/sci/ - Science & Math

Boing btfo

First in for Venus is for fags.

>>11614523
>useless
>heavy
>full of hot air and acid
>but pretty
Venus was the correct name for that planet.

>>11614523
based and fuck balloons-pilled

>>11614525
Women btfo

Shipping bulk spices to Mars to colonists desperate for tasty food and making extortionate profits.

>>11614523
>>11614525
this is the most based thread yet

If you use 4chan-X you can add,

[external-text:"sci","https://boards.4channel.org/sci/#s=sfg"]

...to your "Custom Board Navigation" in Advanced settings so that when you click on /sci/ it will only ever show threads with sfg in them.

>>11614558
Too bad Skylon is a dead end and would hardly compete with Falcon Heavy, let alone Starship

>>11614558
it's better to just have it bump those threads up to the top

>>11614552
Growing everything on Mars and shipping it to the Moon because shipping costs dominate production costs and Earth's gravity well is dummy thicc

>>11614568
No need to lower your IQ with seeing trash threads though.

>>11614492
I made it from parts that weren't originally meant for rocket engines. It's cast iron pieces, but that ended up rusting badly, so I might use stainless steel for any future engines I make.

>>11614566
Dead end for spaceflight. I wonder if the UK would leverage it for defense $$

>>11614600
Pretty sure that's been the goal since day one.

>>11614523
So how would you go back into orbit from Venus anyway?

>>11614618
Just launch off a gigantic pad held up by 90000 gorillion balloons lmao

>>11614618
same way you get to orbit from Earth
and about 9 gorillion balloons

>>11614618
You'd need a two stage rocket that launched from a floating platform, approximately the same size as Starship Super Heavy, and you'd need multiple tanker launches to low Venus orbit in order to send your upper stage vehicle anywhere beyond.
Basically it'd be hard and a big headache compared to launching from literally anywhere else; yeah Earth has more gravity but it also has a way bigger industrial base and of course a solid surface to build on.

>>11614618
It’s complicated. You could travel from the surface to an atmospheric platform using a tether, and then you’d have to launch the rocket from the platform. Doing this would result in slightly kinder delta/v costs to enter LVO than it takes to reach LEO

>>11614629
You don't really have practically available materials to make the rocket or even the fuel out of, either. Would they have to just bus in fuel, refuel in orbit, aerobrake a fully fueled rocket, lift it with balloons, launch it, then refuel it again?

>>11614629
>>11614667
you can make methane out of sulphuric acid and carbon dioxide

>>11614667
>You don't really have practically available materials to make the rocket or even the fuel out of, either.

Make keralox using the atmosphere. Make rockets using ore resources.

>>11614667
From Venus' atmosphere you can make all the oxygen you could ever need, and with some difficulty you can generate lots of hydrogen for making methane as well. The issue isn't really making propellant, it's that you need to make so god-damn much of it to get to any other place in space. It's easily a dozen times as much propellant to go from the atmosphere of Venus to Earth than it is to go from the surface of Mars to Earth.

>>11614674
>Make keralox
no, you'd never have any reason to make any hydrocarbon fuel heavier than butane.
>ore resources
Unattainable, lol

>>11614680
>Unattainable, lol

It’s called digging. There’ll be plenty of viable deposits in volcanic highlands.

>>11614695
>It’s called digging
You do know what the surface of Venus is like, right?

>>11614695
Digging with what? To design something that survives even minutes on the surface is a challenge.

>>11614708
stainless
steeeeel
the hard part would be controlling it

>>11614710
Anon, please describe for us in detail conditions on the surface of Venus. I don't think you know.

>>11614710
Solid stainless steel a mining rig does not make. Everything more complicated than the bit and the skin is fubar.

>>11614711
a soup of gas-like supercritical carbon dioxide at several hundred atmospheres of pressure and uhhhh
800 degrees C? I forget the temperature but it's below the melting point of steel
>>11614714
it'll be FINE you big nancy

>>11614708
Make dozers and drills
https://science.nasa.gov/technology/technology-highlights/electronics-demonstrate-operability-in-simulated-venus-conditions

>>11614566
There could be a niche for it exclusively for transporting people to LEO, if the logistics make it a more cost-effective ferry compared to TSTO.

I have question on the alcubierre drive and ftl stuff in general, though it might be more general physics in nature.

So one reason I've read about that makes any form of FTL whether it be either wormholes, alcubierre, or some other third thing is that changing position faster than the time-space light cone allows apparently fucks things up e.g. causality dying, time travel. From what I've read and understand is that its caused by the fact that there no universal wide "clock" so all time flow is relative and going FTL in an explicitly speed sense allows for time travel in that you can move faster than the speed of causality.

But in the cases of an alcubierre drive and wormholes, explicit speed isn't going past C instead you are your changing positions faster than FTL, but your explicit speed isn't FTL so it doesn't cause time travel and break causality.

But everyone treats these options as they do attain a faster than c explicit speed and therefore cause time travel/break causality.

So am I just a moron or are people over reactionary to any form of ftl?

>>11614750
FTL is fake and basically not worth talking about in the context of anything you could ever end up doing

>>11614750
>The fastest known causes only go this fast therefore no causes could ever go faster

Relativity is a fallacy lol

hahahahaha

>>11614757
>mercury
>gps

>>11614753
Yeah I know your probably right for due to various technical challenges, implications on the fermi paradox, and sheer amount of energy to pull it off. I do want to hold out hope that someday(thousand/million years) it might be able to be pulled off.

I just can't really fathom why causality becomes the problem in the case of wormholes/alcubierre, but not problems when we believe that expansion of space will drive other galaxies away from us faster than light speed.

>>11614775
fake news

>>11614784
Report and ignore.

>>11614780
Fermi paradox doesn’t exist. It’d be impossible to detect an alien civilization a hundred light years away by picking up their radio waves due to extinction.

>>11614784
>>11614786
It's real dumbass, check source
SpaceXfags on suicide watch haha

>>11614795
Link the tweet if it's real.

>>11614796
Stop replying. Report and ignore.

>>11614796
Its fake. That twitter user hasn't been active since 2007.

>>11614802
Wrong. The last post is from five hours ago, but no relevant tweet exists from the given date and all of the actual tweets are in all caps. Report and ignore. Stop replying and they leave.

>>11614800
Might as well clearly call him out on it at least once.

>>11614802
There are fresh tweets on the account. However I've noticed that he uses all caps unlike the tweet that was posted here.

>>11614806
>>11614810
Is this weird bait? The twitter handle is the part that leads with @, which is the part you enter when you want to read all their tweets at twitter.com/*username*.

>thread successfully derailed

Martians will be superior on all levels to terrans and jello baby propoganda is a last ditch effort to keep terran women off of BMC. Prove me wrong.

>>11614820
imagine every post taking 16 seconds to send and update

Thoughts on Boeing's Large Multipurpose Launch Vehicle?

>>11614823
imagine every post taking ten minutes to send

>>11614717
Except the logistics wont, remember that Skylon is a multi billion dollar vehicle and is only meant to fly hundreds of times per unit before retirement, in fact the most in depth cost analysis I've seen puts Skylon as less economic per kilogram than Falcon Heavy, meaning it doesn't even beat partially reusable TSTO. I just don't see how Skylon could compete with Starship even in terms of transporting people to LEO; Skylon could at best fit dozens whereas Starship could fit hundreds easily, and Starship will have a lower per-launch cost than Skylon (if it ever flies, which it probably wont).

>>11614829
Plus, by the point you need the throughput an SSTO could provide you'd also have the lift capacity and funds to just build a rotating skyhook and not bother with an SSTO.

>>11614827
Martians will either have extremely stale memes, or completely incomprehensible ones

ESA's contribution to the Lunar Gatewat just died on the vine

Some Bluefags or Boingfags tried spread fake news about SpaceX, poor these faggots, they are so hopeless.

>>11614750
>time travel
>time flow
What is time?

