>California, the state that produces the most food, will continue to experience more and more intense wildfires thanks to climate change lol what's the worst that can happen?

File: 207 KB, 1500x926, DrmcvlzVYAAeC3-.jpg large.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Fri Nov 9 20:46:48 2018 No.10129885 [Reply] [Original]

>California, the state that produces the most food, will continue to experience more and more intense wildfires thanks to climate change

lol what's the worst that can happen?

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 9 20:53:43 2018 No.10129905 >>10129885 I read that the reason they have so much wildfires was because they mass planted a cheap tree that basically has gasoline in it's bark 100 or so years ago

Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:00:11 2018 No.10129927

>>10129905
/out/ here

The reason why we have so many fires is because Timber sale admins from the FS in the 40s planted a shit ton timber (ponderosa pine mostly) because clear cutting was the way to go back then

Then clear cutting was stopped, regulations and NEPA bullshit put in place, and now the FS timber dept have to jump through hoops to put a plot for auction (3rd party logging companies bid on plots with x amount of board-feet (timber unit), tree species etc).

Meanwhile, all the overgrown plots accumulate fuel and all it takes is I a rogue lighting bolt to light up the entire plot and burn down potential sale

There needs to be more logging. Logging has a negative connotation, but it does a net good to do the land and government

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:08:54 2018 No.10129942 >>10129885 what is it, like 4 years in a row now? >lolnope I was wrong https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wildfires_in_California_by_year https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:California_wildfires_by_size

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:09:46 2018 No.10129943 >>10129927 i bet you think we oughta stop letting all those rivers go to waste by running off into the ocean as well.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:11:10 2018 No.10129949 >>10129885 i dont think forest fires are a threat to farmers fields.

Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:13:22 2018 No.10129958

>>10129927
>timber company plants a metric fuck ton of trees
>industry gets regulated because they were cutting corners for profit, so when they regulated corner cutting everyone got butthurt and quit
>left all of the transplanted trees they put in because nobody paid them not to
>lmao c'mon logging is a net good it's not like it's their fault
huh, interesting point anon

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:15:43 2018 No.10129967 >>10129949 even if they're clear of the fire, if they're in close proximity to any of the areas there's still potential for it to cause issues for them for example http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/crops/facts/01-015.htm

Anonymous Fri Nov 9 21:16:09 2018 No.10129971
File: 52 KB, 960x680, CC_hadleyCell.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>10129885
It's a worldwide thing, one cause is that in a warmer atmosphere the Hadley cells expand so the desert zones expand with them. Besides CA its happening in south Europe, north Pakistan&India, Australia etc.

Food security gets hit
https://youtu.be/Mc_4Z1oiXhY?t=23m10s

Anonymous Fri Nov 9 22:31:22 2018 No.10130155

>>10129943
Not sure what your criticism is, of if you even said anything. Timber land needs to be managed properly. I'm not saying we need to clear cut again, but we definitely need to thin more plots of timber. Lots of excess growth, lots of competition for nutrients, lots of opportunity to fungal and insect attack, lots of disease spreading, lots of fire danger from ladder fires. I'm not against regulation, but at least in the FS, the NEPA really prevents proper timber management by excessive regulation

Ex) someone from wildlife hooted an owl 1 ft inside your proposed and ALREADY scouted timber sale unit, therefore the entire unit is out of commission because it's deemed protected area for wildlife. Meanwhile, all the red fir are have root rot and are dying left and right causing perfect fuel pile ups

Anonymous Fri Nov 9 22:41:52 2018 No.10130172

>>10129958
Again, I don't understand your criticism.

Privately owned timber land is another story. They are generally more efficient at harvesting and replanting than the FS. And they follow the law, otherwise they wouldn't be in business.

The FS and BLM have more hoops to go through because we are government entity and subject to public scrutiny. During our "public comment" time periods before we begin the process of setting up a sale, some dude can stagnate the entire operation because of his personal attachment to some sugar pine in which his mother's name was carved during the 60s. That same sugar pine however is covered in blister rust, has a dead top, and it's in the perfect spot to cause a massive fire or Forest road blockage. Fire comes and an the entire plot of timber is decimated and erosion becomes a thing. All of the could have been prevented by just going in quickly, doing a survey, marking harvest and dead trees for removal, and putting up a quick sale.

There needs to be a fix to the mechanism which allows for proper land management.

