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Pathfinder General /pfg/

If you are asking for build advice, please mention which third-party books are allowed.

Unified /pfg/ link repository: http://pastebin.com/sYFe4hcd

Previous Thread: >>44417615

Shilling Is Over Edition

>> No.44422772

To balance spellcasters is to make it unnatural and taboo

>> No.44422794

redistribute the magics of production from the spellbarons of capitalism to the martial proletariat that allowed them to gain their first two levels

>> No.44422809


Alright, more work has been done on the Fusilier (And especially the additional discoveries that are not limited to it.)

It is, however, still very much a work in progress. Any thoughts on general power/issues would be highly appreciated.

The Fusilier is a warrior-alchemist, working without extracts but with great skill with blade, bomb and gun.

>> No.44422820

Commoners of the world unite! You have nothing to lose but your NPC status!

>> No.44422870

Gonna DM my first PF game soon, should I allow any third party books?
I told them to pick anything they want as long as they avoid those weeby looking alternative classes and hybrid classes.
Unchained should be fine right? Or should I even urge them to use the unchained version since it's basically rebalanced.
I'm also seeing unchained sections in skills sections.

Anyway, how do I make it more attractive to play a fighter?
Casters sound like they'd be the most fun but I'd rather not have my group be 5 wizards.

>> No.44422905

Ohhh boy there's a lot /pfg/ will say to you.

tl;dr unchained is absolutely recommended for monk and rogue and if someone plays a non-unchained monk/rogue they will be awful.
Summoner and Barbarians are optional.

Fighter is still generally awful, a bit less awful with weapon master's handbook, but still takes a surprising amount of effort and knowledge to become an actually good build, and not recommended for beginners (or well, anyone really).

Characters without magic being much worse and less fun than characters with magic is one of the big flaws of pathfinder.

/pfg/'s favourite third party books are Dreamscarred Press' Path of War and Psionics and they would argue that the balance they provide is actually better. (Martials are strong and fun to play, psionic casters are harder to get wrong but also harder to make stupid overpowered)
The big thing to realise as a new GM to pathfinder is that just because Paizo is 'first party', by no means does it mean they're actually good at their job, and the core rules are riddled with problems that you just kind of need to use experience to get a feel of.

Also most of the alt/hybrid classes are pretty good.

>> No.44422906

Allow path of war. It encourages fighters and is generally good.

>> No.44422930

>Anyway, how do I make it more attractive to play a fighter?
Advanced Weapon Training from the Weapon Master's Handbook.

>> No.44422952

The hybrid classes aren't weeb at all and the alternate classes are in fact (other than antipaladin) eastern inspired yes.

>> No.44422962

How do play 15 Point Buy? Summon Monster all day?

>> No.44422972

Ideally you don't.

>> No.44423015

I'll check out those books, Already have a guy willing to play a fighter, he seems much more focussed on proper RP than building a strong character luckily.
What other game systems would you recommend if PF turns too wizardly at some point?
Yeah I meant the alternate ones look weeby, I don't have fantasy japan in my setting. Hybrids just look like they'd complicate things or make other classes pointless. People can multiclass if they want to be part wizard, part sorceror.
I'm going with rolling and assigning myself, using standard fantasy
Pointbuy just sounds like it'd turn into minmaxing shitfest.

>> No.44423033

5e is very similar to 3.5/PF if you don't enjoy PF

Casters are still casters but the imbalance is a lot less obvious

>> No.44423049

>People can multiclass if they want to be part wizard, part sorceror.

This is saying "people can fuck themselves over if they want, I don't care".

I mean, arcanist was one of the least needed class from the ACG, but you still sound like a stupid douche.

>> No.44423059

>People can multiclass if they want to be useless

FTFY. You DO realize that is basically guaranteed to make you useless unless you know what you're doing, right? And that goes double for anything more than a dip or if you're a full caster.

>> No.44423097

I've got like 16 gold left on my new level 1 stalker. Any suggestions for miscellaneous equipment I might not have already? It has to be able to survive prolonged exposure to seawater.

>> No.44423110

>Pointbuy will turn into a minmaxing shitfest
People being able to build their characters they way they want to isn't a min-maxing shit fest. Not to mention trying to make an effective character mechanically shouldn't be thought of as wrong. The ability to roleplay and to contribute to the game is only enhanced when your character is good at his role and is weakened when he finds out he can't do his job as effectively.

>> No.44423124

>weeby looking
> how do I make it more attractive to play a fighter
>4 replies
Come on /pfg/, invest more skillpoints in perception, that's obviously a bait.

>> No.44423148

>Any suggestions for miscellaneous equipment I might not have already?
Bag of chalk or flour.
>It has to be able to survive prolonged exposure to seawater.
Well shit. I guess there are no polyethylene bags?

>> No.44423209


>> No.44423212

I think you should FUCKING LEARN HOW TO PLAY THE GAME before you waste anyone's time as a DM you inbred fucktard.

Fuck you and fuck anyone in this thread replying to you.

>> No.44423239


>> No.44423248

Oh, you're right. We should spend the thread coddling him and being trolled. This is Gaming+ where everyone is a precious flower.

>> No.44423256

I'm learning the game right here and now, asking questions and having people clear things up.
What manner of moron are you?

>> No.44423261

>I'm learning the game right here and now

Holy shit this really is the end of the hobby.

Fuck it, I'm out. Enjoy your troll thread.

>> No.44423264

Nobody is coddling him.
We're telling him why he's wrong without being dicks about it.

We were all new once.

(I do think 5e is probably more suited to the game he wants though;half the appeal in pathfinder is the characterbuild variety)

>> No.44423277

My DM allows Sacred Geometry. NPCs use it too. How do I best use it? I think to pick it in place of regular metamagic feats.

>> No.44423281

Step 1: Pass basic math.

Step 2: Your wizard is now literally invincible.

>> No.44423289

I already completed both steps. The question is, what metamagic feats are useful aside from your usual Dazing/Empower/Maximize/Quicken?

>> No.44423299


>NPCs use it too
>GM can better justify using a calculator because of all the NPCs he has to manage at once

This better be an all-out hyper power wizarding war.
Which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

Generally you can go a long way turning a broken thing into a not broken thing by simply letting everyone have it.
Sucks for the party martials in this case though.

>> No.44423301

Past a certain number of skill ranks for each spell level, it is mathematically impossible to not roll the proper numbers. I forget exactly how many for most of them, but for 9th level spells you require 14 ranks to be impossible to fail.

So as far as metamagic is concerned, Dazing, Empower, Maximise, Quicken. You can also roll with Silent and Still if you want to troll people by casting your spells functionally without visible components. Beyond that, just grab whatever metamagic looks useful.

>> No.44423306

>Benefit: Whenever a creature targeted by a persistent spell or within its area succeeds on its saving throw against the spell, it must make another saving throw against the effect. If a creature fails this second saving throw, it suffers the full effects of the spell, as if it had failed its first saving throw.
>Level Increase: +2 (a persistent spell uses up a spell slot two levels higher than the spell’s actual level.)

>> No.44423308

So what if the soul leave the body? That condition still doesn't prevent you from acting

>> No.44423312

Disruptive. Echoing. Intensified. Shit man, you have enough campaign time to test all of them out. It's not like the whole game isn't doomed to being a miserable fuckfest before it starts.

If there's a player not playing a full Wizard in that group, jesus fuck why even show up?

>> No.44423329

>all-out hyper power wizarding war.
It is, the closest to a "martial" in our party is the mesmerist, who is also the face and leader. And the GM does not uses a calculator, he just looks at the rolled dice, writes down the expression and tells us to roll saves. Always shows it to us when we ask. All under 20 seconds (I measured). Our blaster takes longer to calculate his damage. Like a wizard IRL.

>> No.44423347


Still/Silent for those pesky moments where you're bound and gagged.

Heighten/Persistent for DC shenanigans.

For mind-affecting stuff, Verdant (plants), Coaxing (oozes and vermin), Threnodic (Undead).

>> No.44423361

Is Psychic Duel the ultimate way to kill BBEG?

>> No.44423375

Not always. But it sure is a way to distract and lock him while your companions hack him to pieces.

>> No.44423379

>For mind-affecting stuff, Verdant (plants), Coaxing (oozes and vermin), Threnodic (Undead).
I'd take augment summoning line over that.

>> No.44423391

No. Any half-decent BBEG is going to be able to outclass you and probably kill you in one or two rounds within the psychic duel unless you completely build for it. BBEGs will also have servants that will shake them to allow them saves to leave the duel.psychic duels are only locks against completely solo targets.

>> No.44423406

Tenebrous Spell is pretty good as well, provided you can get the set up for it.
It'd be worth picking up.
Piercing isn't bad if you run into a lot of SR creatures.

>> No.44423407

> implying everyone doesn't already have augment summoning.

>> No.44423415

Also its a mind affecting spell so its very easy to get protection against psychic duels. Any time you could beat a will save and the SR of a BBEG you could do far far worse to them than a psychic duel.

>> No.44423421

>psychic duels are only locks against completely solo targets
Are they legal in PFS?

>> No.44423426

Don't you ever dare say that name in this place.

>> No.44423431

I remembered crane wing nerf thanks to PFS having mostly solo enemies with one attack.

>> No.44423472

it's pretty shitty when people try to normalize grays. they should be uncanny and unnerving, like pic related.

>> No.44423486

Nope. The spell is ban in PFS.

>> No.44423494

How to boost the amount of your skill ranks, aside from getting more INT, being a rogue or that trait from Legacy of Fire?

