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/lit/ - Literature

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4470028 No.4470028[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

I know it is a movie but what do you think about the notion of Idiocracy becoming reality? Surely you have something to say.

>> No.4470052
File: 138 KB, 729x520, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4470052

It's just a way for feeble souls to feel 'superior'.

>> No.4470058

a good education system is pretty much the solution to this problem.

Stupid people have tons of kids, but those kids have to go to school all day, where they're introduced to some standard curriculum of stuff that will hopefully give them a chance in hell at making something of themselves.

Totally contingent though, on whether or not that standard curriculum is any good, and whether educators any are good at teaching it.

Teaching is an important trade yo.

>> No.4470060

>>4470052
That's a nice comic but do you have an argument? Arrogant people aren't necessarily wrong because they're arrogant.

>> No.4470063

It's an okay movie but I find it irritable that everyone namedrops it for any instance of stupidity.

>> No.4470072

>>4470063
That doesn't seem happen here in the old world (I've never heard anyone mention it in any way). Could it be that dismissing the movie's message is just a cool and edgy thing to do among youth in the US?

>> No.4470078

>>4470052
>Stupid people reproduce more because the alternative is sleeping with you
Does that even make sense in the slightest?

>> No.4470085

>>4470060
It's not about arrogance it's about solipsistic morons thinking themselves "intelligent" dismissing everything different as wrong or dumb. Sure there are idiots but I think that most of the people who cum in there pants over movies like this are worse than the people they ridicule.

>> No.4470086

>are unemployed
>get welfare
>buy legalized weed and alcohol
>use food stamps to solve munchies
>repeat

>> No.4470087

studies have shown that people are becoming more intelligent. then there are studies saying whites will in the future become a minority, supplanted by races with lower IQs.

either way, the film was fairly funny but these types of satires which are borderline lowbrow themselves should not be taken seriously in any intelligent discussion

>> No.4470091

>>4470078
it was meant as a disparaging joke at the expense of the other person's character or attitude

your reading comprehension skills could use a polish

>> No.4470094

>>4470085
>there pants
Sorry, you just lost credibility. I just had an idea: could the people optimistically disagreeing with what the movie says actually be one of the first symptoms of it becoming true? Surely a moron is the last one to call himself dumb.

>> No.4470108

>>4470091
I know, but does it make sense? Why does one stupid person have to reproduce more with some other stupid person than they normally would because they don't want to reproduce with that guy? How does this new "theory" explain smart people reproducing less than stupid people?

>> No.4470121

>>4470094
>Sorry, you just lost credibility.

Sorry, but I'm not an anglophone and I'm not proof reading for a post like that.

>Surely a moron is the last one to call himself dumb.

Yeah that's my point, who are the least likely to call themselves stupid? I'd reckon it's the ones having 'proof' that they're clever. Like all the educated morons, who are the ones who define what 'intelligent' means in their own image while what they are doing might not be very intelligent. Maybe what we percieve as intelligence is a brain defect since it's not common.

>> No.4470122

>>4470094

I don't outright DISAGREE with it more than I find the attitude it encourages to be highly undesirable. It encourages a sort of fatalism which is pretty absurd.

>> No.4470128

>>4470121

>Maybe what we percieve as intelligence is a brain defect since it's not common.
Yeah and what if...Dude, what if...It's all, like, a dream, man...

>> No.4470130

>>4470108
You are being to autistic about it. It's not defining a new theory to mansplain anything, it's just making it clear that he has the attitude of an asshole.

>> No.4470139

>>4470130
>mansplain
What?

>> No.4470142

>>4470128
>don't divert from consensus

C'mon is it uncomfortable for you? Or do you require everything to have a 'function'? I guess you are exactly what I would define as unintelligent.

>> No.4470145

>>4470130

>mansplain
Thanks so much, it's like you're actually stamping "I'm a huge retard who thinks him/herself a "gender theorist" or something equivalent" on your forehead.

