/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.22500394]

Struggling to get through Numbers, does it get back to being as good as it was in Genesis and the first half of Exodus?

[Anonymous No.22500415]

>>22500394
genesis, job, ecclesiastes, psalms, isaiah and the gospels. That's all you need the rest into the trash it goes

[Anonymous No.22500434]

The Torah is largely pretty mid after Genesis. Joshua is really good but gets boring again near the end when they start dividing the land up. Judges is grimdark kino and the kino continues until Chronicles, then picks up again at Esther. There are still some autistic genealogies and building instructions that you can skim but it's worth it.
>Captcha: GGAY8

[Anonymous No.22500559]

>>22500394
We don't need books to live

[Anonymous No.22500577]

>>22500394
Numbers is the third most important book in the Old Testament, though

[Anonymous No.22500638]

>>22500577
Source ?

[Anonymous No.22500877]

Most of the Bible is boring AF, but Numbers was especially boring. Try to imagine the dull-witted mind that would enjoy reading this, or get anything useful out of Numbers 33:

[5]: And the children of Israel removed from Rameses, and pitched in Succoth.
[6]: And they departed from Succoth, and pitched in Etham, which is in the edge of the wilderness.
[7]: And they removed from Etham, and turned again unto Pi-hahiroth, which is before Baal-zephon: and they pitched before Migdol.
[8]: And they departed from before Pi-hahiroth, and passed through the midst of the sea into the wilderness, and went three days' journey in the wilderness of Etham, and pitched in Marah.
[9]: And they removed from Marah, and came unto Elim: and in Elim were twelve fountains of water, and threescore and ten palm trees; and they pitched there.
[10]: And they removed from Elim, and encamped by the Red sea.
[11]: And they removed from the Red sea, and encamped in the wilderness of Sin.
[12]: And they took their journey out of the wilderness of Sin, and encamped in Dophkah.
[13]: And they departed from Dophkah, and encamped in Alush.
[14]: And they removed from Alush, and encamped at Rephidim, where was no water for the people to drink.
[15]: And they departed from Rephidim, and pitched in the wilderness of Sinai.
[16]: And they removed from the desert of Sinai, and pitched at Kibroth-hattaavah.
[17]: And they departed from Kibroth-hattaavah, and encamped at Hazeroth.
[18]: And they departed from Hazeroth, and pitched in Rithmah.
[19]: And they departed from Rithmah, and pitched at Rimmon-parez.
[20]: And they departed from Rimmon-parez, and pitched in Libnah.
[21]: And they removed from Libnah, and pitched at Rissah.
[22]: And they journeyed from Rissah, and pitched in Kehelathah.
[23]: And they went from Kehelathah, and pitched in mount Shapher.
[24]: And they removed from mount Shapher, and encamped in Haradah.
[25]: And they removed from Haradah, and pitched in Makheloth.
[26]: And they removed from Makheloth, and encamped at Tahath.
[27]: And they departed from Tahath, and pitched at Tarah.
[28]: And they removed from Tarah, and pitched in Mithcah.
[29]: And they went from Mithcah, and pitched in Hashmonah.
[30]: And they departed from Hashmonah, and encamped at Moseroth.
[31]: And they departed from Moseroth, and pitched in Bene-jaakan.
[32]: And they removed from Bene-jaakan, and encamped at Hor-hagidgad.
[33]: And they went from Hor-hagidgad, and pitched in Jotbathah.
[34]: And they removed from Jotbathah, and encamped at Ebronah.
[35]: And they departed from Ebronah, and encamped at Ezion-gaber.
[36]: And they removed from Ezion-gaber, and pitched in the wilderness of Zin, which is Kadesh.
[37]: And they removed from Kadesh, and pitched in mount Hor, in the edge of the land of Edom.

[Anonymous No.22501561]

>>22500394
Just skim through Numbers. Numbers is "important" but only as a document, because the genealogies of later figures is traced by Numbers. Skim through it and later when the Bible tells you that someone is the descendant of someone else, just assume that it's true and that it's documented in Nunbers or one of the surrounding books. And if you want to check you can always look up the reference, since later verses always show the cross-references on the bottom or side of the page.

The only important thing you need to know is that Jesus is the descendant of David, and Israel as a whole was descended from Isaac and Jacob. This isn't made super clear, but if you pay close attention, the Muslim countries are basically all descended from Cain.

So while Abraham's good descendants led to Jesus, the first murderer in all creation started the tribe that became Syria and eventually Islam.

One important detail with Jesus being a descendant of David is that He is also the creator of David, so it comes full circle. In David's psalms, he writes that the Lord knew him and knit him together while he was still in the womb; and Jesus says in the gospels to the Jewish Pharisees, "Before Abraham was, I AM." This also ties everything back together as it references God's answer to Moses when Moses asked Him His name, and He told him, "Tell them that I AM sent you."

