/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.20866823]

what are we supposed to do?

[Anonymous No.20866843]

>>20866823
become engineers, explore space for a bit - that will be about it for faustian civilization
and it's perfectly fine

[Anonymous No.20866997]

>>20866843
>for a bit
The Faustian Destiny stretches into infinity.

[Anonymous No.20867000]

>>20866823
Unify the Faustian nations into a single political unit and proceed to eradicate the world of the cultural termite infestations. From there the stars are the limit.

[Anonymous No.20867003]

>>20866823
sex gifs

jesus christ marie theyre minerals

[Anonymous No.20867020]

>>20866823
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv9vp5zngV8
things die, new things arise, things rekindle.
Don't let yourself go crazy over it.

[Anonymous No.20867111]

>>20867000
WITNESS ME

[Anonymous No.20867117]

>>20866823
Post his mug and "he's literally right about everything" daily, that'll show'em how.

[Anonymous No.20867170]

>>20867000
>>20867111
I speak to you of Faustian Man! Of his Becoming! His Destiny in Infinity! Breathe in the sinusoid of his Spirit, dance in the tempo of his down going! His Will is the Will-to-Power, the Will to cover the world in his Absolute, the singularity of Relativity disclosing the manifold! His plague spreads, the Lichdom arises, bringing a fire to burn the old gods at the stake! So many lambs and oxen... slaughtered to fix a future for FAUST.

[Anonymous No.20867179]

>>20866823
restore /qa/

[Anonymous No.20867197]

I realized the last thing western man has to do is conquer space travel, go out having a beautiful death as the samurais would have

[Anonymous No.20867327]

>>20867197
B8

[Anonymous No.20867342]

>>20866823
Go all-in

[Anonymous No.20867351]

>>20867000
Clearly World Spirit does NOT want that since Germany tried that two times and the entire world rallied to defeat that idea and now we have some pseudo pacifying version of through the EU.

Faustian era is over. Whatever the fuck America Actually is, and not what Spengler thinks it is, rules the world all over and on every continent.

[Anonymous No.20867425]

>>20867351
>World spirit
I deny any such thing. I'm not going to fall for the 'muh German' bait. That being said it is no surprise the 'whole world' is against a Faustian aggregate, since they could not withstand it, it would be their dissolution. As for America, I agree, Technomancy has great influence, but this is an aberration, a cancer to be excised. Faust cannot be expunged, his machine flys unto Infinity.

[Strange Love No.20867542]

>>20866823

>what are we supposed to do?

Evidently ...

[Anonymous No.20867564]

>>20867351
What we need is international national socialism under syncretic Christianity.

[Anonymous No.20867565]

>>20867425
then why did the German peoples rally repeatedly to dominate and create for themselves against opposing forces from the East and from across the Ocean?
for lolz? cause bored? cause pseudo and pathetic economic or vindictive motives anglo historians like to repeat?
Why go into a Spengler thread if you don’t even care to accept one the first premises for his entire philosophy, you fucking moron.

[Anonymous No.20867621]

>>20867565
KEK. I am not denying the Germans, I am simply not going to be drawn into a long winded, well repeated discussion on the merits of the Germans attempt at expressing the Faustian Imperium. Spengler was a German, thus he naturally sought the Germans as the Imperials rather than the Faustian People as an aggregate. A fault of nationalism even he seemed to recognize, however, failure at this juncture is not an option. If the Faustians have failed in the past then we must learn from our mistakes. We must go beyond national-imperialism to Cultural-Imperialism in the full-bodied sense of Culture that Spengler was perceptive enough to announce.

[Anonymous No.20867650]

>>20867565
>>20867621
It has occured to me that perhaps by 'World Spirit' you meant what I understood to be 'Cultural Organism'. In which case I misunderstood, and you do bring an interesting point. What is the Faustian Imperium to look like? Clearly an Imperial feeling has already come and gone, witness Vietnam. However I refuse to believe there is no more, I will not see Faust die. I will raise him from the grave before God himself can steal his soul.

