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[ERROR] No.40678580 [Reply] [Original] [4plebs] [archived.moe]

Pathfinder General /pfg/

Old thread >>40672819

Using magical denizens of the earth for hard labor Edition.

>> No.40678598

>"Holy fuck I fucking hate this stew fucking brown pile of shit imma make it blue."

>> No.40678742

I have a "bad" habit of throwing my players into encounters that start out simple, and then get more complicated as reinforcements arrive and shit gets real.

However, I typically have these situations turn out a lot less hard than they look because it gives players a sense of accomplishment. The appropriate enemies for a level 1 encounter threw a thunderstone to alert 4 more thugs, but the thugs were effectively level 1 commoners with clubs. Technically this is an APL+2 encounter now (and comes with XP as such), the fighter can pretty much cleave all 4 of them out in a round if the sorcerer doesn't grease/color spray/whatever them into worthlessness first.

However, my new group seems to think that I'm trolling them by making the fights 'so hard'. I just like dramatic encounters and high XP/treasure rewards. Am I being a butt or is this pretty okay?

I've been GMing for years and years but this new group is nothing like the old gang.

>> No.40678770

>>40678742
My rule of thumb is that as long as the party could survive three encounters of this type in a single adventuring day without any deaths, it's properly tuned.

>> No.40678771

>>40678742
Fights should wax and wane in difficulty. Speaking as a player who has a GM who likes super difficult encounters all the time, it's really draining emotionally to always be beaten within an inch of your life.

>> No.40678785

>>40678742
Including such fights is fine, just don't make it every fight. Some fights should be easy, some should be at CR=lv, and some should be hard.

>> No.40678786

>>40678580
I want to marry a drow!

>> No.40678799

>>40678786
You keep saying that anon, but you would not be happy if you married a drow. It would not work out for you.

>> No.40678804

>>40678770
>>40678771
Oh yeah, I tend to do this kind of stuff for encounters that I feel need the big crescendo, like the last fight of a session. Prior this this they were sweeping up centipedes and stomping other weaker encounters.

Effectively they feel unstoppable, then get into an encounter that seems really way over their heads and do surprisingly well and feel awesome. Then in the future they don't go to shit whenever shit gets hard because they feel like they can handle it. This group is slightly resistant so far but I'll make men (and women) of them yet.

>> No.40678813

>>40678804
OR I'm a huge faggot for trying to change how my players view the game and their characters. That's what I was hoping to determine.

>> No.40678842

>>40678813
Sounds fine to me anon. Toughen the fuckers up. 1/3 of their encounters or so should be at ~CR+2 anyways.

>> No.40678873

So how many of "iconic" characters are SJW shit?

I know the brown cleric is a dyke, won't be surprised about the sorc and qt barb is a man h8r, and I think the elf rogue is retarded?

>> No.40678886

>>40678813
IMO a *hard* boss fight should be CR+3 out CR+4, with action economy comparable to the PCs, or gratuitous use of large aoe effects.

>> No.40678888

>>40678873
Wait if I remember the Elf Rogue and Human male fighter were a thing

>> No.40678907

>>40678873

All of them, even our beloved Anti-Paladin who is but a caricature of Evil White CisHet oppression.

>> No.40678909

>>40678786
Enjoy your fleshwarping.

>> No.40678933

>>40678907
That anti-paladin is so cool though

For the HATE-triarchy!

>> No.40678940

>>40678873
There's a fucking reason liberals flock to Pathfinder.

>> No.40678942

>>40678886
I usually use an NPC of my own creation and/or a super monster plus a bunch of comparatively worthless fodder.

>> No.40678958

>>40678873
Witch is best waifu 10/10 would retire and make love to each night in front of the fox

>> No.40678968

>>40678909
What if your drow waifu is using fleshwarping to give you a dick big enough to have missionary sex that she can actually feel for procreative purposes?

>> No.40678970

>>40678873
Roge and cleric are an item, though in the comics its not too obnoxious, only slightly so, its not that bad and they actually have some characterization

Shaman is a magical tranny, and is a pointless character with only that as a character trait.

No one else other than the gay wizard comes across as SJW, experience maybe the emo magus. The rest are somewhat bearable and possess common character archetypes seen in other forms of fiction.

Brawler is Toph, Monk is looking for his sister, Druid is a hippy, Fighter is Man's Life, Ranger is grizzled Ranger, Hunter is Laura Croft, etc

>> No.40678973

>>40678909
>>40678799
Don't worry anons, I'll find a bride to smother with my pure love!

>> No.40678993

>>40678970
>No one else other than the gay wizard comes across as SJW
>Druid is a hippy
Pick one.

>> No.40678995

>>40678958
>that picture

>> No.40679009

>>40678886
That depends on your players. Mine would never survive such an encounter because they have very little idea of how to play well. Their idea of tactics is to have the wizard cast fireballs at the largest collection of enemies first while the fighter stands in front and gets attacked by everyone in the area and the druid casts heals on him.
My old group would have thrown down walls and traps and summons and illusions and could probably have aced a CR+4 encounter, but my current group tends to struggle with CR encounters.

>> No.40679011

>>40678970
Didn't the cleric sell the rogue into slavery?

>> No.40679022

>>40678993
It would be SJW, if not for the fact the other characters think she's a weirdo, and constantly berate her for causing trouble or just being a retard.

>> No.40679041

>>40678813
You're not a huge faggot. Our GM has always come up with clever ways to defeat the "we're invincible" attitude when new players join our group. It's a necessity as it urges new players to the group to not just go charging in to every situation and evaluate what's going on, what might possibly happen or how npcs might react.
My old GM recently invited me back to join his new group made up of two fighters, a ranger and a melee cleric who doesn't heal. Every encounter we've come up against that could have been taken care of either without combat or done much more efficiently they've charged in with a disregard of any consequences, to the point of sparing a minor villain because they promised "not to cause trouble ever again" which pissed off the entire town who was paying us to either bring them to justice or bring them their head. Pair with that the fact that two hours prior they made the exact same decision with two other NPCs who came back later and tried to kill them.
There's nothing wrong with teaching your new players that their decisions, poor or otherwise, may have consequences.

>> No.40679066

>>40678968
> Making your waifu do it.
> Not providing your own alteration.
Martial Pleb detected

>> No.40679092

>>40678995
You take that back you motherfucker

>> No.40679098

I want to play an archer, but I don't want to play a ranger.

What are some good options?

>> No.40679112

>>40678995
No, your thinking of the Shaman

>> No.40679114

>>40678942
I do those sometimes, and sometimes go with a homebrewed boss monster, angry-dm style.

>> No.40679118

>>40679098
The fighter archer archytype is bretty gud

>> No.40679134

>>40679098
Bard, paladin, fighter, warpriest, monk (zen archer), etc. Pretty well any class that can hold a bow can be an effective archer.

>> No.40679139

>>40679098
Zen Archer is okay. Fighter can Archer too, but fighter is aweful. Divine Hunter Paladin is also decent, plus you can share your mercies at range. Inquisitor can also do it. Bow Bard is also a thing

If DSP is allowed, Hawkguard Warder is good, plus you can use Bucklers with Bows

>> No.40679318

>>40678786
Where did I put my adamantine pick?

>> No.40679338

>>40679318
What are you going to do with that anon?

>> No.40679359

>>40678580
>This stew needs a little more salt... This is not as good as what we had at the tavern a couple weeks ago... MOTHERFUCKERS!!! Tell me how it tastes now, spiced up with a load of good old elven date rape!!!

>> No.40679364

>>40679338
Pick her.

>> No.40679381

>>40679134
>>40679139
Alright, another pair of questions I guess then, so that I can figure out where to go with this concept.

Is there any way to reduce the penalty for inappropriate sized weaponry? EX. Using a large long bow as a medium creature.

And is there any good ranged rouge?

>> No.40679392

>>40679098
If you don't mind crossbow the bolt ace gunslinger archetype is neat.

>> No.40679395

>>40679114
In case you weren't sure what I meant:
http://angrydm.com/2010/04/the-dd-boss-fight-part-1/

Boss Fights with a single boss monster that actually FEEL like a boss-fight.

>>40679338
>What are you going to do with that anon?
I'm going to continue to annoy him because I know where he left his adamantine pick, and I'm not telling him because its funny.

Also, friendly reminder that punctuation is important.

>> No.40679402

>>40678786
What is the buttmask for?

>> No.40679426

>>40679381
>ranged rouge
I don't think they have a way to apply makeup at range in pathfinder. I don't recall seeing an airbrush anywhere.

>Is there any way to reduce the penalty for inappropriate sized weaponry
If you can get away with 3.5 material you can take monkey grip.

>> No.40679428

>>40679402

>> No.40679439

>>40679381
If 3rd party stuff is okay with your GM you can do half-giant to get powerful build, otherwise one of the tiefling alternate racial traits lets you wield weapons 1 size larger without penalty. Combine that with permanent gravity bow for two sizes up.

>> No.40679473

>>40679098
Inquisitor archer does alright. Sniper rogue is a little more difficult. Maybe you could make Cavalier work for you too.

>> No.40679509

>>40679098
Bard

>> No.40679539

>>40679381
For a ranged rogue I believe you have to be within 30ft to apply sneak attack to ranged attacks barring buying the expensive sniper goggles.
To be able to apply it though you cannot use flanking the opponent must be flatfooted vs you which means unseen/invisible. Besides a ring of invisibility you can achieve this by rolling an unchained rogue and taking the stealthy sniper rogue talent to reduce the -20 stealth check penalty to -10, then take the signature skill feat for stealth which will reduce it by another 10 making the penalty for stealthing after attacking 0. Then its just a matter of passing checks vs their perception.

>> No.40679618

>>40679473
Actually, that is a pretty decent idea, is there any classes/archetypes where you don't have to use a horse?

Maybe similar to pic related?

>> No.40679640

>>40679539
Don't forget that you can make an opponent flat-footed by making a feint. IIRC there's a teamwork feat that can let two martials share a feint against a flanked enemy.

>> No.40679642

>>40679364
>>40679395
I think 5e had it right with Lair actions? Basically at certain Initiatives (10, 5, 0) in the order, the environment would do something, generally at the behest of the boss.

>> No.40679661

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sp3NKQlJPuo

If you want shit like the Samurai's from this, what would actually be best? A PoW class? Unchained version of Ninja somehow acquiring full BAB?

>> No.40679671

>>40679642
Definitely agree with this. If you're fighting the enemy in their own base, they'll have prepared it against invaders. Cue fighters manning gun emplacements, pre-set mortars shelling the path up to the building, blast doors closing when they infiltrate the bunker and so on.

