/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.22457865]

>Let's see some history books on the history section
>Hitler empire
>Hitler the eunuch
>Hitler the devil
>Hitler and racism
>Hitler terror
>Hitler and nazism
>Hitler 2
>Hitler vs stalin
>50 shades of hitler
>the man who tricked hitler
>Hitler and the 7 jews

For God's sake the world didnt start in 1933 why are they so obsessed? How normal people can even learn history without thinking everything wrong in the world is hitler?

[Anonymous No.22457881]

>>22457865
are you from argentina or what anon?

[Anonymous No.22457903]

>>22457865
Crawl back to your cesspit, you nazi vermin. Just fuck off and never come back.

[Anonymous No.22457946]

>>22457903
Hitler was actually less of a sinner than the American and British president

[Anonymous No.22457951]

>>22457903
>Hitler was the worst person in the world to ever exist! Questioning that fact makes you JUST AS BAD!

[Anonymous No.22458003]

Because WWII is the foundation myth of modernity. Thus most people act like history began in 1945. Everybody subconsciously acts this way. It’s all-pervasive.

Everything of consequence happened then that sets up the epoch of America as the invisible global empire and leader of the world community against the totalitarian regimes of the Nazis and Soviets.

The narrative is simple and it reinforces and justifies all social, political, and cultural norms as they exist today. There is a copypasta I’ve seen that conveys this idea rather succinctly but I can’t seem to find it.

[Anonymous No.22458008]

>>22458003
ww2 ushered in post-modernity tho before that people still thought some kind of totalitarian ideology could usher in utopia after ww2 everyone is just like uhh ya i don't think i will trust the science after all

[Anonymous No.22458107]

>>22458003
>sets up the epoch of America as the invisible global empire and leader of the world community against the totalitarian regimes of the Nazis and Soviets.
But why did it back fire against US? Even its own citizens are sympathetic to soviets and communism. They own greatness isnt preventing them from internal destruction.

I was thinking about Rome and how they started as the light of civilization against barbarians to the great beast and self hating nation until they resset. Maybe every civilization needs a new myth to keep working.

[Anonymous No.22458111]

>>22458003
I noticed this obscured all periods beforehand in the minds of common people. It's impossible for your average Joe, especially if he's an American, to conceptualize that throughout history humanity wasn't based around welfare systems, that life was in a large part tied to agriculture and social status, along with inequality and differences isn't a function of material inequality but higher powers that don't exist today. There are jo more epochs, only the period before WW2, considered shitty and after it, considered increasingly less shitty.

[Anonymous No.22458261]

Hitler would have checked these numbers

[Anonymous No.22458263]

>>22458261
FUCK!

[Anonymous No.22458264]

WW2 is the most interesting point in history and people want to profit on that

[Anonymous No.22458290]

>>22457865
>the world didn't start in 1933
The "modern world" did, and the religion of world war 2 was its base.
Hitler is a stand in for the Devil himself.
Nazis just mean demons.
The Holocaust can not be question.

[Anonymous No.22458292]

>>22457865
How far left were the Nazis?

[Anonymous No.22458304]

>>22457865
Hitler is the mythology that underpins our society. All positive virtues in society are found in opposing Hitler and his qualities.

[Anonymous No.22458358]

>>22458304
What about humane treatment of animals?

[Anonymous No.22458396]

>>22458292
If they were rightists they would be monarchists nostalgics, trad conservative retards or capitalists liberals and they would let jews peek into power completely or Germany turn into a bolshevik anarchy shithole

[Anonymous No.22458411]

I love Hitler sama

[Anonymous No.22458489]

>>22457903
YWNBAW

[Anonymous No.22458544]

>>22458358
No one really gives a shit about animals.

