/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.22572492]

What the fuck. Why Salambò by Flaubert never discussed here - and hardly mentioned anywhere? This is an absolutely insane book, in all the possible senses of word.
>historical novel on the Mercenary war in Carthago around 200 BC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercenary_War
I am halfway through this and the amount of details he manages to put in one book is insane. It builds up to picture the people, the customs, the ideas and the system as totally foreign, and the result is that the book feels at the same time hyperrealistic and psychedelic in a nightmarish way - it's as if he managed to write a fantasy novel that feels absolutely real. Characters do and say and think the weirdest shit following some absurd ancient-time logic. Are you a leftwing hippie who wants to meet god through a series of drug-fuelled hallucinations? This is the book for you. Are you an Evola reader with a kink for ancient times and gorey war? This is also the book for you.

And what is most absurd, this a book by Gustave Flaubert, a guy who is mostly remembered for writing the "realistic" tale of a lady being deluded into depression by YA novels. He should, by all means, be talked about way more on /lit/, and way more outside Madame Bovary - which is by all means a perfect novel, but which will look way different to you once you touch on Salambò and start reading more on him. I don't remember where, but Flaubert was called himself "a mystic who doesn't believe in anything" - and I feel like there is a giant goldmine to be found in his "mystic" vein. It's very present in MB as well, you can see it if you read Nabokov's lecture on him.
Anyway, read this (and the rest). Flaubert's craftsmanship is perfect, you can learn how to write good literature from his books - and Salambò it's the closest you can get to having a drug trip without drugs, in my experience, together with FW. Read it for a couple of hours before sleeping and then report.

[Anonymous No.22572511]

>>22572492
Damn thats actually a great recommendation I want to check this out thank you

[Anonymous No.22572531]

>>22572492
Flaubert is a genius who's strangely neglected on /lit/. He managed to write something in all styles and artistic paradigms. Bouvard&Pecuchet is a very modernist novel. It's something like the execution of a novel Borges might have written one of his fictitious reviews for. And The Temptation of St Anthony is a great psychedelic ride. I hope someday we can use AI to turn it into a movie.

[Anonymous No.22572542]

>>22572531
I am looking forward to reading that. He seems to be strangely neglected in general, I must say, outside of Madame Bovary and Sentimental Education. In my home country (Italy), you can find Madame Bovary and Sentimental Education by all the major publishing houses, but the Temptation, despite being his fourth novel, is only available by a tiny publishing house. His writings are treated very unevenly, which is weird for a major writer like Flaubert.
Very few talk about his philosophical thoughts, mystic tendencies, etc. I feel like there is a whole goldmine that is just passing under silence here for the sake of being able to catalogue him as "realist" writer, while he is very much beyond the realistic-unrealistic dichotomy.

[Anonymous No.22573087]

>>22572542
He certainly seems neglected in the anglosphere, and it's strange to hear about his treatment in Italy, but in Romania all his works have been published. Even his Dictionary of Received Ideas was recently published and most of his works were available even in commie times.

[Anonymous No.22573203]

>>22573087
How is the dictionary? We have it in Italian as well, I was wondering whether to buy it or not

[Anonymous No.22573475]

>>22572492
>Salambò by Flaubert
Who translated it better
A. J. Krailsheimer, John S. Chartres, or E. Powys Mathers

[Anonymous No.22573528]

>>22572492
Sounds truly awesome and just the type of thing I'd like. Too bad that I do not read.

[Anonymous No.22573564]

>>22573203
Haven't read his dictionary yet, but from the few phrases I've seen, it seems to consist of witticisms.

[Anonymous No.22573576]

>>22572492
I had to read in high school (France obviously). I don't remember much of the details but I found it infinitely better than Madame Bovary.

[Anonymous No.22573578]

Great book, very underrated and one of my favorites, thanks for the effortposting OP. Recommended to anybody who's into war novels, extremely well-researched historical novels, or if ancient temples filled with incense smoke where hulking warriors covered in chains and leather kneel before hooded priests performing human sacrifices to Moloch sounds like a cool vibe to you.

One criticism I do have is that it's a little "overresearched" and could have used a less autistic amount of detail. Expect a ton of footnotes or, if your edition doesn't have any, expect to be constantly looking up proper nouns and pieces of obscure military equipment.

[Anonymous No.22573608]

>>22573576
I've tried to read Madame Bovary in high school and I thought it was shit. I was too retarded. Tried again 15 years later and I thought it's one of the greatest books I've ever read, and that Flaubert is underrated.