>> No.40679749

>>40679640
Feinting is usually a standard action though unless you take improved feint which makes it a move action.
I've never actually done it but I assume if you're sniping from a range in which you can apply sneak attack and are currently hiding via stealth you can re-stealth after every shot to sneak attack some more. The feat+rogue talent combination just makes it much more feasible by not taking the -20. This should come online a lot earlier than waiting to buy a ring of invisibility. Also its not countered by true seeing.

>> No.40679808

>>40679618
None that I know of. Been looking for some dragon-cohort archetypes.

Closest I've come across is using an eidolon to approximate a dragon, using either summoner, or spheres of power.

>> No.40679847

>>40679808
There's the Rogue Genius Dragonrider, it's ridiculously powerful, but it exists.

>> No.40679895

>>40679847
Hmm. I'll check that out. Maybe nerf it a bit and include it in my next campaign, with an order of Drake-riding knights or something.

>> No.40679911

>>40679618
Daring Champion archetype trades the mount away for some panache, deeds and such like the Swashbuckler or Gunslinger have. Beast Rider changes your mount into something more like a druid's Animal Companion; you can still ride it but it's easier to make it a combat entity on its own, or a sneaky scout than your horse would be. Castellan is meant more for stationary games where you'll be guarding a fortress I'd think, but mostly gives you some defensive bonuses, Evasion at 6th level as the rogue ability, Improved Evasion at 11th and slightly better Readied attacks. On reading more closely though Castellan gives you the mount, just at 4th level rather than 1st. It does let you pick something less mount-ish, suggesting birds or canines.

>> No.40679919

>>40679618
Beastrider can let you mount dinosaurs.

Not sure if it's compatible with Luring Cavalier, which is the ranged Combat one.

>> No.40679941

>>40679618
Got access to 3pp? Spheres has a 'build your own fucking mount' via conjuration tree.

>> No.40679987

>>40679847
>it's ridiculously powerful
Its only class feature is flying lizard that is basically animal companion in stats, has its breath weapon severely nerfed and limited in uses per day, and doesn't even seem to get blindsense.

>> No.40679994

>>40679661
The Samurai class.

>> No.40680058

>>40679987
This.

I get "free dragon companion" just sounds stupidly powerful, but the class itself is pretty fucking weak and just gets a watered down dragon in return.

>> No.40680079

I know Pathfinder has a not!Egypt and not!Asia places. Is it possible to play in either place or are they "far away" and "mystical"?

>> No.40680092

>>40680079
Not egypt is just across the not Mediterranean sea

>> No.40680097

>>40679661
Warlord Bushi

>> No.40680118

>>40680079
Yes actually, not Egypt is in the innersea's region, not Asia might be the problem but not bad if you dm makes you travel there

>> No.40680120

>>40680079
There are APs that take place in both

>> No.40680152

>>40679987
>>40680058
Aside from full bab, 3 good saves, d10 hit die, bonus feats, half casting with cantrips, the ability to teleport your dragon from anywhere a few times a day, spell resistance, energy resistance energy resistance, low light vision all the way up to blind sense.

As a class you've got quite a bit of utility are you guys just upset your dragons that end up very capable fighters on their own due to their own d12 hit die and 3 good saves and various special defenses and special abilities aren't ancient dragons with 9 levels of at will spells and millenea to machinate, guarding its very own treasure hordes?

>> No.40680216

>>40680079
The "main" Pathfinder region is basically the mediterranean, so not!Egypt is actually pretty damn accessible. Not!Asia is a bit more iffy, but you could definitely visit not!Turkey, which is technically mostly in Asia, so why not go a little bit further east.

>> No.40680245

>>40678580
PFG: I have an idea. We take average stats form the monster manuals and use them as a baseline for where a character SHOULD be at various levels:

Data here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Agyi5tgUTatCdHFjS05Kb18xVGd2bTZhak5YaGQtMFE#gid=3

For example: the "average monster" at level 12 has an AC of 26.7 and has 159 HP.

How much damage should a melee character be doing to be considered "good"?

>> No.40680266

>>40679994
But the Samurai is awful.

>> No.40680307

>>40680245
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/monster-creation
Monster's HP divided by number of DD in party, plus pounce.

>> No.40680340

Question: psionics are much less well-known than arcane or divine magic, but what are the "signature" manifestations that represent psionics the same way Magic Missile and Cure Light Wounds represent magic?

>> No.40680516

>>40680307
what is the CR that a single character should face?

>> No.40680572

Are there any paladin archetypes that scale off of wisdom instead of charisma?

>> No.40680600

>>40680516
CR is rated for a party of four so 1/4 their level maybe? CR is wonky anyways.

>> No.40680778

>>40679473
>>40679618
>avoiding using a horse
Disgusting, unless you're going for Based Bactrian Camel, in which case you are forgiven.

Luring Cavalier is where it's at for mounted archery, though.

Go full-Steppes on some nerds. Don't forget to bring a lance even though it's an archer's game, though. Sometimes you need to charge your weakling foe after ample softening with arrows.

>> No.40680806

>>40680152
>half-casting with cantrips
Not all that great by itself, especially since it's only 4th level caster, and follows the Paladin's "caster level is character level-4" casting level thing.

>ability to teleport your dragon from anywhere a few times a day
Why wouldn't your dragon already be with you? Unless your in town or trying to keep the fact you have a dragon a secret, in either case the ability isn't particularly useful. Plus it's a full-round action.

>spell resistance
Spell resistance is worse than useless since it keeps your own party from healing/buffing you. It doesn't even come online until level 16, at which time no serious enemy spellcaster is going to give a shit about it.

>energy resistance energy resistance
Saying it twice doesn't make it any better. Plus it's to a max of 20 period, and only against the element your dragon uses for it's breath weapon.

>low light vision all the way up to blindsense
So you can see enemies better that still kick your ass? Handy I guess? Plus blindsense doesn't hit until 14 and only within 15 feet.

>> No.40680810

Threadly Reminder that you are a unique person with something truly special that no one else has

>> No.40680828

>>40680516
-3 to -4 his level, 3-4 times per day, or his level -1 to his level, once per day.

>> No.40680844

>>40680810
Fingerprints?

>> No.40680929

>>40680828
Thanks.

>> No.40680958

>>40680929
http://www.d20srd.org/extras/d20encountercalculator/

>> No.40681148

Is taking two mostly useless racial HD and the basic statline of the animal in question the only way to play an awakened animal?

>> No.40681223

>>40681148
Make a custom race.

>> No.40681398

>>40681223
Some GMs would be defensive about that...
Not to mention that the official race creation rules do not allow animals or magical beasts.

>> No.40681453

>>40681398
>Some GMs would be defensive about that...
But not about awakened animals?

>> No.40681476

>>40680216
Not about visiting, but playing a full campaign in those places.

>> No.40681536

>>40681148
How does taking two racial HD to be an animal even work? I've never seen rules on this.

>> No.40681584

>>40681453
>Pathfinder
>reasonable GMs

Choose one.

>>40681536
It's not really a rule, just extrapolation.
The two magical beast HD come from the Awaken spell. Afterwards you follow the rules, or rather suggestions for monsters as PCs.

>> No.40681596

I want to seduce and marry Iomedae!

>> No.40681709

How would you go about creeping out and/or terrifying players?
inb4 use another game system

>> No.40681722

>>40680572
not!Asia's feasible if you play someone from a colony, a handful of those exist, but the vast majority of the people are gonna be Asian.

not!Egypt is easily accessible, but it isn't in a vacuum, there's a lot of influence on not!Egypt, notAsia's gonna be separated from the rest of the world because there's an ocean in between.

>> No.40681735

>>40681722
What?

>> No.40681749

Did some math. Zen archers can do barbarian-tier damage at level 13.

The zen archer doesn't have spell sunder or CAGM, but has amazing range and some minor utility. Wind wall fucks up the archer, but wall of stone does the same for the barbarian. The barbarian does arround 140 damage against an AC of 25 on four seperate attacks, so -4*dr. The zen archer does about 100 damage on 7 seperate attacks, but clustered shot means you apply DR once and hammer the gap means that you deal extra damage per hit. It tends to even out.

So yea: zen archer is as good as a super min-maxed barbarian, and can do his shit from range with no resources.

>> No.40681776

>>40681749
PS: the zen archer has a really rough level 1 through about 4 life, but then quickly picks up. Barbarian is amazing at level 1 to about 4, and then starts sucking till level 10 when he gets pounce.

>> No.40681820

>>40681722
Don't forget that there's a not!Asia just to the east of the Inner Sea too. It's just more focused on India and the middle east, whereas the western not!Asia is China and Viet Nam.

>> No.40681938

>>40681722
Don't forget the Taldane Port Colony in Not Asia which is essentially Not Hong Kong

>> No.40682008

>>40678580

>Using golems or Earth Elementals to build a brothel

Guess that's what happens when you give the 18 Cha Party Face only 10 Intelligence.

Seoni is the only Iconic that seems to change design (mostly the boobs) for every book and it's really bugging me.

If they announced she was the MtF Iconic besides the Shaman I honestly wouldn't be surprised, girl can't settle on a cup size.

>> No.40682038

>>40682008
>MtF Iconic besides the Shaman
Wait what? Citation needed, I thought Shaman McNoCharacter was the only.

>> No.40682082

>>40678958

Fucking Feiya in front her her familiar would be hilarious, mostly because the banter and snide remarks would reach critical mass ten thrusts in.

>> No.40682087

>40678104
Supplemental is here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/9fblkac0obf9mzx/Supplemental.pdf?dl=0
I recommend downloading it instead of viewing it on dropbox. It is much easier to search that way.

>40677668
>40677538
The way the author wrote and intended it, you do get full iteratives, and Deadly Aim scales just fine with it.

Which is cool because there is also a veil that gives you a magical spear of light that gets longer and stronger with essence, that also gets BAB = level and works with power attack.

Vizier is entirely tougher than you expect once you take the Essence of the Immortal feat and get double your essence pool as HP (You should have 32 essence at 20 for 64 hit points).

>> No.40682134

>>40681938
Where is this?

>> No.40682136

>>40682087
Is there a systems and use bit for them like there is PoW? It's a little confusing reading through it all.

>> No.40682156

>>40682134
>>40681938

http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Amanandar

New Oppara is the capital.

New Oppara isn't Hong Kong though, GOKA is Hong Kong.

http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Goka

>Goka is a vital port city that rivals Absalom and Katapesh in size and diversity, and serves as a gateway to Tian Xia for travelers.

>> No.40682224

>Throwing shields
>Phantom sun stance
>Infinite burst of throwing shields in every direction

I have a name for it:
"Solar Wind maneuver: ULTRAVIOLET CATASTROPHE"

>> No.40682225

>>40679911
>>40679618
Inspiring Commander is a 3rd party Cavalier Archetype that trades the horse for INSPIRE COURAGE.

