/sfg/ Space Flight General - Young Elon edition

[Anonymous No.11779749]

Old thread >>11776789

Rocket launch schedule: https://spaceflightnow.com/launch-schedule/

Starlink launch on June 12th if everything goes well

[Anonymous No.11779759]

>>11779749
Based edition.

[Anonymous No.11779774]

>>11779759
no.

[Anonymous No.11779783]

>>11779749
gay, when are they going to build an ORS space elevator already

[Anonymous No.11779782]

Oh no no no no we got too cocky /sfg/bros, we got too fucking cocky

[Anonymous No.11779785]

when will we be orbital boys?

[Anonymous No.11779788]

>>11779665
that works with earth dirt, but may not work with Mars dirt. We thought the mole would work on Mars dirt, but it didn't.

[Anonymous No.11779791]

>>11779785
Soon!

[Anonymous No.11779793]

>>11779783
space elevators don't work on Earth, but they might work on the moon
if the earth were a little bit smaller or spun a little bit faster we could do it with steel but not as it is now

[Anonymous No.11779804]

Let's get some kino photos going on :)

[Anonymous No.11779805]

ETA /sfg/?? 20 years? 30??

[Anonymous No.11779807]

Has any vehicle ever landed like image related?

[Anonymous No.11779812]

>>11779807
Mmmm maybe but that’s a huge 180° swing, and just increase the chances of your chutes tangling and your payload getting rattled around way too much

[Anonymous No.11779816]

>>11779782
I want off this gay planet. I hope Musk makes it to mars and writes a manifesto on the glorious capitalist system and why reddit is gay and how he was a /sfg/ lurker the whole time

[Anonymous No.11779819]

>>11779782
Source? Also I doubt these people know anything about space travel lol

[Anonymous No.11779822]

>>11779711
>>Cybertruck would be the basis of a Mars rover
I hope not. I doubt a cybertruck will handle being pressurized all that well. Really the only attractive features from a Mars rover perspective are big battery, all wheel drive, and active suspension(although I'm not sure it has that yet). All wheel steering would help a lot.

[Anonymous No.11779823]

>>11779788
I don't think you can blame Mars for a rover failing to do something a toddler could accomplish with ease. Pressure pressed brick has already been demonstrated with Martian regolith simulant.

[Anonymous No.11779827]

>>11779805
15 years

[Anonymous No.11779829]

>>11779823
the mole was also demonstrated to work with Martian regolith simulant.

[Anonymous No.11779836]

Not to get too far off subject, but damn, Elon was already balding in that pic. I don't know who did his hair transplant that he rocks today but they were an artist.

[Anonymous No.11779844]

>>11779829
And it was a robot, and robots suck.

[Anonymous No.11779846]

>>11779812
I forgot to draw a step with a drogue. Can't skydivers open their parachute from any position or orientation?

[Anonymous No.11779855]

>>11779819
They don't know anything about anything.
Ideology and the internet hive mind supply all their opinions.

[Anonymous No.11779863]

>>11779855
Source though, i want to destroy them with FACTS and LOGIC

[Anonymous No.11779878]

>>11779804
US design philosophy is so fucking pleasing to the eye

[Anonymous No.11779897]

>>11779863
https://yb.reddit.com/r/capitalism_in_decay/comments/gzkc7g/elon_musk_is_gonna_privatise_space_one_of_the/
Don't engage, it won't go anywhere and they literally don't know anything.
To make this post more /sfg/, though we all already know this
>Lets just hope that it won't be profitable
is stupid as a positive economic feedback loop is absolutely key to getting human activities happening at scale in space. Governments the world over have demonstrated the bare minimum interest demanded by their interests on Earth, and this is not going to change.
Absent the efforts of the likes of SpaceX, crewed space activity outside LEO would remain expensive, infrequent, and dead-ended for decades to come.

[Anonymous No.11779898]

>>11779863
https://www.reddit.com/r/capitalism_in_decay/comments/gzkc7g/elon_musk_is_gonna_privatise_space_one_of_the/

>inb4 reddit
your funeral

[Anonymous No.11779916]

>>11779897
>"This is referred to as Kessler Syndrome and was theorized all the way back in 1978."
This is referred to as Dunning-Krueger effect it's a very fucking real thing. God damn I hate fucking trust fund commies.

[Anonymous No.11779919]

>>11779759
Top one is cuter.

[Anonymous No.11779928]

[Anonymous No.11779937]

>>11779863
who cares, reddit socialists aren’t politions, they are druggies, they don’t matter, at this point the only people who can stop SpaceX is the FA and Congress

[Anonymous No.11779940]

>>11779898
>>11779897
>Backwater leftie reddit
Why were you even there in the first place? Ignore these irrelevant fucks, they're basically /pol/ on the other side of the horseshoe

[Anonymous No.11779944]

>>11779863
They're too numb and fisheyed from smoking a bunch of narcotics that are 'definitely not harmful at all' to care.

[Anonymous No.11779946]

>>11779928

[Anonymous No.11779947]

>>11779940
Anon wanted source and couldn't be arsed to search for it, and I was in the mood to spoonfeed.

[Anonymous No.11779954]

>>11779898
>>11779897
We have a genius here lads,

[Anonymous No.11779960]

>>11779785
When we can build large solid rocket motors without the ATF breathing down our necks.

[Anonymous No.11779961]

>>11779954
He pretty much just summarized Posadist ideology.

[Anonymous No.11779964]

>>11779954
Ah yes, because if someone like Picard met another civilization that still uses money they would just phaser everyone they deemed “too rich”
In this moment I am euphoric

[Anonymous No.11779971]

>>11779805
10 years

[Anonymous No.11779974]

>>11779863
You shouldn't bother with confrontation you will be banned. Those guys seem to be radlib but in the communist mindset capitalism is just a mode of production and a step of development of human history. A way to really make them think would be to compare SpaceX venture with something of the past, like: did Leif Erickson ruin Greenland with feudalism? Also tell them the drone ships are named after the book of a commie writer where humans basically live in a post scarcity anarchist galactic society.

[Anonymous No.11779979]

>>11779964
And the creators of Star Trek at least bothered to justify their space-pseudo-communism by the argument of technological post-scarcity. (Communism still sucks but is marginally more viable in that context)
We still have scarcity, and we are nowhere near its elimination.

[Anonymous No.11779984]

>>11779954
>He posts, while capitalist nations have been trucking along for centuries as dozens of communist shitholes collapse, from a machine designed by a capitalist, manufactured by a capitalist.
Commies never cease to be an amusement, if only they'd stop collapsing countries and slaughtering innocents by the million, they'd make good jesters for civilized people to laugh at.

[Anonymous No.11779986]

>>11779954
> since capitalism PROBABLY creates total civilizational collapse

kek. can't wait to read their groundbreaking manifesto, "Why capitalism probably doesn't work, maybe, possibly." they seem to know a lot about the subject

[Anonymous No.11779988]

>>11779964
If their was a country today that still had legalized slavery and the USAF went in and started drone bombing everyone who owned slaves these same people would cry about Imperialism.

[Anonymous No.11779993]

>>11779897
based mexican spaceflight budget

[Anonymous No.11779999]

>>11779993
they are doing pretty good on space spending for a third world country

[Anonymous No.11780005]

>>11779999
Checked, also yeah that’s probably like 10% of their entire GDP hahah

[Anonymous No.11780007]

Let's keep up the speculation on SpaceX future colony plans

[Anonymous No.11780009]

>>11779984
Comrade Gagarin is very disappointed in your lack of recognition for the USSR space program anon, apologize.

[Anonymous No.11780010]

>>11780007
I swear to god if you say p****** one more time

[Anonymous No.11780014]

>>11780010
Whats the matter anon? You don't like printing?

[Anonymous No.11780015]

>>11780009
Gagarin and co's achievements occurred in spite of Communism, not because of it.

[Anonymous No.11780018]

>>11780007
>The eternal Proonter
>"Hey guys, have you tried proonting?"
>Can only think in terms of additive manufacturing
>Thinks a complicated failure-prone printing mechanism is simpler than a shovel
>Does nothing all day except proonts
>"AAAAA I'm gonna PROOOOONT!"

[Anonymous No.11780021]

>>11779960
>NFA/GCA/Hughes repeal happens
>magical negative boat accidents everywhere
>hobbyist rocketeers upgrade from rocket candy to The Good Shit
>BATFE disbanded entirely
>4ASS recruits /k/
>build a Conestoga type rocket with spare parts in a field
>capsule is just an EVA suit, a crash couch, a MOOSE kit, a few RCS thrusters, and an unpressurized fairing
>pilot brings along a Mosin in case of bears or Shelbys near LZ
>Capsule has Upotte! pinup nose art and the name Leeroy Jenkins on the side

[Anonymous No.11780025]

>>11780018
>>Thinks a complicated failure-prone printing mechanism is simpler than a shovel
Better than thinking a shovel in EVA will be simple.

[Anonymous No.11780026]

>>11780015
You're not very nice, would a hecking space pupperino would change your mind anon?

[Anonymous No.11780032]

>>11780010
Paaaa-rint

[Anonymous No.11780033]

>>11780026
Nope, Russian spaceflight innovation was wonderful back when it was happening, but it will never change the fact that communism is a cancerous disease on civilized humanity and will continue to impede progress in every field until it cease to exist.

[Anonymous No.11780042]

>>11779822
>I doubt a cybertruck will handle being pressurized all that well.
What are you basing that on

[Anonymous No.11780043]

>>11780025
A bucket loader is simpler and equally necessary to feed your printer. We've discussed this a thousand times

[Anonymous No.11780047]

>>11779928
I can hear elon hitting the space bar

[Anonymous No.11780048]

>>11780043
>Bruh, you don't need to waste 15% of your payload mass for an excavator
>just use a whole other Starship to carry special dirt for the printer lawl

[Anonymous No.11780051]

>>11780033
I disagree, and so would this cool commie and his doggo, he went to gulag but he still was the dude, there's even a cross named after him.

[Anonymous No.11780052]

>>11780043
It is not simpler, ways a shit ton more and in no way is necessary for the printer

[Anonymous No.11780056]

>>11780047
I had something else running in the background that made a nice KACHUNK at the exact timing of the separation and I thought it was actual audio for a second

[Anonymous No.11780063]

>>11780009
Too bad Glorious Soviet Space Program didn't see fit to upgrade jack shit or design anything new and instead focused on just price gouging because they could.
The first crewed flight of the "new" Soyuz with a digital flight computer was in April of 2020 for fucks sake. That's almost 70 year old ICBM tech.

There's a limit to "if it ain't broke don't fix it".

[Anonymous No.11780066]

>>11780052
So instead of a bucket loader, you want to use some rotary loader robot that's less versatile but ultimately does the same job. That doesn't really change the fact that you need an excavator, you're just quibbling over the specifics

[Anonymous No.11780069]

>>11780048
15% of a starship is a shit load for an inefficient piece of machinery.

[Anonymous No.11780073]

>>11780066
A bucket loader construction requires EVA.

[Anonymous No.11780074]

>>11780069
>inefficient
we've been over this, printerfag

[Anonymous No.11780077]

Do you think SpaceX will change their astronaut design philosophy? When they first announced their pressure suits it looked cool because it was sleek and minimalist but when actually worn on Bob and Doug we all saw how bulky and chonky they looked, clearly not what they were going for.

Clearly Elon cares a lot about aesthetics so I’m wondering if they’re gonna try something else

[Anonymous No.11780078]

>>11779782
>Elon Musk is gonna bring the free market to space. One of the last things that is still ruined by existing within complete control of the world's governments

[Anonymous No.11780082]

>>11780043
>Hey guise the space agencies are the stupid ones, let's just like build stuff.

[Anonymous No.11780084]

>>11780069
>muh inefficient
Literally all you need to replace what you're posting is a digger and a pressurized mold. Doesn't get much simpler than that

[Anonymous No.11780085]

>>11780077
maybe it'll drive them to actually put money into compression suits

[Anonymous No.11780089]

>>11780074
when have we been over this?

[Anonymous No.11780091]

>>11780073
Shitload better than fucking robots
>>11780082
Space agencies have been spinning in place for 50 years.

[Anonymous No.11780092]

>>11780063
You should sit down, I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news but the USSR was dismantled thirty years ago and their space program was all but almost scuttled. Capitalism truly was a tragedy for the luxury space communism project.

[Anonymous No.11780093]

>>11780069
First, a typical backhoe is 7 metric tons. Also, 15 tons anywhere is impressive still. 100 tons anywhere is incredible.

[Anonymous No.11780094]

>>11780082
this, but unironically
oldspace forgot what it was like to optimize for cost and development speed.

[Anonymous No.11780095]

>>11780084
>and a pressurized mold.
Why do this when you can just as easily print it?

[Anonymous No.11780101]

>>11780095
Because the act of printing isn't as simple as you think.

[Anonymous No.11780102]

>>11779807
No, never, because parachute deployment mechanisms don't work if you try to project the parachute forward into the air stream. For one thing normal parachutes get pulled from their packing via air currents; I'm not sure you could even do that mechanically while also fighting against the air stream. For another thing high speed parachute deployments, especially large parachutes, are susceptible to tearing very easily due to the fabric being whipped very quickly as the chute inflates; as the chute drags any folds in the chute fabric get accelerated sideways and around the bend radius of the fold, reaching such high speeds and g forces that the fibers simply cannot take it anymore and they snap. have enough fibers snap and the chute forms a tear, and once a tear forms it will propagate through the rest of the chute extremely quickly.

[Anonymous No.11780104]

>>11780091
dangerous, inconvenient and not designed for mars use

[Anonymous No.11780106]

>>11780095
A 3D printer is not "just as easy" as pressing a brick. Building-scale 3D printing is garbage, even on Earth

[Anonymous No.11780107]

>>11780101
I've been working with a 3d printer for years, its pretty decent and much less hands on than mold construction.

[Anonymous No.11780111]

>>11780106
I wouldn't be so sure

[Anonymous No.11780115]

>>11780104
>dangerous, inconvenient
Probably the most convenient piece of machinery you'd have. Don't stand in the way, lol.
>not designed for Mars use
Nothing is designed for Mars use yet. All it needs is batteries instead of ICE and radiators.

[Anonymous No.11780118]

>>11780092
>Muh capitalism
They were flush with NASA cash and gouging the fuck out of them. No excuses.