[Anonymous No.22458548]

>>22457951
just curious who is your top 3

[Anonymous No.22458549]

>>22458292
some leftist elements in their economics and ideas of a race-based rather than class-based socialism, but very right-wing in most other areas

[Anonymous No.22458556]

>>22458261
Yeah, checked

[Anonymous No.22458565]

>>22458292
Nazi = NDSP = National Democratic Socialist Party. Look at their policies, they were pretty far left. The poltards on here who claim right wing always attempt to make arguments they were a right wing movement so it falls in line with their views but like most all of what poltards claim it falls far short of reality.

[Anonymous No.22458575]

>>22458565
No one agrees with you. The "le nazis were left wing" is a boomer libertarian meme. You're not a boomer libertarian, are you? That would be embarrassing.

[Anonymous No.22458577]

>>22458565
>National Democratic

[Anonymous No.22458580]

>>22458575
It doesn't matter if you agree with me, I'm telling you what the facts are. You are already telling me you are going to choose to remain ignorant and be a good goy poltard nazi larper, do you enjoy BBC porn and have a junk collection of stuff with SS on it too?

[Anonymous No.22458587]

>>22458580
Next time you should at least get the party name NSDAP (National Socialist German Workers' Party) correct if you want to be taken seriously

[Anonymous No.22458589]

>>22458580
Yes, to the first and no to the second unless my fathers swastika tattoo on his butt counts.

[Anonymous No.22458598]

>>22458587
You got me, you are absolutely right, at least you admit they are socialist now though. Thanks for telling me I won that.

>>22458589
Still getting filtered by introductions to Plato and literal blog posts about hegel?

[Anonymous No.22458600]

>>22458598
Yeah "Socialist" is in the name, just like how the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is a democracy

[Anonymous No.22458602]

>>22458600
Are you familiar with Nazi economic policy? Clearly you have some strange ideas about them, tell me what you believe the nazis are anon. Tell me where the jew touched you goy.

[Anonymous No.22458606]

>>22458598
Are you guys actually Neoplatonists or is this a meme? Do you legitimately believe there is a parallel world which is the form of a chair? It consists of pure chair-ishness.

[Anonymous No.22458609]

>>22458548
Lenin, Churchill, Larry Fink

[Anonymous No.22458611]

>>22458602
Yeah sure they had some leftist economic ideas. Combined with extreme racism, nationalism, traditional values, and a hatred of Marxist philosophy. They are in no way friends of what we typically refer to as socialists.

[Anonymous No.22458612]

>>22457865
>For God's sake the world didnt start in 1933
It did. The sooner you realize this, the more equipped you'll be to fight it.

[Anonymous No.22458617]

>>22458602
If you think economic policy is the determining factor in distinguishing left and right, you are absolutely hopeless.

[Anonymous No.22458620]

>>22458606
Neoplatonism is the meme, it wasn't even created in Athens and didn't involve Plato, it was mostly a plotinus thing. It gets memed around on here in philosophical discussions but I haven't seen anyone try to take it seriously.

[Anonymous No.22458627]

>>22458620
Neoplatonism is just a very dogmatic reinterpretation of the most dogmatic of Plato’s middle era dialogues (ie the ones with the forms) which is why the Hackett intro says they treat Plato like how the Christians treat “the Books of Moses” in Hackett’s own words. They absolutely do involve Plato.

[Anonymous No.22458632]

>>22458611
Ok so you can drop the charade and the larp and just say you are a racist anti-semite. The United States prides itself on "hating" Marxism yet the country has virtually all of the prescribed public policies listed in the titular manifesto.

>>22458617
Just go back and read the posts, if you don't possess that kind of comprehension then go back to pol.

[Anonymous No.22458638]

>>22458627
Holy shit you really did get filtered. Nvm, you're right, go back to nazi larping, my bad.

[Anonymous No.22458643]

>>22458638
You are complaining about an intro you did not read? What Hackett says is that Platonists and Neoplatonists have a faulty foundation to their belief systems because they focus on a dogmatic interpretation of Plato’s writings. That is all he says. The comparison to how the Christians treat books of the Bible is literally his own words on the subject not mine. I am relaying what others said on the subject?