Also trades the heavy armor for way way way better teamwork feat sharing and reduces the action to use it much faster. Also sharing the teamwork feats heals your team or some shit.

>> No.40682230

>>40682038

Don't have a citation, sorry, all I remember is hearing that there's a Transsexual Iconic beside the Shaman.

>> No.40682234

How would you go about creeping out and/or terrifying players in PF?
inb4 use another game system

>> No.40682246

I have a question PFG: how do I roleplay? I'm not very good at it.

>> No.40682302

>>40682246
By using your imagination.

>>40682224
I am about to join a mythic game where everyone is a superhero. Consider your idea stolen.

>> No.40682314

>>40682302
>I am about to join a mythic game where everyone is a superhero

>Superhero shield user

Is the character's name going to be Captain Andoran?

>> No.40682328

>>40679847
>>40679618
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/3rd-party-classes/super-genius-games/dragonrider

Yeah, it looks decent, but this class is far from Ridiculously Powerful. You are a shitty fighter, with no combat features, but your dragon is a suped up animal companion. Don't expect to break the game unless your GM just hates that you have flight access to early. But that is the GM's problem, not yours.

>> No.40682356

>>40682314
Something like that, yeah.

>> No.40682397

>>40682136
Yeah, the veilweaving stuff should be there, before the veils section. However, I think the systems and use is on the SRD.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/variant-magic-rules/akashic-magic

Feel free to ask me any questions. I understand the mechanics fairly well.

>> No.40682406

>>40682302
>By using your imagination.
ok, having a interesting character isn't the hard part, actually PLAYING that character in a way that that isn't overbearing or too subtle to get.

>> No.40682450

>>40682397
Oh, cool.

>> No.40682452

>>40682397
Is this 3.5's Incarnum?

>>40682406
Either take acting classes or just ham it up until the others tell you to tone it down.
It's not like you're standing on a stage. Just do whatever seems fun to you.

>> No.40682462

Is there any way to get dex to damage on 2h weapons?

I want to play as a character who uses a halberd or glaive and just jumps around rather than smashing things with strength

>> No.40682475

>>40682302
>mythic
You realize you can actually destroy the universe, right? You can fire an infinite number of shields an infinite distance dealing infinite damage.

>> No.40682480

>>40682462
pow deadly agility helps, though you still don't get 1.5 damage

>> No.40682508

>>40682452
This is 3.5's incarnum, the totemist has been reworks into a full bab class that gets its totem at 11th level.

The incarnate just got better.

And the Soulborn was terrible so they got rid of it and added a monk that can expend essentia to do cool shit. Yes expend as in it's no longer bound to a feat or soulmeld.

>> No.40682511

>>40682462
Piercing thunder style zweihander sentinel.

Piercing thunder discipline's style feat lets you treat polearms/spears as light weapons, thus you can get dex to damage.

Core has the elven branch spear which is finessable, so elven slayer?

>> No.40682522

>>40682480
>>40682511
neat thanks. I will look at both of these

>> No.40682542

>>40682475
We're superHEROes, though.
The Chaotic Random murderhobos are in the other non-mythic campaign. Which I will not join, since the GM admitted to it being the incarnation of everything bad about PF. Except for the wizard just slinging damage spells all day.

>> No.40682580

>>40678580
Someone needs to shoop Laughing Elf into this

>> No.40682607

>>40682542
Yeah but
>there's an enemy somewhere
>infinite damage shields
>there isn't an enemy any more

>> No.40682631

>>40682580

What do you think the Alchemist is sprinkling into the stew?

>> No.40682639

>>40682607
Okay...
Did I miss something, or where's all this "infinite" coming from?

>> No.40682665

>>40682639
blinkback belt, free draw, and throwing shield.
Free action to throw the shield, free action for it to blink back, free action to draw it. Repeat.

>> No.40682673

>>40680844
Clearly your gift is a sense of humor, Anon

>> No.40682685

>>40682607
Phantom Sun stance generates infinite ammo (shields) as a free action
Throwing Shields can be thrown as a free action, so an infinite number of throwing shields can be thrown as a free action
Champion Tier 1 ability Limitless Range grants an infinite range for weapons

>> No.40682718

>>40682631
Powdered Laughing Elf?

>> No.40682739

>>40682718

Exactly, and as you can see Powdered Laughing Elf is a deep blue, which means it contains significant quantities of copper.

Laughing Elf confirmed offspring of Copper Dragon.

>> No.40682755

>>40682673
>dat plumpness

for once I gotta say, good job piazo

>> No.40682764

>>40682685
Can also be accomplished with a simple blinkback belt.

Pierce the heavens with your Shield.

>> No.40682780

>>40682685
Throwing shields don't count as throwing weapons because shields are armor that can be used as weapons.

>> No.40682788

>>40682780
Throwing Shield is a specific type of shield

>> No.40682804

>>40682780
>my shield that I throw at people and deal damage with isn't a weapon.

Sure thing.

>> No.40682825

>>40682804
You're using it as a weapon.

>> No.40682829

>>40682780
Solar Wind explicitly lists them as part of the Thrown weapon group.

>>40682685
After one such stunt I'll have my free action privileges revoked.
Does Path of War happen to have an equivalent of IRON HEART SURGE, too?

>> No.40682854

>>40682780
>Shield
>Not a weapon
>ARMOR?

I hold it in my hand and I smash it into peoples' faces, it's a fucking weapon.
Paizo aren't qualified to say otherwise.

>> No.40682913

>>40678655
>Like, you'd get full BAB (for natural weapons) and flurry actually works with NW attacks now.
>Really?

>Source?

It doesn't have the "can't be used with natural attacks" stipulation it had in the past, ergo, it is combine-able with flurry. Unarmed strikes are just about the only weapons that leave your claw hands free so this is a pretty nice build for some races.

>> No.40682919

Hey /tg/, how do you feel about multiple Animal Companions and/or Eidolons in the party?

>> No.40682941

>>40682919

It's alright but I would consider it a Bad Thing, mostly because it eats up time that could be better spent playing the game and advancing the story.

>> No.40682973

Usually you're asked what Race fits a class. Today I ask you. What are Dwarves good at class-wise?

>> No.40682981

>>40682941
But how do they not advance the story and be part of playing the game?
Unless you're playing with one of those spazzes who doesn't plan out their turn at all in combat, but in that case why haven't you kicked them out yet?

>> No.40682990

>>40682508
What is this about 11th level? did you mean 1st level?
>>40682919
I think its fine as long as the player is competent enough to keep the AC's turns short. 2 pouncing tigers for instance may take a while, especially if both players are also pouncing wildshape druids, or blasting spellcasters. Summoners may take a while too, depending on what they want to do.

>> No.40683001

>>40682973
See that thing that says Dwarves get a bonus to strength and wisdom at the cost of less charisma?
Go look at classes that use strength and/or wisdom.
Done.

>> No.40683015

>>40682973
This is exactly how I think about shit. What are Dwarves good at? What are Elves good at?
What are Halflings good at? What are gnomes good at?

I have a hard time with these three, even though they're "ubiquitous" and "core" races. Strength penalties are a bitch, Constitution penalties are a bitch, and I want strength with my wisdom, not Constitution, because I can put adequate points in CON via PB, but the +2 is worth more when I can slap it on top of a number that's already higher (like my attack stat, Strength.)


Why play a Dwarf, Elf, Halfling, or Gnome? What are some viable builds for any of these guys?

>> No.40683023

>>40682973
I like dwarf warpriests

>> No.40683024

>>40683001

But Dwarves get Constitution and Wisdom.

>> No.40683042

>>40683001
+Con/WIS, - CHA
Not str

>> No.40683079

>>40683001
Dwarves get Constitution, not Strength.


Strength and Wisdom races are fucking awesome. That's probably my favorite combination of bonuses, tied with Strength and Charisma.

>> No.40683097

>>40683015
Dwarf statline may not be optimal for a lot of things, but it's good for any class that doesn't require high charisma.

>> No.40683103

>>40683015
>Why play a Dwarf, Elf, Halfling, or Gnome?

I dunno, maybe because they want to? There's plenty of viable builds for all of those races, where the hell are you looking?

>> No.40683106

>>40683015
Dwarf has basically best saves in the game. Wis/Con bonus makes them great clerics, warpriests, inquisitors, druids.

Halfling and gnome are small sized, making them ideal for mounted combat. Halflings also have risky striker if you want to absolute DPS with a build that attacks rapidly.

Elf is kinda shit, especially since half elf can poach all their stuff by RAW now. May have use as alchemists/investigators because of the free weapon profs.

>> No.40683125

>>40683079
Oread are hype for this reason, they are my exotic race of choice for most classes, since most of their tradable race traits are solid, like +1 Nat armour, treacherous earth and crystalline form

>> No.40683128

>>40683106

>Elf
>Not the best Magus or Slayer in the game

>> No.40683160

>>40683128
Not if tieflings exist.

Slayers don't even really need INT, and with 6 skill points, it's kinda wasted on them anyway. The CON penalty laso hurts for a frontliner (same with Magus).

>> No.40683225

>>40683015
Gnomes and halfings, though mostly gnomes make surprisingly good cavaliers because even with lower strength, the fact that they can operate well in dungeons makes up for it.

Gnomes make good charisma spellcasters because more HP, more Cha, and fuck strength.

Halfings make decent bard archers too, and decent charisma spellcasters as dex is almost as good as con.

I don't like using elves. The con penalty just is not worth it.

>> No.40683358

>>40683042
>>40683024
My point stands.

>> No.40683410

>>40683106
But you don't get a boost to ATTACK STAT as a Dwarf, Anon. How will you club nerds to death without ATTACK STAT?

>> No.40683431

>>40683103
Post some, fag. I'm just saying I have a hard time justifying picking any of them when I can just pick other races that are just as fun and mechanically superior.

>> No.40683453

>>40683125
I prefer Hungerseed Tieflings THICK ONI COCKS, but Oreads are definitely cool customers.

>> No.40683486

Half-giant and Dreige are my go-to for Str/Wis if I want it. Usually Dreige 'cause irooooon.

>> No.40683556

When rolling for percentage stuff like concealment, which should I be using:

d4s or d100s?

>> No.40683563

>>40683453

>You will never unknowingly make the chaste Paladin a size queen after one night of passion.

>> No.40683576

>>40683563
>unknowingly

>> No.40683577

>>40683410
Use that Con to boost Barbarian Rage, that's how.

>> No.40683593

>>40683556
How do you roll for 20% concealment with a d4?

>> No.40683626

>>40683593
>A
Multiple d4s.

But seriously, what I wanted to know is if I should be using a single big dice or a pool of small dice.

>> No.40683634

>>40683576

It's not like she makes it obvious she only loves thick meaty cock.