>> No.4470148

>>4470142

You're making me tear up with your lack of understanding. Go on.

>> No.4470153

>>4470148
Does this guy resemble how you see yourself?

http://youtu.be/lhAr_UeroCk

>> No.4470158

>>4470052
that comic is so obviously written by a manchild

>> No.4470159

>>4470130
well it's annoying that stick-figure b is calling out stick-figure a for being elitist, but still refers to less intelligent people as "stupid people".

And then says "oh they wouldn't even want to have sex with you" as if being an intelligent white knight makes him the voice of the "stupid people".

stick-figure b is like the macklemore of people with low IQs.

also "more harm has been done by people panicked over social decline...[etc]"
sounds like he made that one up too.

>> No.4470167

>>4470153

Nah. As I said, I thought the movie was trash because of the attitude it breeds. Pretension and fatalism are one of my two least favorite things. Go on.

>> No.4470168

>>4470028
>implying idiots exist.
>implying criticisms against the idiots aren't criticisms against the poors.
>implying you're born dumb or smart.
That's an easy vision of things. Indeed, it simplifies everything, but it's mad false.

>> No.4470180

>>4470168
>>implying you're born dumb or smart.
>/lit/ strikes again

>> No.4470185

>>4470168
>mad false
don't talk like this

thanks

>> No.4470193

>>4470167
Haven't you studied highly intelligent people there's something 'off' about them they don't seem to think like normal people. Maybe they are in fact the stupid ones, a kind of productive retards. So when they pull of some of their shenanigans (usually involving nonsense like math) we blindly follow them because they are percieved as intelligent so what they do must be good.

I mean look at how all objectively stupid things (dysgenic) humanity has done, has always been spearheaded by someone perceived to be 'intelligent'?

>> No.4470198

>>4470185

I don't really know why, but this made me laugh really fucking hard. About as hard as anything I've seen on 4chan, in fact. Thank you anon.

>>4470193

And as I was saying, bro...I'm, like, totes convinced it's all a dream, knowhatimsayin?

>> No.4470201

>Haven't you studied highly intelligent people there's something 'off' about them they don't seem to think like normal people.

but it's only off if you're arguing from a standpoint that encourages ad populum, which makes no sense. if someone is operating on an entirely different wavelength from someone else then they'll have no need or want to "conform" to their standards

you need examples for the second paragraph

>> No.4470205

>>4470198
>And as I was saying, bro...I'm, like, totes convinced it's all a dream

Are you referencing Twains ending of the mysterious stranger? Existence can only be absurd fantasy?

>> No.4470211

>>4470205

What the fuck is Twains? Nah man, I'm just sayin'...Like, think about it for a second...

>> No.4470212

>>4470201
>you need examples for the second paragraph

Politics, clergy, art and science.

>> No.4470213
File: 29 KB, 555x644, 1360484142639.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4470213

>>4470028
>genetics determine intelligence
>implying it's not just random ass occurrences

If geniuses are born not made then we should devote energy to finding 'intelligence', not educating all. That movie was just quasi-science mixed with elitism.

>> No.4470219

>>4470213
Whynotboth.gif

>> No.4470220

>>4470213
is that Pavarotti?

>> No.4470221

>>4470211
Mark Twain.

>> No.4470227

>>4470193
>I mean look at how all objectively stupid things (dysgenic) humanity has done, has always been spearheaded by someone perceived to be 'intelligent'?
hitler wasn't really intelligent, to use one counter example

and how many good things have been done that have been spearheaded by intelligent people?

>> No.4470229

>>4470221

Who? I thought you said it was TwainS, with an s...Fuck man, I'm so confused. But yeah that shit about, like, intelligence being a mental disorder or whatever was fucking cool man...And, like, since weed makes you smart, maybe weed is a mental disorder...Speaking of which, you want another pull?

>> No.4470235

>>4470227

>hitler wasn't really intelligence
[citation needed]
But yeah stop arguing with this guy. He's an idiot.