>>11614558
they've been peddling this engine concept for decades now and nothing. A few prototypes and that's it. No consumer industry proliferation, no mach 5 passenger jets, no mach 5 military jets, nothing.

So kindly fuck off with this dead end.

>>11614826
Literally the Vulcan.

>>11614862
I don't think Blue Origin is too worried about SpaceX because they'll always have Bezos Bucks. Boeing should be terrified by SpaceX in regards to the space industry. Hopefully once Starship flies, Boeing's contribution to the SLS gets heavily scrutinized.

>>11614834
/comfygif/ poster?

>>11614873
>I don't think Blue Origin is too worried about SpaceX because they'll always have Bezos Bucks
Also Amazon is working on a Starlink competitor and will be launching on BO if they ever make any rockets.

>>11614869
I don't recall the Vulcan being able to deliver 4 million pounds to space.

>>11614826
Pretty much every meme technology packed into one, would have worked great for farming grants

>>11614877
New Glenn's debut launch is next year so hopefully it starts flying soon. SpaceX does need some competition imo.

>>11614841
Who says an SSTO can even provide more throughput? Payloads need to be installed into launch vehicles, which will be the time bottleneck. I doubt restacking a reusable two stage vehicle would take so much longer to recycle for launch that it would make SSTO vehicles more attractive.

>>11614894
We're very lucky SpaceX is is intrinsically motivated to push the boundaries without real competitors, because New Glenn isn't cutting it.

>>11614918
This

>>11614902
I feel like in terms of dragging humans and small cargo that can be thrown in a cargo bay with a crane would be faster than vertically integrating an upper stage to a re-usable booster. Though In terms of humans you just have to buckle them up, refill the SSTO with gas, and give the heat shield a once over. Small cargo similarly, seems to benefit from its turnaround time.

>>11614918
It is fortunate, but I'm worried about when the leadership change inevitably happens and the new head might realize "hey, since we don't have any real competitors we don't have to try so hard to make lots of money".

>>11614518

>>11614937
Is пocaдкa lander? Funny how the labels are in cyrillic but the chart isn't

>>11614944
span
entry into orbit
landing
rover

successful
unsuccessful

Methylococcus capsulatus Bacteria makes a fat and protein rich smear food and it feeds off methane that can be sourced from biodigested shit. Salmon like it and it tastes like a bland vegamite
Throw some herbs and spices from the hyroponics and it might make a good sauce for a Martian grasshopper burger
>>11614826
THICC

>>11614715
not just soupy-MOVING

at the density down there a velocity that on earth would be a gentle breeze has enough energy to swat around houses like nothing.

it's a nightmare that we won't have rovers for for like 70 years if ever. Give it up. Venus is a total meme.

>>11615000
We’ll conquer it eventually. We will conquer everything.

>>11614989
>feeds off methane
>Sabatier to feed your engines, sabatier to feed yourselves
I love it.

>>11614989
Mushrooms will probably be a major food source-easy to grow, protein rich, don't even need light.

A layer of mushrooms on composting waste which is further used to feed a hydroponics system packed with veggies and bioreactors that can be used to produce all kinds of useful chemicals. And the plants will also let you take some of the burden off of mechanical CO2 scrubbers and will help with morale with all the fresh food people will get.

>>11614989
>>11615012
>>11615025
>Methane feeds bacteria
>Bacteria feeds fish and shrimp
>Fish shit feeds plants
>Plant greens feed grasshoppers
>Unused bio matter feed mushrooms and methanogenic bacteria
>All of that feeds you
*Muffled Circle of life in the distance*

>>11615000
>Venus is a total meme.
Fair enough. Here's an interesting question. If you can change one thing about Venus to not make it a meme without changing it's climate, then what would it be?

>>11615058
Switch its orbit with the asteroid belt

>>11614923
>I feel like in terms of dragging humans and small cargo that can be thrown in a cargo bay with a crane would be faster than vertically integrating an upper stage to a re-usable booster.
I mean, SpaceX wants to be able to support a fleet of 10 Starships for every single Booster, with a turnaround time for each Starship of one or two days (waiting for orbits to cross over the landing site). This means they're targeting between 2.4 hours and 4.2 hours between every launch, which necessarily must include stacking the Booster onto the launch pad, stacking the Starship onto the Booster, integrating payload, etc. They obviously must be thinking about ways of making this possible; one idea I can come up with off the top of my head is to integrate every payload onto an adapter that can quickly and easily attach to Starship, rather than modern methods where the payload is directly integrated onto the upper stage.

>>11615066
What would change if that were the case?

>>11615091
Jesus. They want to launch a starship every 4 hours? How much methane are they planning on storing?

>>11615094
It would not get as much radiation from the sun and would slowly cool off
Then we swoop in for the kill

Once we get a ship with rotational gravity, we should send chickens to mars ASAP. Those fuckers are such a great source of food and fertilizer. The boost to morale would be massive if martians could sit down for some roasted chicken for supper.

>>11615126
>Murdering innocent animals

>>11615135
chickens are far from innocent

>>11615154
Anything that isn’t a moral agent can never be anything but innocent.

>>11615058
Give Venus a Moon roughly half as massive as our own Moon.

Venus' moon would be the destination, and Venus' atmosphere would be our braking pad for entering the system.

>>11615157
they know what they did

>>11615107
Not much, they plan on burning it actually.

Also this is just the number of Starships per booster, they want to make many many Boosters all with their own fleet of Starships.

>>11615126
They're a great source of novel influenza viruses too.

>>11615169
Dude, no. Raising chickens is very safe. Hundreds of thousands do it yearly in the USA with no problems. Any animals taken to space will be vetted and isolated beforehand. >>11615135
ah, but what if the only chickens that are cooked are older ones that are being painlessly euthanized after pleasant,predator-free lives of abundance and peace? would you be okay with it then my vegan friend?

The main reason to have chickens is of course the eggs-you get waaaaaaaaaaay more out of that then the meat, which would be more of a special treat.

reminder that the soviets were the first and only ones to ever touch venus.

>>11615197
and what did they get for it? like two pictures

>>11615201
true, they got nothing, they wanted to be too advanced for their time and thought they could do the impossible.

>>11615179
>my vegan friend?
I'm not vegan. I've personally raised and killed rabbits for meat, and I eat meat ranging from what's been hunted wild and what's been factory farmed. Regardless, it's a fact that you don't want chickens in your habitat, or really any terrestrial farm animal, at least until your habitat is really really big and can handle cleaning up the odorous gasses that those animals produce before they can permeate the place.

>>11615197
>he forgot about the American probe that accidentally survived on the surface for about an hour

>>11615214
made up stories by the CIA

>>11615212
>I’m a sociopath and murder animals even though I have no need to

Cringe

>>11615219
You bet.

>>11615179
>ah, but what if the only chickens that are cooked are older ones that are being painlessly euthanized after pleasant,predator-free lives of abundance and peace? would you be okay with it then my vegan friend?

Not unless they died naturally. In principle, I’m fine with eating the colonists too.

>>11615212
based

>>11615135
>>11615219
>Of course there is a need. z0rg (pbuh) requires sacrifices.

Falcon 9 legs must be bigger than that Jeff's little dildo
lol

>>11615223
Natural deaths are often agonizing affairs that involve days or weeks of suffering-to not kill an ailing animal painlessly is immoral.

>>11615205
nobody knew it was impossible until they tried, anon

>>11615246
>Natural deaths are often agonizing affairs that involve days or weeks of suffering

Okay go kill terminally ill cancer patients.

>>11615261
sorry, it's illegal due to pussies like you
except in one of the Scandinavian countries, I forget which one

>>11615270
>except in one of the Scandinavian countries

People can ask to be killed in various places. Keyword. Ask

>>11615275
>people can ask to be killed in various places
I know of only one

>>11615276
Australia, Belgium, Canada, Colombia, Luxembourg, Netherlands, and some US states.
“Progressive” people hate life and don’t value life, so it’s only natural they’d legalize assisted suicide.