I have a degree in forestry and work as a forester in the region. Would love to answer more questions and educate anyone interested in the agency NEEDS that would prevent a lot of fires and general timber land management

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 08:04:24 2018 No.10130849 Probably intentionally started forest fires either to clear land or lumber or something similar. My country has them all the time because cutting healthy trees is legally difficult, but damaged ones is not.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 08:07:57 2018 No.10130853 File: 27 KB, 403x252, lots_wife.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10129885 >thanks to climate change Clearly, it's God smiting the degenerates.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 08:10:05 2018 No.10130854 >>10129885 Third worlder here. This is good because it will raise american demand for our food production. California, please burn more.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 08:11:55 2018 No.10130856 >>10129885 >hurr durr we must autarchy you can always import food from abroad retard

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 09:31:24 2018 No.10130944 >>10130172 >>10130155 >>10129927 Comfy /out/ poster.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 09:44:58 2018 No.10130962 >>10130856 sure bub >>10129971

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 15:13:55 2018 No.10131573 The program of controlled forest fires was dismissed 40 years ago......dumb fucks deserve this.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 16:26:13 2018 No.10131765 >>10131573 fuck off back to >>>/pol/

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:01:45 2018 No.10131959 >>10131573 this and /thread

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:17:16 2018 No.10131996 California with all the wacked out liberal cucked parasites got exactly what happens when you let people move into areas and then neglect to trim the fuel. Burn baby burn.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:19:29 2018 No.10132001 >>10129927 >There needs to be more logging. Ya for sure. Removing all remaining carbon and nutrients from the land will definitely stop it from burning. Fucking genius.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:22:27 2018 No.10132008 Grass is incredibly green after a fire.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:22:27 2018 No.10132009 >>10131996 >trim the fuel >profit pick one

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:24:12 2018 No.10132011 Liberal blood is the secret fertilizer. It's full of shit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:24:37 2018 No.10132012 >>10129885 Fuckin yanks make desolate wastelands everywhere they go, so they must feel right at home in desolate wastelands. They should be happy about this.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 18:25:35 2018 No.10132017 Picture is about 10 years old btw.

Anonymous Sat Nov 10 19:34:12 2018 No.10132196

>>10129885
Massive forest fires are the result of the accumulation of chaparral.
Controlled burns are the way to prevent this, but California libtards are too concerned with muh endangered species to take any action, so instead they let uncontrolled conflagrations happen every few years.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 20:05:43 2018 No.10132262 >>10129885 >thanks to climate change that's a lie

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 20:06:07 2018 No.10132266 >>10131996 >conservative, Trump-voting places like Paradise and Redding get ravaged by wildfires >LOL GOOD RIDDANCE, FUCKN LIBTARD COMMIES XDD every time

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 20:16:06 2018 No.10132288 >>10129927 >one rogue lightning bolt Disregard the fact that all the major wild fires in recent years have been started by people, on purpose.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 20:17:17 2018 No.10132291 >>10130856 Most of the world's food in grown in 3 countries, fuck-nugget.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 20:19:39 2018 No.10132297 >global warming this is just an excuse for liberals to escape blame for their shitty policy. ok so say it is global warming, what can we actually do about it in the mean time? >>10132266 >Redding degenerate meth head town

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 20:21:42 2018 No.10132304 >>10132288 In California? Few of the largest wildfires have been human caused, and the ones that were human caused were accidental

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 21:45:02 2018 No.10132449 File: 12 KB, 288x320, tex ball.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >catching on fire during winter Im literally lmaoing @ your life commiefornia, thats wha you get for being liberal faggots, regards texas

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 21:48:25 2018 No.10132453 File: 58 KB, 960x666, DrpydmjVsAUg_cT.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10132449 >texas the liberal disease is coming for you next!

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 21:51:58 2018 No.10132457 >>10132453 we quarantine your kind in austin

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 21:54:09 2018 No.10132461 >>10129885 >climate change and of course it has nothing to do with them draining all the water out of the ecosystem and turning everything into a fucking desert.

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 21:57:46 2018 No.10132466 >>10132449 >faggots Why the homophobia?

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 21:58:26 2018 No.10132468 >>10132457 >your kind I'm warning you. there done with us,we're forever fucked past the point of no return, but they're moving on to you now, what did you think the whole massive beta campaign was?

>>	Anonymous Sat Nov 10 22:16:44 2018 No.10132489 >>10132291 thats a lie

Anonymous Sat Nov 10 23:19:29 2018 No.10132552

>>10132297
>this is just an excuse for liberals to escape blame for their shitty policy.

Wait let me check something real quick:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_power_in_the_United_States_over_time
Just like I thought, we arent living in an alternate timeline where the democrats have held power for 100 years continuously.