[Anonymous No.20867705]

He tells you in his book almost matter of factly to put down the paint brush and forgo poetry in favor of picking up a wrench and learning to code. What he wants you to do is not despair your life by devoting it to culture in a time of civlization, but instead take your creative talents to contribute to civilization. This can happen in arenas like politics, economics, business, law, and the military, but not in arenas like religion, painting, poetry, or architecture. He thinks you'll get farther by devoting yourself to those cold and pragmatic techniques of materialistic civilization. So be a Cecil Rhodes and not a William Shakespeare.

The difficulty faced in this is that even these possibilities seem to be exhausted somewhat. We don't have a Cecil Rhodes colonizing Africa. We have silicon valley tech billionaires that largely exploit their own land and people, often making their fortunes first and foremost through government-enabled subsidies. And to a certain degree, you can't even have that anymore. Jeff Bezos made his wealth riding an internet bubble before he perfected logistics. Who is making a vast fortune with an internet business today? So what to do with that? I don't know. My own personal interests are more in the realm of law than the realm of money, but it's something I've thought about.

[Anonymous No.20867708]

>>20867564
Based Seranno enjoyer.
>Verification not required.

[Anonymous No.20867723]

>>20867705
We need to give to the West an Authority to believe in. Direction is sorely lacking, thus the rise of Silicon Valley exploiters. We need a Caesar.

[Anonymous No.20867726]

>>20867000
based yockey enjoyer.
I WANT TO SERVE AND DIE FOR FAUSTIAN IMPERIUM EMPIRE

[Anonymous No.20867786]

>>20867726
That's the Spirit!

[Anonymous No.20867793]

>>20867705
>He tells you in his book almost matter of factly to put down the paint brush and forgo poetry in favor of picking up a wrench and learning to code. What he wants you to do is not despair your life by devoting it to culture in a time of civlization, but instead take your creative talents to contribute to civilization. This can happen in arenas like politics, economics, business, law, and the military, but not in arenas like religion, painting, poetry, or architecture. He thinks you'll get farther by devoting yourself to those cold and pragmatic techniques of materialistic civilization. So be a Cecil Rhodes and not a William Shakespeare.
what if I just want to see civilization burn to the ground and laught at it?
what can I contribute to the downfall?

[Anonymous No.20867802]

>>20867793
Your grave. Or you can join us in the charge of the light brigade. Your choice.

[Anonymous No.20867808]

>>20866823
Ride the tiger. According to to the Verdas we've only got another 40000 years of Kali Yuga to go so make sure you enjoy it while you can.

[Anonymous No.20867890]

>>20867793
You're what Toynbee coined an "internal proletariat" and from a historical perspective, you could only really be a Spartacus, or else a Roman without a name resigned to the fog of formless history among the masses.

[Anonymous No.20867899]

>>20867723
I see Silicon Valley entrepreneurs as very unlike Caesars.

[Anonymous No.20867903]

>>20867708
I've never even read Serrano. Wtf? I'm confused.

[Anonymous No.20867904]

>>20867899
Checked. I agree, but the future Caesar will have to reign them in. Money is Power, Power without Direction via Authority is implosive.

[Anonymous No.20867908]

>>20867903
Seranno IS National Socialism and syncretic Kristianity. Check him out, if you are so inclined.

[Anonymous No.20867916]

>>20867564
> international national

[Anonymous No.20867922]

>>20867000
>>20867111
holy digits…

[Anonymous No.20867923]

>>20867916
By the time Faust is finished international will be national.

[Anonymous No.20867925]

>>20867908
I just don't want the aliens and spaceship stuff

[Anonymous No.20867927]

>>20867922
Checked and kek'd

[Anonymous No.20867932]

>>20867925
Well he is a bit eccentric, to each in their own time I guess.

[Anonymous No.20867936]

>>20867899
I agree. They're more like Augustus.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/hail-augustus-zuckerberg-declares-love-for-roman-emperor-nflkxjzdx

[Anonymous No.20867945]

>>20867936
Augustus was a Caesar and they are even less like Augustus than other Caesars. This man's "love" of Augustus probably derives from a Reddit meme.

[Anonymous No.20867949]

>>20867945
Augustus was a sperg and couldn't do anything without mentors like Cicero and loyal "men's men" friends like Agrippa. He's no Caesar like Julius Caesar, who could do everything well.