[Anonymous No.11780120]

>>11780111
>subscale
>made on earth with supervision
>still garbage

[Anonymous No.11780121]

>>11780077
Imho elon should focus on Mechanical Conterpressure Suits
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_counterpressure_suit?wprov=sfti1
You don’t necessarily need a pressurized suit to stay alive. The body is naturally sealed; all you need is some sort of elastic garment to keep it tight (i.e. pressurized) which can also serve as a coolant layer if you pump fluid through it. Imho elon should develop this type of suit that slips on easily, with quick attachments for a helmet, a backpack for life support and oxygen, and maybe a slip-over harder shell layer for protection

[Anonymous No.11780123]

>>11780093
>>11780094
Why don't you guys comprise and use an excavator to dig up materials for 3d printing?

[Anonymous No.11780126]

>>11780121
After reading about some of the issues with them I'm hoping on some kind of compromise like a hardsuit with mechanical counterpressure limbs for the intermediate-term. But I hope a full suit can be developed eventually

[Anonymous No.11780127]

>>11777777
Was it that Ellen Page August?

[Anonymous No.11780130]

>>11780123
That's not the compromise, that it requires already. 3d printing is just an extra step

[Anonymous No.11780131]

>>11780127
Autist

[Anonymous No.11780133]

>>11780126
I would want a compromise regardless. I would not want to walk on the surface of the moon with nothing but an elastic layer. I would want some sort of secondary shell layer to help with sharp regolith, fall protection, and micrometeroid minimization

[Anonymous No.11780134]

>>11779822
Steps to take to turn cybertruck into a vacuum capable rover;
1. Replace all windows with sheet steel, install small port hole windows but rely mostly on outboard mounted cameras for navigation. You aren't pulling any high speed maneuvers in the thing anyway.
2. Weld lots of structural ribs to the outside of the pressurized section; those flat panels will want to bow due to the pressure, they need stiffening. Welding them onto the outside means you don't detract from useful interior volume.
3. Airlock, probably inside where the trunk would be on a normal cybertruck. You could probably keep a modified version of the bed cover installed to slide over and protect the airlock while driving.
4. Batteries and motors get hot. You need radiators or heat batteries or both in order to keep everything from getting overheated.
5. Probably just go ahead and swap out every bearing ball with a ceramic one, and make sure there are no metal-on-metal connections, sliding or fixed. Metals don't weld on contact on Earth because they form oxide layers, which in vacuum rub off quite quickly. Ceramics don't weld to metals.
6. Maybe you want to put solar panels on it, but you're probably just charging at the base from its grid anyway. A not-inconveniently sized panel on the vehicle could be good for emergency power.

[Anonymous No.11780136]

>>11780120
>made on earth under severe time constraints
>done as hands off as possible
>still incredibly strong
>easy pressurized design
>Radiation proof
Yeah looks good to me

[Anonymous No.11780140]

>>11780130
You have to build it either way, you aren't going 5o make a habitat

[Anonymous No.11780141]

>>11780133
A full mechanical counterpressure suit is slight enough that you could overlay it with anything you want. You could go full knight in shining armor with a MCP suit underneath

[Anonymous No.11780143]

>>11780120
isn't the point of this to prove that it can work and if given enough money can be refined to the degree they need? You know, sort of like how early rocket prototypes were shit boxes

[Anonymous No.11780144]

>>11780130
you have to build it either way, you aren't going to build a habitat by just digging a hole in porous material.

[Anonymous No.11780148]

>>11779954
The USSR objectively did win the space race though

[Anonymous No.11780151]

>>11779999
wasted quads

[Anonymous No.11780153]

>>11779986
He can't say for certain because the only large and powerful modern civilizations to collapse so far have all been communist lmao

[Anonymous No.11780156]

>>11780143
exactly this, these were built in the most crude form they ever will ever be in and it still held up an excavator.

[Anonymous No.11780159]

>>11780148
First women to do X is not an accomplishment if a person has already done X.

[Anonymous No.11780161]

>>11780148
It's an arms race, not a sprint. HMS Dreadnought kicked off a race, it didn't win it for the UK.

[Anonymous No.11780162]

>>11780148
Superior slav brain, not communism.

[Anonymous No.11780164]

>>11780148
Not really though.

[Anonymous No.11780167]

>>11779782
Capitalist nations have the highest living standards on Earth. You have to wonder how people become delusional enough to dislike it.

[Anonymous No.11780168]

>>11780148
I don't see their flag out there.

[Anonymous No.11780173]

>>11780082
You say this as if you haven't heard of anything to happen in the space industry since the Apollo era

[Anonymous No.11780174]

>>11780168
It was the first to another planet and the first to Mars, and the first to the Moon.

[Anonymous No.11780176]

>>11780144
You know, if you can get your printer on a Mars-bound Starship I would love to see if it's faster than a bricklayer and if it breaks down and no one can repair it. I just know where I'm calling that race

[Anonymous No.11780177]

Step by step, How to actually build a Mars Habitat (larger than anything NASA has in the books) for Cheap and Easy

1. Land a Starship

[Anonymous No.11780178]

>>11779782
If you see any minority and/or commie in mars, remove them. What the fuck is anyone going to do, call the police?

[Anonymous No.11780179]

>>11780161
>It's an arms race, not a sprint.
Good analogy. Sprinting to the Moon means nothing if you lose everything in between.

[Anonymous No.11780181]

>>11780174
>It was the first* to another planet and the first to Mars*, and the first to the Moon*

*with robots*
*which suffered very high failure rates and also which haven't been followed up on in decades

[Anonymous No.11780182]

>>11780032

The issue with other solutions is that there's a lot of energy (which is immensely precious off world, until a large scale continuous system is made available) involved in developing all the other solutions. Further, the available surface area for all the other solutions is nowhere near as valuable as the candidate that won the competition (#2). Which adds a lot of vertical options to their 3D printed buildings. In light of that, makes sense that they won.

[Anonymous No.11780183]

>>11780181
Where is the James Webb Telescope?

[Anonymous No.11780186]

>>11780183
test

[Anonymous No.11780187]

>>11780183
where is the buran

[Anonymous No.11780192]

>>11780141
Exactly. I’m thinking of something like from The Martian, maybe a smaller helmet? But yeah you have a lot of freedom to strap on pieces. I think a modular design would be cool where you could add hardware on hardpoints

[Anonymous No.11780194]

>>11780187
Not the point :) You were mocking Commie inefficiency, but NASA is far, far more inefficient than the Soviet Union ever was, as proven by that graphic above. Iff Mikhail Gorbachev hadn't been such a cuck, then we would probably have a Mars colony of a few hundred by now.

[Anonymous No.11780202]

>>11780148
USSR won the space race in the same respect that Blue Origin beat SpaceX to booster recovery and reuse.

USSR had first satellite launch, first people in space, first space walks, first probes to other worlds, but no Moon landings.
USA landed on the Moon and now has manned flight capability, has sent successful robotic probes to every planet and a couple dwarf planets, and is ramping up to do manned missions to the Moon again.
BO had first stage landing recovery and reuse, first stage to be reused multiple times, first capsule test, first capsule in-flight abort test, but no manned launch.
SpaceX had its manned launch (to the ISS no less), is actually launching to orbit, is developing the worlds largest and most advanced rocket vehicle, and is moving towards the capability of manned flights to Mars and back within the decade, pessimistically.

[Anonymous No.11780203]

>>11780194
That was my only response to you, make yourself less easy to mock you unironic slaviboo

[Anonymous No.11780205]

>>11780115
>Nothing is designed for Mars use yet
False, rovers are, a boom armed 3d printing rover is gonna be easy.

[Anonymous No.11780206]

>>11780194
The USSR doesn’t exist anymore, and all other “communist” nations have adopted market reforms. Communism is stupid, and a failure.

[Anonymous No.11780208]

>>11780021
this post is highly underrated
that too is my fetish

[Anonymous No.11780209]

>>11780205
So what? All I said in that post is that a digger would be useful and easy. You should be glad, you need them too.
>rovers
I said use, as in useful

[Anonymous No.11780210]

>>11780183
I dunno, where's Angara?

[Anonymous No.11780211]

>>11780194
>NASA is far, far more inefficient than the Soviet Union ever was
N1

[Anonymous No.11780215]

>>11780211
>N1
More like N0

[Anonymous No.11780221]

>>11780209
Believe what you want. I'll be here to brag when the printing starts.

[Anonymous No.11780222]

>Ywn drive your custom Mako rover over Martian chasms while blaring the general lee’s horn on live tv while all the anti-spacefags seethe

[Anonymous No.11780227]

>>11780206
>Mikhail was a cuck, therefore communism doesn't work
So, when China becomes an oppresive regime, are they communist or capitalist?
>>11780211
Apollo had far more failures than the N1 did?

[Anonymous No.11780228]

>>11780221
Feel what you want, I hope you're here jacking off like the rest of us when they start tipping Starships and covering them in dirt.

[Anonymous No.11780235]

>>11780179
The "sprint" part is claiming that being "first" means anything. The USSR ultimately did not have capabilities that the US couldn't match. See the hilarious gap in failure rates for Mars programs. It's like if the British crowed endlessly about Dreadnought while everyone else was fielding superdreadnoughts and fast battleships.
>>11780194
>as proven by that graphic above
>what you can actually do doesn't matter, provided you do it "first" so people in other countries decades after your collapse can post infogrpahics and act smug
The USSR was barely capable of sending probes to Mars without them failing, they were nowhere near sending humans (and hadn't even sent anyone out of LEO), and had no plans for such. Even before the collapse, there had been nothing that was the equivalent of the Voyager program, or any missions to the outer planets, as one example.

[Anonymous No.11780237]

>>11779782
>fast forward some 79 years
>O'Neill cylinders have been build on earth/moon langearage points
>earthnoid commies opress spacenoid colonies
>space colonies want independence
>earth says "no"
>rebells on side 3 (pic related) BTFO stationed earth military forces
>war between earth and space colonies breaks out
>spacenoids have developed some "mining equipment" that can fly in space and use tank-sized guns and oversized bazookas
>absolutely anihilate the earth sphere space force at side 5

[Anonymous No.11780242]

>>11780235
>It's like if the British crowed endlessly about Dreadnought
even worse, they never shut up about frigates

[Anonymous No.11780246]

>>11780237
Replace O'Neill Cylinders with Von Braun torus colonies and I'll bet this is gonna happen.

[Anonymous No.11780248]

>>11780237
>Martians send a battalion of Rust stalkers in an invasion of Luna to maintain their trade interests with the spacers
>Turn Apollo City into a fortress with planetary defense guns and anti asteroid torpedo silos

[Anonymous No.11780249]

>>11780246
>we're making gundam real

[Anonymous No.11780253]

>>11780248
Hmmm I wonder if we’ll have space bounty hunters in the future. Imagine someone on the Moon or Mars colony snaps and does something super illegal like murder or sabotage. Imagine sitting in a Starship for six months, only to arrest a guy

[Anonymous No.11780261]

>>11780228
>Imagine using more than the first cargo missions worth of starships as permanent installations.
> Imagine burying them
Doesn't seem probable.

[Anonymous No.11780263]

>>11780248
We'll see if Mars is realy that interesting.
>>11780253
Space could be an ANCAPs wet dream, no goverment will be able to controll the entire solar system anytime soon.
Especialy asteroid miners in the belt would be realy hard to controll.

[Anonymous No.11780264]

>>11780227
>Mikhail was a cuck, therefore communism doesn't work

Communism doesn’t work because communist societies have less access to food (unless you’re part of the privileged party class), less access to luxuries (unless you’re part of the privileged party class), and generally worse living standards than capitalist societies. It is a purely inferior system.

[Anonymous No.11780266]

>>11780235
>while everyone else was fielding superdreadnoughts and fast battleships
Brits made the first super-dreadnought (Orion) and the first fast battleship (Queen Elizabeth or Hood) though

[Anonymous No.11780267]

>>11780227
No Saturn V ever suffered a catastrophic failure

[Anonymous No.11780269]

>>11780261
Why the fuck wouldn't they? It's what they've pledged to do on the Moon and it only makes more sense with the Mars cargo ships which have no other purpose.

[Anonymous No.11780271]

>>11780267
>No Saturn V ever suffered a catastrophic failure
Shifting the goalposts

[Anonymous No.11780272]

>>11780253
Major cities/nations would have special forces/counterterrorism units specifically trained to be professional space troops
It’s just an inevitability

[Anonymous No.11780273]

>>11780148
Technically the US put fruit flies in space in the late '40s on a captured V2.
The soviets put the first animal in orbit.

[Anonymous No.11780274]

>>11780263
>Space could be an ANCAPs wet dream, no goverment will be able to controll the entire solar system anytime soon.
>Especialy asteroid miners in the belt would be realy hard to controll.

Hell yeah. Don’t tread on me or magnetic mines will erupt from my asteroid’s regolith and kill you

[Anonymous No.11780277]

>>11779782
>plebbit tankies mad that white man successful
What's new?
>>11779783
Probably in 3001
>>11779785
When a couple of us have enough shekels to contract with SpaceX and make our own missions and payloads. I mean, is it really outlandish for Elon to visit these threads?
>>11780021
>Capsule has Upotte! pinup nose art and the name Leeroy Jenkins on the side
This but instead it's got lenticular printing depicting the daily dose gif but with Elon and Russia with the words "THANKS DOC" stencilled in.

[Anonymous No.11780278]

>>11780227
Apollo had a 100% failure rate?
What did they use to fake the Apollo-Soyuz Test Project, then?

[Anonymous No.11780279]

>>11780235
>The USSR ultimately did not have capabilities that the US couldn't match
Except they clearly did. First man in space, first space station, first impacted on Mars, The Moon, and Mars. The only reason that they didn't for a crewed landing on the Moon was that their budget was cut.
>They had no plans for Mars or the Moon
This is either a lie or ignorance. The USSR had plans for a human mission to Mars, the Moon and a Venus flyby

[Anonymous No.11780281]

>>11780266
Yes, unlike the USSR, the British took steps to establish and defend an actual lead in capabilities.

[Anonymous No.11780283]

>deals with resource issues
>planning for a planned society
>what war has entirely been for, he's accomplishing through dreams

>ww3
>black astronauts

>implying we shouldn't have taken a knee for great elon

[Anonymous No.11780285]

>>11780279
>The only reason that they didn't for a crewed landing on the Moon was that their budget was cut.