>>11615295
are you fucking telling me that they're almost done with the NEXT one?

>>11615295
How is this thing controlled? Is there a computer somewhere?

>>11615301
yeah, it's nestled in with the batteries above the top (methane) tank
that space is basically useless for anything else

>>11615303
I assume there’s wires that snake along on the inside of the tanks which control various mechanisms, then? Like the engines and the wing control surfaces

>>11615296
They haven't put together any of the parts yet, but they have all the bits, yes.

>>11615296
1915 Germany could build a pre-R (super)zeppelin in six weeks, and that was with a complete clusterfuck going on with the state of the program. We've progressed a lot in 105 years, you know.
t. researching Zeppelin electronic countermeasures for a paper due tomorrow and /sfg/ is distracting me

>>11615308
outside of the tanks, either on a dorsal raceway or underneath the chines on either side

>>11615317
jesus wept

>>11615295
Man these welds are starting to look nice. Do they even have the planisher set up yet?

>>11615355
No, not even using the special 30x steel

>>11615355
>Do they even have the planisher set up yet?
I don't believe they do. Elon said they didn't last time he was asked, which was a few days ago.

>>11615321
I don’t know what a “dorsal raceway” or “chines” are desu. I assume a “dorsal raceway” is some sort of small structure used to shield wires from being harmed, like you see sometimes in offices where they’re under rubber, and that chines are the metal plates that surround the fuel tanks that we see externally.

>>11615427
a "dorsal raceway" would be a small bit of whatever to shield the wires from being harmed, specifically positioned as far away from the windward side as possible in the center of the leeward side (the top side)
Chines are little structures that extend off of the flaps and are welded to the tanks
they would serve aerodynamic functions as well instead of strictly being there to service the wires

>>11615427
>and that chines are the metal plates that surround the fuel tanks that we see externally.
The metal plates you see externally ARE the tanks. Putting the tanks inside a tube would be a waste of mass. Instead both tanks use a single cylindrical wall and are separated by a common (single layer) bulkhead, with caps on both ends to enclose the inside.

Oh shit Elon did it again with the Twittering
I’ll see you all in my fanboy bunker when this blows over

The madlad is on a tear.

>>11614518

>>11615514
Why does she have a 2x4 through her head?

>>11615513
desu the whole uncertainty with the death rates, causes of deaths, actual infection rates, all suggest that we got something seriously wrong with covid19. If it was actually legit bad enough for us to tank the economy in response, why is there still all of this hubbub?

>>11615513
Based Elon fuck quarantine
I’ve never worn a mask and go outside every day to tool around in my car

>>11615303
This question isn't limited to Starship, but is there significant lag caused by the distance between the computers and the engines? Kinda like how humans lag, which is why reflexes are a thing.

>>11615525
Electrical signals travel at significant percentages of the speed of light

>>11614944
Original.
Don't recall that any new Mars mission have been announced since 2019, but ExoMars has been delayed from 2020 (old news).

>>11615525
no

>>11615534
>all those soviet/russian missions
and people say america is the best at space...

>>11615549
look at how many were successful, lol

>>11615522
good, keep at it, fight the mask cabal. Masks are useless outside
>only one instance of outdoor transmission — involving two men talking together in the village of Shangqiu, Henan province — was found among our 7,324 identified cases in China with sufficient descriptions.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.04.20053058v1

>>11615549
>15 full or partial failures out of 19 attempts
gg Russians, gg.

>>11615513
o shit what are you doing

Bump

>>11615179
>ah, but what if the only chickens that are cooked are older ones
Old chicken is stringy and chewy.

>>11615566
And that's before Elon lands a Starship on Mars. Imagine how crazy popular the HD landing footage will be once it gets sent back to Earth.

>>11615861
Can’t wait to drop the tykes in front of the TV and point at it when that happens

>>11615066
Nah, switch it with Mars... or maybe a 3-way with the asteroids to Mars orbit.

>>11615126
Imagine chickens in a low-gravity or micro-gravity environment. Their wings would actually be useful. They could even get to be a real pain in the ass, especially when they poop in zero-g.

>>11616007
>Imagine chickens in a low-gravity or micro-gravity environment. Their wings would actually be useful

On Titan, you could pull off cartoon bullshit like attaching wings to your arms and flapping them really hard to fly.

>>11616007
I wonder how all the nitrogen compounds in chicken shit would react to the perchlorates in Martian soil.

>>11615223
>>11615800
If they die naturally, they weren't healthy enough to eat safely anyhow.

>>11615503
>Instead both tanks use a single cylindrical wall and are separated by a common (single layer) bulkhead
And that's something you can't do with hydrolox, because the LH2 could freeze the oxygen. I've learned that chunks of frozen oxygen bumping around are a bad thing. LOX and LCH4 have similar temperature ranges, no problem.

>>11615522
row row, fight da powah
I've got all sort of bits ready to make a mask in an hour or two if I have to, but requiring masks in general (as opposed to, say, just employees) is total bullshit to make things look scarier for the normeifags. We've got some really pissed off lefty mayors down here in Texas now that based Governor Hotwheels is nixing mask requirements.

>>11615525
It's like a nanosecond per six inches or something. Look for a video of Grace Hopper holding up a wire and explaining what kind of delay it has. Also, twisted pair Ethernet specifically is rated for 100 meters.

>>11615053
>>11615025
>>11615012
>>11614989
ESA is working on bio-based ECLSS (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/253263459_Melissa_The_European_project_of_a_closed_life_support_system).). Not sure if NASA if doing the same kind of things.

>>11616012
On a colony shit is gold, letting it leech out is throwing good nutrients to the wind. So you wouldn't really find out.

>>11615527
so does my fist you fuckin nerd

>>11614521

>>11614518
Alright /sfg/, when will starships begin to replace traditional rockets and when will it become both financially viable and literally possible to move to other planets? Really wish I could live somewhere other than this gay earth in my lifetime

>>11616102
Mars will be gay too bro.
you cant escape the jew

>>11616103
What if I decide to live on a gas planet

>>11616102
>when will starships replace traditional rockets
never. oldspace is incredibly good at lobbying and creating a market for itself with the government. Starship will create an entirely new market, while paradoxically SLS will still exist

>when will it become both financially viable and literally possible to move to other planets?
30 years to live in a tin can, 50 for any comparable lifestyle to a poor person on earth

>>11616113
Living on Mars would be fucking rad.

>>11616116
well good news you can live the exact same lifestyle right now! just subsist off bugs and recycled feces in a sealed tube in the antarctic for the rest of your life

>>11616130
The antarctic sounds kickass too but not as kickass as Mars. It’s just a bunch of ice whereas Mars has beautiful geology just laying around. My rock collection will be magnificent.

>>11616135
if you just want rocks i can sell you some really cool ones at half the price of a ticket to mars

>>11616112
You can gas yourself on earth.

>>11616130
Reminder that comparing Antarctica to Mars is a logical fallacy and you can fuck off.

>>11616137
They’re not Martian rocks, though, so they’re not as cool. Just imagine the hematite formations and the lava tubes.

>>11616130
the antarctic doesn't let you do 0.3g volleyball or dune racing

>>11616142
yeah you're right antarctica has a breathable atmosphere, livable air pressure and water ice everywhere, no environmental radiation that'll give you cancer, as well as higher temps than mars, it's way better.
i'm really pro-mars but you have to be honest about the challenges that come with colonising it. If we do go, it'll easily be the least livable place we've ever been.

Public Notice of Cameron County Order to Temporarily Close State Highway 4 and Boca Chica Beach
Primary Date May 1, 2020 9:00 p.m. – 6:00 a.m. Closure Scheduled
Backup Date May 2, 2020 9:00 p.m. – 6:00 a.m. Closure Scheduled
Backup Date May 3, 2020 9:00 p.m. – 6:00 a.m. Closure Scheduled

>>11616152
Its also been illegal to colonise Antarctica for a very long time. If you scrapped the treaty and said go ahead, colonise and claim that shit, make your own states, you would have settlements inside a year. Its a totally invalid comparison.

