/clg/ - Classical Languages General

[Anonymous No.21445767]

Αncient sȯyjaks edition

>τὸ πρότερον νῆμα·
>>21409393

>Μέγα τὸ Ἑλληνιστί/Ῥωμαϊστί·
https://mega dot nz/folder/FHdXFZ4A#mWgaKv4SeG-2Rx7iMZ6EKw

>Mέγα τὸ ANE
https://mega dot nz/folder/YfsmFRxA#pz58Q6aTDkwn9Ot6G68NRg

Best way to learn is to pick a textbook and start reading it. Don't ask, just read
Ignore shitposters, do not feed the trolls

[Anonymous No.21445892]

>>21445767
I have seen multiple sentences in Plato's Meno like this:
>καὶ αὖ εἰ περὶ χρώματος ὡσαύτως ἀνήρετο ὅτι ἐστίν...
I understand it means something like "and again if he had similarly asked about what color is", but I'm just curious what you call the sort of construction with περὶ χρώματος...ὅτι ἐστίν. is it just apposition (lit. "about color... what it is") or something else?

[Anonymous No.21445930]

>>21445767
>Best way to learn is to pick a textbook and start reading it. Don't ask, just read

[Anonymous No.21446097]

>>21445892
not sure it's a specific construction per se but rather just how the verb ἐρωτάω works, i.e double accusative (whom) (what); in this case, I think maybe the more literal translation ought to consider ὅ τι ἐστίν as a quote i.e "asked you about color: 'what it is', then...."

[Anonymous No.21446109]

>>21445892
not sure it's a specific construction per se but rather just how the verb ἐρωτάω works, i.e double accusative (whom) (what); in this case, I think maybe the more literal translation ought to consider ὅ τι ἐστίν as a quote i.e "asked you about color: 'what is it?', then...."

[Anonymous No.21446169]

>>21446109
I might be getting too much into the weeds here, and you might be right that it's not a formal construction per se, but wouldn't περὶ χρώματος just be considered a prepositional phrase within the fuller verbal phrase (of which the main verb is ανήρετο)?
that aside, while I get what you're saying about the double accusative, both phrases (περὶ χρώοματος and ὅτι ἐστίν) refer to the "what", neither to the person being asked. sorry if that doesn't make sense, but I hope you get what I mean

[Anonymous No.21446246]

>>21446169
>wouldn't περὶ χρώματος just be considered a prepositional phrase within the fuller verbal phrase (of which the main verb is ανήρετο)?
yes, essentially so
i.e σε here as the first accusative so to speak is omitted
my interpretation about being actually a quote, which often is omitted in the original text and must be inferred by context would perhaps make more sense, so περὶ χρώματος specifies the argument so to speak, and the object being a direct quote, so something that in english would go like
"suppose he asked you, about colors: 'what are they?', ....."

[Anonymous No.21446250]

Latin Question:
How would I refer to 'it' or 'this' in phrases like "It's terrible" or "this is sad!" where the subject isn't/can't be gendered
In the latter case is it "(Hoc) Triste est!" or "(Hic) Tristis est!"

[Anonymous No.21446278]

>>21446250
the neuter generally fulfills the role of generic thing, situation, etc... as expected in the idiomatic expression
using hic tristis would imply a guy or male-thing is sad

[Anonymous No.21446285]

>>21446250
Doesn't Latin usually use equivalents of "How sad" like quam tristis

When I think of Latin writers saying something like "Truly, this is sad" I think of them saying something more like "Truly, a sad situation" or "turn of events"

[Anonymous No.21446301]

>>21446246
>my interpretation about being actually a quote, which often is omitted in the original text and must be inferred by context would perhaps make more sense
I think I get what you're saying, but my only reservation for interpretating it as a quote *syntactically* is that I haven't seen any grammar describe ὅτι being used as such (which, of course, doesn't mean that it never was in ancient Greek) and that Plato, at least elsewhere, follows standard ways of making quotes (e.g. using τό with a noun phrase). again, I may be wrong, but it seems to me that syntactically the ὅτι by itself is a relative clause with an omitted antecedent. the concept of apposition came to mind because, under the idea that it's a relative clause, it could be swapped and still make sense in the fuller sentence (εἰ ἐκεῖνος σε ἀνήρετο τοῦτο ὅτι χρῶμα ἐστίν... / if that man had asked you that which color is) and as far as I know the antecedent is normally omitted when it's a pronoun like τοῦτο

[Anonymous No.21446335]

>>21446250
>dcc (dot) dickinson (dot) edu/grammar/latin/idiomatic-accusatives
go to part d, accusative of exclamation

[Anonymous No.21446401]

The word 'sublātus' really confuses me. Wiktionary says it means both lifted up, which is weird with the -sub prefix, and basically the same as 'ablātus' at the same time.
Is that not weird to you, anons?

[Anonymous No.21446414]

>>21446401
the prefix sub- is often better translated as "(up) from under"

[Anonymous No.21446421]

>>21446401
>which is weird with the sub- prefix
I get what you're saying, but one of the meanings of 'sub' is something like "up from under", though not as commonly used
>and basically the same as 'ablatus' at the same time
I don't know what your native language(s) is (are), and maybe there's no morphological equivalent, but my guess is that the meaning came from the idea that if you carry or move something under/down from somewhere, you remove it from that place. depending on your linguistic background it can seem weird. from an English perspective I think it sounds weird (but Romans would have said the same about English)

[Anonymous No.21446441]

>>21446278
>>21446285
>>21446335
thanks anons

[Anonymous No.21446457]

>>21446301
mmh, I'm also a bit unsure about the direct quote option
just to be 100% sure, you are interpreting ὅτι as ὅ (space) τι as well correct? because some versions are more explicit I guess to avoid confusion with the common conjunction ὅτι and write them with a clear space
I think maybe it's something inbetween, maybe an indirect question, which as I learned back then after all unlike with Latin which turns them in the subjunctive, Greek reports in the indicative

[Anonymous No.21446502]

>>21446457
>just to be 100% sure, you are interpreting ὅτι as ὅ (space) τι as well correct? because some versions are more explicit I guess to avoid confusion with the common conjunction ὅτι and write them with a clear space
if I understand what you're asking, yes, I am interpreting it differently than the conjunction ὅτι. I have seen it written both with a space and without, so I wasn't sure how I should write it here.
>maybe an indirect question
yeah that's actually makes more sense, moreso than just being a relative clause, especially given the explicit question word ἀνήρετο. but about περὶ χρώματος in conjunction with ὅ τι ἐστίν, would you describe it as any formal syntactic construction? maybe we could just say it's parenthetical, the ὅ τι specifies the question about color (i.e. it's about its essence).

[Anonymous No.21446685]

Fellow Classical Chinese students, what would you say is your favorite poem?

[Anonymous No.21446976]

Good quality Latin dictionary that isn't ten volumes and $500? Etymology would be nice too

[Anonymous No.21447010]

>>21446976
Cassell's.

[Anonymous No.21447341]

>>21446976
Just go out and buy one from Barne’s and Noble or something. It’s not that bad in cost for them.

[Anonymous No.21447349]

>>21445930
Yeah, the OP is pretty shit. Some opinionated anon who wants to be helpful could seize the opportunity to write a better one.

[Anonymous No.21447372]

any advice on how best to learn and retain the structure of metered poetry? I studied some Ovid, Virgil, Horace, and Catullus a couple years ago in a college class, but haven't read any of it since. I have a couple poetry classes next semester (Homer and Ovid) and want to best prep before the semester starts. appreciate any help

[Anonymous No.21447418]

>>21447372
>any advice on how best to learn and retain the structure of metered poetry?
Write out by hand.
Annotate.
Color code with pens, markers, etc.
Watch online lectures.
Buy Latin poetry textbooks.

[Anonymous No.21447459]

>>21447372
I think reading poetry out loud helps. I have excellent pronunciation, despite being an American, so maybe, your mileage will vary if you say things like pedicab-o (pronounced like the bike taxi) eeego vos (rhyme with gloss) et eyerumaybo.

[Anonymous No.21447474]

>>21447459
At that point it would be better to just use traditional English pronunciation.

[Anonymous No.21447817]

what does quidem really mean? sometimes I can read it as "certainly", "indeed" or "for my part" but often it just looks like a meaningless filler word.

[Anonymous No.21447892]

UUUUUUUUUD REEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[Anonymous No.21447927]

>>21446414
>>21446421
The word actually makes much more sense now.
Thanks.

[Anonymous No.21447928]

>>21445892
this is a case of attractio relativi where the object in the main clause is omitted. It is shortened from something like περὶ τοῦ χρώματος ἀνήρετο τοῦτο ὅτι ἐστίν.

[Anonymous No.21447956]

>>21446301
>>21447928
so basically what this guy said. there are more interesting cases of this where the case doesn't agree with the verb in the subordinate clause, e. f.
>ὁ Σωκράτης ἐπιμελεῖτο ὧν ἂν πράττῃ
>Sokrates cares about whatever he does
here the ων acts as the object of both επιμελεισθαι and πράττειν, but it takes the genetive it needs to be the object of the first one and doesn't agree with the second one, of which it is the actual object. If you would unravel it it would be
>...ἐπιμελεῖτο τούτων ἃ ἂν πράττῃ

[Anonymous No.21447966]

>>21445892
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0007%3Apart%3D4%3Achapter%3D51%3Asection%3D126
Anticipation.

