What the fuck happened to fantasy? Why is it all loosely Medieval European? Where are the truly alien worlds? The civilizations unlike our own? It all feels so inspired by Tolkien. Help, /lit/. Where's the actually fantastical stuff?

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Anonymous Wed Jan 7 19:51:08 2015 No.5965074 [Reply] [Original]

What the fuck happened to fantasy? Why is it all loosely Medieval European? Where are the truly alien worlds? The civilizations unlike our own? It all feels so inspired by Tolkien.

Help, /lit/. Where's the actually fantastical stuff?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 19:52:29 2015 No.5965081 You won't find it in mainstream fantasy. Go back to Borges.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 19:55:32 2015 No.5965091 Reach in my anus with your finger like a curious earthworm and you will find what you seek.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 19:56:44 2015 No.5965098 >>5965091 B-but I already do that with my boyfriend, anon

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 19:58:14 2015 No.5965112

I dont know but it feels very tired. I wanted to see a fantasy that took place in the real world, but not some kind of faux-interaction or interactions in a nuanced way (like one town or city) but something that actually affected the real world on a large scale. I dont even know if it's possible to do something like that without the book itself reading like something completely retarded.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:01:04 2015 No.5965130 >>5965112 Sounds like a fantasy equivalent to Earthbound, with Tolkein replaced by Final Fantasy

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:01:13 2015 No.5965132 Sci-fi.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:01:37 2015 No.5965134 >>5965112 Those exist more in the vein of science fiction, especially if those changes are technology-related. Unless you're talking about urban fantasy, which does occasionally have those elements.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:02:41 2015 No.5965144 >>5965074 >>5965112 You can find both a truly alien world and something that affects the real world on a large scale in this single Borges story: http://art.yale.edu/file_columns/0000/0066/borges.pdf

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:03:37 2015 No.5965151 >>5965130 I dont think that is necessarily the case but that is what would most likely happen. It would be nice to see something different though, everything feels so same-y now.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:07:32 2015 No.5965177
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>>5965074
Fantasy literature is medieval european in tone because it is medieval European in origin. Tolkien drew most of his influence from works like Beowulf. Of course Tolkien was not the first but he essentially unintentionally shaped with his quite good work a shallow derivative pulp genre.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:08:03 2015 No.5965179 >>5965074 Because most of the morons that read it don't want anything else.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:08:17 2015 No.5965180
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>>5965074
I have a writing group, and most of us write genre fiction and critique each others' stuff. I have a tendency to write more traditional stuff, and my friends criticize me for it. However, they do admit that where I excel is in developing characters, and I think that one of the key attributes in fantasy is always going to be characters in a semi-fantastical environment, but never too outlandish.

Why never too outlandish? Because the world begins to distract from the character. The more truly alien the world, the physiology, and the nature of belief in the setting, the less engaging the character really is. People read literature and expect connection at a human level. That's why most "fantasy" races are just humans with some slightly distorted attribute, and why xenophobia is such a common aspect.

I would argue that the genre has become gutted with unoriginal settings in pursuit of a vehicle that will better convey the character within the setting.

If you want a more enthralling world, you can have one, but it comes at the cost of characters being worth the novel they exist within. If this happens, the work becomes less.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:22:16 2015 No.5965247

>>5965074
I stopped trying to write 'nonstandard' fantasy relatively recently. I looked at current trends in the genre and saw that nothing being published featured a protagonist who wasn't a human or an elf or something like that.

It's better to just give in and accept the trend. I'm trying to push the envelope, but work within the confines we've been given. Is it stifling? Sure. But it's also the only way to get out there.

That's why the genre is so stagnant. The publishers choose what gets out into the world, and they've chosen tried and true.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:30:25 2015 No.5965286 >>5965074 because there is actually a thin line between fantasy and sci-fi. Medieval European is one of the things that make it distinctive from sci-fi

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:32:59 2015 No.5965298

Are there any fantasy novels that get published that deal with gods or divine beings in any capacity? I haven't paid attention the genre for a very long time and I wonder if the growing anti-religious sentiment among people would make something like deities would be almost taboo now.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:42:57 2015 No.5965356

It's a tragic irony that the fantasy appellative, originally used to refer to the most genuinely strange and imaginative literature there was, has in the past century come to denote only the most unoriginal kind of melodramatic schlock the publishers are shoveling out in heaps in order to maximize profits. Your favorite pseudo-historical action adventure novels like Lord of the Rings and A Song of Ice and Fire are not authentic fantasy.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:48:40 2015 No.5965384 >>5965298 You clearly haven't read fantasy. It's stagnant as fuck. Bestsellers are things like Name of the Wind and Mistborn. Generic fantasy still holds to its most fundamental conventions.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:48:57 2015 No.5965385

>>5965356

I dont think that kind of fantasy is bad, I think it's just overdone. If someone writes a good book in that vein then it is still a good book. It just gets harder to find gems when publishers are spewing out mountains of trash to try to make money.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:53:05 2015 No.5965400 >>5965074 Read some pre-Tolkien stuff, like Lud-in-the-Mist. It feels completely different, though not truly alien if that's what you're mainly seeking.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 20:59:49 2015 No.5965431 >>5965384 I didn't think Mistborn had any actual gods in it, just the guy who attained god-like powers. I mean classical actual deities, but you are right I largely dont read fantasy anymore and haven't for a very long time.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:09:37 2015 No.5965470 File: 497 KB, 1440x1152, mb_allomantic_webres.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5965384 >Mistborn >generic Why do people talk about books they have not read?

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:12:21 2015 No.5965480

>>5965470
Everyone fucking gushes about the stupid-ass magic system. E V E R Y O N E who reads this fucking book, and I don't get it. Sure, it isn't the run-of-the-mill stuff, but it isn't THAT special.