>>11615427
>the metal plates that surround the fuel tanks
Those actually are the walls of the tank itself.

>>11616180
Time for static braaaptor fire testing.

>>11616152
> i'm really pro-mars but you have to be honest about the challenges that come with colonising

Ehhhhhh it’s fine. Ill start a prayer group and check out rocks and read books,

>>11616152
And if you had a nearby planet where Earth polar conditions predominated, we'd have that shit colonized in months, lmao. "Wahh it's harder than something that isn't actually that hard" good. Humanity needs challenge to feel purpose

>>11616187
eh, I don't know if I buy this. I think there would maybe be a resort or something, but I don't think anyone would actually be eager to colonize Antarctica in any meaningful way.

>>11616228
The amount of people desperate to fuck off their governments but have nowhere to start is huge, don't know if you have been paying attention.

>>11616232
yeah, like all the people who said they would move to canada if trump got elected...

>>11616228
>but I don't think anyone would actually be eager to colonize Antarctica in any meaningful way.

Thousands of people already live there just at research stations.

>>11616228
the Antarctic is a giant lump of untapped resources protected by treaty. If it were legal to strip mine it it would be swarmed

>>11616238
Yeah that’s all well and good until we run into Shoggoths

>>11615377
Wtf are they doing to the nose segments, are they trying to polish it?

>>11616235
"thousands" — google says 1106
>>11616238
you don't call offshore oil rigs "settlements"
sending workers temporarily to handle machinery is a completely different setup than permanent settlement. Nobody would move to Antarctica to start a family.

Starlink news

https://www.spacex.com/news/2020/04/28/starlink-update

>SpaceX is launching Starlink to provide high speed, low latency broadband connectivity across the globe, including to locations where internet has traditionally been too expensive, unreliable, or entirely unavailable. We also firmly believe in the importance of a natural night sky for all of us to enjoy, which is why we have been working with leading astronomers around the world to better understand the specifics of their observations and engineering changes we can make to reduce satellite brightness.

>>11616255
> "thousands" — google says 1106

4000 in the summer. 1000 in winter.

>>11616254
Probably had a lot of spatter. Can't have that shit, so they have to go over with a lamell disc.

>>11616234
Oh look another false comparison.

>>11616255
>you don't call offshore oil rigs "settlements"
lmao. that oil will never be worth drilling. it's the vast, very-much-on-shore, metal reserves
>Nobody would move to Antarctica to start a family.
if you were extracting resources for any protracted period of time towns would absolutely spring up around it. that's just what people do.

>>11616255
>Nobody would move to Antarctica to start a family.

Why not? If there’s jobs, people will throw up living space nearby.

Starship SN5

>>11615513
based, love him even more now, and i am not even american

>>11616289
Shame he deleted them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siJ2SUKLOB8

Boca Chica site 3D model flyover video with explanations

>>11616309
Needs moar sprung tents

>>11616102
Imaging walking at low gravity on mars, hips and ass visibly shaking.
It can't get gayer than that.

>>11616099
>>11614521

is there a live camera from space where we can see the asteroid?

>>11616515
lolno

>>11616517

fucking dumbasses, imagine how much money a pay per view of that thing would make

>>11616523
Oldspace is allergic to cameras or any public attention that isn't tightly controlled.

>>11616528
Remember when SpaceX got in trouble for showing roadster live.

>>11615513
He really is opinionated on things he knows nothing about and people listen to him because he has been successful in completely unrelated fields.
It's a shame so many people that understand the risks will suffer because of those that don't, much like vaccinations.

>>11616523
I can see a probe opening a only fans account.
It would repay the mission just by itself.

>>11616007
Chickens can actually fly on earth, poultry facilities just asymmetrically clip the wing feathers to prevent proper aerodynamic control.

>>11616103
You can if you kill the minecraft villagers coming to mars anon
They aren't gods ya know

>>11616630
That was due to an outdated law that didn't allow exceptions when it should.

>>11616655
That never ends well,see hitler.

>>11616655
Double dubs don't lie
>>11616708
>Send an "error" in telemetry to rocketfull of shekelmancers where they're too far from resupply
>"It was an 1 in million error. this place is full of radiation that screws with computers."

why did musk have to speak out
why can't he just advance spaceflight in silence
I hate that the best champion of human spaceflight we have is such a bitch

>>11615515
Grid fins.

>>11616748
That's not what grid fins look like.

>>11616012
That'd just be mixing an oxidizer with an oxidizer.

>>11616731
What are you moaning about now?

>>11615513
He's making a fool of himself, but it's silly seeing people attacking him for saying dumb shit as if they've forgotten that he always says dumb shit.

>>11616837
the fact that this time is clearly motivated by his pending $750M bonus makes it extra bad

>>11616837
You don't need to forget someone is an idiot to give them shit for being an idiot again...

>>11616845
Bonus in stocks that he can't sell for years anyway.

>>11616647
Likely 100+ million will suffer from economic damage due to closure of work/economic downturn. Meanwhile death rate of covid is getting bit underwhelming. Chances are the closure of work is leading to increase in "covid" death because people are abandoning old people, old people cannot survive on their own, people losing jobs and dying, etc.

Best way to combat this is to reopen economy, get the economy working, enforce mask/social distancing during work, get all supplies/food/old people taken care of, give nurses/doctors more rests/equipment from increased supply/labor

>>11616650
>fly
Glide.

>>11616886
I would argue the best way to combat those issues is to abandon neoliberalism in favor of an economic system that can deal with something as preditable as a pandemic without shitting the bed so hard it takes years to recover.
If your system needs perpetual growth to function it's only a matter of time until it stops functioning.

>>11616811
He's upset that a superior mind realizes that severity of prevention measures must be balanced against detrimental economic consequences. That lives are going to be lost either way and the only question is the extent of long-term damage.

>>11616905
I agree with Musk and Trump that the cure can't be worse than the disease, but I can't shake the feeling that the public distaste for him is going to bite him in the ass when he needs it most

>>11616900
Its always a matter of time with capitalism. But because there's a near infinite amount of resource in the universe, and perpetual growth is the only way to make use of those resources, its the best method of advancing civilization/society.

Sure socialism might work out for short term, but it will create stagnation due to lack of incentives. It will lead to corruption due to lack of competition. It will lead to decaying of society due to lack of advancements. It will lead to death of civilization as other civilizations with more advancements/prosperous growth out gun/out man/out think/out smart you in every way.

>>11616925
There's a huge disinfo campaign against him for decade+ anyway, so what's a little red pill from him going to do? Nothing.

>>11616925
>but I can't shake the feeling that the public distaste for him is going to bite him in the ass when he needs it most
Starship landing on Luna or Mars puts that to bed forever.

>>11616937
Neoliberalism isn't the only form of capitalism and socialism and communism aren't the only alternatives.
Even something as simple as caping the highest paid person in a companies pay to 20x the lowest paid would lead to huge pay increases for most and allow them to have saving instead of living hand to mouth in times like these.
>will create stagnation due to lack of incentives
I always hear this but am yet to see any reasoning beyond "dude trust me". Right now monopolies and duopolies have the same effect but no one talks about that.

>>11616957
>Starship landing on Luna or Mars
"And." Eventually. We need both.

>>11616963
>Even something as simple as caping the highest paid person in a companies pay to 20x the lowest paid would lead to huge pay increases
The world works most efficiently top down from the brightest/brilliant/smartest/genius top commanding the grunt bottom mass. This is true for military, its true for economy, its true for governance and true for any efficient organization. When you reduce the incentives for people to rise to the top, it reduces the effectiveness of the organization.

