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[ERROR] No.72659542 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Since everyone seems to hate every edition of Exalted, has anyone found success in some of the homebrews like pic related?

>> No.72659846

>>72659542
Based on my own experiences, there are two consistent ways to enjoy Exalted. You can read copious amounts of fluff and never actually play the game. Or you can luck out and get a group of friends, or at least people you don't mind spending hours around, willing to either play along with and chuckle at the clunky mechanics or gut them and use something simpler and make some judgement calls on which fluff you want to use and which you don't/just want to ignore.

The same mostly applies to homebrews. There are some people who hate, say, EarthScorpion's Lunars retool with a passion because it allegedly cribs from Infernals. There are others who like it for that reason, or because the Lunars are less pushovers mechanically.

Anyway, I haven't tried Qixalted but like any TTRPG I think having a good group is more important than anything. It just so happens to be doubly so with Exalted given how many issues 3e's development seems to have run into.

>> No.72659904

>>72659542
Does it fix the fact that PCs are encouraged to specialize in wildly different, incompatible areas to the point that nobody else but similarly dedicated specialists can contribute to anything they set out to do?

>> No.72659907

>>72659542
Dead setting. Who cares?

>> No.72660028

>>72659846
My main issue with 3e is that it takes too long to read and by the time you are actually in a place to understand the system and run it without having to look up rules, you could have spent it doing something enjoyable.

>>72659904
Yes, all versions of Qwixalted fix this and so did the 1e quickstart that provided for it. It's actually so strange that 2e and 3e keep running into this issue when they had the solution this entire time.

>> No.72660174

>>72659904
Not in the slightest. It's a heavily cut version of 1e with most systems removed but skills are the same, there's just 15 of them instead of 25 (they're grouped differently). No appreciable change in areas of expertise being vastly different

>> No.72660187

>>72660028
How does it fix it?

>> No.72660206

>>72660174
What makes you say that? XP costs are vastly reduced for getting new abilities so there's no intrinsic reason not to diversify yourself. The average dicepool of a professional mortal in Extended is 2

>> No.72660235

>>72660206
Pretty sure you could say that about normal Exalted with slightly less bad rate of advancement. Look at the NPCs, they're all broadly proficient, it's the PCs that never are.

>> No.72660265

>>72659542
I don't understand why people hate every edition.

We played for a solid year on the 2nd Edition and we were really having a blast, despite the confusing mechanics. (Then again we were new to Exalted.)

I think having a group you enjoy playing with is the N°1 factor in how much you enjoy a game.

>> No.72660268

>>72659542
Quixated is nice, but even the cut-down keyword charms can't capture the full extent of the splats (despite the regular splat charms being awful). You need to use it as a base and make your own modifications, or a lot of splats will feel samey.

>> No.72660276

>>72660235
I'm not exactly seeing the issue here because this sort of seems like to me an issue with Player's wanting to min max and not diversify their skillset (aka most systems)

Jarvis and Daiklave from what I hear had it so that all Exalts simplify it a lot more. In that, if you had Twilight 4, you'd have every single ability associated with Twilight at that level. But you also had Dawn, Zenith and Night at lower but still present levels too. Maybe that's what you mean?

>> No.72660294

>>72660268
I definitely agree. It's a shame that no one knows the anon who made it, because he might have made further homebrew/guidelines for it. Otherwise I'm personally a little lost as to how I should meaningfully differentiate between the splats without just apeing straight from 3e

>> No.72660303

>>72660294
I tried making a Qixalted based on 1e and I realised each splat needed a few more keywords, but to help I have this

>> No.72660313

>>72660303
whoops

>> No.72660551

>>72660028
Honestly this, mostly I'm just annoyed by how making Initiative into a gameplay abstraction makes actual gameplay and feats in the game feel...a bit too abstract.

Well, that and the Crafting system somehow got even more unnecessarily convoluted

>> No.72660592

>>72660313
Why not put Overwhelming into General category if everyone has it anyway?