Allomancy does not make up for everything utterly basic about the work.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:13:42 2015 No.5965485 >>5965470 Oh cool the magic system is just like in the famous tittysucking anime The Qwaser of Stigmata

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:13:52 2015 No.5965486 >>5965074 Every time I read the words 'magic system' I laugh hysterically until I remember that people make money off of this garbage

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:14:39 2015 No.5965493 >>5965130 >Implying Tolkien isn't the Dragon Quest of literature

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:18:58 2015 No.5965511

>>5965486
Agreed. Some fucking autist I know "speedreads" through fantasy novels. He devours at least one a day, and the thing that he always gushes about is MUH MAGIC SYSTEM.

He even told me he wished there were books that just discussed magic systems instead of talking about a story.

Seriously, who gives a shit?

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:22:26 2015 No.5965535

Its not good to go full fucking sperg developing an intricate magic system, but its not good to have a "magic bitch I ain't gotta explain shit" system. Whatever happened to magic just being something that happened in the story that was solid enough to make sense but not fucking detailed enough to go full fucking retard? When did people get so autistic about that shit?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:23:42 2015 No.5965542 >>5965356 >Lord of the Rings >Action >Pseudo-historical Are you retarded?

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:24:25 2015 No.5965546
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>>5965470
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Qwaser_of_Stigmata

>Qwaser: any of the anthropoid beings who possess supernatural powers affording them utility over a single chemical element.

lol

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:25:38 2015 No.5965552 >>5965511 Wow. Have you beat the shit out of this guy yet? I hope you do. He deserves to be put down like a blind old dog.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:25:56 2015 No.5965553 >>5965542 No, but you're an autistic pedant

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:28:31 2015 No.5965562 >>5965553 >Oh shit, I'm wrong, better call him autistic so I can have the upper hand!

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:30:26 2015 No.5965573 >>5965562 Actually, I'm correct. I wouldn't have called you a pedant otherwise. Try again.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:31:51 2015 No.5965579 >>5965552 I think he should be allowed to read things he enjoys. There is nothing wrong with being a pleb. IN fact, the world requires them.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:32:21 2015 No.5965582 >>5965486 >>5965511 you can probably find a video of that fat faggot mormon brandon sanderson "lecturing" at length about how to develop a magic system in his creative writing class. it's fucking embarrassing.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:34:25 2015 No.5965587

>>5965074

Magical realism is where its at son. At least, that's whats getting the kids into high fantasy.

The genre is full of hacks and Tolkein/Rowling wannabes, but there are hacks and wannabes in every genre. Perhaps there are more in fantasy than in other genres, but that doesn't mean good quality fantasy doesn't exist.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:34:55 2015 No.5965590 >>5965582 Lol he's a Mormon? Why do so many of them seem to be drawn to the fantasy genre?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:35:50 2015 No.5965594 >>5965582 I thought Mormons weren't allowed to read anything involving magic 'cos its the devils work.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:37:35 2015 No.5965605 File: 47 KB, 640x475, wolfe.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] So what modern fantasy books attempt to be somewhat original, aside from this?

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:44:46 2015 No.5965619 >>5965590 Their founder was a fantasy author, after all.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:44:53 2015 No.5965620 >>5965605 Depends on what you mean by "modern". Fantasy, as the genre we know today, didn't really come into its own until the mid/late 19th century. So depending upon who you ask, almost all fantasy could be considered modern.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:47:46 2015 No.5965628
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>>5965605
The best fantasy author of recent times is John Crowley. I recommend his novel Little, Big, but don't expect much action or adventure in it. It's completely different from the Tolkienesque stuff that fantasy fans read. The story is rather quiet and not a whole lot happens on the surface, though there is much going on beneath, and it has some of the most beautiful prose of any fiction from the past few decades. His Ægypt tetralogy is also supposed to be excellent, though I haven't read it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:49:27 2015 No.5965633 File: 929 KB, 2833x4062, 1298224229747[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >looking for interesting fantasy worlds in genre fiction instead of playing Morrowind

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:51:42 2015 No.5965636

is there any fantasy that's not about the fate of the world or even a nation but rather a novel about a knight or something, something akin to "the children of Hurin" i guess. Not epic or grand. just a book about a dude and an event or romance or something but set in a fantasy universe.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:53:07 2015 No.5965638 >>5965636 Tons. Look harder.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:53:42 2015 No.5965641 >>5965620 You could say it has its origins in the Gothic fiction of the late 18th century, in the chivalric romances of the Middle Ages, in ancient mythological epic poems, or in the endlessly imitated pulps by Tolkien and Robert E. Howard.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:54:39 2015 No.5965646 >>5965638 C-cant you recommend me one?

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:54:51 2015 No.5965647

>>5965628
I'm only halfway through aegypt but it is... Good, but not as good, and definitely rougher and more uneven and more out there and scattershot. It has a lot of interesting stuff and then a lot of inexplicable stuff.