That, and their moon rocket was a complete piece of shit that constantly exploded.
Kinda like the USSR’s economy

[Anonymous No.11780286]

>>11780274
Practicly speaking, it would be a nightmare to controll an area THAT spread out.
Sure, earth may have the largest fleet in the beginning, but it costs earth a lot more to launch a new ship beacause of gravity.
Meanwhile spacenoids could just build them from whatever they mine and refine in space and don't even need to use chemical thrusters to get to earth.

[Anonymous No.11780287]

>>11780227
>Apollo had far more failures than the N1 did?
Saturn I never failed, Saturn IB never failed, Saturn V never failed.
Of all the Apollo missions, one early test failed (Apollo 1 capsule fire, 3 lives lost) and one lunar mission was aborted (Apollo 13, no lives lost).
N1 meanwhile failed to even reach second stage ignition during launch after 4 failed attempts, before being cancelled and taking the entire Soviet moon program with it.

[Anonymous No.11780288]

>>11780264
>communist societies have less access to food (unless you’re part of the privileged party class)
Probably wrong lol.

https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/document/cia-rdp84b00274r000300150009-5

[Anonymous No.11780290]

>>11780007
>>11780014
>>11780025
>>11780032
>>11780052
>>11780069
>>11780089
>>11780111
>>11780205
>>11780221
>>11780261
You are a:
>plebbitor
>janny tranny
>mod trying to gain (you) shekels

[Anonymous No.11780291]

>>11780285
Cope

[Anonymous No.11780292]

>>11780279
"First" is not a capability. To show what I mean, if it's 1980 and I'm the Soviet Premier, what missions can I expect my space program to perform that the US President could not expect from his? The only one I can think of would be "send someone to Salyut."
>This is either a lie or ignorance
Post-1960s? Not really. The anon I was replying to named "Gorbachev" (i.e. the late-1980s) as the reason why there isn't a USSR/Russian colony with over a hundred personnel on Mars. They weren't working towards that goal during Gorbachev's tenure.

[Anonymous No.11780295]

>>11780291
How much cognitive dissonance do you need to scream "cope" while trying to defend a defunct nation

[Anonymous No.11780298]

>>11780288
>Probably wrong lol.

Breadlines don’t real. Famines don’t real.

[Anonymous No.11780299]

>>11780269
The moon starships can't return, mars starships need to return. The first few cargo starships will be used but i doubt they will be buried.

[Anonymous No.11780300]

>>11780291
>Cope

Poo poo pee pee suck on my wee wee
Stop trying to defend an ideology that has already sunk into the dustbin of history

[Anonymous No.11780302]

>>11780299
I do imagine cargo starships can carry habitable pods.

[Anonymous No.11780304]

>>11780299
Which is why I said the cargo starships. You're throwing in some shit about using the crewed, returning vessels as permanent habitats that I never implied because you need to tweak my words.
There's literally no reason not to bury them as it's fast, simple, and makes them much better for long term habitation.

[Anonymous No.11780305]

>>11780291
okay

[Anonymous No.11780307]

>>11780290
>anything i don't like is plebbit or a conspiracy

[Anonymous No.11780308]

>>11780202
this

[Anonymous No.11780310]

>>11780307
That looks an awful lot like trusses and sandbags. You're not straying from the PROONT god are you?

[Anonymous No.11780312]

>>11780307
oh fuck THAT SPIDERBOT IS GONNA TIP OVER
NOOOOO IT COST 400 BILLION DOLLERINOS TO CONSTRUCT AAAAAAAH

[Anonymous No.11780313]

>>11780249
no, in this timeline we'll have Zeon win

[Anonymous No.11780314]

>>11780292
I am the only anon.
>post 1960s not really
Why would they? Their budget was being cut as they deemed there no benefit in going to the Moon, After all who wants to be known as the country that comes second? Much more efficient for the USSR to cut costs and focus on a space station closer to home than send someone out to the Moon so that they can say "hey we did it too". That was the point in putting Mir into orbit. The only thing that America did first was land humans on the Moon, and had the USSR focused on that they would have achieved that first.

[Anonymous No.11780315]

>>11780298
>Breadlines don’t real. Famines don’t real.
Depends a lot on the country.
Bread wasn't realy scarce in the GDR, except maybe shortly after the war.
However any kind of imported food was pretty hard to get.

[Anonymous No.11780316]

>>11780298
Except the CIA literally confirmed that the Soviet diet was as if not more nutritious than the American one.

[Anonymous No.11780318]

>>11780314
>If
>If
>If

In the real world, the USSR failed. You lose.

[Anonymous No.11780319]

>>11780304
Yeah the first mission of cargo starships isn't enough, you know the normal cargo starships will have to go back too

[Anonymous No.11780322]

>>11780307
That thing is prefabbed though

[Anonymous No.11780326]

>>11780318
>First to everything
>didn't focus on the Moon like NASA
>HA! We win!
American logic

[Anonymous No.11780327]

>>11779954
based posadists

[Anonymous No.11780328]

>>11780307
You'd have a point if you weren't shilling a concept plebbitors like you COOM over. If you were shilling inflatables or hell, fucking BOEING, I'd actually consider you somewhat competent. But you're shilling a concept that is bound to fail, considering that 3D printers need FLAT grounds to extrude upon, or else there's massive distortion in the final product.

[Anonymous No.11780329]

>>11780314
>Much more efficient for the USSR to cut costs and focus on a space station closer to home
And what did that accomplish? Can you think of anything?

[Anonymous No.11780330]

>>11779785
Honestly, 4ASS should focus more on doing stuff in space rather than getting there. Frog version of LESS when?

[Anonymous No.11780332]

>>11780313
We're in the AD timeline, not the UC timeline after all, so why not?
However we can't expect the earthnoids to understand while their souls are weighted down by gravity...
https://youtu.be/hbdFBYtHXWk

[Anonymous No.11780333]

>>11780278
>Cдeйтoн
Huh, shouldn't it be Cлeйтoн?

[Anonymous No.11780334]

>>11780322
It was unrelated i just like base concepts

[Anonymous No.11780335]

>>11780333
also I meant to write э instead of e

[Anonymous No.11780336]

>>11780329
Accomplishments at home?

[Anonymous No.11780338]

>>11780316
Nutritious =/= calorie rich, just fyi

>>11780326
>literally failed to accomplish their own Lunar program
>conveniently ignores this fact and pretend like they planned on staying in LEO fucking around with space stations all along
>became completely irrelevant to space flight as of DEMO 2 launch
goodnight, igor.

[Anonymous No.11780339]

>>11780326
The moon was more distant and risky than LEO. You lost, tankie, make like that the fantasies that trap jew i got fed up with had and take a couple dicks.

[Anonymous No.11780341]

>>11780326
Stay eternally booty blasted

[Anonymous No.11780343]

>>11780328
And what concept am i shilling?

[Anonymous No.11780342]

>>11780315
>Depends a lot on the country.

All communist countries suffered from shortages

[Anonymous No.11780344]

>>11780319
>isn't enough?
Isn't enough for what? The initial pressurized volume of the SS is already more than the ISS, imagine the sheer girth when you have two ships with the full tanks pressurized on the surface. I cannot imagine being you, unhappy about the greatest habitat ever seen off Earth just because it didn't involve 3d meme.

[Anonymous No.11780345]

>>11780343
from a glance it's "dude buildings made of dirt lmao"

[Anonymous No.11780346]

>>11780338
>Nutritious =/= calorie rich, just fyi
>didn't read it
The average Soviet diet was 1750 calories.

[Anonymous No.11780347]

Hey anons, got a question. I remember hearing about people using weather balloon-type setups to get small rockets up high for launching microsatellites. Do any of you know much about this?
I tried searching but my terms are probably too layman because I got some articles about it being used in the past and being used for sounding rockets and some startup planning to do it but no specifics.

Do you reckon with a tiny payload (kg or less) a hobbyist team would be able to get something into a non-decaying orbit? I swear when I first heard about this it was some local hobbyist uni team doing it.

[Anonymous No.11780349]

>>11780346
Jesus christ. No wonder they suck down every drop of vodka they can get

[Anonymous No.11780352]

>>11780338
Fucking around in LEO with space stations is arguably more valuable than a two week road trip to the lunar surface for some sightseeing, especially when you immediately destroy that capability afterwards.
full Apollo Applications Program >> Salyut and Mir and such >> thirteen Saturn V launches and then destroying the tooling

[Anonymous No.11780353]

>>11780328
how are inflatables any fucking better than a 3d printed structure?

[Anonymous No.11780354]

>>11780336
Can you think of anything? Yes or no. Sure they built Mir, and helped build ISS too. What did those projects get us? The ability to build a space station and maintain it? A bit circular, that logic.

[Anonymous No.11780356]

>>11780347
rockoons
they suck

[Anonymous No.11780358]

>>11780342
>All communist countries suffered from shortages
Not going to deny that, but while on limited supplies, the GDR at least didn't have famines.
They where short on everything but the basics and people getting creative to leave it.

[Anonymous No.11780359]

>>11780349
Soz, Soviets were eating 3280 calories compared to Americans eating 3520.

[Anonymous No.11780362]

>>11780345
Yes material scientists are researching how to use martian regolith to build structures. Is cement somehow not a good building material?

[Anonymous No.11780363]

>>11780356
Yeah the wiki article for that was one of the things that came up but it doesn't go into current groups working on them.
I'm pretty sure it was Diffusion Science Radio where I heard about some people working on them.

[Anonymous No.11780364]

>>11780346
Thank you for proving my point. My 120 pounds soaking-wet 5 foot 3 accountant wife eats that much every day. Imagine subsisting on sub-2000 calories a day when you're working in the local soviet steel mill pounding hot iron for 10 hours a day.

[Anonymous No.11780365]

>>11780354
The first astronaut to spend more than a year in space?

[Anonymous No.11780367]

>>11780353
Hmm, let's see:
Virgin printing
>shilled by "I FUCKING LOVE SCIENCE" crowd
>was only tested on earth facilities, even then not even scaled up to expected size
>printers can often bug out and jam
CHADelow inflatables
>2 test inflatables have been sent into orbit and are still somewhat active with pressure still intact
>BEAM was supposed to be deorbited, is still being used for cargo space
>was the reincarnation of a cut NASA concept
Gee, I wonder why I'm shilling for inflatables. It's almost as if they actually work.

[Anonymous No.11780368]

>>11780362
>cement
There's no limestone to make cement from on Mars, anon. They can't use cement. It's possible they could use some kind of sulfur-based 'Marscrete', but those formulas tend to be weaker than good old calcium carbonate.

[Anonymous No.11780372]

>>11780364
Its actually 3250 for Soviets and 3580 for Americans.

[Anonymous No.11780375]

>>11780367
Unfortunately Bigelow laid off everyone and is basically dead, the concept is sound but it has no commercial backing and no active public efforts either.
Of course, as much as proont-anon would like to pretend otherwise, the latter two factors are also true of 3d printed habs, which never had any support to begin with. NASA ran a contest once as a glorified outreach program, that's it.

[Anonymous No.11780380]

>>11780314
>Much more efficient for the USSR to cut costs
The N1 program continued until 1972. It was not instantly cancelled in July 1969. Clearly someone there thought there was value in lunar activities outside of, again, filling internet infographics.
>no benefit in going to the Moon
With automation there's arguably no benefit in having humans in space at all. Pretending that the one is a mere prestige thing (the rocks it recovered were invaluable) while the other is the essence of pragmatism is inane.
>The only thing that America did first was land humans on the Moon
US had a number of firsts related to orbital rendezvous.
US is also the only one to send anything to the outer planets, so the detailed data we have on those planets (as scientific data collection was another key goal) comes from those missions.
>>11780333
Yes. Probably a typo, seeing as they used д and л correctly in the other transliterations.

[Anonymous No.11780384]

>>11780365
And what did that actually accompish? What groundbreaking technological leap stemmed from scheduling a dude to stay in zero G for >1 year? Did we increase our Moon colony's steel production? Did we discover a new method of extracting phosphorous from Martial soil? Did we develop an efficient basalt-fiber extrusion machine for enabling the construction of larger rotating space habitat modules in the Phobos shipyards?

Or did we just check off a box on the list of completely meaningless milestones to pass in space?

[Anonymous No.11780385]

>>11780375
Yeah, fucking joo'd up quarantine ruined it. I hope to God that John Bigelow can try again.

[Anonymous No.11780386]

>>11780367
The GIGACHAD Recycle
>dig trench
>placed old Starship in trench
>cover trench
>simple and rugged
>makes virgin printerlets seethe

[Anonymous No.11780392]

>>11780375
allegedly they intend to rehire people once things stabilize, but it's probably dead for good

[Anonymous No.11780401]

>>11780344
>. I cannot imagine being you, unhappy about the greatest habitat ever seen off Earth just because it didn't involve 3d meme.
Take your strawman back to r*ddit, 2 starships is not enough for a colony, especially one that is meant for 1 million people. 3d printing martian building material is what is going to make the colony sustainable and that is why it is being researched so significantly.

[Anonymous No.11780408]

>>11780384
If you can't see the value of research on human physiology in microgravity, you're a faggot

[Anonymous No.11780415]

>>11780375
luckily, SNC have picked up the banner of inflatable pressurized volume

[Anonymous No.11780419]

>>11780401
> 2 starships is not enough for a colony, especially one that is meant for 1 million people.
>Hey, this is going to be really cool, right?
>You mean [thing you didn't say]?
>No, I mean the thing I said
>That thing can't do [thing you never claimed]
What the fuck, nigger. You stupid fucking faggot. Stop posting if you're just going to randomly throw shit up out of your ass nonsensically. I was talking about the very first habitat on Mars and you're suddenly talking about 1 million people. Kill yourself you fucking illiterate.

[Anonymous No.11780425]

>>11780362
>>11780368
I don't normally pay a whole lot of attention to space but this exchange interested me as a chemist. Looking briefly at what we know of Mars it's mostly basalt type rock and we have seen signs of calcium sulfate but few carbonates and those have been dominated by magnesium carbonate. Not to mention the lack of large sources of water. If that's right I don't see it being viable to try to make any 'concrete' structures on Mars, though I'm sure there's more invested people than me looking for alternatives.
The soil could probably still be used in reinforced earth structures but that's an engineering issue.

[Anonymous No.11780429]

Shut up about the fucking printing guys. The shilling is getting annoying.

[Anonymous No.11780432]

>>11779749
anime
in a COMPUTER
DUDE WwtffFffffffFFFFFFF

[Anonymous No.11780433]

>>11780415
Ohh, nice.