[Anonymous No.20868006]

>>20867802
>>20867890
I mean I understand the message spengler is trying to say here, yes we should continue contributing our talent to this civilization as much as we could but I honestly just don't see the point in doing it. I feel like it's not just Faustian civilization that is falling apart but literally the whole world is falling apart right now.
Before this whole mess start there were this feeling of progress never seen beforem, people are living in peace and prosperity, the internet was just getting started and everyone believe that we are heading toward a some sort of Utopia, A global cyber utopia with endless infinite possibilities with website but then 9/11 happened and end the Last 90s and 2000s internet optimistism of our utopia dream that never came to realize then came with IRL politic starting to infest the net like Anonymous vs Scientology then Gamergate that start the whole cultural marxist movement then 2016 election with Trump presidential that shake the world and after he resign it just keep getting worse and worse. Many people myself included feel hopeless toward current situation Housing Prices, Racial tension, China and Russia beating back, Country being divided, Economy in shamble etc. I see men cutting their dick off and larp as woman, I see mega corporation fucking everyone, I see the people of this nation fighting each other for the sake of ideologies, I see it all and laugh at the absurdity at it.
I just wish it was all over already instead of the continuation of this horrible world.

[Anonymous No.20868036]

>>20868006
>the Last 90s and 2000s internet optimistism of our utopia dream that never came to realize t
lol look up Office Space. the optimism was a veneer.

[Anonymous No.20868044]

>>20866823
Spengler is stupid, do you really believe in what he wrote? Did you read him?

[Anonymous No.20868054]

>>20868044
explain why he is stupid.

[Anonymous No.20868066]

>>20867949
Augustus was arguably the most successful man who ever lived according to the history available to us.

[Anonymous No.20868086]

>>20868054
Do I really need to

[Anonymous No.20868098]

>>20868006
He predicted that Westerners would come to despise the civilization they've built for themselves and that even the engineer would come to detect the satanism in the machine. The age of the Caesars and the empire is basically the age of the few remaining ambitious personalities and their armies, while the rest of the civilization falls between the cracks of their stone-like grains of sand. If you wanted to get ahead of the curve, you would do well to do what you can to carve out a free and pastoral sort of life, but you could be a century early.

[Anonymous No.20868100]

>>20866823
sex gifs

[Anonymous No.20868103]

>>20868086
well sure go ahead.

[Anonymous No.20868111]

>>20868044
I do. I did. Not every particular thing, but in a general sense, yes.

[Anonymous No.20868112]

>>20866823
leave society

[Anonymous No.20868141]

>>20868006
Of course it is absurd. Life itself is absurd. But Life (the show) must go on, we have the choice between dying a useless death or propelling ourselves into the future on the chance we make it through. Evolve or Die. Spengler here would mention the soldier at Pompeii. Yet it need not be such, we have the power, ye though we feel powerless, to push the zeitgeist beyond these petty polemics, to provoke a future fit for Faust. Naturally that isn't to say pessimism is unwarranted, it is in fact completely warranted and necessary to see the possibilities clearly, only with a sober eye can we create the future. To do otherwise is death, thus the choice is between an absurd death, or a death for a future you can be proud of. Face the rising sun, think not of the daily incident but of the future Phoebus promises, reach for it and declare: The West marches on!

[Anonymous No.20868182]

>>20867793
Be part of the next discriminated minority and whine about it.

[Anonymous No.20868194]

>>20868111
Witnessed.

[Anonymous No.20868197]

>>20868086
You read him right? Or what are you criticizing?

[Anonymous No.20868202]

>>20868197
In general, it's absurd. Being a nazi doesn't make one a good philosopher

[Anonymous No.20868210]

>>20868202
Spengler was an early critic of the Nazi Party and had his books banned by them. You're an ignorant retard who talks about things he doesn't understand.

[Anonymous No.20868213]

>>20868202
He wasn’t a nazi, you haven’t read him. You probably think “we’ll he is German and right wing, I hate these things so I’ll call him nazi”, and here we are the rest talking with a retard who doesn’t even read books. Is not like you have to pay them.