I also recommend Four Freedoms even though it's not meaningfully fantastic. Book rules.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:57:35 2015 No.5965653

The fantasy crowd is dominated by people who throw a fit when they hear criticism of "world-building", like when M. John Harrison called it "the clomping foot of nerdism" for instance, and R. Scott Bakker called Harrison some elitist metafictionist or whatever. Brian Evenson says that genre readers tend to be more open minded than "literary" folks, but you don't see a lot of that on the internet. There seems to be a large amount of anti-intellectualism and hostility towards experimentation in the fantasy community, which is odd considering it's supposed to be a genre where the imagination is set unfettered. I've looked up "world-building" boards and seen folks who talk about how they love constructing their fantasy tax system or whatever but they hate actually writing. A lot of these people would probably be better off making video games.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 21:59:42 2015 No.5965664 >>5965653 Seriously. Fantasy nerds have the worst kind of unjustified persecution complex

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:00:08 2015 No.5965668

>>5965641

I could say that, but we are talking about fantasy in the modern, genre-based sense of the word. Every genre of literature that is written and widely read today can trace it's origins back to cave scratchings and campfire stories if you look hard enough, but we are talking about the history of the latest iteration of said genre.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:03:08 2015 No.5965678 >>5965668 Fantasy really has no business being a genre. More properly it's a mode.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:03:08 2015 No.5965679

>>5965074
Arab here, I planned on writing a fantasy series with Arabic and Islamic mythology, I was reading 1001 Nights and everything for preparation and then I realized I was a shit writer and extremely lazy one, so I stopped.
But if anybody wants to pick up some of my ideas I'd be happy to share them.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:04:14 2015 No.5965681 >>5965653 Iawtp even tho I consider myself a fantasy nerd M John Harrison owns, fuck world building

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:08:58 2015 No.5965691 A Voyage to Arcturus. That's that shit you need, believe me.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:15:04 2015 No.5965718 This is actually part of the reason I tend to prefer Urban Fantasy at this point, but I'm sick as hell of the masquerade being all-pervasive.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:15:05 2015 No.5965719 So should fantasy depart from world building and focus more on characters or adventure, or just not real things in general.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:16:45 2015 No.5965724 >>5965719 I think it could have the best of both worlds if it care a little less about having some sort of magic system that's basically just new laws of physics.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:19:55 2015 No.5965732 >>5965719 I think the genre of high adventure in fictional fairy universes that we call fantasy should be done with, to be honest

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:26:06 2015 No.5965751 >>5965679 >I planned on writing a fantasy series with Arabic and Islamic mythology, >What is Alf Layla wa Layla

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:27:24 2015 No.5965757

>>5965718

Urban fantasy is fantasy that takes place primarily in a city right? If there was a fantasy that took place in part all over the real world and in part in a purely fantasy world be considered urban fiction based on the part that takes place in "reality"? Sorry if I'm asking something basic but I'm not familiar with the genre.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:29:29 2015 No.5965759 >>5965081 underrated post i lvoe borges

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:29:35 2015 No.5965760

>>5965757
It's mostly about being modern and gritty. They're usually attempts at a mixture of fantasy and noir, but actually defining genres is pretty tough. The upside to urban fantasy is that it allows for a lot of exploration of magic as it would interact with modern aspects of life, which is lacking from the standard fantasy setting. They usually try to replace modern conveniences with magic counterparts for some reason.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:31:54 2015 No.5965766

>>5965751
1001 Nights is just a collection of fairy tales m8. I was thinking Epic fantasy like LotR or something.
I tried reading Alf layla wa layla for some inspiration and ideas but it's gayly long. Also I suck at writing poetry or songs(Or just writing in general) which is like required for fantasy novels.

>>	Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:33:16 2015 No.5965772 >>5965074 uh, Michael Cisco is pretty good.

Anonymous Wed Jan 7 22:35:33 2015 No.5965779

>>5965760

That's a shame, I would like to see some kind of magic that interacts with the world but isn't styled in a way that it completely replaces technology necessarily. A friend of mine is writing something similar to what I asked about (half real world, half "world between worlds"), but I will suggest that he looks into this genre to see what its strengths and weaknesses are. Thanks anon.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 03:16:03 2015 No.5966662
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>>5965480
I wasn't even talking about the magic system; moreso the plot.
However, the magic system becomes more intricate the more you know about it. I can see how you would think that due to the image I posted, though.
>tfw no Breath to Stormlight ratio yet
;_;

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 03:33:01 2015 No.5966686 >>5965074 There isn't enough folklore to inspire more fantasy.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 03:39:45 2015 No.5966700 File: 48 KB, 290x475, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >so badass it became a religion wiggas act like they don't know what's up

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 10:07:56 2015 No.5967772 >>5966686 There aren't enough facepalms for your post.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 11:09:41 2015 No.5967983 Maybe when you twerps stop shoveling mass-marketed shit into your mouths by the gallon you'll discover that fantastical literature is some of the most strange and beautiful literature out there

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 11:13:17 2015 No.5967999 >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_K._Le_Guin this is some entry-level stuff, broseph

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 12:38:50 2015 No.5968347 >>5965691 I started reading it, but cringed at all the alien anatomy stuff and haven't picked it up since.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 12:48:12 2015 No.5968371 >>5965074 that's because you read the current popular stuff so go fuck yourself

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 12:52:29 2015 No.5968390

Most fantasy fails at worldbuilding. It takes an idealized medieval Europe and adds magic without considering how that would affect politics/economics. None of the characters really think about how magic can be exploited for power or profit, because that would result in meaningful changes to society, and traditional fantasy is all about stagnation.

This series gets it right:
http://www.ethshar.com/

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:41:52 2015 No.5968642
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>>5965470
>people think video-game-tier autism qualifies as good fantasy

Tolkien is generally regarded as the greatest fantasy writer in western culture and (afaik) he never even bothered to explain magic.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:45:55 2015 No.5968666 >>5968642 No one who knows what they're talking about considers him even close to being the greatest

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:49:03 2015 No.5968680 >>5965298 >Are there any fantasy novels that get published that deal with gods or divine beings in any capacity? Almost everything written by Michael Additionalpenis.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:50:14 2015 No.5968684

I'm a little worried the story I'm working on right now is a bit too generic. It's sort of my love letter to the classical aspect of the genre, and it involves the aftermath of an epic quest to overthrow the big bad.