>> No.4470236

>>4470229
Oh man! You're implying that he's saying something he thinks is profound but really isn't profound, just like a pothead would! That's funny, and it also entirely discounts his idea!

!!!

>> No.4470238

>>4470235

>>hitler wasn't really intelligence
Topkek. intelligent*

>> No.4470243

>>4470235
at the very least he was guided by his emotions far more than his logic

>> No.4470246

>>4470236

I'm only arguing on his level, bro. I don't feel obligated to earnestly try and refute a statement made so mindlessly. Thanks for insinuating your intellectual superiority though. That really makes you look like a big man.
See, we can all play the passive-aggressive sarcasm game!

>> No.4470249

>>4470243

That's true. But as I said, this guy isn't thinking about what he's saying. Arguing with him is hopeless.

>> No.4470253

>>4470229
Yea weed makes you totally smart (stupid) man it's scientifically proven. Psychedelics is where it's at man it makes you into a mad monkey, true intelligence.

>> No.4470255

>>4470246
noggas gonna nog

>> No.4470263

>>4470253

Quentin pls go. We're all being sarcastic here. Only you could fail to understand that.

>> No.4470266

>>4470213
>>genetics determine intelligence
yes

>> No.4470274

>>4470266
Explain why there isn't natural language and mathematics then, why does it need to be taught?

>> No.4470289

>>4470274
Because education isn't the same as intelligence.

>> No.4470297

>>4470167
It has never bred those emotions for anyone I know that has seen the movie. We see it as funny (only the first time) and depressing because of its message.
Most people do not use movies to stroke their ego so it seems like you just want to bitch about some pet peeve you got from some weirdo irl or some shit
If you want to get on a soapbox about hipsters please start your own thread.

>> No.4470298

>>4470028
Idiocracy IS becpming reality.
It's why I encourage all my intelligent friends to have kids.
It's not really about genetics, more about raising kids with cultural awareness: interesting discussions at the dinner table, modeling intelligent behavior, using a wide vocabulary, literature as bedtime stories, healthy food, etc, etc.

>> No.4470319

>>4470298
shitty parents are a result of bad education.

all you have to do is educate their kids properly, and get them interested in learning, and you can ensure they don't turn into shitty parents themselves.

i mean a good home life in the first place is ideal, but it's just not something you can regulate realistically.

>> No.4470334

>>4470319
If all the idiots weren't having 3-8 kids, and all the intelligent folks weren't waiting until they were 40 to maybe have one kid with a high chance of autism, maybe it wouldn't be this bad.
And come on: you think teachers can make kids smart? They just stuff their heads with facts.

>> No.4470356

>>4470334
yeah, well, you can't regulate who can and can't have children.

Education is the only humane solution, and even that is a stretch, because the person who writes the curriculum decides what and how they are learning. But with the right curriculum, yes, you can "make kids smart".

>you think teachers can make kids smart? They just stuff their heads with facts.

lol what are you in high school?
in the good states, pedagogy is regulated such that a big chunk of the curriculum is devoted to giving kids room to express themselves and their views on the material (reflections, journals).

How do you even teach history/english without those things? "Why" is fucking fundamental to those subjects.
Also you have art, dance, music etc classes.

I mean, america is maybe a bad context to talk about this, because the inner states are pretty awful, i'll grant you.
but ideally, education is precisely the solution. CF Canada.

>> No.4470359

>>4470298
>modeling intelligent behavior, using a wide vocabulary, literature as bedtime stories
>being relevant

please kill yourself

>> No.4470504

People are getting stupider? Two words: Flynn Effect. Someone who had an IQ of 100 in the 1970's would be slightly mentally challenged by modern standards.

Now, I'm going to ask something here. How many of you are assuming people are stupid based on current pop culture?

>> No.4470523

>>4470504
I assume this based on the popularity of Sarah Palin.

>> No.4470531

I assume idiocracy is happening because the incentives system is set up in the uk so that any single woman can pop out a future pleb and then she's set for life (inb4 benefits are now capped at 2 kids).

