Why are contemporary British writers so timid and juvenile? Every British book is the same shit, disaffected man-children hopping through stock urban locations and at the end there's incest or something.

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Anonymous Sun Sep 6 22:51:51 2015 No.7081947 [Reply] [Original]

Why are contemporary British writers so timid and juvenile? Every British book is the same shit, disaffected man-children hopping through stock urban locations and at the end there's incest or something.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 6 22:52:37 2015 No.7081948 Because contemporary British are timid and juvenile.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 6 22:53:04 2015 No.7081951 >>7081947 an aristocracy becoming increasingly detached from the land will yield such things

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 6 22:55:08 2015 No.7081957 that doesn't sound timid tbh.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 6 22:59:24 2015 No.7081973 >>7081957 It's the most timid gutless thing imaginable. I hate to use the word edgy but it's precisely right for this kind of crap that still thinks pedophilia, bestiality, the scatological, whatever, is shocking and literary in itself

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 6 23:14:29 2015 No.7082015 >>7081951 >an aristocracy >modern british writers >being aristocratic at all

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 6 23:16:29 2015 No.7082021 >>7081973 that is quite the definition of timid you got there. almost scared to know what you consider 'brave'

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 00:10:30 2015 No.7082227

>>7082021
Artistic timidity and timidity regarding what to say at a nice dinner party are different things.

Decades down the road when they're studying postmodern lit they'll scan over passages about raping your sister or getting your intestines sucked out through your ass like we do Victorian passages about chastity and goodly Christian virtue, not even engaging with it enough to get mad, just bored. These guys aren't making anyone faint and drop their monocle, they're just safe and dull.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 00:41:51 2015 No.7082335 >>7082227 I don't see the point in calling people timid when you have set no reference point. But go ahead with the vague poorly worded insults

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:17:30 2015 No.7083181 >>7082015 These kind of writers are still overwhelmingly oxbridge toffs playing working class m8

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:23:06 2015 No.7083188 File: 29 KB, 460x276, nigel-farage-008.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7081951 tips

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:26:26 2015 No.7083192 OP or anyone else here: Is anyone interested in discussing the state of contemporary British fiction, particularly new authors? I invest a lot of time on the subject but I'm hesitant to waste my energy if this is a shitposting thread.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:28:46 2015 No.7083194 >>7083192 Please, at least one person will be interested.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:31:10 2015 No.7083197

Did you watch the Book Club on Australian TV too?

If not: Will Self was a guest on Sunday, they were discussing children's books, and he was hilariously snobbish.

"We are discussing picture books here! But we are adults! We should discuss adult things!"

It did get tiring after about 1 minute though.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:36:33 2015 No.7083201

>>7083197
Will Self just seems like the shittiest most self-satisfied guy. There was an piece of his on Orwell and how he's representative of the English love for mediocrities, while true geniuses like himself go unnoticed. He didn't even make really any specific criticism of Orwell, he just calls him square for emphasizing the practical and not being a cool kid like him writing books where sexually vivacious chimps rule the world

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:36:46 2015 No.7083202

>>7082015
1. Ned Beaumann, privately educated and then Oxbridge educated, the son of a renowned publisher (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ned_Beauman))

2. Adam Thirwell: privately educated and then Oxbridge educated (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Thirlwell))

3. Zoe Pilger: privately educated and then Oxbridge educated, daughter of famous journalist (http://www.independent.co.uk/biography/zoe-pilger))

4. Emma Healey: privately educated and then studied an MFA (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emma_Healey))

5. Alex Christofi: privately educated and then Oxbridge educated, before becoming a literary agent (https://twitter.com/alex_christofi))

6. Adam Foulds: privately educated and then Oxbridge educated (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Foulds))

7. Ross Raisin: Privately educated and then PG Dip in Creative Writing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ross_Raisin))

8. Will Self: Privately educated and then Oxbridge educated (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Will_Self))

I could go on. Writing is a plaything of the rich.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 07:40:43 2015 No.7083206 >>7083194 Which contemporary authors have you read?