The protagonist is the last surviving member of his adventuring party, and he's old. He was never too sociable, and the only thing that really brought him out of his shell was the fostered friendship his group built up over the years as they fought to overthrow a common enemy.

He was the group's magi, but what people didn't know was that he was an illusionist. He spent the entire journey pretending to be some terrible wizard who could conjure demons and dragons, but it was all prestidigitation.

Then, with the evil slain and his friends all dead, he set out to create one last illusion that could deceive himself. He retired to a keep where he could delude himself into believing his friends were still alive, celebrating and living together in the lonely keep's halls.

Then, a stranger arrives, forty some years after the fall of the villain, and he forces the illusionist out of his delusions. He has been sent by a mysterious employer who has use of him.

He is promised the ability to return to the delusion he had escaped to, but only after the job is done. And that's where the story begins.

Thoughts? It's more of a character-centric thing, so I'm hoping that I can be a little generic with the setting. It's really about the character reconciling all he's done and learning to love life again without his old friends.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:50:42 2015 No.5968689 >>5965641 Lord of the Rings is not really 'pulp'. Its a sequel to a children's story that grew into a long novel.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:51:39 2015 No.5968695

TES is nice, it's all about a Godhead with a mind fractured into Stasis and Change and where the laws of physics were created when a trickster spirit rused a bunch of other spirits to become them, in order to create the lowest order of spiritual existence, the Mundus or the material realm, in an effort to there foster a low level spirit that would attain Amaranth (which is a lot like Enlightenment) and ascend to mend the fracture in the Godhead (which he and all other spirits are mere dreamt aspects of). Very roughly put, that is.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:51:48 2015 No.5968698 >>5968666 Let me guess, those people who "know what they're talking about" would be of the sort who read and praise the sword of wheels, But The Magic System, & al. ? :) It does say a lot that Tolkien is still up there in the genre.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 13:57:48 2015 No.5968722

>>5965470
I think the book is pretty shit, but it has fantastic imagery. When Kell is infiltrating the keep in the first novel? Jesus, the rush I got imagining him falling towards it, bounding against coins, flipping about. The author wasn't evocative in any particularly artful way, but the image itself was so well-done that it just came off really well.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:02:23 2015 No.5968747 >>5968695 Too bad that's never reflected in the actual game.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:11:19 2015 No.5968778

>>5968698
>the sword of wheels, But The Magic System
I have no idea what you're talking about, as I don't read that kind of garbage. You realize Tolkien is the one to blame for that shit's prevalence, right? Especially sad since he couldn't even write decent literature himself.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:17:32 2015 No.5968805 >>5968778 Tolkien had literally nothing to down with fags who sperg out about magic systems. His work barely even has one. Also he was a great writer but that's an old argument

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:23:05 2015 No.5968822

I dont have a problem with people shitting on 'AUTHOR' (in this case Tolkien), the problem I have with most people is that when they shit on 'AUTHOR', they dont explain anything and just assume that if you dont agree youre shit. This 'well duh' kind of answer is the tactic of the retarded hipster, so it becomes easy to assume the critic is just being hipster, and as we all know the foundation of a hipster is "the more people like it the worse it is, the less people like it the better it is."

Which is absolutely and completely fucking retarded.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:25:46 2015 No.5968829

>>5968747
Except it is in every one of them. Dagoth Ur's threat wasn't a giant robot, it was a giant robot that could change the nature of reality and was about to hijack the Godhead's Dream and turn it into his own dream instead. Well, perhaps, there are other hypotheses. Alduin the Dragon was going to unravel the particular spiritual system entirely or to a certain degree, in order to maintain the fracture between Stasis and Change but with different spiritual expressions. The Numidium? It was trying to transcend the Godhead so that the collective wish of the Dwemer who had created it and accidentally become its skin could impose a new set of rules that were, in their perception, more in line with their preferred system of logic, but there's no transcendence from the Arena (the nature of the Mundus or the material world) as long as you're contesting anything (as contests are held in the Arena), which is why only Amaranth, which relates to non-contesting in a very Buddhist or Taoist way, is the only transcendence to be had. All this metaphysical fuckery is present in all the games, it's just not obviously explained throughout the plot since almost nobody in physical reality knows about these things. There are tons of books giving hints about it, however, as well as dialogue. Well, not sure about Arena, haven't played it much.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:36:13 2015 No.5968875

>>5968829
Oh, and Elves, or Mer as they're also called, tend to favour carious forms of Stasis, with the extremist Thalmor wishing to free the trapped Aedra and thus unravel physical reality, returning them to the immortal spirits they used to be. While Man tends to side with the trickster spirit Lorkhan who tricked the Aedra into becoming the laws of physics, but was torn apart by the Dragon of Time, Akatosh (or potentially Aka-tusk who Akatosh is only part of, as Aka-tusk too was torn apart), with a lot of debate regarding just what exactly became of his parts. The Heart of Lorkhan in Red Mountain, which Dagoth Ur was connected to through Dwemer Tonal Architecture and intended to power his reality-distorting robot/golem Akhulakhan (built after the blueprints of Numidium).
All in all, I feel this is a pretty good fantasy setting, compared to what you all seem to be complaining about.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:40:01 2015 No.5968892 File: 17 KB, 140x213, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 14:45:20 2015 No.5968920 >>5968875 TES came immediately to my mind after reading OP's post.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 16:13:56 2015 No.5969391 Fantasy is shit. No contest.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 16:35:55 2015 No.5969477 >>5966700 Holy shit that cover is ridiculous. the guy is just shooting his guns without looking. From the hip, even.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 16:45:15 2015 No.5969504 File: 72 KB, 300x498, 18dyfl720tvn2jpg.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Genre has plenty of merit, you just gotta dig deep.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 16:45:24 2015 No.5969506 >>5965112 Magical realism? Try Murakami. Also most books that deal with things on a large scale are pretty shite. The more the author zeroes in on an environment, the more time they have to immerse the reader in that environment.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 17:49:59 2015 No.5969856 File: 58 KB, 537x738, Jack_Vance_Boat_Skipper.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >Where are the truly alien worlds? This guy. Check out the "Dying Earth" series. It's set billions of the years in the future, a few decades before the sun dies.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 17:53:51 2015 No.5969875 Fantasy and science fiction are kind of the same thing, aren't they? Except they center around tropes that have become very well set, which is medieval Tolkien europeshit and Star Wars. It could all be referred to as fantasy.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 17:58:39 2015 No.5969901 >>5969875 That's not what a trope is