[Anonymous No.11780434]

>>11780401
Not him, but that's probably meant as a first habitat, the rest would probably be build by different means.
That's probably not 3D-printers either, but some kind of brick on brick or sheet metal fabrivation because 3D-printing sucks for structures that aren't complex.
Mars is rich in iron ore, if they find a way to refine that ore there efficiently, they have a great construction material for all kinds of purposes.

[Anonymous No.11780435]

>>11780401
Bruh, just use more old Starships to start the colony. There's plenty to spare while the bros fix the cement printer.

[Anonymous No.11780437]

>>11780380
>The N1 program continued until 1972.
I never said that the N1 was scrapped in 1969. It was scrapped before they landed on the Moon as they wanted to focus on projects much closer to home and focus the savings from their space budgets on the ground. The Soviets continued to break ground in LEO with their Space station Mir.
>The US had a few minor victories
Wow, well done. So did Germany, but who won the war?
>>11780384
>And what did that actually accompish?
This is plain and simply retarded to try and even say that there is no benefit to studying the effects of humans staying long term in space.

[Anonymous No.11780438]

>>11780419
Learn to read a thread plebbitor

[Anonymous No.11780439]

>>11780438
Learn to read at all.

[Anonymous No.11780448]

>>11780433
fuck yeah dude, forget Bigelow Scams it's SNC time

[Anonymous No.11780450]

>>11780425
Look into it, there are concrete and composite types that have been proposed, a contest has been done with regolith materials and NASAs Swamp Works has done some cool things. The only reason i am arguing against these idiots is because the actual people whose job is space are researching and talking about 3d printed habitats.

[Anonymous No.11780453]

>>11780448
I wouldn't call Dr. Bigelow a scammer since he DID deliver thrice, but I can't wait to see SNC pick up after his (figurative) death.

[Anonymous No.11780456]

>>11780434
>3D-printing sucks for structures that aren't complex.
they are researching this as we speak anon. There is a reason NASA and ESA are planning it for their future bases. Obviously printing isn't streamlined yet but its continually getting better

[Anonymous No.11780457]

>>11779782
>"Hurr durr capitalist man bad for being successful"

Are r*ddit commies really retarded enough to believe that a government organized space operation would be more effective than a privatized one? NASA's a living testament to that being untrue since their developments in space travel have been stagnant for the past 40 years other than sending some rovers to various planets. Meanwhile SpaceX successfully managed to create several reusable spacecraft that are significantly more cost effective than any of the competition's offerings in under a decade.

[Anonymous No.11780458]

>>11780291
>coping by saying cope
Copeception

[Anonymous No.11780459]

>>11780450
Even if that were true, it's like saying 'the actual people whose job is space are talking about hydrolox' in the Shuttle era. Lo and behold the whole house of cards falls down because it was never based on sound principles. Literally the only thing that matters right now is what SpaceX puts on their rockets, and they've consistently chosen the simplistic first principles approach over oldspace memes.

[Anonymous No.11780460]

>>11780277
>This but instead it's got lenticular printing depicting the daily dose gif but with Elon and Russia with the words "THANKS DOC" stencilled in.
kek

[Anonymous No.11780464]

Honestly I don't have a dog in the Mars habitat shitposting, but I say since Starship can YEET anything up to (hypothetically) 150 tons, I say both construction methods should be optimized for vacuum, shot to the moon and tested live.
Put both automated constructors through their full paces and whoever loses is a faget.

[Anonymous No.11780465]

>>11780277
>This but instead it's got lenticular printing depicting the daily dose gif but with Elon and Russia

[Anonymous No.11780470]

>>11780456
The process of 3D-printing, be it fused filament or laser sintering/melting, is highly energy intensive, time consuming and requires a printer that is larger than the structure you want to print.
That's not exactly great in this specific application.
Meanwhile one could fabricate pressure vessels from sheet metal wich can be produced with all that iron on mars in a massive scale at high speed.
To protect against radiation, you just dig a trench and use the material you dug out to cover the pressure vessel.

[Anonymous No.11780473]

>>11780302
Yes I had this idea earlier. Idk the practicality of it, but it could be done. Kind of like sticking Spacelab in the cargo bay of shuttle to add more living quarters. Hell you could probably stick Orion in the cargo bay of starship and pilot it?

[Anonymous No.11780475]

>>11780464
>YEET
Jfc

[Anonymous No.11780478]

>>11780352
Dangerously fucking retarded. Low lunar gravity is arguably more interesting than microgravity. And we didn’t go “sightseeing” you mongoloid. Selenography and lunar petrology teaches us more about the development of Earth and the solar system than performing little science fair experiments in LEO

[Anonymous No.11780481]

>>11780464
do you have a dog in the "is Starship a spaceplane" shitposting?

[Anonymous No.11780484]

>>11780478
I agree completely, the full Apollo Applications Program with moonbase and multiple Saturn V's worth of Skylab and etcetera would be WAY better than dicking around in LEO with Salyut and Mir
but that didn't happen
we put ONE geologist on the moon and a couple of shitty rovers for a total time of a few hundred man-hours

[Anonymous No.11780486]

>>11780464
>inb4 a SpaceX Starship launches a
>Boring company drill to build an underground habitat powered by
>Solarcity solar cells and the crew drives around in a modified
>Tesla wich is conected via
>Starlink satellites for communication

[Anonymous No.11780487]

>>11780478
>Low lunar gravity is arguably more interesting than microgravity.

[Anonymous No.11780489]

>>11780487
stfu nigger

[Anonymous No.11780493]

>>11780481
A couple threads back I thought it would be better to categorize it as a "finned rocket" rather than a true spaceplane, since it (in my humble estimation) doesn't have enough plane-like characteristics. It launches in a vertical stack, the fins aren't really used for lift like the full sized wings of spaceplanes. It returns to Earth somewhat like a spaceplane but also somewhat like a capsule, steeper angle than the shuttle, shallower than a capsule, and instead of gliding/flying in to land on a runway like an airplane it instead bodyslams and performs a retropropulsive landing more akin to the already existing Falcon rockets.

[Anonymous No.11780501]

>>11780493
Not him, but I'd say it's a kind of its own.
It doesn't do aerodynamic flight like a spaceplane and it isn't a capsule either.
It does hard aerobraking with almost entirely turbulent airflow and can't fly even remotely horizontal like a capsule, but it offers controll and doesn't use parachutes allmost like a spaceplane.

[Anonymous No.11780502]

>>11780493
Perfect, yes yes yes. This is exactly right. The “wings” on Starship are more akin to the grid fins on Falcon, they only resemble wings because they need to be aerodynamically shaped for liftoff in an atmosphere. They, in no way, provide lift like shuttle. Spaceplanelets are so insistent lmao

[Anonymous No.11780504]

it's on youtube now in higher quality
https://youtu.be/aKWio4zHShM

[Anonymous No.11780509]

>>11780437
> It was scrapped before they landed on the Moon as they wanted to focus on projects much closer to home
It was scrapped because they couldn't get it to work. Salyut 1 was 1971, remember. This is concurrent with N1-L3; while OKB-1 apparently wanted to go all in on Salyut, higher Soviet leadership still held hopes for getting N1-L3 working, and did not see the programs as mutually exclusive.
We are in agreement that politicians on both sides did not care about space except as it contributed to their internal/external propaganda goals, and rushed to slash funding as soon as they could, with serious consequences for what the space programs could do.
>but who won the war?
In the case of space now, the US.
Before the USSR collapsed, USSR for sustained human activity, US for unmanned/outside LEO activity.
Manned space went literally nowhere, so the key area for exploration switched to probes and rovers, where the US handily established a presence exceeding anyone else's. The later Salyuts and Mir gave the USSR/Russia the only meaningful human presence in LEO, but that presence did not contribute to anything other than sustaining the human presence in LEO. Energia had tremendous promise and would've given the USSR/Russia a dominant platform for intensive space activities, but alas fate overcame it.
>there is no benefit to studying the effects of humans staying long term in space.
Only if that information is actually put to use, say in designing the craft for long duration missions out of the Earth system. Otherwise the argument becomes "we need a station to gather information about humans in space which we need because we have a station," entirely circular. Though it's not any less circular than "we need a shuttle to have a station to have somewhere for the shuttle to go to," so that is a good argument by conventional space policy standards.

[Anonymous No.11780517]

>>11780486
That’s unironically the gist of it, all of the major technologies from Elon’s companies can work on any remotely inhabitable planet (satellite internet constellations, solar power, electric vehicles, underground tunnel boring, vertical-landing capable spacecraft).
What looks like what happened is when he was young he looked at the core technologies required to make life multiplanetary and started working on every one step by step. We are still very much in the early game.

[Anonymous No.11780521]

>>11780502
I'd agree, they could be classified as "winglets" if they were fixed with their own independent control surfaces, but they're just hinged which makes the entire thing a control surface, and thus more of a "fin". They couldn't be for lift because they're way too short, both in terms of vertical and horizontal size.

[Anonymous No.11780543]

>>11780509
>In the case of space now, the US.
Delusion.
>US for unmanned
This is absolute delusion. The US sent missions to the outer planets, while the USSR was the first to land on the Moon, Mars and the first to land on another planet unmanned, as well as getting the first satellite.

[Anonymous No.11780545]

>>11780517
Indeed, and in the meantine some of these companies can produce some serious cashflow for the project.
Looking at the growth-rate of Tesla, you can see them dominating certain segments now after only a pretty short time since the first roadster and they aren't slowing down their growth at all.
And Starlink just has an insane potential in the order of billions per month in cashflow that could easy be 50 % profit or more once it is established.

Especialy Starlink and SpaceX benefit insanely from each other on several levels.
>Starlink launches fill excess launch capacity with dirt cheap re-used boosters
>costing next to nothing for Starlink and keeping SpaceX workes busy and in routine
>SpaceX can potentialy use these satellites for communication and experiments in LEO
>Starlink will most likely be insanely profitable and fund SpaceX projects like manned Luna/Mars missions
>Starlink satellites can be deployed in lunar/martian orbit for communication there

[Anonymous No.11780547]

>>11780435
>There's plenty to spare while the bros fix the cement printer.
Retard

[Anonymous No.11780550]

>>11780459
they've already built 1/3rd scale models to test the materials.

[Anonymous No.11780554]

>>11780545
>couldn't invest in TSLA because I was still a uni student
>finally finish uni and start working end of 2019
>have enough money to cover all my bills and ready to start investing
>by the time I've got the cash on hand TSLA skyrockets to the point where even a fan of electric vehicles like me knows that shit is overvalued
Fuck.

[Anonymous No.11780556]

>>11780517
>>11780545
I think eventually other companies are going to have to learn how to piggy back off of SpaceX, just because they can't do everything.

So, for example, some company could design a space hotel in a Lagrange point and pay for SpaceX to ship the parts there and ferry tourists there and back.

[Anonymous No.11780558]

>>11780470
>Meanwhile one could fabricate pressure vessels from sheet metal wich can be produced with all that iron on mars in a massive scale at high speed.
>To protect against radiation, you just dig a trench and use the material you dug out to cover the pressure vessel.
So you want to ship in a metal forge, excavator to fabricate and bury a sheet metal hab while on EVA? Seems like a lot more risk and steps than a printer.

[Anonymous No.11780559]

>>11780545
>>Starlink launches fill excess launch capacity with dirt cheap re-used boosters
Once starlink is filled up what's the excess capacity going to be used for?

[Anonymous No.11780560]

>>11780545
Oh, and if SpaceX had a few hundred million in funding each month, you can bet they would advance even faster than they are doing now.
Combined for at cost in-house lauches of Starship, I could see rotating habitats around earth and luna in 10-20 years as well as a private manned mars mission.

[Anonymous No.11780563]

>>11780559
Ideally the Starship will be in service by then and the focus will have shifted to Mars.

[Anonymous No.11780565]

>>11779785
>muh dogwhistles
Yeah fuck off

[Anonymous No.11780566]

>>11780558
Choose an argument. When it's in the context of early colonization you only want to talk about "muh 1 million". When it's in the context of advanced infrastructure you're suddenly worried about complexity. It's almost like your 3D printing meme is an awkward middle ground that is too unreliable for stage 1 colonization and too primitive to sustain a large scale civilization.

[Anonymous No.11780567]

>>11780558
That's insanely more efficient at the required scale than melting sand in layers.
I'd also trust a steel pressure vessel more than a glass lile material as steel offers superrior ductility.

[Anonymous No.11780569]

>>11780543
>Delusion.
If we just use "Missions to Mars during the 2020 launch window" as an example, the US was sending the largest payload there, the Perseverance rover.
If we use the outer planets, that domain is still entirely US.
If we look at ongoing Mars missions, mostly US.
Ongoing and future Moon missions, mostly US.
Again, being the first does not matter. What you do and can do while there matters. The sustained effort you exert matters.
>This is absolute delusion.
What did it get for being the "first?" Passed ten seconds of stability then a notification rang and contract completion money was deposited? Is there substantially more or substantially higher quality scientific data coming from it? These probes are loaded with data collection instruments for a reason, no?

[Anonymous No.11780574]

>>11780386
NOOOO THIS IS TOO SIMPLE AND PRACTICAL!!!

[Anonymous No.11780576]

>>11780559
When the starlink network is complete, starship should be ready as well.
So probably assembly of a few habitats, moon landings and mars landings.
With Starlink in full operation, funding is a non-issue.

[Anonymous No.11780578]

>>11780559
lol if all 42,000 satellites have been launched I think a lack of work to do will be the last thing on SpaceX's mind. From the moment of the first Starship launch onward, there will never again be "excess capacity" because the great thing about space is you can scale it infinitely up. If you have a flight-capable Starship that's yet another candidate for getting chucked to mars or titan or the moon or any of the dozens of places in the solar system we'll eventually inhabit

[Anonymous No.11780582]

>>11780565
No one hears “dogwhistles” except for crazy communist SJWs

[Anonymous No.11780586]

>>11779785
>fag frog
Yotsuba can go

[Anonymous No.11780587]

>>11780582
You're painfully transparent. The last one even had 1488

[Anonymous No.11780588]

>>11780565
There are no "dogwhistles" in the flag, you idiot.

t. Made the 4ASS logo

[Anonymous No.11780590]

>>11780450
>The only reason i am arguing against these idiots is because the actual people whose job is space are developing and building SLS
imagine having this thought process

[Anonymous No.11780593]

>>11780587
We literally did launch a frog though.

[Anonymous No.11780595]

>>11780484
>we put ONE geologist on the moon and a couple of shitty rovers for a total time of a few hundred man-hours
And it stands to this day as the greatest scientific data haul of any space program ever attempted, anon.