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 08:40:19 2015 No.7083337

>>7083201
Wasn't that the article where he rambles on about advocating plain English which is understandable by the everyman is a bad thing? I wanted to punch that cunt. Being able to write something that can be understood by as many people as you can (whilst still maintaining its quality) isn't undesirable.

i always get the impression from self that he's a lazy but highly confident and self-assured man; he has no creativity or energy, but people around him think he's intelligent because he seems to know what he's talking about and he clearly doesn't care about earthly matters. only sheer laziness can explain why he managed to get a 3rd in PPE at oxford (i do that fucking degree, and you have to spend less than 5% of your time studying to get anything less than a 2:1)

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 08:41:11 2015 No.7083339 >>7083202 >I could go on. Writing is a plaything of the rich. So is everything in the UK. A list of popular television comedians would yield similar results, for example.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 08:42:24 2015 No.7083344

>>7083337
>only sheer laziness can explain why he managed to get a 3rd in PPE at oxford (i do that fucking degree, and you have to spend less than 5% of your time studying to get anything less than a 2:1)

Well, he was a junky. Rebellious enough to mess up his grades but not quite rebellious enough to drop out and get a real job.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 08:59:15 2015 No.7083383 >>7083339 Stand up comedy is less rigged

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:08:54 2015 No.7083395 >>7081973 Yo are you trying to slander my book?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:11:59 2015 No.7083398 >>7083337 I know it's a bit armchair psychology but I think Self is one of the best "public" speakers, he speaks slow, extremely controlled, and in a deep bass - to people that way of talking just immediately says "intelligence".

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:19:09 2015 No.7083409 >>7083202 Who?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:20:41 2015 No.7083413 >>7082021 He might have had a point if he'd called on them to be more politically brave.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:24:06 2015 No.7083419

>>7083398
When you go by mere audience percentage, yeah, but there's the problem of it actually not being intelligent speaking, and of it not appealing to actually perceptive, actually intelligent people, who after the psych-study is over, will go ahead to alter opinion.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:38:50 2015 No.7083458 >>7083409 All contemporary British novelists who have received awards and mainstream praise.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:46:33 2015 No.7083477

tfw the working class is dead in England

back in the 60s we ruled everything, every politician was state schooled, all the writers and musicians and filmmakers were working class

then thatcherism happened, though we tried again during new labour and sort of achieved something

now though, its worse than ever

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:49:35 2015 No.7083483 >>7083477 What can we do buddy?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:52:54 2015 No.7083489 >>7083483 the fire rises

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:54:24 2015 No.7083493 >>7081947 Idk, I cant tell if Will Self or Martin Amis is worse. The French and Murkans are the only ppl who can be do writing like good y'all tbh fam smdh.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:55:07 2015 No.7083495 >>7083458 Oh.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:55:56 2015 No.7083497

>>7083477
You're romanticizing things of course, but it is true that for literature at least the number of working class authors has decreased significantly. In the 60s there were enough working class writers to justify a literary movement (Angry Young Men), now there are only regional writers aping foreign writers (Ben Brooks aping Tao Lin et al, Joe Stretch aping Houellebeq, and so on) and writers who aim to write shock novels designed to entertain the bored middle-classes who want an image of what it is to be working class (Richard Milward's debut "Apples" involves parental abuse, rape, infanticide, drugs, etc). Not saying these things don't happen but it's cheap to throw these things in for a reaction IMO. MFAs are now a big thing, though unlike in the US there don't seem to be any that offer a scholarship based on merit / potential (in return for the candidate being willing to teach and live frugally). Publishing houses are closing down and going for safe bets to squeeze whatever money they can from a public they treat like children. Ireland however is doing rather well, and has a tradition of encouraging their young writers with grants and the willingness to see their work in print. Colin Barrett and Rob Doyle are both new Irish Writers who benefitted from being published in Ireland and then having their works bought by UK press.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 09:56:19 2015 No.7083498 >>7083489 oooh i like you

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:00:53 2015 No.7083508 >>7083497 As someone with no connections to any sort of literary group or movement, how would I go about submitting a novel to be considered for publishing? My work is disgusting but virile. I need money.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:01:14 2015 No.7083511

