/sci/ - Science & Math

>falling for the NASA lie

>>11073100
NASA not existing in the first place would make a great conspiracy theory. It would be like a shell organization designed to steal taxpayer money, and delay the future of space travel. I've never even seen anything from NASA in person. Coincidence? I think not.

They took this from us. Stolen our dreams, our spacefus, and I'll never forgive them.

These test booking suggest a hop in November?

>>11073093
You linked wrong previous thread, here is the real one:

>>11066471

Speaking of space hotties, how about that Christina Koch?

I have a massive crush on her (and her surname is pronounced "Cook" so don't be lewd)

>>11073155
she's nice, probably the prettiest space waifu I've seen

also knowing she's highly intelligent and physically healthy hnnnng

>we will never go to the moon under NASA
>we will keep funding new rocket projects that get delayed/overbudgeted/exadurated/lied about
>the next administration will cancel all projects, and claim to start a new "right" project
>refunding the same conglomerates and manufacturing cartels

Defund NASA. Breakup ULA.

>>11073093
>no boobs
>>11073110
>thick waist
>>11073155
>jewish
Hard pass x3

>>11073110
I think I'm gonna---

>>11073297


>>11073093
nice slime shape feels good to embrace run your hand softly trough her hair as you impregnate her
>>11073110
more comfort room for babies cute as fuck when walking
>>11073155
nice thick body and nice thick cute face that smiles when you tell her "im gonna make you pregnatn youre gonna be a mommy

Everyday astronaut's Aerospike voice is finally out

what happened to all those planned falcon heavy launches with classified payloads anyway?

>>11073346
Nobody actually needs a rocket that big.

>>11073353
So they'd be demoted to regular falcon 9 launches?

>>11073353
This. Instead of developing big rockets to shuttle large amounts of cargo to and from spacr as efficiently as possible, we should put more money in them programs. We need programs for underprivileged kids and shit.

>>11073364
If you want aid for the poor, you demonstrate/go on general strike until the budget is allocated for it.

Military and science always get their budgets approved first because the people in power understand that their power existentially depends on these fields.

>>11073377
>their power existentially depends on these fields
Their power depends on paying blacks and commies to vote for them, and not to riot. Defense against an external threat doesn't even come close

>>11073385
>sourceless graph, straight outta mspaint

>>11073346
>>11073353

There’s two classified payloads currently scheduled for Falcon Heavy, one for launch in 2020 and one in 2021. Neither are likely very big or expensive, considering they would launch on a Delta 4 Heavy or Atlas 551 if they were.

>>11073401
Delta 4 Heavy barely competes with the payload capacity of Falcon Heavy in fully reusable configuration, and costs three times the price, while Atlas 551 has straight up 10 tons less capacity to LEO and is still slightly more expensive

I just don't get why anyone would even use these outdated launchers

>>11073408
>I just don't get why anyone would even use these outdated launchers
Because of (perceived) reliably. Remember that ULA is often depicted as being more "trustworthy" and more "reliable" than SpaceX. Especially with their history with the US government.

>>11073408
>>11073420
Because these special government payloads are expensive to the point that the launch cost is only a fraction of the mission’s overall price. Therefore, the Airforce value things like a 100% reliability, Centaur’s impressive performance to high energy orbits, vertical integration (Class C payloads require this so SpaceX can’t launch them) and other classified services ULA provides for military payloads, more than just minimal cost savings from switching to a cheaper provider.

>>11073400
>I don't like those facts, they aren't pretty enough
Let's see your "alternative facts" then, Kellyanne

>>11073300
>>11073318
Should I post the latex spacesuits?

>>11073364
>hungry
Why she fat?

>>11073475
>the airforce prefers 100% reliability
Then why did their meme shuttle keep blowing up lol?

>>11073555
The air force canceled all plans to use shuttle after Challenger exploded. They care more about the perception of reliability than the actuality.

>>11073555
>Then why did their meme shuttle keep blowing up lol?
The Shuttle wasn't a USAF launcher. They were talked into using it by NASA. Once the Challenger incident happened, the USAF revived some of the expendable launchers that the Shuttle was supposed to replace.

Also, the Shuttle only exploded twice.

>>11073569
>They care more about the perception of reliability than the actuality.

I mean the Atlas 5 has a 100% reliability record and the Delta 4 Heavy only partially failed once in it’s test flight.

>>11073550
(x) yes
() yes

>>11073093

>>11073211
>Defund NASA
NO. Defund SLS. Increase NASA fund into other technologies research.

>>11073593
Atlas V came withing what, like 2 seconds of failure not that long ago? The first stage cut off early by a few seconds and the second stage had to burn for like two minutes extra in order to make up the difference, and it just barely had enough propellant to do so. 2 seconds earlier on that 1st stage shutdown and that payload would've ended up in the ocean somewhere. Still not a failure obviously, but definitely qualifies as an 'event'.

>>11073638
star-hip

>>11073638
also
>SLS
>can only build two per year without expensive new facilities
>SS
>will probably be building at least one per week

>>11073657
True, but SpaceX had some more spectacular failures than what the ULA did*. Add in the failed attempts of propulsive landing and one could easily twist the facts to make it seem like ULA is the golden child of reliability and SpaceX is that cheap unreliable provider who can only be trusted with unimportant stuff. Even if it's not the case.

*The Atlas is a very old rocket that has been flying before ULA existed, so all of the early flight hiccups were already done by the time Atlax V was flying and when ULA was formed. Meanwhile SpaceX had to develop their medium lifter from scratch and thus had to go through the early hiccups.

>>11073638
Oh no. Rocket 1 costs more than Rocket 2. Who gives a fuck.

>>11073534
>i still have no source but will some how try to flip this

Falcon 9 technology was in all aspects already figured out. Except for landing the boosters. Which took spacex five (5) years to figure out. On the other hand basically every element of Starship is untested and unproven. Weird how so many people expect it to be finished within a year given that SpaceX suffers delays on everything just like everyone else. The big shiny mock up rocket did its job evidently.

>>11073672
2 is also closer to actually flying and will have vastly superior payload capacity

>>11073551
Hungry all the time.

>>11073672
Anybody who wants to put something in space, taxpayers who's money is being spent on Rocket 1.

>>11073697
>>11073700
Do not respond to low effort shillposters

>>11073695
bruh it's Falcon 9 + Shuttle it's not complicated

>>11073695
I think most people (apart from some hardcore SpaceX fans) expect delays as Starship gets developed, but most people are very confident that SpaceX can get through the development hurdles and get the rocket functional. SpaceX has shown to be very capable.

>>11073697
>complete srbs
>complete spacecraft
>complete SM
>complete core stage
>complete ICPS
>complete interstage
>engines being attached right now
versus
>a steel cylinder
I'm going to go with the actual built rocket in this race. Also I would like to live your universe where a proposed 100 tonnes (subject to change and viability) is "vastly superior" to 95 tonnes.

>>11073731
100 tons to LEO, 100 tons to the Moon's surface.
vs
95 tons to LEO, 5 tons to the Moon's surface.

muh refueling meme actually works.

>>11073731
One of them will be flying in space 2020 and doing missions. Other won't fly until mid 2021-2022.

>>11073723
I don't disagree. I respect the ambition. However what the fanboys think will happen in 2020 and 2021 will really be happening around 2024. Nothing wrong with that. That's pretty fast. It's just like, I would have thought by now that people would listen to Elon say orbital test in 6 months and smile, the mentally add another 12 months to that number rather than actually believe it.

>>11073692
>t. still hasn't refuted the data but insists the onus is on everyone else anyway

>>11073741
SpaceX isn't going to sit on Starship for 5 years. If you're intending to cite FH, do so with reason. FH was only delayed because F9 was being developed and its capabilities were getting too close to FH range, so they delayed it intentionally until they could work out an approximate final design, the block 4. Falcon Heavy flew within 5 months after block 4 was finalized and with reused boosters to add.

SpaceX sitting on 5 years of development with other rocket will kill them. Not just from competition but from inability to launch their 40000 starlink satellites and all their business proposals.

What you're suggesting isn't delays, you're claiming "SpaceX will die in 5 years." That is bullshit as any other.

>>11073211
Ares V and SLS are very different. This guy's an idiot.

>>11073695
>dragon 2 took 8 years to develop
>Elon: LIFE SUPPORT FOR STARSHIP WILL BE THE EASIEST PART. PEOPLE WILL FLY NEXT YEAR
Friendly reminder that people actually believe this garbage.

>>11073754
>SpaceX will die in 5 years
Not just that, "Elon skeptics" camp delude themselves into thinking SpaceX will commit suicide by not doing anything for the next 5 years. That's their delusion taking over and forming a reality around it.

>>11073754
>What you're suggesting isn't delays, you're claiming "SpaceX will die in 5 years."
He never said that though?

>>11073776
Do you lack reading comprehension?

>>11073778
I just woke up, okay?

>>11073769
How can Dragon 2 have taken 8 years to develop if the program wasn't even funded until 4 years ago?