>> No.40683668

>>40683634
Oh I see what you mean, I meant you making her a size queen was an accident

>> No.40683669

>>40683626
...I-it's a %, anon. You roll a d%. How is this even hard?

>> No.40683697

>>40683669
What?
Huh?
How?

>> No.40683723

>>40683697
you roll a 10, and then you roll another 10. the first ten is teh ten's place and the second ten is the one's place. That is your percentage. if you get 00 you got 100

>> No.40683744

>>40683723
I'll just use a d100.

>> No.40683748

>>40683723
Also sometimes dice are sold with a percentile D10 just in case you get yourself confused like a moron.

>> No.40683826

Hey chaps, does anyone happen to have the Warpath expansion?

>> No.40683952

>>40683668

Well it's also an accident, you're just fucking her how you'd fuck anyone else.

>> No.40683953

>>40682087
Holy crap. That was my request way back, didn't think I'd get an answer (let alone a thread later).
Thank you very much.

>> No.40684083

>>40683556
I use a d20. The % chance is almost never not an increment of 5, and I can do the math in my head fast enough that it doesn't slow me down.

20% Miss Chance? Roll over a 4.

etc.

>> No.40684156 [DELETED] 

>>40684083
>20% Miss Chance? Roll over a 4.
>I can do the math in my head

>> No.40684437

>>40683015

Dwarves make for excellent clerics and druids on account of having a high casting stat and high not-dying stat post racials at the cost of something they don't need much of (clerics need a little CHA, but not a lot if you're not into channeling in a big way).

Steel Soul also means Dwarves are one of the only fighters that don't have horrendous saves against magic, but the joke is on you because you're still a fucking fighter.

Elves are meant to rogue and wizard it up, for the most part, while halflings and gnomes make for good rogues and bards. Also, sorcerers, I suppose.

>> No.40684546

>>40682919
I'm all good with it (like I am with summoning, or even leadership) so long as the player doesn't take a long time on their turn.

If a PC keeps taking a long time I will bring back timers and if you haven't decided what all your character is doing by the time it goes off, you miss your turn.

I don't want to be mean, but I'm not going to let you make combat take an hour and a half because you don't couldn't be bothered to learn what your spells and summons do, and can't be bothered to decide what you're doing on your turn before it comes up.

>> No.40684577

>>40684546
How long are your timers? I was thinking of implementing a timer, ranging from 1 minute to 5.

>> No.40684646

>>40683826
Annnnyone?

>> No.40684650

>>40683563
>>40683576
>>40683634
>>40683668
>>40683952
Is it RAW legal to use Alter Self to become literally yourself but with more strength and a thicker cock? Can you maximize your cock with Alter Self?

>> No.40684693

>>40684650
You can't change into a specific creature with Alter Self so no.

>> No.40684713

>>40684693
Hmm, and it won't be very romantic to just Become some other nigga.

Oh well.

>> No.40684716

>>40684650
I'd allow it.
One of the more common tropes of magical fiction is that some wizards and magi are people who are rather vain on the inside, and the moment they achieve a measure of magical might, they use magic to modify/enhance themselves.

I would, as long as the effects were permanent and not dispellable.

>> No.40684720

>>40683953
My bad man. I went to bed right before you posted your request. Glad my response was seen though!

>> No.40684721

>>40684577
Typically 30 seconds per character (that's 30 for you, and 30 for mr. tiggles the tiger), if things start to be really slow.

But you don't have to be done in 30 seconds, you just have to have decided and be in the process of resolving the action.

So for instance, if you're a wizard, and your turn comes up, you have 30 seconds to tell me what spell you're casting, where, and what options (such as which creature to summon) go along with the spell, and where you're going to move, if you're moving, and you should be starting to resolve that when the timer goes off.

And no, you can't look up the spells or monsters in the rulebook mid-combat, unless it's during other people's turns, then sure whatever, but you're not going to get extra time because you were looking up your spells that you should know/have written on your sheet anyways.

If you're the first person in combat I'll give you a little longer for your first action, maybe 2 minutes.

>> No.40684771

>>40684721
Sounds good. A little bit fast for my current group, but maybe I could turn up the heat later. A minute it is.

>> No.40684817

>>40684716
I was talking Racial Spell-Like Alter Self, actually, but that's not permanent, of course.

>> No.40684841

>>40684771
>If you're the first person in combat I'll give you a little longer for your first action, maybe 2 minutes.
Make sure you give the first person longer, since they're not getting 4+ other people's turns with which to decide what they're doing.

>> No.40684846

>>40684841
Good point. I'll remember that.

>> No.40685028

>>40678970
>Ranger is grizzled Ranger
Are you kidding me? Harsk is a fucking doof.

>MUH BROTHER'S AXE
>MUH CROSSBOW
Seriously a shit. They couldn't have figured out a better dwarven ranger?

>> No.40685055

>>40683410
Unless you are a wis caster...

>> No.40685104

>>40685055
>he doesn't attack dorks as a cleric or druid

Son, they're not faggy wizards. You NEED to fucking club nerds to death when you're playing clerics and druids. It's just the way of things.

>> No.40685113

>>40683410
I put the extra 4 points or so I save on buffing my WIS/CON, into my attack stats.

>> No.40685125

>>40682225
>Also sharing the teamwork feats heals your team or some shit.
It's temporary HP, but yeah.

It's p. fun. I don't know if I'd have ever played it if I hadn't duct-taped it to ZS Warder, though. I never even noticed Warders don't get ranged weapon proficiencies, but the Cavalier side takes care of that for me!

>> No.40685182

I made this a while ago, it's a bloodrager archetype with Mystic's maneuvers. Anyone might want to comment on it?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1hJ2LsZwrrxwIo7V8FTfQ4zKYm3jt2_vMhYDd_Kw_M3g/edit?usp=sharing

>>40685104
Well, the bonus spells that you use to buff yourself are better point for point than 1 more STR I think.

>> No.40685191

Is Cucked-by-Elves-and-out-for-blood a good character concept for a Ranger with favored enemy (Elves)?

>> No.40685194

>>40681749
No one ever said the ZA Monk couldn't do shittons of damage. The Sohei does more, actually, iirc. It's just that they're fuck useless outside of making enemies pincushions.

>> No.40685263

>>40682462
3 levels of Unchained Rogue will give you Dex to Damage with one finesseable weapon. The elven racial weapons and the estoc seem to be valid options for this.

You even get 1.5x Dex with them, which is exclusive to the Unchained Rogue. Good job, Paizo, way to make the iconic TWFing Rogue even less optimal!

>> No.40685295

>>40682829
Nope. There are a few save replacer counters and shit, but they pretty specifically went out of their way to make shit not retarded.

>>40682854
Yeah, good luck getting any DM to agree to that.

>> No.40685315

>>40685191
I can't help but think most of /tg/ fits that concept.

>> No.40685332

>>40685263
To be fair, the TWF rogue probably still has higher DPR if he hits and gets the SA.

But branch spear+combat reflexes is bound to be ridiculous.

>> No.40685353

So I was planning on playing a Magus in an upcoming game, but it turns out the GM is doing ten points buy and wants a kind of gritty, survivalist feel. Can I still make Maguc work, or would I be better off as a Barbarian?

>> No.40685363

>>40685353
>10PB
run away

>> No.40685368

>>40685263
TWF Rogues are Iconic? First I've heard of that. I always saw Rangers as the iconic TWFers.

>> No.40685385

>>40685353
Flee this game and never return to it. Then call the cops and let them know there's a psychopath on the loose.

>> No.40685389

>>40684437
I'm now tempted to make a Dwarven Mutation Warrior/Myrmidon who drinks his mutagens and then punches motherfuckers to death. 16 Str baseline? Not a problem when I've got a mutagen!

>> No.40685393

>>40685353
You are best off with a SAD caster. I'm not even joking.

Holy shit, 10PB seriously?

Bolt ace/Swash or rogue can maybe pull off a single stat martial build without being shit.

>> No.40685426

>>40685368
Every rogue I've ever seen in fiction was always running around with daggers or hand crossbows (or a dagger and a hand crossbow), generally dual wielding them. They're not the straight-forward TWFers like rangers, but it's no less iconic to their style.

>> No.40685430

>>40685353
Your choices with 10 point buy are a druid, a psion, a wizard, a summoner, or a cleric. Nothing else will function against level-appropriate threats.

>> No.40685499

>>40685430
This, summoner is a good option. anything that gets you an AC/summons that will most likely outfight the martials works too.

>> No.40685500

>>40685363
>>40685385
>>40685393
>>40685430
Yeah, I did ask if he could at least up it to 15. I'm hoping after he sees how 10PB actually is he'll let us reroll.
"Shit, there's a ten foot jump? Okay, who took acrobatics and has good Dex? No one? Okay, hopefully another party will pick up the pieces ina month or two. Gentlemen, it was a privilege fighting with you today."
>cue violins.

>> No.40685508

>>40685353
Don't play, or convince the GM that he is insane. >>40685430
This person at least has a good list of stuff to use. Anything with a companion is good, since the companion will be using more than 15 point buy for its stats for the most part.

>> No.40685546

>>40685508
Noted, ta. Magus getting shelved for now then.
Christ, the rest of the party so far is a Brawler and a mad. I don't even know what class. Probably an Expert, because the player actively hates PF.

>> No.40685565

>>40685546
Play a summoner.

>> No.40685567

>>40685546
*and a maid.
Kinda want to run a successful Barbarian just to see if I can. Would fit the gritty survivalist feel the GM is going for.

>> No.40685590

>>40685546

>> No.40685603

>>40685567
>maid
>gritty survivalist feel
Nahhh.

>> No.40685711

>>40685315
My inclination was to go for Archer Hunter to make the whole Cucked-by-Elves angle even more apparent, since he's literally just trying to do Elf Stuff, but he can't even see in the dark or nothing.

Really emphasize the inadequacy angle.

>> No.40685733

>>40685567
See, this is the part where your GM is on fucking drugs. Pathfinder? Gritty survival? CHOOSE ONLY ONE. Fuck dude, you can put a scrawny-ass wizard through a swimming race in /fucking lava/ and he'll live! Not just live but walk out the other side, crispy as fuck, and move and fight without penalties. You can stick a peasant in full plate and force march them without sleep for days and all they get is /tired/. If he wants gritty survival he should run a game actually built for it instead of contributing to PF's rep of attracting fucking grogs.

>> No.40685800

>>40685353
Play a Human Druid with a spinosaurus animal companion and take the alternate racial feature that grants any pet you have +2 to a stat of your choice.

Then laugh at him when he realizes that you have a pet with a higher point buy total than the PCs do.

>> No.40685826

>>40685733
Yeah, if he ever starts getting annoyed at it I'm going to tell him three words. "Gritty Survival? Traveller."
Sure, it might not lend itself to fantasy well, but gritty survival implies low or no magic anyway, so...

