Buddhist Traditionalism

[Anonymous No.23098839]

Is there a buddhsit critique of modernity?

[Anonymous No.23098844]

>>23098839
>modernity
No such thing exists.

[Anonymous No.23098854]

>>23098844
> what was early capitalism

[Anonymous No.23098856]

>>23098854
>capitalism
No such thing exists.

[Anonymous No.23098857]

>>23098839
yes
https://politicallyincorrectdharma.blogspot.com/
as you would expect, it's rubbush

[Anonymous No.23098858]

>>23098856
> what is a megacorps

[Anonymous No.23098860]

>>23098858
>megacorps
No such thing exists.

[Anonymous No.23098861]

there is, it's called living in a monastery

[Anonymous No.23098864]

>>23098860
> what is going to work

[Anonymous No.23098866]

>>23098864
>work
No such thing exists.

[Anonymous No.23098868]

>>23098839
Buddhism doesn't care about societies. Buddhism cares about cultivating a few qualities of the mind to end suffering. This is independent of any society.
From a buddhist point of view, all societies are the same: they are made by non-enlightened people who have wrong view on the aggregates and who base their lives on sensual pleasures.

[Anonymous No.23098871]

what do bhuddist monks even do?
christian monks are supposed to make wine or preech to thirdoworlders or run hospitals, historically write books, things of that nature

but what do bhuddist monks do? what are they getting paid for? seems like they just conned the king or local nobility of some kind into letting them have a nice building for themselves and then just sit around eating and working out?

[Anonymous No.23098873]

>>23098866
Well, apparently, not many things exist to you. May I ask, what does exist?

[Anonymous No.23098875]

>>23098871
collect alms

[Anonymous No.23098876]

>>23098871
buddhists monks are supposed to get up, meditate, then beg for food, then eat and do the daily chores then spend the rest of the day and night meditating

[Anonymous No.23098880]

>>23098873
The only way to know, is by knowing what doesn't exist.

[Anonymous No.23098882]

>>23098875
they get to live rent free and in return they get to have a sidejob?
huh?
>>23098876
so they eat for free and all they have to do in return is keep their house clean?

I don't think either of you understood my question, what do they do for the local economy or kingfom or culture as a whole? Like I said, christian monks made wine and wrote books and preached to foreigners. What do bhuddist monks do?

[Anonymous No.23098884]

>>23098882
The point is not to be a slave.

[Anonymous No.23098888]

>>23098884
but they are at the mercy of the nobility?
nobility lets them live rent free and builds their temples (housing), i'm asking what's in it for them?

[Anonymous No.23098895]

>>23098888
Why do people go to Church?

[Anonymous No.23098899]

>>23098882
>>so they eat for free and all they have to do in return is keep their house clean?
huh no, buddhist monks have no obligations towards the civilians besides what is written in the monastic code. If they do clean their monastery, it's because the abbot says so, not to please the civilians.

>>23098882
>I don't think either of you understood my question, what do they do for the local economy or kingfom or culture as a whole? Like I said, christian monks made wine and wrote books and preached to foreigners. What do bhuddist monks do?
they do jack shit for the normies because buddhism doesn't care about normies. Buddhism is not for the masses. That's why buddhism is not a religion, but only a cult.

It's the logocentric neurotic morons like te jews who can't stop deriving a legal system from their shitty religion and this creates a society.

>>23098888
yeah the local kings like to support some religious people, mostly because at the time they cared about spirituality. All people want to know about the universe and truth and stuff like that, the ruling class included. It's just that they don't really like to hear their way of life is not spiritual at all.
It's what ashoka learned and he changed completely his rules for his kingdom

[Anonymous No.23098900]

>>23098895
ritual chanting

[Anonymous No.23098948]

>>23098900
So what do people who go to church gain?

[Anonymous No.23098954]

>>23098948
i don't know

[Anonymous No.23099944]

Social classes in feudal Southeast Asia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Toungoo_Empire#Social_classes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayutthaya_Kingdom#Social_classes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pagan_Kingdom#Social_classes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paik_system#Land_holdings

[Anonymous No.23099976]

>>23098839
Anon...
Buddhism literally critiqued the whole world. There really isn't a reason for them to go and specifically focus on the flavor of the week.
>Is there a buddhist critique of x?
Is x in the world? If so, it's already dunked on by default.