[Anonymous No.21448338]

>>21447817
quĭdem avv.
1. per enfatizzare un termine o una frase, certo, certamente, naturalmente: unum quidem certo promitto tibi c’è una cosa che posso garantirti con certezza, Pl. St.480; flagitium quidem hercle fiet, nisi dos dabitur virgini certo, succederà un macello se non si darà una dote alla fanciulla, Trin.612; Prop. 3.13.3; Cic. senpai.14.4.2 ◆ nel dialogo: “meus numquam fiet.” “Si sapies quidem” “non sarà mai mio.” “Se sarai furbo, certo che sarà tuo”, Pl. Trin.559 ◆ dopo pron. pers.: vos quidem iam scitis voi certo sapete, Pl. Amph.11 ◆ dopo pron. o agg. dimostr.: pro di immortales, eri concubinast haec quidem! per gli dèi immortali, ma quella è proprio la cortigiana del padrone!, Pl. Mil.362; Cic. Att.4.15.7.

2. con valore restrittivo, almeno: Pl. Men.22; nostrae fere causae, quae quidem sunt criminum in generale le nostre cause, almeno quelle penali, Cic. de orat.2.105 ◆ nisi quidem a meno che naturalmente: Pl. Men.993 ◆ dum quidem almeno fino a che: Pl. Pseud.507 ◆ quoniam quidem dal momento che evidentemente: Cic. Att.2.1.3.

3. nel rafforzare, e per di più: Ter. Hec.624; eos quae voluissent impetrasse nullo quidem negotio che loro avevano ottenuto quello che volevano e per di più senza alcuna difficoltà, Cic. Att.11.20.1 ◆ ‹con et is e sim.›: una in domo, et ea quidem angusta in una sola casa e, per di più, piccola, Cic. fin.1.65; 1.1; vivere, et eam quidem vitam quae... vivere, e per di più una vita che..., sen.77 ◆ in domande sarcastiche, et quidem? e proprio?, davvero?: Pl. Bacch.222; Ter. Haut.606 ◆ in risposte: Pl. Bacch.220.

4. in frasi che esprimono una restrizione o correzione, ma, sì però: “at publice commodasti.” Non sine magno quidem Siciliae detrimento “eppure hai reso dei servizi alla loro città.” Sì, ma non senza gravi danni per la Sicilia, Cic. Verr.4.20; Pharnabazus habitus est imperator, re quidem vera exercitui praefuit Conon comandante fu nominato Farnabazo, ma in realtà l’esercito lo comandò Conone, Nep. Con.2.2.

5. per un’affermazione subito seguita da correzione o attenuazione, sì, certo: raras tuas quidem, sed suavis accipio litteras rare indubbiamente, ma affettuose sono le lettere che ricevo da te, Cic. senpai.2.13.1; L. Domitius nulla quidem arte, sed Latine tamen dicebat è vero, L. Domizio parlava senz’arte alcuna, ma tuttavia in un buon latino, Brut.267; quasi principem non quidem odissent, sed tamen existimarentur col pretesto che, se anche non odiavano Nerone, avevano però fama di odiarlo, Tac. ann.15.71.2 ◆ quidem... vero da una parte... dall’altra: Cassiod. hist.1.15.

6. in frasi negative, neppure: “numquid recusas contra me?” “Hau verbum quidem” “hai per caso da protestare contro di me?” “Non una sola parola”, Pl. Poen.1355 ◆ ne... quidem neppure: vedi ne3.

[Anonymous No.21448931]

>I can read fluently I'm so smart!
Someone made a post like that in the last thread and it was rather cringe considering 5 year old Enoch Powel was able to read Ancient Greek and even discounting him in the past 14 year old boys would be undergraduates from University being able to read Greek and Latin fluently and able to write in styles of different authors.

[Anonymous No.21448949]

>>21448931
I doubt powell could read fluently any text without a laxicon that early, more like he had quickly learned enough grammar and foundations to approach any text WITH a lexicon, which you can only absorb through reading a lot, and that takes time.
But in fact I don't find it as impressive considering children brains are especially good at learning languages for obvious reasons, it's far more impressive if e.g a 60 years old learns ancient Greek from scratch to a reasonable fluency.

[Anonymous No.21449184]

>>21448931
you can't, though

[Anonymous No.21449493]

Shouldn't the 'eius' be an 'eōrum' in this context: "Quīntus est frātēr Mārcī. Iūlia soror eius est." I thought 'eius' was a genetīvus singulāris. Ahh wait, my bad. I suppose the 'eius' only refers to Quīntus and not also to Mārcus.

By the by, why is it that in the Exercitia Latina you have this:
>Corporis et maris genetīvus singulāris est.
Isn't "Corporis et maris" a plural noun phrase? And isn't it meaning to say that "Corporis et maris" belongs to the class of genitive singulars and not that a genitive singular is "Corporis et maris"? (Since this is, according to what I know, the only way for this sentence to be grammatically correct).

[Anonymous No.21449495]

>>21448949
Well he could do that so you're just wrong
>>21449184
Source

[Anonymous No.21449599]

>>21449495
>Source
your mental retardation probably

[Anonymous No.21449601]

>>21449493
>isn't "corporis et maris" a plural noun phrase?
that is a tricky question. I would be curious to see what other anons say, as I can't think of any grammar of the top of my head that spoke on the subject, but my interpretation would be that there is heavy elipsis. e.g. 'corporis' genetivus signularis est, et 'maris' genetivus singularis est. so syntactically these words are *not* being treated as a single noun phrase, though you could. I have seen this sort of thing before with authentic Latin, but I don't know the potential limitations on this writing style.

[Anonymous No.21449627]

>>21449493
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/corpus#Latin
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/mare#Latin

[Anonymous No.21449667]

>>21449601
>>21449493
from "Essential Latin Grammar: Bennett's Grammar Revised"
>With Two or More Subjects
>1. *Agreement in Number.* With two or more subjects the verb is regularly plural; as, - pater et filius mortui sunt (the father and son died)
>2. But sometimes the verb agrees with the nearest subject, namely: - a) When the verb precedes both subjects or stands between them; as, - mortuus est pater et filius, pater mortuus est et filius; b) When the subjects are connected by aut; aut ... aut; vel ... vel; neque ... neque; as, - neque pater neque filius mortuus est (neither father nor son died)
>3. When the different subjects are felt together as constituting a whole, the singular is used; as, - temeritas ignoratioque vitiosa est (rashness and ignorance are bad)
so, assuming this grammar exhausted the reasons for verb agreement in terms of number, 3 seems to be the right explanation

[Anonymous No.21449733]

>>21449627
Pardon? I don't understand. I know the declensions, but I don't understand how the sentence makes any sense.>>21449601 is where I am leaning towards. I do believe he is correct though I don't know why Orberg would do this without mentioning it.

[Anonymous No.21449741]

>>21449667 Welp, yea I suppose that makes alot of sense. Thanks

[Anonymous No.21450957]

bumpus

[Anonymous No.21451046]

>>21447966
>>21447956
>>21447956
appreciate the help anons

[Anonymous No.21451073]

>>21445767
Perseus is utter shit. Clicking on words is nearly useless for definitions. Achilles doesn't even bring up the name it just says "grief".

[Anonymous No.21451084]

>>21451073
But what the hell kind of person is studying the Iliad in the original Greek and doesn't already know who Achilles is?

[Anonymous No.21451101]

>>21445930
>The best way to improve something is to criticise. Don't offer alternatives, just criticise.

[Anonymous No.21451110]

>>21451084
click on one of the lexicon buttons next to "Show lexicon entry"

[Anonymous No.21451209]

>>21451110
edepol I meant to quote >>21451073

[Anonymous No.21451511]

>>21451073
I explained this to you last thread. Click the LSJ hyperlink.

[Anonymous No.21451783]

I still don't understand what the aorist is used for in Greek.

[Anonymous No.21451933]

>>21451783
what resource(s) have you read/watched about it?

[Anonymous No.21452242]

I don't get it. What the fuck is an infinitive?
For a second I thought I got it was an action that isn't a verb but then a gerund is a "verbal noun" (whatever the fuck that means). Can someone help?

[Anonymous No.21452296]

>>21452242
Verbal noun: Swimming is good for you. An apple is good for you. Swimming is a verb (present-continuous)—as in "I am swimming", "He is swimming." But this isn't how swimming is used in "Swimming is good for you." It's more akin to a noun. Anyways, an infinitive is of the form "to {verb goes here}". For example, "to run", "to walk", "to talk", "to eat". In english, the infinitve is not binded to a particular tense or subject. "He was to eat." "He is to eat." "He will eat." (This is the bare infinitve—i.e. an infinitive without the "to" kek). Not bound to subject means one may contruct the above examples with "You", "Him", "They", or "I" instead.

[Anonymous No.21452348]

>>21452242
it's a non-finite verb form, meaning it doesn't syntactically signify person number or tense. their specific syntax depends on the language, but in both Greek and Latin they can be used to express actions or states (errare humanum est), with auxiliary verbs (βούλομαι μανθάνειν), in indirect speech (ait nos formosas esse) or other subordinate clauses. there are more uses, more than I know I'm sure, but it depends on the language

[Anonymous No.21452749]

>>21451783
The best way to explain it is to say it's like the preterite in spanish, a snapshot of time as opposed to a continuum like the imperfect. Eventually you'll get a feeling for it.

[Anonymous No.21453176]

>>21451783
>>21452242
read more greek until you get it

[Anonymous No.21453191]

[Anonymous No.21453225]

>>21453191
stale meme

[Anonymous No.21453251]

>>21453191
>Stasia femina populares est
popularis
>Sacculos magnos ea delectat!
sacculi magni, eam
otherwise this is a really cool idea. I have an idea of making a reader passed off as a serious attempt to elucidate and ameliorate studying an authentic ancient text that doesn't have a common reader, but make it as bad as possible (shitty formatting, spelling mistakes, unhelpful notes, wrong glosses of words, etc.). I just think it'd be funny to see a bunch of people write angry reviews about it

[Anonymous No.21453343]

>>21451783
It means an action that took place at one point and is complete
The perfect means the same but references present time so is naturally used less

[Anonymous No.21453354]

>>21453251
>>21453191
to add
>Chadamum videtis
vident
>Visne hic gladius
hunc gladium
>et gladius tuus non longum extendit
>Longissimum extendit!
why in the accusative? not saying you're necessarily wrong, as i don't claim to know everything about Latin, just curious. I know the accusative of extent/space is a thing, but ime that's normally used with specific measurements. ime the adverbial form of adjectives are more commonly used (e.g. longē)
>>21453343
Ive read thought that in non-indicative cases it normally only indicates aspect. i.e., it refers to an action that takes a relatively short amount of time

[Anonymous No.21453426]

>>21453354
No. Aorist means according to Oxford "a single event happened in the past" for indicative
For imperative, subjunctive, opative and infinitive it can reference future time and present.