>> No.72660628
File: 180 KB, 500x405, 1517385216792.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72660628

>>72660551
>that part where it tells you Charms are just gameplay abstractions and no one says "Monkey Leap Technique" in character

>> No.72660630

>>72660592
The thing is that each splat actually has slightly different dice-adders to different limits, like how Dragon-Blooded double the dice they get from their dice-adding charms but only up to their Attribute+Specialty. But that granularity wasn't included for some reason.

>> No.72660643

>>72660628
Charms are the weakest aspect of Exalted since everyone needs them to differentiate themselves as heroes but there are so many of them and many are poorly designed.

>> No.72660797

>>72660628
>No one says "Monkey Leap Technique" in character

Wait, they don't? We all did that.

>> No.72660883

>>72660628
This part isn't consistent. 2e says Ghost-Eating Technique was developed for fighting Primordials after all. Also, martial arts styles, Sidereal especially look like the charms are actually an in-setting thing.

>> No.72660905

>>72660883
>Exalted
>inconsistent
You don't say.

>> No.72660907

>>72660905
Well, yeah. It's not really a surprise

>> No.72660946
File: 208 KB, 398x1089, Charms3e.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72660946

>>72660797
3e dwelled on it pretty hard and pretty much just said "no, don't call them this"

>> No.72665119

>gives rules for playing Primordials

Oh no no no...

>> No.72666150

>>72659542
Here I have the character sheets.
minus DBs and Yozys for watever reason

>> No.72666178

>>72659542
fuck off mite

>> No.72667858

>>72659542
2e fluff, exwod rules.

>> No.72668443

Anyone has Blood and fire?

>> No.72668578

>>72667858
>2e fluff

Why?

>> No.72668972

>>72660276
>with Player's wanting to min max and not diversify their skillset (aka most systems)
Problem is this is exacerbated in Exalted due to anything of worth having requirements of "Be specialized in this or you'll never have it". Requirements for Charms frequently have enormous jumps in reqs or essence despite the effects remaining relatively simple. NPC's diversify because they have to "live" in the world, otherwise every NPC would be "Sword Autist" or "Social Autist", with little inbetween, and players wouldn't be able to make any real progress because those autists would outnumber them grossly. It'd be like if every socialite in a game was minmaxed, and you had to be too just to be on an even playing field, which is a fucking disaster for games in general.

>> No.72669019

>>72660628
Thats a 3Eism which doesn't make sense in the slightest. Like a lot of 3E's changes.

tl;dr The guys who wrote 3E, and the actual game of Exalted, are two very different things. They infested the game with woke-ass garbage and added in a bunch of trash that was literal fanfiction they dreamed up that was never there before. 3E is as close to actual Exalted as the tip of your dick is to the moon.

>> No.72669097

>>72668972
That's fair. Extended fixes that issue I think; it relies less on you having high Traits in the thing you're getting unless you want to have the crazy good stuff.

Lunars book went a long way to fixing the minimum stat requirements for Charms too in fairness.

>> No.72669153

>>72669097
Lunars use a different, more expensive metric, because their stuff is keyed off Attributes and not skills. Honestly the real issue is the 3E core-ALL of it-Needs a rewrite. And the current dev's don't want to errata the fucking thing or fix a damn thing in the slightest. So we're back at the same issue 2E had: The core book is completely fucked, and every other book is building on this shitty foundation. They might look better in comparison, but none of the actual issues of the game will be solved.

>> No.72669211

>>72669153
The devs actually do want to rewrite core, but management is telling them that they can't. That's why they're doing a soft rewrite of Craft in Crucible of Legends- I can't blame those guys for it, they got fucked over big time.

>> No.72670455

>>72669211
IIRC the real reason is "lol not being paid for it". Which, OK, sure. Not being paid.

But fuck, at least put out an errata or something, you useless shits. They spend more time answering retarded shit from bluehairs too worried about tranny shit than fixing the fucking issues in the game. If they can sit around in Discord playing dangerhair retard wrangler, they can FIX. THE FUCKING. BOOK.

>> No.72671325

>no scene long charms
>but paced says you can extend charm effects

So which one is it?

>> No.72671631

>>72668443
Here you go, friendo. Also, I'm the author, so I'm happy to answer any questions.