Presumably you had to pass a basic literacy and critical thinking test to graduate high school. How did you do it?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:07:51 2018 No.10132608 >>10132552 >united states >past 100 years we're talking about california, sweaty, try and keep up. and don't be so hard on yourself, you lot need way less than 100 years to fuck shit up.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:09:58 2018 No.10132611 >>10132466 >homophobia Why the Islamophobia?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:21:45 2018 No.10132629 >>10132608 You know Ronald Reagan was the governor of California, right?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:41:22 2018 No.10132651 >>10132611 >Islamaphobia Why the xenophobia?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:42:36 2018 No.10132652 >>10129971 CA isn't alone with drought, that whole latitude is experiencing the same https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBoO1wto4w0

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:46:57 2018 No.10132668 >>10132629 yeah like 30 years ago and he ruined it, but that's neither here nor there. what on earth is your point?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:48:49 2018 No.10132673 >>10132651 Wut?

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:55:02 2018 No.10132675

>>10129885
>thanks to climate change

False. It's thanks to poor land management. Fires get put out too often, which leads to overgrowth and eventual super fires.

Also, denuding the land of trees near the coast has made it difficult for moisture from the ocean air to make it inland before it gets burnt up under the sun.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 00:59:44 2018 No.10132678 >>10130155 This is a progressive marxist board. Don't expect them to listen to your facts.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 01:12:48 2018 No.10132686 >>10129905 its not, that’s what the conservatard shills are saying; its because they’re experiencing a drought and heightened temperatures. >>10129927 Please kill yourself

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 01:15:19 2018 No.10132689 >>10132461 there has been a massive drought the last few summers in california. the drainage of water is in the southwestern US not in NorCal which gets plenty of rain and has river systems and lakes

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 01:36:06 2018 No.10132705 >>10129885 >communist government policies is climate change now Imagine being this much of a willfully ignorant brainlet

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 01:37:11 2018 No.10132707 >>10132686 Embarrassing

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 02:08:44 2018 No.10132749 >>10129958 Dumb lefty more concerned about casting blame than solving the problem. Typical.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 02:11:47 2018 No.10132752 >>10132749 can't solve what you don't even admit is a problem analogy: alcoholism

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 02:39:24 2018 No.10132784 >>10132752 >the problem is loggers were greedy 50 years ago The problem is we have a bunch of trees too densely packed, retard. There aren't even any loggers left ffs.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 02:40:02 2018 No.10132786 how saturated is cali in cell towers? they fry things up real good.

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 03:33:31 2018 No.10132850

>come to science board to discuss and learn about obscure topics in mathematics/science
>1/5 threads are about global warming.
Who cares about it. You won't convince anyone on either side and you do nothing but fill this board with the same tiresome politics related science. Its just as tiresome as iq or raceposting. People know and people don't care.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 03:47:35 2018 No.10132869 they are a plague, a social media plague plugged in to their apps and groups, droids without a single original thought. I hope they burn to death in these fires.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 03:56:18 2018 No.10132880 Cutting trees is murder.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 04:31:46 2018 No.10132916 >>10132850 because 1/5 posters here are I FUCKING LOVE SCIENCE STARS AND STUFF™

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 04:36:00 2018 No.10132924 >>10132707 keep being a shillfaggot >>10132850 >who cares about the 6th major extinction event and western north america becoming a cloud of ash 6 months a year every year from now on until we all die off

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 04:41:46 2018 No.10132935 >>10132924 ever heard of the dustbowl? the climate has always changed kys retard

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 04:43:06 2018 No.10132937 >>10132935 >ever heard of the prelude to what GHG’s are going to do to every single bread basket on Earth >da cwimate aways change lol you guys all deserve to be gassed man

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 04:46:29 2018 No.10132944 How many years does it take till wildlife population and plants recover?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:00:21 2018 No.10132958 >>10132937 >agricultural production the highest it's ever been and growing >IT'S A WORLDWIDE DUSTBOWL WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE BE SCARED you should be publicly hanged

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:03:36 2018 No.10132963

>>10132958
>misconstrues what i said clearly so everyone knows he is dishonest, a venal ophidic nigger and also witless
>durr hurr more people and more technology so more land converted to crops that must mean no dustbowls
you should know that your race is going to be literally food for hordes of niggers because of what people like you enable

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:05:35 2018 No.10132967 >>10132963 >angry negroid detected your children and grandchildren will starve to death. that's the natural order of things, get over it

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:05:41 2018 No.10132969 >>10132608 > you lot need way less than 100 years to fuck shit up With respect to global warming, demonstrably no. With respect to global warming more than just california matters. Again I question how you managed to graduate high school.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:06:54 2018 No.10132972 >>10132784 >bunch of trees too densely packed [citation needed] All the news I've seen show just grass areas burning, not massive forests. This is all about the drought

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:10:20 2018 No.10132976

>>10132967
brainlet lol

every single piece of arable land in the most inhabited lattitudes is going to become unviable for crop production and the northern lattitudes will succumb to overuse and rising sea levels all the same while summers last longer and freak weather devastates harvests with random cold snaps and hurricanes. Enjoy hell