[Anonymous No.22458673]

>>22458643
I will frankly admit I didn't read the intro to Hackett, but I don't care about secondary sources, especially in philosophy. I have read damn near the entirety of Plato's known works and I will say that most disputes within/out rationalism are mostly epistemological in nature. This is almost as stark a contrast to the theological example you have provided as you can get since accepting religious convictions based on scriptures means conformity to the same epistemological structure. A true rationalist would recognize disagreement and probably just say you are wrong for disagreeing but that is about it. If you didn't actually read Plato and didn't read any neoplatonic material and just read Hacketts intro and showed up here to debate that then I can readily understand why your filtering made the rounds as much as it did, it may have been overzealous.

[Anonymous No.22458724]

>>22458673
No, I have read every single thing Plato wrote along with his spuria as attributed by Thrasyllus. What I said is that you don’t have to dogmatically read the middle era dialogues as the end all, be all of his philosophy and that Plato’s dialogues are meant to get you to think not to dogmatically cite him as scripture. I brought up the Hackett intro only for his comparison of Neoplatonists with zealous Christians (he doesn’t say evangelicals but you can infer that is the comparison being made). I don’t even see what was so controversial with whatever I said as it was word for word form Hackett.

[Anonymous No.22458733]

>>22458673
That is actually my honest opinions on the matter. Whatever you are thinking of I don’t remember but I admit I do try to be overly antagonistic a lot of the time so that may be part of it.

[Anonymous No.22458752]

>>22458673
Oh and I know you didn’t ask but I also tried to start the “Maxims -La Rouchefoucauld translated Plato” meme on here because the Rossellini film featured translations by a writer named Jean Dominique de la Rouchefoucauld.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Dominique_de_La_Rochefoucauld

The meme didn’t really take off but I found it amusing enough. If you have fun it wasn’t for nothing.

[Anonymous No.22458754]

>>22458003
This

[Anonymous No.22458855]

>>22457951
Thanks for using a wojack so I know you're retarded

[Anonymous No.22458858]

>>22458292
They took their eugenics program from commiefornia...

National SOCIALISTS any one??? Hello???

[Anonymous No.22458862]

>>22458754
Just read GR and get on with it

[Anonymous No.22460216]

>>22457951
Thanks for using a basedjak so I know you're intelligent

[Anonymous No.22460305]

>>22457865
You forgot
>Hitler 3: Even Hitlerer
>The Last Days of Hitler
>The final solution of Hitler
>Hitler's mad affair with Germans
>Hitler had a small pp (with even shorter introduction!)

[Anonymous No.22460329]

>>22458003
This actually makes lots of sense. Thanks for that shower thought.

[Anonymous No.22460342]

>>22458565
The party was called: "NSDAP" meaning "Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei" which just translates to "German Nationalsocialist Workers-Party". Nothing with democratic in the name lol.

[Anonymous No.22460375]

>>22458565
>NDSP
you must be american, right?

[Anonymous No.22460432]

>>22460305
>Hitler 4: the gaza line
>Hitler untold
>Hitler Megami Tensei: Nocturne
>Putler: the new Hitler

[Anonymous No.22460448]

>"Today we're going to study the neo-Assyrians, they had a brutal regime that did a lot of unpleasant things but they also had a vibrant culture and of course a functioning state and economy, with many cultures and societies under their aegis that went on pretty much as normal. The reasons they did what they did are historically contingent and we can study and discuss these, and it's not abnormal if you admire many of their achievements and culture, or if you understand how it was possible that a monarch here or there was particularly brutal in prosecuting foreign politics. History is very complicated."

>"Today we're going to study the Macedonians, they had a brutal regime that did a lot of unpleasant things but they also had a vibrant culture and of course a functioning state and economy, with many cultures and societies under their aegis that went on pretty much as normal. The reasons they did what they did are historically contingent and we can study and discuss these, and it's not abnormal if you admire many of their achievements and culture, or if you understand how it was possible that a monarch here or there was particularly brutal in prosecuting foreign politics. History is very complicated."