[Anonymous No.21453452]

>>21452749
I was talking to my little sister about that a month ago. I thought she was saying predicate, but I got it eventually. I am so happy that I now have an intuitive understanding of Greek grammar. To everyone else out there. I'm a little over 2 years in, and I recognized that it had become intuitive 6 months ago or maybe more. The one thing that trips me up is conditionals, but that's mostly because of how other people explain them.

[Anonymous No.21453482]

>>21453452
if you want to get good at conditionals, read some philosophy. I've been going through Plato's meno and there have been a ton of different conditionals (I even saw a mixed conditional today). the work isn't even that long and it has apparently 70+ conditionals (I have a reader that has said as much). I'm only a quarter into it but it's been very beneficial I think - very much a step up from the stuff I've read in my Greek class and in my spare time beforehand

[Anonymous No.21453547]

>>21453482
Cool. Thanks. What reader are you using?

[Anonymous No.21453559]

>>21451101
>>The best way to improve something is to criticise. Don't offer alternatives, just criticise.

[Anonymous No.21453574]

>>21453559
Why are you shitting up this general?

[Anonymous No.21453582]

>>21453547
it's from Geoffrey Steadman. it's just called "Plato's Meno". if you do have plans to getting it, or at least want to get a glimpse, he has free pdfs of (at least some, I haven't checked all of) his readers. he's done a few of plato's dialogues, but a bunch of other stuff too (xenophon, homer, herodotes). I have seen a couple of typos in my physical version though, just something to keep in mind

[Anonymous No.21453667]

>>21445767
everyone knows neolatin literature, but is there also modern authors attempting to write Ancient Greek prose and poetry?

[Anonymous No.21453764]

>>21453667
I believe some Czech guy wrote a science fiction epic in the style of Homer. (Or I think he was Czech.)

[Anonymous No.21453798]

>>21453574
He has some fancy new pepejaks.
>t. saved all of them

[Anonymous No.21453818]

delectamur libris legendi

can someone translate and explain this to me?

[Anonymous No.21453930]

>>21453818
are you sure is 100% correct? I think it should be
>delectamur libris legendis
anyway
>we are pleased/have fun by/with reading books
>delectamur
mediopassive
>libris legendis
gerundive plural ablative, you use this instead of the gerund when it has a direct object (*libros legendo)

[Anonymous No.21453935]

Do latinz ever use a noun as a verb?

[Anonymous No.21453940]

>>21453818
I agree with
>>21453930
but you can still make it work by reading it as
> [nos,] legendi[,] delectamur libris
so
> we, reading, are pleased by books

[Anonymous No.21453963]

>>21453940
I think in that case it should be
>nos, legendo, ...

[Anonymous No.21453976]

>>21453963
In this case, it can be either, no? "legendo" is a gerund, "legendi" a participle.

[Anonymous No.21453997]

>>21453976
>"legendi" a participle.
I'm not sure. Do you mean "legentes"? Legendi would be a future passive participle (id est, a gerundive), no?

[Anonymous No.21454014]

>>21453997
> I'm not sure. Do you mean "legentes"?
Yes, sorry, you're completely right.

[Anonymous No.21454187]

Πρόσταγμα

[Anonymous No.21454388]

Do you even read any obscure shit from early modern period? That's what would I use Latin for.

[Anonymous No.21454455]

>>21454388
Anything cool you found that people here might not already know?

[Anonymous No.21454515]

>>21454455
I don't know, maybe someone like Francesco Patrizi? Especially De spacio physico et mathematico.
Sorry I don't remember much else now.
I

[Anonymous No.21454521]

Can anyone tell me whether it’s normal to use the accusative for a noun in Latin when the verb acting on it is abstract? For instance, “Pecuniam volo” or “Linguam Graecum Scio.” In my reading these types of first person statements don’t seem to show up that much, so I’m not certain.

[Anonymous No.21454631]

>>21454515(me)
Maybe we can find free stuff of Maurolycus too.

[Anonymous No.21454776]

>>21454521
I don't get your doubt, nouns and adjectives go in the accusative whenever they are the direct object of a transitive verb

[Anonymous No.21454786]

>>21453935
This is a serious question.

[Anonymous No.21454805]

>>21453935
there are standard ways to form verbs from nouns like in most languages
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:Latin_verb-forming_suffixes

[Anonymous No.21454844]

>>21454521
>when the verb acting on it is abstract
>abstract
not to be rude, but that might be too broad a class. I'm sure other anons will chime in, but I haven't seen any grammar talk about normal syntax of abstract verbs in general (though abstract nouns is a different story). you also want to think about manners of speaking e.g.:
>linguam Graecam scio
ime, scio is normally used with indirect speech e.g.:
>non edepol nunc ubi terrarum sim scio "by Pollux, I don't know WHERE on earth I am now" (Plautus, Amphitruo)
> is me, quia scit tuum familiarem esse, crebro ad cenam invitat "He, because he knows THAT I am your friend/acquaintance, repeatedly invites me to dinner" (Cicero, Epistulae ad Familiares 7.9.1.1)
but you do see 'scire' being used in this way
>num Latine scit? "He doesn't know Latin, does he?" (Cicero, Philippicae 5.1.1)
but, as with natural languages in general, there are bound to be exceptions you can find in authentic texts. anyways, my point is it may be more fruitful to just look at trends of specific words, as some words work particularly, or at least reduce your scope from abstract to something finer

[Anonymous No.21455714]

νὴ τὸν Ἡρακλέα διανεγνώκω τὸ ἔσχατον βιβλίον τὸ τοῦ Ξενοφῶντος Ἀναβάσεως πρὸ τέλους τοῦ ἐνιαυτοῦ

[Anonymous No.21455954]

>>21453191
nice. oc?

[Anonymous No.21456011]

>>21453667
Not exactly modern but Milton wrote some poems in Greek.

[Anonymous No.21456149]

>>21455714
something about presocratics

[Anonymous No.21456310]

Hello, everyone. It's Ethiopianon. I just graduated with my BA. I will not be going to graduate school next year, and I am not looking for a straight job. I am committing myself to writing, translating, and archiving.
My goal has been to make my work available for free and accept donations from those willing and able to pay. My current quandary, one that has occupied me for years, is how to promote my work. Other than this thread, I'm on virtually zero social media sites, and I have no desire to turn myself into another F. Gardner. Other than posting a link to a new article in a tweet, do you have any suggestions for promoting my work?
I'm not the best in the world at any of the languages I know, not yet anyway, but I'm much more open to alternative thinking and alternative media than the typical scholar. You know the type, the ones who rehash the same topics no one is interested in, like Seneca and gender studies, desperately trying to get published by stale, shitty academic publishers.
The typical Classics grad student has to choose between Latin and Greek for their main focus, and after that, they have to choose an author / genre. I'm in an entirely different position. There are so many attractive options, but I can't pursue all of them right now, at least not all the way up to 11. Do you have any suggestions on what language(s) I should focus on for right now? The options are Latin, Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic, and Ge'ez, and I do anticipate on growing that list, but it will be a while before I do.
t. Ethiopianon

[Anonymous No.21456428]

>>21456310
>any suggestions on what language(s) I should focus on for right now?
if you plan on learning all the ones mentioned, it shouldn't ultimately matter which. just choose which one seems the most exciting and stick with it. but for the sake of ease, maybe look into which language has the most cognate words and roots across all of those languages and choose that first. also, ime, the further you are in a language, the easier it is to pick it back up after not studying it for some time. so, while I know you're eager to get at all of them, it would probably not be best to just get an introductory knowledge of grammar and some odd hundred words then jump to the next (but that's ultimately your choice).

I don't know the specifics of your long-term plan (to the extent you have one), but I would say there's not necessarily anything wrong with being more specialized. it depends on your specific goals, but if you plan on reaching a very high level at all of those languages and understand various texts in all of them, you will be spreading your time very thin. I am not a major polyglot by any means, but I've heard it can be a real bitch trying to maintain your current level in multiple langauges, especially the more you incorporate and how different they are from your native language(s).

[Anonymous No.21456444]

>>21456149
ne timeas conranicule, illic ait 'mehercle omnino perlegam ultimum Xenophontis "Anabasis" librum ante anni exitum'

[Anonymous No.21456478]

>>21456444
festina igitur!

[Anonymous No.21456606]

>>21456444
ego tantum perficitur capitulum decem llpsi, sed una die scio quid dicis

[Anonymous No.21456620]

>>21456606
>scio
sciam

[Anonymous No.21456661]

>ἔστιν γὰρ χρόα ἀπορροὴ σχημάτων ὄψει σύμμετρος καὶ αἰσθητός
"for color is a stream of shapes proportionate to sight and perceptible" - is that right? also, if my interpretation is right, why are the predicate adjectives masculine?