[Anonymous No.20868220]

>>20868210
>>20868213
Don't fall for the bait guys

[Anonymous No.20868222]

>>20867351
Uppity Jews are not the entire world despite their insistence otherwise.

[Anonymous No.20868233]

>>20868222
Checked and kek'd

[Anonymous No.20868251]

>>20868210
I know. I mean he was anti-democratic, anti-liberal, nationalist-socialist, anti-rationalist and an influece on the nazi party.

[Anonymous No.20868265]

>>20868213
*well
Incredibly gay picrel btw

[Anonymous No.20868382]

>>20868006
Thucydides has an interesting account of Athens during a plague. It took a Pericles to pull them out. Become Pericles, or if ye have not the talent, seek him out.

[Anonymous No.20868690]

>>20868141
Do you think there's the same greatness in technocratic methods as those of Julius or Augustus Caesar?

[Anonymous No.20868727]

>>20867000
>Unify the Faustian nations into a single political unit and proceed to eradicate the world of the cultural termite infestations

always has been (since 1946)

[Anonymous No.20868738]

>>20867705
>learning to code

this is bugman shit

[Anonymous No.20868758]

>>20867705
>So be a Cecil Rhodes and not a William Shakespeare.
>NOOO DUDE YOU CANNOT CREATE A MASTERPIECE OTHERWISE I WILL GET DISCREDITED

watch me do it, and i will piss in the grave of spengler

[Anonymous No.20868766]

>>20867793
>what if I just want to see civilization burn to the ground and laught at it?
>what can I contribute to the downfall?

unironically read Nick Land and become an Accelerationist

[Anonymous No.20868775]

>>20867945
>This man's "love" of Augustus probably derives from a Reddit meme.
https://youtu.be/QT13kk8HDDo

[Anonymous No.20868780]

>>20868766
Fuck off accfag tranny

[Anonymous No.20868791]

>>20868780
what a pussy lol

[Anonymous No.20868805]

>>20868758
To be clear, it's not that he would not have you create a masterpiece. It's rather that he thinks the attempt will leave you frustrated in the end.

[Anonymous No.20868819]

>>20868766
I always wonder what exactly is it that accelerationists think they're accelerating and how they suppose it would happen. If a modern Bronze Age collapse is the goal, they're delusional to think they could influence things like that.

[Anonymous No.20868833]

>>20867621
France, Spain, Italy, England are only Faustian because of the Germans who went there during the Great Migration Period and usually became the Elite; Spengler says this explicitly.
The Germans had not just the Italians and Spanish on their side in the last run, they also made France, Netherlands, skandinavian countries allies next to such non germanics like Lithuanians, Hungarians, Croats, Bulgarians etc. to fight off this non European invasive horde in the East that was threatening to move in and against the mongol race that found itself across the Ocean and had made bitter, continental hating masochistic England, a springboard vassal.
The Faustian Spirit died with nazis and only vestiges remain in ideas like the EU, exemplified pathetically through someone like Macron, or in the industrious descendants in America that long only use or regards faustian technology the way Japan or China does.
Your messiahs have come and gone. Wilson killed it and FDR and Stalin dug the grave and left no tomb stone.

Catilina (the original Caesar) was killed by his own country men; what happened to the Faustians is like the Parthians and Germans coming in and killing Caesar on the Forum and splitting the Empire up amongst themselves. There was never a faustian Caesar and the new culture emanating from America and the vengeful ones from Russia and China never want a faustian Caesar and would do everything to stop him.

As the inbreds say: It’s over.

[Anonymous No.20868865]

>>20868833
You are equating the various Germanic tribes of 430 AD with the Germans of the 1930s, but this is a mistake. His essay Prussianism and Socialism suggests that he thinks each nation has a different version of Faustianness.

[Anonymous No.20868869]

>>20868833
>France, Spain, Italy, England are only Faustian because of the Germans who went there during the Great Migration Period and usually became the Elite; Spengler says this explicitly.

what a bunch of nationalism bias

[Anonymous No.20868883]

>>20868833
America is clearly a Faustian country, arguably the most Faustian country.