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 18:06:42 2015 No.5969958

It's always funny when peopel try to be elitist about genre fiction and yet they can't even use the word "trope" properly. In fact, misuse of the word "trope" is probably the easiest way to determine that someone is not worth listening to when it comes to matters of criticism

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 18:09:04 2015 No.5969982 >>5969875 yhyh all books are fantasies sum r just moar honest amirite

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 18:34:36 2015 No.5970177 >>5969875 Star Wars is not science fiction.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 18:39:43 2015 No.5970216 >>5970177 There are space ships in it so it actually is.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 18:59:23 2015 No.5970361

>>5970216
That is not what defines science fiction.

Star Wars is a fantasy story in space. There is a wise old wizard, a farmboy who goes on an adventure, a princess to save and an evil overlord to defeat. The spaceships and ray guns are nothing but window dressing.

Anonymous Thu Jan 8 19:44:04 2015 No.5970623
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>>5968722
The main battle of Stormlight 2 (Words of Radiance) is so fucking raw.

Also I'm convinced this "magic system" argument is a strawman as I only see it discussed by people who "complain" about people who bring it up and rarely otherwise.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 19:45:07 2015 No.5970628 >>5970361 That's not what defines fantasy though

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 19:46:03 2015 No.5970634 File: 45 KB, 324x500, richard-morgan-the-steel-remains.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5965074 THANK ME LATER

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 20:02:16 2015 No.5970703 >>5965074 China Mieville Perdido Street Station THAT is my kind of fantasy.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 21:10:56 2015 No.5970988 >>5965751 >its been done once so it can never ever be done again ever Uh I got some bad news for you m8

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 21:19:21 2015 No.5971025 >>5970988 Um yes if youre not 100% original you shouldnt even bother writing, whats the point of making something that isnt 100% original in every aspect all the time? :^)

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 21:25:43 2015 No.5971051 >>5971025 Better burn literally every book you have then

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 21:27:06 2015 No.5971060 That's why I really enjoyed the turn The Black Company books took when they ended up in a very Thailand/India inspired land.

>>	Anonymous Thu Jan 8 21:37:40 2015 No.5971108 >>5965590 Designing the world they create when they become a God after death.

Anonymous Fri Jan 9 09:32:49 2015 No.5972377
File: 66 KB, 750x500, mb02_symbols-webres.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5971108
What are you implying here?

The Lord Ruler fucked up the world on purpose when he handled Preservation for the brief time so when Sazed became Harmony, he righted the world back to how it should have been.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 10:51:57 2015 No.5972597 >>5966700 just watch the movie

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 10:54:56 2015 No.5972608 >>5968684 the premise sounds good. I actually would like to get into more character driven fantasy than epic quest why didnt they ride the eagles to mordor shit. now you just need a convincing and original world. GODD FUCKING LUCK

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:02:09 2015 No.5972636 >>5972377 Not the guy you're arguing against, but no he didn't. Lord Ruler just straight up fucked up because he was just doing his best to handle a power he had only a short time to learn of.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:03:12 2015 No.5972643 >>5972377 Are those extra metals from The Alloy of Law?

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:03:31 2015 No.5972644 >>5965074 >implying tolkien feels inspired

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:21:41 2015 No.5972705 >>5970361 Have you heard of 'hard sci-fi'? 'Sci-fantasy' isn't a thing.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:28:21 2015 No.5972718 >>5972705 Science Fantasy is absolutely a thing, and Star Wars is about as removed from Hard Sci-Fi as you can get.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:34:38 2015 No.5972729 >>5972718 Star Wars is sci-fi, what you want to call sci-fi is hard sci-fi.

Anonymous Fri Jan 9 11:50:34 2015 No.5972755

I'd like to try writing a fantasy story.
but whenever I try I get annoyed because I think it's to lord of the rings, my story was going to be based on two brother gods, give life by their father, to create the world how they see fit their dad is the big boss, the GOD if you will, whom are polar opposites, but used to agree a few thousand years ago and when they work together they can effortlessly create life, like how the made Hus( the world my story was going to be based in ) but they fell out over the some of the more malignant things they made and then I get stuck with the clique one becomes evil, one stays neutral, like he doesn't want to fight his brother, but he will to keep balance in Hus, then on an island a few hundred miles from the continent where all life spawned from in Hus, the gods had their final cataclysmic battle with each other and their armies, which made the land on the island unlivable, destroying the River of ende and starting to stagnate the world, making the rest of the world less fruitful and more twisted. but the story follows a character called Flac ( haven't got a last name) on his journey across the continent and inadvertently helping restore the balance between the brothers, whom have recently awoken by their father, after their last clash.

but I can't think of anythink of any reason why he'd travel that wasn't boring or unoriginal..