[Anonymous No.21456724]

>>21456661
sounds about right, σύμμετρος makes sense ending in -ος as composite adjectives typically are two-end adjectives with feminine equal to masculine, but indeed αἰσθητός as verbal adjective should regularly be a three ending adjective
LSJ does report it as being both ways, i.e -ος, -ον and -ος, -η, -ον, possibly because of this passage in Plato itself

[Anonymous No.21456737]

>>21456661
Looks right.
>σύμμετρος
Compound adjectives often have only two sets of endings, one for the masculine/feminine, the other for the neuter.The same seems to be the case for αἰσθητός, judging by the LSJ entry for it, it can either be a three-termination or a two-termination adjective.

[Anonymous No.21456741]

>>21456661
Those are two-ending adjectives (although apparently αἰσθητός normally has distinct feminine forms, according to the LSJ). It's not unusual for a compound adjective like σύμμετρος to take two endings

[Anonymous No.21456757]

>>21456724
>>21456737
>>21456741
thanks. the book I'm using glossed σύμμετρος as two-termination, but αἰσθητός only as the typical 1st and 2nd declension 3-termination adjcetive, so I was confused. I guess I should've looked at other dictionaries first. my book normally points out oddities though, so I'm surprised they didn't here

[Anonymous No.21457530]

any of you joggers read some unadapted Homer? if so, how as it? what text(s)/resource(s) did you use?

[Anonymous No.21457742]

>>21457530
I've read benner's selections in class it has decent notes, vocab and grammar sections too. The only English text in the main section is for section headings and occasional glosses of very uncommon words.

[Anonymous No.21457832]

>Greek chads having deep discussions on actual literature and grammar
>Ethiopanon is back like the phoenix from the ashes
>Only Latin discussions are in Latin
>Thread is actually thriving with latin textbook faggots in their containment thread

[Anonymous No.21457890]

quo modo "I want a juicy cock in my ass" in latina dicere possum?

[Anonymous No.21457907]

>>21457832
> (You): being a faggot like always.

[Anonymous No.21457911]

>>21457832
Okay, but this is funny:
>>21457320
>>21457857
>>21457874

[Anonymous No.21457918]

>>21457890
mentulam sucidam in meo culo volo.

[Anonymous No.21457967]

>>21457890
Ego volo unum sucosum gallum in meo asino

[Anonymous No.21458201]

>>21456428
>if you plan on learning all the ones mentioned,
No, I already have learned them all. The question is where should I build my expertise going forward? My intention was to survey people's opinions to see what people think the marketplace needs. For instance, the most viewed and read dead language content on the internet is Latin, so the demand for Latin is the greatest. There is virtually zero content for Ge'ez. Perhaps, there is very little demand for it, but there might simply be an unfulfilled demand, in which case that could be a good place to specialize.
I'm quite good at Latin and enjoy reading it, but I'm inclined to think that the work I would do in Latin will go unnoticed. Plus, I'd like to be a trailblazer. If I wanted safety and conformity, I'd try to be a professor. However, there is no sense in blazing a trail and building a railroad if only 5 people want transportation. I've kind of made a dichotomy between Latin and Ge'ez and made it seem like I can only work on one language. That's not the case. Furthermore, there is original work to be done in Latin. But the fact remains that I can't focus on all 5 languages right now.
t. Ethiopianon

[Anonymous No.21458448]

>>21458201
>the marketplace
lmao

[Anonymous No.21458472]

>>21458201
Make a niche in Ge'ez and then try to contact big language creators for collabs. You will get extra views from all the people who are interested in Ge'ez (Academics, Language enthusiasts, Ethiopians, etc.) and people who pretend like they want to learn Ge'ez language (libsharts, we wuzzers, people trying to convince themselves that they are not racist). After that, profit.
If you reach out to Latin, Hebrew, Coptic, and Egyptian creators you will most certainly bring an interested audience to you. It's that simple.

[Anonymous No.21458793]

>>21458448
What's funny?

[Anonymous No.21459094]

>>21458201
> There is virtually zero content for Ge'ez. Perhaps, there is very little demand for it, but there might simply be an unfulfilled demand, in which case that could be a good place to specialize.
I agree. The same goes for Aramaic, especially the non-Biblical variants.

[Anonymous No.21459157]

>>21459094
Besides Biblical Aramaic, I think I have a handle on all of the Jewish Aramaic varieties, barring the very late / modern ones. I definitely intend on teaching myself Syriac, which I'm told is an easier jump than BH > BA, which was very easy.
I've been working off and on on a manuscript project that will be of help to anyone who can read Jewish Aramaic. It just occurred to me that I could release the first part of it and not wait until I complete the whole project. You have that to look forward to, if you can read Aramaic and find a website with bad SEO.
t. Ethiopianon

[Anonymous No.21459173]

>>21459157
> You have that to look forward to, if you can read Aramaic and find a website with bad SEO.
Nice. I'm not in a hurry, I'll still be busy with Hebrew for some time.

[Anonymous No.21459868]

>>21457967
risi

[Anonymous No.21459894]

>>21457832
necesse est semper habere aliud filum de llpsi, liber est ideo licet ut filum tale fiet

[Anonymous No.21459909]

>>21445892
it's called prolepsis
instead of writing ἀνήρετο ὅ τι ἐστὶ τὸ χρῶμα
τὸ χρῶμα which is the subjective of ἐστὶ goes to the main sentence (ἤρετο) as an adverb of reference (περὶ χρώματος)

[Anonymous No.21460534]

>>21456310

specialize in greek. yes, publicize everywhere you can, but try to throw some stuff together for deliuberables. gl anon.

[Anonymous No.21460539]

anyone else hate classics acaedmia? basil gildersleeve and geniuses like himw ould never make it today.

also anyoe here rich and can donate money to my survival pls lmk.

[Anonymous No.21461129]

>>21455714
ααααααααααααααααααααα
ἔτι μιᾶς ὥρας ὑπαρχούσης πρὸ νέου ἐνιαυτοῦ, διατετελεύτηκα ὅ μοι ὑπεθέμην, διανέγνωκα ἅπαντα τὰ τῆς Ἀναβάσεως βιβλία

[Anonymous No.21461146]

>>21460534
Two questions for you. Where is everywhere I can? I'd like to get into audio/visual content, but for the moment, my goal is to write articles that can be read be read on the train or toilet, publish some translations, and create some learning resources. Basically, that means I will be creating brief, consumable content, longer content, and resources that can be accessed again and again.
The second question is what do you mean by deliverables? I'm familiar with the term in broadcast media, but I don't know what it means in this context. Thanks for your input.

[Anonymous No.21461168]

>>21458201
>My intention was to survey people's opinions to see what people think the marketplace needs.
I have no job, and I thought writing stories would help me make money. My vocabulary was lacking, and my prose wanting; decided to read more, and decided to learn latin. If when I learn Latin I will probably write interesting stories in it; that is what I want. Can you do that? Can you make learning fun for beginner-intermediates? Methinks this is always lacking.

[Anonymous No.21461519]

>>21445767
>εἰ γὰρ ξένος ἐν ἄλλῃ πόλει τοιαῦτα ποιοῖς, τάχ' ἂν ὡς γόης ἀπαχθείης
"For if you should do such things as a foreigner in a different city, you would quickly be taken away as a sorcerer" I feel like I got that right, but feel free to correct me anyone. my main concern though is the use of ξένος here. I'm just curious how you would describe it syntactically. I've seen this sort of thing done in Latin too, and in indicative clauses: there's no explicit syntax used with it (like a particle or something), but the noun refers to someone in a way other than the standard "I, you, they" pronouns or their own name or some other epithet. in English we normally use "as" (e.g., "As a boy I worked with my father on the farm"). I just wanna know if it has a formal name

[Anonymous No.21461522]

>>21461519
sleep tight Plato

[Anonymous No.21461540]

>>21461519
keep in mind ξένος is also an adjective, so there's not necessarily a need to e.g add the participle ὤν
idk, maybe you'd call it "predicative adjective of the subject" or some mouthful like that

[Anonymous No.21461623]

Nam tantos, rogo, quis ferat labores?
Et stanti legis, et legis sedenti,
currenti legis, et legis cacanti!
>ego mihi ipsi legens diu incacans (vel impooting)
>>21461519
dormi arte, plato

[Anonymous No.21461633]

>>21461540
>ξένος is also an adjective
right. I'm not sure how you would describe it here - just as an adjective or a substantive noun. either way I think you're right in that it's just a predicate

[Anonymous No.21461864]

>>21461623
legere in latrina nolo
Si digitus faecem tangat, quomodo librum cum digito cacato legat? sine purificatione non posse legere est, sed tantum purificem post cacandum
>>21461519
bene dormi, plato, atque laetum annum novum

[Anonymous No.21461907]

>>21461864
Fortasse Furium respondebas?
> hanc ad munditiem adde mundiorem,
> quod culus tibi purior salillo est,
> nec toto decies cacas in anno;
> atque id durius est faba et lapillis.
> quod tu si manibus teras fricesque,
> non umquam digitum inquinare posses
> haec tu commoda tam beata, Furi,
> noli spernere nec putare parvi,
> et sestertia quae soles precari
> centum desine: nam sat es beatus.

[Anonymous No.21461995]

>>21461864
Num caecus es ut digitis legas in oculorum vicem? Et quomodo cacas ut timeas ne digiti tibi inquinentur???

[Anonymous No.21462017]

>>21461168
>If when I learn Latin I will probably write interesting stories in it; that is what I want. Can you do that? Can you make learning fun for beginner-intermediates? Methinks this is always lacking.
Are you asking if I will write stories in Latin? No, that's not my intention. I do want to translate some songs into the languages I know, but that's likely to be more of a personal fulfillment thing and not something that will generate wide-ranging appeal.
I'm afraid I cannot make learning fun. I don't do illustrated readers or high energy YouTube videos with lots of jump cuts. One of my goals is to make a searchable Ge'ez dictionary, but that's not really making learning fun, just easier and more convenient. If I was trying to help someone overcome the shitty parts of learning a language, I would remind them of their motivations and try to grow them.