[Anonymous No.20868894]

>>20868883
a lot of Germans did migrate to America

[Anonymous No.20868921]

>>20868894
a lot of them are escaping to south america nowadays

[Anonymous No.20869028]

>>20868883
Only America not acquiring new colonies confuses me, but it's arguable this has happened. It just might be that the way it has happened is more subtle and less visible.

[Anonymous No.20869032]

>>20868883
>implying 1910 USA is anything like 2022 USA
You are so far removed from the truth and the fact America still rejects Bismarck tier Socialism is the most obvious indication of that.
America is its own concoction of Jewish+Black+Med+Native+Rootless Mongrels.
Vestiges remain, but Fastianism is no longer a historical aspect of the USA.

[BulgarINFJ No.20869039]

>>20866823
try to become the next Caesar

[Anonymous No.20869064]

>>20869032
What the formless does at this point matters almost not at all. The tendency among a handful of people is the same.

[Anonymous No.20869138]

>>20868869
France: Gaulish roman colony whose 18th century revolution was greatly about removing the frankish kings and later Napoleon III LARPing some gaulish pride into France to distinguish it before getting defeated by germans and his capital become a schizo zoo.
Spain: Reconquista movement from greatly “outside” of Spain by elite catholics and later literally was under German (Habsburg) rule again. Just compare even modern day Castellanos to the more endemic Basques and andalusians (neither of which are faustians) and recognize the true Visigoth descendants.
Italy: The place most raped by Germanics out of all. See the modern influential and economic areas, where for example the most prosperous is literally named after the German langobarden tribe that ruled there. Italia Italy is a poverty stricken shithole because it is actually italian and not germanic occupied and imbued by the germanic spirit and blood. The only thing that binds the north and south is the language and the south’s dependance on the norths money. They should desperately be two separate countries if the north didnt take pride in being romanesque.
England: lmao I dont even have to say how they are Germans. They call themselves Angel-Sachsen in Angel-land

[Anonymous No.20869157]

>>20869138
>Italy: The place most raped by Germanics out of all. See the modern influential and economic areas, where for example the most prosperous is literally named after the German langobarden tribe that ruled there. Italia Italy is a poverty stricken shithole because it is actually italian and not germanic occupied and imbued by the germanic spirit and blood. The only thing that binds the north and south is the language and the south’s dependance on the norths money.

Comte de Gobineau tier opinion

[Anonymous No.20869178]

>>20869064
America is a goalless, short sighted, Mammon revering free for all. America fights wars the best but (impressively) thats it. If that strength dissipates the entire system collapses into nothing. No culture, unity or cause to be shared amongst the “americans”. China can come back after almost thousand years of “shortly interrputed” foreign rule, because the people are chinese even if ruled by Mongols or Mandchu, or dominated by English or Japanese. America is as deep at any point as its paper currency is. It is not faustian for sure and the thought is revolting to actual european faustians.

[Anonymous No.20869185]

>>20869157
That’s literally how Spengler writes about these peoples. Find your countries Historical Philosopher to create /lit/ threads for if you dont like Spengler’s point of view.

[Anonymous No.20869200]

>>20869185
the Kingdom of Two Sicilies was quite prosperous before the Italian Unification

[Anonymous No.20869253]

>>20868044
>>20868086
>>20868202
What a fucking brain-dead retard. You've never read a book in your life clearly, let alone Spengler. Why are you even here?

[Anonymous No.20869391]

>>20869178
Ah, that's the problem: You're running off of the Richard Spencer idea, wherein "Faustian Man" is something about "Retaking Constantinople" (a strange thought given that it was never ours to begin with) and bizarre fantasies of some kind of Hegelianism that results in an even gayer version of NATO.

Spengler posits Culture-Civilizations, AKA World Spirits. These are mental entities that exist inside men's heads. They determine how we conceptualize spacetime. "Faustian Man" refers to a specific conceptualization of spacetime (specifically of a vector moving through 3D space while a transcendent and absolute Time ticks along). America is the most Faustian country there is precisely because it isn't held back by archaisms and twee little hobbit holes in the countryside of England. Global financial systems are about as Faustian as you can get. They're a massive mental construct that assigns a multitude of values to literally everything everywhere, and they constantly change according to, you guessed it, a transcendent and absolute Time.