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 12:03:32 2015 No.5972780 What are some fantasy like Morrowind.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 12:07:31 2015 No.5972788 File: 3.31 MB, 1920x1200, Morrowind 2010-10-09 17-13-56-70.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5972780 also interested in this

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 12:47:26 2015 No.5972875 I intend to write a fantasy story that's just about the lives of a few people going around trying to survive. And I won't waste time explaining how the world works, so readers will have to draw conclusions on their own.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 12:56:45 2015 No.5972907 >>5968347 Understandable. I wouldn't call it masterpiece, but it's pretty unique at what it tries to do and I feel like most scifi/fantasy has a bit of cringey shit you have to put up with.

Anonymous Fri Jan 9 13:00:51 2015 No.5972921

>>5972780
Something New Weirdish. Can't think of anything that perfectly fits off the top of my head, but Finch by Jeff Vandermeer might be what you're looking for. City of Saints and Madmen is good too. Something by China Mieville, one of his Bas Lag novels might be as well.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 13:03:23 2015 No.5972930 >>5965091 Your journey shall not be easy, Lemiwinks.

Anonymous Fri Jan 9 18:21:55 2015 No.5973924
File: 530 KB, 1589x1200, alloy_map_2_elendel_gray-webres.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5972636
Partly that but he did keep the world stagnated on purpose.

>>5972643
We haven't seen all of the metals yet.
The main character of the modern Mistborn trilogy will be a Nicrosil Misting.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 18:29:05 2015 No.5973958 >>5966700 dude i read this book in elementary school, it was fucking awesome, i had no idea who l. ron hubbard was, but this book was a fucking trip 10/10

Anonymous Fri Jan 9 19:08:22 2015 No.5974108

>>5973924
>Partly that but he did keep the world stagnated on purpose

I think he did so because he was sure that, in doing so, he could be guaranteed the security to seize the power at the Well when it returned so that he could fix everything. Everything after his time at the well was consequence of, firstly, his attempt to gain control of the dominances, after which Ruin stepped in

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 19:55:30 2015 No.5974245 Original fantasy is still out there it's just over in the horror section now. Stuff in the fantasy section is just ren fair bullshit.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 20:34:01 2015 No.5974391 >>5965144 >http://art.yale.edu/file_columns/0000/0066/borges.pdf This was very entertaining ty anon. I don't know that it's quite what OP was after though

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 20:48:04 2015 No.5974433 >>5965074 itt: people dont know what fabulous fiction is gtanted its a young genre and kinda sucks but it has potential

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 23:11:34 2015 No.5974842 File: 78 KB, 508x496, _1284980166237.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] read "Journey to West" my favorite book, its refreshing and the chinese mythology is great. lots of alien words

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 23:19:48 2015 No.5974868 >>5974433 Sounds gay.

>>	Anonymous Fri Jan 9 23:43:17 2015 No.5974915 >>5965074 Lol butthurt non-aryan detected

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 03:22:14 2015 No.5975390 >>5968892 GGK is awful. His books are cringeworthy.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 03:26:26 2015 No.5975395 >>5972755 Stop this ridiculous world building shit, it's so fucking dumb. Tolkien was literally the only person to ever do it without producing spergy garbage.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 03:33:22 2015 No.5975409 File: 27 KB, 720x480, HEY.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5965130 > implying final fantasy's coverage of everything from rabbits to robots is at all similar to tolkien

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 06:30:26 2015 No.5975817 >>5968684 Sounds interesting tbh good luck

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 06:32:16 2015 No.5975821 >>5965074 Fantasy has always been European. Europe is literally the best collection of civilizations.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 06:48:15 2015 No.5975861 >>5965719 What if it attempts to deal with relevant themes in a somewhat historical setting and has grand events but focuses more on the characters?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 06:52:08 2015 No.5975874 >tfw /lit/ has made you not want to write i-it's okay

Anonymous Sat Jan 10 07:02:58 2015 No.5975906

>>5975395
Most people don't know how to world build. The point is to generate stories then flesh out the events and settings surrounding the stories, not flesh out a setting then insert a generic story.

If you implement a generic story or plot point like a rebellion, then worldbuild around the event the story becomes more developed and complex naturally. However if you develop the world first then insert stories to write the stories remain primitive and basic, there is nowhere for them to grow because they are trapped by the arbitrary walls of worldbuilding and you're left with every Tolkein copy paste fantasy world in existence.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 08:42:12 2015 No.5976117 >book thread on /v/ last night >someone thinks NotW and WMF is good >explain why it's bad >get personal insults repeatedly >and projection Which one of you was this?

Anonymous Sat Jan 10 14:29:09 2015 No.5977242

>>5974842
I was waiting for the day a thread would be created about this book. What edition did you read? I just read the David Kherdian translation and there it's so sparse in either character or world building; it just felt like a list of Chinese deities and mythological places rather than an actual story. Should I try another translation?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 10 16:24:34 2015 No.5977723 >>5976117 So why are they bad?

Anonymous Sat Jan 10 17:57:02 2015 No.5978099
File: 23 KB, 197x300, Zap mothafucka.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Huh, didn't think /lit/ allowed genre fiction discussions judging by my last few visits here.

Well anyways, may as well ask here. I have been out of the loop for a while so I don't know what's up anymore. Could you recommend (or point me to some place that could recommend) any good fantasy books about wizards doing wizardly things? I've got a huge weak spot for magic and all that cool shit.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 05:27:48 2015 No.5980261 >>5974433 >gtanted What does this mean?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 05:29:47 2015 No.5980270 >>5978099 LeGuin's Earthsea series, starting with, hey, A Wizard. Belgarath the Sorcerer is pretty fun, at least if you're young.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 06:33:44 2015 No.5980478 >>5980261 i assume he meant granted also google turns up nothing on fabulous fitcion

>>	kitty !kitty/EnNg Sun Jan 11 06:38:40 2015 No.5980495 >>5980478 >fitcion /fit/coin to the moon!