[Anonymous No.21462061]

>>21461907
kek

[Anonymous No.21462106]

>>21461907
> To this cleanness add the more clean
> because for you the asshole is cleaner with(by means of?) the salt cellar
> and not by a whole ten shits in a year
> and it is stronger than bean and stones
> which you if with your hands would rub and chafe
> not ever would you be able to stain a finger
> this you (with) conveniences so blessed, Furius
> Do not despise nor think small
> and sesterces which alone to beseech
> Give a hundred: since you are blessed enough

Mone me, latinons. Where did I go wrong? This IS a poem about constipation, right?

[Anonymous No.21462139]

>>21462017
Then why did you learn the language if you didn't want to write in it or speak it? Could have spent your time doing something else with more obvious return on investment. Honestly think about writing a stories; you must have read some great myths along the way.

[Anonymous No.21462244]

>>21445767
When is someone gonna make LLPSI for Greek?

[Anonymous No.21462283]

>>21462244
30 years ago (athenaze)

[Anonymous No.21462293]

>>21462244
Someone is working on a LGPSI, though it's not complete.

[Anonymous No.21462312]

>>21462293
it's based on Koine not 5th ce BC Attic

[Anonymous No.21462313]

>>21462106
This last part is about the benefits of not having to shit, or more specifically, about the benefits of having nothing to shit, and how this is such a bless that this guy should stop asking for those 100 sestertia.

> To this cleanness add the more clean
> because for you the asshole is cleaner with(by means of?) the salt cellar
cleaner than
> and not by a whole ten shits in a year
and you don't shit 10 times in the entire year
> and it is stronger than bean and stones
harder
> which you if with your hands would rub and chafe
> not ever would you be able to stain a finger
> this you (with) conveniences so blessed, Furius
> Do not despise nor think small
> and sesterces which alone to beseech
> Give a hundred: since you are blessed enough
and stop asking those 100 sestertia you use to

Compare your mistakes with a proper translation made by someone who isn't an ESL and a dilettante

[Anonymous No.21462322]

>>21462312
Aren't those basically recognizable as two forms of the same language in the same sense that our English and Shakespeare's English are?

[Anonymous No.21462364]

>>21462322
An extreme example would be good luck reading Shakespeare and Addison if you learned English from twitter.
On top of a lofty level of diction, you also have to become familiar with the complicated syntax, different orthography, the original meanings of words, and finally the morphology that has been dropped over time and simplified.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qe0_BKkfg6g
In this vid, you can find people can somewhat read Koine from the bible but once they get to Attic and Homeric they might as well be reading Chinese.
To bring this back to an anglophone example, you may be able to read Shakespeare with some ease but that will not help you read Beowulf.

[Anonymous No.21462511]

>>21462139
None of the people I have taken dead language classes with said they were interested in writing or speaking the language. Homer, for instance, wasn't an ancient Chinese guy who learned Greek just to create the Iliad and Odyssey. Homer was a Greek who came up with poems in his native language. And so if I wanted to write a story, English would be far and away my first choice. That's just how I feel about, but don't let that stop you from writing your own Latin stories.

[Anonymous No.21463067]

>>21462364
That's speakers of Modern Greek, not Koine, though; as you said they can only somewhat read Koine in the first place. I imagine a native Koine speaker would be able to understand more of Homer than they can, even if not everything.

[Anonymous No.21463070]

>>21462511
That didn't stop a ton of people in Medieval and Renaissance Europe from writing in Latin even though it wasn't their native language. Same with most classical languages, really, that's part of what constitutes a classical language- being continuously used as a written standard even after it's no longer actively spoken. (Actually, something like 95% of surviving Latin is post-Roman if I recall.)

[Anonymous No.21463085]

>>21463070
>that's part of what constitutes a classical language- being continuously used as a written standard even after it's no longer actively spoken

k

[Anonymous No.21463218]

𒈬 𒌍 𒋳 𒋗 𒌑 𒅇 𒀾 𒋗 𒈪 𒋗 𒇻 𒌑 𒋗 𒌌 𒈬 𒌝 𒀀 𒈾 𒆪 𒉡 𒋆

[Anonymous No.21463358]

>>21463218
Writers of cuneiform languages did not use shitty plastic pencils with interchangeable lead points contained within the body of the pencil. They used reeds.

[Anonymous No.21463369]

>>21463358
I meant to include this image

[Anonymous No.21463373]

>>21463358
they weren't a bunch of primitive monkeys
look into the lost technologies of the past. they literally went to space and had iphones.

[Anonymous No.21463436]

>>21463373
That explains why Anne Frank's diary was written in ballpoint. A Sumerian time traveller from 2000 BC wrote it and gave it to Otto Frank. It all makes perfect sense now.

[Anonymous No.21463663]

>>21463358
hey, she's got assburgers, give her a break
besides, it's all desert in the pic, where was she supposed to find reeds

[Anonymous No.21463675]

>>21463358
>>21463373

[Anonymous No.21463715]

>Mārcus īrātus pulsat Quīntum
>Nōn respondet, quia dominam videt īrātam
is it right to think of the adjective 'iratus' as eliding 'est' in these sentences?

[Anonymous No.21463743]

>>21463715
not eliding, no, that would be iratust as you can encounter in e.g Plautus
it's simply an implicit predicate

[Anonymous No.21463745]

>>21463715
No, the sentences already have verbs, and the first one would be rendered incorrect by adding another. In the second you could add an "esse" (not "est"), but dropping it here I wouldn't call elision.

[Anonymous No.21463831]

>>21445767
>Best way to learn is to pick a textbook and start reading it.
>Don't ask, just read
Well, I HAVE to ask.
How can I read if I don't know how? How can I read a Greek or an Akkadian text if I don't even know what the characters mean or how to pronounce them?

[Anonymous No.21463839]

>>21463831
"textbook" means a book that teaches the language.

[Anonymous No.21463869]

>>21463831
>Akkadian
I am glad you asked!
http://oracc.museum.upenn.edu/

[Anonymous No.21463922]

>>21463839
'textbook' is a book with text.
>>21463869
>https://oracc.museum.upenn.edu/
Not working for me.

[Anonymous No.21463932]

>>21463922
> 'textbook' is a book with text.
ESL? I know the language often doesn't make much sense, but the sooner you stop fighting it, the better.

[Anonymous No.21463953]

>>21463922
Look up the word "textbook" in any English dictionary.

[Anonymous No.21463955]

>>21463932
>ESL?
Yes, English is indeed my second language.
Though I was merely being facetious.

[Anonymous No.21464115]

>>21463831
Textbooks provide pronunciation guides. One tip I want to give for Greek, since you brought it up, is that alpha is pronounced like the a in father. Omicron is pronounced like the a in law. Be sure to also keep omicron distinct from omega. Ahhhh, like you are relaxing or understanding something, for alpha; awww, like you are admiring a cute puppy, for omicron; and ohhhh, like you are shocked or dismayed, for omega.
Oh (like omega) by the way, zeta is not a straight up z. Textbooks will instruct you to pronounce it like dzeta or zdeta. For reasons which I won't get into here, the former is more correct, so you should use that one.
Pronunciation isn't entirely necessary for understanding, although it helps, especially for people like me. Champollion obviously didn't know how Egyptian was pronounced until after he cracked the code, and even then, Egyptian is famous for having uncertain pronunciation. No one can be entirely certain of how any of these dead languages are pronounced (that goes for Latin too), but generally, we have a pretty good idea.
Good luck with your studies and happy new year.

[Anonymous No.21464119]

>>21463663
>hey, she's got assburgers, give her a break
What?

[Anonymous No.21464374]

>>21463953
Don't need to desu.
>>21464115
Thank you kindly for the tips on Greek; on the pronunciations and whatnot.

[Anonymous No.21464769]

>Neque enim in ūniversum aliquid, quasi certam fōrmam habeat, cōnstituī potest
>in ūniversum
It just mean "in general" but the first time I read locutions like this they always confuse the shit out of me. I guess they aren't any more confusing than modern ones
>"in general"... what the fuck does all this have to do with being inside the general?
My autism also can't tolerate the fact that quasi has short vowels while quārē doesn't. WHY??

[Anonymous No.21464854]

>>21464769
quasi = quam + sī + iambic shortening of last i
quārē = quā + rē

[Anonymous No.21464930]

>>21464854
>quasi = quam + sī + iambic shortening of last i
those proto-pastaniggers shortened the first syllable too

[Anonymous No.21465160]

>>21464930
That’s cool.

[Anonymous No.21465469]

>>21464119
nescīsne? infirmitās sēria est, nōlī dēlūdere!

[Anonymous No.21465489]

>>21465469
>asinusburgus
iucundius latine fuisset

[Anonymous No.21465727]

protip for greek bros: if you aren't already, be cautious about using wiktionary for declensions and conjugations. on multiple occasions I have seen lacking forms in their tables. I just recently looked up δέξεται because the book I'm using glossed it as aorist subjunctive, which seemed weird to me at first as I thought it was a normal middle future. but I did find elsewhere that it *is* also an aorist subjunctive in Epic Greek (which makes sense, as I found it in Pindar, who apparently partially wrote in Epic Greek). anyway, wiktionary only showed δέξεται for the future indicative. if you don't know of it already, en (hyphen) dictionary (dot) cum is a great resource for word forms and has multiple dictonaries

[Anonymous No.21466160]

recommend easy shit for when I feel like I'm gonna IMPOOOOOOOOOT Latin
Are modern Latin novellas any good? I've only read Julia A Latin Reading Book but it's almost 100 years old

[Anonymous No.21466589]

>>21466160
Cornelia by Mima Maxey is in the public domain.

