction either way.

>> No.74243475

Shut up shill

>> No.74243521

No, it will spawn a 3rd group of TV-show-only tertiary fans who will compare the entire rest of the franchise to the TV show. You'll be begging the meme-only fans to come back.

>> No.74243569

Did you even read what I posted previously? I am criticising GW you retard.

>> No.74243623

At least we'll have radical hoverboards by then.

>> No.74243628

I've been here since the day /tg/ was made and I don't have any social media. Don't get angry because people point out commonly observed behaviour. It's not a hyberbolic strawman, it's simply what they do.

>> No.74243632

What? No. Fuck no. It's going to be Dawn of War all over again.

>> No.74243667

>the "secondary" thing started with touhoufags
There should be a mandatory lurk only period.

>> No.74243703

"I love the direction there taking" doesn't sound like criticism to me but what do I know can just read English

>> No.74243750

>pillow friends out the wazoo
I don't care what setting you've been handed, this phrase warrants immediate termination.

>> No.74243767

At least the show-only tertiaries will have been exposed to one cohesive story set in 40k.

>> No.74243772

Agreed somewhere in the region of
a decade and a straight lifetime ban for misuse of board slang

>> No.74243822

No, the definition is a member of the fanbase who criticizes the primary medium in comparison to a secondary medium, thus secondary. For instance, bitching about the board game's rules not reflecting how overpowered the daemonhosts are in Eisenhorn are would be secondary shit. It doesn't matter how they were introduced to the setting.

Name (leave empty)
Comment (leave empty)
Password [?]Password used for file deletion.