[Anonymous No.11780597]

>>11780587
That was made by someone else as a joke to Conestoga 1620.

[Anonymous No.11780598]

>arguing over 3d printing vs reusing starships
>not using a combination of pressurized tunnels and inflatable habitats made of Mars made dyneema so you can go 100% ISRU

[Anonymous No.11780599]

>>11780578
Or to build habitats near earth.
Remember, Starship isn't just a heavy lifter, but mainly designed to bring down launch costs further.
F9 is allready insanely competitively priced and operates at a margin of about 50%, meaning half of what they charge is pure profit and they are still the cheapest per kg launch provider IIRC.

[Anonymous No.11780601]

>>11780597
>>11780588
>haha it's a joke
You're not fooling anyone

[Anonymous No.11780602]

>>11780565
fuck off tranny go back to discord

[Anonymous No.11780603]

>>11780587
>Communist screaming

[Anonymous No.11780605]

>>11780601
why are you even here lol, go to reddit and help out the reddit spaceprogram if you're gonna whine about dogwhistling you nigger

[Anonymous No.11780606]

>>11780567
This is the correct opinion, anon.

Steel structures and steel liners surrounded by reinforced regolith is the road that will get us from zero to one million the fastest. You literally cannot beat welding together steel tubes in excavated trenches, especially once we send the best performing mexicans at Boca Chica to Mars.

[Anonymous No.11780608]

>>11780595
Harrison Schmitt doesn’t get the credit he deserves. Based geologist astronaut- AND he’s a republican

[Anonymous No.11780609]

>>11780601
>Accelerationist who's stated goal is to kick off conflict by manipulating political factions.
You couldn't have possibly picked a worse example, you are actively aiding this scumbag in his stated goal.

[Anonymous No.11780610]

>>11780598
Honestly, jokes about proonting aside, all viable options should be tried. Space flight should be about opening possibilities, not trying to turn every mission plan into an exclusive club.

>>11780601
You do know that the "okay" sign existed for longer than that and is often used as a joke sign from middle school humor, right?

[Anonymous No.11780611]

>>11780605
>>11780602
This stuff started appearing once the threads got popular with cross boarders

[Anonymous No.11780612]

>>11780569
Using examples from after the fall of the Soviet Union doesnt count. The Soviet Union objectively won the space race; the only thing that America won was the Moon race.
>What did it get for being first
What did it need to get? Propaganda? The probes sent by the Soviet Union were loaded with scientific probes and sent back precious information about the inner planets, it analyzed the soil and regolith of Venus and many other accomplishments. Your delusion that "America is the only country to accomplish things in space" is astounding.

[Anonymous No.11780614]

New vid on abandoned SpaceX rockets by HULLOman
https://youtu.be/4g796kiGDyU

[Anonymous No.11780615]

>>11780610
You know what that gesture has come to mean now. You made a conscious decision to include it just like the 1488 bullshit

[Anonymous No.11780618]

>>11780610
Tried putting the clover inside the globe?

[Anonymous No.11780619]

>>11780615
Again, why are you still here? Go aid the pl*bbit space program

[Anonymous No.11780621]

>>11780610
I have to imagine that the early phases of the Mars program will be the actual people on Mars trying to run through all of the autistic things that people back on earth think they should do, to see what actually works.

I still think tunnels is best meta, because the existing proposals for long term habitation say it's a good idea, and because it allows for 100% ISRU.

[Anonymous No.11780623]

>>11780615
>be literally the only person in the thread who sees white supremacist symbols
>everyone else is the one with the problem

I fucking hate /pol/niggers, but you have a bad case of rent free my dude.

[Anonymous No.11780626]

>>11780623
/etm/ is comfy though

[Anonymous No.11780629]

>>11780598
The goal for the first habitat will be:
>house a crew of about a dozend people for 2 years
Two starships in a trench should do the job just fine.
The goal for later habitats will be:
>provide as much volume/space ASAP for a lot of people safely
Here 3D-printing would be insufficient and inefficient.
Meanwhile infalteable habitats mean you need to fly in all the mass from earth, wich is only realy possible every few years and expensive as hell.
Producing sheetmetal on mars itself makes you independent from the beginning and allows you to expand from two starships in a trench to whatever is required on your own quickly and efficiently.

[Anonymous No.11780631]

>>11780615
>You know what that gesture has come to mean now.
Yes, now it is a joke sign. The Nazi association is tacked on by few people looking for an ax to grind. Nazism was not on my mind when I made that logo.

>You made a conscious decision to include it just like the 1488 bullshit
I put the okay sign as a joke, unrelated to Nazism. The 1488 version was made by someone else.

>>11780618
The clover was a rushed afterthought after I scrapped drawing a more detailed globe.

>>11780621
I'm more of a fan of covered trenches as they're simpler to make and are more structurally sound than a tunnel, but tunnels are probably better in the long term.

[Anonymous No.11780632]

>>11780629
This is just my own person vision for it, but I would want the first habitat to be way more than a dozen. 50 or higher would be ideal.

My theory is that more people helps to stave off violent insanity.

Then again, I'm basically envisioning Mars colonization as IRL dwarf fortress, so I might be more worried about tantrum spirals than I really should be.

[Anonymous No.11780633]

>>11780606
Shit, totaly forgot that SpaceX is now the master in welding pressure vessels of that size from sheetmetal.

[Anonymous No.11780635]

>>11780608
His geriatric scientific yarns about geology, dong expansion and piss condoms in 1/6 g are cozy. He'd be easily the smartest man I'd ever meet if I ever meet him. The man is a national treasure.
https://www.americasuncommonsense.com/1-apollo-17-diary-of-the-12th-man/c-chapters-10-18/8-chapter-10-a-valley-on-the-moon/

[Anonymous No.11780637]

>>11780631
The issue with the cut and cover method is that you need reinforcement and the resulting structure isn't resistant to internal pressure.

If you have a tunnel boring machine in geologically stable bedrock, you can eliminate both of these problems.

[Anonymous No.11780641]

>>11780631
>now it is a joke sign.
Strange looking joke.

[Anonymous No.11780642]

>>11780621
With significant tunneling you'll end up with a shitton of raw materials for building above ground as well. It'll be involved but alongside everything else

[Anonymous No.11780645]

>>11780641
Why are you even here?

[Anonymous No.11780647]

>>11780567
>That's insanely more efficient at the required scale than melting sand in layers.
As opposed to mining, refining and forging steel? The cemwnt/composite printed in the tests seemed to work just fine.

[Anonymous No.11780649]

>>11780598
Before I realized the other thread was dead I wrote up a little post about how by packing ten tons worth of jigs and welders and metal bending equipment plus 140 tons of 5mm thick aluminum on a roll, you could crap out about 10,000 cubic meters worth of habitable living volume in the form of capsule shaped cans 10 meters across and ~10 meters tall, connected by short tunnels with airtight doors.

Basically, by dedicating a single Starship's cargo capacity, you get ten Starship's worth of living space after a few weeks or months of construction work. The thing is, once you have the metalworking equipment, if you can get your own in-situ aluminum smelting operational, you can flow from expanding living space in large increments every 2.5 years to expanding your living space continuously in small increments, adding up to a much larger total expansion over 2.5 years, at least once aluminum smelting and sheet metal rolling production increases to at least 140 tons per 2.5 years (~1077 kg of aluminum sheet metal per week).

Of course, it may make sense to instead use steel after taking energy into account, since iron is easier to smelt even if you need to expend energy splitting the CO2 produced back into the carbon you need to reduce the iron oxide. Iron also seems to be more plentiful on Mars (though it isn't literally everywhere, people who think Mars is one big ball of iron oxide can fuck off). Electron beam welding (the chad of welding) works regardless of metal choice, so even if we started off by sending aluminum it wouldn't be a big deal to switch to steel once we could produce it on Mars.

[Anonymous No.11780653]

>>11780566
> thinking its only one anon
Face it anon your oldspace fantasies are outdated.

[Anonymous No.11780652]

>>11780647
Mars is literally covered in iron oxide though. That's why they call it the red planet.

When you combine that with that fact that you would lose little to no heat to convection during the steelmaking process, and it would be pretty easy to make steel.

[Anonymous No.11780654]

>>11780632
Even at 50 people, the starship in a trench will be the most efficient way of building a first habitat.
And keep in mind that it's a temporary one for only aqbout 2 years for the first crew.
The heavy equipment will come with later missions.

[Anonymous No.11780657]

>>11780609
I'm not really into acceleration, jerk is where it's at.

[Anonymous No.11780658]

>>11780645
Better question is why did these threads got polluted with cross boarders like you. This shit didn't happen a year ago.

[Anonymous No.11780659]

>>11780642
I envision the meta for Mars habitats as being mole people cities with transparent plastic domes above to house farms and botanical gardens.

[Anonymous No.11780660]

>>11780645
Just fucking ignore him, he's obviously just here to stir shit.

[Anonymous No.11780661]

>>11780645
I'm not even the same anon, but retards trying to still claim that the ok hand signal isn't used as a Nazi dogwhistle should hang themselves

[Anonymous No.11780665]

>>11780637
The cut and cover method is much better for early colony set ups because the tools don't have to dig as deep nor through as dense materials. It can be done faster, cheaper, and easier than a tunnel. The reinforcement method can be solved by separating the pressure bearing and load bearing structures. However, tunnels are superior once significant equipment is on-site.

[Anonymous No.11780666]

>>11780653
>haha i'll say oldspace
Mate, you literally advocate proont because of some NASA contest a few years ago. You constantly appeal to authority using NASA and ESA. You don't care about scalability and you don't care about simplicity, you believe in the robot meme. Your shit is oldspace. Don't throw that around when you don't know what it means.

[Anonymous No.11780667]

>>11780601
>Actual SJW on 4Chan

[Anonymous No.11780668]

Where the fuck did this plebbit faggot come from?

[Anonymous No.11780670]

>>11780621
One issue with tunnels is the fact that constant occupation will warmt he surrounding rock to uncomfortable temperatures unless you actively remove that waste heat before it can build up. This is a big issue for subway tunnels on Earth for example, a few in Britain are constantly at ~30 degrees celsius because of the heat generated by the brakes on the train and stored in the surrounding earth.

[Anonymous No.11780672]

>>11780668
Why did /pol/ newfags decide to come to these threads? They were comfy before

[Anonymous No.11780674]

>>11780612
>Using examples from after the fall of the Soviet Union doesnt count.
I split it into two time periods: "space now" and "before the USSR collapsed" for precisely that reason. I received replies of "delusion" and "absolute delusion" (mfw I wanted "not great" and "not terrible") for those separate time periods.
>the only thing that America won was the Moon race.
And the outer planets race, and the "greater than 20% success rate to Mars" race
>The probes sent by the Soviet Union were loaded with scientific probes and sent back precious information about the inner planets
Exactly. The probes are there to accomplish something. They're not just empty hulls (as they would be if being "first" was all that mattered). The data they collect is not affected by the order in which probes arrived, but by their instruments, and their ability to survive long enough to collect and transmit data.
>Your delusion that "America is the only country to accomplish things in space" is astounding.
>Before the USSR collapsed, USSR for sustained human activity
is American chauvinism now? The Soviet Union did many things in space; however I see space as being more than an arena for propaganda, in which case "being first" is irrelevant. Boeing was a key contractor for Saturn V, but is that relevant to whether SLS today will beat Starship to the Moon? No. Taking the lead only matters if it converts into a depth and breadth of activities which others can not fully replicate. Otherwise it's all just trophies gathering dust.
The entire reason why crewed space activities have stagnated in LEO for nearly 50 years is that politicians share your idea that space is really just a series of publicity stunts, where everything is done for the quick headline and nothing afterwards matters.

[Anonymous No.11780678]

>>11780661
GO BACK
>>11780658
I'm not even a crossboarder but ok. Also, increased contamination could come from increased interest in space recently due to crew dragon launch, starship development, etc. That's all I could think would be the reasons anyway.

[Anonymous No.11780679]

>>11780670
Well, they won't be dealing with train heat on Mars for some time, just ambient body warmth. You could pump the excess heat into thin hollow channels in the above-ground parts of the habitat, to keep them from being thermally shocked at night when temperatures plummet. That, or colonies will just need some modest radiator fin farms along with the solar farms.

[Anonymous No.11780681]

>anyone that has more than 2 brain cells is from Reddit
Wew laddie

[Anonymous No.11780682]

>>11780672
>pol newfags
I've posted on /sfg/ for over a year now but ok, and I mostly posted on /k/ before then, not /pol/

[Anonymous No.11780684]

>>11780670
Could the waste heat be dealt with by placing water piping around the tunnels to carry the heat to the water storage where it is cooled?

[Anonymous No.11780690]

>>11780684
Probably, I wonder how cooling towers would work on Mars.

[Anonymous No.11780692]

>>11780682
>I've posted on /sfg/ for over a year now but ok,
Holy shit this is great

[Anonymous No.11780695]

>>11780692
Literally nobody has complained about the 4ASS logo before you anon, you're definitely new

[Anonymous No.11780696]

>>11780682
I'm also a /k/ main.

You need to stop giving (you)s to shitposters my dude.

[Anonymous No.11780700]

>>11780665
Fair enough.

I first got interested in the topic after seeing a contest to design a Martian city that can support a million people, so most of my thinking on Mars colonization is built around how to achieve that goal.

Earlier phases won't look anything like that.

[Anonymous No.11780704]

>>11780696
What I don't understand is why they suddenly appeared on this thread. These faggots are even more annoying then the mods who post "muh rockets don't work in space" copypastas to increase activity.

[Anonymous No.11780708]

>>11780690
Maybe it could use the low pressure of Mars' atmosphere to expand the water to cool it? Although, what might be best if Mars' interior is relatively cool is to transfer the heat in the water to a coolant which is then pumped deep underground where it can dump the heat.

[Anonymous No.11780711]

>>11780690
I'd assume you'd just pump the water over the outside of a very corrugated tower through radiators, obviously evaporation cooling towers can dump a ton more heat, but you probably wouldn't want to waste that much water on a planet where you have to excavate just to get at it.

[Anonymous No.11780712]

>>11780637
>you need reinforcement
You'd rely on habitat pressure to counteract the mass of earth sitting on top of it. If the habitat depressurizes you're dead anyway.
>the resulting structure isn't resistant to internal pressure
It would actually be resistant to higher pressures than before, because there'd be less pressure differential compared to the shell liner pressurized to 1 atm sitting uncovered on the surface. Nobody's saying you'd use a non-airtight layer for your habitat in a cut-and-cover setup.