>>7083192
Gabriel Josipovici's What Ever Happened to Modernism? has some harsh words about current British fiction, though its not the focus of the book. Josipovici himself is one of the few interesting British novelists atm, to which I would add Ali Smith, Lars Iyer, and Tom McCarthy (I haven't read Self)

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:02:51 2015 No.7083516 >>7083511 9. Gabriel Josipovici: privately educated and then attended Oxbridge (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabriel_Josipovici))

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:04:02 2015 No.7083517 >>7083508 Smuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:10:05 2015 No.7083525

>>7083508
Well I'm in the same position and all you can do is submit to agents and independents who take submissions.

I wrote half a novel aged 21 and submitted an excerpt and the first place that read it wanted to read the whole thing, but I withdrew because it was plebeian garbage. I've since written another novel, which was rejected by around 20 agents / publishers. I am now attempting to complete a third novel but I'm going to make sure that I have the style right before I continue. It's finding the time that's the biggest worry for me. Rarely has a noteworthy author written anything worthwhile while working a full-time job, but the current state of the job market and the publishing business makes the idea of risking financial security extremely hazardous. I could just about pay for an MA but fuck that.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:18:03 2015 No.7083542 >>7083477 >new labour >working-class nice one, mong

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:19:24 2015 No.7083545

>>7083517

It's not smut, it is absoloute heartbreak poured onto page with riddles, red herrings and based 'philosophical', religious and psychological concepts to boot.

>>7083525

That's a shame you withdrew. You lost faith in the work? Or the excerpt was the cream of the crop and you felt embarrassed sending the rest in for giving a false representation of the entire work? Either way, is there a list of agents and independents somewhere on the web or might you even be so kind to share contact details?

Whilst we're here, what sort of novel are you writing? I'm getting a fantasy, GoT vibe from you. And what sort of style are you aiming at?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:20:25 2015 No.7083546 >>7083545 By that I meant *Write smuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:26:20 2015 No.7083563

>>7083546

I don't know if I could do that. I'm tempted. I know I could do it.

But muh integrity. I work with the Holy Spirit and that would be an abuse of said contract. I mean I'm already walking a fine line.

I don't know. You think I should write smut? How could one retain integrity in smut?

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:28:46 2015 No.7083570

>>7083545
I realized it was trash, and have no interest in contributing to the trashheap that is British contemporary fiction. As for agents there is the annual agents book that some googling will find, though personally I looked up the agents of authors whose books I don't necessarily enjoy but who are writing the same sort of stuff I'm writing. Your success in finding them will depend on your interest in doing so.

Not fantasy at all. I'm writing a sort of picaresque novel about two unemployed brothers living in a post-industrial town, one of whom defends his refusal to look for work, while the other looks desperately for any jobs he is able to find. What do you mean by "style"? Style is very important to me, which is why I'm not rushing into it too quickly. I have most of the plot sorted, but the writing style is what's slowing me down, as I keep telling myself that the way I'm writing is fraudulent and the result of insecurity and the subsequent desperation to please. I know once I get it right then I'll be set, but it's a matter of tuning things properly at the minute. What are you working on?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:32:19 2015 No.7083580 >>7083563 Don't write smut, you idiot. Pursue your dreams, ya wag.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:52:02 2015 No.7083623

>>7083570

Oh fair enough. You've definitely got the neurotic self-doubt of a great writer but keep that self-critic under control lest it destroy you completely. You seem fairly balanced though, I'd like to see less self-doubt.

Your scrutinizing your style, is that a chasing for depth that you cannot find in plot? Are you not excited by the plot? I love experimenting with style. The novel I'm wanting to send out is a collection of short stories with repeating themes, like vignettes and accompanying experiments with style. One of them is an egoic stream of conscious with no grammar whatsoever until the last sentence which shakes the reader out of the stream of consciousness with an awareness of how that consciousness was acting in a non-aware way. So it gets kind of meta in that way. Style is fun, don't let it boss you around.

