/sci/ - Science & Math

>>15260490
You should include some sort of mandatory reading list. I have no idea what this is about and wikipedia doesn't quite help

>schizo general

Also: can't tested or can't prove it, therefore not science. Go back to /lit/ wordcel.

>>15260497
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLE_DQdH4_ZkT7RyuIz_hHZHNZmoQ2w0eL

Best place to start is the above.

>>15260504

Metaphysics is the bedrock of scientific models. If you don't discuss the ontology of your models, you can end up with quagmires like the "Hard Problem of Consciousness" that materialist scientists find themselves in. This is a completely relevant topic for a science board.

>>15260516
>metaphysics

Can't prove it, can't test it, therefore not science, back to /lit/ to wordcel.

>>15260490
I FUCKING LOVE CONSCIOUSNESS

>>15260529
Actually we can, and have. You are just stupid so you don't understand it

>>15260490
Pretty sure all these threads are started by materialtards themselves to create a pretext for them to spew their corporate religion.

>>15260510
>playlist of podcasts
Anon I .....

>>15260497
Start here:
https://esotericawakening.com/what-is-reality-the-holofractal-universe

read it THEN follow the links in it

>>15260490
idealism is infantile garbage.

>>15260504
>>15260529
If all substances are composed of infinitesimally small pieces, then at some point the “smallest materials” that compose things aren’t observable as they don’t exist in the physical world. When you move your fingers or bring your leg forward as you’re walking, you’re compelling your body to move with some force. Where is that force derived from?

Where's Cult of Passion/Aether king of /sci/?

>>15260490
>using computer science materials to spread your anti-materialism message.
If you really didn't believe in materialism, you would be spending all your time spreading your message through direct telepathy rather than the use of modern telecommunications devices.

>>15260784
Then quit using materials to spread your messages, use immaterial telepathy and shut the fuck up, quit disturbing the air and the global packet switching network with your nonsense.

>>15260926
>t. mentally ill

>>15260932
>hurr durr, materials aren't real and I have all these materials that prove it

>>15260933
Whom are you quoting, schizo? You are mentally ill.

>>15260922
Not believing in materialism doesn’t mean you believe human beings are capable of engaging with the immaterial world.

>>15260936
All the people using material components and computer science devices in an attempt to disprove materialism.

>>15260937
By engaging with materials instead you are acquiescing to materialism and defacto proving materialism is the best way to engage with anything.

>>15260940
>All the people using material components and computer science devices in an attempt to disprove materialism.
So? What's the connection? Are you mentally ill or just retarded? Matter doesn't need to be fundamental for computers to work.

>>15260504
>/lit/ wordcel
Wouldnt wordcels be in the math or whatever dept and mathcels be in the library?

>>15260948
What is the connection between people who use computers to say computers aren't real and OP using materials to claim materialism isn't real?

If you don't think computers need materials, then build a computer in your mind and shitpost there instead of bothering real people with your nonsense.

>>15260957
>people who use computers to say computers aren't real
Are you having another schizophrenic attack?

>OP using materials to claim materialism isn't real?
What's the problem with that? Are you too mentally ill to comprehend the post you just read?

.

>>15260954
What's your opinion on Euclid's propositions?

>>15260957
>then build a computer in your mind and shitpost there instead of bothering real people with your nonsense
>he doesnt know you can shitpost telepathically
>he never realized thats what praying is
>not shitposting to Satan for bantz

My life is simply better than yours.
>schizo
Yes, BETTER.

>>15260960
The problem is that your proof requires you to use the very thing that you say doesn't exist.

>>15260963
Love Prop 17, reverse engineering requires a couple too many steps so its got an odd "wtf was he thinking" place in my heart.

What about you?

>>15260967
Are you mentally ill, retarded or a literal bot? Quote where I said matter "doesn't exist".

>>15260965
No I literally started in this thread telling you to go shitpost telepathically instead of with computer materials, so again, if prayer works so well in spreading your message, go do that and quit disturbing all the materials and wasting electricity and other resources just to prove you don't actually believe anything you claim and are actually addicted to using materials instead of praying your way to heaven or whatever.

>>15260969
I like how they're connected to fractal appearances in the concsciousness

>>15260973
I accept your concession, materialism is real, it would be a problem to use materials to disprove materialism, OP is wrong, which is why we are all using materials to communicate instead of just praying our preferences into the universe, thanks for playing.

>>15260973
Explain how mental illness or really any illness can even exist in an idealistic universe.

>>15260982
It's when evil spirits possess

>>15260976
Mmm, for when viewed like that Im reminded Penrose's theory. I feel like we're surrounded by overlapping tiling layer harmonics that produce mostly chaos until you realize there are there are "seperate frequencies" and they "pop" into existence when you can tune into them (simply focus on like depth when looking at close as far at the same time).

Its nigh impossible describing hyperdimensional hyperbolic geometric planes to...well...anyone.

>>15260979
>>15260982
Materialism is a mentally ill cult metaphysical dogma. Still waiting for you to quote where I said matter "doesn't exist".

>>15260984
That is not mental illness, it is demonic possession, but if everything is just your mind, there is nothing to possess or be possessed, its just your mind hallucinating conflict where none actually exists.

>>15260992
Yes... I'm mentally ill sometimes and not ill sometimes. It's all very confusing

>>15260990
You just said it doesn't actually exist because it is just a mental hallucination, yet you can't make me mentally hallucinate anything, you can only use computer science materials to broadcast your obviously false message that you clearly don't believe or you wouldn't waste you mind using materials instead of prayer to influence me who is actually yourself.

>>15260984
>It's when evil spirits possess
Or when a good soul submitted.

>They gave into evil *sniffle*. It still hurts, damnit.