>>11073782
>the program wasn't even funded until 4 years ago?
Source?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5GI6-IBDFM

Who is in the wrong here?

>>11073782
>How can Dragon 2 have taken 8 years to develop if the program wasn't even funded until 4 years ago?

>This happened in 2015

>>11073782
Do you mean that it wasn't fully funded until 2015?

>>11073672
The people paying, you complete drooling retard.

>>11073789
Eminent domain is only morally acceptable when it's done by an agency acting as an arbiter for public interest, and even then it's highly questionable.

The whole thing is entirely unethical on spacex's part.

>>11073799
>>11073788
No, it wasn't selected until late 2014. Before that was just preliminary designs between various companies. It was only in 2014 when NASA was serious. And the funding is never fully given, its only given partially funded.

>https://govtribe.com/award/federal-idv-award/indefinite-delivery-contract-nnk14ma74c

>>11073807
>it wasn't selected until late 2014
There were multiple phases involving nearly a billion in funds for spacex before the final down select to two providers.

>>11073755
Come on man, it's really hard to divorce Ares V from SLS when Ares V was evolving through the design process to resemble what eventually became SLS. At the very least it's a spiritual successor to Ares V that inherited all the design baggage of the Shuttle program.
>>11073769
Nuclear submarine life support system with exactly one change, instead of doing electrolysis of water to generate oxygen you use electrolysis of carbon dioxide. Submarines have unlimited water to use obviously, but Starship wont, and it'd be more effective to recover respirated oxygen from both the water and the CO2 waste products. Otherwise a life support system is effectively a very reliable dehumidifier, with an air filter and some other doodads. The hard part about designing life support for a small capsule is that you don't have the mass or volume budget for high levels of redundancy, instead you need ultra-reliable systems, and you can't accept any down time, unlike on Starship where it'd take days of no life support system activity to build up enough CO2 and water vapor in the air to start being a problem. Starship would even have the mass budget to allow for emergency open-cycle life support, in which they simply went some of the oxygen from the tanks directly into the habitat atmosphere, while capturing and dumping CO2 and water elsewhere, no fancy and delicate electrolysis machines required.

>>11073814
>billion
Wrong. You can't give SpaceX billions when the yearly budget is only around $500 million. The max SpaceX.

>https://www.planetary.org/blogs/casey-dreier/images/commercial-crew-funding.html

If you're talking about the total given so far, then that's still roughly a 1 billion. That's over the course of 8 years of pre-selection designs and slow funding throughout the years. They were never funded 100%, most of the early years were around 30-50% yearly funding.

>>11073806
I wouldn't care if SpaceX were stacking up dried corpses of 3rd world children and burning them in furnaces to generate heat for their factory floors in winter, getting humanity onto multiple other objects in space besides Earth is too important to worry about schmethics.

>>11073833
>The max SpaceX.
The max SpaceX got was $460 million for the initial development of the vehicle itself. The rest is mainly testing stuff and delays due to various reviews necessary after each step.

>>11073769
Nobody sane believes that people will be flying on Starship next year. I fully believe that Starship will be flying next year. It might even go to the moon.

>>11073638
>not calling it Starship Launch System (SLS)

>>11073789
The company that SpaceX contracted to write up the buyout proposals. Bunch of lowballing fuckheads.

>>11073806
>unethical
They are making generous offers with 3X assessed real estate prices. They're even saying bring your own agent to assess it. If some of the residents feel the need to milk SpaceX for their fairly generous offer of 3X market value, then its a moral duty of SpaceX as a company to pursue legal options. They can't just let some residents milk them millions for properties that have no real value. Hopefully that won't come to be and the residents could be persuaded, but if push comes to shove, SpaceX should not be giving into money grubs.

>>11073731
>Also I would like to live your universe where a proposed 100 tonnes (subject to change and viability) is "vastly superior" to 95 tonnes.

You forgot to account for launch rate differences. SLS is a ~100 ton of payload to orbit per year class of launch vehicle, at best. Single Starship is designed to achieve 1000-10,000 tons per year.

>>11073852
The offers that were made sucked dick, but it'll probably all work out peacefully soon.

>>11073806
>Eminent domain is only morally acceptable when it's done by an agency acting as an arbiter for public interest

Advancing rocketry is very much in public interest.

>>11073862
>The offers that were made sucked dick
When compared to billion dollars. Yes, but these houses are not worth millions nor are they worth billions. They're at best worth few dozen thousands to hundred thousand. If they feel cheated, they are told to bring their own assessor.

>>11073852
>They are making generous offers with 3X assessed real estate prices.
Who cares? They aren't trying to sell their houses.

>>11073867
>Advancing rocketry is very much in public interest.
They already have a $2 billion launch pad in Florida that was given to them for free. They don't need another.

>>11073871
They do need another. Also, it is in the interest of the state of Texas to have the most advanced spaceport on the world located within their borders.

>>11073868
>missing the point this completely

>>11073882
>They do need another.
Source?
>it is in the interest of the state of Texas to have the most advanced spaceport on the world located within their borders.
Texas has had no part in these attempts at stealing property.

>>11073769
Just put some dragon capsule in a starship
Boom

>>11073889
>They do need another.
>Source?
Starship isn't gonna launch from any of the legacy pads SpaceX uses, they're gonna launch it from a platform and skip using a giant ass concrete pad altogether.

>>11073906
>Starship isn't gonna launch from any of the legacy pads SpaceX uses, they're gonna launch it from a platform and skip using a giant ass concrete pad altogether.
Source?

>>11073885
>>11073870
>they aren't trying to sell the house
Not according to as the local interviews and their tones.

According to the locals, they want SpaceX to pay for "that view" of sunrise and sunset at the beach and their "dreams." And when Elon was talking with residents during the meeting after the Starship update, the residents were negotiating for MORE like Tesla cars and stuff. So its not a matter of not selling but rather "at what price." By definition, that's "milking"

>>11073739
>One of them will still be flying in space in 2050 and doing missions. Other will only fly until mid 2021-2022 when Starship comes online.
FTFY

>>11073909
Elon

>>11073889
>Source?
Don't have source right now, but Elon said that due to increased bureaucracy in Florida, they want to have their own spaceport in Texas. And bureaucracy / government interference is a total cancer on spaceflight, so he is likely very correct.

>Texas has had no part in these attempts at stealing property.

Cameron county specifically takes steps to support SpaceX facilities, including granting a non-profit Cameron County Spaceport Development Corporation eminent domain rights.

https://www.businessinsider.com/spacex-boca-chica-texas-launch-site-spaceport-corporation-eminent-domain-2019-9

>>11073475
If it's classified, how do you know the cost of the payload? There is existing information on some spy satellites, such as the Japanese ones that blew up in 2003 aboard a H2-A rocket that were only 78 million total and American Blackjack satellites that are only 6 million. Most spy satellites are actually getting cheaper as imaging technology rapidly improves. I'd wager that most launches have payloads of only a few hundred million.
>minimal cost savings from switching to a cheaper provider.
Even lawmakers don't seem to share your 'trivial amount relative to the cost of the equipment' assertion.
https://spacenews.com/us-lawmakers-decry-high-cost-launching-spy-satellites-amid-funding-woes/

>>11073912
>According to the locals, they want SpaceX to pay for "that view" of sunrise and sunset at the beach and their "dreams." And when Elon was talking with residents during the meeting after the Starship update, the residents were negotiating for MORE like Tesla cars and stuff. So its not a matter of not selling but rather "at what price." By definition, that's "milking"
Source?

>>11073917
Source?

>>11073921
>Don't have source right now, but Elon said that due to increased bureaucracy in Florida,
Source?

>Texas = Cameron county
You're an idiot.

>>11073909
They're going to fly one from Boca Chica. And there is no legacy platform there. For Florida, they're building an extension. https://twitter.com/julia_bergeron/status/1172896260241666054

>California
Wont be extending anytime soon due to huge increase in cost for launch and insurance.

>>11073909
The part that says Starship pad is what the whole stack is eventually gonna be launching from. It's apparently easier to build an elevated 'milk stool' launch platform and tie it in to some of the ground support hardware than it is to reconfigure the main pad where Falcon and FH launch from to be able to also accept Starship.

>>11073928
see >>11073934

>>11073929
>>11073934
Anything within the fence at 39A is still considered part of the pad. I'm guessing you think that the launch tower, water tower, fuel lines and tanks, and all the other infrastructure are not part of the pad?

>>11073928
>Elon/Locals talk
https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-spacex-boca-chica-village-private-meeting-buyouts-2019-10

>"that view"
https://www.kveo.com/news/update-spacex-residential-buyout/

>>11073928
>You're an idiot.
Source?

>>11073941
It's not even that special, let's be honest. There are parts of the UK with a sunset like that a couple of times a year!

>>11073923
>American Blackjack satellites that are only 6 million

That’s an experimental DARPA program which involves creating a large constellation of satellites and not comparable to current birds. Sure, their are cheaper military satellites probably in the hundreds of millions of dollar per unit e.g. NROL-76, but I’m talking Class C payloads like KH-11s and ORIONs that are valued in the billions.