>b-b-but muh amerigoblins
Newsflash bro everyone is an Amerigoblin now. Why do you think Germans and Turks and Frenchmen and Brits call Biden "Mr. President"? Because he is their President. You are one, too. You're actually a really good example of one: totally rootless, zero conception of race, your politics entirely formed based off of products and media consumption.

[Anonymous No.20869602]

>>20869391
>They're a massive mental construct that assigns a multitude of values to literally everything everywhere

this is more of an anglosaxon tradition than anything else

[Anonymous No.20869630]

>20869391
Americans shouldn’t be allowed to post in Spengler threads.

[Anonymous No.20869721]

>>20869178
I think you should just read the book.

[Anonymous No.20869775]

>>20866823
There were a lot of Marxist responses to Spengler back in his day, including some by big names. Why haven't they seen a revival in interest with the recent popularity of Spengler?

[Anonymous No.20870018]

>>20869775
Because history has shown Marxism to be exactly what Spengler said it was — a capitalism of the working class.

[Anonymous No.20870388]

>>20866823
As thou wilt.

[Anonymous No.20870397]

>>20867890
can you explain that concept, please? it sounds interesting

[Anonymous No.20870460]

I guess that this is the dedicated Spengler thread, so I'll drop my question here. Spengler alludes to Incas and the other Andeans as being a high culture, but he never goes into them. Using Spengler's model, what can be said about them? What was their prime symbol?

[Anonymous No.20871085]

>>20870460
Something that encapsulates mountain terraces and long foot paths. Altitude?

[Anonymous No.20871086]

>>20868112

[Anonymous No.20871363]

>>20871086
kek'd

[Anonymous No.20871375]

>>20866843
Engineering and space exploration are dumb.
>>20866997
"Faustian destiny" <-- to have some new horrible group of assholes, but instead of being on Earth they're on Mars. Yippee.
>>20867000
For what? To build more dumb crap, but on Mars or something? Just end it.

[Anonymous No.20871383]

>>20867564
Build some new stupid social order so we can birth people to slog away for it, all under the auspice of a fairy tale, and if you "win" you get to die anyways.

[Anonymous No.20871410]

>>20866823
How about reading a real historian like Toynbee instead of this occultist cue ball?
Spengler mixed actual historical study with unverifiable mystic mumbo jumbo + he had a conservative agenda and hence wasn’t objective in his writing

[Anonymous No.20871471]

>>20866823
read this, be disappointed by your pathetic le based philosopher, move on to actual thinkers

[Anonymous No.20871475]

>>20867000
BLESSED

[Anonymous No.20872063]

>>20870388
who's this?

[Anonymous No.20872095]

>>20867000
based and checked

[Anonymous No.20872098]

>>20871410
Every single writer has an agenda. Toynbee wouldn't exist without Spengler. Spengler had an IQ of 170. You sit at home and livestream videogames. You are a pseud!

[Anonymous No.20872212]

America is a plastic whore, a complete moral and cultural void. It's existence was only ever destined to be a short lived spurt of Capitalistic orgasm. It never had a future or a prayer of establishing itself as a motherland. The "home of the brave" is, in actuality, the daycare centre of the repressed and narcissistic effluent that constitutes its mongrel populus. America, in all its brazen, tacky nothingness is going to hell. How unfortunate that the rest of the world, having made a false idol from such a flagrant gluttonous bully, must be dragged down to Hades along with it.

[Anonymous No.20872502]

>>20872212
To hell or high water...

[Anonymous No.20872505]

>>20872063
That jew crowley

[Anonymous No.20872519]

>>20871085
I was thinking Blood and Rain, though I am more familiar with the North Americans than the southern. The terraced pyramid may point to altitude as you suggested; tall steep mountains and all that. The heights in which the wind (breath, soul) pour forth (rain, blood, body). Would make an interesting physiognomic study for someone dedicated enough, especially the contrast between North and south, plains and forests / mountains and jungles.

[Anonymous No.20872534]

>>20868727
Then the elites really need to let us in poverty know what's going on, hard to coordinate when your only option is reactionary.