>If you have a tunnel boring machine in geologically stable bedrock, you can eliminate both of these problems.
They aren't really problems as you suggest, but okay. Counterpoint, maybe it's very hard to find significantly large, unfractured monoliths of bedrock on Mars, maybe no matter where you dig you need to install an impermeable liner anyway, at which point the only real savings you're making are in liner material, because there's functionally zero difference between the liner of a bored tunnel and the shell liner of a cut-and-cover habitat. The biggest differences would be that the cut-and-cover method is easier, faster, and less resource intensive, while also being much more flexible. The disadvantages of cut-and-cover are the increased materials cost for stiffer, thicker liners and the increased potential of accidentally damaging the liners while covering them.

I'd say that tunneled habitats will probably make sense eventually, but as an early game method of increasing living space, no. It's just not worth it to send a thousand ton machine, assemble it on Mars after landing it near a suitable site, getting the thing digging, and then installing habitats behind it as it hollows out space, at least until such time that dozens of Starships at least are going to Mars every launch window and we're looking for solutions for more problems than just habitation (connecting nearby but separated habitat clusters via buried pressurized access tunnels?).

[Anonymous No.11780713]

>>11780708
>which is then pumped deep underground where it can dump the heat
Perhaps we could just dump it into unstable lava tubes.

[Anonymous No.11780716]

>>11780711
That's what I was thinking honestly. I wonder how large the radiators would have to be to effectively disperse heat in the martian atmosphere.

[Anonymous No.11780720]

>>11780713
Only if the tube is significantly cooler than a warm habitat.

[Anonymous No.11780723]

>>11780695
That 4ASS bullshit appeared not a month ago

[Anonymous No.11780726]

>>11780704
Assuming they really are the ones retardposting, what's to stop them /pol/ posting too, just to stir up shit? That also accelerates the thread and can plausibly be excused as /pol/ leakage and election tourists. Just ignore all offtopic/retarded posters and do the thing, giving them replies or even just discussing them makes it worse. Last time I'll post about it.
>>11780716
Nothing major compared to the radiators for large power supplies that will be involved with ISRU stuff like baking marscrete bricks or PRINTINNNNNG, and cracking ice for air, water and propellant.

[Anonymous No.11780728]

>>11780661
>Muh dogwhistles OMG

No one cares tranny

[Anonymous No.11780735]

>>11780723
Considering I haven't seen you complain about it in any thread for a month, that just shows you're even newer then I thought. Also, good luck forcing affirmative action bullshit on Mars.

[Anonymous No.11780737]

>go to thread to see if the 3dfag subsided and actual space discussion is happening
>a fucking war occurred over the ok gesture
wtf happened?

[Anonymous No.11780739]

>>11780652
>Mars is literally covered in iron oxide though.
In dust which will be a lot harder to gather than normal regolith.

[Anonymous No.11780740]

>>11780737
Trannies

[Anonymous No.11780741]

>>11780674
>for precisely that reason.
For precisely what reason? To try and shift the goalposts and say that America won? America lost the space race by every metric, the only exception being human landing on the moon.
>USSR only a 20%success rate for Mars
The USSR was aiming for Mars far earlier and sending far more than the US. During the 1960s the USSR attempted 10 fucking launches compared to America's 2.

In the 1970s the USSR attempted 13 mars missions compared to the NASA's 4.

[Anonymous No.11780742]

>>11780728
Just stop replying to them for now. As >>11780726 pointed out, they're probably either election tourists or mods trying to accelerate the threads.
>>11780726
I wonder if SpaceX will be able to get the go-ahead for nuclear reactors within even a decade of the colony being set up.

[Anonymous No.11780747]

>>11780735
I've been seeing it for a while and commented on it just like the one with the 1488. That is off topic larping.

[Anonymous No.11780749]

>>11780661
Who gives a fuck?

[Anonymous No.11780751]

>>11780610
>all viable options should be tried
You're right. Maybe it's the plebbit shilling that's soured it for me, but maybe proonting could actually be viable, but perhaps for storing tools and stuff. I still don't really trust it as actual living quarters.

[Anonymous No.11780752]

Elon here, just wanted to say I don't in any way condone /sfg/ , and Pepe Gagarin will soon be taking another crack at the moon, I hope before Labor Day. This time, though, it will be in the Dr. Zooch Rocket Coincidentally Bearing Some Resemblance to the Falcon Heavy (TM). Because he's outgrown the crew cabin of Shitpost Starship.

[Anonymous No.11780754]

>>11780728
>>11780740
>tranny tranny tranny
>but I'm not from /pol/

[Anonymous No.11780755]

>>11780666
>You don't care about scalability and you don't care about simplicity,
if i didn't care I'd be shilling for steel

[Anonymous No.11780760]

>>11780695
When someone brags that they are "not a newfag because they've browsed [x] for a year, it's incredibly cringe and you know that they are new.

[Anonymous No.11780761]

>>11780682
>I've posted on /sfg/ for over a year now
go back

[Anonymous No.11780765]

>>11780754
Well, I'm not from 4/pol/.

[Anonymous No.11780766]

>>11780761
>>11780760
>says the people complaining about ok hands

[Anonymous No.11780767]

What would the interiors of those Martian/Lunar bases look like (beyond sparsely decorated research outposts, but rather larger bases where people are expected to live in). As common as the clean futuristic iPod look is, I don't think this would be what such interiors would look like. The iPod look is rather sterile and not homely. It looks fine for an office or a TV show set, but not for a place someone will come to relax and sleep in at the end of every workday.

Warm colors that are more relaxing for the eyes than white could be use, but keep the lighter tones as to make the space look bigger. Maybe even have patters on the walls and ceiling as to hide the contours of the habitat. Giving the illusion that it's more spacious.

Thoughts?

[Anonymous No.11780769]

>>11780752
Got pictures of the Dr. Zooch Rocket?

[Anonymous No.11780770]

>>11780767
Dark brown, like poo

[Anonymous No.11780775]

>>11780767
I'd say we start with the apple look, but with more beige colors and stuff. Then, we add earthy furniture, until it's like that room from 2001: a Space Odyssey, but actually lively. Looks futuristic and comfy.

[Anonymous No.11780776]

>>11780767
Anything touched by SpaceX will almost certainly have a minimalistic interior aesthetic. Which I think is fine. If you're into minimalism, you just keep it that way; if you're not, you'd just treat it as a blank canvas.

[Anonymous No.11780779]

>>11780769
Currently being assembled at our Mouth of Loli, TX facility.

[Anonymous No.11780784]

>>11780728
>tranny

[Anonymous No.11780786]

>>11780726
>Nothing major compared to the radiators for large power supplies that will be involved with ISRU stuff like baking marscrete bricks or PRINTINNNNNG, and cracking ice for air, water and propellant.
Sorce: your ass

[Anonymous No.11780789]

To get the thread to stop being so chaotic, let's post KSP screencaps.

[Anonymous No.11780790]

>>11780766
>says the people complaining about ok hands
>This assblasted he quite literally outed himself as a newfag
Oh nonono

[Anonymous No.11780792]

>>11780742
I don't think they'd get the go-ahead for their own if they decided to make them, because the red tape surrounding private nuclear power is enormous, but I can see NASA being willing to supply a Mars outpost with their Kilopower units, both to field test them and to advance space exploration. As they are, kilopowers are far too anemic to get anything serious done, besides keep the lights on and recharge vehicles.
What could work is sending the empty reactor over first, and then sending the fuel over separately in an armored flask rated for reentry and loaded with redundant protection like crash bags and parachutes.
The only way I can imagine the US government (and everybody who's airspace the fuel will fly over) consenting to a private reactor being sent up in a rocket is if it's is practically impossible for anything up to and including a RUD to release the fuel.

[Anonymous No.11780793]

>>11780779
Pepe Gagarin is a very brave frog. Godspeed.

[Anonymous No.11780794]

>>11780789
>tfw KSP 2 got cancelled

[Anonymous No.11780797]

>>11780654
Pretty much. Just the habitat section of one Starship would give 50 people 20 cubic meters to themselves. If you put a Starship on its side in a ditch, cut holes in the bulkheads and welded the valves shut to turn the methane and oxygen tanks into more habitat volume, you'd end up with a total of about 2600 cubic meters, or 52 cubic meters of volume per person. Definitely livable, that's an over 200 square foot room per person (less in practice of course since you're in a cylinder, not a block).

[Anonymous No.11780801]

>>11780755
>hurrr i'm not oldspace you are ps fuck steel!
Go fuck an isogrid, go suck off a pressurized hydrogen tank, you are the enemy

[Anonymous No.11780803]

>>11780789
I wish I brought over my /kspg/ meme folder from my old computer.

[Anonymous No.11780808]

>>11780794
Yeah, kinda sucks. At least mods could probably fill in for the utterly new flavors the game would've brought in. I mean fuck, have you seen some of the HD mods? Man I wanna live on Laythe now.

[Anonymous No.11780809]

>>11780794
I don't even wanna think about it

[Anonymous No.11780810]

>>11780794
Why?

[Anonymous No.11780816]

>>11780704
It's because (((they))) feel the need to double down on shill activity ever since DEMO 2's success

[Anonymous No.11780817]

>>11780794
At least the hype motivated me to finally start trying out the science mode rather than just mess around in sandbox.

>>11780808
Got any mod suggestions?

[Anonymous No.11780821]

>>11780794
Not cancelled. They moved the project to a new studio and thus pushed back the release date by quite a bit. I am patient.

[Anonymous No.11780823]

>>11780794
Source?

[Anonymous No.11780826]

>>11780816
>meme joos parentheses

[Anonymous No.11780832]

>>11780817
I recommend Tweakscale. Massive godsend, my rendition of that Xevious Solvalou (i asked if that thing could fly in a past thread) wouldn't be bumbling about when i try to yaw without that mod.

[Anonymous No.11780834]

>>11780792
Corporations will have to take over the government to ensure the survival of humanity

[Anonymous No.11780835]

>>11780786
I mean shit's gonna get hot, not exactly like there's an excess of air on Mars for normal convection cooling. Better than hard vacuum but still nowhere even remotely near what you can get away with on earf.
Where exactly do you think the heat is going to go, since only a tiny amount of it can be drawn away by Mars' extremely thin atmosphere?

[Anonymous No.11780838]

>>11780741
>For precisely what reason?
Because conditions now and conditions then are different. The Soviet Union no longer exists and was evidently limited in what it passed down to Roscosmos.
>attempted
being the operational word.
A probe that crashes or shuts down 14 seconds after landing is of no scientific or programmatic value, except in debugging your processes so that future probes will actually work and accomplish tasks.
High failure rates when starting out or desperately trying to catch up (like the N1) are understandable. But wouldn't we expect the world leading programme to achieve better success rates, reflecting its higher technological level? To be the programme providing the data of choice for those studying the target world?
Again, the difference in viewpoint is about space as nothing but propaganda and space as a domain to be explored, used, and occupied. Though seeing as the USSR sent multiple missions to Mars, the Moon, Venus, LEO, etc., clearly "one success and that's all we'll ever need" was not the driving philosophy there either.

[Anonymous No.11780841]

>>11780835
>Where exactly do you think the heat is going to go, since only a tiny amount of it can be drawn away by Mars' extremely thin atmosphere?

The ground.

[Anonymous No.11780842]

>>11780794
It isn't canned, the shitbags at TakeTwo just poached the old teams devs and some of their project leads to move them to a studio directly owned by them. I think the idea is to put the game in the hands of an overall larger team over which TakeTwo has more direct control, it definitely raises concerns as to whether they might fuck it all up by trying to micromanage development, but the game isn't dead yet.

[Anonymous No.11780852]

>>11780767
Lots of ceramics (easily produced on Mars, which has clay and water, all you need to make simple pots and things) and bamboo furnature (a mature plant can grow new shoots at a rate of over a foot per day in ideal conditions, and bamboo is durable and very versatile in application). Also, potted plants, potted plants, specifically very vigorous plants with affinity to low light levels. Also also, rock collections, rock collections everywhere (shit like native copper and native gold that have all been picked clean from Earth by thousands of years of human activity will be strewn about the place on Mars).

[Anonymous No.11780854]

>>11780784
you are right transgenders don't exist. Just delusional men

[Anonymous No.11780858]

>>11780767
I think you might see some variation on those Japanese sliding wall things, since those allow you to demarcate spaces/rooms within the larger space without having to fuck with the building itself. Obviously not made out of wood, and presumably less weeb-looking, but you get the idea.

It just seems like a relatively practical way for someone to personalize and divide their limited space on a budget.

[Anonymous No.11780862]

>>11780842
Don’t worry about it. It’ll be fine

[Anonymous No.11780866]

>>11780841
So you're gonna keep your machines in intimate contact with the ground via what exactly? Also how are you going to deal with the fact that the ground is a very effective thermal insulator and thus an incredibly shitty heat sink on its own?

[Anonymous No.11780867]

>>11780841
You could, but I'd argue it's easier to just pack a few radiators than to sink heat pipes. Less drilling involved in just setting up some radiators, you could probably even use the same frames as solar panels, except set them to always turn away from the sun instead of towards it.

[Anonymous No.11780873]

>>11780858
You’re describing star trek sliding doors lmao. I’m not opposed- although idk how much power each door would consume

[Anonymous No.11780874]

>>11780767
They actually had that as part of the 3d printing project, it was bright and clean like you said for mental health reasons. Although they would make the walls flowy and less sterile looking

[Anonymous No.11780876]

>>11780874

[Anonymous No.11780877]

>>11780866
>So you're gonna keep your machines in intimate contact with the ground via what exactly?

Heat pipes. The ground is the biggest possible heat sink you could ask for

>>11780867
External radiators would be more vulnerable to erosion and general damage, but that’d work too. Would look like sails or something sticking out of buried mounds

[Anonymous No.11780881]

>>11780873
He means the doors that are just slid with your hands.
>t. half-a-jap-a hapa mutt

[Anonymous No.11780882]

>>11780876

[Anonymous No.11780892]

>>11780877
True, but since the most common plan seems to be to power everything with solar at the start, which will also be susceptible to erosion degeneration over time. Spares for everything. The good thing about radiators is that surface scratching isn't really an issue just very long term major erosion damage, the most efficient ones I've heard of are some test examples from NASA made using inconel pipes and very finely woven carbon fiber fins, they'd be very robust.
Of course you can also reuse your waste heat for other stuff, feed it to subsidiary stirling motors to generate some electric charge, or use it to melt some more ice, or keep the temperature of the hab's surface-facing structures warm during the night so they don't crack from thermal shock.