[Anonymous No.23100016]

>>23098948
>>23098895
Thats not his question. Why are you being obtuse
Christian monks make alcohol, pretzels, cheese,preach, community service, academics, and the religion is core to the state
Buddhist monks don't seem to do anything
So why are buddhist monks even tolerated? Shouldn't they be living in caves with no support at all, not in ornate temples or anywhere near a capital city? Especially in countries that aren't buddhist as a whole or are atheist?

[Anonymous No.23100085]

>>23098882
>preached to foreigners.
I would love to torture Christcucks in my ancestral country and send their heads back to Europe as a gift.

Kys, icchantika.

[Anonymous No.23100086]

>>23100016
You don't understand religion, robots could make cheese.

[Anonymous No.23100096]

>>23098839
What about modernist criticism of Buddhism?

[Anonymous No.23100103]

>>23100016
The bigger question is why we don’t force conscription on Jehovahs Witnesses

[Anonymous No.23100117]

>>23100086
I'm not criticizing religion at all. Relax
>>23100103
We don't even do conscription

[Anonymous No.23100208]

>>23100085
what country

[Anonymous No.23100210]

>>23098839
>Is there a buddhsit critique of modernity?
There has been for 3000 years. And Buddhism's only 2500 years old.

[Anonymous No.23100253]

>>23098880
Nigger thinks he's a Zen sage

[Anonymous No.23100258]

>>23098839
Tbh I don't really understand Traditionalism so I might be missing some context here but there's the concept of the degenerate age of dharma but that said, it's not necessarily connected with modernity
>>23100016
If there exists a number of people who want Buddhist monks to be in their city, what is the problem?
Why do you think Buddhist monks should be living in caves with no support?

[Anonymous No.23100275]

>>23100253
>Zen sage
No such thing exists.

[S10241875 No.23100327]

>>23098882
>what do they do for the local economy or kingfom or culture as a whole? Like I said, christian monks made wine and wrote books and preached to foreigners. What do bhuddist monks do?

About the same, depending on the time and region and the Buddhist school. Nominally, as the anon above explained to you.

[Anonymous No.23100348]

>>23098873
Pretty sure it's a joke about buddhism m8

[Anonymous No.23100627]

>>23098839
Among other things, modernity values delusions such as self-view, nihilism, materialism, and hedonism. Ancient aristocracy/monarchy may not lead all of its citizens directly to enlightenment, but it at least quashes these and has more pro-social "delusions" like caste, duty, hierarchy, and a belief in the metaphysical (both in terms of supernatural beings and a supreme ultimate reality). These kinds of social-political teachings usually take a back seat to the actual pursuit of enlightenment, but they can be found in the suttas.
>>23098868
This is a reductionist view. For example the Buddha teaches about social stability in the Mahaparinibbana Sutta, and on reflection afterwards applies his teaching to the Sangha. The Sigalaka Sutta and Cakavatti Sutta also contain social teachings for the laity, so it's clear that from a Buddhist perspective there are good societies and bad societies, just as much as there are good and bad people, or good and bad realms (heaven/hell).
>>23098871
While both Christian and Buddhist monks write books and give spiritual teachings, I think you've hit on an important difference here. By caste, Christ was a peasant and Buddha was an aristocrat. So it makes sense that the followers of the carpenter would busy themselves with proletarian affairs like making food and medicine, whereas the followers of the prince would either meditate or provide guidance to their followers. Though the Buddha did teach generosity is a virtue, an ordained monk should pursue liberation above all else, so in their voluntary poverty the only thing they can give is wisdom.
>>23100096
That would be Nietzsche, but I remember seeing similar criticisms in Borges.

[Anonymous No.23100647]

>>23100117
No, but it would be funny if we did

[Anonymous No.23100781]

>>23098839
Buddhism in the sense of the Buddha's unvarnished message critiques every modernity in which it is situated.

That said, if by 'traditionalism' you mean right-wing Buddhism, that exists widely. Thai royalism and ethnoreligious Buddhist nationalism in Burma, Myanmar, Cambodia, and Sri Lanka are all examples. In previous ages, something like the Ikko-ikki or early Budhhist monarchies in the southeast Asia would serve as fitting examples.