>> No.72671654
File: 717 KB, 1620x800, alchemical_castes_by_meluran_d2kca5j.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72671654

>>72659542
My group switched to Godbound. Not a perfect translation, but we all have adapted to the new system, and it runs much faster.

I'm interested in Qwixalted, though, if only because I would love to run an Alchemicals/Autochthonia campaign.

>>72668578
Not that anon, but each edition has a certain feel to it, regardless of the outlier stuff. 2e had some stupid outliers, but the overall feel was really good.

>> No.72671857

>>72671631
Thanks I'll give it a read!

>> No.72671950

>>72671654
>Not that anon, but each edition has a certain feel to it, regardless of the outlier stuff. 2e had some stupid outliers, but the overall feel was really good.

For those not in the know
1e was pulp mythology
2e was anime high fantasy
3e is sword and sorcery a la Conan, but they're slowly trying to undo it for the new stuff.

>> No.72672014

>>72671631
No questions just yet. But from my initial skim: art is pretty good in most places, and layout looks nice!

>> No.72672258

>>72672014
Thanks! The art is mostly donations from artist friends, a couple of commissions, and some stock art/CC licensed art.

>> No.72672335
File: 209 KB, 960x322, 16kenu3mqn521.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72672335

>>72659542
Was Autochthonia and the Locust Crusade all just one big Palinka Effect reference?

>> No.72677469

bumpity bump

>> No.72680151

>>72671325
It basically means that you can't have scene long perfects or dice adders since that stuff is mechanically super relevant to fighting

But you could have charms that let you walk on water, go without sleep and delay a wound from hurting you for a millennia. But you couldn't say, make all wounds that scene be delayed for a millennia unless you paid each and every turn.

>> No.72681286

>>72672335
I thought that was the Raksha as a whole

>> No.72683047

>>72660797
it upset the new devs, they thought it was silly. this is a serious game of explaining serious social issues of transgenderism

>> No.72683059

>>72660883
thats cause its 3e bullshit

>> No.72684092

how much "xp" should npcs typically have? whats a good number of ability dots for a mortal hero? a professional soldier? some conscripted baker about to be put into tigerwarrior training? a sorcerer?

how many procedures is reasonable for a pre-3e thaumaturge?

how many charms on a pre-3e martialartist, just up to the form? one full style/multiple styles to the form? two or more mastered styles? does this change if a pc adopts them as a minion hoping to teach more or is their potential pretty much tapped short of the pc using specialized lore charms?

>> No.72684462

>>72684092
If you're talking about Qwixalted, it gives character creation rules for heroic mortals.

Otherwise, most professional mortals in the setting have 2 dice pools and one or presumably none for things they aren't trained in, so they're pretty much down to a Chance die.

>> No.72685490

>>72680151
you don't need to pay each turn you can pay once every (X) turns.

>> No.72686278

>>72685490
That makes literally no sense with the sidebar. Could you show your working, anon?

>> No.72686649
File: 143 KB, 720x678, x turns.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72686649

>>72686278
Here it's clearly written that in dramatic time (combat) you can pay once and have the effect active for (x) amount of turns, one of the examples is a martial arts attack with lasting effects.
The sidebar only explains why there is a distinction betwen dramatic and chronologic time.

>> No.72686752
File: 169 KB, 1280x720, 1509849187160.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72686752

>>72686649
Alright that actually makes way more sense than whatever shitty idea I had. Thank you based anon.

>> No.72686903

>>72686752
Don't worry it feels good knowing that I helped!

>> No.72687636

>>72660883
The main thing that's changed is that Exalts don't instinctively know what the book calls their charms and honestly, two characters talking about their charm purchases in-character is pretty cringe.

>> No.72687782

>>72687636
I must say that I also cringed when character talked about charms, maybe there could be somekind of middle ground.
Like talking about thechniqes or solar magic/powers

>> No.72687797

>>72687636
That’s because they shouldn’t be doing it casually. It’s like you’ve never seen a king fu movie. The whole reason powers for those flowery names is one of the devs told Grabowski when he was making Charms ‘no no these need martial arts movie technique names’. You’re not supposed to discuss your moves like collectible trading cards, you’re supposed to swoon and gasp at how cool someone is so they can tell you how they spend six months meditating under a cherry blossom before learning the Peony Blossom Technique in a moment of enlightenment.