>Neoliberalism isn't the only form of capitalism and socialism and communism aren't the only alternatives.
The world doesn't have many positive examples. There's feudalism or hunter gatherer or scavenging tribal economics.

>>11616973
All musk did was land on moon/mars. ANYONE could have done that. Private companies like SpaceX are leeching off of government subsidies. They're ruining space forever for the rest of us. The money should instead be used to feed the hungry and the poor, and used to combat pandemics here on earth. Space is nothing but a richman's hobby.

-t 2025 time traveller.

>>11616957
it won't if public outcry cucks private space from leaving LEO because planetary protection aligns with their "all things anti-thing/person I don't like"

>>11616985
>The money should instead be used to feed the hungry and the poor
>$20bn vs $1500bn
WHITEY ON DA MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOON

Get the fuck out.

>>11616957
>inb4 Whitey on the Moon remix

>>11616985
>The money should instead be used to feed the hungry and the poor,
Do I have to post the budget statistics?

>>11616985
>>11616992
>>11617000
Anyone who makes that argument should be summarily executed.

>>11616980
>earning ~10x the average wage isn't an insentive
Why not? If you can pay off a house in a 10th the time as most and rent that property out to pay off the second in an 8th the time you can still get very rich, you just can't exploit people and have working poor while you make $8m an hour.

>The world doesn't have many positive examples
See any western nation from 1940 to 1970, not one of them was running neoliberalism and the average man could support a family of 4 while his wife didn't work.

>>11616985
You've misspelled 1975.

>>11617007
Which argument specifically?

>>11617018
"Space is rayciss, gibsmedat."

>>11617018
X could be used for something else argument.

>>11617007
We spend nothing on space and shit gets delayed forever as a result of it. We spend never ending increasing amounts to "feed the hungry and the poor" in all corners of the world. Fuck, we're even sending to China because somehow they're a "developing" country.

But it's never fucking enough, is it? Gotta carve up those few pennies spent on space so every can have a fucking puff on a newport.

>>11617019
Reminder that Elon Musk is literally African American.

>>11617028

He’s also doing the rockets. He likes the rockets. He does good at rockets too by the way.

>>11617012
If you increase the pay of our soldiers by 10x, decrease the general pay/incentives by 10x, you're not going to get a better military. You're going to get a worse military.

If you increase the pay of workers by 10x, they're not going to be more efficient workers. Worker efficiency is already near max. On top of that, machines are moving to replace the workers, so human labor efficiency could even be worse than a machine.

Meanwhile you can either attract joe shlomo as a CEO for $1M per year contract or get Elon Musk as your CEO for $100M per year contract. Who would the company get? Someone with vision/ability/proof of taking multiple companies to multiple billion dollar valuation or some random joe stock from off the street?

>>11617007
I think you misspelled "should be reprocessed into Onions Green"

>>11617042
>You're going to get a worse military
Why? Because only actual patriots are going to work in a military that pays worse than the private sector? That is already the case.

>machines are moving to replace the workers
Nothing is going to stop that, arguing people should work for pay that means they will never own a house because if they don't a machine will take their job is bullshit. Sooner or later that machine is going to be cheaper any man and they will replace people anyway.

>get Elon Musk as your CEO
Elon starts his own companies, he has no interest is working for yours no matter the pay. You will have a hard time finding truely competent buisness leaders that don't run their own company and are looking for a job at yours.

>>11616845
it's not a money bonus, it's a bonus control of Tesla

>>11617042
>machines are moving to replace the workers
Yeah that's a meme. If you've ever worked construction, you'll know that machines are great as long as everything works perfectly.
Guess what, it never does go perfectly. There's always an issue somewhere or something unexpected happened to the material and you need a workaround and then you need a human brain and a pair of human hands to sort it and/or do the job manually.

Been there, done that. Got 200% overtime pay for it many times.

>>11617063
>Why? Because only actual patriots are going to work in a military that pays worse than the private sector? That is already the case.
No because any incentives of staying longer in military for any talented genius would be reduced. People that stay in the military despite lack of incentives are those who are passionate and may possibly have mental issues. Things like patriotism needs heavy dose of reality check. Otherwise, we could get mutiny at every corner due to various different interpretation of patriotism.

>Elon starts his own companies
He didn't start Tesla. He's going to be paid $750 million in bonus for taking Tesla stock high and keeping it there. Elon wants to focus more on SpaceX/others but if push comes to shove, he may step down from Tesla to reduce hassle. Tesla board members don't want him to resign at all. Tesla = Elon Musk. His resignation = huge loss of company. So to keep him, they'll pay him what will be deemed exorbitant amount by the populist but money well spent by Tesla itself.

Tbh I'm looking forward to seeing the butthurt of pseudo humanitarians.

>>11617079
I'm talking a 20 fold pay cap, that means if a gunt is on $50k the top gets $1m, are you sure $1m a year isn't enough? People would leave because only making $1m a year after starting as a grunt is a shit career cap?

>>11617102
>are you sure $1m a year isn't enough

For the Elon Musks of the world, hell no.

1m a year doesn't get you into a position where you can finance something like SpaceX. It also isn't worth your time. He could probably make more money than that just on speaking fees.

>>11617102
$1m isn't nearly enough to attract top talent. Unless you plan on enforcing that $1m cap all across the globe, which is impossible, someone else will bid higher for the talented CEO and snatch them or worse, they could state their own company and compete directly against your company. Now you're fucked.

>>11617102
Listen, you dumb fucking communist, it's not about morality or "should be enough." It's about "can I make more money applying my skills in some different place?" And if the answer is yes, you're going to struggle to retain talent because those people will make the rational decision to make more money doing other things.

>>11617114
You are acting like the only money you can make is what your pay check is. Give me 1m a year for 10 years and I'm going to have more than 10m at the end of the decade.

>>11617115
That was specifically a military example, if you are willing to pay the lowest paid in your company 200k you get 4m ect.
Hell make it 50x limit, I'm just sick of seeing neoliberalism take nations where a man could support a family and own a house on his pay alone become places where in the coming decades most will never own a house.

>>11617116
See above, if you can think of another way to stop the accelerating wealth devide I'm all ears.

>>11617143
>if you can think of another way to stop the accelerating wealth devide
Blow it out your ass.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rv5t6rC6yvg

>>11617151
Thanks for proving my point, the last decade wifes didn't need to work.

>>11617143
>That was specifically a military example
We don't even need to go hypotheticals on military because right now, military is struggling to attract and retain top talent because their pay is so low and can't compete with commercial entities.

>>11617143
>Give me 1m a year for 10 years and I'm going to have more than 10m at the end of the decade.

That's another reason your idea is dumb.

You can make way, way more than 1m a year trading stocks.

This would accelerate financialization, because all the talent would go into the stock market.

>See above, if you can think of another way to stop the accelerating wealth devide I'm all ears

Just do what Scandinavia did. Unions + strong social safety net + strongly progressive income tax.

If they had less minorities it'd be a perfect system.

>>11617160
The bottom pay is so shit they can't get people, not the top.

>>11617164
Because private sector economy is stronger than military incentives. That's the problem. Whatever cap you implement, if its not universally across the whole universe, someone else will snatch those recruits.

>>11617159
That's an immigration problem and an affirmative action problem, moron. Housing is expensive because the US imports a million poopskins every year and jobs don't pay enough because women are in the workforce in order to try and overcome that problem. Stop immigration, deport a few tens of millions of those that should never have arrived, and end affirmative action, and watch all the married women start staying home. My grandfather was an enlisted soldier and was able to provide for my grandmother, father, and aunt all on his own because land was cheap and immigration wasn't flooding the country. Then his generation voted for the disastrous policies of the 1960s and that all went straight to hell.

>>11617143
>if you can think of another way to stop the accelerating wealth devide I'm all ears.

Then just raise taxes on everyone and use them to fund social programs? All this talk about pay limits is commie bullshit. Large private capital is crucial for advancement of humanity. Heck, there would be no SpaceX without it.