[Anonymous No.20872537]

>>20866823
We are supposed to love. Love is why we are created; love god, love our neighbours, love ourselves.

[Anonymous No.20872549]

>>20868833
I like your digits, but not your attitude. Optimism is cowardice, but soul sucking pessimism is stupidity. It will never be over. Faust lives forever, he will rise as a lich and spread his locusts to consume the niggers of the world. I will make it certain.

[Anonymous No.20873125]

sex gifs

[Anonymous No.20873377]

If Faust is the West then who was The Devil that we sign contract with?

[Anonymous No.20873383]

>>20873377
Machiavelli. Maybe even Socrates.

[Anonymous No.20873409]

>>20873377
Machine/electronic knowledge = world power

[Anonymous No.20873425]

>>20873383
>>20873409
not /pol/ jews?

[Anonymous No.20873443]

>>20873425
Only Messianic Jews and their dejected descendants, who turned to secular humanism or sheer psychopathy, are the problem.

[Anonymous No.20873707]

>>20873377
The devil

[Anonymous No.20873727]

>>20867000
>>20867111

[Anonymous No.20873771]

>>20871375
>Engineering and space exploration are dumb
Why? New frontiers means new stories from which to expand our consciousness through.

[Anonymous No.20873776]

>>20871471
Ich nich spich german, summary?

[Anonymous No.20873781]

>>20867000
>Perhaps a future survey of the needs of mankind will reveal it to be thoroughly undesirable that all men act identically; rather, in the interest of ecumenical goals, for whole stretches of human time special tasks, perhaps in some circumstances even evil tasks, would have to be set.
In any event, if mankind is to keep from destroying itself by such a conscious overall government, we must discover first a knowledge of the conditions of culture, a knowledge surpassing all previous knowledge, as a scientific standard for ecumenical goals. This is the enormous task of the great minds of the next century.

[Anonymous No.20873828]

>>20871471
qrd?

[Anonymous No.20873854]

Sometimes it seems to me the only thing left to do is make as much money as possible, but even that seems less and less an option, particularly for those that don't find themselves on that path already by young adulthood.

[Anonymous No.20873856]

>>20866823
Read something that isn’t pseudoscience pseudohistorical bullshit

The fact that people still believe in this mind venom “philosophy” shit like hegel, spengler, deleuze, etc when the scientific method already exists is amazing to me

[Anonymous No.20873862]

>>20866823
Read something that isn’t pseudoscience pseudohistorical bullshit

The fact that people still believe in this mind venom “philosophy” shit like hegel, spengler, deleuze, etc when the scientific method already exists is amazing to me

[Anonymous No.20873884]

>>20873856
>>20873862
You forget to delete your post fag.

[Anonymous No.20873905]

>>20873884
do tell how did he post the exact same post twice within 40 seconds?

[Anonymous No.20873933]

>>20869039
> reads this
> goes back to meaningless low level day job that demands diversity seminars and niceties between spreadsheets

[Anonymous No.20873938]

>>20873905
using two electronic devices, copy and paste what else?

[Anonymous No.20874025]

>>20873938
and what would be the end goal of all this?

[Anonymous No.20874117]

>>20874025
spamming the thread with low effort posts?

[Anonymous No.20874125]

Does spengler consider latin america or the entire american continent to be part of faustian civilization?

[Anonymous No.20874175]

>>20874125
Didn't he say that Latin America was a felaheen people already? They seem to have had their age of Ceasarism already.

[Anonymous No.20874249]

>>20873776
>>20873828

the title is "I envy everyone who lives", it consists of notes to himself from before he was famous (around his early 30s). Reads like a compilation of some incel board, endless pining for women + self-hate for being weak, shy, boring, cowardly and antisocial. And its not just about women, its a totally devastating psychological self-portrait.
Not that I mean to gloat, but it's just curious how with every fucking right-wing tradlarper you find sexual and social frustration right around the corner

[Anonymous No.20874260]

>>20874249
Read the private diaries of Napoleon Bonaparte.

[Anonymous No.20874271]

>>20873854
And it looks like just about everything has reached a point of saturation and maturity.