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:20:19 2018 No.10132990 >>10132976 you dont know what you are talking about, climate change is many things but is not a threat to arable land, food production will actually somewhat increase in northern lattitudes, only southern lattitudes will be devastated

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:21:05 2018 No.10132991 File: 236 KB, 466x469, 1520690744890.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10129885 >retarded commies abandon brush control policies because muh enviromeme >entire state now catches fire daily >how could climate change have done this.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:21:21 2018 No.10132992 >>10129927 >>10130172 >>10130155 this guy seems to know what he is talking about

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:24:20 2018 No.10132995 >>10129885 California still gets most of its electricity from fossil fuels, despite nuclear being available for decades. You reap what you sow.

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:25:49 2018 No.10132997

>>10132990
>you don’t know nuffin
Climate change is expected to cause desertification all across the planet, extreme droughts and destruction of soil systems along with the already outrageous topsoil depletion that mechanized farming and population growth is perpetuating
>da norf gon be safe from tithonic aids
not for long when everyone migrates, when the land is overtaxed by gmo monocultures, when sea level rise begins swallowing the northern countries and the new extended summer bakes the life giving soil into dust

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 05:37:19 2018 No.10133010

>>10132995
I don't really understand the mentality that the governments of a place are necessarily equivalent to the moral worth of the people who live in that place. Most people don't know, care about, or even have the time to actually be educated about what the proper energy sources to support are, and it seems like a fruitless effort to think people are morally bad for something they don't have a choice in.

It's as that cunt, kant said. "Ought implies can", if a person ought to do something, then it should be that they had the option in the first place. And a person born in poverty who has been taught in certain ways, or funneled through a certain system, without the actual option to do anything else (regardless of the deterministic truth behind things anyway) certainly can't be held morally responsible and definitely doesn't deserve to die.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 06:12:52 2018 No.10133029 >>10132997 >when the land is overtaxed by gmo monocultures GMO fearmongering only further confirms that you are a certified pseud

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 09:21:46 2018 No.10133222 >>10133010 >Most people don't know, care about, done. they deserve to pay for their stupidity

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 09:25:47 2018 No.10133227 >>10132976 >freak weather devastates harvests with random cold snaps and hurricanes. that's called weather you mongoloid lmao

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 10:09:34 2018 No.10133281 >>10132608 Oh, seems like everyone forgot that climate change is a phenomenon which was caused only by california, and which's effects are limited to california as well! Thanks for reminding us that that is the case

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 10:25:40 2018 No.10133301 >>10133281 >climate change

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 10:54:58 2018 No.10133341 >>10132686 >mad underweight kid is triggered to the point he can't even pull some bullshit argument out of his ass, and instead writes ad hominems and "kys"

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 11:01:51 2018 No.10133356

>>10129927
It's a net good for humanity not a net good for the Earth, you dope. That's the problem. Humans are fuck heads. I know you're all a bunch of anti-social shit heads. But we need to stop spreading out in suburbs. It's literally encroaching on nature. It's killing the planet shit heads. Not logging specifically, nor suburbs specifically. But the selfish need to have all of it. The Earth was not meant for this many people. Quit fucking arguing left/right bullshit so we can get off this fucking rock.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 11:37:22 2018 No.10133442 File: 140 KB, 900x900, serveimage.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10129927 >>10130155 >>10130172 >only guy who knows what hes talking about >ignore him and /pol/&/leftypol/ wank I fucking love science

Anonymous Sun Nov 11 13:52:59 2018 No.10133705

>>10133281
what is it with you people and your lack of comprehension skills?I was talking about policy. i was not talking about climate change,which is such a convenient problem, by the way, isn’t it?I find it amusing that question was never addressed: if it was simply a consequence climate change, what do you propose we do about it?

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 17:37:07 2018 No.10134154 >>10132935 >the climate has always changed bullshit pseudoscience. moron of the month award.

>>	Anonymous Sun Nov 11 17:41:13 2018 No.10134161 >>10133029 >Lets ring every last microjoule of energy from the system for human population growth and then blame liberals and niggers when natural fluctuations lead to hardship >for muh ecomomy >for muh grof muh jerbs you people are literally cancer

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 01:04:11 2018 No.10134958 >>10133010 >>10133010 of a place lol fuck

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 01:08:01 2018 No.10134962 >>10129885 >climate change Is that the new Californian word for batshit insane arsonist?

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 03:07:35 2018 No.10135115 >>10134962 People have blamed terrorism on climate change, so probably.

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 03:14:42 2018 No.10135130 >>10132675 I mean, broadly speaking those could be considered "climate change."