[Anonymous No.21466784]

>>21464115
>One tip I want to give for Greek, since you brought it up, is that alpha is pronounced like the a in father.
What "the A in father" sounds like depends significantly on what part of the English-speaking world this person is from, or if they're not from the English-speaking world at all, what part their teacher was from. Same goes for "the A in law". It would be far more useful to give pronunciations in the International Phonetic Alphabet or else link to some good sound recordings.

[Anonymous No.21466795]

>>21464119
If you actually don't get the joke: the character is sort of a mascot/representation of autism/autistic people.
https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/ashbie-moon-aspie-girl-aspie-chan

[Anonymous No.21467114]

How easy is it to learn romance languages after Latin? Was Luke Smith right or overstating his prowess to appear "based?"
I'm tempted to learn Italian because of their women

[Anonymous No.21467123]

>>21467114
If you want to learn a language for the women learn Irish. All the Irish girls I've known have been gorgeous. (I may be biased since I'm Irish-American myself.)

[Anonymous No.21467131]

>>21467114
It doesn't help that much. The most it helps with is that it teaches you grammar and how to learn a language properly, which is applicable to all languages. It can help a little bit with vocabulary but frankly not that much. Italian is one of the easiest languages ever to learn though, it's like Spanish, entry level romance language.

[Anonymous No.21467151]

new containment thread is out
>>21466436

[Anonymous No.21467573]

>>21467151
I'm happy that shit isn't going on here.

[Anonymous No.21467630]

>>21467123
>Irish-American

[Anonymous No.21467704]

>>21463922
>Not working for me.
wait, do you unironically want to learn akkadian

[Anonymous No.21467753]

>>21467630
What can I say, my great-grandparents decided to leave Ireland and come here and now here I am.

[Anonymous No.21468308]

>>21467151
I thought they were subverting this general for fun but it looks like they actually take it seriously. Bizarre.

[Anonymous No.21468310]

Is anyone learning a modern language simultaneously like Latin/Greek or another classical lang? I'm learning Russian rn.

[Anonymous No.21468345]

Ō nōn is di'n't

[Anonymous No.21468405]

>>21468310
trying to learn latin and german

[Anonymous No.21468416]

>>21468405
Did you start them at the same time?

[Anonymous No.21468457]

>>21468310
japanese and latin

[Anonymous No.21468552]

>>21468416
started first with latin, so I don't feel like I'm confusing them, but I'm advancing very slow with german, maybe because I'm dividing my time between the two (and because, let's be honest, I'm not specially bright)

[Anonymous No.21468562]

>>21468552
>but I'm advancing very slow with german
I started Russian last month and I'm also moving quite slowly. I'm taking a little break from Latin because I go so burnt out with it. I'm struggling to remember some of these Russian words with zero resemblance to the English, but it's refreshing just because it's a different scenery. I got fucking sick of rereading the same FR chapters over and over again. Idk if I'm going to even finish it. Not because it's difficult, but because it's boring as shit.

[Anonymous No.21468585]

>>21468310
French in addition to ancient Greek and Latin. I enjoy learning new languages, and have literary interest in French, but I'm learning it now so I can hopefully fulfill the modern language requirement for grad school (assuming I get admitted)

[Anonymous No.21468594]

>>21468585
>modern language requirement for grad school
French and German are very important for people studying classics - especially if you want to branch out into most obscure Near Eastern languages whose only grammars or dictionaries may be written in fr. or de.

[Anonymous No.21468604]

>>21468562
>rereading the same FR chapters over and over again
Are you the guy who was doing that thing of reading each chapter 7 times or so and who sometimes uploaded here the graph showing his progress?
Anyway, there's a lot of books in the llpsi series, they start being interesting with the fabula syrae imo because at least that book tells actual myths, but there's two pretty easy booklets before that, too. Or you could try to read the New Testament.

[Anonymous No.21468619]

>>21468604
>Are you the guy who was doing that thing of reading each chapter 7 times or so and who sometimes uploaded here the graph showing his progress?
Ew. No. I'm not following any youtube method. I just took a long hiatus and had to review to reinforce vocab and I finally decided this is such an inefficient way to learn grammar OR vocab. So I stopped a few weeks ago around chapter 25.
> fabula syrae imo because at least that book tells actual myths
Have it, about to start it.
>Or you could try to read the New Testament.
I've read a bit of the Gospel of Mark. It wasn't too bad, but it did feel weird because the grammar is strange.

[Anonymous No.21468737]

>>21468594
that makes sense. I've seen some grad programs recommend/encourage that students who already meet the modern language requirement take up another (though, of course, these programs likely have mixed motives - namely extra tuition)

[Anonymous No.21468756]

>>21468737
For example, languages like Sanskrit or Coptic have shit materials in English and certain dialects of Aramaic or other langs like Hittite and Akkadian may have German dictionaries.

[Anonymous No.21468945]

>>21467123
People speak English in Ireland

[Anonymous No.21468970]

>>21468756
in the fall of last year I was looking into the etymology of cornutus in the sense of cuckold, and seeing what dictionaries glossed it as such (as opposed to just 'horned' or something), and the only thing I could find with that sense that actually gave a proper, elaborate definition with a dated example was a late medieval/early renaissance French/Latin dictionary

[Anonymous No.21469021]

>>21467151
I'm surprised to see how well is working

[Anonymous No.21469371]

I just wanted to offer a comment on that Latin teacher who is going "viral" on this board, particularly outside of this thread. I'm totally for Wheelock and "grammar-translation". However, that woman is no genius. I can tell why she is only a middle school / high school (English equivalent) teacher. That's all I wanted to say. The online Latin community is very unimpressive.

[Anonymous No.21469383]

>>21469371
Fuck off to the other thread, no here cares.

[Anonymous No.21469387]

>>21469371
>particularly outside of this thread
please don't bring that shit here

[Anonymous No.21470392]

sursum perculsum

[Anonymous No.21470549]

nunc mingendum est

[Anonymous No.21470606]

>>21470549
Spero te non Celtiber esse, si scis quod Celtiberia in terra faciunt.

[Anonymous No.21470614]

>>21470606
> Celtiber
Celtiberem

[Anonymous No.21470823]

>>21467704
Not atm, yet that does not stop me from being curious.

[Anonymous No.21471408]

when latin gets posted here,does anyone read it with the ecclesiastical pronounciation or is every one here using the classical?

[Anonymous No.21471685]

>>21468457
Why Japanese?

[Anonymous No.21472032]

>>21468945
Most people, yes.

[Anonymous No.21472165]

Gaudeamus igitur,
juvenes dum sumus!
Post jucundam juventutem,
Post molestam senectutem
Nos habebit humus.

Ubi sunt, qui ante nos
In mundo fuere?
Scandite ad superos
vadite ad inferos,
Ubi jam? Fuere.

Vita nostra brevis est,
Brevi finietur.
Venit mors velociter,
raptat nos atrociter,
nemini parcetur.

Vivat academia,
Vivant professores:
vivat membrum quodlibet,
vivat membra quælibet
semper sint in flore!

Vivant omnes virgines,
faciles, formosae!
Vivant et mulieres
teneræ, amabiles,
bbona; laboriosæ.

Pereat tristitia,
pereant osores,
Pereant diabolus,
quivis antiburschius
atque irrisores!

[Anonymous No.21472343]

>>21472165
Ĝoju, ĝoju ni, kolegoj,
Dum ni junaj estas!
Post plezura estanteco,
Post malgaja maljuneco –
Sole tero restas.

Vivo estas tre mallonga,
Kuras ne tenate,
Kaj subite morto venos,
Kaj rapide ĉiun prenos,
Ĉiun senkompate.

Kie niaj antaŭuloj
En la mondo sidas?
Iru al la superuloj,
Serĉu ilin ĉe l' subuloj –
Kiu ilin vidas?

Vivu la akademio
Kaj la profesoroj!
Vivu longe kaj en sano
Ĉiu akademiano,
Vivu sen doloroj!

Vivu, floru nia regno
Kaj regnestro nia!
Kaj amikoj mecenataj,
Protegantoj estimataj
De l' akademio.

Vivu ĉiuj la knabinoj
Belaj kaj hontemaj!
Vivu ankaŭ la virinoj,
Amikinoj kaj mastrinoj,
Bonaj, laboremaj.

Mortu, mortu, malgajeco!
Mortu la doloro!
Mortu ĉiu intriganto
Kaj malamon konservanto
Longe en la koro!

[Anonymous No.21472434]

who here is in a gradutae program in "ckassical studies" like me? i recommend looking up the absolutely based basil gildersleeve.

[Anonymous No.21472532]

>>21471408
I'm not an Italianoid nor Catholoid, so I pronounce it correctly

[Anonymous No.21472538]

>>21472532
Traditional pronunciations of Latin are perfectly valid.

[Anonymous No.21472566]

>>21472434
I'm not yet, but hopefully by next fall i'll be enrolled in one.
>basil gildersleeve
all I know about him is that some "but muh white supremacy in classics" classics professor (Sarah Bond @ Iowa, specifically) denounced him in some classics conference a few years ago, so I'm guessing he was at least halfways based

[Anonymous No.21472727]

How hard is Theocritus?

[Anonymous No.21472729]

>>21471408
Nobody born before 9/11 uses ecclesiastical

[Anonymous No.21473173]

How long did it take before you stopped translating on the fly and started thinking in your classical language of study?

[Anonymous No.21473201]

>>21472538
not only that but using "classical" for certain periods would be completely wrong

[Anonymous No.21473650]

>>21470606
quid faciunt?

[Anonymous No.21473989]

is /clg/ dead without beginner textbooks wars and why it is?

[Anonymous No.21474062]

>>21473989
nah, last maybe 2-4 threads were essentially free of it, all reached bump limit with minimal page 10 bumps
it's not as fast as the braindead LLPSI shitflinging but that's ok for a board of this speed, even /lang/ on /int/ despite the much broader argument has often troubles staying afloat

[Anonymous No.21475111]

>>21475072
romancesisters...