>> No.44423509

So, I wana play a dedicated caster/battlefield control character in an upcoming game... and I have no idea what I'm actually doing. I'm looking at either Wizard or Arcanist as my class, but I'd like some advice on how to get the most mileage out of these classes without reverting to just being a "blaster caster" who shoots fireballs the entire time.

>> No.44423516

Being human gives you one per level. You can spend your favored class bonus on them. There's a feat in ultimate psionics if thats allowed called open minded that gives 1 skill rank per level. INT boosting items can provide pseudo-ranks in certain skills.

>> No.44423522

Everything on the PFSRD allowed, but core races only. We'll be starting at level 5. So advice on how to start and then how to progress beyond that is helpful.

>> No.44423528

>I have no idea what I'm actually doing.
In that case, try reading a guide. There are links to guides in OP pasta.

>> No.44423533

First and most important thing is to discuss how illusions work with your DM. Many DMs hold that using spellcraft to identify the spell or putting your hand through etc is automatic disbelief and many also hold that just being too close to an illusion is "interacting with it" and "interacting" takes no action. If they believe this kind of crap DON'T USE ILLUSIONS.


Aside from that, spells like create pit, charm person, enlarge person (this one is cast on your allies), web, fog cloud and similar spells are what you should look into.

>> No.44423556

Spellcraft only identifies the illusion if you are seen casting it, according to my GM. Illusions include tactile and other sensations unless they're specifically mentioned not to.

"Interacting" with the illusion does not include just being "close" to it, unless the person in question suspects it's an illusion already, and even then they have to make a Will save or do some kind of "check" like "Detect Magic" to catch it.

>> No.44423637

That sounds more or less like how illusions are intended to run. You should consider if you want to do battlefield control the use of illusions. Creating sudden walls the enemy has to walk around or wont fire attacks through can be clever, as can convincing them there are traps or lava they have to avoid etc. You can be more creative than that of course, especially outside of combat.

One of my favorite tricks is to run around a corner, duck through a door then use an illusion to hide the door so the chasing foe will run right past.

>> No.44423691

Not him but.. Isn't Silent Image still blocking LoS even after disbelief? Disbelief just reveal that it's not real.

>> No.44423697

Why are you worried when you've picked a badass tier 1 caster in a mid level game?

>> No.44423708

Well, I'm not really that "good" at Pathfinder. Last time I made a Wizard, I ended up making a "blaster caster", blowing all my spell slots in the first few combat encounters, and then generally spending the rest of my time hiding because I was useless...

>> No.44423713

Just becareful, some Illusion spell has the duration of concentration (standard action), so unless you are a Gnome who can take feat to do it as swift action, you won't be able to do anything else.

>> No.44423719


A successful saving throw against an illusion reveals it to be false, but a figment or phantasm remains as a translucent outline.

>> No.44423728

Would giving daevics 8 + Int skill points be enough to push them into tier 3?

>> No.44423737

>skill points
>pushing someone up a tier

If it was, chained rogue wouldn't be t5.

>> No.44423749

Read, anon.
Handbooks exist for this reason.

>> No.44423750

Rogues don't have skill-upping veils that get better with more base skill points though.

>> No.44423754

Probably not. It would probably just shit on Gurus.

Daevics are pretty damn good anyway, i would have called them low tier 3 if i had a say in it.

>> No.44423774

How can we make daevics mid/high tier 3 without tampering with skill points?

>> No.44423793

Have scrolls/wands etc. with you for emergency like that.

For scrolls, it's better to pick spell that doesn't rely on DC like buffing spells or summon spells.

>> No.44423795

Tiers are about versatility. Act on that.

>> No.44423811

>MORE skill bonus will make rogues t3
>MORE damage will make fighters t3


>> No.44423862

If your GM offer you soulknife's mind blade along with form, shape and enhanced, how many feats would you give up for that?

>> No.44423912

I'd probably offer it to people if they took wild talent first, and then they get it at -3 level progression, with a feat available to take it up to full progression. Considerable investment for many characters, but usable.

>> No.44423952

Why do you have to be so mad? It's only a game, friendo :^)

>> No.44424028


Tiers are about varying levels of power and versatility.

>> No.44424036


>> No.44424304

What would be good quest ideas for warzones, /pfg/?
When the PCs are just mercenaries for one side or another

>> No.44424334

PC level, magic level, conflict scale?

>> No.44424360

PC 5, lotsa magic, huge conflict between the humans and the orcs (happening in the future, they went time travelling)

>> No.44424376

>happening in the future, they went time travelling
Tech level? Time travel availability?

>> No.44424384

Szuriel has engineered the entire conflict, and a demonic harbinger in service to another horseman is assisting the party in an effort to slightly weaken her in another plot of daemonic intrigue.

>> No.44424407

IMO Arcanist has the potential to be broken harder, simply due to one of their archetypes allowing them to take a wizard school without an opposition school. Conjuration/Teleportation and their Dimensional Slide Exploit can give you pretty unmatched mobility, and neither provokes Attacks of Opportunity. If you're not planning on making/buying items like wands, the also have some pretty good damaging-dealing exploits. Why spend slots on Magic Missile when you can do Acid Jet or Ice Missile that scale for longer and have extra effects? Finally, they have some exploit called "quick study" or something that lets them swap a spell they've prepared for one they havent as a full-round action, essentially giving them access to their entire spell list at any given time (especially out of combat).

That being said, the Bonus Feats Wizards get is really nice if you wana supply your party with magic items or use Meta-Magic alot... and if you're campaign is staying low-level, they get access to higher levels of spells a little bit earlier than Arcanists (like 1-3 levels). If your campaign has a good level of loot drop, just go with Wizard and use wands/scrolls to make up for the fact that you can't switch up your spell list on the fly. (Getting a free familiar is nice too, although the Arcanist can get one through an Arcanist Exploit).

Personally it's a matter of taste and what you wana do. In more combat-heavy campaigns, I'd say Arcanist is slightly better

>> No.44424505

I don't get the occultist at all.
I heard it's just written like rotting skin, what does it do?

>> No.44424537


Molthune invading Nirmathas, party can join either side of the conflict, although Molthune will pay and offer more.

Qadira and Taldor, Grand Campaign version 2.

Border skirmishes between Cheliax and Andoran.

Land of the Linnorm Kings longship crew, out to raid the south lands of Nidal and Cheliax culminating in the sacking of Kintargo.

Of those, I would do Molthune since the conquest is real, the need for mercenaries is at its highest there, and there are clear sides with clear rewards.

>> No.44424638

I dunno. Could be worth like 3 feats if its at your character level. Without blade skills not more than that.

>> No.44424656

First time I see a comic supporting Ayn Rand. Feels weird.

>> No.44424668

What PF race is closest to the Goliath in 5e? I have an idea for a brawler.

>> No.44424671

I don't know about scaling, but meta-physical weapons are always awesome.

>> No.44424703

It isn't supporting Ayn Rand. Anon you have a problem if you read that story and see Ayn Rand as being supported. Not to mention its only half of the story.

>> No.44424750

>Molthune invading Nirmathas, party can join either side of the conflict, although Molthune will pay and offer more.

Molthune is a criminally underused part of the setting and their conquest of Generic Villages and Towns Land is awesome.

It lets you really get your raider on, or rule over a village without answering to a higher authority.

Plus there isn't a lot of lore on them, which works in your favor since you can now bullshit.

>> No.44424759

>LE vs CG
>I wonder who'll be the focus of the AP when they get around to it

>> No.44424766

Heres a story i think we've all been through.

>> No.44424767

Sauce? I've seen it somewhere before, but apparently not in steelforge.

>> No.44424783

Second part
It was cut from steelforge iirc.

>> No.44424794

It's from my document that got submitted to steelforge. No idea if it'll make it in.

>> No.44424815


Who cares about the AP? What we know *right now* is Molthune is gobbling up Nirmathas, and those poor peasant farmers are *desperate* for heroes.

It's classic adventuring at it's finest, where you've got an Evil Empire, good peasant yokels, and a whole lot of opportunity to carve out a place in the world.

>> No.44424922

Why did it get removed from steelforge?

>> No.44424961

How do bonus damage dice from martial stances (or Flaming AoMF) interract with damage inflicted with grappling (as a part of maintaining grapple; with grab or constrict) by RAI?

>> No.44424996

If it applies to your unarmed/naturals, it applies to grappling.

>> No.44425000

Well i dont know. I just think that, i don't even know if its true.

>> No.44425011

By RAW its whatever damage your unarmed strike does (or a natural weapon) is the damage so anything that boosts that boosts the damage.

>> No.44425029

Heyo, /pfg/
Would it be worth it to go 2-3 levels in Hunter to improve an animal companion? I'm currently a Ranger, if that changes anything.

>> No.44425058

A jar of pig grease/fat
Our rogue has found an endless number of uses for that stuff

>> No.44425083

She and Stirner are the only ones actually playing the game. The other two would be considered That Guys in most tables.

>The PCs have diffenrent levels, with one being level five and another being level 10
>most of the players are That Guy
>Except the paladin, somehow
>DM doesn't roll the fight just "LOL, you dead"
>Bully the only one doing actual roleplay at the table
What a shitty group.

>> No.44425084

No there's a feat called "Boon Companion". Get that instead. It makes your animal companion match your level instead of being 3 behind.

You can also get evolved animal companion if you want to go overboard.