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 03:17:02 2018 No.10135135 >>10132001 >people like this actually browse here

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 03:17:34 2018 No.10135138 >>10133029 >>10133227 >>10133341 brainlet shill

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 03:25:58 2018 No.10135149 >>10129885 Okay PG&E , yeah it’s JUST climate change

Anonymous Mon Nov 12 03:26:15 2018 No.10135150
File: 78 KB, 1024x1001, urn-newsml-dpa-com-20090101-140804-99-06826-large-4-3-jpg.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>10129885
California is just the literal tip of the iceberg. This summer we had forest fires in Scandinavia. If it happens here it can happen everywhere. If you live near a forest prepare for wildfires.

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 10:29:30 2018 No.10135518 >>10132552 >Presumably you had to pass a basic literacy and critical thinking test to graduate high school. How did you do it? literally no such thing

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 10:48:00 2018 No.10135547 File: 33 KB, 702x395, Roll Safe.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10129927 >You can't have forest fires if you cut down all the trees

Anonymous Mon Nov 12 10:59:19 2018 No.10135566
File: 57 KB, 612x395, Rise of the Ridiculously Resilient Ridge.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>10133442
It's a nice theory, but it's wrong. It's promulgated by conservatives that want to evade the fact that the American South West is simply drying out.

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 11:22:34 2018 No.10135606 >>10132924 >Seasons are climate change now Is this the power of communist intellectualism?

Anonymous Mon Nov 12 11:32:27 2018 No.10135621

>>10135566
>be commie posted faggot governor Jerry Brown
>create laws banning prescribed burning
>tell populace that green lawns are racist
>create an artificial scarcity of water
>force water treatment companies to waste thousands of gallons of water each month because of commie antiwatering laws
>act surprised when lightning ignites overgrown vegetation and consumes entire towns in flames
>blame (((climate change))) white people and conservatism
>repeat until commiefornia becomes a third world hellscape with nothing but Shitskin inhabitants

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 11:51:29 2018 No.10135670 >>10135566 they would not understand even if their own house burns down

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 12:02:08 2018 No.10135695 >>10135150 >wood can burn Holy shit my almonds.

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 12:17:25 2018 No.10135736 >>10135695 dry vs wet >mind blown

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 13:25:01 2018 No.10135869 >>10135518 I had to take an exit exam to graduate high school. You didn't?

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 21:28:54 2018 No.10136713 >>10129885 >california produces the most food The midwest literally produces nothing but starches and fats, I'm calling bullshit.

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 21:29:56 2018 No.10136718 >>10129927 Or maybe we should stop planting an excessive amount of trees?

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 21:31:27 2018 No.10136720 >>10129927 >implying firefighters are stupid they do controlled burns to prevent this exact thing

>>	Anonymous Mon Nov 12 22:27:51 2018 No.10136801 >>10132608 >sweaty You get done perspirating?

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 01:15:50 2018 No.10137076 >>10129971 based youtube link. that guy knows his stuff. i've read his book and i'm scared af.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:04:30 2018 No.10137140 >>10129885 >California, the state that has a bunch of rich as fuck celebrities >None of them think to put a fire retarding tent around their homes.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:18:08 2018 No.10137162 >>10137140 they're not retarded like the inflammable you

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:20:51 2018 No.10137166 >>10129885 I dunno but hopefully all the cuckfornians die.

Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:25:38 2018 No.10137174

/out/ poster here again. Let me tell you how the FS puts up a sale.

1. An area is scouted, usually using aerial maps on GIS. A good place to start is by looking at the plantations from 30 yrs ago and areas with excessive biodensity. Plantations are plots of land that were previously logged, and replanted.

2. A proposed map is drawn, and submitted for approval to Wildlife, Archeology, Hydrology, and Silviculture departments (although Silviculture dudes are usually in the same office) as well as Forest Chief and District Ranger

3. The individual departments make adjustments to proposed maps, if for example, areas needing management are within protected wildlife or archeological areas. Logging near creeks and streams can be accomplished as long as buffer zones are established to prevent excessive dust and soil from operations to enter watershed (this darkens water, increases light absorption and raises temperature messing with fish and other life). Skyline/cable logging are feasible alternatives, IF the end bidder has these capabilities (i.e the equipment).

Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:29:40 2018 No.10137183

>>10135695
It happened in British Columbia and Washington and parts of Brazil as well, its happening more intensely than at any point in the last 100 years and is directly correlated with record temperatures and record low rainfall. You're completely fucking insane if you think that this is just a coincidence.
>>10136713
California is on the West coast and they produce more food than any other states besides the Plains states. All of the Western US and North America is expected to see increased droughts and wildfires this century. I just lived through almost two months of the worst wildfires in recent memory, its not just in California.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:31:12 2018 No.10137186 >>10135869 those boys were tricking you into doing that and now your "exam" is on youtube

Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:38:01 2018 No.10137192

>>10137174
4. Based in the new map (usually lose some area) a crew is sent out to survey the plots of land. This requires the crew to walk the entire unit and note: dominant and co dominant tree species, creeks, changes in slope, whether existing roads are still present from past logging, a place to potentially set up a landing for machinery, whether sources of water not visible through aerial (springs, water holes, bogs) are present, lack of trees, disease, excess vegetation growth

5. Plots are either dropped or adjusted based on initial scouting. Proposed total area shrinks usually. Map is adjusted. Crews go out to to "quick plots" which are estimates of total potential merchantable timber ( usually only trees between 13-26" DBH (diameter breast at height) are harvested, or as per prescribed by the silviculturist).

6. A large marking crew is sent out to mark all merchantable trees within stipulations. Legacy trees are kept, wildlife habitat trees are kept, usually within a cluster, the healthiest dominant tree is kept. Disease trees are culled. Snags are kept, unless near a road or trail, otherwise it's marked for removal

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:46:51 2018 No.10137206 >>10135621 >repeat until commiefornia becomes a third world hellscape with nothing but Shitskin inhabitants and it’s beautiful

Anonymous Tue Nov 13 02:58:06 2018 No.10137219

>>10137192
7. Based on tally of marked tree species and diameters, an estimate in board feet (unit for /loggingtimber) is put together by sale admin. Final proposal is once again sent to departments, district ranger, and Forest Chief. They can make adjustments if need be. Public comment period opens for public. NEPA specialist reviews proposal to make sure everything is within code and no regulations are being stepped on. If approved, timber plots are put up for auction in which a a 3rd party logging company bids for the right to log everything that was marked for harvest. Bidder is subject to following all regulations established in contract. A breach of contract results in termination of contractor. A bidder bids based on how much board feet are present, tree species, their own capabilities (equipment).

Steps 1-7, on average, take a total of 5 years. Could this be expedited? Certainly. How? Several ways

No one I'm the FS is there because they want to curtail regulation and just cut everything down. People in the agency love their job and love the outdoors. Same for loggers. These guys have usually been doing this kind of work for generations, most companies are family owned and they're not evil boogymen that want to cut down everything for a profit. It's in fact, not incredibly profitable.

Proper land management prevents forest fires

Anonymous Tue Nov 13 03:09:19 2018 No.10137237

>>10136720
Prescribed burns are handled by the Fuels department. Firefighters are just used a muscle to go out and do the actual burning when the Fuels guys are stretched thin, because firefightera are usually, you know, out fighting fires.

Fuels is another story. If you think I'm complaining about my work in the timber dept, the Fuels guys have it worse. Lack of funds, lack of manpower, stifling regulations.

>>10136718
You need to replant what you harvest. Overplanting is not the cause of overgrowth. Overgrowth is caused by fire suppression and neglect in land management.

I'll be here to answer any questions. Keep politics out and let's focus on the science. Particularly since the anonymity of this website lends itself to a perpetual shit-slinging fest that none of you would engage in a real life discussion.

It really takes a damaged individual to wish harm to the land and people, regardless of their race or political orientation, as seen by
>>10137166
>>10135621
>>10137206
Regardless of what your individual backstories are, I hope for you the best and that one day you will be able to leave this website. Places like this make people grow unnecessarily angry and delusional.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 03:21:14 2018 No.10137250 >>10137162 https://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2009-06/fireproof-house

Anonymous Tue Nov 13 03:23:36 2018 No.10137253

>>10136713
Look up any USDA publication regarding food production. I was surprised to learn CA is #1 dairy producer in the US. I thought it was Wisconsin (#2)

Iowa is #1 in pork, onions, corn and eggs.

>>10133356
No, it's a net good for the land. Never going to improve on nature, but we certainly can do our part. We are also never going to stop being greedy. Land management is more feasible than asking people to stop being greedy.

>>10132991
It's not unique to CA. OR, MT, ID have seen devastating fires recently for the same reasons I've outlined. Have a number of colleagues in MT and they timber operations there are less stifled

>>10132972
Good eye

>>10132944
Depends on how hot the fire burned, the species endemic to the area and how much erosion becomes a problem. Lodgepole pine for example, thrives after fires pass through, and usually vastly outcompetes all other species. If you have a forest full of lodgepole, all it takes is disease or insect pesta to create massive problems, etc

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 03:24:31 2018 No.10137256 File: 303 KB, 1040x1024, 1040px-Central_Valley_STS040-609-38.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10136713 Central Valley is ridiculously productive. Would be interesting know how they're quantifying the amount of food though.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 03:41:06 2018 No.10137273 >>10129885 >makes the most food And that is a bad thing for variety of reasons with massive negative effects on Nature. Any reduction to industrial agriculture is welcome.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 12:55:41 2018 No.10137905 >>10129885 California flora is based on a firery ecosystem, has nothing to do with global warming. Read up on the formation of redwood trees.