[Anonymous No.11780898]

>>11780881
I know I was just expanding on the idea lmao. I like the idea of sliding doors but I feel like it would be too thin for, uh, privacy. Especially on Mars when procreating will be of utmost importance

[Anonymous No.11780900]

>>11780882

[Anonymous No.11780901]

>>11780873
Nah, I'm not talking about powered doors between rooms, I'm saying the rooms themselves can be subdivided with movable/sliding barriers that can be extended or retracted to create or expand spaces within the larger room.

The concept does not require power.

>>11780874
The blue carpet reminds me of a thought: Will high-visibility equipment or safety signs be colored blue to contrast against the Martian landscape?

[Anonymous No.11780902]

>>11780874
>>11780876
>>11780882
These interiors aren't anything I'd want to live in long term, they're clinical/office like. Guaranteed somebody would eventually jump out the airlock just to escape it.

[Anonymous No.11780908]

>>11780902
Just put up some band posters/wall tapestries.

[Anonymous No.11780910]

>>11780595
true, but it's so much less than we could have had
should have had

[Anonymous No.11780911]

>>11780902
I agree. I’d rather have wood panel or something warm red, green, or blue

[Anonymous No.11780912]

>>11780615
uh no it still means that if you look at it I get to punch you, duh
but only below the belt

[Anonymous No.11780919]

>>11780902
you spend a shit ton of time at an office. most "homey" places would feel way too claustrophobic after awhile

[Anonymous No.11780923]

>>11780902
Those are just the advertising shots, the actual product will look significantly less like Stock Art. Though it might keep the Ikea look.
>>11780911
>wood panel
It might be baseless speculation on my part, but wood is probably going to be a luxury good on Mars. Y'know, since Earth imports are going to be at a premium, and it's not like it'll be easy to get orchards growing on the Red Planet.

[Anonymous No.11780930]

>>11780911
The planet is reddish brown, you aren't going to want earth tones ore the cabin look because there is no contrast. White and blue is going to look clean and refreshing, green and white would also work. no reds browns or wood color.

[Anonymous No.11780934]

>>11780923
I'd imagine there ought to be a lot of faux wood, maybe even floor carpeting with something like a grass texture, aside from hydroponics trays it would be the closest to real plant life the colonists would see for years.

[Anonymous No.11780937]

>>11780900
I'll build and live on my own mud hut before I live in one of those stupid ass cocoons.

[Anonymous No.11780941]

Just saw something on curiosity stream that talked about heating up the Martian poles with a solar sail. He then said a thick enough atmosphere could be achieved in as little as 50 years.

[Anonymous No.11780953]

>>11780937
Why? just because you don't like it? The egg shape is actually really strong, the material doesn't require the same thickness as concrete and the outer inner shell is effective.

[Anonymous No.11780961]

>>11780953
>Mars habitat sponsored by Tenga

[Anonymous No.11780963]

>>11780953
>Why? just because you don't like it?
Yes.

[Anonymous No.11780966]

>>11780934
Grass-like carpets seem like they might be a bitch to clean. But yeah, faux-wood for a lot of things would make sense. Might give Martian interior design an almost 70s look if they go overboard with the faux wood.

I do sometimes wonder what weird cultural directions Martian society would/will take, especially regarding Earth wilderness/outdoorsmanship imagery.

>>11780937
Understandable, but practicality will have to come first. I'm sure some aesthetic touches can be added to make it less butt plug-esque.

[Anonymous No.11780968]

>>11780961
Its the most impressive habitat proposed so far. Elon is still talking about glass domes.

[Anonymous No.11780971]

>>11780963
good thing you aren't going to mars then.

[Anonymous No.11780981]

>>11780937
>wants to live on mars
>picky about how his house looks on the outside
never gonna make it

[Anonymous No.11780982]

>most of the people who signed up for space force were IT guys
i bet the same thing is going to happen to mars. lots of wealthy IT guys with no trade skills looking to become a sys admin, webdev, or youtuber on mars. the people with actual trade skills are too poor, don't care about space, and have families to take care of.

[Anonymous No.11780988]

For those of you talking about steel structures, give us some concept art. otherwise i'm sticking with 3d printing.

[Anonymous No.11780989]

>>11780968
Maybe elon will develop some sort of transparent meta material

[Anonymous No.11780999]

>>11780968
What about radiation?

[Anonymous No.11781001]

>>11780988
I’m not for 3D printing. It’s fucking dumb. But what can you tell ME to change my mind? Aside from a stupid university project sponsored by NASA, how likely are we to see printing at THIS scale and how in the FUCK would it be easier than bringing an excavator

[Anonymous No.11781003]

What do you guys think of the ESA's moonbase concept?

[Anonymous No.11781007]

>>11780672
DM-2

[Anonymous No.11781012]

>>11781003
Shit, just use landed starship as your base while you build something bigger.

[Anonymous No.11781018]

>>11781003
Another tiny meme concept as if you need a fucking pressure vessel to hold a thin atmosphere in

Make concrete and pour lots of it, add coating on both sides to seal

[Anonymous No.11781021]

>>11780982
There are more tradies with money than you think. Tradesmen will be number one picks for Mars candidates once they exhaust a few starship loads of the best of the best of the best types.

[Anonymous No.11781025]

>>11780968
That's just to present pretty pictures. Don't want to show people the tunnel mole city they are going to actually build.

[Anonymous No.11781026]

>>11780810
its a whole thing. Bascially Take 2 is being extremely slimy by telling them about the cancellation via linkedin and (successfully) poaching the studios developers.

[Anonymous No.11781035]

just got done with for all mankind

i skipped over all the gay and immigrant shit, but other than that crap it was pretty good.

[Anonymous No.11781042]

>>11781025
It’s just going to be giant hexagon warehouses
There is no soil on mars, the ground is going to be solid tough rock
You don’t dig just for fun

[Anonymous No.11781049]

>>11781042
>There is no soil on mars

didn't even read the rest of your post after that.

[Anonymous No.11781064]

>>11781042
>There is no soil on mars

.........What?
Wrong. There’s tons of dust, dirt, and clay.

[Anonymous No.11781069]

Kino table

[Anonymous No.11781071]

>>11780042
For the same reason the De Havilland Comets crashed: sharp edge bad for holding pressure
>>11780134
I agree with all of that except the part about using the cybertruck frame. Just make a new frame that can actually withstand the pressure, and slap on the batteries, motors, suspension, and what not. This is even easier for tesla's cars that have a skateboard construction. Although this >>11780221 illustrates a pretty important design consideration for Mars rovers, being able to dock with airlocks. This is very difficult to do with a regular car and is a good reason to make something like JSC's SEV which has all wheel steering. It would not be difficult for tesla to whip up their own version of the SEV.

[Anonymous No.11781078]

>>11781064
>>11781049
Soil is organic matter, it’s quite easy to dig through
Mars is none of that, it’s a thin layer of gravel and sand on top of rock

Not going to be doing much digging unless you have a real purpose

[Anonymous No.11781081]

>>11781001
>Aside from a stupid university project sponsored by NASA
It wasn't a university project
>But what can you tell ME to change my mind?
We have made cement from real lunar dust that was strong and credible. The excavators we use on earth require traction in the other direction of the dig that can be an issue on the moon/mars. A printer is much more hands off than an excavator/welding type of build and thus is less dangerous for the supervising astronaut. A lot of the work and maintenance can be done while inside instead of out on EVA. A 3D printer is multi use, It can be tasked to make tiles for roads, dust shielding for equipment and can change designs without needing retooling. You can reinforce the regolith you bury the hab in like pic related. It makes inflatable habs actually useful. All of you materials can be gathered from the dirt around you and you can add your plastic waste to make it stronger. AI makes the manpower necessary much lower and can make remote construction possible. It is meltable material so it is easier to deconstruct, it doesn't need to be as thick, it can be built above ground and you could have a bunch of rovers/gatherers for the weight of one excavator.

[Anonymous No.11781085]

>>11781018
>Make concrete and pour lots of it, add coating on both sides to seal
what are you going to do that with?

[Anonymous No.11781088]

>>11781025
he literally said he thought a glass dome could be an option.

[Anonymous No.11781094]

>>11781085
You do that with your construction crew and the heavy machinery you brought

[Anonymous No.11781099]

>>11781094
>You do that with your construction crew and the heavy machinery you brought
how many in the crew and what machinery?

[Anonymous No.11781103]

>>11781088
I mean he's not lying, even if they plan to use tunnel machines, glass domes are still an option.

[Anonymous No.11781123]

>>11781003
cock and balls

[Anonymous No.11781124]

>>11781123
i like it

[Anonymous No.11781127]

>>11781081
you still need to move dirt around, so you're still going to need excavators.
>>make tiles for roads
how fast
>>meltable
melting dirt sounds like it takes a lot of energy. And if you need more energy, you'll need more solar panels. Current mars printed mars habitat designs just use plastic mixed with rock...
>>A printer is much more hands off
but is it really? So why not just take a tube and bury it? One neat thing you can do is just throw regolith up on to the habitat because air resistance and gravity is low.

[Anonymous No.11781133]

>>11781127
>you still need to move dirt around, so you're still going to need excavators.
pic related.
>how fast
how fast do you need it to be?

[Anonymous No.11781138]

>>11781127
>melting dirt sounds like it takes a lot of energy. And if you need more energy, you'll need more solar panels. Current mars printed mars habitat designs just use plastic mixed with rock...
as opposed to what melting metal and running an excavator?
>but is it really? So why not just take a tube and bury it?
yes. Also that limits you to the amount of tubes you can get there at a time, it also limits you on space and design.

[Anonymous No.11781140]

>>11781133
forgot pic

[Anonymous No.11781144]

Name a more iconic duo

[Anonymous No.11781150]

Will this 3d print faggot fuck off and go jerk off over his printed funkopop collection

[Anonymous No.11781164]

>>11781138
>>melting metal
need not take much energy if you aren't melting much of it
>>yes
prove it
>>that limits you to the amount of tubes you can get there at a time
You can't print everything which means you will still be limited by parts coming from earth. Airlocks, stuff for sealing your habitat, air handling equipment, lights, and basically everything that ain't dirt will need to come from earth for the forseeable future. You can get more tubes there at a time by making them on the spot through spiral welding of sheet metal.
>>11781133
excavators don't scale down well. Especially when the gravity's lower. One big excavator will be better than a bunch of small ones. This is because the amount of force an excavator can apply is limited by friction which is limited by weight. Excavators work better when they are heavier.

[Anonymous No.11781166]

>>11781150
show me your designs then faggot

[Anonymous No.11781167]

>>11781164
>You can't print everything
yes you can
>need not take much energy if you aren't melting much of it
how much metal are you using exactly?

[Anonymous No.11781170]

>>11781164
>excavators don't scale down well. Especially when the gravity's lower. One big excavator will be better than a bunch of small ones. This is because the amount of force an excavator can apply is limited by friction which is limited by weight. Excavators work better when they are heavier.
A big excavator like you are describing will have trouble with the opposing friction. The small digger you are talking about has been tested for low gravity...

[Anonymous No.11781176]

>>11780752
Fix your parachutes.

[Anonymous No.11781178]

Alright bros I think we can all agree on one thing. When the plans and concept art gets released for Artemis bases, NASA will give us some shitty 90s CGI concepts and SpaceX will give us some super futuristic domed city concept. I guess we will have to wait and see what actually happens

[Anonymous No.11781184]

>>11781167
>>yes you can
show me an airlock printed from dirt. There's a lot of things that can't be made from dirt.
>>how much metal
much less dirt than you're melting. And you aren't even melting all the metal, you're just welding the edges together
>>11781170
>>The small digger
and the entire design is based around making itself heavier as it digs so that it digs more efficiently.

[Anonymous No.11781192]

>>11781184
>much less dirt than you're melting. And you aren't even melting all the metal, you're just welding the edges together
give me a concept because I don't believe you.

[Anonymous No.11781193]

>>11781003
ESA should stop doing studies for shit they never intend to actually do.

[Anonymous No.11781196]

>>11781193
They might do it if they can buy the trip cheaply

[Anonymous No.11781197]

>>11781193
*All space agencies, desu. We should be living in the age of results. I’m all for trial and experimentation- but it seems like all these agencies dive headfirst into these studies knowing it will be a road that leads to nowhere

[Anonymous No.11781199]

>>11781178
>>base
nice meme. Current plans call for the astronauts to stay there a grand total of about 6 days. There isn't going to be much of a base.

[Anonymous No.11781204]

>>11781199
they're supposed to do a few missions before setting up gateway/the base

[Anonymous No.11781207]

>>11781192
spiral welded pipe. We also make wind turbine pylons in the field this way. Now show me an airlock made from dirt.

[Anonymous No.11781212]

>>11781204
Base or gateway will never happen
Even the SlS is one failure from cancellation

[Anonymous No.11781218]

>>11781204
for the most part, just a rover.

[Anonymous No.11781224]

>>11781207
>a windmill
wow you sure showed me

[Anonymous No.11781227]

>>11781207
>now show me an airlock made from dirt
did you forget the stale briny pisslock already, anon

[Anonymous No.11781228]

>>11781207
Implying you couldn't make an airlock out of basically anything

[Anonymous No.11781231]

>>11781212
Except for the part SLS is mandated by congress to fly certain payloads? It's literally impossible to be cancelled.

Also SpaceX will 100% leave a starship 'base' on the moon.

[Anonymous No.11781236]

>>11781231
Starships as a base are so boring, I hope NASA plans to build a real base.

[Anonymous No.11781240]

>>11781236
100% agree, a starship base is like me living out of my car and claiming it a house

I wanna see some KSP tier bases that serve actual purposes, and look cool.

[Anonymous No.11781246]

>>11781199
I know this but at the same time what the fuck is the point of Artemis them besides putting a fucking woman on the Moon? They’re selling it as “a stepping stone to permanent lunar living and future Mars missions”... how the fuck is it going to help us with a Mars mission if were only going to the Moon in increments of six days.
I hope the first Mars astronauts spend six months only to land on Mars for a week, because NASA / SpaceX won’t have any experience unless they get it right on the Moon first

[Anonymous No.11781255]

>>11781240
>>11781246
Its SJW bullshit and they are pushing for the United Nations base type shit. I have no faith in NASA. Our best hope is SpaceX

[Anonymous No.11781261]

>when you hate SLS on leddit so much you give it free advertising
thanks borgar

[Anonymous No.11781264]

What do you think about Elon saying “moon base alpha” on Twitter? Think it’ll translate to the first Martian city being Mars base alpha?