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 13:44:40 2015 No.5981753 >>5980270 Thanks anon, I'll check those out.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 13:50:44 2015 No.5981776 File: 26 KB, 400x250, tsomw_mw_lord_vivec.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5965633 Morrowind is legitimately one of the greatest human creations god fucking damn it

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 16:23:31 2015 No.5982471 File: 7 KB, 225x225, interested-frog.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5981776 >Morrowind is legitimately one of the greatest human creations

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 21:57:05 2015 No.5984190 >>5981776 No shit?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 22:11:21 2015 No.5984273 >>5982471 Wake up, we're here. Why are you shaking? Are you ok? Wake up. Stand up... there you go. You were dreaming. What's your name? Well, not even last night's storm could wake you.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 22:14:31 2015 No.5984283 >>5981776 This is gamers. So starved they'll even pretend morrowind is more than a reskinnd D&D.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 11 23:36:48 2015 No.5984627 File: 5 KB, 194x259, Pepe Cosplay.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5984283 >Comparing a video game to DnD

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 13:19:24 2015 No.5987059 >>5984627 They're both games

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 13:21:27 2015 No.5987075 >>5984273 >It was a dark and stormy night

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 13:37:22 2015 No.5987157 >>5965112 Last and first men?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 14:40:42 2015 No.5987376 >>5987059 yeah, in the same way that magic the gathering and poker are both card games

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 15:27:21 2015 No.5987527 >>5987059 They're both game settings*

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 18:39:22 2015 No.5988311 >>5966700 This book is terrible, don't read it. LRH was a hack who wasn't even that good at hackery.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:05:12 2015 No.5989366 Can someone give me a brief summary of TES' mythology/world? Ive always found it fascinating but i never really read the books or payed attention to the lore.

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:36:20 2015 No.5989546
File: 37 KB, 500x375, cultofmk.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5989366
If you go into the more metaphysical/mk stuff then basically a schizophrenic god is sleeping and in his dreams his personality splits into two sides, order and chaos, and nothing is real because it's all a dream. If you somehow manage to realize this you can either cease to exist or rather cease your perception of existence because you never existed at all, or if you manage to hold on to your sense of self you achieve CHIM, enlightenment I guess, which is basically like lucid dreaming and you can do whatever you want. Everything in some way leads back to and is a part of that that sleeping god. There's more but that's the fundamentals I think. I'm personally not a fan of some of the sillier stuff.

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:38:20 2015 No.5989557
File: 1019 KB, 1280x720, boobies over demons.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5965074
You might dig the Malazan stuff. It doesn't borrow too heavily from tolkien, has ancient lore, an interesting and complex system of magic, multiple races (including a non-humanoid race) and an active and changing pantheon.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:38:30 2015 No.5989558 >>5989366 It's generic fantashit. Gods who represent vague metaphysical concepts create the universe and then there are wars between humans, elves, orcs (corrupted elves ofc), demons and so on >>5989546 Also teh matrix yeah

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:40:21 2015 No.5989567 >>5989557 Sounds literally exactly like dungeons and dragons

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:42:45 2015 No.5989577 >>5965081 Borges is awesome Calvino too more like these?

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:45:59 2015 No.5989587

>>5989567
Yeah, I mean the first book was intended to be a module or whatever for GURPS. There aren't any orcs, dwarves, goblins or elves, though. Idk, I'm at the end of the 4th book and enjoying it pretty well.
And I don't know if the K'Chain Che'malle (the non-humanoid race) have any parallels in "typical" fantasy or D&D.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:48:19 2015 No.5989598 >>5989546 why is the god asleep? How is it possible to know that you are a thought in the mind of a dreaming god? why is he schizophrenic?

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:52:50 2015 No.5989614

>>5989577
There was a thread for this a while ago, but I remember was recommended Dictionary of the Khazars by Milorad Pavic, Encyclopedia of the Dead by Danilo Kis, 40 Stories and 60 Stories by Donald Barthelme, Wittgenstein's Mistress by David Markson, Blow-up and Other Stories by Julio Cortazar

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 22:55:15 2015 No.5989623 [DELETED]

>>5989598
>why is the god asleep
no one knows
>How is it possible to know that you are a thought in the mind of a dreaming god
I don't really know, I remember it has something to do with a wheel and a tower and 'I' but then again how do you realize you're dreaming in a dream?
>why is he schizophrenic
no one knows

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:18:09 2015 No.5989736

>>5989558
TES isn't all that 'generic'.

>>5989546
Something like that. /tg/ or /v/ can explain it better. Everything is a dream inside the 'Godhead'. There are so many wacky ridiculous concepts inside the entire lore. Like planets being the bodies of 'Gods' except they're not actual bodies of Gods but that's how we perceive them to be.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:23:25 2015 No.5989761 >>5989736 >TES isn't all that 'generic'. Yeah having cats instead of orcs makes it totally different. Fuck off, manchild.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:25:48 2015 No.5989775 >>5989761 >cats instead of orcs But anon, there are cats AND orcs

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:26:50 2015 No.5989778 >>5989775 >responding to it

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:27:25 2015 No.5989781 >>5989778 Who are you quoting?