>> No.72687943

>>72668578
2e was more refined than 1e, but is more complete than 3e. Plus it's what I'm more familiar with, so naturally that makes it better.

>> No.72688007

>>72687943
I personally prefer a mix of 1E and 2E lore, with Lunars being my own personal reinterpretation mixing all three editions since they’re not very good in any edition

>> No.72688245

>>72688007
I kinda do the same.
I'm my ver of lunars they are more like wardens of creation against chaos where the fairfolk keep trying to conquer/destroy creation and the lunars holding them back and that's mostly why they aren't as active in creation as a whole but now with the realm crumbling and the return of their mates the lunars are faltering in their defence and abandoning their posts and leaving creation open for invation.

>> No.72688765

>>72660946
>>72660797
The problem was that in the 2e autist days, things were increasingly written like Charms were magic black boxes somehow separate from the actual character in-universe, but the whole point of them in the first place was to represent learned techniques rather than D&D-esque spells.


>>72669019
>doesn't make sense in the slightest

It makes perfect sense. Monkey Leap Technique in Exalted is meant to represent the same kind of thing as, say, the Cloud Jump feat in Pathfinder: it's a technique you can recognize people performing, and they might even put a name on it... but it's an abstraction over a supernatural use of talent, not a specific piece of magic that is in-universe always identical between all characters that have the same mechanical element.

Or, to put it another way, real-world people who know extremely esoteric martial arts techniques know the the same technique, but they don't literally have a 'spend 1 fatigue point, get result' module installed, and that's what 2e autists were increasingly treating Charms like towards the end of the edition.

>> No.72688923
File: 589 KB, 1303x883, Charms.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72688923

>>72688765
>but the whole point of them in the first place was to represent learned techniques rather than D&D-esque spells.

The distinction isn't very meaningful, especially for the more abstract Charms. An Excellence is a broad-enough power that you could quibble its meaning, but things like Life-Extending Prana or Glorious Solar Plate are clearly things in-universe, magics that were learned and researched to create. Pic related is from First Edition, and is more or less exactly what you're complaining of as a 'late 2E-ism'

>> No.72688953

>>72688765
>and that's what 2e autists were increasingly treating Charms like towards the end of the edition.
Because thats what Charms always were even in 1E. They were distinct, developed techniques. Thats why the fluff sometimes spoke of lost or custom ones that could do things. It's a fucking retarded change, because now everyone just has "lol i dunno i jus do dis" as an answer for every fucking thing, despite the fact we all damn well know thats not how it fucking works in Exalted.

3E is disgustingly shit on so many fronts and actively as poisonous to the game as 2E, maybe even moreso because the brain damaged, battered "wives" neckbeards defend it mindlessly because "new gud, old bad". Except in this case it's old bad, and new bad. 3E's a fucking failure.

>> No.72689238

>>72688953
>They were distinct, developed techniques.

There's a huge difference between 'technique' and 'black box effect where you put magic in one side and get an effect out the other side, and can study it separate from the person using it', and the 2autism that needed pushback was the latter.

>> No.72689239

>>72688765
>but it's an abstraction over a supernatural use of talent.

That's an Excellency.

>> No.72689278
File: 2.98 MB, 384x288, 1585895100822.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72689278

>>72689238
>techniques can't be studied independantly of a person

>> No.72689350
File: 323 KB, 719x1000, 1568262639002.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72689350

Alright so I've played a session as Zenith alongside a Night and Twilight and we've actually had a lot of fun with this.

Are there any good cheese tactics for this though?

>> No.72689374

>>72689238
The distinction between 'technique' and 'spell' in this context is largely the activation trigger. You activate an Excellence by focusing essence while swinging a sword. Its natural like breathing, you don't think 'Peony Technique ACTIVATE'. But even this blurs on some powers. In universe Glorious Solar Plate absolutely is activated by thinking 'Glorious Solar Plate ACTIVATE'. Charms which enhance a mundane action could be read as merely an enhancement that follows any number of interpretations [like how one studies swordplay and combines stances and moves] but others are absolutely distinct individual superpowers or 'spells' in the manner you're viewing them and always have been.