Maternity laws are an unfair bitch for employers but I still support them.

Dumb women have things to gain. Smart women harm their careers

>> No.4470542

>>4470087

>studies have shown that people are becoming more intelligent

I'm not surprised at that whatsoever. Every time I come in contact with somebody above the age of 50 I'm alarmed by their complete lack of common sense.

>> No.4470548

>>4470523
There's been MUCH MUCH worse than Palin in history bruv.

>> No.4470590

>>4470236

I'm sorry but his idea is pretty damn awful.

He is attacking 'intelligent' people because they don't have perfect clarity in the outcomes of their actions as if that's a constructive criticism. He then constructs a reversal where somebody in a position to do that thing who fails is not merely imperfect but unintelligent as a result.

It should of course be pointed out that such (intelligent) people are generally those who are in positions of power and those who can even be the ones who spearhead such 'objectively stupid things'. It's sort of a judgement which only people in positions of power can be judged by and thus completely unhelpful to use.

>> No.4470600

>>4470548
Well, there's always the "willfully poisoning themselves with shit food" angle as well...

>> No.4470630

>>4470600
It's legal to sell how can it be poisonous 'shit' food? Checkmate

Vegans 0
Atheists 1

>> No.4470650

>>4470630
Oh, silly me.
I forgot that the people in power are always right.
Please be trolling.

>> No.4470671

>>4470504
>IQ of 91
>slightly mentally retarded
>IQ
>meaning anything at all

>> No.4470680

IQ has been steadily going up for years and more people are literate/educated than ever.

Also predators have never been the driving force behind the evolution of human intelligence, scarce food sources and fighting with other tribes of humans over those resources were the primary causes.

>> No.4470688

>>4470504
>IQ meaning anything
Wow, you're the real retard here. Do you seriously think an average man in 1950 would be considered retarded by today's standards? People are getting better at taking tests -- our entire lives are structured around them now. That's the only difference. If you think anything else you're a fool

>> No.4470692

>>4470688
>Wow, you're the real retard here. Do you seriously think an average man in 1950 would be considered retarded by today's standards? People are getting better at taking tests -- our entire lives are structured around them now. That's the only difference. If you think anything else you're a fool

So being bad at taking tests accounts for 10 whole IQ points?

>> No.4470722

>>4470688

>our entire lives are structured around them now.

Take your "fuck the system" teenage shit out of here. This is a board for adults.

>> No.4470753

>>4470722
Get your system loving sheeple ass out of here.
This board is for literati.

>> No.4470757

>>4470028
>implying it isn't reality now
>proof
>this thread

>> No.4470778

>flynn effect
>IQ mostly determined by genetics

We dont evolve that fast; It would make sense for intelligence to be genetic if we compare ourselves to other species, which would mean that IQ tests aren't a good measure of intelligence, skills like pattern recognition and reading comprehension would help with intellectual work, and would contribute to a persons success but I dont think IQ tests are a good measure of intelligence.

>> No.4470783

>>4470753
>using the word sheeple
>not being a pleb

pick one

>> No.4470796

>>4470783
>using the word "pleb"
>objecting to use of trite labels
Well done. Very GBII.

>> No.4470798

>>4470542
Maybe you just live in a shitty area. All the seniors I know here in San Bernardino are idiots but the ones up in North San Bernardino and in Loma Linda are pretty good. Except the 90+ ones but at that point brain atrophy is a valid excuse.

>> No.4470816

c a t
:)

>> No.4470817

>>4470798
Try Berkeley.
All the old folks around here are fucking geniuses that swim every day.
They will also bore the piss out of you on their favorite political subjects.

>> No.4470824

Idiocracy is becoming true. Only it's not bible thumping rednecks that are taking over, it's privilege checking leftist feminist anti-white racists.

>> No.4470827

>>4470824
>actually believing this

>> No.4470849

>>4470824
Agreed.