>> No.40685841

>>40685826
Traveller, Call of Cthulu? Yeah. All better for this.

>> No.40685847

>>40684720
I sure as fuck wasn't complaining!

One question on Hand Cannons (and I guess riven darts too): What's their critical ratings? Default to 20/x2 due to nothing written?

>> No.40685870

>>40685800
This is a point, the brawler was going to switch to druid. Mostly so he can ignore physical stats by being a bear, but it helps a lot.

>> No.40685876

>>40685847
Yeah, the default 20/x2.

>> No.40685892

>>40678786
That is not a drow, that is an undead elf.

>> No.40685953

>>40685892
Actually, it's an undead elf possessing the body of a night elf (which could count as drow in some interpretations).

>>40685870
Druids don't ignore physical stats in PF. Widlshape only acts as a buff, not a stat replacement.

>> No.40686015

>>40685953
Sylvanas is not a night elf, she's a high elf.

>> No.40686034

>>40686015
Sylvannas is a banshee that body-jacks elves. She is currently inside a night elf body.

>> No.40686066

>>40686015
Yes. An undead high elf, possessing the body of a living night elf.

>> No.40686095

>>40686034
>>40686066
No, she's in her corpse. Did neither of you play WC3?

>> No.40686299

>>40686034
>>40686066
It just looked like that for a while because they built her character out of the nightelf female model, before burning crusade came out.

>>40686095 is right, she is in her own corpse, as she has been since she became undead in WC3.

>> No.40686378

>>40686034
>>40686066
>>40686095
>>40686299

For reference, WCRPG Horde players guide, pg 150

>> No.40686443

>>40686378

Fix'd

>> No.40686817

Yo does anyone know of a decent NPC database for lazy DMs?

Stuff like "I need a mob boss and some goons statted out. Oh look this book has a level 7 Sorceror and some level 3 goon classes. Perfect."

>> No.40686840

>>40686817
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/npc-s

>> No.40686867

>>40685028

Who is the most system savvy or "has their shit together" Iconic?

>> No.40686896

>>40685191

My Dragonslayer started his career because a Brass Dragon cocksleeved his wife (and she loved it) so personally it's a great concept.

Hard to argue against a guy's actions with that kind of motivation.

>> No.40686929

>>40685711
He'll get a spell that helps with that.

>> No.40686930

>>40686840
The Paizo NPC codex is utter shit. Have you ever actually looked at that piece of shit?

Whoever statted that shit out firmly believed the Stormwind falacy was true.

>> No.40686964

>>40686867
Definitely not the fighter. He is 2wf with a longsword and shortsword, and took weapon focus and weapon specialization in both. No power attack.

>> No.40686970

>>40686930

I remember being in a Paizo thread about min-maxing when a developer actually came in and said, "min maxing is bad, because a strength-based wizard or intelligence focused rogue can still have moments to shine, and in the end that's all that matters."

>> No.40686998

>>40686867

Alain is literally out for bitches and gold, he doesn't have any sort of edgy backstory or try hard motivation.

>> No.40687009

>>40686970
Int focused rogue is hilariously bad. I'd rather have an Investigator so that the int gets put to use and I get free d6s on everything.

>> No.40687035

>>40687009

Doesn't matter, as long as the rogue gets one or two moments in a campaign to do a cool thing it's all worth it!

>> No.40687037

>>40686970
I demand a link, anon. A link to this fucking horror.

>> No.40687040

>>40686867
Probably the Barbarian and Bloodrager.

They have Power attack, so even if they don't grab all the best stuff they can they at least have a boatload of str and power attack.

Maybe the spellcasters, but I don't know.

>> No.40687089

>>40686970

>A strength based wizard

"Come, friends! Now that I have dazed this monster's dumb ass to stunlock it for five rounds, let us all beat the shit out of it together! With my prodigious muscles for my profession, I can join you in slaughtering the all but helpless creature!"

So yeah, wizards can make their own opportunities to shine. I can see that.

>Intelligence focused Rogue

Ah. More proof a portion of the design team apparently prefers to design for Magical Tea Party with d20s than Pathfinder.

>> No.40687120

>>40687040
The barbarian is wielding an oversized bastardsword (or was it a short sword?) with no feats/class features to mitigate any of the penalties.

I think the Bloodrager is okay tho. I recall he's using a reach weapon.

>> No.40687177

>>40687120

I think he fights with an Earthbreaker, actually.

Still, that's only somewhat worse than a greatsword, and he has the GOOD Elemental Bloodline...

>> No.40687189

>>40687120
It's a minus 2 penalty and I just checked her rage power selection. It's atrocious, but even then she will still fare ok in bestiary encounters.

>> No.40687220

>>40687177
Pretty much, he can at least fly.

>>40687189
I guess. It beats most of the other martials.

>> No.40687225

>>40687040
>Maybe the spellcasters, but I don't know.

Noo most of the casters spell list is awful. The cleric prepares healing spells

>> No.40687237

>>40686867
The Cavalier.

If you grab Spirited charge, mounted combat feat line, and power attack you're already set. Pretty sure he did all that.

>> No.40687316

>>40687089
>Magical Tea Party with d20s
I think I love you.
>>40687035
Oh god. I guess spending 4 hours a session being outshone is worth it when partway through the game I succeed at some skill because everyone else who could roll also rolled like ass.

>> No.40687344

>>40686867

The warpriest.

He Fights with a Greatsword, is a divine caster, and arrayed his stats decently. His biggest weakness is that he can only go full capacity in fights a few times a day, but most fights don't need all your bells and whistles.

>> No.40687384

>>40685426
Haley Starshine from Order of the Stick is an archer based rogue.
>http://www.giantitp.com/comics/ootscast.html

Rocky Jones from Our Little Adventure is a single dagger rogue.
>http://danielscreations.com/ola/characters/rocky.html

Most of the rogues from the Forgotten Realms (except some Drow) weren't dual wielders.

>> No.40687597

Can a familiar get an AoO on somebody trying to grapple them for whatever reason?
This is something happening in-session so an immediate answer would be veery appreciated.

>> No.40687622

>>40687597
They can if the person attempting to grapple doesn't have Improved Grapple or some other ability that prevents it.

>> No.40687627

>>40687597
Depends, does the familiar reach the person grappling him? Most familiars have a reach of 0 so although they could AoO, they can't reach to do it, unless the initiator is already in their square.

>> No.40687645

>>40685426
Best Rogue used a shortsword, handheld repeating crossbow, and significant research/knowledge to do his job.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewW2qnx9D90

>> No.40687647

Updated Zealot archetypes are out! https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EefwFNF3SCNKDGjyAvMNvMRolDAXnIx2FnBnOLv-Wr0/edit

As far as I can tell:
>Awakened Champion is mostly unchanged
>Discordant Crusader has fewer power points and obviously doesn't have Restorative Strikes, but still has all of the stuff they got in the previous version, otherwise
>honestly no idea about Void Prophet, didn't look at it previously

All in all, I'm very okay with the changes to Zealot. I'm going to have a lot of fun with it.

>> No.40687691

>>40687647
Hey, this reminds me of something:

Can the gifted blade and awakened champion get Psionic Knack to boost their ML up a couple of notches?

>> No.40687708

>>40687645
Let's be honest, Favaro is a Slayer, if not a Warlord of some sort (or maybe a Hawkguard Warder?).

>>40687691
I don't see any reason they couldn't? They both count their ML as Character Level - X, so Psionic Knack would lessen that.

>> No.40687847

>>40687708
Favaro is pretty good at swordplay, but let's be real here. When Kaisar got serious in a 1v1 arena style fight Favaro lost hardcore.

Favaro isn't a full BAB murderstick like Kaisar. His success lies is expert use of battlefield conditions and research before jumping into most situations.

>> No.40687880

>>40687847
Eh. I'd go with Stalker, then. He's totally not a sneak attack/trapfinder kind of guy.

>> No.40687961

>>40687880

I can't say Stalker either because honestly Stalker's are way too good at murdering and have have relatively shit social skills.

A lot of Pathfinder classes can't really define him all that well. Maybe the Survivor from Liber Influxus

>> No.40687984

>>40687880
Archeologist Bard?

I mean, he gets sneak attack, but he sounds like a bluffing/skilled/lucky type of guy.

>> No.40688050

>>40687984
The ACG Swashbuckler would be perfect, but it's just plain too good at murdering stuff.

>> No.40688069

>>40688050
It could be like, a low level swashbuckler. With shitty stat spread that tries to skillmonkey.

Also

>swashbuckler
>good

>> No.40688183

>>40688069
Swashbucklers are good, outrageous even, at one specific thing.

Doing damage and that's it.

They aren't particularly good at surviving, making saves, solving problems, or anything like that. But if it's not immune to precision damage then the swash will fuck it.

>> No.40688256

>>40688183
except no, a barbarian with a sword and 0 feats will out damage you easily. Hell...a fighter with a greataxe and 18 strength can do more than you can.

>> No.40688263

What are the ways you can get summoning as a standard action outside of being a summoner?
Sacred summons?
Is there anything for Wizards/Sorcerers?

>> No.40688281

>>40686896
What's a fitting alignment for a cuckslayer?

>> No.40688287

>>40688183
Swashbucklers, IIRC, actually only eke out an advantage in damage compared to just about any full BAB class with a twohander and PA that's worth about 5% or less total damage and need all their class features to do so, being locked in a single style and everything.

Now, A Daring Champion on the other hand...

>>40688256
This isn't exactly true; if you do the DPS calculation, they actually keep up pretty well. I think they even overtake falchion fred most of the time.

>> No.40688325

>>40688183
>Swashbucklers
>Doing damage

>> No.40688393

>>40688325
A ronin swashbuckler at lvl 5 with a Katana is essentially a crit machine gun

>> No.40688394

>>40688256
Sounds like you never even read the class
>adding her swashbuckler level to the damage dealt. To use this deed, a swashbuckler cannot attack with a weapon in her other hand or use a shield other than a buckler. She can even use this ability with thrown light or one-handed piercing melee weapons, so long as the target is within 30 feet of her. Any creature that is immune to sneak attacks is immune to the additional damage granted by precise strike, and any item or ability that protects a creature from critical hits also protects a creature from the additional damage of a precise strike. This additional damage is precision damage, and isn't multiplied on a critical hit. As a swift action, a swashbuckler can spend 1 panache point to double her precise strike's damage bonus on the next attack. This benefit must be used before the end of her turn, or it is lost. This deed's cost cannot be reduced by any ability or effect that reduces the amount of panache points a deed costs (such as the Signature Deed feat).

This means you can grab a Rapier, 13 str, and power attacks for 3-1 power attack while still getting your level as precision damage. When you have more than one panache you can choose to double your level in precision damage.