>>11073940
Don't be a dumbass, dude. They aren't launching it from the legacy launch pad, which is THE most expensive and time consuming part of building any launch complex by far. They could replicate their launch stool design pretty much anywhere, it only needs a crane instead of a service tower, and since all the tanks are filled via connections that run through the base of the Booster they don't even need any fueling tower rig to enable launches.

>>11073789
>Who is in the wrong here?
The homeowners, a dozen people willing to fuck the development of space flight and the countless new technologies that will be created from it just so they can have their shitty bungalow in one of the poorest areas in Texas. I recommend anyone defending the homeowners actually look at the location on Google street view. This is exactly why eminent domain exists.
>>11073849
What? They offered them three times what their properties are worth. They'll only receive a 3rd of that if they have to use eminent domain.

>>11073952
>It's not even that special, let's be honest
That's the point of "that view."

>NOTICE: Road/ beach closures in Boca Chica for Wed, Oct 23 - Fri, Oct 25 have been CANCELLED, according to the Cameron County website.

https://twitter.com/bluemoondance74/status/1185506046384705536

>>11073965
>willing to fuck the development of space flight
Explain why spacex can't just stay in Florida.

>>11073969

>>11073969
oh nononono

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8SMcj-yHfI&t=2m53s

>just hammer it in, dude

So this is how you build an interplanetary spaceship.

>>11073971
Faster to test in undeveloped area than to test in a highly developed area.

>>11073977
but they are also testing in Florida

You actually think companies should be able to forcibly take people's property because it can make things more "convenient"? lmao

>>11073984
Eminent Domain is not there for convenience. Its there for when rationality breaks and there's a need for the government to step in to ensure greater access to the public/national/security development.

>>11073956
>I’m talking Class C payloads like KH-11s and ORIONs that are valued in the billions.
Those are not the majority of government launches. Orion can go up to six years before another mission. KH-11 was 43 years ago. We can split hairs all day long, but the point is, price per launch is a definite factor, even for the US military.

>>11073987
>Its there for when rationality breaks and there's a need for the government to step in to ensure greater access to the public/national/security development.
starship is not public/national/security development, and is not even owned by the government at all

>>11073971
What are you even asserting? That rocket companies shouldn't be allowed to move outside the area of their first launch? That eminent domain shouldn't be applied so that they can build spaceports? It makes no sense that any company would limit themselves to that.

>>11073994
Hello rockets are national security.

>>11073868
it's not about how much they're worth, or how much they're worth to the residents, or how much the residents not being there would be worth to SpaceX (completely worthless, absolutely priceless, and many many dollars, respectively)
The important metric here is what it would cost to buy or build a replacement elsewhere. (many dollars, but not as much as it would save SpaceX not having to deal with them)

>>11073995
>What are you even asserting? That rocket companies shouldn't be allowed to move outside the area of their first launch?
That people who don't want to sell shouldn't be forced to sell, especially not to a private company.

>>11074002
SpaceX should work with them to buy beachfront properties for them elsewhere while in full cooperation with the residents. But of course, they'll never do that because it's not as easy as throwing money at the problem.

>>11074002
>The important metric here is what it would cost to buy or build a replacement elsewhere.
SpaceX showed them houses in comparative areas as part as their offer. They're not actually on a beach, they live in a shitty community with houses that look like garbage and people that look worse.

>>11074002
Brownsville is one of the poor area in Texas. There are plenty of 3-4 bedroom houses for around $150K. There's plenty more under $100K. What the residents "lose" in vague values like "watching sunset", they gain in access to local hospitals/supermarkets/jobs/etc within walking distance.

>https://www.zillow.com/brownsville-tx/

>>11073928
Nomadd is a poster on NSF, and he is a local in Boca Chica
he is quite gossipy about his neighbors

>>11074008
>That people who don't want to sell shouldn't be forced to sell, especially not to a private company.

So you are against the concept of an eminent domain as a whole? This is stupid ancap ideology speaking, not reason.

Private company serving public interest is just as valid benefactor of an eminent domain as public company.

>>11074012
>SpaceX showed them houses in comparative areas as part as their offer
Source?

>>11074016
Source?

>>11074013
>What the residents "lose" in vague values like "watching sunset", they gain in access to local hospitals/supermarkets/jobs/etc within walking distance.
Maybe the residents don't give a shit about those things.

>>11074019
>So you are against the concept of an eminent domain as a whole?
Why do you keep inventing strawman arguments?

>Private company serving public interest is just as valid benefactor of an eminent domain as public company.
That's a subjective opinion and also incorrect.
spacex already has a pad in Florida.

>>11074023
>Maybe the residents don't give a shit about those things.
They have to, as they still need the food and hospital access to survive. The distance between the village and brownsville is 20 miles/30-40 minutes drive.

>>11074027
>spacex already has a pad in Florida.
Not sure what the argument is. Are you suggesting that SpaceX not expand/have backup access/find ways to cut down costs/etc?

>>11074027
>spacex already has a pad in Florida.

Irrelevant. Cameron country, Texas, wants them to have a pad within their county, and that is what matters.

>>11074008
You drive on a highway lately? You know how many projects only happen because of eminent domain? They're not being forced to sell by a private company, but a government run development association. No one in the state of Texas is going to risk losing a billion dollar spaceport and thousands of high paying jobs over a handful of white trash holdouts who mostly just like the attention they're getting or got too greedy while negotiating.

As far as eminent domain goes, you cannot find a better example of appropriate use than this case. A handful of residents versus something that will literally have an effect on every single American, if cheap space flight comes of age and advances technology. Even Starlink is a huge game changer for those living in rural areas, like where the Texas launch site is.

>>11074013
>>11074012
>>11074011
they really should take a look at Beaufort, South Carolina. Similar dirt poor living arrangements on the coast.
>>11074023
can't you fucking read? NSF. You should know what that stands for.

>>11074027
>That's a subjective opinion and also incorrect.

It is demonstrablly correct, as determined by Cameron county judge when they granted eminent domain rights to a Spaceport Corporation non-profit, exactly for a situation like this.

Wow, Boca Chica Village is thriving! Look at this great corner lot, surely this is community any rational person would want to stay in so they can live in complete poverty right next to their crazy neighbors, while in the middle of nowhere so it defeats the purpose of rural living.

>>11074028
>They have to, as they still need the food and hospital access to survive. The distance between the village and brownsville is 20 miles/30-40 minutes drive.
If it's "too far away to survive" then why did they move there in the first place? Idiot.

>>11074030
>Are you suggesting that SpaceX not expand/have backup access/find ways to cut down costs/etc?
I'm suggesting that they shouldn't have bought land next to a town, and then complained that a town is there. Retard.

>>11074032
Then why is spacex conducting the negotiations?

>>11074035
>they really should take a look at Beaufort, South Carolina. Similar dirt poor living arrangements on the coast.
Oh nice, petty classism. How cute.
>can't you fucking read? NSF. You should know what that stands for.
National Science Foundation?

>>11074037
Then why is spacex conducting the negotiations?

What do you mean Spacex won't give me two million dollars for my house? I live near a beach.

>>11073093
Not science or math.

>>11074050
>petty clsasism
it's underdeveloped land on the coast, which is what they're looking for
Driving down highway 170 around lemon island there's a bunch of property

>>11074050
>I'm suggesting that they shouldn't have bought land next to a town, and then complained that a town is there. Retard.
They're not complaining, they're acting with regards to their interest. Complaining does nothing. Acting does.

>>11074056
seething redditard

>>11074050
>why is SpaceX conducting negotiations
Because eminent domain is a last resort and usually requires you try negotiations first?

>>11074073
I'm not seething at all, I think the situation is funny and it's really strange how people justify the way they live when they should be jumping at the SpaceX offer that would get them away from this shithole.

Nearly every house has boarded up or gated windows. Two houses have full chainlink fences surrounding them with barbed wire on top. Half of the houses look abandoned or minimal maintained.

>>11074034
>You drive on a highway lately? You know how many projects only happen because of eminent domain?
You do know 99% of highway projects happen without condemnation, right? You do know that highway projects almost never take someone's entire property, right? (and these day's it's pretty much against federal law to do so) You do know that even when these projects take people's property, they still go out of their way to insure they don't take people's houses, right?

>>11074090
>they should be jumping at the SpaceX offer that would get them away from this shithole
3x market value for their shitholes is not enough for them to leave, it would just leave them with no house and a pitiful amount of money

>>11074091
Eminent domain is used constantly and you cannot hide this fact. Even in Texas, a football stadium just got built displacing hundreds of people. Let's face it, you don't give a fuck about eminent domain laws, you're only upset about it because SpaceX may use it.
>and these day's it's pretty much against federal law to do so
Complete bullshit. The supreme court affirmed that property can go to private companies. See Kelo V the City of New London. "Court held that the general benefits a community enjoyed from economic growth qualified private redevelopment plans as a permissible "public use" under the Takings Clause of the Fifth Amendment."