>> No.44425104

in general, classes operate better if you specialize in them in Pathfinder.

the problem is that you won't expand your animal companion choices by going hunter; for some reason Rangers have a really limited AC selection and it's weaker than normal (though Boon companion makes up for that). The animal focus might be worth it, but the only reason to go with level 2 or 3 would be the teamwork feats, and those heavily depend on how many other martials are in your party.

regardless, I'd personally ask if you can get your Ranger levels swapped out for Hunter wholesale; they're just better - the only thing Hunters lose over Ranger is a lack of favored enemy and Combat Style - which is covered by the bonus teamwork feats they get in a sort of "Teamwork" style. that's literally it - Hunter is better in every other way.

If that's not on the table, then consider strongly what you get for dipping; you can't swap to a stronger animal companion, but your AC does gain the ability to learn Skirmisher Ranger tricks, such as Cunning Pantomime, which is beyond hilarious. You also get animal aspect, to buff your companion a bit. If you go to level 2 or 3, you get bonus feats. You also get some low-grade spellcasting, but that doesn't really mean much.

Is it worth it? Not in my opinion. you're better off just picking up Boon Companion and staying straight Ranger.

>> No.44425130

Thanks. This is how I ruled it in my games.
I guess only normal and grab grapple damage recieve this bonus damage and constrict doesn't, right?

>> No.44425166

Constrict isn't an attack, so no bonus damage there.

>> No.44425191

Cool, thanks again.

>> No.44425303

I think you didn't get the joke if your focus was on details like the different levels. Back in ye olden days people played with different levels in the same group and were accustomed to it for some reason and pop culture's view of D&D maintains that there are different levels.

Also no, arguing that the treasure should be shared with the people or donated to the temple or returned to its rightful owner is not being that guy nor is it uncommon. Any Paladin who's following the spirit of his code for example will call to return stolen goods and most good aligned party members wont loot the shrines of good gods etc.

>> No.44425318

dont forget bags of flour

>> No.44425327

Alright, thanks. I'll probably stay straight Ranger then.

>> No.44425337


What, for making bread?

In fact, why are there no botanist wizards?

Like, all I know is the Ghoran, but where are the magically-engineered wheat or potatoes?

>> No.44425351

Oh i see most of your post was replying to the second comic about the nature of lich. Yes, the joke is that they are all that guys and refusing to fight the monster. Also yeah, they just roll and you are dead because the lich used finger of death and that's what finger of death does. You save or you die.

>> No.44425364

toss it around for invisable opponants, finding secret doors etc

>> No.44425379

They're probably different levels because half of them won't fight

>> No.44425392

That isn't the lich one is it. Its the orc one. Fuck. Look yes the joke is that philosophers are bad at D&D. The D&D isn't accurate because the joke is about the philosophers.

>> No.44425398

I wish I had a group like this. Instead everyone's just... dumb.

>> No.44425424

Hi guys

So, tl;dr

I have some new guys in my group that are having trouble grasping actions in combat.
Does anyone have a chart like pic related that can explain what someone can do in combat action wise?
On top of that, any general charts that can help explain the rules in general to new people?


>> No.44425436

I don't know. There's a certain joy in stupidity. We don't get good stories to tell from smart people, we get them from the paladin who eats the mushrooms from my spell component pouch (the ones i kept around for euphoric cloud) and ends up throwing away his armor after he is convinced its possessed by outsiders.

>> No.44425465

Uh well personally i find those charts confusing. My advice would be to print out some paper and cut it up into cards with scissors. Then write down the things he can do on them!

So write down say his normal attacks like one for the sword and one for the bow and what the bonuses are etc on these little bits of paper and any other special abilities he has.
You can write move, standard, swift or full round action on them and maybe make like a move, standard swift etc card he can "tap" like in magic the gathering or wow tcg.

>> No.44425490

>for bread
Invisible people nigga

>> No.44425492

I mean, we get some good laughs in, but I'm the only one who seems to enjoy the math/strategy part of things, and the attempts at roleplaying are actually pretty much what you described. I get this feeling that it could be so much better and then I get a bit sad.

>> No.44425511

Wouldn't recommend charts, get them to read this

>> No.44425567

Yeah well pretty much the same here for one of my groups.

But because I like the math/strategy part and because i recognize the link between the math/strategy part and the roleplaying part everyone calls me a min maxing munchkin who only sees his characters as numbers.
I'm the only one with a written backstory in the group. I'm the only one who consistently gives up mechanical advantages to stay true to my character and I'm the only one who weakens himself to focus on cool over pure power.

>> No.44425789

What kinds of tiefling bloodlines would you like to see?
What about aasimar?

>> No.44425825

How many threads are you going to ask this question in?

>> No.44425844


Are there any Celestials/Fiends that don't have an Aasimar/Tiefling bloodline?

>> No.44425860

the new ones from B5
the snake fiends
elemental fiends

>> No.44425972

Question about sacred geometry: do you have to use all the numbers rolled in your dice pool? Or can you use, say, 3 out of the 5 numbers and still cast the spell?

>> No.44426044

Anyone have a link for weapon master handbook.

>> No.44426051

>Pic related trying to cleanse arueshalae with her mighty and divinely granted dick.


>> No.44426071

You don't have to do anything with dice, the only requirement of Sacred Geometry is to get out your eraser and start looking up feats.

>> No.44426081

Can you fucking not

>> No.44426090

Just use one of the online calculators for it, anon.

>> No.44426124


She doesn't have a dick though.

And what kind of question are you even asking? Arueshalae's cleansing needs to be done with words and deeds, not dick, in fact dick is the last thing she needs prior to redemption.

>> No.44426154

Who are the Zon-Kuthon worshippers in the lore? I want examples for my upcoming Zon-Kuthon cleric.
What if she corrupts the dick?

>> No.44426158

I'm guessing he's suggesting an idea for the porn commission an anon mentioned he's going to buy a couple generals back. A lot of people were shouting for Arueshalae and several other people were suggesting one of the two people in the commission should be a chick with a dick because the anon paying for the commission stipulated it needed to be two girls because he's not a fan of man-ass.

All that said though, who is the girl in that picture? I don't recognize her name or her art. Is she an NPC from WotR?

>> No.44426177

Aw shit, since when did the races I made with you guys get put in the pastebin? That's swell.

>> No.44426188


Nidal is the nation with ZonZon as their lord.

Also Arueshalae's issue with dick is she might accidentally suck out a soul while sucking it. That's kinda the thing, she's a starving cannibal with a juicy piece of ass and she's fully aware she might take a big bite without thinking it, which would damn her forever.

>> No.44426198

From the hair cut and armour design, probably a SOB from 40k/a fantasy character art based on one.

>> No.44426226

That's what I was thinking too, but I'm not into Warhammer much and my only familiarity with the SoB is passing familiarity from other people's posts about them that I occasionally see. So, I wasn't sure.

>> No.44426252


It's a Galfrey, isn't that the royal family of Mendev?

>> No.44426292

That's ridiculously OP and I know that if I tried to use an online calculator my GM would have a problem with it.

Then again, if I used pen and paper it would slow down the game.

>> No.44426323

There's a reason that Sacred Geometry is considered HERESY here.

>> No.44426341

Oh, you're that anon? I made an unrooted dryad last month but live in fear of myconids perpetually now. Thanks, I guess.

>> No.44426347

So /pfg/, help me out there. I need to know if there's a big spiked ball weapon I can roll around, because I want to combine that with bull rushes, overrun, and Hamatula Strike to become the Prince.

>> No.44426376

There was a dwarven exotic weapon that just just a big metal ball

>> No.44426443

You're not thinking of the Dwarven Chain Flail, are you?

>> No.44426482


Yes, please!

>> No.44426495

I'm thinking of doing a TWF barb/alchemist build. I can reach 32 strength by level 5 (1 level in barb, 4 in alchemist - 20 strength base, 4 rage, 4 mutagen, 4 bull's strength extract), but it will take me two turns to fully buff myself at the start of the battle.

My question is: is there a way to drink a mutagen or extract faster at low levels, or counteract the need for me to use up so many standard actions buffing myself? The feat that allows quicker potion drinking specifically does not work.

>> No.44426496

Looks pretty cool. I only have a very basic understanding of maneuvers, though.

>> No.44426539

Make potions of Bull's Strength and drink it as a move action. Unless you traded out potion making as a class feature.

Otherwise, get a pair of Poisoner's Gloves (or two pair if you've got vestigial arms going) and punch yourself twice/four times to buff.

>> No.44426730

Use Ragechemist archetype but cut out the Bull's Strength extract - frankly, every turn after the start of battle which the party's Barbarian is not spending on the frontline puts the party in danger.

>> No.44426750

As you should.

>> No.44426772

How powerful is a Mythic Commoner if no one else in the party is Mythic?

>> No.44426820

>recommending ragechemist

>> No.44426861

Poisoner's gloves look really cool, however they would probably only be efficient if you were delivering two different buffing effects to yourself. I would definitely like to make this work though, since the idea of a Hyde/BANE type guy is what I am going for.

Ragechemist would be decent but since my will save will be trash, getting hit five times and then falling unconscious does not seem like a good idea.

>> No.44426880

hey /pfg/, why can't i make my characters anyting other than humans?
I dont wanna be the boring player anymore, but everything else is so clunky and full of unnecessary things...
I would love to make my next characters a femdwarf, but there's all that useless stuff... Human is so clean and slick, "there you go, +1 skill and an extra feat, go bless yourself!" whilst dwarf gets bonuses to not get tripped and to check for stoneworks, woah!

Are there the first symptoms of a min-maxer?