Fencing Grace for dex to damage

>Swashbuckler weapon training: At 5th level, a swashbuckler gains a +1 bonus on attack and damage rolls with one-handed or light piercing melee weapons. While wielding such a weapon, she gains the benefit of the Improved Critical feat. These attack and damage bonuses increase by 1 for every 4 levels beyond 5th level (to a maximum of +4 at 17th level).

Free attack+damage steroid and improved critical at level 5

I guarantee you that your level to damage is more valuable that a bonus equal to 1/2 your str modifier from the moment you get it.

Once again, Swashbucklers are a shit class because they have shit defense and problem solving skills, not bad damage.

>> No.40688422

>>40688325
Since it seems you guys never actually read the class, just heard people bitch about it on PFG here's a link to the class:

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/swashbuckler

It's a shit class for a lot of reasons. but not the reasons you state.

>> No.40688443

>>40688287
They never get pounce so iterative attack damage never matters

>> No.40688465

>>40688443
Have you ever played a game of Pathfinder?

>> No.40688499

>>40688443
Runner's shirt/other magic items.

There are ways around pounce. You are generally right tho, just saying.

>>40688394
You actually need to wield it in one hand. Using it two handed is "attacking with a weapon in your other hand".

>>40688465
He's right tho, it's a definite disadvantage. They also can't even use ranged weapons as well as other classes can (which is the strongest combat style).

>> No.40688523

So - if I had previews for the new art in Bloodforge (original artist offered to replace his work gratis)...?

>> No.40688539

>>40688394
>>40688499
>Free attack+damage steroid and improved critical at level 5

It's not free. You had to take 5 levels of swash for it.

Compare it to fighter, who'd get +3/+3 at that level, would already have mutagen, and could pick up the improved critical by that level anyway as a bonus feat.

And fighter is universally regarded as a shit class.

>> No.40688559

>>40688539
This. When greatsword fighter can out damage you, you need to rethink your life if you are trying to DPS.

>> No.40688570

>>40688539
Don't forget that that would also open up Gloves of Dueling as an item option to make the bonus even larger.

>> No.40688589

>>40688570
That's what I meant by +3/+3 actually, since we are talking about level 5.

Also
> and could pick up the improved critical by that level anyway as a bonus feat.

I meant to say in a few levels.

>> No.40688611

>>40688523
Lemme see that.

Also, answer on >>40687691 ?

>> No.40688643

>>40688611
Nothing forbids it.

Alicorn: https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/11391749_10155635499680398_4914941774903878890_n.jpg?oh=86bd6f8769289577079cd49e76fda1b2&oe=5623A0C4

Merg: https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t1.0-9/11423613_10155652166505398_10623472447824334_n.jpg?oh=39211042800a9d0f369ff4ade2d4f2e4&oe=55F4CE6B

Oggr: https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/11053098_10155563157925398_7412359233201840819_n.jpg?oh=48c83b558c2444b26217df1a9753bc64&oe=5632F008

And finally, Houri: https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/11264020_10155544259980398_960394277542502404_n.jpg?oh=a207ba3e4b98f1523e4e8aa810a015d1&oe=55E906ED

>> No.40688693

>>40688643
...um
would someone mind re-posting the images to this imageboard?

>> No.40688721

Is there any advantage from using TWF over TH except the fact that you have double the enhancements?

>> No.40688726

>>40688693
Sorry. Still a bit new to the tech and I don't keep 'em saved on my computer (mostly because I generally link them via IRC at folks).

>> No.40688745

>>40688539
Where's the Fighter getting +3/+3?

Improved Critical is an 8th BAB required feat, so no fighter has it by 5th level unless they have archetypes for it. As far as I know, no such archetype exists.

>>40688570
Gloves of dueling is something I will cede since Swashbuckers have no such equivalent as far as I know.

>>40688589
I don't know any level 5 dude who's picked up gloves of dueling since it's a 15,000 gold item. Maybe if he has a crafting buddy, but you don't always have a wondrous item crafter.

>> No.40688750

>>40688721
You can spend more feats on it.

>> No.40688783

>>40687961
Favaro wasn't really a slouch when it came to the fighting potential stuff. It's just he's surrounded by full BAB facesmashers (Kaisar the Warlord, Knight Kotetsu the Warder, Amira the motherfucking Transmutation Wizard/Eldritch Knight, assorted demons with badly-pronounced names, etc.)

>> No.40688794

>>40688721
That's... actually the opposite of true. You'll have to split your money between 2 weapons to enhance, while falchion-guy only needs one.

There are class dependant advantages; having more static bonuses to damage means you can theoretically achieve a higher DPR, but it's linked to you being able to stand still and full attack. Also, you can make better use of crit-feats as well, which could be interesting.

>> No.40688797

>>40688721
Under some, very limited circumstances, it can severely out damage 2HF.

Once such circumstance is a 10th or 15th level Ranger whos taken Mounted Skirmisher to Full Attack after moving. Since 2 weapon fighting is strongest when you have frequent access to full attacks and when you have substantial bonuses to attack and damage.

>> No.40688798

>>40688643
Significantly less shit than the ones that were in the book. The alicorn is making a derp face super hard, though.

>> No.40688847

>>40688794
Well you can have swords of different elements and go full Monster Hunter.
But PF isn't half as fun as Monster Hunter.

>> No.40688855

>>40688797
uhh...ok, maybe. But for 99% of the time it is just a way to spend feats to make yourself worse.

>> No.40688856

>>40688721
With this feat
>Prodigious Two-Weapon Fighting [Combat]
Your great physical might allows you to wield two large weapons with ease.
Prerequisite: Strength 13
Benefit: You may fight with a one-handed weapon in your offhand as if it were a light weapon. In addition, you may use your Strength score instead of your Dexterity score for the purpose of qualifying for Two-Weapon Fighting and any feats with Two-Weapon Fighting as a prerequisite.

A lot of 2WF builds become pretty good.

Can you say Pouncing 2WF barbarians?

Fighters being able to 2WF effectively without going down a shitty dex route?

All the path of War Builds who want to STR Thrashing Dragon murder?

Breathes new life into that shit.

>> No.40688873

>>40688855
>Under some, very limited circumstances, it can severely out damage 2HF.

It's ok, sometimes I skip entire sentences when reading anon posts too.

>> No.40688900

>>40688726
You can copypaste the links into the "upload" box, and it will grab them and upload them.

You do have to do it one at a time though.

>> No.40688902

>>40688873
I was agreeing with you, and adding emphasis on how it costs feats and often makes it worse.

>> No.40688924

>>40688856
What book is that from?
Looks sketchy as all hell.

>> No.40688949

>>40688924
Path of War.

>> No.40688981

>>40688643
>Alicorn
Meh.
>Merg
Not bad.
>Oggr
Kinda shit. And wtf is up with his right hand. I've seen worse, but this is not good.
>Houri
This is okay, but again with the mangled hands, and who the fuck holds a bowstring that way? Also that's not at all what wrinkles in fabric look like.

People like to give WAR a hard time because he cheats anatomy to put people in impossible poses, but come on.

That said, while I have a bunch of criticisms of this art; at least it's not making me want to gouge out my eyes.

>> No.40689010

>>40688924
It's perfectly fine, anon. TWF still takes a mountain of fucking feats to do anything you could do with a greatsword and powerattack, it's just one more for the pile.

>> No.40689054

>>40688949
DSP literally why.

>> No.40689080

I just want to make sure, but Primal Fury maneuvers are limited to 2H melee weapons right? Otherwise Stance of Aggression can be used on a Crossbow to deal extra damage.

>> No.40689095

>>40688281

Chaotic Good

>> No.40689127

>>40689080
>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers

>The associated skill for the Primal Fury discipline is Survival, and its associated weapon groups are axes, heavy blades, and hammers.

>> No.40689157

>>40688263

Don't think so for Wizards/Summoners.

The occultist Arcanist can use the summoner's type of summoning, as I recall.

Totem Shaman Druids can summon their totem animal as a standard action, so Saurian Shamans can gangbang an encounter with dinosaurs pretty quick.

>> No.40689200

>>40689127
Yeah but unlike pretty much every other discipline it doesn't list weapons it has to use or other conditions. For example:
>All Scarlet Throne maneuvers and stances require that the initiator not be using any kind of shield in their off-hand (including animated shields) while initiating a maneuver or while using a martial stance of this discipline.

>> No.40689216

>>40689010
it would be nice if there was a feat called "two weapon fighting"

"whenever you make an attack with your primary weapon, you may also make an attack with your secondary weapon"

Was that so hard?

>> No.40689230

>>40689216
>vital strike
>now get two attacks

>> No.40689234

>>40689054
Because even with taking out the Dex-MAD (for the cost of /yet another feat/), TWF is just painfully, sorrowfully bad.

>> No.40689253

>>40689080
Primal Fury has no such limits. That in mind, it's also, like, Priority 1 on the errata list, so there's that.

>> No.40689264

>>40689253
Got it, so it's more powerful than intended.

>> No.40689287

>>40689264
Oh god so much more. Primal Fury and Broken Blade both got out of hand and no one noticed until we'd already published. Assuming Ultimate happens, that's getting fixed for it (if Ultimate doesn't, we'll still errata it, it's just, y'know, not gonna be in a big huge sexy compilation book).

>> No.40689322

>>40688981
Notably, it's the same artist for both versions. I'm pretty pleased with his improvement, myself, but he's always lookin' to get better. I'll kick the info his way.

>> No.40689334

>>40689287
I would buy Ultimate. I haven't spent a dime on PF books, but I'd buy Ultimate. If only because I want to hug the Path of War.

>>40689322
At least he's not the guy who did the art for the Spheres of Power book. That guy... yeah...

>> No.40689440

My wizard just hit level 5, what metamagic feats are actually worth taking when you only have 3rd level spells? Extend/Piercing Spell?

>> No.40689474

>>40689322
Just a question.
Why don't you embrace full weaboo and have a book with anime style pictures?

>>40689440
Intensify is really good. Keeps certain damage spells in play longer. Piercing isn't really useful because SR isn't common yet, and extend isn't worth the spell slot burn for lower leveled spells.

>> No.40689487

>>40689440
I might consider extend, for the summons, but honestly I tend not to take metamagic feats, and go for crafting feats instead.

For the rare time I want to metamagic I use a rod.

>> No.40689504

>>40689474
I hope they do not do this. I want this stuff to blend in with my Pathfinder books as seamlessly as possible.

>> No.40689508

>>40689474
Psionics Augmented: Wilder will scratch that itch if you're inclined. It's not full big-eyes-small-mouth style but it's got a lot of the hallmarks, and I was unreasonably happy to see knee pads on, like everyone. Adventurers spend a lot of time crawling around on stone floors looking for hidden traps and shit.