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:36:06 2015 No.5989827
File: 195 KB, 950x715, 1414111737792.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5965633
Based Kirkbride. Honestly, the game wasn't even all that fun, but the visuals and setting age tremendously, and the writing was fantastic. The mythos alone is some of the best fantasy I've read about, putting most other fantasy settings to shame.
But no one who plays the games reads the millions of books. ;_;
And, yes, I know I'm gushing. I just wish other Fantasy writers would try something new, even if it is weird and unprofitable.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:37:27 2015 No.5989834 File: 399 KB, 790x1200, twok_ephemera-1_codes-webres.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5989827 At least we get a 30+ year Fantasy meta-series brewing.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:40:09 2015 No.5989848 File: 1.28 MB, 1944x2584, CHIM.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5989366

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:45:56 2015 No.5989875 >>5989761 Tes lore is really wonderful.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:46:19 2015 No.5989879 File: 250 KB, 979x2473, TES lore.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5989366

>>	Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:47:39 2015 No.5989887 >All this TES love So this is where /tgesg/ goes when we don't have threads...

Anonymous Mon Jan 12 23:52:22 2015 No.5989913

>>5968829
I don't at all disagree that TES is a great example of this kind of thing. I got sucked deep into all of this shit.

But your understanding of a lot of this is fairly flawed. Which is fine, given how complicated and divinely contradictory and heavily argued a lot of this stuff gets, but you really are exaggerating certain elements. I suppose that has to come with selling the world.

Anonymous Tue Jan 13 00:53:49 2015 No.5990153
File: 41 KB, 477x636, LionKurage_Yummy[1].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

I've read or decided not to read most of the recommended fantasy books, and I'm just wondering if there's a place where you can look through new and upcoming fantasy series to see if they're any good. I'd try library or bookshops but they don't seem to have anything good, at least the ones in my area don't.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 00:55:08 2015 No.5990159 File: 38 KB, 500x500, sdasw24e.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] This is the alien world you're looking for, OP

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 01:12:27 2015 No.5990213 >>5989761 nice meme

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 01:26:49 2015 No.5990265 >>5989366 Alot of it is influenced by Glorantha and real world esoteric philosophy, like Gnosticism, Hermeticism, and Thelema

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 01:27:49 2015 No.5990267 >>5989827 As cool as Kirkbride's imagination is, the guy is kind of a douche.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 01:30:02 2015 No.5990278 >>5989761 Those cats are actually elves.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 01:36:10 2015 No.5990291 >>5990267 Who cares that he's a douche? That is, if he wasn't an awful writer. And since he is, again, who cares that he's a douche

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 01:52:05 2015 No.5990330 >>5990278 except some of them are tiny and walk on 4 legs, also they are good slaves

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:26:14 2015 No.5990571 >>5990267 Oh, absolutely, but that's true of a lot of good writers

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:38:37 2015 No.5990601 File: 12 KB, 380x304, 12315464568.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5965074 Fantasy and Sci-fi are not the same nerd. Also Tolkein wasn't medieval european? you must be tripping, what do you think inspired all his work?

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:39:57 2015 No.5990606 >>5965298 Malazan series Has gods and ascendants. It's also probably the GOAT fantasy

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:41:27 2015 No.5990613 Fantasy went to shit when the emphasis became "worldbuilding" and not themes

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:42:31 2015 No.5990619 File: 134 KB, 334x393, 1414764390538.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5965485 >>5965546 You disgusting anime nerds don't think this is anything related to Mistborn do you? Magic centered around alloys and metals is not a novel concept.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:43:59 2015 No.5990623 >>5990613 untrue there's only so many themes you can do before it gets repetitive world building and overall themes are both necessary and there's many other elements to it

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 03:47:43 2015 No.5990631 >>5990623 >there's only so many themes you can do before it gets repetitive Thats even more untrue than what I said

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 08:27:49 2015 No.5991339 Are there any fatnasy novels which emphasize the the isolation and ultrahuman aspects of moden industrial society in a fantastical world without a lot of world building?

Anonymous Tue Jan 13 10:00:39 2015 No.5991640

Has anyone here actually read the Silmarillion, Akkalabeth, and the Lord of the Rings?
Tolkien was inventing an English Mythology.
Everything involving Frodo, Sauron, and the One Ring is almost like an appendix or afterword to a series of protracted wars, migrations, and conflicts between the Noldor and Morgoth {which inevitably involved other Valar, the Sindar, and the Edain or Men}.
The backdrop involves an initial Genesis and Creation by Eru and the Ainur / Valar... and the conflict among them and one of their own, Melkor / Morgoth.
In this sense I feel like it is more related to Norse or Germanic mythologies than to Modern Fantasy.

I think to generally label it as "fantasy" is misleading and driven more by commercial mandates than literary or artistic ones.

A Song of Ice and Fire {GRRM}
Prince of Nothing {Bakker}
Book of the New Sun {Wolfe}
Malazan Cycle {Erikson}
are what I would generally call "modern fantasy", wherein the line between fantasy and science fiction, magic and science, past and future, is intentionally blurred to some degree or another.
For this reason I feel like these are less Mythologies and more Historical Fictions.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 10:14:01 2015 No.5991684 >>5968684 So basically it's a schizophrenic wizard mite b cool/10 would read excerpts of if you post it on /lit/

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 10:21:25 2015 No.5991703 What does /lit/ think of dark souls worldbuilding

Anonymous Tue Jan 13 11:18:46 2015 No.5991879
File: 1.00 MB, 1000x1500, Final.Fantasy.IX_.full_.1391398.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>5965074

I'm afraid since LOTRs it's been video games that have produced the kind of otherworldly charm you're looking for, while genre fiction has just gone about cloning LOTR or trying to be as gritty, unhappy and dark as possible, or both.

There's nothing of the ilk of for example Final Fantasy that's made it big as a book series.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 11:22:07 2015 No.5991903 Stop reading schlock.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 11:28:05 2015 No.5991927 File: 196 KB, 1600x1150, niceguys.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>5972930

>>	Anonymous Tue Jan 13 11:34:39 2015 No.5991954 >>5989913 Such as?

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/lit/ - Literature