>> No.4470860

>>4470849
>>4470824
Samefag detected

>> No.4470862

>>4470860
>>4470827
samefag detected

>> No.4470879

>>4470058
>a good education system is pretty much the solution to this problem.
This attitude is exactly why Idiocracy could happen. Kids go to school for 7 hours/day. They spend the other 17 learning how to be humans from their family.

>> No.4470901

>>4470879
why is this attitude "exactly" why Idoicracy could happen?
what is the alternative solution?

it's all you can do to try and form the future generation of adults into good parents through education.

You can't very well force stupid people not to have kids.

>> No.4470905

>>4470879
What if kids went to school for 7 hours a day learning valuable information similar to that taught in a classical education then learned important values and "how to be a human" from their family? What if the family, if you believe that's who kids should be taught from, had a more direct say in the child's education?

>> No.4470906

>>4470824
What.

>> No.4470911
File: 322 KB, 546x700, polacks.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4470911

>>4470824

>> No.4470918
File: 345 KB, 500x242, tumblr_lyvcdr0fmr1qcdaw2o1_500.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4470918

People aren't really becoming dumber.. it's just that dumb people are more visible.

>> No.4470920

>>4470911
>I don't like your post
>go back to /pol/!


Cry more babby

>> No.4470924
File: 8 KB, 162x311, wow.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4470924

>>4470920
>"the jews are responsible for all of my problems! not me!"

>> No.4470928 [DELETED] 

>>4470901
You seem to be implying that a better education system is all it would take. Children learn things like responsibility, determination, work ethic, etc. at home. You have to fix the parents before you can fix the kind.

And you do this by exterminating the niggers.

>> No.4470929

>>4470905
you can't force parents to parent one way or the other.

you can propagandize them to, but, unless their doing something illegal, it's not really the governments business.

>> No.4470932

>>4470920
Mods should ban posts like that.

>> No.4470937

>>4470905
>What if the family, if you believe that's who kids should be taught from
This has nothing to do with what should happen. It's what does happen.

>> No.4470939

>>4470928
Enjoy your b& faggot.

>> No.4470942

>>4470918
>tfw you will never impregnate Princess Zelda

>> No.4470943
File: 47 KB, 396x386, 1310672235781.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4470943

>>4470932
>"hitler didn't kill jews, that's a JIDF lie!"
>"hitler killed jews, he's awesome!"

>> No.4470945

>>4470928
i'm not saying that's all it would take, but i am saying that education is the only pratical option.

how do you propose we fix parents, except by educating them as children? kill all dumb lazy parents?

being lazy and watching sitcoms with your kids for 6 hours after they get off school, is not a crime.

see:
>>4470929

>> No.4470949

question to see if you're smart: which do you think is harder, jeopardy or wheel of fortune?

>> No.4470951

>>4470949
wheel of fortune is "harder", jeopardy is trivial technically

>> No.4470954

>>4470945
>being lazy and watching sitcoms with your kids for 6 hours after they get off school, is not a crime.
No one said it was. But it does lead to shitty children.

>> No.4470965

>>4470213
Some people can take in and process information better than others, and as such are smarter. Only a moronic social justice warrior can really think otherwise. Kids are taught at the same level to start with and some rise to the top while others sink to the bottom. Are you saying there is no reason for this, because it is to a very large extent genetics.

The reason there is no selective breeding at all is because that would be eugenics, a dirty word because of the association with Hitler scares people. People struggle to accept the notion that he might have been right about anything, regardless of whether eugenics came before him or how he completely fixed a broken economy, all ignored because, and I hate to sound so /pol/, "muh holocaust".

>> No.4470966

>>4470954
yeah i know, that's what i'm saying.
it's bad parenting, but you can't stop it.

education is the only solution. that is my point.

>> No.4470969

>>4470951
>"harder"
who are you quoting?

>> No.4470974

>>4470965
> how he completely fixed a broken economy
That shit wouldn't last past the war and you know it.