So that was that, the heartbreak piece, which will never be able to be repeated. It is absoloutely distinct in it's form, which is why I want to send it out. It will probably get rejected because I'm not sure if it's verging on the overtly occult.

Since then I've been writing short stories again. They're always little head trips with a twisty ending. The most recent one follows a man who is going on a blind date. He has a pre-date ritual of seeing a hooker to get rid of anxiety based around the self- he is a successful man but doesn't feel it, and cannot judge the intentions of the women he dates with regard to do they like him for him or for his success and money. He sees this hooker and there is something ethereal about her, she sweeps him off his feet and they have this kind of quietly intense moment with one another - he thinks he's her soul mate. When he asks her name she tells him her name and it is the same name of the blind date he's about to go and see. Then he is miserable and goes home to watch the news on TV. It's supposed to be all up in the air with regard to interpretation. What do you think?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 10:55:28 2015 No.7083629 >>7083580 Smut would be easy though. A sideline perhaps.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 11:01:41 2015 No.7083650 >>7083383 money can't teach you to tell a joke

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 11:03:24 2015 No.7083655 >>7083344 Looking to do that next year, what do you think of the course? Also, anything you'd recommend reading beyond the obvious?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 7 11:05:48 2015 No.7083666 >>7083655 Oops meant >>7083337

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 11:45:00 2015 No.7083770

>>7083623
>>7083623
I've focused quite a lot on plot with this novel. My previous one was rejected for being too plotless I feel, which is something I can accept. I focused more on the writing style and quality of articulation more than plot, and I feel the work suffered for it. Yes I am intrigued by plot, but it's hard to tell when description of movement is superfluous, when enough time has been spent on a scene and so on. This is something I'm working on, and I feel my plot is in a good place.

Good luck with your short stories but do let me warn you that publishing short stories is notoriously difficult, and that unless you have had a bunch of them published and have made something of a name for yourself, then the odds are low for your getting any positive feedback. For some recent ones check out Colin Barrett's "Young Skins" and more recently Tom Morris's "We Don't Know What We're Doing". Colin's is the better of the two books in my opinion, but each will give you a sense of what is currently floating around out there. That short story idea reminds me of She Stoops to Conquer. It sounds interesting, if I was in your position I would make sure to understand that sort of culture ("Punting" is what it's referred to in the UK) and avoid it being too melodramatic or idealogical. I offer this advice only because it was an old tendency of mine which tended to spoil things, as I rushed to the one sentence I knew would be slotted in the end, and the rest of the story suffered as a result.

But without trying to sound like I know what I'm talking about, I'd say it's good that you're having ideas and I would encourage you to always remain open to new ones. Paul Schrader, screenwriter for Taxi Driver, has repeatedly said how basic the movie is in terms of its structure. He started with a theme he thought was relevant for his culture (loneliness), looked for a symbol that represent this (a taxi driver as being surrounded by people but fundamentally separated from them), and worked out the rest of the story from that basic structural footing. I feel this is relevant in short stories especially, where you don't have much time to say something that is memorable. The ability to remember a short story is I feel often more important than the precision of the writing. I can remember the basic plots of a dozen or more Carver stories simply because of how interesting one image or set-piece was, and that's what you should aim for while being strict with yourself in terms of not selling out to your more restless instincts that would have you settle for cliches and hackneyed phrases when what you should insist on, mentally speaking, is a series of words that work so well to articulate something in a deeper and more interesting way than you have seen expressed. John Williams is very good at doing this in Stoner. You know he means what he says, and that he isn't trying to impress you with obscure words or impose emotions on you that the work does not merit.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 12:30:42 2015 No.7083923

>>7083770

I feel like if I'm focusing too much on prose or descriptive elements then I am condescending to the reader. Like I'm jerking off in their face or something. I feel like people know what a sunset is, people have experiences, and to assume they need an element explained for them is to assume they need to have things explained to them and that I'm happy to do it in a flowery way, which of course I'm not. This devalues the intellect of the reader and gets in the way of communicating concepts.