>>11617162
>Just do what Scandinavia did. Unions + strong social safety net + strongly progressive income tax.
No. Don't do what we did. It's fucking shit here. No innovation, almost all new "jobs" are in public sector. Infrastructure that rots because we can't afford to spend money internally in the country in fear of inflation. Bloated budgets to pay for it and 80%+ of your paycheck makes its way back to the state to pay for all this "free" shit.

And unions are on the way out. Construction sector is fucking dead, it's all been shipped to Asia. The job I used to do is now done at Hyundai docks in SK. Do not fucking emulate us.

>>11617174
this

>>11617172
What I'm proposing would increase the pay for recruits at the expence of those in the pentigon. As for them going elseware good luck leaving the penigon and taking a high ranking job in another military without commiting "suicide".

>>11617174
If the average man was getting the kind of money your grandad was big families would still be a thing meaning you would still have a influx of labor.

>>11617178
I have given up on the idea of higher tax brackets under neoliberalism as it has been proposed and shot down so mant times. That is why I think we need a new economic system to fix those issues.

>>11617174
Dont confuse legal immigration via skilled workers/legitimate refugees and the illegal unskilled workers from mexico. The problem is illegal Mexicans flooding the low skilled market and destroying the semi-lucrative low skilled jobs for Americans. Legal immigrants are contributing properly, growing the market, increasing productivity, with innovations and such etc.

>>11617195
>Dont confuse legal immigration via skilled workers/legitimate refugees and the illegal unskilled workers from mexico.
Right, the legal immigrants are worse. They camp out at the top of the skill tree and depress wages for everyone else.

>>11617194
>What I'm proposing would increase the pay for recruits at the expence of those in the pentigon. As for them going elseware good luck leaving the penigon and taking a high ranking job in another military without commiting "suicide".
So you're sacrificing the future for the shortterm. That's the problem of socialism as highlighted in >>11616937

>>11617198
So you are just looping back to "no incentive to innovate, dude trust me"?
I'm not talking about everyone getting equal pay, I'm not talking about UBI, I'm talking about limiting growing wealth to the point a single person can buy all housing in a state and basically have surfdom.

>>11617194
You seem to have missed the rest of my post where I explained how to do that without commie bullshit.

>>11617211
>So you are just looping back to "no incentive to innovate, dude trust me"?
Yes because you didn't address how you'll fix the lack of incentives other than "muh patriotism" in military. You weaseled out of economy and went to military. You're not getting anywhere with your argument. You're not presenting any fleshed out arguments. Just running around and moving goalposts everywhere I'm pointing out the issues.

>>11617212
Taxes? Name the last POTUS that increased tax of the wealthy.
If your answer is tax the poor then how does that help stop them being poor?

I see lots of boomers wonder why the younger generations have a problem with neoliberalism and the answer is simple, as a "boom" generation they have controlled the vote since their 20s.
When they were 20 they asked for higher minimum wage and got it, when they were 30 they wanted cheaper housing and got it, now they are determined to keep the minimum wage low and housing prices high because they have employees and investment properties they can afford because of the advantages they voted for when they were young.
This shit just pisses me off and I want to see a future where once again a man can enter the workforce without a diploma and support a large family.
For the /pol/aks out there THIS IS WHY WE ARE BEING OUTBREED.

>>11617230
Ok I see your point. So I'll give a quick rundown of the changes I would like to see.
>currency stagflation so saving retain value
>nationalisation of resources on government land, you own the land you own the resources
>economic protectionism
>limits of property ownership to stop a single person pricing millions out of the market
>a minimum wage higher than the cost of living including rent

>>11617248
>dude just tax the rich XD
First of all, income taxes fall on the middle and upper middle classes rather than the truly wealthy. The rich get rich on capital gains, but that's also how companies grow, so raising capital gains taxes always backfires in a world where the Internet exists.

Secondly, it's pretty clear you're a high schooler or an undergrad who just wandered in to the threads, so kindly fuck off back from whence you came.

>>11617178
>Large private capital
It normally displays a huge flaw of being short-sighted. Large businesses don't think beyond a few decades and have rather narrow perspective when concerning anything not directly involving revenue. As in pretty much any large business will be happy to strip-mine something for two decades even if it leads to long-term market oversaturation afterwards or the environmental damage will require greater cleanup investments than the profit generated by mining.
I'm not a PETAphile and I hate commies with a passion, I'm talking about legacies and at least trying to not slow down civilization from one's mere several decade activities.
I'm essentially talking about mindsets that would generally go "investing into spaceflight? That's retarded, I'll not live to see ROI" in pre-SpaceX times.

>>11617248
>Ok I see your point. So I'll give a quick rundown of the changes I would like to see. ....
And I'd like to see world peace, become super saiyan, immortal, have harem of sexy anime girls, etc. But how are you going to get there. Just stating your goals/wishes isn't going to do anything and doesnt help your argument. You have to present your idea in fully fleshed out ways. Account for potential issues, fixes/workarounds, account for issues for those aswell, and so on until you come to an acceptable way.

>>11617256
If you are so much better educated than me on economics I'll take this opertunity to learn from you.
Why is inflation required and if it's to stop wealth hording why has it failed?

Can SpaceX board kick Elon Musk from the company? I'm tired to see he acts like retard on Twitter.

>>11617266
>Why is inflation required
It's not.

Also holy shit get a spell checker you retard.

>>11617268
kys

>>11617268
Probably not, and if they could then the company most likely wouldn't. He's their hype machine and he does it for free.

>>11617256
>The rich get rich on capital gains, but that's also how companies grow, so raising capital gains taxes always backfires in a world where the Internet exists

What if you just taxed earnings from capital gains at the same (progressive) rate you taxed earnings from salary?

>>11617004
Anon, even if the entire budget of nasa was tree fiddy, they still would be complaining that it was too much.
haven't you learned anything about these people?

>>11617280
>What if you just taxed earnings from capital gains at the same (progressive) rate you taxed earnings from salary?
Nobody would ever bother investing more than about 50k in one place and the economy would collapse. Good job, retard.

>>11617164
that's because they can't promote people above a certain point (give them a pay raise above a certain point) before they end up generals

>>11617268
Only after Amazon kicks out Bezos.

>>11617288
>E1 pay is shit because they get raises over time
Just increase the base pay for a day 1 E1.

>>11617297
Trump did a couple years ago.

>>11617282
Then I say screw it and put a golden statue of Trump on the moon.

Cut the non spaceflight shit. This came out today. Anybody gone through the entire thing? Anything interesting? My skimming just saw evidence SpaceX BTFOing oldspace.
https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR4200/RR4251/RAND_RR4251.pdf

>>11617299
>first pay raise in a decade
>3%
I'm talking about a raise larger than inflation.

>>11617304
what is it?

>>11616985
The irony of this idiocy is that the welfare budget dwarfs NASA's budget.

>>11617311
There are so many fucking people in DoD that by definition no pay raise will ever be meaningfully more than inflation.

>>11617304
Goofy-low claims about how much money ULA is getting from the Government.

strong wind damaged a ring..

>>11617314
Seeing there has been 18% inflation from 2010 to 2020 it would have been nice if their first raise since 2010 was 18% instead of a 6th of that.

>>11617314
more like pay raise will cause inflation lmao

>>11617329
Bingo.

>>11617322
>don't scrap
SCRAP IT

>>11617304
>the US share of the addressable launch market is likely to fall
Excuse me what? Are they just ignoring Starship?

>>11617322
>(
into the trash it goes

>>11617329
As long as pay rise is higher than inflation, it will be fine for the bottom end.

If pay rate increased from $10/h to $20/h and inflation increased only 50%, that's still good for the low end workers. Even 100% increase inflation only means its neutral.

>>11617092
Pseudo humanitarians, flat earthers, religious fundamentalists, moon landing deniers... the list of people it pisses off is almost as valuable as the accomplishment itself.