>>15260998
>You just said it doesn't actually exist
Quote it. Full-blown psychosis. No other words to describe your bizarre behavior.

>>15260997
Or maybe you are always mentally ill and thinking you can disprove materialism through the use of advanced computer materials is just another manifestation of your mental illness which is why it is so confusing even for you the person trying to make the fallacious point.

>>15261003
You're so profoundly retarded you're getting repeatedly trolled by your own materialtard buddies. The absolute state of your crew.

>>15261000
>Materialism is a mentally ill cult metaphysical dogma.
So this isn't true, materials do exist and materialism is not a hallucination, it is simply a result of people physically encountering alien physical materials that are not part of the person?

>>15261005
>So this isn't true
It's 100% true and it doesn't say materials don't exist. You are completely psychotic. lol

>>15261004
Sure, you totally trolled me by pretending to be retarded, nice job.

>>15260936
he literally is

>>15261009
You are mentally ill and profoundly retarded.

>>15261008
So if materials exist and you and your computer are made of materials, then how is materialism wrong?

>>15260989
The frequencies are actually very directly related. I realized this when thinking about geometrical symmetry patterns a few weeks ago

>>15261016
>materials aren't real, but the materials in your brain can totally be possessed and become ill because the materials in my computer told me so

>>15261017
>how is materialism wrong?
For starters, it's wrong by purporting to be scientific while simultaneously making unfalsifiable metaphysical claims about matter being the fundamental substance of reality. You can't have both, schizo.

>>15261021
See >>15261016

>>15261022
So then why is your communication fundamentally dependent on surrounding materials rather than immaterial expression, why aren't you able to explain the fundamental truth of reality to me through telepathy rather than typeface?

>>15261014
I'm literally about to be possessed by demonic forces right now, please help

>>15261025
Too bad I don't care about some retard's buzzword based opinions.

>>15261026
What does your psychotic babble have to do with what I said? You are legit mentally ill.

>>15261018
>The frequencies are actually very directly related.
Well yeah, but irs like findinf there are stations on a radio instead picking up parts of a song here or there.

I believe thats why so many Theologies have some sort of geometric component, sort of like a "channel station" for tuning into.

108 in Buddhism, 72 in Judaism/Islam, some are hybrids, using not just one geomtric shape but two, signifying different things (which correlate to reality first, human understanding second). Like the Octagon and Chaos, (for me that would be Base-8, the real one, not Octa-DECimal (8 of 10). Real Base-8 has no Zero, so its a measure for Chaos, not counting.

>>15261031
See >>15261016
It's so hilariously easy to make you and your crew look both retarded and deranged. There's never any need to actually discuss your materialtard delusions. Merely allowing you to associate it with your person and behavior does more damage than any intellectual discussion.

>>15261032
What does your continued use of material components for communication have to do with disproving materialism?
Every ASCII digit you post only piles onto the evidenced for the contrary.

>>15261033
>108 in Buddhism, 72 in Judaism/Islam, some are hybrids, using not just one geomtric shape but two, signifying different things (which correlate to reality first, human understanding second). Like the Octagon and Chaos, (for me that would be Base-8, the real one, not Octa-DECimal (8 of 10). Real Base-8 has no Zero, so its a measure for Chaos, not counting.
That's an interesting observation. Really makes you wonder if the octalogical beings are inherently more attuned to the natural resonances of the psychical world

>>15260846
>If all substances are composed of infinitesimally small pieces, then at some point the “smallest materials” that compose things aren’t observable as they don’t exist in the physical world. When you move your fingers or bring your leg forward as you’re walking, you’re compelling your body to move with some force. Where is that force derived from?
This is an /x/ containment thread thank god but this is a very good question
Say a human kicks a rock, what compelled them to do so? It was the rocks energy that must flow to its final state of it's resting spot. There is a void it must fill, and the human is part of the calculation in filling it.
You can say things that are too small to observe have to be meta. But that's giving up, you can create the equations to fit an ever increasingly chaotic and smaller physics.
There is a force which hasn't been described properly that wants energy to flow more efficiently which manipulates gravity differently than magic space time. It doesn't mean your existence is deterministic or you need to call upon meta gods to quantify it.
Did biology invent an intricate way to take advantage of it?

>>15261038
>What does your continued use of material components for communication have to do with disproving materialism?
I don't care about disproving your unfalsifiable metaphysical dogma, but I've just explained to you why it's non-scientific and it seems to have thrown you further into the rabithole of your violent mental episode.

>>15261039
No it actually makes people wonder if mental illness is a social contagion.

>>15261034
All I see is you presenting more material in a retarded ass backwards effort to disprove materialism.

>>15260965
you are a 14 year old and have no right to defy Alex Grey's beautiful art with your garbage. anyone who still says "bantz" or "lolz" needs to be shot. and no, you will never transcend matter

>>15261039
>attuned to the natural resonances of the psychical world
Hysteria
Biology just might have interesting interactions with energy, that is all
It doesn't mean you can suddenly tune into it or not, you only can understand we haven't quantified this force

>>15261044
This is older than civilization itself. Youre basically telling radio operators there is "No such thing as data "flying" through the sky, schizo." Utterly deluded and would be funny if your igorance was you stepping on a shovel to hit your nose...but instead youre tossing shovels in front of other people.

You know not even your own family, son...

>>15261048
His art is mediocre. Ive been to dozens of the worlds best art museums around the world, dont talk "art" to me, boy...you clearly never seen any.

>>15261050
This is not just energy it's related to the transcendent vibrations of the thin fabric separating the conscious world from the unconcscious world

>>15261043
No, material is more fundamental because if you remove the material that makes you up, you awareness and mental modeling goes with it, but when you go to sleep or into a coma and remove your awareness, your material body does not magically go away with it.