>> No.72689390

>>72689350
Build a base of operations. Zenith-Twilight sync very well for building a fortress/religion/city-state/thieves guild/whatever, and the Night can protect it.

>> No.72689573

>>72687636
>>72687782
You guys are no fun.

>> No.72689910

>>72689238
If you develop or study it, it isn't a black box.
But even if they were black boxes, calling them abstractions doesn't actually change that because there's no mechanical effect!

>> No.72691605

>>72689239
The entire Solar skill set is doing normal things impossibly well to an ever increasing degree of esotericism and impossibility

>> No.72692479

>>72689350
performance is the best form of social, and if you're playing 3e there is like 6 charms in the craft section that when combined average of like 400 successes at ess 2 int 5 craft 5 and exceptional tools.
https://www.reddit.com/r/exalted/comments/8nioxo/craft_system_3rd_edition_why_people_went_crazy/

>> No.72692548

>>72692479
I think he is talking about qwixalted

>> No.72692631

>>72692548
no
this is now exalted general thread
it means we are talking about 3e
qwixalted is ripping off essence and is for faggots
all hail our transsexual overlords

>> No.72693408

>>72692631
essence is ripping off quicksalted you fagele

>> No.72693518

>>72688953
>It's a fucking retarded change, because now everyone just has "lol i dunno i jus do dis" as an answer for every fucking thing, despite the fact we all damn well know thats not how it fucking works in Exalted.

Man you sound like the most pedantic, fat faggot in existence if *this* is what has you meltdown and declare 2E to be superior. My dude just chill the fuck out and maybe go play godbound or something, being a 2E Death Cultist isn't healthy or happy.

>> No.72693552

>>72689238
iirc in 1e charms were basically blackbox macros that let you cheat the usual magic process. despite dev claims charms are fixed rigid things even in 3e, else you could stunt the jump charm into a super kick charm instead, something explicitly forbidden. charm progression makes no sense if they arent "feed x motes to get y effect" machinery since so many are only minor extensions of what you could do before that any reasonable person wouldnt need to buy if things were flexible and instinctive to the point solars dont even recognize themselves as having them.

>> No.72693562

>>72693518
>call 2E shit, because it is shit
>durr ur a 2E death cultist
3Etards are beyond salvation if they're this retarded.

>> No.72693586

>>72693552
That's retarded though.

They don't need to be codified techniques, even if that's how the system chooses to abstract them. It's not like everyone in Creation who can jump a dozen feet in the air is using Monkey Leap Technique, Solars or not.

>> No.72693669

>>72693562
>3E is disgustingly shit on so many fronts and actively as poisonous to the game as 2E, maybe even moreso
>maybe even moreso

You're still a 2E Death Cultist. Of course 2E is shit, but it was shit your broken brain conditioned itself to like, something like Stockholm syndrome or some bitch being NTR'd by an Ugly Bastard. Just go back to your hole and jack off about Paranoia Combat and Solid Gold Motepunk over there instead of shitting up the thread, you sensitive fucking flower.

Or else learn not to have a minor meltdown each and every time someone else disputes the dogshit you call an opinion.

>> No.72693698

>>72693408
Sounds like someone's in denial. Maybe nice nice girldick?

>> No.72693724
File: 62 KB, 193x231, youdensemotherfucker.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72693724

There's really no way a person who played 2E's system and 3E's system can, in good faith, claim that somehow 3E's is just as bad or even worse than 2E. At best they're just engaged in convoluted apologism for shit like Paranoia Combos and Social Combat without trying to be too obvious about their shilling.

>> No.72693736

There's one weird trick to repel any exalted player. First, mention ticks. If that doesn't work, whip out a picture of Holden and Rich T. Just like Vampires.

>> No.72693824

>>72693736
I had to keep track of ticks even when I wasn't the GM for my 2E group, because everyone else kept fucking it up or struggled to comprehend it.

Holden at least made ExWoD, so I'll probably decide to forgive him if Morke ever rapes someone someday.