[Anonymous No.22573615]

>>22573087
>neglected in the anglosphere
I've got all his fiction and the Egypt book and his letters in penguin classics. For a 19th century foreign writer he's hardly neglected.

[Anonymous No.22573663]

>>22573615
Are you the anglosphere? No? Ok. But seriously, hats off to you for your literary taste. (assuming you have his works for the value you find in them)

[Anonymous No.22573685]

>>22573578
>Expect a ton of footnotes or, if your edition doesn't have any, expect to be constantly looking up proper nouns and pieces of obscure military equipment.
based. I'm in.

[Anonymous No.22573711]

>>22573663
>Are you the anglosphere?
Penguin is the leading publisher of classics in the anglophone world and they have published everything by Flaubert, so he is hardly neglected in the anglosphere.
If I go to say The London Review of Books and search for articles about Flaubert, they have written more about him than about other 19th century writers like Thackeray or Trollope, so he is hardly neglected in the anglosphere.
I could go on. What evidence will you accept that this Flaubert fellow is actually very highly regarded in the anglosphere? Because he's not, you pulled that out of your ass and I'm calling you out on in

[Anonymous No.22574426]

>>22573711
>Penguin is the leading publisher of classics in the anglophone world
Well, that's exactly the kind of publisher which could publish neglected classics. Or it could publish him in small numbers. In fact all your arguments fail to provide conclusive evidence for the kind of problem this is: one of proportion - how much attention does Flaubert really get in comparison to other authors, even 19th century ones.

Even the last argument would only be pertinent if The London Review of Books was sufficiently important throughout the anglosphere, which is not evident at all.

Still, it's comforting to hear that he's appreciated in the UK. He's rarely mentioned on this board, and he's also not mentioned in Bloom's canon (whatever you may think of it, it's the only famous one).

[Anonymous No.22574599]

>>22573578
Yes I also got the feeling that it was somewhat baroque in the amount of stuff he puts in. Yet, it's because there's so many foreign objects and vocabulary and customs that the book conveys the feeling of depicting (hallucinating) another world. I suspect he might have been overdoing it in purpose

[Anonymous No.22574720]

>>22573608
I read it recently and it was good but the whole time I was wondering why I wasn’t reading a Russian classic instead.

[Anonymous No.22574735]

>>22574426

[Anonymous No.22574743]

>>22574720
Prolly bc most of those Russian classics were influenced by it.

[Anonymous No.22574752]

>>22573528
Same. I just keep buying books hoping one day i'll feel like reading again

[Anonymous No.22574753]

>>22572492
Recently stole this book from a café is this a sign to start reading this? Sentimental Ed is one of my favorite pieces of literature how well does Salambò compare to it?

[Anonymous No.22575468]

>>22574426
He is in Bloom's canon.
>Gustave Flaubert
>Madame Bovary, translated by
Francis Steegmuller
>Sentimental Education
>Salammbo
>A Simple Soul
Directly from the Canon.

[Anonymous No.22575497]

>>22572492
The book caused a Salammbo-mania in France and French Tunisia. Old Carthage is now renamed the Salammbo district, today there's a Salammbo driving school, a Salammbo supermarket, Salammbo pre-school etc. The Tophet is known as Salammbo's tophet.

[Anonymous No.22575512]

>>22574753
They're very different works. Sentimental Education is a bit, ahem, boring bourgeois adults being damp squibs. Salammbo is proto-decadent and proto-fantasy sensualist violence and eroticism. The common thread is Flaubert's excellence and dillgence in writing.

[Anonymous No.22575534]

>>22572492
Salammbo museaum exhibition from last year, mostly in French
https://www.mucem.org/en/salammbo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OoKNo3TouYU

[Anonymous No.22575542]

>>22573475
I just read the copy my local library had, from an old minor publisher. French translations are much safer than from other languauges, the pool of good translators is very large.

[Anonymous No.22575606]

>>22572492
>>22573578
That sounds awesome.

[Anonymous No.22575641]

>>22572492
I haven't read it but I hear it was inspired by Martials Epigrams, the cover reminded me of Martials spanish wife/whore/mistress, and..
> hyperrealistic and psychedelic in a nightmarish way
sounds about right.

Hey, this book has grown legs and is swaggering around in holiday clothes.

[Anonymous No.22575644]

>>22575497
that's almost like with when the Romans renamed Troas as Illium. Nice but a bit too much.