>>15261053
I am not denying air, light or sound though, there are numerous materials flying around for the human brain to receive like a radio, you are the one denying them all because you think reality is some idealistic projection instead.

>>15261059
I don't know what your mentally ill and incongruent reply has to do with what I said. It's like you're incapable of forming coherent thoughts. This is good. I want you to keep being rabidly insane in response to my perfectly adequate points and discredit your cult.

>>15261058
>transcendent vibrations
Describe this in a rigorous manner
And never refer to music

>>15261050
>Biology just might have interesting interactions with energy,
Youre not a Biologist, or even a Geneticist. Probably not a Chemists but I'll know in a few minutes.
>Learn about how electrical signals/voltage (your energy) effects living beings and dont talk back until you do.
https://youtu.be/5ChRM4CEWyg
>After you finish I have the next course...but you're not gunna pass the test before so...are you?

I am, buck-o.

>>15261062
>I am incapable of understand other people because idealism dictates I am the only real mind, so you are the incoherent one for refusing to agree with me, rather than me for refusing to take reality into account.

>>15261058
You sound like a new age hippie.

>>15261067
Once again, what does your fully psychotic rambling have to do with what I said? Keep it up.

>>15261061
>you are the one denying them
I have never spoken about "Idealism" or "Materialism". Either in these threads or ever in my life, I find both are deluded by definitions that do not fit reality so both sides will always be wrong.

Stop posting about me, you will NEVER know me enough to do so without looking like a liar.

>>15261069
Yes-chad.jpg

>>15261069
You sound ignorant and stupid

>>15261071
I am the one keeping up, you are the one who can't figure out what words mean and keep complaining about your poor communication abilities while ignoring the very clear reasons why material is more fundamental than idea since you are using materials to spread your ideas rather than using ideas to spread materials.

>>15261073
>>15261076
>>15261077
You schizo retards could at least attempt to quantify idealism rather than being 100% meta, you could even try 50% meta, or 25% meta, or 10% meta, what about 1% meta?
Yes the universe may bend to each person's subjective existence, but quantify it or go live your life instead of shitposting when we are trying to do science and maths

>>15261073
If materialism is so deluded get off of the computer forever and stop using the fruits of materialism, stop eating, stop drinking, stop breathing forever if the materials that compose food, water, and air are all just delusions.

>>15261079
>how is materialism wrong?
For starters, it's wrong by purporting to be scientific while simultaneously making unfalsifiable metaphysical claims about matter being the fundamental substance of reality. You can't have both, schizo.
I challenge your overtly psychotic brain to come up with a response that references only what I explicitly state in this post, and none of the stuff the voices in your head say. Protip: you literally can't.

>>15261082
Rounding up and shooting materialtards is eugenics 101. Your post is proof. Allowing you to spread your psychotic illness is a net detriment to humanity.

>>15261083
I already explained why matter is more fundamental than mind and how that can be tested and you just ignored the point. >>15261059

>>15261081
This is literally the highest form of your childish "science and math" you buffoon

>>15261090
>I already explained why matter is more fundamental than mind
Now show me where my post says anything about mind being more fundamental than matter. Notice how you can't write a coherent reply even when I explicitly explain to you what a coherent reply should look like, and warn you against replying to the voices that infest your subhuman mind.

>>15261085
So you want to gather their material in a circle and use material bullets to disprove the existence of materials? Why can't you accomplish that with telepathy Scanners style if it is mind over matter instead of the other way around?

>>15261081
My opinions are true because i said so.

>>15261095
See >>15261085

>>15261081
>You schizo retards could at least attempt to quantify idealism
No, everything in the universe is wrong except for me. The burden of proof is on you.

>Your definitions are all retarded and you've slit reality into two halves and each side see's the truth in one and not the other.

Like QM and GR....you two are both wrong, no matter how right you are "under these specific conditions"

>>15261097
Yes I replied to the post where they only solution to your problem of appearing retarded involved the application of specific materials to other material bodies who noticed you are retarded.

>>15261101
See >>15261085

>can't solve the hard problem of consciousness
>can't solve the problem of other minds
>can't solve the binding problem
>can't explain physical reality
>can't solve ethics
Idealism is a failure, a cope, a larp and an incoherent pseud narrative. It belongs in the trash.
Let's address your seething in advance
>but muh materialism
False dichotomy.
>hurr durr there is no hard problem
Denial ad nauseam.
>you're a poopy shitlord
Ad hominem.
>soijak reaction image
Was never funny. /qa/ lost.

>>15261056
i mean its you who posted it in the first place, "boy." art is subjective but i dont think hyperaccurate realism is the highest standard of it, if thats what you mean

>>can't solve the hard problem of consciousness
>>can't solve the problem of other minds
>>can't solve the binding problem
>>can't explain physical reality
>>can't solve ethics
>Idealism is a failure, a cope, a larp and an incoherent pseud narrative. It belongs in the trash.
>Let's address your seething in advance
>>but muh materialism
>False dichotomy.
>>hurr durr there is no hard problem
>Denial ad nauseam.
>>you're a poopy shitlord
>Ad hominem.
>>soijak reaction image
>Was never funny. /qa/ lost.

>>15261107
>art is subjective
False

>>15261094
Matter is the fundamental property of your reality because if the matter composing your body is removed so too is the awareness associated with it, but when you are unconscious you don't even notice the matter that composes your environment changing. Feel free to remove your head or have someone do it for you and test for yourself if your consciousness can outlive that specific rearrangement of matter.

Him; >>15261073
Me; >>15261082

Holy shit...who is he talking to, this is wild.

>>15261112
lol...me and him is switched, oops

>>15261112
>>15261115
More like you are trying to distract from being BTFO so hard your identity is now in flux.