There's lots of obscure little things you can learn from Numbers, but only if you've already read the rest of the Bible and understand some of the tribes already.

I'd skim through Deuteronomy too since it's similar. Once you get to the minor prophets, Samuel and the story of Samson, the story of David and Saul, things get a lot more interesting.

[Anonymous No.22501768]

>>22500394
God is talking to you. Are you a spiritual warrior or some couch-bound sleeper? The book of Numbers contains a large amount of activity.

>Balaam and the donkey that gets to talk
>the tired pigeons that fell in piles two feet tall, and when the people ate the cursed flesh they perished with blood in their teeth
>Joshua and Caleb are set aside from the other ten spies

And so much more.

>oh no, there are some numbers and stuff!

Grow up. Do you want spiritual gifts or do you want to go to sleep? God's battles are tough. We can't have you falling out every ten minutes like the people in Numbers did.

With everything in the Bible, ask yourself "should I copy this behavior or should K avoid this behavior?" You should avoid just about every single behavior in Numbers.

[Anonymous No.22501773]

>>22501561
You can take the high speed interstate through the Bible, or you can park your car and get out and walk.

Jesus knew and loved the Old Testament. We must be like Jesus.

[Anonymous No.22501795]

>>22500877
It's good for studying history.

[Anonymous No.22501811]

>>22500394
Just skip the Tabernacle sections of Exodus, Leviticus, the Census sections of Numbers, and Deuteronomy save the last four chapters.

[Anonymous No.22501822]

>>22500415
Acts?

[Anonymous No.22501858]

>>22501768
Yes, Numbers has SO much to "offer".
5.11-31: A prescribed trial-by-ordeal for women accused of adultery; the man has plenty of say in the matter, but she has none.
14.18: Children are cursed for the sins of their parents, to the third and fourth generations.
14.20-37: Anyone who complains gets condemned to wander the wilderness until they die.
15.32-36: God commands that a man gets stoned to death for gathering sticks on the Sabbath.
16: The people rebel against God for not fulfilling his promises to them, and he responds with mass murder.
16.49: 14,700 killed by a divine plague.
I could go on. Frankly, it sounds safer to NOT be a follower of this God.

[Anonymous No.22501864]

>>22501795
My study Bible (the Oxford NRSV) admits most sites are not geographically identifiable.

[Anonymous No.22501877]

>>22501858
"If now thou hast understanding, hear this: hearken to the voice of my words.
17 Shall even he that hateth right govern? and wilt thou condemn him that is most just?
18 Is it fit to say to a king, Thou art wicked? and to princes, Ye are ungodly?
19 How much less to him that accepteth not the persons of princes, nor regardeth the rich more than the poor? for they all are the work of his hands."
- Job 34:16-19

[Anonymous No.22501882]

>>22500394
The book is a cringe hodgepodge of ancient Jewish myths and laughably primitive cultures filled with genocidal, superstitious idiots.

[Anonymous No.22501891]

>>22500394
no, the bible is frontloaded like an encyclopaedia
sorry

[Anonymous No.22501909]

>>22501891
Genesis is completely retarded though. Why does God punish Adam and Eve? Because he was holding them accountable for their action, right? But wait, they made the action to eat the fruit of the knowledge of Good and Evil before eating it, which means they did not know Good and Evil before they ate it. How can you hold someone accountable when they lack the faculties to understand their decision in the first place? Literally the very first book and the bible falls flat on it's face.

[Anonymous No.22501921]

>>22501811
Understanding the symbolism of the Tabernacle is important though. It recurs in the temple in the Solomonic period, again in the dream temple of Ezekiel, and then culminates in the structure of the Gospel of John, which identifies Jesus' life, ministry, and death all with the various rooms and rites of the Tabernacle, obviously wanting the reader to see him not only as the perfection of all prior rituals but also as God dwelling among man.

The human heart might not always delight in God's word immediately, but that's no reason just to neglect passages that when recontextualised by later books can only inspire awe and wonder at its depth and intricacy. I recommend picrel which should be a great help to anyone trying to understand the way the Bible works as a cohesive text.

[Anonymous No.22501926]

>>22501921
>culminates in the structure of the Gospel of John, which identifies Jesus' life, ministry, and death all with the various rooms and rites of the Tabernacle, obviously wanting the reader to see him not only as the perfection of all prior rituals but also as God dwelling among man.
Explain this to me, please.

[Anonymous No.22501932]

>>22501909
>oral tradition from before copper was mined isn't scientifically accurate or logical from my perspective
Go figure. You know the fundamentalist/normal explanation for Adam and Eve, but there's increasingly kooky interpretations. Don't forget there's a Sumerian equivalent in the tale of Adapah, and it mirrors all the gift of clothing/eating of fruit, but in Sumerian lore Adam was the first priest, not the first man. (The bible mentions the creation of man before Adam is introduced BUT THAT'S HERESY!!!~!)