The beginning sentence of another story goes

'It was 38 degrees centigrade; the dust of the desert floor reflected the mid-day rays'

It's simple, non-superfluous. I even rewrote it to make it more descriptive but ended up changing it back, because we know what heat reflecting off a surface looks like. It's shimmery. And it has nothing to do with the plot.

of the first story I outlined: 'They peered at one another with darting eyes, studying each others face in the fullness of the silence - her complexion reflected the moonlight, her hair was pasted in strands across her damp forehead'

I don't want to wank with the language. It's always direct, gently communicative. That's why the stories tend to be short. I had been reading some Philip K. Dick shorts and was amazed at the concentration of the stories. I'm pretty sure it was Tolstoy who said in the future short stories would become the norm.

Looking at the plot for She Stoops to Conquer, you're right that is quite familiar. I've never read or heard of that story but do you know what's hilarious? The brothel in my story is actually called Marlow's, for no distinct reason, and Marlow is the surname of the main character in She Stoops. Fancy that.
What culture are you talking about? Seeing a hooker before a date? I don't know what that culture is, and punting is giving me nothing on google. It's definitely not melodramatic, it's in fact the opposite. Minimalist and deadpan. I'd like to leave it up to the reader to place their emotion in the words so that it's like a communication happening and I'm not...well...just jerking off in their face.

Anonymous Mon Sep 7 21:38:56 2015 No.7086194
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>>7083655
>>7083666
>what do you think of the course

it's alright. i don't ever feel the need to work hard at it, but i always feel i don't work hard enough. phil/pol have so many ways to tackle an essay or problem that writing essays often feels deficient. nothing more satisfying than nailing a problem. i'm doing philosophy and econ from this year on; it's very versatile. i think the course is alright.

if you want to do it, power to you. but there are a lot of pseudointellectuals and wankers at oxford. there are at any university, i guess. often the place feels cripplingly smug, self-satisfied, and filled with middle class kids who seem all too happy to be mediocre (working class lad w/ a chip on his shoulder reporting)

>Also, anything you'd recommend reading beyond the obvious?

politics

most valuable book i read was charles tilly's coercion, capital, and european states; it's on the syllabus, and it's golden and you can wind long essays on it if you know anything about history.

other than that anything goes

economics

not really anything specific. if you want, look over one of the textbooks. varian's intermediate microeconomics is free on the internet as a pdf, and that's a first year econ textbook.

philosophy

read anything. want some good foundations on moral phil, epistemology, and metaphysics. i read aj ayer's language, truth, and logic for the latter two for the ucas shit. but i think they were bored of it, since it's really easy to go "hurrdurr how do u verify the verification principle?! xd fuk u ayer"

Anonymous Tue Sep 8 04:32:35 2015 No.7087156

>>7083923
I'd say the prose and descriptive elements are pretty separate issues, though I think I understand your concern and again it's good that you're aware of the potential of these things to undermine your work. And yes, the sunset example is a useful one. I'd ask yourself how different writers you respect would create some sort of effect while describing the sunset. The worst would be overly descriptive (IMO) and attempt to overwhelm you with this isolated image of the sunset, using abstract metaphors and obscure words and a totally false sense of feeling. The best however, again in my own paltry opinion, would describe it in a way that fits the context of the story, and reinforce the theme or tone you have already asserted. It's an easy go-to example but the ending of Joyce's The Dead is so good because it provides the sense of an ending that the story itself has been pushing towards. If the story overall had been dull that ending would come across as a desperate attempt to rescue it from mediocrity, but you get the sense that Joyce knows he doesn't have to push it too far because he trusts that you understand what he is trying to say and why the image of snow falling in unseen places is a meaningful way of expressing it. One book I would recommend for this is David Foster Wallace's "The Pale King". He is obviously notorious for colouring in the entire picture book and leaving no room for the reader to fill some gaps of their own, but the way he does it is illustrative and shows a total comprehension of an image, rather than a desperate attempt to prove he knows what he is talking about. If you're writing from a position of familiarity, whether real or feigned, it comes across as such to the reader I feel.