>>15261103
Based

>>15261110
Notice how your psychotic is incongruent both with itself and with the post you're responding to. lol

>>15261103
/thread

>>15261119
Notice you can't actually explain your position or come up with a counterargument, you can only throw out buzzwords and pretend like you didn't understand how easily your losing position was refuted.

>>15261122
>you can't actually explain your position
My position is crystal-clear: your materialtard faith has nothing to do with science. Screeching that matter is the fundamental substance of reality is metaphysics through and through.

>>15261117
>I have never spoken about "Idealism" or "Materialism".
AT ALL.<------- READ, RETARD

YOUR, literally, FIRST WORDS BACK;
>If materialism is so deluded
If materialism is so deluded
>If materialism is so deluded
If materialism is so deluded

THINK. WHO ARE YOU TALKING TO?

ME? CANT BE, IVE NEVER OPINED ON THIS BEFORE.

THINK.
>THINK.
THINK.
>THINK.

>>15261103
Idealism BTFO

>>15261103
Hard problem not for idealism. We believe existence of immaterial soul

>>15261123
Except for the fact that science is exclusively done through the measurement of materials and you haven't proposed any contrary solution, you can't even communicate with me about your rejection of materialism without relying on numerous material devices.

>>15261128
Another incongruent reply. This is so funny. I could do it all day. You are not human and will never reply coherently.

>>15261133
Still pretending to not understand since coming up with a counterargument would be too hard and downright impossible without relying on materials to spread your argument.

>>15261136
I understand your cretinous opinion. It's just completely incogruent. Do it again. The more you do it, the more you and your faith are ridiculed.

>>15261103
all true and based, except:

>False dichotomy.
that's false

>>15261140
>that same obsessed, mentally ill drone sperging out again
Why haven't you killed yourself yet? I know every day of your life is misery.

>>15261139
Its not it exactly explains that materialism is scientific because the scientific specifically depends on materials to make measurement, but feel free to keep pretending like you don't understand the innate connection between the two while being entirely unable to propose a method of science without material measurement.

>>15261143
>materialism is scientific because the scientific specifically depends on materials to make measurement
Total nonsequitur.

>>15261103
OP here. I admit I was wrong about everything.

>>15261103
>False dichotomy.
I also feel like one side and inched its definition closer and closer to irrefutable aspects of reality in order to bolster its reputation while the other sort of cant.

>muh breath
>muh then just transcend reality then lmao

Tiresome, this has turned into an interpretive word game, not actual interspection of existence and its place in it.

>>15261145
Nope you pretending you can make scientific measurement without a material base while being completely unable to follow up with an explanation for how it is actually possible is non-sequitur.

>>15261153
And now you're back to the voices. Looks like I can make you have an overt psychotic episode for as long as I want.

>>15261153
>make scientific measurement without a material base
Possible, but youre not able to percieve hyperdimensional reality, like I can, because if you vould you wouldnt be caught in this retarded debate.

>measuring scalar with a 3D ruler measuring in feet
Doesnt work like that, one would know if they knew...but ye do not.

>How?
I use a debased metric, Base-8, not OctaDECimal (8 of 10) and true Base-8 has no Zero, so there is no "counting, aka MEASURE" in a sense (You) can percieve.

>Dont beleeb u
Its like an illiterate dirt farmer telling the Trinity Physicists "Atoms dont exist because if they did I would see them."

>>15261164
Sure because talking about voices and psychosis is so congruent to the point I made.

>>15261145
I love pseudo intellectuals. Materialism is the only correct.

>>15261177
What else is there to say about your mentally ill behavior? You are quite literally unable to write a single coherent reply.

>>15261176
Sure, I bet you just lower yourself to sounding stupid in retarded debates instead of interacting with hyperreality and doing something true for the lulz.

>>15261180
NTA but as a spectator in this schizo containment thread you seem to be the most schizophrenic. Just fyi

>>15261112
my dude, a lot of people on this board are legit mentally ill and the rest are incapable of grade school logic

>>15261183
You are losing your mind with impotent rage.

>>15261181
>instead of interacting with hyperreality
I *AM* HYPER-REALITY, NORMIE MORTAL MAGGOT.

>when you btfo so hard they disengage the debate to "no u dum"
Tiresome. All so tiresome.

>>15261183
updated copy, and this doesnt do it justice. I have been watching him for literally years. His sperg outs and meltdowns. There is no question he is a literal schizo

>>15261184
Yeah...I'm down for the scuff for the few moments of true insight, both given and recieved. Just...sometimes its really shocking to see that they really will walk off a cliff to spite the truth.

>>15260490
.png = glowie
too easy to spot

>>15261185
>I-I don't mimic you s-schizo!

>>15261193
>>15261198
I know "schizo" gets thrown around here a lot, but now you're clinical showing signs of literal psychosis.

>>15261183
>you seem to be the most schizophrenic
Hold my Brandy.
*cracks knuckles*

You cant even reverse engineer the combinatorics argorithm needed to simulate a quantum multi-verse.
NOT EVEN CLOSE, NONE OF YOU ARE AS SCHIZO AS ME.

I have not only the credentials but the evidence in medical and scientific (physics, biology, genetics, psychology) citations to back EVER CLAIM UP. All of it.

>>15260965
>Not conducting a escalated privilege attack on yourself to install ransomware.
/g/ is disappoint.

>>15261180
You haven't once actually pointed to specific behavior you just say vague buzzwords that could apply to anything or anyone.

>>15261184
Finally you speak from experience rather than some drug induced stupor.

>>15261202
>/g/
>remedial math class

I vomit of computer science as a weak engineering space but also a limited math space for programming.

WEAK SHIT, YO.