[Anonymous No.22501949]

>>22501932
>logical from my perspective
I mean, my perspective has nothing to do with it. If morality is to mean anything, it must include culpability. And for culpability to exist a person must be capable of apprehending the error of their action beforehand. Otherwise it's just punishment for the sake of punishment, the essence of sadomasochism.

[Anonymous No.22501962]

>>22501949
maybe adam was retarded

[Anonymous No.22502003]

>>22501909
Because they chose not to obey God and rejected Him as the sustenance of their being. Their wanting to know moral good and evil for themselves displays a lack of trust in God, as if He would not provide for them all the good things that they needed. The almost arbitrary, superfluity of their being not allowed to eat from the tree is really the essential detail in the story: they will obey God in everything else because it aligns with their natural desires, what they need to thrive and enjoy life, they have no reason to not want the goodness he provides them. The forbidden tree adds an element of choice, however: will they choose to obey God out of sheer obedience, out of love for His perfect will, or would they rather pursue what they believe to be superior. Whilst it's a rather imperfect analogy, the decision of the child to disobey his parents is not brought on by the child's ability to discern between what is morally right and wrong; it is a decision as to which authority he will trust - his parents or himself. In a sense, Adam and Eve were spiritual children, faced with much the same choice, and they chose themselves as the ultimate authority, and also all the death, suffering, and separation from God that that entailed.

[Anonymous No.22502018]

>>22502003
If a parent places a poison apple in the middle of a room and then leaves, and the child eats the apple and dies, the parent is going to prison for neglect causing death. No one would dream of blaming the child for it's ignorance, since it's obvious the child was ignorant at the time and the responsibility for it's well being resided upon the parent. God supposedly set up every criteria of the scene and then allowed Adam and Eve to be tempted, and in their ignorance they went along with it. The whole story makes no sense if you think rationally for even a moment.

[Anonymous No.22502032]

>>22502018
It's all for a greater glory in the end though so it makes sense from that perspective if you think about it.

[Anonymous No.22502041]

>>22501882
>genocidal
The Bible is....based?

[Anonymous No.22502106]

>>22501926
Well, you would have to read the James B Jordan book I attached above for the full explanation, but I will try and summarise it here.

John's Gospel begins with the Word's becoming flesh, and "tabernacling" among us, the word in Greek translated as "dwelt" being the same as is used to describe the glory-cloud of God when it is in the Tabernacle in the OT. I'm not too certain but I think this is a fairly standard interpretation of the verse.

John then divides his account of Jesus' ministry and teaching between three sacred items of the Tabernacle: the laver of cleansing, the table of showbread, and the lampstand. The laver of cleansing section relates Jesus' baptism, his turning water to wine, his discussing baptism of spirit and water, his presenting himself as the stream which if drunk from will banish thirst forever, and he heals at the pool of Bethseda. Next, table of showbread, Jesus feeds the five thousand, declares his flesh must be eaten to attain salvation etc. Then, lampstand, Jesus calls himself the light of the world, heals the blind, calls Lazarus back from the realm of darkness to light. In this same order, before the Passion, these are all revisited again, in his washing of his disciples' feet, breaking of the bread, and discussion of the Spirit. His death and resurrection are fairly obvious parallels with the Tabernacle sacrificial system. Jesus' being brought back to life parallels the acceptance by God of the High Priest's sacrifice. The two angels at the head and foot of the tomb are like the cherubim on the ark of the covenant.

These are just the most obvious parallels, because what's important to remember is that the Tabernacle represents an essential, archetypal idea which in modulated forms is represented right from the Garden of Eden to the new creation. There is an accumulation of signs throughout the Bible related to the "Tabernacle" in its various forms, all of which find their focal point in Christ. Because of this, there is some more cool stuff about the Garden of Eden etc not explicitly linked to the Tabernacle but nevertheless related via exegesis and careful and attentive typological readings. I cannot recommend Jordan's book enough however, it has greatly helped with my own understanding of many Bible passages I found vague before or foolishly dismissed as having no substance.

[Anonymous No.22502228]

>>22500394
Nah it's over. Skip to the NT, then read the rest slowly through your life

[Anonymous No.22502264]

>>22500415
very jewish of you to say that trash part.

[Anonymous No.22502340]

>>22502264
The entire bible was written by jews, except possibly like 3 books.

[Anonymous No.22502527]

>>22502032
>Obey and be a slave
>Don't you dare consider Good and Evil for yourself
>For "a greater glory"
So just a run of the mill cult?

[Anonymous No.22502611]

>>22501773
>We must be like Jesus.
So, celibate? Definitely a good idea in your case.

[Anonymous No.22502639]

What translation do you guys use? NASB (1995) here.

[Anonymous No.22502778]

>>22502639
KJV.