>>11074104
That isn't true, there's cheap property all over Texas, even near the ocean. If you think SpaceX would try to fuck the property owners in order to save a few million when it's going to cost them way more than that if the spaceport gets delayed, I don't know what to tell you. Even some of the residents already stated that the offer was fair and took it.

>>11074118
I don't think SpaceX are trying to fuck property owners, I think they contracted it out to a local real estate firm or something and THEY tried to shaft the local property owners.

>>11074091
just move the houses lol

I bet SpaceX will increase the offer to 5x the value as determined by an independent evaluator, then throw a free Tesla car on top of that. Most residents will cave in at that point. Few remainers will get eminent domain'd.

>>11074034
>You drive on a highway lately? You know how many projects only happen because of eminent domain?
The DOT used eminent domain in my area to get the land necessary to build a highway over a decade ago and there's still people salty about it.

>>11074111
>Even in Texas, a football stadium just got built displacing hundreds of people.
Why do you assume I'm ok with that?

>you don't give a fuck about eminent domain laws, you're only upset about it because SpaceX may use it.
You're a seething retard. You don't know anything about me.

>Complete bullshit. The supreme court affirmed that property can go to private companies.
Another strawman argument. When did I say that it couldn't go to private companies? My point is spacex already has a launch pad elsewhere and they should use it.

If I were one of these property owners I'd sell, and then inverse condemnation on spacex's asses after they built all their launchpads offshore anyways and win millions of dollars.

>>11074128
seriously

>>11074135
>lvl 100 trailer park

>>11074141
this is actually relatively common in north america

>>11074134
You ain't getting millions of dollars for a mere house in the middle of nowhere, even if you win inverse condemnation.

>>11074128
spacex won't do that because they're going for the cheapest method possible (push insufferable demands until the property owners refuse to sell, and then use the courts which are already in their pocket to force them to sell at less than appraised value)

>>11074151
Seems like a PR hit would be worse than just paying out a few $ million.

>>11074154
spacex could crash a rocket on a daycare center and kill 200 kids and nobody would give a shit at this point
there's too many redditor incels shitposting about elon everywhere on the internet 24/7 to change people's minds now

>>11074147
it wouldn't be just for the house, it would be for potential property value lost and damages for having rights violated

>>11074158
>there's too many redditor incels shitposting about elon everywhere on the internet 24/7 to change people's minds now
No, there isn't. Calm down.

>>11074158
>there's too many redditor incels shitposting about elon everywhere on the internet 24/7 to change people's minds now
Maybe someone else should do something worth shitposting about

>>11074132
Sure, some people will fight tooth and nail just to save their shitty $30,000 house that is falling apart, but that isn't a reasonable reaction and I think it's wrong to fuck millions of people who stand to gain from American space flight just to appease a few people. There are no kids in Boca Chica Village, so it's not like there's generational housing. You can go north to Port Isabel, Texas and find equally shitty and cheap housing that is also next to the ocean.
>>11074134
>Why do you assume I'm ok with that?
So you openly spoke out against it like you do with every single eminent domain project and spent hours of your life defending the residents there? No? That's because it has nothing to do with eminent domain and you're upset about SpaceX.
>You're a seething retard. You don't know anything about me.
Projection. I looks like a hit a nerve. You should calm down.
>When did I say that it couldn't go to private companies?
You stated it was "pretty much against federal law" to take someone's entire property, it isn't. You were completely wrong about it.
>I'd sell, and then inverse condemnation on spacex's asses after they built all their launchpads offshore anyways and win millions of dollars.
This is why you're not a lawyer and just some idiot on the Internet pretending he has any knowledge on a subject you don't.

>>11074171
>to fuck millions of people who stand to gain from American space flight
How would it "fuck millions of people" if spacex just used their florida pad that was given to them by the public for free like they should have done in the first place?

>>11074158
redditor incel leftists are the single largest group of anti-musk people in general

you have to go back

>>11074165
>potential property value lost and damages for having rights violated
Would you stop fucking pretending to be a lawyer? This is ridiculous, no rights are violated through eminent domain. You get fair market value for your property, that's it.
>>11074177
One pad isn't going to be enough for a multi-billion dollar company that is a leader in rockery. It's like saying 'why does the NFL need another stadium when they already have one?'

>>11074177
>How would it "fuck millions of people" if spacex just used their florida pad that was given to them by the public for free like they should have done in the first place?


Like this:

>"He talked about the regulations in Florida and why it was better for them to be here rather than in Florida because things could get done a bit faster," Ray Pointer said.

https://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-spacex-boca-chica-village-private-meeting-buyouts-2019-10

>>11074177
>How would it "fuck millions of people" if spacex just used their florida pad

It would fuck people in Texas and in Cameron country in particular quite thoroughly.

>>11074125
They're real estate agents, both sides will try to fuck each other. Let's look at the other part of this, they're trying to fix up abandon homes so they can get more money for them. The end result is still that residents are getting way more than the houses are worth.

>"New appraisals were set to begin Oct. 7, with a new buyout offer deadline of Oct. 17. Terry Heaton said earlier this month that he’d been busy sprucing up properties at the request of some of the village’s out-of-town owners.
>“Some of them hadn’t been in their houses for quite a while,” he said."

>>11074197
>It would fuck people in Texas and in Cameron country in particular quite thoroughly.
Who cares?
I don't live in Texas or Florida so my concern is the federal government spending public resources on spacex, and spacex squandering those resources (resources which I partially paid for through taxes)

>>11074201
yeah, the vast majority of these properties are abandoned or just owned by people who've forgotten about them

>>11074205
>my concern is the federal government spending public resources on spacex, and spacex squandering those resources
Such as?...

>>11074171
>So you openly spoke out against it like you do with every single eminent domain project and spent hours of your life defending the residents there? No? That's because it has nothing to do with eminent domain and you're upset about SpaceX.
Maybe I care here because I've been following spaceflight since before you were sucking your mothers tit?

>>11074214
pad 39A

>>11074205
>Who cares?
Cameron county judge, apparently.

>my concern is the federal government spending public resources on spacex

So it is about SpaceX after all. Rest assured that taxpayer money spent on SpaceX is among the best taxpayer money ever spent.

You wouldn’t fuck this cat girl would you?

>>11074219
>Rest assured that taxpayer money spent on SpaceX is among the best taxpayer money ever spent.
Sure. $3 billion spent on "crew dragon" and it'll barely be used 2 or 3 times before spacex intends to replace it.

>>11074218
But they're not squandering it?

https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/20-Augusta-Dr_Laguna-Vista_TX_78578_M76958-91101?view=qv

This house is under $200,000, close to the ocean, close to Boca Chica Village and in a much nicer area. Boca Chica Village are likely getting more than 200k for their houses. It costs SpaceX basically nothing to throw a few million at the 7 or so remaining residents.
>>11074215
That doesn't answer my question. Why specifically do you have a problem with this potential use of eminent domain when you clearly don't care about other uses and have no understanding how it even works?
>I've been following spaceflight since before you were sucking your mothers tit?
Oh, so you're some old space retarded boomer that hates SpaceX, that's exactly what I figured. I never accused you of being consistent.

>>11074231
>and have no understanding how it even works?
Explain.

What is the point in manned spaceflight? There is nowhere habitable out there to go and all science can be done in space by robots.

>>11074225
>"rent" 39A for free
>forbid others from using it
>quickly stop using it and instead build a pad next to it instead, but don't use that either and just move everything to texas

>>11074240
Robots are slow, don't respond well to unusual problems, and perpetrate anemic launchers which reduces the amount of space industry that can be done.

>>11074234
>Explain.
You have no understanding of how eminent domain works and erroneously said that giving whole properties to private companies is against federal law when it's not, on top of other stupid claims.

>>11074240
Science is not the only or even the most important goa of spaceflight. Space colonization is.
>There is nowhere habitable
We will make it habitable.

>>11074241
>>"rent" 39A for free
I thought they had to pay for it?

>>forbid others from using it
Well, yeah. It's their pad.

>>quickly stop using it and instead build a pad next to it instead, but don't use that either and just move everything to texas
They're still using it to launch Falcons.

>>11074190
>forcing people to sell their property so "things could get done a bit faster" at your private enterprise
lmao imagine actually defending this shit

>>11074231
TIL: Texas looks identical to the West Indies. Houses here are not that expensive though lol.

>>11074246
>and erroneously said that giving whole properties to private companies is against federal law when it's not
I literally did not say that, idiot. I said that, in regards to highway projects, it's illegal to take land without independent assessments determining that it won't severely affect the people it is taken from. I didn't say anything about private companies doing it or about it being illegal.

>>11074253
Imagine pretending you're some great defender against eminent domain so you can use it an excuse to shit on SpaceX

>Oy vey, 7 residents are forced to get at least three times the value of their abandoned houses. It's like another holocaust.