With your own sentence, I would personally (again take this at face value) remove the "centigrede", as I would trust the reader to understand whether its fahrenheit or not as the story proceeds, to remove the rather jarring semi-colon, and to make it clearer what you mean by "dust" of the desert floor, because personally I just picture sand.

Also is it being 38 degrees specifically noteworthy?

If it's weirdly high then: "It had reached 38 degrees" implies exactly that

Also "desert floor" seems like a weird image, as the idea of a "floor" isn't really associated with a desert.

Subjective and possible flawed alteration: "It was thirty eight degrees, and the the mid-day rays reflected on the desert sand"

I'm talking about the culture of using prostitutes. Too often you'll find writers who know very little about a subject and will do one of two things. One is to research it in a totally detached and uninteresting way, and then paste a load of facts and trivia in an attempt to make the reader familiar with it also. Two is that they will feign familiarity with a subject and come across as a total fraud. What I'd do is gain some sort of vicarious understanding of what it would be like if you used prostitutes in this way.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 8 05:52:49 2015 No.7087307 >>7083770 >>7087156 Am I the only person on /lit who enjoys extremely long sentences, a la Proust or Lazlo Krasznahorkai? I find that kind of minimalism overdone, stiff and lacking emotion tbh.

Anonymous Tue Sep 8 06:48:06 2015 No.7087395

>>7087156

I was considering this point last night actually. If it's a military-themed story, the sunset gave it's final salute etc. somewhere in the vein of that. but then again I find no value in talking about the sunset when on the same page I'm talking about a soldier who likes to suck milk from goat teats. It's like there is an economy of focus and it's not gonna be spent on aesthetics, like saying 'I'm not fucking around with you, but there is a soldier who likes to drink milk from goats teats'. I don't know. Do you get what I mean? It's like it IS abstract, so deal with it. And that's what I hope to achieve in your sense of the reader knowing what is being communicated. That could explain why centigrade is in there, either exactly because it's redundant or because it establishes separation by concept; often words are redundant so in effect saying take and leave what you will; The meaning is behind the words and between us, but it's not here specifically in the heat of the day. (But it is hot and we're in a desert, btw). Call it a smiling tease or me a cynical writer.

'It had reached 38 degrees' Implies implied intent, so if I were a good writer and wanted to imply intent with the weirdly high heat then It had reached would fit better. In this case the heat just is. It's hot and we're in a desert. And the desert has a floor because it suggests it is a surface that could be anywhere, only it's a desert floor this time.

If the theme of the story was that humanity is a collective and there is no individuality then the desert floor could be sand, sand being fragmented rock and indiscriminate from one grain to the other. As it happens, the story is empathetic and bridging enemies from one individual to the other and so the sand metaphor doesn't fit where floor you can have a kitchen floor or a desert floor. A floor is a floor, yet it is also transferable concept.

Ultimately It is a battle theme, and the sniper team spots an enemy sniper, who suddenly is eating a sandwich out of a shrink-wrap. The sniper can't shoot him because he's eating out of shrink-wrap. Do you get that? It's funny. Kitchen floor. Desert floor. Empathy. shrink-wrap - he imagines only a mother would package a sandwich so. The backup they call in turns out to be an airstrike, and their selves are destroyed in it.The realisation of empathy destroys the self leading to death and further suggests separation is required for reflection aka existence.

Hey, if you wanna throw me some bucks I'd be happy to research the brothel. Haha. But in this case it's not a study on prostitution but a vehicle for thought. Again fogue-like. I see what you mean though, if someone who is familiar with visiting brothels reads it and says 'urgh that's so not what it's like' they might not be so immersed by the story. But again, my aim isn't to convey brothel culture at all. The brothel is lit by fairy lights because I wanted it to be etc.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 8 08:57:36 2015 No.7087658 >>7083337 If you read his books you wouldn't say he has no creativity.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 8 09:00:55 2015 No.7087670 File: 206 KB, 384x407, Screen Shot 2015-08-24 at 23.23.53.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>7082227 >we do Victorian passages about chastity and goodly Christian virtue hahahhahaahhahahahahhaahhahahhaahahahahahahahahahahhaah (cont. p420)

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/lit/ - Literature