>> No.40689521

>>40689440
What do you do as a caster? There are also Discoveries which are pretty neato, and Craft Wondrous Item isn't too bad, especially if you took the Arcane Crafter discovery.

>> No.40689529

>>40689287
I think what happened was

"Oh it's 2 handed fighting. meh."
"Oh it's unarmed combat. meh"

And thus few if any people actually looked at it.

I think what you're doing now, where you say "Ok, this thing is up next to be published. LOOK AT IT PLEASE" is the right thing to be doing and may prevent another Broken Blade fiasco.

>>40689234
Path of War has a lot of things to make 2-wpn fighting, not just decent, but downright scary. I think the statement "TWF is just painfully, sorrowfully bad" when Path of War has several classes, archetypes, and even a prestige class that make 2WF very very strong.

That said I like prodigious 2 weapon fighting and think it's great.

>> No.40689542

>>40689508
Anime isn't really big eyes small mouth, it's just less pronounced jawline, more impractical hair, and fancier weapons. Maybe I meant 'jrpg'.

>> No.40689555

>Wrath of the Righteous
>Tiefling Witch
>Character is really unfun to play, mechanically, useless in a lot of situation, but not really dead weight but that's because Wild Arcana.
>have a blast roleplaying him, but seriously actually playing him in combat is becoming to be a real drag as those -2's start becoming utterly irrelevant and most things are becoming straight up immune to mind affecting attacks.
>I'm practically praying something crit kills me
>gibbering swarms of Eviscerator demons
>get beat to shit, driven insane
>multiple personality disorder
>planning on alt personality being a princely devil type convinced he's on a crusade againts demons.
>planning on picking up a random martial weapon and charging the biggest demon I can find in Drezen and hoping my shit gets packed in.
I don't want to come off as a salty bitch because my character got fucked up though if anything I'm kinda salty he didn't get fucked up enough.

I'm not sure what to do, really.

>> No.40689561

Just a reminder that all these 'PoW is Weaboo' faggots have known about Codex Martialis for several threads now yet still refuse to look into it in any great detail despite it using art from historical arms manuals and other classical artwork to illustrate the various functions and feats found therein.

>> No.40689572

>>40689542
One of my favorite anime, that also really plays out like a DnD campaign didn't have much of this problem. The most impractical hair in it was a pompadoor.

>> No.40689573

>>40689529
I want to make a Judge like this guy, but I have no idea where to start...

>> No.40689589

>>40689561
I looked through it, anon. It's low-magic, gritty combat.

I could see myself integrating it into a d20Conan game. I don't see myself integrating it into Pathfinder, game of fantasy super heroes.

>> No.40689594

>>40689572
It was pretty good, but that may be mainly due to the fact the season when it aired was weak as shit.

>> No.40689621

>>40689573
Oh ok, let me help you out friend.

First let me ask some questions before I point you in a direction.

1. Can you use 3rd party products?
2. Do you want full plate?
3. Are you partial to initiating?
4. I seem to remember ff12 judges having some sort of magic, but I forgot to what extent. Please describe it?

>> No.40689635

>>40689555
>Hey, DM? I'm really not enjoying my character. Is it cool if I reroll something else?

If he says no, you charge your Witch into the closest evil thing and hope it murders you.

>>40689561
That's some neat armor right there.

>>40689572
Favaro's afro is pretty goofy, though. Definitely enjoyed the fact that the protag was not a traditionally attractive guy, though. Which is weird considering it is made by the same people who are in charge of [email protected] Cinderella Girls.

>> No.40689652

>>40685733
Yeah, Jesus...PFG is a fucking superhero game.

>> No.40689689

>>40689621
Thanks, anon. I'm really bad at anything that isn't a full archer.
1. My GM allows most things, but specifically bans psionics. He usually runs the game to test himself against 3PPs, but he won't suddenly kill my character off just because he does more damage than intended. I mean, he's more impressed with the Celestial Commander's smite evil army.
2. Full plate is awesome. We already have a rogue for the more flexible stuff.
3. I'm fairly new to PoW as a whole, so initiating is a new term to me.
4. In the FFXII verse everyone has magic, but Ganbrath mostly has things that would be counted as 'explosions and sword waves'. Which I can refluff in.

>> No.40689691

>>40689561
Because it's not all that good. Quit pimping it here, make a general for it.

>> No.40689700

brawler 1/warpriest with weapon focus(unarmed) 19

Want to have magic weapon fists. Bad idea?

>> No.40689721

>>40689635
The studios have no control over the IP. Cinderella Girls and Rage of Bahamut existed as their own games before being animated.

>> No.40689724

>>40689521
Transmutation school, evocation/necromancy opposed, spellbook packed with utility spells, knowledge skills through the roof across the board. Combat-wise he's just sat in the back flicking Telekinetic Fists at baddies until the boss shows up for him to spam Color Spray at, but he's getting too high level for Spray to be very effective anymore so I'm moving toward Strangling Hair/Corrosive Touch/Haste

>> No.40689727

>>40686095
God, cool, dead elven pussy must be heaven.

>> No.40689743

>>40689700
Master of Many Styles 1/Sacred Fist Warpriest X

>>40689721
They're both run by Cygames, who I assume are the ones who hired the character designers. To be clear, I was talking about the source games, not the anime adaptions. Should have clarified.

>> No.40689747

>>40689700
Why Brawler at all?
Also Sacred Fist Warpriest.

>> No.40689748

>>40689700
Maybe try a Brawler vmc magus?
That might work, assuming your GM allows vmc.

>>40689724
Evocation works well with intensify, necromancy is good with extend. Get a rod for Piercing. SR is rare enough to not justify blowing a feat on it.

>> No.40689760

>>40689561
Just because we saw some neck beard shilling it doesn't mean we actually accepted the piece of homebrew shit as worth wiping out collective arses with.

>> No.40689764

>>40689555
Why aren't you summoning, vomitting up bug swarms, dropping curses, and supporting your team? Also what is your Familiar?

>> No.40689792

What kind of feats/magic items do you guys think a witch/shaman/mystic theurge needs?

>> No.40689835

So what kind of stuff in WotR absolutely requires mythic ranks to get past?

>> No.40689871

>>40689760
>piece of homebrew shit
Hey now. Nothing innately wrong with homebrew.

It's just that the homebrew in question would be rather underwhelming in a Pathfinder game.

>> No.40689876

>>40689764
>Why aren't you summoning
Don't know any summon monster spells or any summoning feats.
>vommiting up bug swarms
Worthless don't know any of those spells
>Dropping curses
Made its save. Made its save. Flubbed SR. Made its save. Failed it's save, oh wait its immune to that anyway. Failed it's save someone coup de grace.
>supporting your team?
I am, call me cancerous, but I reallly am finding the support roll boring. The withc also seems to have shit for good support spells. I'm basically a flight monkey/bandaid. We recently got a cleric so now I can even capitalize on the bandaid bit.
> Also what is your Familiar?
A viper I keep in my trousers that hasn't been mentioned since the second session.

>> No.40689878

I wanted to play a Paladin from an order that doesn't worship a god so my DM said I have to come up with the Order myself and write the oath. This is what I have so far.

>I take up the sword now, not for vainglory or greed. I have become a weapon to destroy these.
>I will be miserly with myself and generous with others. What I have exists only for the sake of those who have not.
>I shall tolerate neither the selfish ambitions nor the depraved indifference of the wicked. I will strike them down without thought of the cost to myself.
>I will be merciful to those coerced into darkness. To those who freely chose to inflict suffering, I will be implacable.
>Never will I believe myself to be a righteous man. Doubt will be my shield against hubris.
>I will serenely accept my own failure, for I know that the crusade is eternal. As long as even one soul cries out for justice, my work will never be done.

What do you guys think?

>> No.40689887

>>40689689
Ok, one last question. Do you want to be a tank? If so this would be a good way to go
Human Warder
Str focus. Leave dex at 12.
Level 1 feats: Prodigious 2 wpn fighting, 2 weapon fighting
Level 3 feat: Discipline focus: X discipline
Level 3 Bonus feat: Warder stuff

Join the Empreal Guardians or Black Thorn Knights as per the Martial Tradition rules and trade away Iron Tortoise. Broken Blade has a lot of support for 2 weapon fighting, especially "Broken Blade Stance." If you don't like Broken Blade use a trait to trade it for Thrashing Dragon, which focuses on 2WF.

What does this build do?
1. You essentially get combat Patrol for free
2. By using combat patrol you can move to an enemy so that on your next turn you can rip into them with a full attack
3. You inflict a great debuff do to armigers mark
4. You have strong supernatural abilities from the Black Seraph/Silver Crane trade
5. Cool teamwork support from Golden Lion
6. Kill fools

The thing I'd worry most about is the Allegiance benefit for Organizations. If those look problematic don't use them.

If you don't like/want tanks I can come back with something else.

>> No.40689888

>you will literally never kiss Shelyn

Why even live?

>> No.40689935

>>40689888
Hope springs eternal

>> No.40689937

>>40689878
Seems pretty solid.

>>40689887
Have to be a Dervish Defender to get TWF for free at first level. You can't take Prodigious TWF unless you have base TWF, so you either need 15 Dex or to get it through a class feature.

As an aside, DD Warder's TWF doesn't specify that you don't need to meet prereqs for the feat. However, when you take Prodigious TWF, it allows your Str to count for Dex requirements, so you might be able to sidestep that. It's probably going to be something you have to ask your DM.

>> No.40689985

>>40689876
Did the GM limit your spell list?
>A viper I keep in my trousers that hasn't been mentioned since the second session.
You sir, are a contribution to the team.

>>40689878
Annoying in a party.

>>40689887
Hmm, a little beefiness would be nice, since my GM throws APL+5 monsters at us like no tomorrow.

I was actually considering the Judge archetype for Stalker, but that looks so bad.

Looks interesting...
My GM's setting will probably has any organization I join completely wiped out, so that isn't a problem.

>> No.40689988

>>40689748
Opposed schools, he's not casting evo/necro without a wand

>> No.40689989

>>40689747
Because i started as a brawler before realizing how terrible of an idea it was. Fucker just gets to two weapon fight as a class feature and not even with a good selection of weapons. I originally thought of sticking to brawler, but the stuff the GM is handing out doesn't help me at all. Mostly heavy armors, weapons i have no proficiency with, and wands/scrolls. Money is useless thanks to the GM teleporting us to bumfuck nowhere after every dungeon, only to get us into another dungeon that teleports us to even farther in bumfuck nowhere.

I'm level two and a bit, but i held out on leveling (along with the rest of my group) because we're all martials and are trying to convince each other to take levels in magic using classes to actually use the two thirds of our loot that is inaccessible to us. I wanted to stick to my character concept of punchy guy, but i don't really know what to do.