>>11074251
>I thought they had to pay for it?
They didn't not, other than a few hundred thousand to renovate it for their "needs"

>Well, yeah. It's their pad.
No, it's NASA's pad that they are leasing. Idiot.

>They're still using it to launch Falcons.
How often will falcon launch from there 5 years from now? When the lease is only half up?

>>11074247
Space colonization is for rich people, I don't support it anymore. I'm all for sending a couple guys to set up a research base on Mars but funding a casino city for billionaires do I look like a cuck to you?

>>11074264
You said:
>You do know that highway projects almost never take someone's entire property, right? (and these day's it's pretty much against federal law to do so)"
It had nothing to with taking land without independent assessments and the bullshit you're trying to use to back pedal. Just take the loss and stop trying to save your pride, you're only looking worse by trying to cover your ignorance.

>>11074253
When the private enterprise is going to colonize Mars, yes, I will defend it, and lick those boots clean. Get bent, commie.

And you are forgetting the main reason why eminent domain can even be applied in this case - public interest of Texas and Cameron county in having the spaceport within their borders. This is something that could potentially transform the entire valley from barely relevant collection of towns into the world's leading space industry center.

>>11074265
>Why yes, I do defend thing I like and every decision they make, good or bad. How could you tell?

>>11074253
>>11074265
How did this even become an issue in the USA of all places? You have fuckloads of land, Why couldn't he have built this spaceport in the Nevada desert?

>>11074266
>No, it's NASA's pad that they are leasing. Idiot.
Yes, but NASA gave the pad to SpaceX for them to use as they see fit. Sure, my appartment is owned by my landlord and not me, but I'm not going to let other people live in my appartment.

>How often will falcon launch from there 5 years from now? When the lease is only half up?
I don't know, they may be phased out by then, replaced by Starship. At that point the place will most likely be renovated to suit Starship.

>>11074276
because they're throwing away morals in order to reach for every penny they can, and then attacking everyone else for "overcharging" for launch services

>>11074272
Nothing about my statement is incorrect. Are you mentally ill?

>>11074270
>I hate space colonization

So now we finally got to the root of your issues. It was never about eminent domain, or even about SpaceX. You are just a regressive idiot.

>>11074275
It's not clever for you to take the inverse of my argument and pretend it's original. I have no problem with eminent domain in cases of great national importance.
>>11074276
They need ocean access. Most of the US coast is developed or protected. Would you want to have test rockets flying over you?

>>11074288
>great national importance
such as?

>>11074282
Yes, it was incorrect. It's not against federal law to take someone's entire property, even in a highway project. In some cases they're forced to do just that.
>Are you mentally ill?
That's my concern for you, based on the amount of back pedaling you have done and claims that you said something completely different than what you did.

>>11074276
>Why couldn't he have built this spaceport in the Nevada desert?

They need to be on the east coast near the ocean and as south as possible. The reasons are obvious for anyone with any understanding of a space launch. South Florida coast and South texas coast are the only two viable places in the US.

>>11074286
>everyone I disagree with is actually just one person

>>11074292
>even in a highway project. In some cases they're forced to do just that
Like I said, "practically."
If they took someone's house when there was a valid alternative, they would get btfo in court, and rightfully so.

>>11074291
Such as SpaceX and the development of cheap rockets to further all of mankind and drive rapid technological advancement. It's even greater for Americans which would be leaders in the industry, one of the few areas they can compete with other countries like China on. I wish we had more companies like SpaceX.

>>11074263
yeah, everything subtropical looks basically the same

>>11074298
That isn't "practically" at all, you fucking retard. By practically illegal, you mean not illegal in the least. For the third time, stop pretending to be a lawyer, you have zero understanding of the law and are literally making shit up as you go.

>>11074298
>everyone I disagree with is actually just one person

Well, there is 1-2 redditor FUDposters plaguing these threads ever since they began as SpaceX generals a year ago.

>>11074286
I just joined the thread, no idea about US property law because I'm not American.
You can't refute what I said about space colonization though, Starship passenger is 100% going to be like Concorde - for the rich. I'm not totally against it but I'll only support it if it's mostly designed for scientific explorations, with tourism as a side venture.
>>11074288
Oh okay fair enough.

>>11074306
That doesn't sound like national interest at all. In your own words you say "all of mankind," a term which includes the chinks.

>>11074312
>you didn't mean this, you mean THIS!!!!1!
seething

>>11074276
>>11074295
"One reason rockets are launched in Florida has to do with the Earth's rotation. The Earth rotates most quickly at the equator, and to take advantage of this, in adding to the orbital velocity of the rocket, it is most beneficial to launch from a southerly location (near the equator). In addition, to take advantage of the direction of rotation of the planet, launching from a location on an easterly coast where there is no inhabited population where debris would land in an emergency would be ideal for both the safety of the people on the ground and for fuel efficiency of the rocket. The only locations in the United States capable of this are on the east coasts of Florida, Texas, and Puerto Rico, but given the high population densities in coastal Texas, South Florida, and Puerto Rico, the Space Coast is the best location when all factors are taken into account."
>>11074318
Luckily, no one gives a fuck what you think and nearly everyone would disagree with you, including the US government, which is why the will allow eminent domain for SpaceX.

>>11074295
What about Puerto Rico?

>>11074318
having America be the one doing it for all mankind is very important anon, because the Chinese won't pretend they're doing it for anybody but themselves

>>11074320
You meant exactly what you typed, which is factually incorrect and even more incorrect in your attempts to defend it.

Ever notice how the autistic screechers who hate SpaceX never actually talk about rockets?

>>11074328
>which is factually incorrect and even more incorrect in your attempts to defend it.
Explain why then.

>>11074219
Tbf Anon, a "county judge" in Texas means like "mayor of the county." It's an elected position that has basically nothing to do with actual judges.

>>11074316
>You can't refute what I said about space colonization though, Starship passenger is 100% going to be like Concorde - for the rich

Sure, at first. But technology is one thing that definitely trickles down. The goal of Starship is to enable a viable Mars colony, not just a tourist resort. It won't be me, but maybe my children's children will be able to sell their Earthly possesions and move to Mars to stay, just in time to escape the climate catastrophe and dysgenic degeneration of the Earth. Forcing a few boomer fucks to move is more than worth for this possibility.

Ever notice how the autistic screechers who love SpaceX never actually talk about rockets?

>>11074333
Already did. Pretending you were pretending to be retarded the whole time and you didn't lose the argument and decide to start trolling, is retarded, retard.

>>11074251
>>forbid others from using it
>Well, yeah. It's their pad.
SpaceX DID go back on their promise they would let others use pad 39A if awarded the lease.
See here: http://spacenews.com/37376spacex-changes-tune-on-lease-terms-for-shuttle-pad/

A P O L O G I Z E
>https://spacenews.com/firefly-partners-with-aerojet-rocketdyne-mulls-ar1-engine-for-beta-launch-vehicle/

>>11074331
>>11074336
Can we get back to talking about rockets, please? Like about Russia's latest plans for reusable rockets?

>>11074344
Please spoon-feed me info about this - I am curious

This is what a real IVA suit looks like. Rugged and dependable, with a heritage stretching back to the very first Mercury astronauts. It's utilitarian, but classy in its simplicity.

>A few pics from this morning.

>>11074352

This is what a real IVA suit looks like. Rugged and dependable, with a heritage stretching back to the very first Mercury astronauts. It's utilitarian, but classy in its simplicity.

>>11074355
yeah but I don't look like a superhero in it

>>11074346
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019/09/30/russia-plans-reusable-rocket-to-compete-with-elon-musk-by-2024-rbc-a67508
>Russia plans to build its own reusable Argo rocket to start sending resupply missions to the ISS by 2024
>Roscosmos has changed their opinion on reusability being a "nice trick"
>$9.8B for development
>It all seems like a general response to SpaceX supplanting Roscosmos as the cheapest launch provider

THIS on the other hand, is what happens when you try and force design. It looks ugly and bloated, because the design is fundamentally opposed to the functionality.

>>11074360
oh nononono....

>>11073769
>"IF PROGRESS CONTINUES TO BE EXPONENTIAL"
At least quote him entirely.
Sure, it's a bit ridiculous to even state anything under this assumption.
But then again, with prototypes getting completed within a few months by ordinary welders under the sun, raptors apparently being dirt cheap, getting cheaper and really ramping up in production soon and the ships potentially being incredbily reusable, you can kinda sorta see how he can daydream about something like this.
I mean if this all worked out perfectly, they could just keep flying their grain silos a hundred times and keep shitting out new improved ones whenver they learned something. As long as nothing blew up and everything worked out perfectly, why not keep launching them a few dozen times and then stick people on there? With a hundred tons of payload available surely they can keep 2-3 astronauts alive for a limited time without super complicated systems neccessary.

>>11073905
maybe don't use dragon capsule and boom in the same post like that.

>>11074359
Why does Russia keep trying to build all this new equipment? Is there something just fundamentally wrong with the Soviet-era designs? Can they no longer compete with modern technology? They're running on a shoestring budget as-is; they really should be focusing on using what they already have.