>> No.4470975

>>4470969
skrillex

>> No.4470979

>>4470966
I think it's deeper than just education. It's a social problem. If the lessons being taught in school aren't reinforced at home, many of them are completely lost.

>> No.4470985

>>4470979
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZoNDYOdmBM

>> No.4470987

>>4470965
The reason why you are still virgin is sexual selection you stupid neo-nazi.

There's no need for eugenics evolution takes care of itself.

>>>/pol/

>> No.4470989

>>4470979
>the lessons being taught in school

curved grades and rote memorization?

>> No.4470991

>>4470924
>>4470943

They didn't say anything remotely like that though.

>> No.4470993

>>4470979
i agree with you, and a kids home life has much more of an effect on who they turn out to be than their education does.

but you can't control what people do in their homes if they're not committing any crime. The best you can do is give kids homework (which is, i found out, what homework is there for).

education, and propaganda are still the only solutions i see.
feel free to name another one though.

>> No.4471002
File: 159 KB, 576x3864, last half is wrong.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4471002

>>4470965
>Are you saying there is no reason for this
The family is a important factor that you're missing. The way you are raised and potenciated by your parents in certain hobbies or such play a major role in your early life, which later it's affected by your friends and other things.

>> No.4471006

>>4470993
I'm kind of cheating here, because I don't think there is a solution. Things could obviously be made much better than they are, and I hope that happens because I work in public education. More investment and decentralization would be very beneficial. But I still believe that the majority of students are simply not going to succeed in the way idealistic reformers think they should.

>> No.4471008

>>4470987
Neither a Nazi or a virgin, just saying that if a person does a horrible thing that doesn't mean other points can't be valid.

The point to the post was that some were born smarter than others and that it is largely genetic, the post I was replying to basically claimed people are not born smart and it's all nurture which is bullshit. Finding intelligence as opposed to educating the masses would be eugenics, which would never happen in today's society because it's a dirty word.

Context is important yo.

>> No.4471011

>>4470993
>solution
Oh, I thought this was a "we are doomed" thread.

>> No.4471012
File: 15 KB, 374x250, 1313684588753.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4471012

>>4470991
>"niggers are savages, that's why we should kill them all!"

>> No.4471017
File: 1.05 MB, 500x248, ZELDASKYWARDSWORD4.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4471017

>>4470985
Self-interest must be subjugated to the will of the volk, a people's community.

>> No.4471018

>>4471012
Solid refutation comrade.

>> No.4471020

>>4471006
>students
>succeeding
This is about how himans are becoming progressively stupider because the dumb ones breed more.
Pay Attention!!

>> No.4471023

>>4470985
>amurika

lmfao

>> No.4471031

Prophetic fiction is essentially just a way for the writer to say "look at how smart I am".

Still, I have seen strange things that give me hope for a strange future that nobody could predict.

>> No.4471035

>>4470918
why havent you been banned yet for avatarfagging?

m00t if you are reading this please make smug posts a bannable offense

>> No.4471042

>>4471002
Family is of course a very relevant factor, but simply to claim genetics isn't a factor as so many do is simply infuriating.

The movie itself in it's "society is doomed" opening showed essentially a failing in both genetics and in family environments due to over breeding. I don't see it as a likely future, I simply hate the notion that intelligence is based off "random ass occurrences".

>> No.4471043
File: 469 KB, 500x281, tumblr_myfc5x1Mnv1sthzylo1_500.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4471043

>>4471035
Why would you want me banned?..

>> No.4471050
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4471050

>>4470753

>sheeple
My bottoms.

>> No.4471055

>>4470778

Then what, pray tell, IS intelligence if it isn't intellectual ability?

>> No.4471058

Since this is /lit/, why has no one brought up the Cyril M. Korbluth stories hat inspired "Idiocracy?

Go here:

http://www.gutenberg.ca/ebooks/kornbluth-littleblack/kornbluth-littleblack-00-h.html

and here:

http://mysite.du.edu/~treddell/3780/Kornbluth_The-Marching-Morons.pdf

Get back to me when you have a clue, you bastards.