>"Today we're going to study the Romans, they had a brutal regime that did a lot of unpleasant things but they also had a vibrant culture and of course a functioning state and economy, with many cultures and societies under their aegis that went on pretty much as normal. The reasons they did what they did are historically contingent and we can study and discuss these, and it's not abnormal if you admire many of their achievements and culture, or if you understand how it was possible that a monarch here or there was particularly brutal in prosecuting foreign politics. History is very complicated."

>"Today we're going to study the Golden Age caliphates and sultanates, they had brutal regimes that did a lot of unpleasant things but they also had a vibrant culture and of course a functioning state and economy, with many cultures and societies under their aegis that went on pretty much as normal. The reasons they did what they did are historically contingent and we can study and discuss these, and it's not abnormal if you admire many of their achievements and culture, or if you understand how it was possible that a monarch here or there was particularly brutal in prosecuting foreign politics. History is very complicated."

>"Today we're going to study the Italian Fascist and NSDAP regimes of the 20th century,

[Anonymous No.22460495]

>>22460448
>>"Today we're going to study the Italian Fascist and NSDAP regimes of the 20th century, they were evil disgusting pigs unfortunelly the germans still breath to this day.
>Now lets move to the japanese empire, they had a brutal regime that did a lot of unpleasant things but they also had a vibrant culture and of course a functioning state and economy, with many cultures and societies under their aegis that went on pretty much as normal. The reasons they did what they did are historically contingent and we can study and discuss these, and it's not abnormal if you admire many of their achievements and culture, or if you understand how it was possible that a monarch here or there was particularly brutal in prosecuting foreign politics. History is very complicated."

[Anonymous No.22460504]

>>22460495
keked and checked

[Anonymous No.22460519]

>>22457903
I don’t think op said this cuz he likes hitler. He’s just annoyed there isn’t anything else.
>>22457865
Where do you live OP? I live in the United States of freedom. I see history on everything.

[Anonymous No.22460629]

>>22458548
Top 3 most evil men? Lenin, Yeshua, Cromwell

[Anonymous No.22460690]

>>22457865
its the founding myth of neoliberalism why would you expect anything else

[Anonymous No.22460696]

>>22458003
>There is a copypasta I’ve seen that conveys this idea rather succinctly but I can’t seem to find it.
was it a beaverpost?

[Anonymous No.22460703]

>>22457865
Unironically, I would pay £10.99 to read Hitler and the Seven Jews. Future NYT bestseller.

[Anonymous No.22460704]

>>22458565
>National Democratic Socialist Party

[Anonymous No.22460709]

>>22458606
>Do you legitimately believe there is a parallel world which is the form of a chair?
Nobody believes this, not even Plato. This is the product of a pervasive halfwit reading of The Republic. The forms exist in this world.

[Anonymous No.22460726]

>>22460709
This world contains copies of the forms from which you CAN glimpse the forms themselves albeit fleetingly. You are technically right but half wrong too. The forms as pure essence do not exist in this world.

[Anonymous No.22460730]

>>22460704
It is an accurate meme.

[Anonymous No.22460732]

>>22457951
Nice reddit meme image

[Anonymous No.22461776]

>>22458565
You continue to misuse left and right despite being corrected. I'm guessing you haven't read Hitler Democrat by Degrelle. National Socialism was the purest expression of a nation's democratic will in modern times. Democracy has nothing to do with voting, and everything to do with the general will as Rousseau conceived of it in On the Social Contract. Doubt you've read Rousseau either.

[Anonymous No.22461960]

>>22457903
reddit rage

[Anonymous No.22462040]

>>22461776
Actually I have read Rousseau, he is my favorite social contract thinker. My suspicion is that you aren't actually aware of what political left and right are on a global sense and are limited by whatever country you live in. Whenever you figure it out amongst your neo nazi larping and Aryan fairy buddies come back and let me know all about it.

[Anonymous No.22462205]

>>22458003
This copypasta?

What is a foundation myth?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_myth

It fulfills three functions.

1) It explains the origin and structure of the world (and society).