>>11074335
judging by historical trends your children's children will be unlikely to hold the same views as you. I agree they'll probably want to escape the heat though.

>>11074336
No because when Thunderfoot isn't spamming the thread we talk about Starship mission profiles, laugh at SLS, and build model rockets. You'd know this if you used the thread for anything but autistic screeching.

>>11074355
>>11074360
IMO, the Boeing suit would look the best out of the bunch if it had a better helmet (like the one from the NASA suit). It wouldn't hurt to have the international orange color too.

>>11074341
Where's your source for any other company requesting use of the pad and SpaceX denying it?
>>11074355
>>11074360
They both look like shit. They need to stop funding anything besides mechanical counterpressure suits and allow the technology to replace it. The pressure issue has already been mostly solved.

>>11074342
Can someone explain why they would use AR1 and an expendable rocket? It's two months from the year of our Lord 2020. Throwing Aerojet-priced staged combustion engines into the sea can't be cost competitive, right?

>>11074375
I'm pro-SLS too Anon, but I just lurk here usually. There are dozens of us! Dozens!

>>11074381
>hurr I literally can't read :P

>>11074376
IMO it's the chest region on the Boeing suit that looks bad, like it's been over-inflated. The color is eugh too, you're right, but the helmet is the least of that suit's worries.

>>11074384
SLS will continue to have a place until Starship has demonstrated a couple hundred safe reuses. It makes SLS really pointless when it can do that, but NASA considers SLS human-rated out of the gate. Starship is a risky wildcard that could open the stars or just explode a bunch.

>>11074360
yikes, whose suit is that?
Forcing suit design is stupid because things don't become fashionable because they look good (how do you measure what looks good) but rather because they are iconic. Most fashion items started out as entirely practical apparel eg jeans bomber jackets so 2030 kids will probably start wearing orange NASA suits.

Why can't spacesuit designs look like this? Both utilitarian AND cool. Instead we get teletubbies.

>>11074385
The article doesn't really get into detail as to why it's considered cost effective, just that "it is lol".

>>11074379
>They both look like shit. They need to stop funding anything besides mechanical counterpressure suits and allow the technology to replace it. The pressure issue has already been mostly solved.
Anon, mechanical counterpressure suits are basically sci-fi as of right now. There are a few "working" prototypes, but they're completely impractical for real-world use.
Also, orange suit good.

>>11074376

>>11074379
>mechanical counterpressure suits

Your balls would swell up.

>>11074391
That's SpaceX's suit, except that's the real one, worn by real astronauts, not the mock-up worn by a model they used to promote it. Pic related is how it was SUPPOSED to look.

>>11074387
I really don't mind the bloated chest. It looks more sturdy that way. Then again, I really want the "space suits become like plate mail" future.

>>11074394
another one

>>11074410
I mean. I wouldn't mind a jacket in that style, maybe in a different color.

>>11074415
Well the mock-up looks unironically kino, but that's what happens when you hire the guys that make movie costumes.
It's when you try to apply that logic to functional gear that things become problematic.

>>11074369
Kinda hard to do corruption unless you "try" to build something

>>11074376
NASA suit is slaying, cut, colour, accessories all yasss
t. LGBT

>>11074375
>Thunderfoot
Who?

>>11074390
Starship has a launch escape right?

......right?

>>11074400
They're sci-fi because NASA refuses to fund much research into them and prefers spend hundreds of million in hopes of barely improving the Apollo era designs, yet a small team at MIT got most of the way there on counterpressure suits. Hell, you can wrap yourself in spandex and get 2/3rd of the pressure needed to survive in space, it's only a matter of time until someone cracks it, specifically getting enough pressure to areas like your joints.
>>11074408
It's 2019, bigot, men don't need balls.

>>11074410
He looks like The Stig.

>>11074434
>Top Gear (the good one) but in space
Imagine...

>>11074394
>>11074413
Want a serious answer Anon?
There are two types of spacesuits: hard-suits and soft suits. A pure hardsuit would look like pic related, btw.
Soft-suits are light, flexible, and easy to tailor to individual astronauts. However, their weakness is that they essentially inflate like a balloon when pressurized, making even simple tasks an arduous ordeal of fighting the suit from the inside.
Hard-suits are heavy, rigid, and nearly impossible to customize, but they don't lose any flexibility when pressurized, making them much more easy to work with in practical conditions.
NASA's new xEMU is a hybrid suit design, which uses elements from both. Your suit designs are almost exclusively soft-suits, and would suffer from the same disadvantages.

>>11074427
apollo tech works

>>11074425
it might be able to survive a zero-zero abort if the lower stage fails
the upper stage IS the ship however

>>11074354
I can fap to this pic

>>11074205
>squandering
>resources I paid through taxes
kek How much did you pay for SpaceX to "squander"?

>>11074446
I'd rather stay on earth and die in the asteroid fireball than wear that fashion crime.

>>11074404
Based and suit-pilled.

>>11074453
more than you did, neet incel

>>11074376
I can see the leotard in boing suit

>>11074448
whats a zero-zero abort?

>>11074460
You told him

>>11074465
Zero altitude and zero airspeed, aka sitting still on the pad

>>11074447
>apollo tech works
Yes, it works, but it's terrible expensive and it isn't worth spending so much money on barely improving it. The technology is getting worse in some sense because they did away with custom fitted suits. Modern suits are around 17 times more expensive than in the Apollo era suits were.

It's time to switch to counterpressure suits, the technology is there. They can use elastic fabrics to get most of the pressure needed and coil actuators to get the rest. It's a hard design challenge but very feasible.

>>11074481
Anon, if you think the xEMU is in any way inferior to the Apollo suits, then I'm sorry but you really don't know what you're talking about.

>>11074470
That would never work because the ship engines are pointing straight down.
>>11074481
New designs are a pain though, research, development costs they never work good on first try. I don't disagree with you but I don't blame them for sticking with Apollo tech.

>>11074500
>that would never work
nah

>>11074485
>if you think the xEMU is in any way inferior to the Apollo suits, then I'm sorry but you really don't know what you're talking about.
It's objectively inferior in sizing and your fallacy argument doesn't change this fact. Having to swap out the arms or legs of your suit defeats the purpose of having just one size that fits everyone and you still end up looking like:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj6LYpZosRU

It's obviously less functional in that way than Apollo suits were and it adds unnecessary weight. Custom fitted suits are an improvement and they should have never had tried to get rid of them to save cost.

>>11074504
Anon, how are custom fitted suits superior in anything but aesthetics?

>>11074500
Research and development is why NASA exists. NASA is descended from NACA, which served to teach American companies how to airplanes. NACA didn't build airplanes. NASA should exist to teach American companies how to rockets (ie the Starship refueling joint venture) and launch exploration missions that aren't commercially viable (like Europa Clipper, Juno, the Mars rovers, etc).

>>11074500
Well, it is NASA and they can barely do anything without having to spend millions of dollars more than it should have taken, but I expect the private companies will force the change. Most of the initial research has already taken place over decades, partly funded by NASA, and they've created functioning prototypes. I really believe it's just a matter of time before the switch happens and thinking that they're going to be walking around in bloated space suits a hundred years from now is like thinking that the horse will forever remain the dominate form of transport.

It would be a great question to ask Elon Musk what he thinks about them and if SpaceX has any plan to design a suit for EVA. It seems like he would be the first one to try to make the switch because of his love for slick design.
>>11074554
>Anon, how are custom fitted suits superior in anything but aesthetics?
Weight, for starters, they already try to get their suits as light as possible to aid in mobility. Forcing a naturally weaker person like a small woman to carry the weight of a suit that would support an adult male is nonsensical, they already have countless shoulder issues just from their training. Another thing is just the added size itself and trying to work around it. I would be like putting on a giant snowsuit over your existing one and trying to do physical work, it would get in the way of everything when you're already struggling to move.

>>11074574
You're forgetting that weight is essentially a non-factor in the lunar environment, and that soft suits inhibit movement much more than hard suits.

>>11074586
I'm completely aware of that and it doesn't change the fact that most use of spacesuits are in training on earth, which is why they spend so much money trying to get the weight down. It's one of the biggest factors in suit design, around 30 astronauts have already had to have shoulder surgery because of the training with space suits.

>>11074597
Weight isn't a factor in the NBL either. They can use reduced-weight models for training if they need to do stuff outside of it. I'm really not sure what you're getting at.

>>11074600
>Weight isn't a factor in the NBL either
Yes, it is. I was quoting a NASA astronaut when I was talking about the shoulder issues and it something that is discussed at length within NASA. Here's an old report on it:
https://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20120009404.pdf
>They can use reduced-weight models
Even the reduced weight models are very heavy. You can see the woman in the xEMU suit struggle to get up the stairs, pick up a rock, and she was only able to stand up for ten minutes before she had to get off the stage and recover. It was a reduced weight suit, something like 70 pounds.
> I'm really not sure what you're getting at.
You know exactly what I'm getting at, having to wear something heavier and bulkier is worse than something that is lighter and more form fitting, practically everyone would agree with it, but you're still here playing dumb and ignoring the reality.