>>	Anonymous Tue Nov 13 13:18:24 2018 No.10137947 Jack pines require forest fires to regenerate. Forest fires are 100% natural. You are trying to butt fuck mother nature. And mom is pissed.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 14 02:46:19 2018 No.10139603 >>10129885 >what's the worst that can happen? with more then 50 people dead it's the worst fire in many decades

Anonymous Wed Nov 14 11:31:15 2018 No.10140172

What's all this hate on California when it's the state that's literally carrying America on its back?
All the rednecks do nothing for America but consume subsidiaries. California even grows the most food. Rednecks can't even do farming right even though they're rural hicks.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 14 11:35:54 2018 No.10140180 >>10139603 The Camp Fire has only 48 confirmed dead but I agree in reality it is probably more than that. It's the most destructive in terms of structures lost and the deadliest wildfire in California history.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 14 14:33:07 2018 No.10140574 Only rural and suburban retards voted for Trump. City people all voted for Hillary

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 15 02:38:46 2018 No.10142098 climate change means all of rural America may become as dry as California and could burn down https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJCRuRhL0Ng

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 12:20:34 2018 No.10142834

>>10140172
They're arrogant gits who despite all evidence to the contrary, delude themselves into thinking that its the poor rural areas holding up the country and have their wealth sucked out by cities. The rural population is the worst case of an ungrateful bastard in existence, their lives are subsidized by the cities they hate, they enjoy disproportionate voting representation and then claim unfairness benefits the victims of it rather than the benfactors.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 14:42:18 2018 No.10143111

>>10142834
But those who produce the food and livestock in California are rural themselves. And nearly half of the state is rural. Unless you meant specifically poor rural areas, but then you could argue they are less wealthy than metropolitan areas in the same state. I don't think anyone hates California's rural communities, what they really mean is that they hate those living in the cities. Regarding voting, why is mitigating total mob rule a bad thing?

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 15:01:18 2018 No.10143173

>>10130172
I'm a native California living in the Sierras. There is some logging going on, but it's all beetle kill pine. On my drives I see on average one or two log trucks going down the hill back into the Fresno area. But then I look at the forest and I still see a fuck ton of beetle kill pine standing. From what I understand it's a bitch and a half to get that timber cut that and PG&Es fuckery in the area as well.

We've gotten really lucky with the fire we had this year. Thankfully CalFire was able to get a handle on it and it burned mostly rugged inaccessible terrain. Save for the two firefighters that died, the fire was by and large good for our area. (closing Yosemite notwithstanding.) It ended up clearing a lot of dead vegetation and old growth as well as beetle kill pine. Which, in my opinion, is a good thing.

What people don't understand is that it takes a balance between fighting fire and letting it burn. The forest needs fire to regulate it's self. Fire removes the dead brush, the dead trees, and the old growth that otherwise would continue building. All while providing an opportunity for the local bull pine and Sequoias to drop their seeds and reproduce. But we can't let it go out of control.

In decades past a fire would burn through an area every decade or so. The pine would largely be left unscathed, but the volatile fuel brush would be removed. The ground would be fertilized by the ash, and new life would spring up. California's stupid decision to limit our abilities to manage our forest coupled with the practices of fire fighting of a hundred years ago has really caused a major fuels issue in our forest that we can't remove because of California policy. Then in the case of the Ferguson fire, we have a catalytic converter set grass on fire and bam, major wild fire starts. Then there's PG&Es shitty infrastructure causing fires too.

Something really needs to be done.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 15:08:33 2018 No.10143189

>>10137256
Central California resident here. Sure, there's a lot of corn, but there's also a FUCK TON of almonds, pistachios, grapes, rice, etc... We actually produce more peaches than Georgia.

I respect our Ag a great deal, but the crops we grow here don't exactly help our water problems. It takes a lot of water to grow a peach, plum, pound of rice, or an avocado.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 16:04:37 2018 No.10143338