>> No.44426894

>probably only be efficient if you were delivering two different buffing effects to yourself
As opposed to two of the same buffing effect...?

>> No.44426925

Take a look at alternate racial traits if your GM allows them, some of them can be quite useful compared to what humans get. Elves, for example, can swap out some traits to get +2 to casting defensively and +2 for piercing spell resistance. There's no free trait a human can take that can make up for both of those effects.

>> No.44426926

They are the symptoms of someone who prefers simplicity over complexity.

Clean and slick isn't good. Humans have no mechanical identity because of how vague their abilities are and are overpowered for nearly every build because of it. Humans being "simple" has lead them to be a hindrance to roleplaying because they cause people like you to think every race should be like humans and then shy away from those other races.

>> No.44426957

As opposed to one buff by itself.

>> No.44426967

Honestly, it sounds a little like it.

>> No.44426976

One of the things I liked about 5e (which I think is a quirk from 4e) is that no race had a racial penalties to an attribute, so while some races were still better at the job than others, you were never completely barred from a race because it's actively BAD at using that class. Of course, this is in a system where your ability scores are less vital to literally everything you do.

>> No.44426977

Does anyone have a pdf of Pathfinder Player Companion: People of the River? I can't find it at all.

>> No.44427015

Never done a two handed character before. Aside from stuff like Power Attack and Cleave, what would y'all suggest?

>> No.44427016

Nevermind, I'm a fucking retard and you have already helped me pre-emptively in the OP.

>> No.44427019


Should be somewhere in there

>> No.44427093


I'm honestly not sure I'd suggest cleave myself, cleave is pretty situational in itself, and my GM rarely throws us encounters where it would be relevant.

>> No.44427112

Cleave is great at level 1, just retrain later.

The point of a two handed character is that that's all you need.

>> No.44427132

I'm making an Inquisitor. I notice I have free repeating crossbow proficiency. I do not intend to invest anything whatsoever into ranged combat.

These in mind, is the Heavy Repeating Crossbow the best choice of ranged weapon? Also if I use Call Out, does that force people to come fight me in melee?

>> No.44427155

Half the people i play pathfinder with think attribute scores are meaningless and all that matters is roleplaying, because any class can do well at that and there's value in playing for instance an 8 int wizard. They then use this as an argument for why rolling 3d6 down the line is good.

>> No.44427159

The only thing crossbows are good for is 1st level wizards who ran out of spells.

>> No.44427161

The repeating crossbow is never the best choice of ranged weapon. It's a trap. Use the longbow instead, as an inquisitor you should have the strength to use it without much investment.

>> No.44427177


JJ once argued this on the Paizo forums when he talked about how a character design is acceptable if the player gets at least one cool moment in the campaign.

>> No.44427217


Non humans should be purged you degenerate

>> No.44427272

I hate, hate, haten HATE shit like that. 3d6 down the line was NEVER acceptable, even back in ye olden times when elves were a class. Roleplaying games are supported on a foundation of mechanics, without it you do not have a game, you have a bunch of people doing freeform.

The idea that roleplaying and rollplaying are mutually exclusive is the biggest fucking fallacy ever. The mechanics are JUST as important as the roleplaying, because they are the basis in which you build the roleplay your character. If I'm playing a wizard with 8 int, I'm not playing a fucking wizard, I'm playing a deluded commoner.

>> No.44427297

Characters should be cool every time their area of expertise comes up damn it.
Sure but what you are doing right now is roleplaying motivated so it doesn't bother me. What bothers me about humans is how mechanically they have no real identity and how that doesn't foster roleplaying. An elf is proficient in the weapons of his people, so players gravitate towards that and introduce it into their elven identity. Dwarves are a people known for their mountain fortresses, so they have stonecunning to represent their knowledge of underground architecture.

Bonus Feat and Skilled just come from "i dunno, humans are adaptable i guess?" which stems from the very flawed idea that humans are necessarily any more adaptable than other intelligent species.

>> No.44427350

Actually, Call Out is really ambiguous as fuck. I think an opponent with a ranged weapon (or spellcasting) gets to continue using that as long as they target themself or me. But who's permissable target? There's no indication that it has to be humanoid, there's no Mind Affecting language, there's no Fear involved, so if you challenge some ooze doing its own thing, it has to participate in this weird courtly duel thing with you?

>> No.44427357

Oh, cool. Thanks for the help!

>> No.44427358


But anon, the moment you start assigning things to Humanity is the moment you're saying "Humans *should* be like this" which alienates the huge, paying portion of your fanbase that would find that toxic, problematic, and probably misogynist.

>> No.44427366

'Duel' is an actual mechanic somewhere. Like, with it's own set of formal rules.

>> No.44427380


>3d6 down the line

What's the absolute best way to generate attribute scores?

I ask because I can't get over how useful 5d6 drop lowest 2, reroll 1s is.

>> No.44427396


Last I remember, "Duel" as a mechanic is literally just a normal fight with everyone having an at-will Iron Shell counter.

You roll to hit, they roll to parry, repeat until someone connects.

>> No.44427399

Yes, and they don't say anything about this.

>> No.44427409

I just use point buy every time

>> No.44427417

>I hate, hate, haten HATE shit like that.
What you gonna do about it, fakkboy?
We play with 3d6 perfectly fine, it is just more fun this way.

>> No.44427448

Its not like there is any way to argue with those people though. Its almost a religion in a certain sense, in that it comes back round to just a handful of arguments which they assert have never been defeated and each time you defeat one they cycle back to the previous.
Maybe against stuff like oozes you are just stomping your feet on the ground in a way that annoys it?

>> No.44427460

Point buy is infinitely better. It lets you make the character you actually want to play instead of potentially getting fucked over by luck.

>> No.44427461

Rolled 2, 2, 3, 1, 5, 6, 1, 5, 1, 4, 1, 5, 1, 6, 2, 6, 5, 1 = 57 (18d6)


>> No.44427462

>Want to play as tentacle monster synthesist composed only of tentacles, teeth and eyeballs
>Serpentine base form seems good for this purpose
>It only has 12 starting strength
>the stat they encourage you to raise is also by design, meant to degrade as you progress
>Final product no matter how much effort you put into it will end up with shit stats
Why do they even bother with the serpentine form then? Its literally the kineticists of all the forms.

>> No.44427478

I recognize that artist AND that name.

>> No.44427482

You don't understand, you're having fun in the wrong way. If you don't have fun in the way this anon wants he will be very upset, do you want to make him upset?

>> No.44427491


Okay, then what's the best PB?


>> No.44427492


>> No.44427502

I have no problem with you enjoying those mechanics, what I do have a problem with is you saying it's the "right" way to play, and that people who prefer point buy are just filthy min-maxers.

Pathfinder handles 3d6 down the line like I handle dicks, painfully and without some bloodshed.

>> No.44427513

I think it's because humans are more varied rather than adaptive

I can never get behind rolling. It just ends up making one character better than others which kinda makes sense in that we are not made equal but I find it to be a fun killer when there is a character over/under powered because of some (un)lucky rolls at the start of the campaign... I really should get to writing that program that randomly gives you an array based upon how how likely that is to occur if you were to roll it.

>> No.44427519

>>Take vestigial arm discovery two times
>>Give the arms poisoner's gloves, one filled with bull's strength, the other filled with enlarge person
>>Turn 1 of combat
>>Two arms inject the alchemist with the extracts, and the alchemist drinks a feral strength mutagen
>>Turn 2
>>Rage and unleash the rape train

Anything here that is not allowed in the rules?

>> No.44427522

If POW and DSP content is allowed, grab deadly agility. Failing that, Amulet of Mighty Fists with Agile on it. You're welcome.

>> No.44427524


15 for 'realistic"/"low-powered" games

>> No.44427529

Man, I wish spiked chains werent castrated in pathfinder.

>> No.44427531

People will just respond that "assign lets you do that too" and "4d6 drop lowest means you wont get as fucked stats!" which is great until you wanted to play a big burly barbarian and got 12-14 in everything or you want to play a Fighter who's also pretty cunning and have 3 18s and 3 8s so you pretty much have to give up on dreams of good mental stats. God i can remember when i had one 18 and one 13 and everything else was 11 or below. I was like "well I guess I'm a wizard now" because there was no real way to play anything that needed more than one attribute.

>> No.44427540

25 errtime

>> No.44427550

20 or 25

>> No.44427551


Pick whichever one your group likes best.

>> No.44427557

25, some people say 32.
Holy fuck no. Even on 20 you get screwed over if you want more than two attributes.

>> No.44427562

>I can never get behind rolling. It just ends up making one character better than others which kinda makes sense in that we are not made equal but I find it to be a fun killer when there is a character over/under powered because of some (un)lucky rolls at the start of the campaign...

Anon... This is why you roll three sets of the roll, and the two rolls you have left over get thrown into a big ole pot of leftover rolls that people can take from if a better array presents itself.

>> No.44427573

20 PB is only slightly better than "just play a fucking wizard". You're still in retarded-autistic-fighter-with-no-goddamn-sense territory at 20. 25 is minimum for a game where you aren't running a party of full casters, 32 is the sweet spot if you want MAD classes to function well.

>> No.44427578

Or just use point buy

>> No.44427586

I'm thinking of trying to make a spatial magic type character who focuses more on battlefield control over anything else. DM is fine with refluffing spells to fit the theme.

Any ideas and what spells to grab?

>> No.44427608

Yeah they went too far on it. 2d4 damage and no crit modifier for disarm, trip and finesse. Could have thrown double weapon on there or given it 19-20 or even something like +2 to AoOs.