>>11617338
You really don't understand anything about anything. Lurk the fuck more.

>>11617312
>The annual number of launches worldwide grew to 71 in 2018 from 47 in 1998, but the commercial portion over which launch firms compete addressable share—stayed steady at around 20 launches; today, the addressable share represents only 35 percent of the total market.
>This market is likely to see only moderate growth over the next ten years, and the U.S. share of this market is likely to fall. The net result is that the addressable share of the launch market is unlikely to support more than one U.S. supplier of launch services focused on commercial heavy lift.
>In many conceivable futures, the USAF’s current acquisition plan is unlikely to provide sufficient near-term supply of NSS-certified launch vehicles.
>Supporting three U.S. launch service providers in the short term might increase the probability of global supplier consolidation but decrease the probability of additional foreign competition.
>Make prudent preparations for a future with only two U.S. NSS-certified heavy lift launch providers, at least one of which might have little support from the commercial marketplace.
So it seems like there is a concern that lifters for the USAF might experience a crush economically, and preparations should be made to keep at least two alive.

>>11617283
>Nobody would ever bother investing more than about 50k in one place

Define.

Because I was thinking capital gains earnings as a whole, not capital gains earnings per location invested in.

>>11617349
it's literally just an excuse to give money to ULA

>>11617349
I think we are at the start of an actual depression so I wouldn't be surprised if commercial launches slowed for a few years and older networks were kept in service longer than planned.

>>11617360
The fact that they're ignoring Starship's implications for launch cost and cadence is a pretty fucking big red flag in that regard, yes.

>>11617359
>Because I was thinking capital gains earnings as a whole, not capital gains earnings per location invested in.
Oh good, that will just destroy investment in general. Kill yourself.

>>11617360
Surely that is in no way related to the 3 airforce officials that now work for ULA as "advisors" but don't need to turn up to get paid.

>>11617363
>destroy investment in general
Yes, if people go from making 20m on a trade and paying 0% tax to paying 20% tax and only pocketing 16m it's totally not worth investing at all.
I mean what can you even do with 16m?

<New GAO report
>Additional cost growth and schedule delays are likely after NASA establishes a new launch date for Artemis I—an uncrewed test flight of the Space Launch System, Orion crew capsule, and associated ground systems.
https://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-20-405

This shit is getting out of control.

>>11616034
>And that's something you can't do with hydrolox
You can, but the wall needs insulation. The 2nd stage of the Saturn V had a common bulkhead separating the hydrogen from the oxygen, they needed to hire surfboard manufacturers to get the insulation to stop delaminating.

https://twitter.com/RocketLab/status/1255567765995319296
>We've rolled Electron out at LC-2 in Virginia for the 1st time! We're gearing up for our 1st mission from U.S. soil - a dedicated mission in partnership with the Department of Defense’s Space Test Program & the Space and Missile Systems Center’s Small Launch and Targets Division.
>Our team carried out integrated systems tests to verify launch systems on Electron and on the ground systems at LC-2. Tests included raising Electron vertical, activating & tuning pad fluid systems, power and comms checkouts, plus RF testing with the range.

>>11617377
>getting
I swear the only reason ULA is retiring the Delta is for RnD shekels.

>>11617379
>hey needed to hire surfboard manufacturers to get the insulation to stop delaminating.
Why isn't this a more popular bit of history? NASA SURFS TO THE MOON ON AN EXPLODING BOARD THE SIZE OF A SKYSCRAPER would have been an incredible headline.

>>11617379
>>11617389
There is a great interview with one of the project managers talking about how when the surf was good none of the board makers would turn up.
It was a mix of "fucking hippies" and "good for them".

>>11617363
>be fantastically wealthy
>make billions of dollars off of stock market
>pay 35% maximum tax bracket on it
>make 35% of billions of dollars

I'm not seeing how this would make investment not worth it.

I mean, it'd discourage foreign investment, and encourage people not to sell if they've already made a lot of money that year so they don't get bumped into a higher tax bracket, and a bunch of shit like that, but I don't see how it'd kill investment.

>>11617386
Ah yes this was the failed scud like mission.
its like they can transport it anywhere but launch it after two months.
impressive

>>11617388
Nah, it's because the Falcon Heavy ate its lunch so badly. Three times the payload for less money.

>>11617392
That's because you don't understand on what thin margins a lot of investments happen. Lurk moar.

>>11617377
They wont even deliver,this is flat out stealing money and nobody does shit about it

>>11617391
kek nice

>>11617393
To be fair they were expected to launch from the arctic circle and there is a bit of history of rockets not liking extreme cold.
I honestly think that location was chosen to make sure it failed.

>>11617400
>Falcon Heavy ate its lunch so badly
Does that even matter for the DOD? It's still got to be cheaper to keep the Delta in service than give ULA $200B and 15 years to replace it with something even more expensive.

>>11617377
"Since GAO last reported on the
portfolio in May 2019, cost growth was approximately 31 percent over project
baselines—the third consecutive year that cost growth has worsened after a
period of decline. The average launch delay was 12 months, compared to 13
months last year."

And that's just the opening paragraph.
Tempted to go to /biz/ to borrow pink wojaks at this rate.

>>11617410
please don't post any pink wojaks

>>11617410
Honestly I'm tempted to buy some Boeing stock not because they are competent or likely to make profit but because the single largest bailout in history has to be going to them any day now.

>>11617409
It matters for every customer BUT DoD. If ULA was keeping the Delta IV Heavy alive just for DoD they'd overcharge them for it even compared to their usual usurious rates. I honestly suspect it's a wash.

>>11617409
the Vulcan can do every mission that the Delta could do

>>11617425
Boing! already turned down bailout money because the feds had the temerity to ask for an ownership stake like they did GM.

https://www.fitsnews.com/2020/03/24/boeing-bailout-ceo-rejects-government-ownership-stake/

>>11617377
>Further, in 2019,GAO found that the Space Launch System (SLS) and Orion programs have underreported cost growth.
>Our analysis shows that NASA’s cost and schedule performance is expected to deteriorate as a result of several factors, including likely Artemis I delays and understated cost growth for the Orion and SLS programs.
>The project (JWST) recently conducted a cost and schedule analysis, which indicated a 12 percent confidence level in achieving the current committed launch date of March 2021.
>NASA had planned to conduct the uncrewed demonstration of Artemis I in June 2020, but after a series of delays the agency is currently reevaluating this date. The Orion program is currently planning to be ready for an Artemis I launch as early as November 2020, although this launch date is likely to be delayed, according to NASA.

>>11617443
the ride never ends lmao

>>11617437
At that point I would let them go under, buy everything at the auction and gift it too Sierra Nevada just to prove that "too big to fail" is a dead meme.

>>11617443
That wasn't me >>11617410, honestly.

>November 2020
Yeah and I'm king of fucking China.

>>11617456
But the jobs and key contractors!

>>11617464
Sierra Nevada would be hiring.

>>11617443
SLS = Shekel Loss System

>>11616898
Chickens fly just fine, if you ever fucking saw one in real life maybe you'd know.

>>11617075
Yep. The best case scenario is that over time the number of machines that can be feasibly managed per person will increase.

>>11617322
Funny how this would cause a complete shut down and two month process review in order to find the root cause of why the ring fell down if this were any other space organization (except for the Russian ones).

>>11617377
>>11617410
>>11617443
This is literally just a compilation of past reports, there’s nothing new here, why did you post it?

>>11617522
>Funny how this would cause a complete shut down and two month process review in order to find the root cause of why the ring fell down if this were any other space organization (except for the Russian ones).
Funny how SpaceX and Roscosmos are the only ones building actual human rated rockets anymore.

>>11617522
Oldspace wouldn't do that though. Instead they would perform a study on the best way to find the root cause first, thus doubling the amount of profit gained from the process.