>>10143111
>But those who produce the food and livestock in California are rural themselves.
Who are guaranteed a market by subsidies paid for by the cities, use tools made in the cities and grow their food from genetically modified seeds made from the cities and then hate the cities.
>And nearly half of the state is rural.
Incorrect, 95% of the state is urban population. (https://www.icip.iastate.edu/tables/population/urban-pct-states))
>I don't think anyone hates California's rural communities, what they really mean is that they hate those living in the cities.
The cities are the economic heart of every country and generate 85% of US GDP. (https://www.mckinsey.com/~/media/McKinsey/Featured%20Insights/Urbanization/US%20cities%20in%20the%20global%20economy/MGI_Urban_America_Full_Report.ashx)) The Right claims to respect success but if someone they don't like enjoys success such as Jews or urbanites, they accuse them of cheating.
>Regarding voting, why is mitigating total mob rule a bad thing?
The principle of democracy is one person, one vote, not one acre, one vote. The rural population hates cities because they think cities run politics while enjoying the fact that their votes are worth more than someone living in the city. You only think it's "fair" because you're the one whose vote is worth more.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 15 16:08:15 2018 No.10143354 >>10129885 I bet Morocco once had lush forests filled with huge trees at one point too. It's natural. Humans "manage" the shit out of everything.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 18:24:07 2018 No.10143637

>>10143338
Fair points regarding GDP, the figure I was using probably referred to geographical distribution and not population. Though I understand why you'd assume so, I don't live in a rural area nor has my family for several generations. From the context I wrongly assumed you were implying that the food production of California was urban and that rural areas wrongly believe they produce all the food. Now re reading your post I realize you were specifically referring to wealth (GDP). For voting, do you mean to say that you prefer Athenian democracy to representative democracy, or that they should be combined? Should states with smaller populations necessarily be beholden to those with larger? I'm not being rhetorical, I'm genuinely asking for clarification.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 19:43:17 2018 No.10143779 [DELETED]

>>10143637
A mix of both Representative and Direct democracy with which being which decided based on a case by case basis, when representative democracy is used, the elected official should ideally have a team of experts at their call who will know the subject matter better than them but as the elected representative, they get the final call. Direct democracy is applied when things that the general population will individually care about (for example, the city I live in recently had a Direct Democratic vote on whether to host the olympics) and doesn't require a lot of education to understand.

In the question of whether states with smaller populations should be beholden to those with larger population in matters that affect the entire country, I would genuinely say yes. Even then, smaller population states aren't completely beholden to larger population ones as there are three levels of government (municipal, federal and state governments). While which issues should be decided by which level is too complex for a single post, smaller population states do have plenty of authority in the state and municipal level.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 19:50:05 2018 No.10143799

>>10143637
A mix of both Representative and Direct democracy with which being which decided based on a case by case basis, when representative democracy is used, the elected official should ideally have a team of experts at their call who will know the subject matter better than them but as the elected representative, they get the final call. Direct democracy is applied when things that the general population will individually care about (for example, the city I live in recently had a Direct Democratic vote on whether to host the olympics) and doesn't require a lot of education to understand.

In the question of whether states with smaller populations should be beholden to those with larger population in matters that affect the entire country, I would genuinely say yes. Even then, smaller population states aren't completely beholden to larger population ones as there are three levels of government (municipal, federal and state governments). While which issues should be decided by which level is too complex for a single post, smaller population states do have plenty of authority in the state and municipal level.

I'm not fine with the current system where location causes someones votes to be worth more or less. This goes against the principle of democracy that each individual gets one vote (and this often disenfranchises the wealthier and more successful who live where the wealth and opportunity are) and makes it possible for politicians to get elected with less votes, possibly because they rearranged the districts.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 15 19:57:17 2018 No.10143811 >>10137237 >Particularly since the anonymity of this website lends itself to a perpetual shit-slinging fest that none of you would engage in a real life discussion. >the virgin NeoCon versus the Chad forester

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 15 20:11:10 2018 No.10143840 >>10143799 Thanks for indulging me, I apologize for the more knee-jerk initial reply, I didn't take the time to read the post carefully and made assumptions.

Anonymous Thu Nov 15 20:15:23 2018 No.10143856

>>10129927
Old world forest management called for all fires to be extinguished immediately. Problem is old world forests were relatively flat and peasants cleared the junk from the floor.

California forests are on hills and no one clears the junk. So dead dry junk builds up and becomes kindling.

Advanced search
Text to find
Subject [?]Search by post subject. Leave empty for any.
Username [?]Search for user name. Leave empty for any user name.
Tripcode [?]Search for tripcode. Leave empty for any.
Email [?]Search by email. Leave empty for any.
Filename [?]Search by image filename. Leave empty for any.
From Date [?]Enter what date to start searching from. Format is YYYY-MM-DD
To Date [?]Enter what date to start searching until. Format is YYYY-MM-DD
Image hash
Search in	All Posts OPs Only
Deleted posts	Show all posts Show only deleted posts Only show non-deleted posts
Internal posts	Show all posts Show only internal posts Show only archived posts
Order	New posts first Old posts first
Capcode	All Posts Only by Users Only by Mods Only by Admins Only by Developers
Results	Posts Threads
Action	[ Simple ]

/sci/ - Science & Math