[Anonymous No.11781272]

>>11781246
>I hope the first Mars astronauts spend six months only to land on Mars for a week, because NASA / SpaceX won’t have any experience unless they get it right on the Moon first

Not possible because of how far apart transfer windows are. They’d spend months there

[Anonymous No.11781282]

>>11781264
MONB01
MRSB01

[Anonymous No.11781290]

>>11781144

[Anonymous No.11781312]

>>11781264
>What do you think about Elon saying “moon base alpha” on Twitter?
aeiou
>Think it’ll translate to the first Martian city being Mars base alpha?
No, that will be named Shelbyville just to rub it in.

[Anonymous No.11781320]

>>11781246
>>what the fuck is the point of Artemis them besides putting a fucking woman
The entire point is to return americans to the Moon because politics. All the justifications for doing so came after the sending americans back to the moon thing. And because the astronauts actually need to do something when they get there, they'll be exploring a permanently shadowed crater that could have mineable water ice. And maybe during later artemis missions they'll test ISRU. Both of those things are helpful for humanity's future in space. The other thing is that sending up people allow NASA to sell a bunch of other stuff. The average ape doesn't give a damn about determining the extants of lunar ice deposits, testing some funny looking box that makes oxygen from dirt, or figuring out how to make a landing pad and other things which are important to our future in space but don't necessarily require people to do. But so long as we tack on people we're able to do these things. The people will leave after 6 days but experiments and the autonomous rover will remain. Neither of those would have gotten funded at all if we didn't send people. Same with the deep space gateway

[Anonymous No.11781325]

>>11781290
Based oldspace btfo

[Anonymous No.11781326]

>>11781196
There‘s gonna be zero budget for this as Europe doesn‘t care about space.
Have fun in space, America.

[Anonymous No.11781332]

>>11780988
>muh concept art
lol

[Anonymous No.11781333]

>>11781199

what will the 6 day mission be doing on the moon?
is there an list made public?
what sort of experiments are they gonna do?

[Anonymous No.11781334]

>>11781320
Okay so it seems Artemis has larger goals than Apollo- mostly spurred by a growing number of possible technologies, but what’s stopping it from becoming Apollo 2.0 where NASA just sends people until it gets defunded? Like imagine if SpaceX didn’t exist... Artemis would suck major donkey dick

[Anonymous No.11781362]

>>11781333
explore a permanently shadowed crater and ideally sample water ice and other volatiles.
>>experiments
Besides sampling water ice, TBD. They'll probably figure out more after the VIPER mission.
>>what’s stopping it from becoming Apollo 2.0 where NASA just sends people until it gets defunded?
nothing at all.
>>Artemis would suck major donkey dick
it already does with the SLS requirement. The gateway's not that great and the CLPS missions are pretty underwhelming and are really just a government handout.

[Anonymous No.11781365]

>>11781332
>Can't even show a concept of his "superior" method
>wants us to take him seriously

[Anonymous No.11781384]

>>11781334
>but what’s stopping it from becoming Apollo 2.0 where NASA just sends people until it gets defunded?
Starship. If Starship is a lander then SpaceX will have full stack private moonbase capability. Space Force will be waving shipping containers of cash at Elon to be the first military presence on the moon.

[Anonymous No.11781391]

>>11781078
>Soil is organic matter
Literally wrong, you're talking about humus. Soil is defined as being mixed grains and particulates of rocky material. Technically, gravel is a type of soil, as is pure clay. Most soil on Earth is loam, a mixture of sand and clay particles, which plants have evolved to handle well (which is why loam makes good soil from plants). Mars has lots of sand and lots of clay, and plenty of areas of loamy soil too. It wouldn't matter if there wasn't though, because it's easy to approximate loamy soil texture by mixing sand with powdered sand. You can also artificially accelerate the breakdown of rocky minerals into clay particles if you want, and end up making true loam.

>it’s a thin layer of gravel and sand on top of rock
Just like on Earth? What's the issue. Also, again like Earth, there are many areas on Mars where loose soils extend dozens and perhaps even hundreds of meters down, such as along what were once huge landslides.

[Anonymous No.11781393]

>>11781384
I don’t think space force is going to the Moon anytime soon. Or space for that matter. Militarization of space just makes us look like assholes even Trump wouldn’t demand it

[Anonymous No.11781398]

>>11781393
Militarizing Space is badass. Fuck pacifists

[Anonymous No.11781407]

>>11781398
It is badass! What is less badass is unnecessarily escalating tensions with other nuclear powers in an area that we are otherwise able to cooperate or at least avoid conflict.

[Anonymous No.11781410]

>>11781384
This, but knowing NASA they will use a few lunar starships to put pic related on the moon

[Anonymous No.11781417]

>>11781407
Why? We can now raib death from a location they can't reach

[Anonymous No.11781420]

>>11781398
We could get away with it by establishing them as non-militaristic scientists with the ability to be militarized if need be. That’s what the NOAA corps is, and starfleet I guess if you’re a star trek fan. I love the idea of the NOAA corps, you become an officer with ranks so you can’t be executed if captured during wartime- but most of the time you’re just doing science. We need something similar in space, like a NASA corps.

[Anonymous No.11781423]

>>11780923
Wood is phenomenally versatile. Besides that imagine the symbolic value of having a mighty oak as the centrepiece of your Mars colony, its roots reaching down into Martian soil.

[Anonymous No.11781430]

>>11781410
What the hell are the little testicles for?

[Anonymous No.11781433]

>>11781393
the space force wont be on the moon because there's no reason for them to be there
if they find a reason, they're not gonna care about looking like assholes

[Anonymous No.11781436]

>>11781423
I also have dreamed of an oak in the center of a mars building but I think everyone here is forgetting one thing. You are on mars, you aren't going to see green, blue and white in nature like we do now. So brown is going to be a very unlikable color in a habitat.

[Anonymous No.11781441]

>>11781430
Fuel. Those are technically landers

[Anonymous No.11781446]

>>11781441
>>11781430
Either that or comms equipment

[Anonymous No.11781457]

>>11781436
I suppose the question is how much of our sense of aesthetics is based on our experience, and how much of it is an innate part of how our brains work.

[Anonymous No.11781473]

>>11781436
Depends on the species I suppose. But obviously there's loads of useful stuff to be had from trees e.g. turpentine. Thinking about this led me to think of a commercial opportunity - imagine the bragging rights and thus the price that could be charged for the option to have Martian oak veneer in your Bentley Bentayga. Veneer weighs next to nothing and you could charge a fortune for it. Obviously though it doesn't exactly grow quickly

[Anonymous No.11781512]

>>11781473
The wanky material market on earth is huge, just basic rock worked into tiles or pavers or whatever will fetch a fortune.

[Anonymous No.11781515]

>>11781512
Billionaires will be competing to be the first to have a Martian stone hearth in their getaway cabin on Earth.

[Anonymous No.11781543]

Trying to figure out how much a ticket would be on an E2E Starship... assuming they had been flying for a few years, and prices had stabilized to a reasonable amount, would it be as much as a plane? $2 million per launch (at best, it’ll probably be more) with 100 people... idk

[Anonymous No.11781548]

>>11780033
>Nope, Russian spaceflight innovation was wonderful back when it was happening, but it will never change the fact that communism is a cancerous disease on civilized humanity and will continue to impede progress in every field until it cease to exist.
You sound like a fucking idiot.

[Anonymous No.11781556]

>>11781548
Go away communist

[Anonymous No.11781558]

>>11781543
e2e can do 300-400 people with commercial airline volume per person, which is obviously not realistic, so lets say 200, which is plenty of margin for high g chairs and waste to circular floors, and we get 10,000 a ticket at 2 million.

[Anonymous No.11781562]

>>11781558
>ywn ride in a Starship across the world in under an hour
feelsfuckingbadman.jpg

[Anonymous No.11781572]

>>11781548
Ever actually visited a communist country? I visited a couple of Eastern bloc countries immediately prior to the end of communism. It was not pretty

[Anonymous No.11781578]

>>11781572
And it was even worst after capitalism was implemented. And now there is no great space program.

[Anonymous No.11781580]

>>11780842
The idea is to get the fucking game out of the development hell it was firmly lodged into. Is it a nice way of doing it? Hell no, but this is what they signed up for when they went for a major publisher.
They did this all to themselves. It's clear as day that the game was going nowhere beyond a pre-rendered trailer and some pottering around with the old engine with new fx.

[Anonymous No.11781583]

>>11781578
Take a look at eastern germany in the 1980s and in 2020, it sure has gotten a lot better.

[Anonymous No.11781585]

>>11781578
>I hate standing in breadlines but at least we wasted money launching a woman into space!
Name one fucking country that got worse after the abolishment of the USSR. Just one.
>>11781580
I mean it is what it is. I’m pretty sure everything KSP2 was going to do, you can just do on KSP with mods. It didn’t look like it was offering much besides a nice coat of paint and implementation of new pieces and space bases. Still makes me sad though

[Anonymous No.11781586]

>>11781583
Exactly. Poland was polluted and dismally shabby and poor compared to now. Don't even get me started on GDR. Literally Orwellian levels of misery

[Anonymous No.11781587]

>>11781585
Well, KSP with mods you still have to pretend you're actually doing anything with the shit you launch. "Today I'm going to send a mission to X to click a button and do... nothing".

[Anonymous No.11781588]

>>11781543
I love the idea for E2E, however I think the sonic boom deal is just going to be too much, that's part of what killed concorde and Starship is much, much worse at making big booms. Just look at this shit.

[Anonymous No.11781602]

>>11781585
>I mean it is what it is. I’m pretty sure everything KSP2 was going to do, you can just do on KSP with mods

In a very poorly optimized engine with a memory leak that has never been fixed and all of the ramshackle general junkiness that comes from a mod introducing a mechanic never actually intended for the game. On paper, KSP 2 is probably just KSP with mods, but it’d do anything mods would do at least twice as good.

[Anonymous No.11781610]

>>11781588
Hmmm I mean regardless it will probably be restricted to landing offshore like in the concept video. But yeah I was thinking of the Concorde problem. But as someone who lives in Houston I can tell you that low flying helicopters and airplanes are a fucking 5-minute occurrence so what difference would it make to hear a slight rumble as the thing lands in Galveston or Port of Houston or wherever.
Also our old lesbian mayor signed some thing to make a spaceport up near Johnson Space Center but I doubt it’ll ever be made for sound reasons. If I got to rule the world I would make a spaceport in Boca Chica, Houston, etc. and use the Boring Company to crate fast-as-fuck transportation between the two. That way we you can land and make it back to the inner city rapidly

[Anonymous No.11781619]

>>11781610
Its not simply offshore though. Looking at that picture they would want to be 250-300 MILES offshore. That's a long fucking way dude.

[Anonymous No.11781664]

>>11779928
Did they catch either fairing? I never saw an update on them

[Anonymous No.11781699]

>>11780953
>the material doesn't require the same thickness as concrete and the outer inner shell is effective.
not as a radiation shield
I'm on team space hobbit holes

[Anonymous No.11781720]

>>11780127
It mentioned le heil reich man.
It was too good of a get for this world.

[Anonymous No.11781807]

>>11780586
but anime is not real, unlike froge

[Anonymous No.11781842]

>>11781588
why the fuck is st. petersburg in florida?

[Anonymous No.11782039]

>>11780866
Heat pipes buried in the ground but not deep, expanding horizontally.
A bit like floor heating (the concept is actually the same, just for the opposite reasons).

[Anonymous No.11782043]

>>11781842
Same reason there's a Bergen in New Jersey. USA is a country full of people from all sorts of nations.

[Anonymous No.11782049]

>space is really cold
>overheating is a problem in space
well???

[Anonymous No.11782052]

>>11782049
Yes.

[Anonymous No.11782053]

>>11782049
Well what?

[Anonymous No.11782054]

>>11782049
Space isn't really cold.

[Anonymous No.11782065]

>>11782049
>space is really cold
Depends where you are
>overheating is a problem in space
It's a better insulator than anything on earth

[Anonymous No.11782073]

>>11782049
Is this bait?

[Anonymous No.11782079]

>>11781436
>So brown is going to be a very unlikable color in a habitat.
why

[Anonymous No.11782085]

>>11782069
>"space Kalashnikov rifle."
More like a fucking Space Lada.

[Anonymous No.11782086]

>>11782073
TBF it is a common misconception of space, and we have been getting newcomers here.

[Anonymous No.11782096]

>>11782069
Imagine how salty they're going to be about Starship

[Anonymous No.11782107]

>>11782096
Take as much butthurt as they actually feel and add 10x to that out of desperation for Putin-senpai to listen. Rogo is gonna be so shrill his tweets break glass

[Anonymous No.11782109]

>>11782096
who’s being salty

[Anonymous No.11782131]

>>11782109
Rogozin.

[Anonymous No.11782177]

>>11782049
>space is really cold

False premise. It’s very warm in direct sunlight at 1 AU and can reach into the 70’s Fahrenheit at Mars and higher

[Anonymous No.11782244]

New bread needed

[Anonymous No.11782249]

>>11782244
Ask and thou shall receive.

>>11782245
>>11782245
>>11782245
>>11782245

[Anonymous No.11782271]

>>11781365
I'll do you better.

[Anonymous No.11782282]

>>11782049
The concept of temperature is pretty flawed in a vacuum.

[Anonymous No.11782285]

>>11782282
The concept of convection is pretty flawed in a vacuum. Temperature isn't.
But space isn't the dead space people seem to imagine.

[Anonymous No.11782304]

>>11782282
t. Thermodynamicslet

[Anonymous No.11782308]

>>11782285
Try to measure the temperature of essentialy nothing.

[Anonymous No.11782317]

>>11782308
>essentialy nothing
But space isn't "essentially nothing" unless you're talking about deep space far, far, far between the stars where there's barely an atom hitting another atom.

[Anonymous No.11782320]

>>11782317
Good luck measuring stray atoms velocities...

[Anonymous No.11782365]

>>11780704
>the mods who post "muh rockets don't work in space" copypastas to increase activity.
this has to be the most retarded meme you people keep pushing

[Anonymous No.11782428]

>>11782365
But do they actualy work in space?
I mean, they can't push against the ambient air there after all...