[Anonymous No.21475225]

>>21475111
see >>21475143

[Anonymous No.21475297]

>>21475111
>>21475225
Stay in your containment thread, please.

[Anonymous No.21475900]

ναὶ τὼ σιὼ they weren't joking about Thucydides' prose

[Anonymous No.21477629]

>>21475900
I don't know anything about Greek. How is going bro?

[Anonymous No.21478102]

>>21477629
not bad after all, slowly going through the second book of the Iliad and just finished Xenophon's Anabasis, now since I'm also keeping up with my Latin(Plautus mostly, gotta pick up the Aeneid again) I got my hands on a bilingual Greek-Latin Thucydides and I'm going to try reading through it, trying to use only the Latin as help
definitely picks up in syntactical difficulty, not even so much a matter of lexicon, feels like reading Tacitus for the first time all over again

[Anonymous No.21478141]

>paucas pallabris
broken latin or broken sp*nish?

[Anonymous No.21478168]

>>21478141
sounds more like a mix of both, for us Romance niggas it's understandable as we also say something similar e.g Italian poche parole, but the geminated -ll- maybe indicates something more akin to Asturian?(pallabra)

[Anonymous No.21478183]

>>21478168
>for us Romance niggas
>niggas

[Anonymous No.21478190]

>>21478183
when in Rome do as the Romans do, I'm merely adapting my speech register to anglophones and their peculiar Bantu infatuation

[Anonymous No.21478761]

>>21468562
>I started Russian last month
https://www.youtube.com/@Leucomustaceusparergaotiosa/videos
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTWnQB38Se1t-tHX0VFeFIFimeJOJf7h8
http://antibarbari.ru/
https://www.youtube.com/@antibarbari4255/videos
http://ancientrome.ru/antlitr/

[Anonymous No.21478782]

>>21468562
https://t.me/s/parakharatteintonomisma
https://vkontakte.ru/atticista
https://vkontakte.ru/antibarbari

[Anonymous No.21478799]

>>21468562
https://www.youtube.com/@thinkbyzantine2101/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@AlexeiGloukhov/videos
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLjRdPAc7-AcLBcU6DNtsd13Q3sbrQXtev
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLjRdPAc7-AcIqJOW93relbb-khJAdDsCL

[Anonymous No.21478810]

>>21468562
https://lingvoforum.net/index.php

[Anonymous No.21479338]

vesta dea orabatur, ne ignis foco deesset

why isnt it "vestam", shes the object of the pleads.

[Anonymous No.21479346]

>>21479338
orabatur is passive, oops

[Anonymous No.21479691]

>>21478761
>>21478782
>>21478799
>>21478810
I was already subscribed to the first dude with the glasses, but the rest I'm unfamiliar with and can't read the pages yet :(

[Anonymous No.21480010]

Learning Latin, and connecting arrows between words and their relations. For example, in "Iūlius vir Rōmānus est." I would point an arrow originating from the subject 'Iūlius' to the verb 'est', and then 'est' would point to the object 'vir' which is itself being pointed at by the adjective 'Rōmānus'. What I am having trouble with is this sentence: "Inter duās portās est via lāta, quae castra in duās partēs dīvidit; ea via centum pedēs lāta est." This last sentece is giving me trouble. I know 'ea via' means 'that road (in particular)', so they both point to 'est'; but I don't know what 'est' points to. I don't believe 'lāta' is an adjective here since 'centum pedēs' is plural and thus necessitates the plural 'lātae', right? But the same applies in the other direction. Is there some kind of elision going on here? Could the sentence be "Ea via tam lāta est quam centum pedēs."? How should one draw the arrows here?

[Anonymous No.21480050]

>>21480010
centum pedes is in the accusative and specifies how long the via est lāta
it's not so odd, in the accusative you have expressions of e.g temporal length as well

[Anonymous No.21480172]

>>21480050
So then 'lāta' is an adjective applying itself to 'ea via' and not to 'centum pedēs'? So the sentence roughly translates into "That wide road is a hundred feet."? I thought the sentence translated into "That road is a hundred feet wide."; where 'wide' applies itself to 'a hundred feet' and not to 'That road'.

[Anonymous No.21480210]

>>21480010
>ea via centum pedēs lāta est.
lata is indeed an adjective an agrees with via, centum pedes in an accusative, a couple examples from my dictionary
>panem tris pedes latum Pl. Bacch.580
>ratem … pedes quinquaginta latam Liv.
there are a couple examples using the ablative and the genitive instead of the accusative, too
>Rotae, quae erunt in raeda, sint latae per medium diametrum pedum quaternûm Vitr. 10.9.1
>latum pede Vitr. 2.3.3

[Anonymous No.21480215]

>>21480172
sorry, I meant to say wide
>So then 'lāta' is an adjective applying itself to 'ea via' and not to 'centum pedēs'?
correct, more precisely, it's called something like "complement of extension" and in Latin it's usually expressed in the accusative
"latus" could maybe be less literally translated here as "extends" or "is extended", in this case, as you rightfully pointed out, in "wideness"

[Anonymous No.21480219]

>>21480172
Not the anon you're quoting but in case you speak Italian
>La via è larga 100 piedi

[Anonymous No.21480255]

>>21480215
to be more precise, one could simply say
via est lāta, the road is wide
the accusative phrase "centum pedes" specifies how much
it's similar to the accusative in case of time, e.g bellum gesserunt (how long?) decem annos

[Anonymous No.21480256]

>>21445892
Nice.

[Anonymous No.21480348]

>>21480255
>via est lāta, the road is wide
>the accusative phrase "centum pedēs" specifies how much
Oh ok, I think I understand. Is the sentence written like this: "Ea via centum pedēs lātās est." translate into "That road is (literally) one hundred wide feet."—as in the road is made of a hundred feet which are wide and not that the road is a hundred feet (wide)? This is what I originally thought the sentence was going for, but I couldn't figure out how 'centum pedēs' and 'lāta' agreed with one another.

[Anonymous No.21480380]

>>21480348
n.b pēs is masculine so it'd have to be pedēs lātōs
but in that case the accusative would cease to make sense since there is no noun/adjective describing size/length like lāta, so to translate your phrase it'd have to be "centum pedēs lātī" in the nominative

[Anonymous No.21480393]

>>21480348
lata and centum pedes are not supposed to agree with each other. Lata agrees with via. The road is wide. Centum pedes is an accusative of extent of space. Centum pedes tells how wide but is its own phrase in the same way a genitive of possession does not have to agree in case, number, or gender to what is being possessed.

[Anonymous No.21480503]

>>21480380
>pēs is masculine
Lmao, I'm too retarted for this shit.
>>21480393
Alright, the analogy with the genitive of possesion helped. So drawing arrows would yield "Via" -> "est" -> "lāta" <- "centum pedēs"; or is drawing arrows mentally-challenging here? Thank you, nonetheless.

[Anonymous No.21480643]

>>21478799
Thanks.

[Anonymous No.21480866]

>>21445767
Do you guys think studying Latin and Greek simultaneously is a bad idea? Should I just start with latin?

[Anonymous No.21481816]

>>21480866
Start with whatever you want.

[Anonymous No.21482069]

>>21480866
"Learning" at the same time or "starting" at the same time?

[Anonymous No.21482178]

>>21480866
>Do you guys think studying Latin and Greek simultaneously is a bad idea?
I think so.

[Anonymous No.21482200]

>>21479691
>>21480643
https://youtube.com/watch?v=cXjyVJAoXqk

And listen a lot. In podcast apps you can select a country. You can also create a new Google account for Russian YouTube channels.

[Anonymous No.21482203]

>read sentence
>know the words
>know the grammar
>still have to read it several times to understand it
>don't need to look up words or anything, just reread it a few times
>it's a fucking grader reader
>mfw

[Anonymous No.21482505]

>>21482203
So you read it over a few times. Sometimes you have to do that to get better at the language.

[Anonymous No.21482666]

>>21482203
every time i read Xenophon

[Anonymous No.21482768]

>>21482666
at least you're reading a real author, I'm reading the fucking llpsi (at least it's the de bello gallico one but still)

[Anonymous No.21482875]

>>21482768
No shame in that. Keep grinding my man.

[Anonymous No.21482917]

Do you guys take notes when you learn a language? Every time I try, I end up crumbling up the paper on the first page. It feels to time consuming and idk if it even helps my memory. Same with flash cards.

[Anonymous No.21483132]

>>21482917
Notes are busy work for normies. Don't bother if you have a 3 digit iq

[Anonymous No.21483236]

>>21483132
>Notes are busy work for normies. Don't bother if you have a 3 digit iq
Thank you anon. I've always just read textbooks without writing anything down and I thought I was doing something wrong or maybe I was making myself learn slower.

[Anonymous No.21483311]

>>>/int/176075244
Pretty much a total Greek newb, can anyone tell me how I fucked up here?

[Anonymous No.21483358]

>>176075244
>>21483311
are you trying ancient or modern?
in ancient it'd be more like
οὐκ ἔχω γυναῖκα
ποῦ ἐστὶν ὁ ἀνὴρ αὐτῆς;

[Anonymous No.21483376]

>>21483358
>ancient
This, but I'm only about a week in.
Thank you for the corrections anon
What is the difference between οὐκ and μή?

[Anonymous No.21483380]

>>21482917
>>21483236
what kind of notes do you take? depending on the kind and how quickly, I don't think there's a problem with them. I have been making notes in some Plato that I've been going through in the book itself (mainly underlines, question marks, etc for unique grammar, morphology, etc.) and I have elsewhere sometimes made notes on my computer to later look up constructions I found while reading for the day. I think there's a sweet spot where you should try to understand a lot of what you're reading and just accept the ambiguity for the present moment, but notes aren't necessarily bad imo.