>>15261203
>You haven't once actually pointed to specific behavior you just say
I don't need to. Every time I remind you that materialist dogma is unscientific, you have a meltdown and start replying to some voices in your head and trying to refute points I never made. lol

>>15261200
No, every anon who disagrees with him is the same anon, he has known this esoteric secret of anon for years.

Watching schizos fight themselves is very entertaining. We have most of the major schizos here
cult of passion
xxsussyxx
bodhi
idealism schizo
sharting schizo
Only the quantum virtual reality schizo is missing

>>15261209
i'm being gangstalked by retards pretending to be me or using my copyrighted phrases

>>15261210
>Only the quantum virtual reality schizo is missing
*points to heart*
He never left.

>>15261208
No, I simply point out that the scientific method depends on a base of measurement and measurement requires material consistency and you can't seem to understand this, so go off on some unrelated tangent that still requires materials using other materials to spread your message.

>>15261213
You can't copyright phrases, that is the realm of trademarking, you lying tard.

>>15261216
>the scientific method depends on a base of measurement
So? Notice how your blood pressure just spiked. Let the psychosis commence again. :^)

>>15261200
>>15261209
>>15261213
>replying to and having a conversation with yourself
you have issues

>>15261220
You are losing your mind with impotent rage, son.

>>15261210
Why am I only 2nd on your list?

>>15261219
So read the bit you ignored.
>measurement requires material consistency
ie the scientific method require material consistency which can only be explained through materialism rather than idealism which would need any scientific method because everything would just be whatever ideal you thought of rather than what you measure in reality.

You just aren't worth further conversation as you clearly can't read and you are singularly focused on projecting your own mental illnesses and ignorance.

>>15261223
>the scientific method require material consistency
>material consistency
What does this schizophasic babble mean?

>>15261221
I bodied you so hard so many times you have my stink all over you for life.

>>15261222
SEE; >>15261201

>>15261225
You're a known child rapist.

>>15261226
If I may cross cite, see >>15260895

>>15261231
...but I like the structured atom model. It fits my autism shaped brain.

>>15261223
>the psychotic can't respond to >>15261224
Concession accepted.

>>15261231
Oh, and definitely not a Particle Physicist, think CERN is a terrible cost/benefit endeavor by inverting the periodic table, making a cone whos point inverts to inverse magnitude table. Or as I say "How many times can you cut a grain of sand in half?"

>>15261108
materialism isnt perfect therefore [sacred geometry or some shit like that]
>>15261109
i'd post a basedjak but i cant be bothered to

>>15261258
Do animals like you ever stop to reflect on the fact that they are completely reactive? Do you realize that your entire anti-woman worldview is nothing more than a reaction against imaginary boogeymen?

>>15261263
Women are slaves though you can be pro women and know their duty is sweaty hot slavery and death till you part
Only fags abuse their slaves

>>15261258
>[sacred geometry or some shit like that]
>OR SOME SHIT
Not much of a Physicist, are you?

>>15261263
>>15261266
>anti-woman
Anti-human*. Fuck. Welp, time for me to kill myself because I can't get over the cringe of that mistake.

>>15261103
Twist dialectics head off

>>15261271
The schizos in this thread don't understand beauty anyway it's the same
Women should be allowed to be immolated upon my death pyre

>>15261239
Giant steps half goosey.
Shoadingers planked in grain silo.
Appreciating expenditure values.

>>15261263
lmao at anti-woman i think that completely seals the deal here but i will still, because of my superior moral virtue, address you and say, no, i dont have an "anti-human" worldview, im just tired of plebs like the other poster im replying here who think that they can escape the boredom of their lives through some internet-age mysticism.
>>15261270
no and neither is any single individual on this site, you don't understand that picture, can you even tell me what a photon is?

>>15261306
>i dont have an "anti-human" worldview,
You do. You're just too dumb to realize it. But that's not even the main point. Your entire comprehension of reality is a reaction against imaginary boogeymen. It has zero intellectual substance. It has zero independent existence. You have zero independent existence. Your whole identity revolves around trying to counter some imaginary character that you've been trained to constantly lash out against as a teen by corporate-sponsored goysloptaintment.

>>15261306
>neither is any single individual on this site
I read this at age 13. Whats your credentials....not "no ur not", WHAT ARE YOU?
>you don't understand that picture,
I made it BECAUSE it shows what I know. Simply stating "you havnt read that book" shit when I can cite it in all kinds of ways makes you look VERY charlatan-midwit.
>can you even tell me what a photon is?
NO, YOU TELL ME WHAT MY PICTURE IS. ITS PHYSICS. ITS REALITY. DO RESEARCH.

Weak, bring citations and an argument, not your FEELINGS about this.

>>15261311
how can you be this high on the smell of your own farts as an enlightened being? you're here on 4chan seething at people who aren't interested in obtuse metaphysical circlejerking
>goysloptaintment
okay motherfucker you crossed the line. i will fucking bet ten thousand bucks that my diet is more schizophrenic than yours? what do you eat? "organic"? perhaps keto? hahahahahah!
>>15261319
i am the guy who is living in your walls.
you read a book by some retard who couldn't even walk? wow congratz, he's a complete pseud anyway
you made some stupid image? wow congrats, do you even know the angles in a pentagon?
>NO, YOU TELL ME WHAT MY PICTURE IS. ITS PHYSICS. ITS REALITY. DO RESEARCH.
mmh, and what part of physics does it perhaps involve? are the people in the bottom right corner involved in physics?

Verification not required faggot

>>15261344
>okay motherfucker you crossed the line.
And yet my point stands completely undisputed: your entire comprehension of reality is a reaction against imaginary boogeymen. It has zero intellectual substance. It has zero independent existence. You have zero independent existence. Your whole identity revolves around trying to counter some imaginary character that you've been trained to constantly lash out against as a teen by corporate-sponsored goysloptaintment.