>9th Falcon 9 launch and the 11th SpaceX launch of 2019
>911
>9/11
SpaceX did 9/11. Here I thought it was the fucking Jews.

>>11073755
Your right, SLS is just the Jupiter rocket minus the Middle progression :^)

Update on my pressure regulator search. I've looked at sites like Summit Racing, but I couldn't find one that met the pressure requirements I have (~1000 psi inlet to ~200 psi outlet), so I'm going with the one I picked first. Once I get that and it's fittings figured out, all I need plumbing-wise is one electronically operated valve. I really hope I can get thing done!

>>11074128
>>11074135
>>11074145

>Texas Flip and Move Brownsville edition

>>11074378
Nice Isogrid.

>>11074441
Someone did once, and imagined the three being resurrected a couple hundred years in the future doing a cheap rocket challenge. Wish I could find the damn thing again.

>>11075455
>but it's welded from steel, not milled from a single block of aluminum like the kind of precision parts you need in space!

>>11075472
>Clarkson screaming "POWER!" while doing a perilune burn, his spacecraft is falling apart
>May giving a dry technical presentation about why ion drives powered by nuclear reactors are the way of the future, the audience are falling asleep
>Hammond wanders around on what he thinks is the far side of Ganymede, is actually at the north pole on Earth

>>11075489
>As you'd imagine, I've done this properly
>Slaps beat up Falcon 9

>>11074091
Source? See how easy that is retard?

>>11075489
Fund it

>>11074316
You'd be surprised how many blue-collar welder folk could afford to drop their Earth based properties and buy a $500,000 ticket to go weld things together on Mars instead. Snobbish billionaires won't be able to build a casino on Mars on their own, because none of them can figure out which end of a bolt goes in a hole. They're gonna have to pay red-collar Mars men to build their palaces, and in the process a lot of them are gonna turn from billionaires to millionaires, and many of them won't even like Mars and will go back to Earth having spent most of their money and got nothing out of it but a gigantic amount of precious salt.
An industrious Mars colony is the perfect old-money trap to help reset ultra-rich families back to baseline, as god intended.

>>11075497
>"For tonight, Jeff gave us his new lunar lander for us to test, and we're going to test it the only way we know how..."

>>11074354
me rikey, me rikey a rot ^--^

>>11074408
Mechanical pressure on your limbs, pneumatic pressure on your torso, head and genitals. Did I just solve space suit mobility issues via big brain moment?

>>11074500
>That would never work because the ship engines are pointing straight down.
????
What do you mean, do you think the Booster failure is gonna damage the Raptor engines? Not likely, considering they'd start firing IMMEDIATELY and the exhaust plume from those 7 engines is gonna blow any debris back down away from the Starship, and when rocket stages fail they don't actually detonate anyway, they deflagrate, which means a much less destructive release of energy. Elon has said that they can go from zero to firing the engine and ramping to 100% thrust almost instantly, way faster than they've done on the test stand, but it would be hard on the engines so they haven't done it yet. Just to entertain the idea, if a Starship ever had to abort off of a Booster, after it landed they'd probably swap all the engines out for inspection just to make sure they were still good to go. I don't think that by the time Starship is cleared to fly people that there will be any meaningful chance of the Booster failing anyway.

>>11075473
>additive manufacturing
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>11075559
Imagine Starship's hull, tankage, and superstructure being entirely 3D printed.

>>11075568
>Print time remaining
>20000000 hours

>>11075568
It's already additively manufactured, plates of metal welded together into rings and rings stacked into tanks.
The RIGHT way to do it would be to forge a giant steel rod, 10 meters wide and 55 meters tall, then machine it down to the correct outer and inner diameters plus 1 inch within 0.1 thou tolerances, forming the bulkheads as they go, and then do a second pass where they machine isogrids into every surface to save weight. Also, only one milling machine going at a time, and for every half hour of work they need to perform an 8 hour cleaning sweep to remove any and all chips that could otherwise potentially gall up the cutting bit. Every time the bit reaches end of life, after 360 minutes of cutting, it requires a 12 hour operation to replace with a new $440,000 bit and the machine needs to be re-calibrated, because any cheaper option could introduce variations in thickness that go out of the final 0.02 thou thickness deviation spec.

>>11075587
>Shipyards of the future are just fucking huge automated lathes turning out hull after hull

Kino

>>11075587
>mixing metric and imperial measurements
more cursed than anything else there

>>11073672

>>11075719
gotdamn when you put it that way it looks insane
here's my shitty pic of the initial price for both, which looks even more insane

>>11075790
shit i fucked that up im retarded lmao

>>11075790
>>11075808
this one is less retarded

>>11074376
The boeing helmet is interesting. It doesn't look cool but it does seem like it weighs a lot less.

>>11074360
>both have a super awkward facial expression
>both slouching
>the top is too fucking short
>helmet not closed and see through
>gloves not on
Honestly, the short top is the most egrigious. Looks like they're wearing kid spacesuits.

>>11075943
>not wanting to go to space in your pajamas

>>11073093
Daily reminder nada had valid evidence for proliferating life on Mars in the 70's and immediately quit sending life detecting equipment, even though adamant that is their goal.

I really hope Elon is successful in getting people to Mars if only to btfo of NASA

>>11075587
imagine the sm... er, steel

>>11075943
>implying it's a short neck
>implying it's not giant 80s A E S T H E T I C shoulderpads

>>11074885
Well ifc the jews are somewhere in there, pilling the strings

>>11074222
I'd turn into one and get fucked.

>>11074222

>>11074562
I'm which case they're kind of redundant at this point. SpaceX seem to be doing ok

>>11074454
>fashion crime
come on now, it's very fancy
it even won a Michelin star for design

>>11075472
>Top Gear but with spaceships

Star Citizen did that

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wcSgaNQUgo

>>11074354
This is what a rocket would end up looking like if I tried to build it. I can't imagine what oldspace types must think, because you can bet they're watching and it's a physical repudiation of their entire philosophy, a massive shiny middle finger being whacked together by grunts in the dusty open air, poised to expose them as corrupt charlatans peddling a hopelessly uncompetitive product.

Presumably all this exterior plumbing etc. is going to be moved inside for production versions and they're just putting it on the outside to make prototyping easier?

>>11074434
>Some say he urinates asymetric hydrazine, and that he has never seen the Great Wall of China. All we know is he’s called the Stig.

SpaceX Paul Wooster's Mars Society Convention presentation, watch here (fucking spam filter)

https://pastebin.com/7LH7LPSh

>>11073211
nice try SpaceX shill

>>11076199
Nonfagbook video? Upload to YouTube or something

>>11076226
im watching without a jewbook account

>>11076147
Nah, you just don't hear about it much when SpaceX gets technology transfer stuff. SpaceX has been taking a lot of ideas from the past 50 years and finally making them real.

>>11073838
>getting humanity onto multiple other objects
But that is not what they do, the launch commercial payloads into GTO an LEO. No scientfic missions not launching humans no development of lifesupport and so on. Stop repeating their laughable PR claims you gullible fool.

>>11076293
>not launching humans no development of lifesupport

Crew Dragon rings a bell, retard?

>>11076199
>every second word is "you know"
I didn't expect Elon to be giving speaking classes at SpaceX

>>11075719
>government vs private

Really makes you think.

>>11076300
Yeah, that one sure went well.

>>11076312
Technical heads at spacex are autistic people with stem degree and not liberal arts major. Thus you get presentation made for technical presentation not PR relations.

>>11076300
Tbf Crew Dragon is launching NASA astronauts and being funded by NASA money to do this, there currently aren’t any viable customers apart from NASA when it comes to human spaceflight. SpaceX could technically launch their own astronauts, but they haven’t because there’s really no point at the moment.

>>11076354
The Crew Dragon also involved heavy technology transfer with NASA, especially in regards to the life support system.

>>11076358
I notice the lack of complaining about literally every single other rocket company receiving technology transfers from NASA

Starship LAUNCH cost will be less than Falcon 9 according to Paul Wooster. 150t, fully reusable, etc

>>11076363
Nobody’s complaining about technology transfers, just making the point that a lot of the R&D for stuff is done or funded by NASA. This applies to all aerospace companies.

>>11076413
This has been said multiple times already, Wooster’s presentations are somewhat boring, because usually nothing new apart from a few small technical details are revealed.

>>11076433
He did mention that with regards to life support, they are going to use a Dragon 2 derived system initially, as it is sufficient for flights in cislunar space with smaller number of people. Also supported by lots of supplies and spare parts due to high payload capacity. Then they are going to work from there.