I wonder if maybe /pfg/ should work together on a rebalanced weapons homebrew? We could go through the weapons and spice up the weak ones so they can compete well with the good ones. I mean everyone agrees crossbows and most exotics are shit but maybe we could do something about it.

>> No.44427619

>32 is the sweet spot if you want MAD classes to function well.

But anon, 32 is just overpowered! If you want to play with that much attributes just do freeform!

Jeez, imagine a Fighter with positive Charisma, what a waste!

>> No.44427625

The problem here is that dex suffers penalties as the eidolon increases in size. It seems that you'll end up with mediocre ability scores even if you focus solely on str or dex.

I really wish there was some sort of incentive to take that base form. Quadruped gets pounce and Biped has the highest strength and starting evolutions that will work regardless of what build you have in mind.

>> No.44427644

There is no right or wrong way to play. 3d6 in order just works for me and my group. We generate stats first and choose a class based on the roll. We also play with suboptimal builds and no concern about party composition.

>> No.44427645

>Void school, Reveal Weakness, have your team-mates love you forever.

>> No.44427665

20 for a "standard" game, IE the kind that the Adventure Paths are balanced around.
25 for the ability to use any base class without much or any issue, at least attribute-wise (things like Chained Monk or Kineticist still suffer for other reasons, but no amount of point-buy will fix those).

>> No.44427683

I love you anon but so many of us have played with people who legitimately believed that i think most people wont see the sarcasm.

The other day when i suggested 32 to my DM he said "why not 42 so you can get all 18s!". My brain seriously hurt at that comment and i had to explain how all 18s is 102 points.

>> No.44427701

>All these people not playing casters
This is your problem with low point buy. Martials are an NPC class anyways.

>> No.44427721

>No amount of Point Buy will fix those
I disagree on the monk actually. The higher the point buy the more his disadvantages fade. His ability to get wisdom to extra things and his large number of attacks serving as a good multiplier for damage stats (especially if he actually gets enough strength to hit things) mean he scales better and better the higher the PB goes.

Plus the chained monk has archetypes that don't suck.

>> No.44427741

>The other day when i suggested 32 to my DM he said "why not 42 so you can get all 18s!".

You know what you do when they say this?

You actually make a character with 32 PB, make the same character with the PB they want, and then show them the two and describe how most of the "improvements" are actually just semi-fluff to make the character feel like a character.

A Human Zweihander Sentinel I'm playing with 30 PB is running on 18 13 14 15 12 13, they should see this isn't actually that overpowered by any stretch of the word.

>> No.44427763


>That pic
>Tall buxom blonde with a cute little boy

>> No.44427805

No see they aren't capable of seeing it that way. This DM believed all characters needed things like 10s and 8s to make them believable roleplaying characters, because 10 was the human normal and all characters should be relatively close to that.

The fact the mechanics don't support that and taking 8s etc is usually considered (by this same person) to be min-maxing and taking "dump stats" doesn't matter.

>> No.44427819

AP are actually balance around 15 PB. At least that is what Paizo always say.

>> No.44427834

To be fair, the APs are also balanced in such a way where Crane Wing was legitimately overpowered. Fuck you paizo.

>> No.44427835


Maybe I have spent too much time on /d/

>> No.44427857

With all the arguingbabout stat gen, maybe this is a good time to ask a question I've been wondering. Should you adjust encounter difficulty for high PB? Like, if I have my players use 32 PB, should I treat the party as one level higherv for determining appropriate CR challenges?

>> No.44427871

Might get in a Gestalt game pretty soon

Any fun combos? Paizo only sadly.

>> No.44427884


Lordy no.

32PB won't affect CR value basically at all, unless you design encounters like Paizo (see: >>44427834 ) where the only definition of "more difficult" is "the lone big stompy guy with no special powers deals 50 damage instead of 30!"

>> No.44427978

Dwarf is actually one of the best core race. Every classes can use more WIS and CON.
Hardy is incredibly strong and you can get a trait and a feat to improve on it. Stonecunning is great in dungeon.

The other racial traits are pretty much just a freebie.

>> No.44428004

I personally love Harbinger/Witch

Also Alchemist/Wizard and Oracle/Paladin and Ranger/Druid and Sorcerer/Summoner and Barbarian/Oracle

>> No.44428035

Despite the poor choices of classes I'd like to do an arcanist and wizard purely for "lol I'm not running out of spells" factor. Use the arcanist for spells I'll probably need and the wizard for utility spells and what not.

>> No.44428040

Well at low levels, that basically is how encounters are balanced, unless you're fighting the wizard's squad of level one apprentices or something. Assuming the martials have gotten an extra CON mod and another plus one on reflex, AC, and initiative, or a better will save, that's a notable improvement that gets magnified by the small scale of low levels. You can argue you shouldn't play at low levels, but that's besides the point. Mages will probably max their casting stat anyway, so increasing PB probably won't increase that. Likely, the extra PB will go to CON or DEX, secondary stats for all mages. Again, raising each of those mods even by one can make a notable difference while at low levels.

>> No.44428051

Agreed. I rarely play dwarves because I always seem to be feat-starved (too much I want to do), but they are a rather good race if you can afford to be down a feat.

>> No.44428061

15 : Fullcaster
20 : Gish
25 : Martials
32 : Anything

>> No.44428063

No, that's PFS.

>> No.44428083

Alchemist/Sage Sorcerer
Alchemist/Any INT Based class

Promethean/Preservationist is a good archetype so you can have a pocket summoner buddy

>> No.44428086

>going to play wrath of the righteous soon
>stuck between battle oracle, paladin, and unchained sanctified rogue
Party is a monk, spiritualist, and another is undecided. I have no idea what to play at all from all these ideas.

>> No.44428090

What about 30?

>> No.44428095

I was thinking of maybe going Arcane Duelist bard with something else. Not sure what to put it with yet. Maybe just a fighter. I love me some FEATS.

Or maybe taking this opportunity to do a Paladin/Mysterious stranger build or actually making the shitty Spellslinger Archetype work and go full gish with it by going something similar like 1st level spellslinger/gunslinger and then the rest as Sorc/Gunslinger or something.


>> No.44428112

30 is fine too, but 32 is just enough to mitigate too many odd scores

>> No.44428128

What fits in the anything category that isn't full caster, fish, or martial?

>> No.44428137

> Harbinger/Witch

That sounds really action heavy. How does it play for ya?

>> No.44428145

Unchained Monk/Goliath Druid. Shapeshift into a giant and deliver massive sized kung fu. Alternatively get feral combat training and use flurry of blows with a T-Rex bite.

>> No.44428157

Having fuck tons of spells doesn't really help when you are still limited to 1 (or 2 with quickened ) spells per round. Generally you want an active and a passive class.

>> No.44428173

MAD classes like Monk, Paladin, Rogue, Magus.

>> No.44428176

Not the same guy, but it is very action-heavy. That being said, you can throw around curses and hexes to make your Cursed Razor maneuvers even better, and you're pretty much solely an INT-SAD character with it. I personally prefer Hedgewitch//Harbinger but that's because I like Spheres of Power and Bonus Combat Feats too much.

Also, how do you do Gareth? It feels like it's been a while.

>> No.44428177

Fighter without head injuries.

>> No.44428189

Damn that would be funny as fuck, but sadly, the game is very dungeon based, so going full Eren Jaeger would go.. Poorly.

I can see that yeah.

It almost seems like Sorcerer/Oracle (or bard) Swashbuckler would be easy to get away with, and make the swashbuckler side feel decent. I'll think on it.

>> No.44428199

>has a special designation for Gishes
>doesn't include the iconic gish class

>> No.44428203

You mean odd number scores?
As a player I never really minded them, as it offered a little flexibility in growth later on to me.

>> No.44428227

Battle oracle of course.
The Inquisitor is a gish.
Magus is a MAD gish. Get it?

>> No.44428235


Go Paladin, Touched by Divinity with Iomedae.

>> No.44428240


>>pounce: Fantastic if you're a melee character. Works profoundly well with Vivisectionist.

To me, this implies that an alchemist can take from both the Vivisectionist and Beastmorph archetypes. That seems extremely powerful if it is the case - am I correct in thinking that this is possible?

>> No.44428249

Like fucking shit, anon. Holidays still kicking my shit, been in a depressive funk, tooth still killing me. Been avoiding professional work in favor of running my quest to cope.


>> No.44428277

Okay then, how about an unchained Rogue/Druid that transforms into diminutive animals? You only can get dex to damage and sneak attack so your fucking tiny ass form can do massive damage. You'd be like Ant-Man.

>> No.44428289

More like Monk and Rogue without head injuries.

>> No.44428313

Meh, that can be done with a druid with an agile amulet of mighty fists. Sneak attacks are pretty unreliable for boosting damage

>> No.44428324

>The AP you really, really wanted to be good, but it just isn't

Which one is it?

>> No.44428329

Yeah those Archetypes stack since they replace/alter different things.

>> No.44428331


You can combine any archetypes so long as they don't modify or replace the same class features.

>> No.44428336

Druid/Bloodrager might be fun too, transform into a fucking hellbeast.

>> No.44428347

I don't know, I've never gotten further than a book in because people are unreliable.

>> No.44428355

Multiple archetypes can be used as long as they don't conflict: That is, no archetype taken alters or changes an ability that the others alter or change. Vivisectionist only replaces bombs and optionally alters discoveries, so it stacks with all archetypes that don't alter or replace bombs.