>>15261349
if you'd actually have even the fraction of the IQ you think you do, you would have noticed that i was challenging you to a duel of the schizos, yet no, i can't outschizo you, for you are too retarded to even conversate with. don't you see how eloquent i am compared to you? don't you see how you squirm for words as you try to come up with a reply?

>>15261356
See >>15261349. Your entire existence is relative to an imaginary boogeyman.

>>15261224
>>15261237
It means material like atoms behave consistently over time such that consistent instrumental objective measurement like temperature can be achieved via mass produced devices regardless of how you hot or cold you personally subjectively feel.

>>15261344
>are the people in the bottom right corner involved in physics?
...
>"I view people as independent from reality like some sort of 20th century fundementalist christian thats doesnt believe in evolution."

>"Science is in a lab, not in my room where I watch porn, wearing my diaper."

Truly a scientific mind, nothing is out of your reach.
/filtered

>>15261364
>material like atoms behave consistently over time
Why did you invent a retarded schizophasic term for it? But okay, nevermind that. Suppose they do. What of it?

>>15261359
and what is this imaginary boogeyman, please enlighten me?
>>15261366
well science is certainly not with you, retard, perhaps you could try to solve some quadratic equations for starters, but oh wait they don't have cool fancy imagery you could look at

>>15261374
>and what is this imaginary boogeyman
Why don't you sperg off about it some more and show me?

>>15261375
this site is actually ruined

>>15261376
Your entire existence is relative to an imaginary boogeyman.

>>15261210
How is Idealism a schizo position? We posit that the only thing we can be certain of is the basis of reality. On the other hand, materialists speak of entities that they never have nor ever will know directly.

>>15261369
I didn't, I used specific words that mean specific things that you, for some reason, could not extrapolate based on the individual meaning of the words, the combination, and the context of the conversation.

>What of it?
It means the scientific method is fundamentally dependent on a material base rather than materialism being unscientific.

>>15261428
>idealism
>We posit that the only thing we can be certain of is the basis of reality.
So then how do I buy one Ideal on Amazon?
I know how to buy materials, they are abundant, but where are all the ideals to own?

Retard mods must be asleep to actually allow real discussion here

>>15261103
The first point is blatantly wrong. There is no hard problem in Idealism.

>>15261374
>well science is certainly not with you, retard

>Doesnt even know the theory
>posted self evident evidence of reoccuring phenomena at all scales of reality
>basically visual citations but left the written part out dor brevity and filtration
>gets filtered immediately

>quadratic equations
LMFAO isnt that like mid-level Mathematics, you outed yourself, boy.

>>15261236
I'd prefer it that way myself.
But no. I had to go and molest a bunch of undergrads in evermore exotic ways.
Comprehension trolling as it turned out. is an incomprehensibley dumb thing to do.
Toying with the fabrics of conscious and reality.
I get why they resist any real arguments.
Why they hyperlink appeals of higherpower.
Ignorance is to be safeguarded.
Because what takes place is dread.

>>15260683

Uhh yeah because we love ourselves. You don't.

>>15261446
>denial ad nauseam

>>15260943

You are only showing that you don't understand these issues at all. Please read more.

>>15261452
>Ignorance is to be safeguarded.
>Because what takes place is dread.
Pfft, fuck...so true. The subconsciouss protecting the psyche so it can impulse them to commit acts of evil even they would be repulsed by and kept sane through blindness.

Threaten this divide and they recoil, "He's finding out!"

>>15261229

>>15261026

What is matter?

>>15261479
Nothing, what is a matter with you, anon, why do you want to escape the material so desperately or need to feel above it somehow?

>>15261488

Just answer the question please. What is matter?

>>15260490
OMG it's full of quarks

>>15261498
Matter is that stuff in the universe that's made up of fermions.

>>15261504
>no chemistry, no life
don't forget leptons

>>15261488
>why do you want to escape the material so desperately or need to feel above it somehow?
Let's suppose he does. The reasons for that would be obvious and humany understandable. Now you explain why you so desperately need to feel like a lump of matter and a puppet of physics? :^)

>>15261498
You always answer questions with other questions without expecting more questions in return?
Your computer is made matter for starters, so why use it instead of something ideal to ask your questions if idealism is somehow superior to materialism?

>>15261466
Hope springs for a kindred one.
For one kin in a kingdoms sun.
Kings not one, without a kindred son.

>>15261507
Leptons are fermions.

>>15261524
What about electrons then?

>>15261527

>>15261510
>Now you explain why you so desperately need to feel like a lump of matter and a puppet of physics? :^)
I don't feel like, it is imposed upon me, if you knew what being humanly meant, you would know that and that physics is just a mathematical approximation that was presented to us by numerous other people in our environment to create a set of axioms to model the information received by the human condition and it is the most accurate and repeatable model I have been presented down to the fact that it allows quasi-realistic (and improving) computer simulation of the human condition and global communication whereas idealist assumptions of hidden creators and esoteric codes have yet to provide any relatable predictions even if they have led to unrelated conversations that did end up being relatable.

>>15261457
It is just wrong. The problem of getting one completely unrelated type of thing from another doesn't exist because we posit all is of the type consciousness.

>>15261541
The question of qualia isn't answered by "they just are, okay".

>>15261544

That is the answer. Consciousness is fundamental. Everyone forming an ontology has to pick sonethibg that can't be explained in terms of something else, and cobsciousness is the most reasonable choice since it is all we have access to.