2) It defines ultimate good and evil (and from those definitions are derived the values that are used to justify the holding of power).

3) It determines what is held sacred in that society.

For modern Westerners the story of WWII has become their foundation myth. It fulfils all three functions.

1) We live in the ‘Post-War World’. The lines on the map, the institutions, the sense of what era we live in, all arise from the starting point of WWII.

2) "Ultimate evil" is Nazis. "Ultimate good" is opposing Nazis. The values derived from these definitions are anti-racism, equality, diversity, anti-nationalism and so on.

3) The only thing that is held sacred, that cannot be denied or mocked in the contemporary West, is the Holocaust.

The problem is that all three functions are backwards or negative.

Instead of the origin event being one of fertility and new life, it was a conflagration of death and destruction.

Instead of ultimate good taking the central position in the story that slot is occupied by ultimate evil. Everyone knows that Adolf Hitler, the "personification of evil", holds the center point of the WWII story.

Instead of that which is held sacred being something mysterious and sublime it (the Holocaust) is an obscenity.

*Having a negative foundation myth means the tree of life for Westerners is poisoned*

[Anonymous No.22462901]

>>22460519
agree with both. i don’t think OP is Nazi he’s clearly annoyed.
I like in the UK and mostly it’s egyptian, african + medieval (ALOT honestly) stuff here

[Anonymous No.22462972]

>>22457865
>why are they so obsessed?
Because the jews scratch their open wound and want everyone to see it. They don't allow it to heal and move on, but want to be a perpetual victim (much like the muh reparations crowd). Notice how you don't see the books that talk about the genocide of Russian Christians, in communist Russia, perpetuated by jewish atheists.

[Anonymous No.22463007]

>>22458003
It's not just myth. After WWII both political liberals and political conservatives embraced market liberalism and republicanism as sacrosanct pillars on which all future ideologies would be built. Even Western Marxists pivoted away from a wholehearted embrace of Soviet style communism as Stalin's crimes became known and even within the USSR there was deStalinization and the switch to a more oligarchic system that was less ideological.

Modern liberal democracy wasn't born in the French Revolution. The end of noble privileges, creation on constitutions, and elected governance all called up new questions. Chief among these initially was the "social question," that is, if most of the people are poor, illiterate peasants, how can they be sovereign when there is such a huge gap between the rich and the poor.

The social question bred socialism. Democracy didn't conquer socialism, it sublated it, taking on parts of its platform. All liberal democracies today have socialist policies, no child labor, universal education, state pensions, some form of welfare, etc.

Nationalism started as a radical movement against the right of kings to rule multiethnic empires. This was sublated too. By the post-War era, democracy was not international. Even liberals didn't think France holding Algeria would be ok if Algerians just had the right to vote. Even the left proclaims "an Algerian state for Algerians," and "Iraqi government for Iraqis."

WWI marked the death knell of monarchy. WWII marked the death of nationalism based movements that operated outside the principles of liberal democracy. Socialism limped on as an independent force but was subsumed into social democracy except where force kept such a sublation in check. Eventually the USSR collapsed and China liberalized.

There is no counter force to liberal democracy on the lines of communism, reactionary monarchism, or fascism today. WWII marks the birth of American hegemony but more over a unipolar political world where even critics of liberal democracy still tacitly accept its goals. Even most strongmen today go by "president" not "king," and go through the effort of sham parliaments and elections. Even Iran feels forced to follow this mold.

Liberalism today faces its own contradictions. Mass migration undermines nationalism and nationalism was in turn the shared identity that provided support for socialism. Military technology is changing in a way not seen since the stirrup. Automated systems, drones, UGVs, autonomous artillery, etc. make it so that once again a small cadre of professionals can rout massively larger "peasant" forces with small arms. If history repeats, this will shift power from the masses to elites. Likewise, the labor of the masses is less and less economically relevant. The dialectical churns on in fractal self-similarity.

[Anonymous No.22463213]

>>22458358
Most of society still opposes that.