>> No.44428361

Why don't you just play Druid with Crocodile domain?

>> No.44428381

I didn't know that - I have been looking at this in completely the wrong way. Cheers lads

>> No.44428403

Everyone's flat footed until they take their first turn in combat, druids can summon animals to flank with them (or use their animal companion) and if you can't find cover to use the stealth skill from whilst you take up less space than a fork then your DM is placing you in completely empty rooms all the time and is lazy.
Why not have both? They stack.
Eh, honestly I'd go for regular Barbarian. The increased rage strength bonus as you level up and the rage powers seem like they'd be worth more than the bloodline abilities or arcane spells.

>> No.44428418

>Any fun combos?

I like Bard (Archaeologist)/Oracle. I usually make the bard part go into Noble Scion for the free better companion.

>> No.44428430

I haven't actually played it, but as more time goes on, more people talk about it and their experience with it, so I get more disappointed about Giantslayer.

>> No.44428451

>there are people ITT that dislike arueshalae just because shes liked by most of the anons here
>the ultimate waifu is disliked for the shittiest reason

>> No.44428468

Carrion Crown.
Is there any good horror adventure/AP for pathfinder?

>> No.44428470

Please god post the whole thing I fucking need this in my life right now

>> No.44428513

It's literally written in Archetype rule.

> A character can take more than one archetype and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the base class as another alternate class feature. For example, a fighter could not be both an armor master and a brawler, since both archetypes replace the weapon training 1 class feature with something different.

>> No.44428520


>> No.44428531

The feat? That's the entirety of it.

>> No.44428535

Hell's Rebels, easy. I was totally down for urban revolution combat and general "Les Mis: The Adventure", but the sheer amount of mismanagement, as well as the sheer BS of everything related to Shensen makes it a huge disappointment.

>> No.44428587

seriously? did you not hear about Shensen prior to starting it? As soon as I saw Shensen I knew it was going to be pretty fucking terrible.

>> No.44428604


I thought the ultimate waifu was Greta.

We better get a genki evil girl in Hell's Vengeance, along with some top shelf hunks.

>> No.44428630

>as well as the sheer BS of everything related to Shensen makes it a huge disappointment.

Wait, how does the campaign actually handle Shensen? Is she just sort of in the background fucking noblemen and doing her own thing?

>> No.44428633

Awoo is usually considered number 2 to Aru in terms of best waifu, it's just WotR is shit and most people play RoW instead so Greta comes up more often.

>> No.44428692

Druid can't summon as standard action though. Summon Nature Ally has the casting time of 1 round.

Also there is currently an argument on Paizo forum on whether you can sneak attack from steatlh. Since stealth gives total concealment, but total concealment itself doesn't denied enemy dex-to-ac.

>> No.44428744

Oh, I knew. Most of my disappointment was that she was involved at all. It just turned the whole thing from "interesting concept" to "you are, once again, some NPC characters servants for the entire adventure" that APs have a bad habit of falling into.

>> No.44428763

>Also there is currently an argument on Paizo forum on whether you can sneak attack from steatlh. Since stealth gives total concealment, but total concealment itself doesn't denied enemy dex-to-ac.

Well that's fucking retarded, if you have managed to stealth away why wouldn't you get a sneak attack, they aren't aware of where the attack is going to come from.

>> No.44428773

So if someone wanted to make money off 3.P what would be the best way to go about it?
So far I'm thinking:
>Write an adventure path of my own
>Doujins of existing adventure paths

>> No.44428780

...What? There's nothing else for this? Cmon, man. This shit sounds cool as fuck and I'd love to give feedback and shit for you.

>> No.44428806


Are you suggesting you know how to draw?

Because if so we've got a backlog of smut that needs to be illustrated.

>> No.44428824

I already gave my reasons. It was that her redemption attempt stems from Desna mind-fucking her on the level of helm of opposite alignment shenanigans. I am fine with redemption stuff but when all that made you turn was magic, all it takes to turn you back is magic.

Forced redemption isn't very much in the spirit of the thing.

>> No.44428830



C'mon it can't be that bad.

Seriously, if you have a DM that's able to alter the SJW bits and put a collar on the Mythic causing everything to become Easy Mode, how bad could it be?

>> No.44428838

How are the dwellers of the Paizo forums reacting to Hell's Rebels, anyway? Do they have a lot of people complaining about it too, or are most of them eating it up? If the former, how are the AP's writers reacting?

>> No.44428845

I momentarily went braindead and thought you meant you'd never played a character with two hands before. Like, every character you'd ever played was Captain Hook.

>> No.44428849

Yeah nah, too many people do that. Unless it's really well drawn and has a good set of characters (or just ones with FAT HALF ELF TATS) you'd just get lost in the sea of shit.

>writing an AP
I don't think you understand how much work that entails. Also, selling it would be a bitch.

>Doujins of existing adventure paths
Probably your best bed especially if it's lewd

>> No.44428853

>I wonder if maybe /pfg/ should work together on a rebalanced weapons homebrew?
This hasn't been done before?
Can we just get rid of most of the god damn asian weapons? Want a katana? Sure buy a longsword and call it a fucking katana.

>> No.44428861

Katanas are actually bastard swords.

>> No.44428887

>All these people saying 25 or 32 are the best point buys

Sounds feasible.

I remember when I was newish and my GM said 'path of war gestalt characters, 52 point buy'. I questioned if he was serious and he said it was fine.

He later admitted he was kind of annoyed at just how easily my character steamrolled everything.

>> No.44428901

That's not the point buy doing it, that's fucking gestalt + PoW doing it.

>> No.44428904

As someone currently working on writing an AP, I can safely say "Not that one". There's a huge amount of work involved, particularly if you're going it alone, and that's just the writing, let alone the art assets. Your post seems to hint that you have at least some artistic talent, but that just gives you an even bigger workload.

>> No.44428929

>This gray-skinned humanoid has long, willowy limbs and a bulboys head with oversized black eyes.
And no dicks either.

>> No.44428932

Longswords are actually greatswords.

>> No.44428935

I'm personally about to run it so I'll check, but I've heard that the PCs aren't the big damn heroes the AP is made out to be since everything important is attributed to NPCs the PCs are escorting or just NPCs that did important shit offscreen.

Ignoring [trumpeting] of course.

>> No.44428940

That too, yeah.
But that was also his idea since his goal was to show us how DSP was fun and balanced and wouldn't upset the powerlevels of our other 1pp gestalt game.

Ultimately I do agree it's a lot of fun, but the claim it doesn't outclass 1pp martials? Ha ha ha

>> No.44428943

Of course its going to be lewd.
Whats the point of a doujin if its not lewd?

>> No.44428949

Oh fuck off with that weapons having unique and different stat blocks is a good thing. Combining the katana, longsword and khopesh into one "sword" thing would just mean there's less cool options for fighters.

It would be like if we just said "oh yeah use a rat statblock for racoons and foxes" for a casters familiar or "yeah ray of enfeeblement and ray of sickness are the same thing just use one".

>> No.44428966

They could be cute stories about Greta fantasizing about that mysterious adventurer and their handholding

>> No.44428971


Remember anon, lewd art is best when it's canonically feasible, rather than just an excuse to slap big fat tits on a character like Trinia Sabor.

>> No.44428975

>Ultimately I do agree it's a lot of fun, but the claim it doesn't outclass 1pp martials? Ha ha ha

The entire point of ToB and PoW is that core martials are underpowered. Although I think ToB did it better.

>> No.44428993

Really what the problem is that weapon choice is overcentralized, because of all the range of things on offer, a small handful stand out as clearly better than their peers.

What needs to be done is to rebalance the other often ignored weapons to bring them up to par, or at least closer to par.

>> No.44429008

I tend to think of it as magic giving her the chance to start but her own effort being what really drives the change. If no further effort was taken after the magic, she would eventually fall back to evil status. But that magic removes the "default to evil" drive in a demon's mind and lets the succubus think about it like a normal person. She then has to take the personal effort to change her ways and to atone for past actions in order to become more goodly.

Once she's fully, totally converted to goodness, she's as set in it as hard as a regular succubus is to evil. Magic could change her back, but not easily because she would have to actively want the change.

>> No.44429010

>Ultimately I do agree it's a lot of fun, but the claim it doesn't outclass 1pp martials? Ha ha ha
PoW pretty much objectively outclasses martials, that's in fact kind of the point of PoW because 1pp martials are bad.

>> No.44429032

Like I said, I submitted it to DSP for approval (And it did!). It's with Psybomb now, but here's the original document.


If you like what you see, please let Psybomb (Or maybe Gareth, since he visits the thread) know so they know what their customers want.

(I'm a big fan of the Unarmed weapon quality and Bound weapon myself)

>> No.44429036

Because Rogue are too OP and need more nerf.

>> No.44429044


The PCs are big dick heroes, they're generals of the Crusade by book 2 answering only to the Queen.

There is literally only one moment in the campaign where the PC's Thunder is stolen, just one. This is when the lexicon was stolen from Nocticula by an unnamed band of adventurers.

Guess what happens with that? Fucking nothing, the party gets the book and the people who stole the book fade away without even a name.

Give it a read-over and see for yourself, the AP is surprisingly fine when you replace some pronouns or races to make it more "classic crusade" and less "SocJus and friends overcome all."