>>15261533
See >>15261510

>>15261564
1. Consciousness being fundamental isn't unique to idealism and doesn't imply idealism.
2. It still doesn't give you any insight about qualia. Hence it doesn't address the hard problem and is intellectually worthless.

>>15261527
Electrons are fermions.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermion

>>15261578 see >>15261533
It is not some kind of feeling that can be ignored, it is an understanding of physical limitations such as gravity or how your communication is limited to material reality rather than your idealist expectations that are subordinate to your desperate desire to be above everyone and everything else yet can't meaningfully transfer to the real world with any kind of telepathic messaging or any other proof of concept.

>>15261610
>It is not some kind of feeling that can be ignored, it is an understanding
Merely understanding something doesn't usually make people obsessively reiterate their opinions about it day after day, for hours on end. Now you explain why you so desperately need to feel like a lump of matter and a puppet of physics? :^)

>>15260490
Materialists don't even have an argument. When you break it down you reach an impasse after which they can't explain anything other than just saying "it just is" or some dumb shit like that. Midwit retards.

>>15261646
>When you break it down you reach an impasse after which they can't explain anything other than just saying "it just is" or some dumb shit like that
That's all metaphysics.

>>15260516
Atheist materialist scientists who dip their toes into philosophy without even a basic understanding of the problems involved are cringe and retarded. I hope these faggots go away and stick with looking through their microscopes.

>>15260846
You would think that the implications of quantum mechanics would have killed this argument 100 years ago, but here we are. These homos continue to break everything down into "atoms."

>>15260957
Do you even know what a computer does? Like, how it works? When you understand this, you realize that calling everything a computer gets you nowhere. It especially doesn't explain consciousness.

>>15261628
Its like you said it is humanly obvious why it would be nice to be above the material or to realize better imaginable comic book physics realities, but while the physical approximations and computer models are not completely satisfying, they are better than anything you can present, so when you come along trying to deny the reality day after day for hours on end and infer or claim that you actually have transcended material reality while all your measurable actions and communication is entirely dependent on material reality and you have no immaterial way to prove any of your nonsense, all I can really do is point out how you are demonstrably wrong, you have no influence over physics or reality as you are desperately seeking by pretending you are completely immaterial when even bots are made of hardware.

>>15261678
>all I can really do is point out how you are demonstrably wrong
Why? What makes you so obsessed and emotionally invested in the idea that you are a lump of matter and a puppet of physics?

>>15261646
The fact that you don't know something and you can't dissuade their material based measurements with your ideals proves materialism over idealism, otherwise you could just go to your ideal computer and look up the ideal solution from your ideal database and get and ideal response instead of using spyware to poorly communicate your demonstrably false ideals over a global packet switching network that is wasting real physical energy on your idealistic idiocy since the only thing you have succeeded at is presenting yourself as the ideal idiot.

>>15261689
Mental illness.

>>15261687
I didn't invest anything, it is an imposition that is slowly deteriorating everything around us without our consent and you idealists just cope by lying about it and embracing some semantic imprecisions over the reality you are subjected to.

>>15261700
Cool story, but why are you so emotionally invested in the idea that you are a lump of matter and a puppet of physics? Why do you ramble about it for ours on end, day after day, and devolve into psychotic anger whenever you stumble upon someone who thinks otherwise?

>>15261691
So you admit that this exchange that has been entire based in material mediums, specifically computers, is not consistent with your ideals, your reality is not idealistic, rather it is filled with illness of all sorts?

>>15261714
I'm just marveling at your mental illness. I have no commentary on the content of your psychosis.

>>15261703
But that's what we are lol
Stop believing in ancient notions of souls and spirits
Matter is all there is

>>15261720
Ok, but why are you so obssessed with reiterating it over and over while you froth at the mouth? Notice how you are unable to answer this question.

>>15260490
I WILL EAT SCHIZOS FROM THIS BOARD

>>15261703
Its not just an idea and you haven't transcended it.
I have made a lot of good decisions, so I have a lot of free time, you are the one undergoing a measurable quantifiable clinical narcissistic psychosis by submitting to idealistic delusions about being the ultimate source of your own little idealistic universe while constantly complaining about what other people think and do with their lives.

>>15261728
Cool story, but why are you so emotionally invested in the idea that you are a lump of matter and a puppet of physics? Why do you ramble about it for ours on end, day after day, and devolve into psychotic anger whenever you stumble upon someone who thinks otherwise? We've already established that it's not merely because you're right, but for some other reason.

>>15261715
I accept your concession that you actually believe reality is not idealistic because there is sickness and some information about reality that you can't explain with your imaginary ideals.

>>15261733
I savor the extreme distress you are feeling right now as you keep trying to deliver some incoherent schizopoint while no one cares.

>>15261723
Why are you obsessed with lying about your experience and embarrassing yourself by failing to have a proof of concept about obvious falsehoods you keep trying to reiterate over and over, why are you so mad that a lie doesn't come true if you tell it over and over and the truth isn't falsified by denying ti over and over?

>>15261726
lick my taint

>>15261741
Schizo word salad.

>>15261732
Why do you try to lie over and over thinking you won't be corrected by someone even after you admit they are right, then attempt the same lie all over again day after day?

>>15261737
Fantastic. Glad you have fun losing arguments win/win.

>>15261751
Cool story, but why are you so emotionally invested in the idea that you are a lump of matter and a puppet of physics? Why do you ramble about it for ours on end, day after day, and devolve into psychotic anger whenever you stumble upon someone who thinks otherwise? We've already established that it's not merely because you're right, but for some other reason.

I am now hiding this thread. Reply again to confirm my point.

>>15261743
Cool Story, but why are you obsessed with lying about your experience and embarrassing yourself by failing to have an idealistic proof of concept about obvious falsehoods you keep trying to reiterate over and over, why are you so mad that a lie doesn't come true if you tell it over and over and the truth isn't falsified by denying ti over and over?