[Anonymous No.21483409]

>>21483376
broadly speaking οὐ and its composites refers to objective/indicative negation, while μὴ and its composites to subjective negation
e.g you use the latter in the imperative, in subordinate final clauses, etc..., you'll get used to it in time

[Anonymous No.21483413]

>>21483409
Thank you anon :)

[Anonymous No.21483455]

Where can I find the answers to homeworks of Familia Romana Lingua Latina?

[Anonymous No.21483497]

>>21483380
I'm not talking about notes for texts. I'm talking about notes when you are working through an introductory course or textbook.

[Anonymous No.21483539]

>>21483497
okay, but what kind of notes specifically do you make? what is the typical content of your notes?

[Anonymous No.21483576]

>>21483455
If I'm not mistaken you'll find them in the book "LLPSI Teacher's materials and answer key" and you can download it from the mega folder in OP.

[Anonymous No.21483652]

>>21483539
Just like summarizing a textbook chapter.

[Anonymous No.21483669]

>>21483652
This is a very helpful exercise because it "tells" your brain that the information you have absorbed that day is relevant for long term storage and was not just part of your daily ephemera. Even getting into the habit of thinking "what did I learn from that chapter I read" while you're in a quiet/dull moment later in the day, or in the shower, or falling asleep, can do wonders. After a while you can almost feel it working, I swear, it's like tutoring a little kid whose information retention is spotty and unpredictable and then seeing actual progress in him as he actively shows he's assimilating, sorting, and structuring the knowledge you've given him. There's something about going "and what did we LEARN today?" to your own brain and realizing it's waking up to the fact that you want it to care about what you forced it to process 3 hours earlier. Also I think the act of actively creating and structuring symbolic systems (like filling in a paradigm in your mind rather than only having it imposed on your mind while actively reading the textbook) does something for long term memory retention.

[Anonymous No.21483752]

>>21482203
What’s your problem though?

[Anonymous No.21483771]

>>21483652
in addition to what >>21483669 said, afaik research on remembering what you read clearly shows that summarizing a chapter you just read is one of the best ways to retain it

[Anonymous No.21483820]

I wanted to make a sort of translation challenge: I would post a translation into English of some Latin text and then anons (and me) would try to write it in Latin. Then other anons would point out mistakes. One could also compare its own with the original text. I thought of using Familia Romana because it's easy, prosaic, and the level of difficulty can be easily chosen, similarly to the /lang/ challenges. The problem is translating the text. I can use g**gle but it is quite bad for Latin (you can find fully digitized copies online from which you can copy and paste). Does someone knows if there is a translation of this book available? Or any other text I could use?
Example made with g**gle:
>Julius walks to the door, which is opened by the porter.
>The Lord enters the village through the gate.
>After him come Syrus and Leander, who carry two sacks.
>The porter closes the door behind them.
>Bear and Dave leave with an empty litter.
Iulius ambulat ad ostium, quod ab ostiario aperitur.
Dominus per ostium in villam intrat.
Post eum veniunt Syrus et Leander, qui duos saccos portant.
Ostiarius post eos ostium claudit.
Ursus et Davus cum lectica vacua discedunt.

[Anonymous No.21483855]

>>21483820
>Iulius ad portam ambulat, quae ab ostiario aperitur
>Dominus (lol) per portam vicum intrat
>Post eum Syrus Leanderque, qui duos saccos portant, veniunt
>Ianitor post iis portam claudit
>Ursus et Davus cum lettica vacua discedunt

[Anonymous No.21483888]

>>21445892
nice post anon

>>21459909
>>21447928
thanks anons. im dreading going back to school and struggling w learning greek

[Anonymous No.21483896]

>>21445767
any publisher selling good bilingual editions of works on latin and ancient greek? it's easy to find PDFs, but no so much actual books
>https://ryanfb.xyz/loebolus/

[Anonymous No.21483918]

>>21483669
>>21483771
I don't understand. Are you guys saying I should mentally take notes instead?

[Anonymous No.21484041]

>>21483576
Thanks

[Anonymous No.21484106]

>>21483918
idk about the other anon, but I'm saying making some sort of summary, though I like writing it out as it's more explicit and I think it makes you think a little more about the content (because you have to think about how you would describe it, write it out, then see if it makes sense after it's written), is beneficial.

[Anonymous No.21484116]

>>21484106
What if I just write some points out on a dry erase board?

[Anonymous No.21484191]

>>21484116
I don't see why that wouldn't have some positive effect. again the idea broadly is to get yourself thinking more consciously about what you have went over and/or recently learned

[Anonymous No.21484725]

>finally over the catalogues of the Achaeans and Trojans and onto book 3
yeah I ain't rereading that as I usually do

[Anonymous No.21486031]

Guys what are some good ideas for a greek/latin only vtuber?
Obviously nobody will be able to communicate with the streamer at all but maybe it can be like some esoteric thing to watch where everyone memes about the streamer summoning demons or something

[Anonymous No.21486069]

>>21486031
>Guys what are some good ideas for a greek/latin only vtuber?
being able to speak proper greek/latin

[Anonymous No.21486300]

>>21486069
I think it would make good practice since streamers talk a ton, and talk about all kinds of topics

[Anonymous No.21486459]

>>21486031
latin authors and literature

[Anonymous No.21486498]

>>21486031
There's alot of Japanese streamers who do English learning streams.
Though that is entertaining because it holds an audience for both English and Japanese viewers.
Whereas if you are doing a Latin learning stream, it may not attract any audience outside of people from the Latin community.
Also alot of people might instantly assume you're speaking spanish or something and not look twice.
I think it would be entertaining if you larped as an ancient Roman who is learning about the modern world

[Anonymous No.21486764]

>>21486498
That definitely sounds fun. I wonder if something like that would work for Classical Chinese.

[Anonymous No.21486770]

>>21486764
The 'LARPing as an ancient who's learning about the modern world' thing I mean.

[Anonymous No.21487222]

>>21486764
> I wonder if something like that would work for Classical Chinese.
You would have to use something other than Mandarin pronunciation, which practically no one would understand.

[Anonymous No.21487303]

>>21487222
Hokkien or Cantonese, maybe?

[Anonymous No.21487695]

>>21486764
> Classical Chinese
本

[Anonymous No.21487707]

>>21487695
If you're interested in Classical Chinese, add me on Discord at Terpomo11#9900, I can invite you to a couple of excellent servers.

[Anonymous No.21487716]

>>21487707
>I can invite you to a couple of excellent servers.
I'm not learning it, but I'm wondering how many people are in these communities.

[Anonymous No.21487717]

>>21487707
Thanks for the offer, but I don't do Discord.

[Anonymous No.21487722]

>>21487716
This particular server has a decent number, I'm not sure exactly off the top of my head. A few hundred at least, though like most Discord servers, most aren't active.

[Anonymous No.21487752]

>>21487722
I meant more-so how many people are studying Classical Chinese in general here in the West. What motivates you guys and what is the goal?

[Anonymous No.21487774]

>>21485018
>Learning Chinese/Japanese to the level where you are really engaging with wenyuan is not like learning Latin or something where you can learn the language while reading at the same time
Is this true?

[Anonymous No.21487777]

>>21487774
This is what I'm asking

[Anonymous No.21487820]

>>21487752
It's hard to really say how many, but I think for most of us the goal is to read literature originally written in Classical Chinese, just like people learning any ancient language. I get the impression it's one of the more popular ancient languages, though nowhere close to the level of Latin and Greek.
>>21487774
I think the assumption that Classical Chinese must be engaged with through modern Chinese or Japanese is erroneous. It can be learned on its own terms, just like you don't have to learn Latin through a Romance language. I do agree it's often terse and allusive, though, and the resources available in modern Chinese or Japanese can be beneficial, but there are also dictionaries and glossaries and commentaries in Classical Chinese itself.

[Anonymous No.21487826]

>>21487820
>I get the impression it's one of the more popular ancient languages, though nowhere close to the level of Latin and Greek.
This baffles me because I never see it talked about online and I don't see many textbooks available in English. Are you an Anglophone resident or from another country?

[Anonymous No.21487845]

>>21487826
I'm living in the US. I don't know, maybe my sample is skewed because I'm the sort of person who's learning Classical Chinese and therefore am exposed a lot to other people who are but I at least get the impression it's more popular than, say, Akkadian, Egyptian, or Old Irish.

[Anonymous No.21487856]

>>21487845
I will say I think you are wrong about it being more popular than Egyptian. Lots of Kemetphiles in the US. People don't seem all that interested in the Orient of the far east here. de

[Anonymous No.21487863]

>>21487856
I've only known a couple people who were seriously studying Egyptian, but maybe I just don't know where to look.

[Anonymous No.21487868]

>>21487863
There's a lot of crossover with people who are learning Greek & Hebrew.

[Anonymous No.21487869]

so the first one js clear

Itaque deos hominibus colendos timendosque esse censuerunt

gerundivum and dativus auctoris and accusative

but then

Dei hominibus timendi non sunt

why isnt it Deos hominibus timendos non sunt?

[Anonymous No.21487877]

>>21487845
>>21487856
NTA, but CC is one of the big five classical languages (meaning you'll never run out of stuff to read), so I would also have put it way above Egyptian in terms of popularity.

>>21487820
> I think the assumption that Classical Chinese must be engaged with through modern Chinese
But you do know some modern Chinese? Later writings tend to have vernacular mixed in, and I'm wondering whether these will still be accessible if one only ever saw classical.

[Anonymous No.21487887]

NOVUM
>>21487884
>>21487884
>>21487884

[Anonymous No.21487898]

>>21487869
why would the second be in the accusative?
the first is in the accusative because it's an infinitive phrase introduced by censuerunt