I have str 17, dex 16, con 14, int 7, wis 14 and cha 10 and am a half-orc. My first level feat is combat expertise.

>> No.40689996

>>40689937
Prodigious Two-Weapon Fighting [Combat]
Your great physical might allows you to wield two large weapons with ease.
Prerequisite: Strength 13
Benefit: You may fight with a one-handed weapon in your offhand as if it were a light weapon. In addition, you may use your Strength score instead of your Dexterity score for the purpose of qualifying for Two-Weapon Fighting and any feats with Two-Weapon Fighting as a prerequisite.

You don't need to be a DD Warder and in fact being a DD means you wont have access to the requested fullplate.

>> No.40690014

>>40689996
Huh. Could have sworn TWF was a prereq? Never mind all that, then.

Yeah, that makes things easier. I need to go back and look at the Warder/Barbarian/Dragon Fury I was thinking about.

>> No.40690029

>>40689985
>Annoying in a party.
Really? What's wrong with it?

>> No.40690043

>>40689878
Could always hijack the Empyreal Guardians oath and alter it slightly. They've got this whole 'angelic cult' thing going on but with minor adjustments it'd be pretty decent for a non-religious paladin.

>> No.40690052

>>40689988
Oh I didn't see the opposed.
Yeah he doesn't actually need the metamagic feats much. Maaaaybe extend, but a rod is better.

>>40690029
Sounds the type to drag the party around for even the slightest of issues, to vanquish evil etc.

>> No.40690055

>>40690029
Some people are really buttblasted that Paladins exist at all. The code doesn't seem any more restrictive or NO FUN ALLOWED than any other I've ever seen.

>> No.40690098

>>40689985
No, I just don't have a way/opportunity to learn new spells.
I just finished a session, my prepared spell list looked like this
Mage ArmorX1
Enlarge Person1
CLWX3
Silent ImageX1
Level 2
CMWX4
Level 3
FlightX2
Ice SpearsX1
Level 4
Dispel Magic.
Black Tentacles.

>You sir, are a contribution to the team.
That's kinda why I don't want to kill him. I'm having a bit of fun being the party clown it's just that I'm groaning when initiative rolls come around.

>> No.40690103

>>40690052
>Sounds the type to drag the party around for even the slightest of issues, to vanquish evil etc.
It's going to be a fairly heroic party. Everyone is some flavor of Good Aligned. One of them has running a soup kitchen in their background.

>> No.40690120

>>40689876
Listen, you can't play a witch like you can a Wizard. They require more finesse and subtlety. You are supposed to be the guy who uses your familiar and weird powers to confound, obfuscate, observe, and creep out. You aren't as powerful as a wizard, and the Witch's abilities tend to require heavy planning and roleplaying to use properly. I suggest you look at the Spell list, comb over the coolor looking spells, and start to form plans.

Also, I believe there might be some witch guide floating around somewhere.

>> No.40690121

>Pathfinder game
>four-member party is at Lv.3
>encounter ninja ogre
>big HP sponge
>can summon shadow clones
> can turn invisible
>+12 to hit
>1d10+10 damage plus sneak attack dice
Does this seem balanced? Because currently 3 of us are probably dead on the ground in a cave.

>> No.40690157

>>40689985
If running an initiator ends up being a problem ji=ust ask if you can run that prodigious 2 wpn fighting feat.

You could run a suitable Judge using that feat and Warpriest/Paladin

>> No.40690167

>>40690121
That actually sounds like a hilarious encounter from an outside perspective.

Realize that you guys probably could have turned tail and fled before he started knocking people into negatives.

>> No.40690207

>>40690098
That's actually pretty good. I don't see the problem. Unless your GM chucks things with insane saves at you.

Maybe try to use knowledge rolls to find out about their weak saves and react accordingly? That's what most witch players do.

>>40690103
Ok, then go along. This is perfect without sounding like a buttblasted paladin.

>>40690121
Nope, that's beyond hard.
Tell your GM to stop being a dick.

>>40690157
>Ivalice Judge
>Paladin
*intense coughing*
I'll go ahead. If prodigious is allowed it'll open up a heck lot of builds for me, but from my angle it looks beyond broken, so it might be not.

>> No.40690224

>>40690167
Oh he one shot one of our own in a suprise round, the the other two in one hit each a few rounds later, the only reason the one is alive is because of being a Crit machine gun, constantly critting.

>> No.40690231

>>40690121
It's a pretty dickbag encounter.

Sure a 4 man level 3 party can win, but an NPC like what you described is what we call the start of an arms race.

That's at least 2 ninja levels on top of ogre racials and he probably changed the base feat selection.

>> No.40690333

>>40690207
>That's actually pretty good. I don't see the problem. Unless your GM chucks things with insane saves at you.
I might be exaggeration the save situation. Most things that aren't immune fail pretty consistently really. It just feels kinda boring.
>Look into my Evil Eye
>Cackle
>Slumber
>Deep Slumber
Repeat first two steps till the barbarian is done mincing people. Occasionally step in to cast fly or fortune hex the Barbarian or Wild Arcana:Lightning Bolt some zombie clusters.

I'm pretty sure I've spent more in combat rounds cackling and picking my nose than actually casting spells.

>> No.40690352

>>40690333
You do you cackle is a move action, right?

>> No.40690360

>>40690231
So that's a CR 3 monster with a minimum of 4 class levels since he's using two different kinds of ninja tricks. How much do class levels add to CR?

>> No.40690368

>>40690360
Class level -2, iirc.

>> No.40690377

>>40690360
Isn't it something like level-2?

>> No.40690382

>>40690120
>>40690098
>>40690333
Witch Guide(s)
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1YkARuboGbaCVdOpcgoA0epQFqBlCygzzUsgaBdba9BE/edit

>> No.40690402

>>40690352
Yes. It's just by the time turn 2 rolls around most things are dead or in the process of being dead/dying/out of range of new hexes.

>> No.40690407

>>40690157
Inquisitor? They judge stuff all day.

>> No.40690449

>>40690402
You could forgo evil eye.
It's only really good against BBEG sponges. Spamming spells can be good.

>> No.40690452

>>40690382
I used that guide to help make the character.

>> No.40690491

Man, PoW somehow really affected my expectations for a martial character.

>> No.40690498

I dunno what the fuck feats to take as an arcanist other than extra exploits.

>> No.40690504

How does the unchained rogue match up against the ninja? Is ninja still clearly superior for a similar role or is it a little more even now?

>> No.40690521

>>40690498
Spell Focus and crafting?

>> No.40690531

>>40689200
Seriously, where are people getting this? This was gutted and removed from PoW way before it hit print. Only Broken Blade has restrictions now.

>> No.40690543

>>40690504

Rogues get dex-to-damage and better sneak attacks with debilitating injury and the hilarious quality gap between ninja tricks and rogue talents isn't as big as it used to be.

I'd say the ki pool and invisibility stuff still has the ninja coming out ahead, but the rogue's a lot better at competing with it than it used to be.

>> No.40690577

>>40690531
It's on the SRD

>> No.40690588

>>40690491
Yeah, man. I know that feel. I expect my martials to not be happy if they aren't capable of whistling and tying their boot laces at the same time, now.

4+Int or better skill points on everybody?
At least two good saves (or 1+ good save and a class feature to improve another)?
Actual useful class abilities?

Please, yes.

>>40690531
http://gyazo.com/bb7eb783d27a057f92458ebded8ba2dc
This is from my PDF copy of PoW.

>> No.40690610

>>40690504
>>40690543
I'm pretty sure you can do Unchained Ninja, since Ninja is effectively a Rogue archetype.

>> No.40690626

Is a TWF inquisitor viable?
Or am I going to miss all my attacks?

>> No.40690627

>>40690491
Path of War makes it really easy to make a good character.

Using it it's easy to make a character
-With competitive DPR
-Capable of doing very versatile things in combat
-Competing well in the skill check game

The content was balanced against the toppest tier builds for Barbarians, Rangers, and Paladins so it's no wonder they can get a bit out of hand in a lot of people games.

I've set my expectations for martials at the feat or the Aegis, Battle Lord, and Daevic. They are strong in combat, can solve problems, and have multiple options to tackle situations without being ridiculous.

>> No.40690652

>>40690627
Now I feel bad because I want an inquisitor with the ability to PoW.
Judge is shit because it doesn't get dual/triple judgement.

>> No.40690653

>>40690588

Download the most recent version of the PDF. Mine says this

All Scarlet Throne maneuvers and stances require
that the initiator not be using any kind of shield in
their off-hand (including animated shields) while
initiating a maneuver or while using a martial stance
of this discipline. The initiator may use bucklers or
rings of force shield or an effect that grants a shield
bonus to his AC, just not a physical shield larger than
a buckler. He must either have his off-hand empty,
or be wielding a weapon two-handed to use this
discipline.

>> No.40690680

>>40690626
Judgment (or Studied Target if you go Sanctified Slayer) can help make up for it. It's not generally advised, no, but you can make it work.

2H Str or Archer Inquisitor are pretty much the safest ways to go, though.

>>40690653
Isn't that exactly what my gyazo link says?

>> No.40690715

>>40690521
I've never been in a campaign where I had more than a nights rest worth of downtime.

Spell focus is decent enough though I guess.

>> No.40690716

>>40690652
Warpaths, in the Expanded playtest.

>> No.40690717

>>40690652
Look at Warpath follower
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1hHsiSKoL2nR4oWgzPKQwXfqYENuNkDmBiX323SlTPfc/edit

Also before you complain about judgement being removed I I must say, just be happy they still left you with Bane and Greater Bane.

>> No.40690736

>>40690680
Indeed it is! My bad I was using this quote

>>40689200

Yeah Scarlet Throne pretty much only said "No light shields, heavy shields, and tower shields. Just 2 handing and bucklers"

>> No.40690752

>>40690680

What's the best weapon for a 2H inquisitor if you don't get a deity with a martial two-hander? Longspear?

>> No.40690772

>>40690752
Yep.

You wont have much AC, so reach is very valuable.

>> No.40690798

>>40690736
Technically he just quoted the first line and left the rest out. Which means that he's not WRONG, just ADHD and apparently incapable of reading the whole paragraph.

>>40690752
Longspear, yeah. It's pretty much hands down the best simple 2H weapon in the game. The Weighted Spear is pretty boss, too, though.

>> No.40690896

Redpill me on the Slyph Wind Listener Wizard

>> No.40690989

>>40690896
You get spontaneous divination for free without taking the school

You get Abjuration Trap Sense, and Perception as a class skill

Also free natural invisibility and DR.

All for essentially no cost, on a race of natural wizards

>> No.40691041

>>40690989
>Essentially no cost

You lose your familiar and all your bonus feats that you'd use for metamagic

>> No.40691074

>>40691071
New thread

>>
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