Is it because you believe you are a loser in real material life that provided this computer for you to vent, so the truth hurts?

>>15261759
Your idealistic lies don't come true by repeating them and they never will, someone will always be around to correct your lies, stay mad and keeping thinking its only one person who sees your lies and keep repeating that as soon as an interaction initiates so that your madness is easier for everyone to identify..

>>15261767
>>15261776
Your absolutely deranged, incomprehensible rambling demonstrates my point.

>>15261504
>>15261511

The point is that you will never be able to reduce matter to a fundamental material level. The quantum spookiness shows that there is more going on than just matter.

Add to that the fact that we have free will, and you will see that materialism makes no sense because materialism necessitates determinism, which is false.

Finally, materialists have no way to explain what my thoughts are or who I am. Unless you can show me how my body (actually the matter that composes what we conceptualize as my body) generates ME and my thoughts and feelings, then you have no way to explain the fundamental question of existence. How do my five perceptions (touch, taste, smell, sight, hearing) produce consciousness? I'll wait for your answer.

>>15261649

Exactly you RETARD. You are conceding the argument. Don't you get it? We MUST go beyond physics because physics is not fundamental. I swear, you guys are so wrapped up in your bullshit that you can't even see the answer as you type it.

>>15261817
You and your mentally ill materialtard buddies are two sides of the same ZOG coin.

>>15261815
>Add to that the fact that we have free will, and you will see that materialism makes no sense because materialism necessitates determinism, which is false.
Okay bro everything disregarded cuz you trolling

>>15261826
>materialtard
Okay so you really did get bored with spamming about "determinitards". Glad you at least concede that determinism is true.

>>15261830
Absolutely deranged.

>>15261827

If materialism is true then so is determinism. Do you think free will exists? Why or why not?

>>15261791
Say it as much as you want, but it won't come true, they aren't magic words, they are simple lies.

>>15261815
>How do my five perceptions (touch, taste, smell, sight, hearing) produce consciousness?
Ah I see you don't have a sense of reason or a sense of truthfulness, no wonder you are so confused without a sense of balance you are probably very disoriented all the time.

>>15261851
I don't have to say anything. Your continual schizobabble simply makes no sense and that speaks for itself. lol

>>15261815
>you will never be able to reduce matter to a fundamental material level.
I don't know what that means exactly but it sounds like you are confirming material reality as most fundamental since it can't be reduced to anything more fundamental like some hidden layer of universal consciousness, only the material as it exists.

>>15261857
You haven't had anything to say except lies, so you will only improve quality in your absence, maybe the whole board is too schizo for your feminine ideals and you should go back to whatever woowoo hugbox indoctrinated you and humored your idiotic ideals.

>>15261866
>more incoherent psychiatric rambling
Like clockwork. Genuinely have no clue what you're losing your mind about. It's not contruent with anything ITT. You are true face of the materialtard delusional psychosis.

>>15261873
Must be why you are still using computer materials instead of directly projecting ideas to the world because you totally proved materialism is a delusion and your ideals dictate reality instead.

Do idealist cucks believe in free will? Yes or no?

>>15262200
i will answer for them. for the most part, it seems that they do. however, it's not universal. for example, one of the most prominent idealists, kastrup, does not.

free will is incoherent nonsense btw.

>>15261527

>>15261854

In a materialist world, all we would have is the reaction of matter to other matter. You don't think the outside world is actually entering through your eyes and projecting itself, do you? Your eyeball is reacting to input and generating a signal.

We do not perceive reality. We perceive the reaction of some matter to other matter.

>>15261858

Nope. We already reduced matter as far as we can go physically. See quantum spookiness. There is something beyond matter. Evidence:
>quantum spookiness
>your own consciousness
>free will

>>15262200
>>15262214
Many idealists like Kant believe that consciousness is inherently a transcendental entity and outside of space-time and thus free will is preserved.

>>15262200

Yes, you ARE will. You exist as pure will. However, your ability to impose that will on physical reality is limited by facticities.

>>15262229
Based Schopenhauer bro

>>15262234

actually never read him

>>15262214
>free will is incoherent nonsense btw.
Why are NPCs so proud of their eleutherophobia?

>>15262234
>>15262239

what schopenhauer do you recommend reading?

>>15262241
why do you relentlessly jump to the defense of indefensible garbage? it's a wonder

>>15262244
The world as will and representation. Of course you should have knowledge of Plato and Kant before reading Schopenhauer.

>>15262239
If you came up with that realization without reading Schopenhauer then prepare for the blackpill because of that thought expanded on.

>>15262249

Thanks. I haven't read any of that stuff. I guess Plato way back in school.

My belief is that we exist as pure will, and every moment is our responsibility and decision to give it meaning. So we can choose whatever meaning we want from life. I don't think we are the same "stuff" as matter, but obviously we are somehow connected. I think the brain/mind is part of the physical world that limits our will. For instance, the mind gives us all kinds of thoughts and feelings that we don't necessarily want to use our will to enact within the physical world. But idk how the brain can generate thoughts for us if it is purely physical, and we are purely mental.

>>15262260
For Schopenhauer there is no distinction between mental and physical, everything is pure mental. And within the mental construct, there is resting energy (unmoving matter) and moving energy (moving matter). Living things are obviously the latter.

So to your question of "Idk how the brain generate thoughts" there is literally nothing in knowable reality outside of Will and thoughts.

>>15262305
If life is this way, then that means music is......

this type of shit is going to give me a existential crisis.

>>15262305

Hmm I don't really get it. Guess I have reading to do

>>15260787
nta but thanks bro

>>15261026
you do not understand what materialism is, please google it.