One example of a text from the Pali canon that would be coded as 'conservative' today is the Mahasupina Jataka, which you can read here:
https://suttacentral.net/ja77/en/chalmers

A large problem you'll find in pursuing this line of inquiry is that Buddhism incorporates autocritical reflection into its system, typically in the direction of shedding traditional beliefs, not shoring them up. However, the core of Buddhism is always the renunciation of desire, which is permanently opposed to anything that calls itself 'modernity' which is always centered upon the liberation of new desires.

[Anonymous No.23101051]

Something else to consider, although this isn't a critique per se. I think it's noteworthy that modernity as we know it originated in the Christian West, whereas nothing of the kind gained traction in Buddhist Asia. I wonder if part of this is the hypermonopolistic nature of Christianity. Wherever Buddhism went, the native beliefs were mostly undisturbed, I mean when it arose it already incorporated some Vedic gods like Indra and Brahma, but when it moved to rest of Asia, it coexisted and often syncretized with the native polytheist systems. But Christians were extremely intolerant, to such an extent that you had Pascal reduce the question to either Christianity or irreligion (and gave only a statistical defense at that), so it was very easy for the West to turn secular-atheist as it is today. Then again, the muslims are also intolerant, and they never turned out anyone like Dawkins or Sartre.

[Anonymous No.23101100]

>>23101051
>the muslims are also intolerant, and they never turned out anyone like Dawkins or Sartre
the problem with the muslin is that they became so inbred that they are almost incapable of thinking or functioning outside the framework they were indoctrinated in

[Anonymous No.23101249]

>>23098839
McMahan - Buddhist Modernism; not so much a "Buddhist critique of modernity" but the (successful) Buddhist response to Christian missionaries sent from modern Western countries to colonial Asia
>>23100096
Buddhism was and in some cases still is an accessory to feudal (or feudal-ish) power structures in Asia; monasteries had serfs and plantations, were used as tax havens and often possessions of the surplus sons of the nobility, similar to remarkably similar to European Christianity on non-philosophical matters
>>23100781
>the renunciation of desire, which is permanently opposed to anything that calls itself 'modernity' which is always centered upon the liberation of new desires.
I was going to ask OP for a definition of "modernity" but "not being able to say no" is pretty good
>>23101051
Look into the Assmann, egyptologist Jan Assmann. He hit on a similar line of thinking as you did, got scolded for it, and being a good German apologized for being too hasty in blaming Abrahamism for introducing a dichotomy of true and false religion into western theology

[Anonymous No.23101251]

>>23100016
>in countries that aren't buddhist as a whole or are atheist
i think in those places the temple is a privately held property not granted by the state

[Anonymous No.23101274]

>>23101249
>Assmann
That's funny, I've had him on my reading list for a while now due to pic related. Thanks for the rec, I think I'll read him next.

[Anonymous No.23101296]

>>23100627
>but I remember seeing similar criticisms in Borges.
like what?

[Anonymous No.23101302]

>>23101051
>>23101100
>bashing Middle Easterners out of the blue
Genuinely kill yourselves. Europe deserves something far worse than the Mongolian invasions or Tamerlane. You Euroshits need to learn humility, really. The reason the Middle East failed is because of Mongolian and Turkic invasions. Islam was actually strengthened by the Mongols.
Also, Iran's IQ is around 97.
Honestly, all Europeans are genetically icchantika, and Israel should join BRICS and all of you should then be systematically culled in an apocalyptic world war.

[Anonymous No.23101315]

>>23101302
>Israel should join BRICS
?

[Anonymous No.23101321]

>>23101315
Israel should join BRICS as a way to truly destroy NATO and the West. You would be completely obliterated and spiritually destroyed when your masters abandon you. Smug pompous demons will finally get what they deserve. Then you will have a true white genocide at hand.
Eat shit and die.

[Anonymous No.23101332]

>>23101321
The only "Israel" that would join BRICS would be an Israel that had joined the Arab League after becoming Palestinian majority.