>> No.72693866

>>72693724
wrong

>> No.72696317

Is this the Exalted general? What happened to the Exalted general?

>> No.72696413

>>72696317
A new one hasn't been made yet.

>> No.72696646

>>72696317
Mage shitposters swarmed over again and people wouldn't stop engaging them. Nothing but shitposts, no exalted content. WoD wins again.

>> No.72696942

>>72668578
Bad taste

>> No.72696990

>>72687797
Someone that fucking gets it.

>> No.72697831

>>72692631
But 3e is cumbersome and boring to learn and even more boring to play.

>> No.72697843

>>72697831
YOU DO NOT GET A CHOICE
OPEN YOUR HEART TO DIVERSITY (and 3e)

>> No.72698141

>>72696317
Killed by a mage(fag).

>> No.72698298
File: 128 KB, 814x438, 1578304168640.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72698298

>solar without ghost-eating technique

>> No.72698341
File: 14 KB, 417x344, 1520275922364.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72698341

>twilight without sorcery

>> No.72698595
File: 13 KB, 220x253, Joseph Kucan.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72698595

>dawn without penis envy

>> No.72698622
File: 22 KB, 480x472, 1583652594254.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72698622

>Dragonblooded without gender dysphoria

>> No.72699019
File: 10 KB, 200x200, 1503936750251.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72699019

>sidereal with an apparent age of greater than 2

>> No.72700436
File: 814 KB, 1307x528, celestial bliss trick.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72700436

>solar without celestial bliss trick

>> No.72700642

>>72692631
Isn't Qwixalted really old? Like, 12 or so years old by this point.
And the fuck is Essense anyway?

>> No.72700763

>>72700642
>And the fuck is Essense anyway?
It's the official lighter and simpler alternative to 3E that's in the works.

>> No.72700821

>>72692631
When is Essence coming out anyway?

>> No.72700973

>>72700821
Never.

>> No.72701376

>>72700642
This Qwixalted was made very recently. There's three versions

>Jarvis, incredibly rules lite d6
>Daiklaive, less rules lite. d6
>Extended, even less rules lite and involves a few dice tricks. d10
>Essence, a less rules lite 3e

>> No.72701667

>>72701376
I hope Essence has some rules for simplifying Charms that can be retooled, Qwixalted has a good base, but kind of over-simplifies stuff that isn't Solars.

>> No.72701761

>>72701667
Essence will have universal charms but will also had a lot more native charms. I Qwixalted's biggest downfall is that you actually have to end up reading the books to find some good charm inspiration and then just honing them down. I as an ST can do that, but my players might not know where to look.

Pondering whether someone should make a homebrew doc of created charms, and if that someone should be not me

>> No.72701844

>>72659542
I wrote a PbtA hack for Exalted that I'm reasonably happy with (always room for improvement). The big thing I like about that system is how it's really good at enforcing tone and theme though it's mechanics. It's allowed me to write the Greek tragedy that Grabowski always wanted.

>> No.72701870

>>72701761
I basically crapped out when I tried to adapt Lunar charms to it. Not only are most lunar charms crap, most rely on some sort of detailed full vs partway shape-shifting to achieve a goal or stat change.

>> No.72701937

>>72701870
You should try Extended then, I know jarvis had a few issues with the sameyness.

>> No.72702488

>>72701844
Share it, bro.

>> No.72704709

>>72665119
Not complete rules. What the fuck is 'power' in relation to the Primordials?

>> No.72705418

>>72704709
It does have complete rules or what is missing?

>> No.72705483
File: 14 KB, 440x255, Primordial Power.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
72705483

>>72705418
This is the only time Power is brought up in reference to Primordial Health Levels.

>> No.72705869

>>72668972
>Sword Autist
I've heard this a lot, what does it mean?

>> No.72705922

>>72705869
It's because in Exalted you really are encouraged to dedicate yourself entirely to a concept so that you're viable.

Also tangentially related to the fact that as specialisations you can do "Sword", so you can take three specialisations for Melee as 'Sword' to get 3 bonus dice on every single roll where you use a Sword...which is fucked up.

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