>> No.44429052

Simple, divide them into three categories

Damage, critical, property

Simple weapons get one category
Martial weapons get two
Exotic any combinations of the three

>> No.44429084


I fully agree.
There's a long painful story of That Guyism behind it, but the tl;dr is that I got convinced to like PoW on its own merits despite the person responsible for exposing me to it being a huge dick who tried to force the system down my throat.

>> No.44429101

oh true, getting d6s added to your damage with no daily limit is way to powerful.

>> No.44429105

The first one I want to do is Nualia from burnt offerings getting captured by a PC and tormented in different ways till she reverts back to the once innocent shy Aasimar girl.

Then she gets raped some more

>> No.44429128

So... exactly what i was suggesting before some asshole said we should just cut out eastern weapons because "they are basically european weapons"?

>> No.44429162

There is no rule that says a creature unaware of you is denied dex or is flat-footed apparently. Only if they are unaware of you before combat.

>> No.44429171


Why not start off with the cute innocent teenage Nualia getting knocked up in the cave system after the Varisian punk convinces her to give it up?

You'd hit like a dozen kinks that way.

>> No.44429176

Oh, you're right.
I didn't read far enough up the reply chain.

We should totally do that.

>> No.44429187

I was thinking of a system like this, as far a damage and critical (threat or multiplier) it's pretty simple. But the properties are not equal, reach is pretty damn useful but shit like deadly is just fucking useless, it'd be hardly balanced to consider them to be traded on a one to one basis.

>> No.44429218

A number of weapons also have small unique abilities that aren't catch-all properties: coming up with more of those would also be nice.

>> No.44429219

Do what you want Anon, just know if that you actually do it and your art is decent you'll probably get a barrage of requests for more things. That idea sounds great though, it's like stereotypical mindbreak hentai except this time it's the good guys doing it and the bad girl is getting corrupted with goodness.

>> No.44429263

asshole here.
On retrospect you're probably right, there are a few things that annoy me still, nodachi should have been an exotic like the other eastern weapons and asian themed classes shouldn't be getting access to clearly better weapons purely because they are asian, that was fucking bullshit.

>> No.44429266

Purification is best fetish, I will not hear anything to the contrary.

>> No.44429278

I see it as magic making her remember her time as a mortal or a better person and her realizing what shes become.

>> No.44429285

What kind of Perform skill should a Zon-Kuthon worshipper use?
String instruments made from "human gut"?
Act to give genuinely compelling recreations of being tortured?
Oratory to tell tales and poems of suffering and pain?
Sing to fucking scream the thousand screams of all their victims and bring true fear to the audience?
Or comedy, for gallows humor?

>> No.44429306

String, Act, or Comedy would be most fitting for Zon-Kuthon I feel.

>> No.44429323

Well anon you realize of course those asian classes did fucking suck right?
The extra proficiencies they get don't change the fact they suck and are really just nice little extras.

Many archetypes give exotic weapon proficiency or access to far better weapons than the eastern weapons.

I mean why do you think the Nodachi needs to be exotic compared to the Falchion?

>> No.44429326

>alchemist supplies lube
>it's a change alignment infusion
Forceful conversion to good through anal

>> No.44429328


Is this why Arueshalae is so popular?

Imagine purifying Greta through handholding, cuddling and gentle missionary rather than the rough doggystyle she's probably used to.

>> No.44429350

Its hard to tell isn't it? He was basically the artsy side of Shelyn in his youth (and in many ways, still is) and that means he covers quite a lot of art.

>> No.44429365

>Having her alignment forcibly purified via enema

Goddamn, I actually do kind of want to see this now.

>> No.44429372

Even when it's free it's a trap because rapid reload makes the regular light crossbow much faster firing.

Crossbows are traps overall though to begin with.

>> No.44429383

Yes. Which is retarded.

>> No.44429403

For my maneuvers I grab as many boosts and counters as I can. My standard action is for spells, my swift and immediate are for maneuvers.

Overall i feel very safe because Harbinger gives me maneuverability and safety (also it is a ravenlord harbinger so my dark messenger is strong).

>> No.44429413

I'm compiling a list of all that shit now, hopefully some other good anons can work on it later

Although slight, it's an upgrade (S or P damage and brace), if you are proficient with martial weapons and you want the 18-20 crit you are better off going the nodachi.

>> No.44429426


Holy water enema followed by an infusion of Aasimar "essence" with the Angel Blooded feat would do the trick.

>> No.44429436


fuck meant to quote >>44429323 in the second paragraph

>> No.44429462

I thought Greta was canonically not getting any, and that's why she's so desperate to hook up with someone? It seems more likely to me that she's going to want to rough doggy style since its been so long since she last had it. Which suites my tastes just fine anyway.

Anyway, I don't think I could tell you why Arueshalae is so popular. It's probably part purification, taking an evil girl and making her good. Part of it is that succubi are hot. The idea of saving the sexy evil girl is super old and pretty cliched, it's always the pretty 10/10 evil chick that's redeemable. Maybe the rest of it is lack of other waifus in the AP? I've never heard of others in it, at least.

>> No.44429486

Pretty much every other major NPC is either old, a dick, or already in a relationship. The only other major one is the Queen, and she's pretty fucking suicidal all things considered.

>> No.44429491

Actually this makes me wonder, while I doubt I have the means to do it, is it even possible to capture Nualia or do you have no choice but to kill her?

I haven't played or read much about RotRL, and recently started playing it.

>> No.44429535

Do primal fury charging maneuvers work while horseback?
I want to play a mounted ambush hunter, but this might put a damper on my scamper.

>> No.44429539

Also she's a pure waifu who just wants true love.

Also as a bonus of being a succubus, literally demon lord tier at sex.

>> No.44429564

What's your favorite in character trial?

I was playing a character who really needed power, like really fucking needed power, to the point he decided to sell a good portion of his soul. In the setting the fey courts are divided into two for each season, and he ended up selling his soul to the Unseelie winter court, the court of the hunt.

This meant that despite adventuring every day with his friends, each night he would be taken in his dreams to participate in the hunt. He would be stripped naked and released into the forest, and chased by the fey enjoying the festivities.

They would always give him a sword and encourage him to fight, because otherwise it would be boring, and each night he would die in the dream and wake up exhausted (the condition).

The trial would continue until he either escaped, or died of exhaustion. He finally managed to beat them by instead of running into the forest sneaking back into the fey's camp and ransacking it before laying a trap for one of the fey (isolating him from his hounds and the rest of the hint).

And that's how my DM let me retrain into PoW levels from fighter.

>> No.44429566

The other good-aligned PCs should probably contribute some of their essence too, just in case that helps.

>> No.44429572

Depends on the GM and character I suppose.
A sufficiently powerful class like a master summoner or a synthesist can afford to go full non lethal and capture her no problem.

>> No.44429599


Don't forget she's got about 7 more charisma than the average Succubus, she's Areelu Voresh tier hot.

>> No.44429616

>human with racial heritage (centaur)
Fucking PF makes magical realm too easy

>> No.44429637


Canonically, Greta is seeking a long-term mate because she wants one, it's less "I can't get any" and more "I want to settle down."

>> No.44429645

one of the classes that has Primal Fury on its discipline list has two mounted class features (Outrider's Gambit and Cavalry Gambit). I'd think it's safe to say if you're entitled to a charge you can make it with your mount.

>> No.44429670

That's good to know.
Rangers may still not get jack shit for class features, but I'll shit damage on stuff with a lance.
Should I use a shield so I can give the ac bonus to my mount or two-hand the lance for delicious power attack damage?

>> No.44429700

I don't know, Nualia is a Lamashtan, isn't she? Something like that would be hot, but it might not help the attempt to purify her. Or maybe it would, since it shows she can get it on the good side of things too? She's leading the goblin hordes, right? Is there going to be a chapter where she's taking care of "paying" the all goblin tribe leaders at the same time?

>> No.44429719

PoW: Expanded systems and use chapter §3a has this to say, by the way
>Maneuvers and Mounted Combat - When a martial disciple initiates a martial maneuver (strike or boost) during a mounted charge attack, the initiation of the maneuver overrides the damage bonuses that are sometimes gained (such as from the feat Spirited Charge or while wielding a lance) while performing this action. The initiator inflicts damage as if it were a normal attack while mounted and then the strike and/or boost’s additional damage and effects apply to the target. If the strike includes a charge attack component, the initiator’s mount forgoes its action this round and performs a full round action to facilitate the movement portion of the strike and may move up to twice its base movement speed as if it were charging. Apply the effects of the strike to the initiator’s attack at the end of this charge as normal. Martial counters and stances are unaffected by being mounted, and may be applied or used as normal.

also, AC bonus does not become meaningful and does not scale for the investment you put into it, compared to another defense like miss chance

>> No.44429731


Canonically, Greta being a winter wolf in an evil society that values domination would mean she'd prefer her mate to take her rough, especially if she's developed feelings for the character!

You can introduce the lovey-dovey handholding later, but at the start it'll be doggy and prone-bone for a while.

>> No.44429739

Is the anon that was asking about making money from this even around still? Or are all these good and potentially profitable ideas just spewing out into the aether like "holy water" after Nualia's purifying?

>> No.44429750

I remember when my GM tried to give me a waifu and neither I nor my character felt anything for her. Apparently he got mad because she was supposed to betray me later.

>> No.44429772


>Rest of the party joins in
>Barbarian is curiously absent
>Side-panel showing him plowing Shayliss in their room at the Rusty Dragon Inn with Ameiko shouting from downstairs to keep it down.

>> No.44429801

>I remember when my GM tried to give me a waifu and neither I nor my character felt anything for her.