[Anonymous No.23101343]

>>23101332
Israel can be persuaded to join BRICS. Driving a wedge between Israel and the West is easier than you think. Once Israel and Iran make a peace, Yazdgird III's dream can be completed over your corpse.

[Anonymous No.23101355]

Buddhism seems to be a perpetual critique of modernity for all time, I would say that’s why it exists in the first place. In Theravada at least
>>23098857
This guy constantly shits on Western “Marxist” Buddhism then writes things like that lmao, literally the other side of the same coin.

[Anonymous No.23101361]

>>23101343
Holy damn the angry little browncel is still going

[Anonymous No.23101395]

>>23101361
>le brown
Most Buddhists, that is Sri Lankans, are brown. Honestly, I would have preferred having brown skin to further distance myself from you pompous LARPing snow nigger demons.

[Anonymous No.23101412]

>>23101395
Take your meds freddie mercury

[Anonymous No.23101499]

>>23101302
It's happened twice now that I've made perfectly dispassionate observations like
>the agganna sutta doesn't support evolution
>muslims are extremely intolerant of other religions
and gotten some seething tirade about le icchantikas. Regardless, maybe you should take some time off the internet and practice some compassion, for yourself and the rest of the world.

[Anonymous No.23101575]

>>23101499
Evolution is a fact of reality, you dumb icchantika. Also, Pisslam and Christcuckery have miniscule differences.
>practice some compassion
Stop corrupting the Dhamma, you dumb snow nigger trash.

[Anonymous No.23101995]

>>23100627
>This is a reductionist view. For example the Buddha teaches about social stability in the Mahaparinibbana Sutta, and on reflection afterwards applies his teaching to the Sangha. The Sigalaka Sutta and Cakavatti Sutta also contain social teachings for the laity, so it's clear that from a Buddhist perspective there are good societies and bad societies, just as much as there are good and bad people, or good and bad realms (heaven/hell).
No, the buddha only gives recommendations to the laity and those amounts to the 5 precepts over and over. And a society is not run on 5 precepts, let alone the buddhist ones.

[Anonymous No.23102611]

>>23098861
This

[Anonymous No.23102759]

Why do you think modernity bad?
>Because women are all whoring around
If these women lived 2,000 years ago what would stop them from doing so?
>Social norms, culture, religion, etc
So you admit that women are whorish regardless of the era, and that all traditional society does is outwardly cover up this fact?
>hurrr…
I’d rather live in a time when the truth is fully on display. If I spent my life slaving away for the sake of some lying slut, only to realize it at the end of my days, I would think it a life ill spent. Maybe you’d rather live under that delusion though.
>Yeah but modernity also bad because x, y, z
In most cases it’s probably no different from the above - that is, the veils have been ripped away and we’re seeing reality and human nature in its raw state, without the makeup that traditional society layered onto it. Instead of whining you should be glad you’re privileged to have access the these truths.

[Anonymous No.23102772]

>>23101274
>Jan Assmann
what are the odds that guy got bullied at high shool?

[Anonymous No.23102776]

>>23102772
I used to know a Titsman. He was never bullied though

[Anonymous No.23103351]

>>23102772
>>23102776
Nothing wrong with being an Assman or a Titsman, the problem is with Manass or Mantits

[Anonymous No.23103434]

>>23098839
>buddhsit critique of modernity

[Anonymous No.23104995]

>>23101995
Again, reductionist. Here is his counsel about the relations between masters and slaves, from the Sigalaka Sutta:
>A master should serve their bondservants and workers in five ways: by organizing work according to ability, by paying food and wages, by nursing them when sick, by sharing special treats, and by giving time off work.
>Bondservants and workers served by a master in these five ways show compassion to him in five ways. They get up first, and go to bed last. They don’t steal. They do their work well. And they promote a good reputation. Bondservants and workers served by a master in these five ways show compassion to him in these five ways.
Of those ten articles, only the one about servants not stealing matches one of the 5 precepts. And in the larger section the Buddha gives similar advice about relations in and between families, castes, etc. that can't be boiled down to the precepts. The precepts are just the bare minimum, and for that matter they're all about abstention from bad activities, whereas the Buddha gives (in this sutta and others) plenty of positive advice about doing good and cultivating virtue.