>>11616963
>would lead to huge pay increases for most
It doesn't follow that a salary cap would lead to anyone else's salary being increased. The actual amount divided by employee would be tiny. In 2019, Walmart's CEO had total compensation of 23.6 million USD, for a ~1,000 to 1 median worker salary ratio. Divided by Walmart's 2 million each employees, each employee would receive ~12 dollars.
> am yet to see any reasoning beyond "dude trust me".
Other than the obligatory look at the Soviet economy, without competition and some benefit to the innovator (growth), there is no reason to devote effort to innovation, rather than just increasing one's consumption. There is no mechanism that makes it highly attractive for anyone else, let alone the majority of a field, to adopt any innovations.
>monopolies and duopolies have the same effect but no one talks about that.
People and major news sources/opinion pieces constantly complain about those.

>>11617489
Yeah, about 1 meter off the ground.

>>11617489
Not the most common breeds, which are too heavy to even walk correctly, let alone fly briefly like the small breeds.

>>11617012
>not one of them was running neoliberalism
That economic system depended on specific circumstances which no longer exist and couldn't be brought back. The boom (and that system did require constant growth) was over almost everywhere industrialised by the 1970s. Japan kept it going longer by increasingly tenuous financial games, but even they had to abandon it.

>>11616260
>paint Earth-facing side with Vantablack or similar
>if that would cause heating issues then it can just be Vantablack painted sheild

>>11617409
>bit of history of rockets not liking extreme cold.
How about the chilled ones?

>>11617574
>employee would receive ~12 dollars
And $1 per hour more for every $20 per hour the CEO wanted to make. I think base wages would increase to fuel the greed of those on top.
>look at the Soviet economy
Despite being nepotism embodied they won every step of the space race until the US set a more distant goal.
>There is no mechanism that makes it highly attractive
Invent thing, patent thing, sell thing. You can still make 20x your lowest paid employee and for just about every small business owner that would already be the case.

>>11617601
>he thinks CEOs get paid an hourly wage
Kill yourself.

>>11617604
>he can't divide a salary
Why are you making this seem harder than it is?

>>11617609
>thinking CEOs mostly get paid in salary

>>11617194
>What I'm proposing would increase the pay for recruits at the expence of those in the pentigon
Those are government employees. You can't reduce salary like that. It also wouldn't do anything on a per-capita level. Pilots are well compensated, but even they are tempted by the private sector.
>If the average man was getting the kind of money your grandad was big families would still be a thing
Increasing income decreases fertility. Looking at OECD countries, the strength of social protections has no relation to TFR.
>we need a new economic system to fix those issues.
>one policy proposal can't get the support to pass
>I know, we need to put in something entirely different, that will probably go well

>>11617616
>can't add stock options at market value at time of transfer

>>11617621
So given the problems with neoliberalism and globalism what would you suggest?
I see (economic) national socialism as the best option and seeing it's effects in the past it seems to work well.

>>11617633
>(economic)
The economics part only works with the other part by removing certain bad actors.

>>11617650
You can push them out of the market without killing them. Think about the capital a nation state has to start a bank, think about how easy it would be for them to offer the lowest interest rates and zero fees. Think about how long other banks would survive in this market.
There are ways to get control of the economy back without anyone dying.

>>11617656
>You can push them out of the market without killing them
History indicates otherwise. Even expulsion doesn't work long term.

>>11617656
think about how long that bank would continue to exist without getting infiltrated by bad actors

>>11617601
>>11617609
>he thinks CEOs work regular hours
>And $1 per hour more for every $20 per hour the CEO wanted to make.
Except that wouldn't work because Walmart has 2,000,000 employees, rather than 20. Your proposal would add 2,000,000 USD per hour in costs per 20 dollar "hourly" increase in CEO salary.
> they won every step of the space race
US pulled ahead before Apollo, and in most cases the gap wasn't even large. Freedom 7 was less than a month after Vostok 1, and had a pilot who actually controlled and landed with a vessel.
Also a bit funny to use a field where strong competitive pressures exist as an argument that the innovation incentive structures are independent of economic systems.

>>11617601
>Despite being nepotism embodied they won every step of the space race until the US set a more distant goal.
Forced labour is amazing at driving down costs all around. I'd go into more detail but that would be off-topic and would likely invite politicstards of various inclinations.
You could find some info yourself by looking up such wonderful concepts as "cyббoтник" and "дoбpoвoльнo-пpинyдитeльнo".

>>11617678
>as an argument that the innovation incentive structures are independent of economic systems
What would you prefer me to use? Also I'm not talking about Communism so a comparison to current day Saudi Arabia or Qatar would be more accurate.

>>11617659
>>11617661
Protect the nationalized industries with something similar to the constitution.

>>11617682
Wasn't the point innovation like the first close cycle engine or mach 3 fighter? Why are you talking like forced labor is required for innovation?

>>11617697
the US went to the moon entirely with either open cycle gas generators or pressure fed rockets

>>11617697
>Protect the nationalized industries with something similar to the constitution.
OK so you're an actual pants on head retard. Go back to your polisci 101 course and leave /sci/ forever.

>The company also hinted at a “next generation” Starlink satellite that will be built to take advantage of the company’s massive Starship rocket, which SpaceX is developing now. SpaceX president Gwynne Shotwell said in October that Starship will be able to “take 400 satellites at a time.” While the company didn’t specify what those next generation changes will be, SpaceX said those Starlink satellites “will be specifically designed to minimize brightness while also increasing the number of consumers that it can serve with high speed internet access.”

naisu

Also by June all future Starlinks will have sun visors which should appease the astronomers.

>>11617700
Yes and 60 years later the US finally has a closed cycle of their own. Why were the Russians first if they could innovate under their economic system?

>>11617701
Why can't something vital to the security of a nation be protected in law? Why is this an insane idea?

>>11617704
>communications satellites the size of buildings blasting shitposts from Australia into the civilized world at unprecedented speeds

We've created a dystopia.

>>11617704
I get they want starship today but I feel they are jumping the gun when they are about to fly a prototype 2nd stage and the first stage doesn't exist.

>>11617719
The entire starlink project is banking on starship to get off the ground, literally. 184 falcon 9 launches for the initial 11k satellites when they're planning 40k is not exactly viable.

>>11617728
Could take awhile but I don't see how it's not viable to do it on Falcons when they get the first stage effectivly for free after most customers launches.

>>11617735
10 launches a year considering they have paying customers as well as NASA shit to launch? So yeah, expected speed and coverage in 18 years then?

>>11617753
Fair point.

>>11617697
>Why are you talking like forced labor is required for innovation?
I specifically mentioned that it's good for reducing costs overall. When you have a budget that has to be spent on different things and you can greatly reduce expenditures on several categories by telling your "citizens" to work for free, you can spend the difference on other things.

>>11617332
>>11617322
>don't scrap
Just looks like an elastic buckling to me, so there shouldn't be any permanent damage.

>>11617841
it's fullhard stainless, anon
that's well into plastic deformation

>>11617753
>10 launches a year
It's like one a month so far, and this is the first year where they are the least prepared (every launch is basically an experiment). Full cadence is probably much stronger even on Falcon hardware

>>11617847
>It's like one a month so far
I believe they're doing 10 per year. That's the maximum they're capable of squeezing in. They have paying customers.

>>11617859
>they have paying customers
and the space force is being a bitch about the range

>>11617863
And 10 per year is "roughly one a month".

>>11617859
Last indication I see of guidance for rate is 24 in 2020. Obviously we're shooting under that, but they don't seem to see the limit as anything like 10/yr

>>11617844
Ah, so it got stronger via work hardening then.

>>11617892
*snaps*

so when's the static fire

>>11617555
gotta shit on SLS with months old info I guess

>>11618114

somebody made a thread about ten hours too early

>>11615513
Giga based. Fucking pathetic coofers whining and squealing that he doesn't want to utterly trash the entire country with indefinite quarantine.

thread is still up
niggers didn't make a thread until now