Anon, I know exactly how that feels, my DM effectively shoved this Samurai chick into my character's face as his love interest and I've spent the last 7 RL months showing absolutely zero affection or interest in her.

Care to give us a bit of storytime?

>> No.44429850


>The party paladin gets the pelt before the party encounters Greta
>Old Deadeye parts the clouds and gives him two thumbs up when they meet her for the first time.

>> No.44429893


Nualia only has 15 AC, +1 Reflex and 16 CMD.
A simple unchained synthesist build like Bite, Reach (bite), Trip (bite) at 4 evo points can lock her down with a simple Grease and Bite AoOs no problem.

>> No.44429923

>I'm a bloodrager, and probably cannot manage to do all of this to lock her down and knock her out
>even if I did, I wouldn't have a way to change her mind or do much of anything after the fact

Oh well, it was a nice thought.

>> No.44429938

Forget Nualia, Forget Greta, Forget the succubutt for a second.

When are we going to be able to waifu Queen Abrogail II?

>> No.44429941


Here is the entirety of Greta's presence in Reign of Winter outside of being a generic guardswoman.

>She is an experienced woman, not some naive little girl

I think this and the way it describes her in the bit on the left confirms Greta isn't a frustrated nerd, but rather a woman who's been around and is now ready to find a man she can spend the rest of her life with.

>> No.44429942

>tfw hand-holding actually is lewd by Winter Wolf standards
>tfw a PC mistakenly thinks he should hold Greta's hand in front of the other wolves so they buy the act, but Greta just slugs him and storms off with a blush after he tries it

Man, I don't even know. There's enough ideas here that he could be making a multi-chapter doujin if he wanted, and that's not even touching on whatever ideas he has. Wasn't he suggesting trying to cover the whole AP in lewd doujin form though? How many "chapters" would it be worth dedicating to each of the six books in an AP? It's so much stuff that I have to imagine he can't come through with it, even though it'd be awesome if he could.

And there was an anon a couple threads back talking about commissioning some actual porn of Pathfinder characters and asking who /pfg/ would be interested in seeing. Haven't heard from him again either, but hopefully he's still kicking.

>> No.44429958

>When are we going to be able to waifu Queen Abrogail II?

Hell's Vengeance, Book 4 "For Queen and Empire."

>> No.44429959

Well that sucks, but i guess stacking primal fury charges with spirited charge would be too much damage.

>> No.44429970

I was playing a devil blooded tiefling fighter with a bunch of eldritch heritage for pit-touched bullshit. Found out my lineage actually originated directly from a Pit Fiend seven generations back. I wanted no part of it, but apparently hell's politics thought I would be useful (easily manipulated more like).

The love interest was towards that end, she was introduced as a nice bard, also a tiefling, and felt the same "outcast's lot" as I did. The thing is, my character didn't feel that. He knew he was discriminated against, but had spent most of his life as a mercenary since he got sold off as a kid. He couldn't remember his parents and didn't really care, he had enough money now to live the high life. Prostitutes don't really care if you have a set of horns as long as you got enough coin, and his party didn't give a shit he was a tiefling (neither did the mercenary company he eventually ended up in).

She went on and on about changing things, and all I wanted was coin and eventually a nice comfortable place to live out my long life.

She was actually sent by devils in order to tempt me, but was shit at it. Got the point she tried to use mind control on me, but my GM didn't realize how fantastic my saves were and I not only resisted, but fucking put dimensional anchors on her so she couldn't run and butchered her for trying to encroach on my mind.

>> No.44429976

Just grapple her, she can't do shit if you grapple her. Get a high enough CMB and you can tie her up so tight she can't escape her bonds.

>> No.44430056

Covering the whole AP and "Milking" it for all its worth is what I want to do.

Obviously since I'm a procrastinating little fuck it will probably take a while to even get started. Anyways I want it to be bdsm heavy with a lot of emphasis on rough. The MC will probably be a tier 1 to make it believable. And I kind of like the idea of the iconics being involved somehow.

>> No.44430105


You should read half of the encounters in The Howlings to get a good idea on how Winter Wolves behave.

It's full-on "my property disagreed with me, I'm going to eat him... You know how it is with humans."

Greta's probably no different considering her NE alignment.

>> No.44430118

Maybe have the iconics actually doing the AP and the MC is doing it simultaneously with his dick?

>> No.44430164

Do you want to use the particular Iconics that feature in that AP? If so, which Iconics are those? Or would you rather just use your favorite Iconics?

And you could always have an original MC leading the Iconics. It seems to me like that would be the best compromise to strike, especially since it also gives several options to pick from for people to be involved in any single given lewd scene.

>> No.44430171


It was convenient to use as I figured I needed a picture if I wanted people to actually look at the homebrew rather than glance over it in the mass of text.

And hey, I commissioned the picture. Might as well use it.

>> No.44430195


>Implying Seoni isn't all but guaranteed.

>> No.44430200

On one hand, I still wouldn't have anything in my arsenal to convince her afterwards to not be a murderous demon-worshipper and my character would probably just drive his sword through her stomach by the time the party faces her, but on the other hand this is probably one of my DM's fetishes, the kinky motherfucker.

>> No.44430224

fuck, making that list took too fucking long, I can't post all the unique abilities here due to there being too fucking much. I'll put it in a google doc later so people can look at it and shit, but for now I am going to bed.

>> No.44430268

Any pics of cheliax queen full body?

>> No.44430277

He's a good artist, cheap pricing too.

>> No.44430405

I like the idea of an opportunistic malevolent NPC picking off both the iconics and the npcs one a time and having his way with them.

In the comics the main crew was Valeros, Ezren, Seoni, Merisiel and Kyra With Lini showing up briefly. So maybe he spirits one or two away during their occasional screw ups.

Fun prey progression would be:
>Merisiel after she gets ko'ed during the Thistletop raid
>Lini after she helps the iconics then buggers off to do her own thing.

>> No.44430450

Except that double (or more) charging damage is most of the time much better than what the boost or strike could give you.

>> No.44430456

New thread when?

>> No.44430467


New thread.

>> No.44430632

Are you the artist in question, or someone else commenting on his proposed project? Because I'm not sure that seems much like what he had in mind, from what he's described so far.

Personally, that's not much to my tastes and I think it'd be much more interesting to see this done from the perspective of a party playing through the AP. Hell, it could even be run like it's the theater of the mind of a group ERPing the AP. In that case, it would probably be following the exploits of four of the Iconics, and possibly a fifth character (the MC that the potential artist suggested before) who is leading the party. A DMPC basically, except no one would actually care because it's the lewd stuff everyone's there for. Anyway, part of the reason I think that'd be better is because so far everyone commenting on it seem sold on the idea of things like the PCs purifying Nualia with hot dickings, so it sounds like there's more interest in seeing the PCs doing the typical hero thing (but with a much more sexual bend than normal) rather than having it focus on a single, evil character just opporating behind the scenes and stealing the girls of the AP one by one.

If you are the actual potential artist, then I maintain my stance of do what you want, but that idea is less interesting to me at least. Which, I mean, is fine! You're not going to be able to appeal to everyone, especially when it comes to smut. I just mean I'd be disappointed.

>> No.44430668

I consider it to be worth two feats. One to get "you've got a backup weapon," and one to get "you can use your weapon well."

For reference, in 3.5, you could do that off of one feat if you ate some WBL costs. I think two feats to not have to spend money on a weapon is about in line for the value of two feats, especially early on in the game.

>> No.44430777


It's terribly-written, yeah.

The occultist has a couple important things that makes it fairly good:

>The ability to get up to seven different passive abilities that are not great, but aren't terrible
>Similarly, the ability to get up to seven active abilities that are decent but not great
These are gotten over 18 levels.

>At 3rd level and every odd level after, you get a Focus Power. These range from terrible to incredibly good.
>Some highlights include stuff like Summon Monster a bunch of times per day as a standard action, solid fog that doesn't affect you, the ability to utterly wreck mystery plots in several ways, save or loses, minionmaking, buffing allies, using AoE spells without hitting allies, and other neat things

And finally, the thing that makes them hilarious
>42 spells known by level 18, not including cantrips. Spontaneous casting.

>> No.44430834

I'm the guy who thought of doing a doujin yeah. Oddly enough I'm not surprised that some prefer good aligned dickings to evil-er dickings that I want to go for.

For reference I would probably take a lot of inspiration from fatal pulse/victim girls less the snuff.

I'm sure a lot of people dislike the idea of some sort of sociopath being less than tender with their waifus. But for me I think its better to have it out that he's not a nice guy rather than some noble MC performing equally wicked acts and trying to paint himself as good.

>> No.44431740

I was stuck in this line of thinking.
Then I played a gnome bard and then an elf magus.
Now I'm just waiting for the game where I can be a centaur monk.

>> No.44431753

What's the best stance for a level 5 stalker with Scarlet Throne? It seems Broken Blade and Thrashing Dragon get the good ones. It seems Scarlet Einhander is still the best one, right?

>> No.44431876

You have yet to give a citation for where you came up with this. All her backstory said was that Desna gave her a dream where she remembered her past life.

>> No.44432138

Your best bet is maybe something with a summoner and an eidolon.

>> No.44432407

Sartre's eyes are all over the place.

>> No.44432463

Makeshift explosions.

>> No.44432633

Having higher stat bonuses doesn't remove problems the Chained Monk has, like his weak BAB and how it affects his ability to do things like combat maneuvers. Though some of the archetypes do help with that. I wish they could be ported more cleanly to Unchained Monk as well though.

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