>> No.4471060

>>4471055
genetically superior brain

>> No.4471069

>>4471060

Superior in what sense?

>> No.4471075

>>4471069
all things being equal, my brain works better than yours.

>> No.4471077

>>4471075

In what way?

>> No.4471078

>>4470087
>then there are studies saying whites will in the future become a minority, supplanted by races with lower IQs.
I know I'm late but
can you give me the source to these studies please? it's just I fear that this is the inevitable outcome of the US, and not too far off within our lifetime

>> No.4471084

Wow murrikans, seriously. I dead the whole thread and not ONE original contribution. It is BOTH genetics and education you idiots. And guess which is the only one you can tinkle with. And yes it is not only school but family, friends, TV, everything the kid touches and comes in contact with. You'd think here people knew how the rich take care of their young. If it's only genetic why do they spend so much sending them bere in europe? Ad for the question in op things are gradually improving but very slightly. Also the movie is about u murrikans and no place else. Sorry for how I wrote this, 3 Am andò from phone bere.

>> No.4471088

>>4471077
memory capcity, processing speed, attention.

i mean, if you had to quantify intelligence, i'd start there.

>> No.4471090

>>4471078
why the fuck does it matter what skin color people have to you?

>> No.4471091

>>4470879

Then what do you suggest, o Augustus?

>>4471088

And these are all essentially intellectual abilities.

>> No.4471092

>>4471090
I don't want to become a minority

>> No.4471094

>>4471060
isnt me
>>4471055
When someone is dumb, or smart, isnt it usually considered intellectual ability? Then there are phrases like "creative genius". We arent really certain what intelligence, or mental ability actually is yet it seems.

>> No.4471102

>>4471090
Race is deeper than skin color and you know it.

>> No.4471103

>>4471091
i just don't like the word "abilities" i guess, because i'm trying to stress that they are genetic, rather than something that can be practiced.

there is a part of all of those that come from practice, but i'm talking about the other part that makes me better or worse off than you by default.

you can't test that with an IQ test, because you can study for an IQ test, you can re-take, and do better on an IQ test, etc.

>> No.4471104

>>4471088
>genetically superior
>all things that can be improved except processing speed

>> No.4471109

>>4471103

But what about an IQ test for which you have not studied at all?

>> No.4471110

>>4471104
Of course they can be improved, but some have higher bases than others.

>> No.4471119

>>4471103
other than looking at genetics there is no test that can measure these things because all of us have some amount of practice in them. Also If you could reach the same degree of skill (unless there is a genetic limit) default intelligence is not that important.

>> No.4471120

>>4470929

Education is not "propagandizing".

>> No.4471123

>>4471120
>Propaganda is a form of communication aimed towards influencing the attitude of the community toward some cause or position

>> No.4471124

>>4471109
it could depend on skills practiced in daily life, otherwise Intelligence as defined as IQ wouldn't play an important role in things.

>> No.4471128

>/lit/ totally missing the point of the movie
Why am I not surprised. The movie talks about corporations and technology taking over the state and thus nobody needs to learn anything because machines do it for them. It doesn't have anything to do with "smart" people or "dumb" people ughhhh

>> No.4471133

>>4471120
Of course it is. You are indoctrinating them by according higher value to certain forms of knowledge above others. Everything about public education is purely ideological, and it was designed expressly for that purpose.

There's a reason that the elite go to private schools.

>> No.4471134

>>4471109
if i have a better brain than you, but a shittier upbringing, you will do better on the IQ test than i will, even if neither of us have studied.

that means IQ tests aren't measuring the cold hard fact of our intellectual potentials.

>> No.4471135

>>4471128
Did you skip the first half hour of the movie? sure it has a dystopian theme but they make the point obvious at the beginning about stupid people out-breeding dumb people

>> No.4471138

>>4471103
IQ tests only work when the subjects bother to put their full effort into them. Maladapted children won't bother and skew the results dramatically.

