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[ERROR] No.43249098 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Hey /tg/, would Byzantinian Lamellar style armor be reasonable to have equipped to a steppe based kingdom in my homebrew setting? I'm trying to make a reasonably realistic style for the kingdom, and also happen to like the look of the armor itself. Would it not be fitting for the warm climate of such an area?

>> No.43249160

>>43249098
Although heat was a concern, it did not influence armour use as much as people think. Even the prophet Muhammad in the heat of the Arabian desert sometimes wore two mail coats to battle.

>> No.43249232

>>43249160
That's interesting. It's just my first time writing up my own stuff like this, so I like to try to be historically accurate. I remember before seeing people discuss the influence of climate on armor styles and uses.

>> No.43249660

>>43249098

Lamellar armour, though made from boiled leather, is actually one of the most common types of armour found in steppe cultures. It would have been more common in temperate climates, as well, due to accessibility of the material and the cost efficiency, but the leather would start to rot under continued exposure to wet climates, so the principle kept to hotter climate regions.

Apart from that, any sort of armour apart from full plate would be feasible in steppe climates, seeing how scale and maille are equally represented in those areas.

Apart from that, steppes aren't always "that" hot, mind you. Mongolians come from a steppe background and they traditionally wear very thick clothing to resist the cold winds.

>> No.43249691

>>43249098
I mean, Byzantium was pretty warm. It *was* Greece and Turkey.

>> No.43249764

>>43249232
If the choice is between being hot and tired and being dead, you imagine how it panned out most of the time.
Arabs and persians routinely wore long mail coats or something called a kazaghand (basically one or two layers of mail with padding around and between them, all sewn into one fairly convenient jacket or coat). Indian armour of choice was mail-and-plate.

Don't think about climate (much), think about the economical and social concerns instead.

>> No.43251582

>>43249660

Seconding this. Lamellar, along with scale, were used heavily by a variety of steppe and nomad cultures. Huns (pic related), scythians, parthians ect. It makes sense when you consider that the little scales, though labor intensive, don't require huge furnaces or forges. Easy to make and and repair, if time consuming. Also, scales can be made from a huge variety of materials. Leather, iron, steel or bronze.

>> No.43251603

>>43251582
>Huns (pic related)

>> No.43251623

>>43249098
>Byzantinian

>> No.43251803

>>43249098
>You are not fit to wear the purple!
One day i'll hear someone use this insult in fantasy fiction

>> No.43252078

requesting more pics of Byzantine armours

>> No.43252232

tibetan close enough to the steppes for you?

>> No.43253309

>>43252078

Say no more fam

>> No.43253338

>>43253309

>> No.43253374

Since I saw some people talking about Arabic armours, I'll just post this tidbit that popped into my head.

It's not like the Arabs didn't see the value in plate armour. It was just a matter of economics that they never developed their own plate armour.

Arab metal smiths refused to make plate armour, since it was seen as a cheap cop-out to drive them out of business, their skill laying in mail and lamellar etc.

>IIRC

So hell, if you want to, you can even have fucking steppe horse archers in plate. Just make sure they have gloves, and not plate gauntlets.

>> No.43253453

>>43252232
Tibet appears to have had a significant amount of Mongolian influence in their armour.

>>43253374
Any source for this? Seems to me a customer taking his coin and turning around to leave would be a pretty effective way to make people try making something new. Plus, it isn't just the Arabs going at it here. Ottomans, Persians, the various Afghani and Pakistani peoples, and onwards into India. You'd think someone would swallow their pride.

Also, a book on middle eastern armour manufacture sounds like a thing I want in my life.

>> No.43253492

>>43253453
I dunno man. If I had a source, I would have attached it.

It does make sense though, Arabian cultures have a long history of corruption and "I don't care if X is more effective as Y, Y makes me more money so we're doing Y".

>> No.43253606

>>43252232
>>43253309
>>43253338
Damn I love scale armor.
>it was the "shitty cheap default" for fighters in D&D3

>> No.43253772

>>43253492
>"I don't care if X is more effective as Y, Y makes me more money so we're doing Y".

That's hardly outright corruption. Perhaps there wasn't enough demand to justify the expense of setting up an expensive new blast furnace?

>> No.43253864

>>43249098
>warm climate
Steppes aren't any hotter than the Mediterranean climate of Byzantium.

They have much colder nights and winters, the hot days in hot months aren't much different.

>> No.43253940

>>43253309
So any noteable examples of fantasy with characters running around with this type of armour?

>> No.43254013

>>43251803
I love those insults as well as an old Arabic one
>may your children all be beautiful daughters.

>> No.43254102

Polish hussar commanders often wore lamellar or scale armor because it looked flashier, even though they offered inferior protection to plate armor. John Sobiesky wore one as he led the largest cavalry charge in history at the battle of Vienna. Pic related.

Needless to say the eastern borderlands of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth were mostly steppes.

>> No.43254205

>>43254013
That's pretty good. Got any more?

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