Also said that they want to have a central column in the middle of the cabin for radiation shielding in case of solar storms.

shiny boi

>>11075643
>He hasn’t worked in aerospace

>>11076486
Americans should be nuked to oblivion for their crimes against SI

>>11076195
kek

>>11074394
>Why can't spacesuit designs look like this?
a: you don't want bits and pieces and straps to hang lose and risk getting entangled with
b: you want to keep number of parts down to reduce overall risk of failure
c: you want to keep it simple to keep cost down (as well as risk)

>>11076474
>ultra boom

>>11073550
>>11073631
>(x) yes
The funny thing is, the "polymer" in the MIT spacesuit is latex. They tried spandex but it did not provide enough compression. Latex works and is also air tight (and moisture tight).

>>11076529
is that a super soaker?

>>11076192
there are going to be chines, and the plumbing goes under the chines

>>11076199
so what's the timestamp to skip the filk?
Okay, found it while captcha was broken. It's good to hear them talk about the direct lessons they've learned from the heritage projects of NASA like the Space Shuttle

the blue/purple of methane is beautiful

>>11076474
>making it out of mundane stainless steel
>not making it out of glorious Mag-Thor
Elon, wtf are you doing?

>>11076545
Yes, not certain which model though. /toy/ could probably nail it without difficulty.

>>11074376
NASA is the best by far

How do you become an astronaut? If you study astrophysics can you go on space missions or do you get cucked into staying on earth while the cool people go into space?

>>11075719
that's like 1 launch per year
vs
1 launch every other day, for a year

>>11076951
The current flight of astronauts includes a man who:
>Is an ex Navy SEAL, with multiple combat deployments
>Who has a master's in mathematics from Harvard
>And has an MD
You kind of have to reach or exceed those standards to even be considered

>>11076958
Gay, when do regular people get to into space?

>>11076964
After it gets as cheep as flying across Pacific.

>>11076964
20 more years. First few batches of SpaceX plan would require extraordinary men/women and not Joe/Stacy who work 9/5 jobs and party on weekends.

>>11076964
Why do you limit yourself to being a regular person?

>>11076785
if you have a gas oven at home, it is the same color, beautiful indeed

>>11076989
yeah but the gas stove isn't big

>>11076982
Even then, they're probably not going to take many 45 year olds and prioritize younger people. If you're reading this thread in 2019, the chances of you making it to Mars any time in the next 30-40 years is very slim.

>>11076985
>"just get ten degrees and fifty years Air Force experience bro, what's the matter?"
No thanks, just sell me my Starliner ticket and hurry up with the in-flight cocktail already.

>>11076964
Better question, how long until I can get into space just on the merits of having a working body and willing to do boring labor.

>>11077024
Never

>>11077018
>"just get ten degrees and fifty years Air Force experience bro, what's the matter?"
Sounds like one of those bullshit requirements that some companies post when they really don't want anyone applying (or are delusional and expect really high standards for an entry level job).

>>11077026
>advancing spaceflight for the sole purpose of leaving all humans on Earth to rot forever
Pretty sneaky, AI overmind.

>>11077034
>entry-level position
>20 years experience required

>>11077018
Regular people wouldn't be able to afford a Starliner ticket.

Checkmate.
>>11077024
You can barely get a job in first world nations just having those qualifications, let alone in space or on another planet. By that time automation would have hit so hard that even low skill jobs would be rare.

>>11077049
>regular people wouldn't be able to afford a starliner ticket
the math works out cheaper than business class if you assume best case stuff
worst case stuff it doesn't fly
there's no real telling at this point

>>11077049
>Regular people wouldn't be able to afford a Starliner ticket.
They said the same for oceanic crossings and now fat middleclass slobs get shitfaced and fuck on Carnival cruises for the cost of a shitty used car.

>>11077051
>>11077054
Go on any 12 month long(6 months each way) cruises lately? If they had to do the same thing with an oceanliner, tickets would still be prohibitively expensive for most people and they're going to gear it towards the very wealthy. I'm assuming you would want to spend some time on Mars as well which would also increase the cost.

impactlab.net/2019/10/18/international-space-station-crew-3d-prints-meat-in-space-for-the-first-time/

Is this real??

>>11077092
oh, you were talking about trips to Mars?
there's no way they're bringing anybody who doesn't have a viable business plan or is hired by somebody with a viable plan. It'll probably be treated similarly to taking out a large loan.

>>11077102
>oh, you were talking about trips to Mars?
Yes, although I realize that wasn't the context of the conversation now. I just read about someone working in space and without thinking assumed they meant Mars. Tourism there is really nonviable based on the travel times, it would be a once in a lifetime trip for a few very wealthy people.

>>11077096
Yes, but don't think they're just printing out steaks left and right and eating them. Lab grown meat is very expensive and hasn't yet come of age.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-_Zy-arDb0

>>11076474
giver of life and the giver of speed
ever we take even her gravity
her glowing beauty is something to see
bigger and brighter she cometh to me

>>11077191
>virgin mars for the rich
>versus chad there is one planet v

>>11074355
Aesthetics is just as much a selection factor in that spacesuit design as Elon's. What I want to see are the receipts.

>>11074360

Nah, the real problem is the idea of having a suit at all. Starship will be shirtsleeves.

Boohoo some ruskies in the 60s died when they could have worn spacesuits. Build better spacecraft cabins. All shuttle astros may as well have worn nothing at all.

>>11077185
>50 years ago no one imagined humans would leave a footprint on the moon
this is the sort of knowledge level I now expect from people working with NASA in 2019

>>11077294

That said, SpaceX might have a suit stock so their customers can have the full fantasy astronaut experience.

>>11077018
>there is no area between Regular and PhD
that is why you will never see space, not the requirements

>>11077328
I see space right now, checkmate fag.

>>11074369
>>11074420

Soviet-era stuff is just outdated, old equipment not suited for todays requirements. Its also not about corruption but about keeping an unique industrial sector alive that gives Russia immeasurable prestige.

"The first woman and next man to the moon"

This is such a canned line, I'm already sick of hearing it. I wish NASA wouldn't market Artemis like female Ghostbusters.
Future missions:
>The first transperson and next woman
>The first disabled person and next transwoman
>The first little person and next disabled person.

>>11076192
Ease of access is part of it, but other rockets have had some external plumbing as well so not all of it necessarily has to move inside. If it's the side facing away from reentry I don't see why it couldn't just be left external so long as it's calculated that reflected heat from the reentry won't cause any problems with it.

>>11077385
A little person would be at least three times as useful as a token women, cause less strife and consume fewer resources.

>>11077282
>Aesthetics is just as much a selection factor in that spacesuit design as Elon's

In a way your right, it’s purposefully orange to make the crew as visible as possible during recovery operations.

>>11077385
The First Woman and Next Man launched on an American Rocket from American Soil

>>11077385
Who cares if it helps public interest in space travel?

>>11077400
Expendable midgets are not just a good idea, they're imperative to humanity's success in space.

>>11077425
This, and this is why "nuke Mars!" is a good idea. Nuke Mars not because it will magically terraform Mars. Nuke Mars because it will give us good baseline data for what changing the water vapor content of the Martian atmosphere does to the planet's climate, and because nuking Mars is fucking cool. It's like a planetary impactor for terraforming science.

>>11077339
Kek

>>11077385
Well it started a long time ago but it's especially relevant now, a while back the political parties decided that their best strategy was instead of arguing over who's overall policy would be better for the entire country, it would be better to split and balkanize the population into identity groups with each party being the champion of only that group. The result is that now every government project can only be justified in the context of whether or not it advances the goals of one of the balkanized groups, so space exploration isn't worth it unless Tranny WoMexicans of Color who spiritually identify as wolves are specifically advantaged over other members of society.

>>11077400
>cause less strife and consume fewer resources.
Maybe we should only send Little People to Mars along with Elon Musk. It can be like their own Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. Elon will be Willy Wonka, of course.
>>11077420
Yikes. That's enough for a drinking game any time you watch something from NASA. Drink every time you hear:
>First woman
>Next man
>American soil
>American rocket
>>11077425
It doesn't, it just makes it look like there's no reason to go to the moon other than to place whatever token non-CIS male there. They should focus on the science and how it will help advance space travel in general.

People are going to be interested in STEM/Space if that's what their geared for. Female empowerment slogans are worthless. Some of the countries with the most feminists have the largest gap in genders for certain jobs like nursing.

>>11077445
>It doesn't
>Female empowerment slogans are worthless.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dana_Scully#%22The_Scully_Effect%22

>>11077400

>A little person

This begs the following questions:

1: When are we going to see childeren being launched into space?

2: How long can a child spend time in space before irreparable damage is done to his/her's bodily development?

3: How close are we to building things that mimic Earth's gravity in space (Think of spinning rings, simulating gravity through centrifugal forces)?

4: Will we ever see the use of gravity plates (using a higgsboson field to simulate gravity)?

>>11077451
That's literally anecdotal pop-science bullshit with a source from Yes Magazine. If female empowerment propaganda worked, the gender gap would have been closed already. There are natural differences in interests between the average male and female, regardless of the environment they were raised in. If we look at better evidence, such as the gender gap in the most equal countries on the planet, we see that in some cases the gender gap actually widens.

Just stop with the bullshit.