>> No.4471139

>>4471135
Yeah, I've probably skipped it because I've only watched it on tv. My bad.

>> No.4471141

>>4471119
see, i don't think it's important either.

but if you're going to quantify intelligence, that's how you'd do it.

IQ is basically useless because you can improve/regress depending on the effort you put in.

>> No.4471160

Idiocracy is what a person of average intelligence sees happening to the world with their basic understandings of biology and social sciences. What they do not appreciate is that they, themselves, are considered to be the manifestations of the Idiocracy that has always existed by their betters, who work to exploit that meek and gullible, and have done since the dawn of human civilization.

We have always lived in the Idiocracy, and it has gotten us to where we are today.

>> No.4471167
File: 139 KB, 547x533, WWII_MOUT_CassinoApr44b.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4471167

Yes, societies in the past were objectively more intelligent than the ones we have now.

>> No.4471184

it's obviously true. If you subsidize dumb people then you'll get more dumb people. Obviously. What debate is there?

>> No.4471259

we'll be genetically engineering ourselves to be superior beings before too much damage is done.

>> No.4471281
File: 176 KB, 926x875, 1384201062629.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
4471281

People are becoming more intelligent, less violent and compassionate on average at a high rate. Read some Steve-O Pinker instead of watching Beavis and Butthead 2.

>> No.4471284

>>4471259
Yeah but to what end? There's no way to know exactly what sort of predilections a genetically engineered person might have...

>> No.4471288

>>4471281
more compassionate*

>> No.4471544

>>4470085
You are being one of those people you just described right now. Instead of addressing the argument you are attacking the character of the people who you believe (note there is no evidence those are actually the people who believe this) are representing it.

>> No.4471940

I don't think people's inherited iqs have gone down, I just think that people are just getting more and more intellectually lazy and less and less curious/thoughtful.

People just don't care.

>>4470052
xkcd is cancer.

>> No.4471954

>>4471940

I think it's more that stupidity is able to be communicated faster. It's like the effect of only depending on news reports for a view of societal crime. The outrageous, the "bad", the "unacceptable" is something we almost seek like a bad drug or rather becomes more ingrained in our consciousness. The vast prehistory of organic forms which had to learn a strong negative bias against strange stimulus, against bad experience!

People have always been "intellectually lazy". A lot of people are still mendacious social apes. It's what works in a civilized mode of production where your surplus resources don't really depend on strict intellectual truth but motivations and vague stories and ideologies that erupt like lightning.

Look at the morons who look at evolution and ask stupid questions like "Why are there still apes?" or "What's the EVOLUTIONARY PURPOSE..."

The simple idea of mechanics creating cybernetic loops is like something light years above some weird autistic inculturating system that they possess, where every mechanic must correspond to a personal symbolic.

>> No.4472018

>>4470052
That reminds me of a little philosophical question I made up. It's inspired by those african dilemma tales.

A landowner has three guests. They are sitting by the fire and chatting. The first is an avid gun collector. The second is a marksman. The third knows that there's a bear on the landowner's property. Who is the most powerful?

Of course you can and are supposed to dick around with various variables. But the point is that you can't really say who is the most powerful. It's a dynamic thing. However, if the third guest manages to convince the other that the bear problem is not only worse than it really is but also totally new, then he will remain the most powerful.

>> No.4472037

>>4471138
>Implying caring about faggot tests is maladaption

>> No.4472050

>>4472037
It is. IQ tests are only a tool. And every tool can be misused because of overestimation

>> No.4473074

>>4470060
But in this case they are. People haven't been getting dumber. In fact, we've become smarter in relation to generations past. It has to do with the quality of education and the ease of access to information.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vpqilhW9uI

Now does that mean that there are no stupid people in the world anymore? Of course not. But every time you look at the demographic of 'stupid people' trends of poverty, illiteracy and less educational opportunities.

>> No.4473339

>>4471940
>>4471954

also I'd like to add that intelligence is probably just as much an emergent phenomena as much as it is influenced by genetics