[Anonymous No.20874278]

>>20874125
>>20874175
I think that's a retarded take. South American hasn't even begun yet.

[Anonymous No.20874303]

>>20874260
What about them?

[Anonymous No.20874369]

>>20874117
there is no way That is the most efficient way to do that though, now is it?
You make no sense and dont want to admit you incorrectly assessed the initial situation

[Anonymous No.20874382]

>these fucking posts
most of you havent read the Book and most havent even read Faust!
Why do you morons have the urge to vomit your idiotic wikipedia opinions and mimicked questions here?

Fuck off back to your favorite video game or tv show or annoying fucking losers.

[Anonymous No.20874431]

>>20874125
He conceded that America, as in the United States of America, was Faustian, which seems strange at first given how a culture-civilization is intimately bound up with a particular landscape, but makes sense once you consider the timing of the peopling of America (close to 1800, the dawn of Faustian civilization). In a certain sense, America is a pseudomorphosis over North America, but Americans cannot be a pseudomorphosis. It follows the same would be true for Canada, Australia, etc. South America is a little different for a number of reasons. I don't think he ever says it's Faustian, but Spain was. Spanish/Portuguese America could probably be regarded as analogous to something like Greek colonies in the Mediterranean. Both belong to the culture-civilization, but on the fringes of it, lacking a particular Destiny of their own. The Caudillo is notable for the Caesarism impulse.

[Anonymous No.20874577]

>>20873938
>>20874025
>>20874117
I was posting with internet, thenit said it didn’t work so I switched to LTE and it posted, then I saw it worked the first time, kept trying to delete my post but wouldn’t let me even though I swear it had been 45 seconds, probably because I was trying to delete on LTE the post I made on wifi and vise versa, couldn’t figure out which was which, gave up.

[Anonymous No.20874595]

>>20874577
>>20874369
>samefag
imagine being so pathetic you feel the need to make up such a retarded story to “save face” on an anonymous image board.

[Anonymous No.20874605]

>>20874595
? not even that guy but what's there to even save face about, he just doubleposted by accident. there's no cui bono in that, he has no reason to care

his story seems likely enough but i admit i skimmed it. mainly just don't get why it's even an issue, what would he be saving face about?

[Anonymous No.20874607]

>>20874595
That’s literally what happened though spengler schizo

[Anonymous No.20874651]

>>20873933
Mart?

[Anonymous No.20874783]

What's a faustian civilization anyway?

[Anonymous No.20874835]

>>20874783
The collective Western nations, i.e. Germany, the United Kingdom, France, and The United States of America.

[Anonymous No.20874838]

>>20874835
Why the term, though?

[Anonymous No.20874859]

>>20866823
>>20866843
>>20867000
civtards are retarded and hopeless

[Anonymous No.20875007]

>>20867197
The Samurai were not Faustian and didn't live according to the Bushido in reality.

[Anonymous No.20875224]

Spengler never talk deeply about other civilization before right?
can anyone tell me more about prime number of each civilizations?
and the reasons why russia culture never develop their cultural expression through architect?

[Anonymous No.20875238]

>>20875224
As far as I'm get.
>infinite space
Faustian westerner want to created infinite among of possibility creations.
>The body and shape
greece and roman are sculpture autistic
>Enclosed dome
Abrahamic saw the sky as dome while Modern Western see it as endless space
>All-devoring cosmic cycle
Self explanatory
>Sumerian
>Chinese
>Indian
I don't get these one.
And lastly where is African culture?

[Anonymous No.20875422]

So should I learn to code or not?

[Anonymous No.20875432]

>>20874125
>>20874175
>>20874783
>>20874835

[Anonymous No.20875447]

>>20875432
>SEA
I'm seafag myself and I always wonder how would spengler think about this region due to how much influence both China and India (Mainly buddhism) come into this place.
Does this count as India or China civilization? or are they like North and South america that it kind of have these feeling but not entirely like the core culture.

[Anonymous No.20875465]

>>20875447
it could be a indic/chinese syncretism, either that or straight up fellaheen

[Anonymous No.20875502]

>>20875465
fallaheen?
also yes I would argue that it might syncretism between Chinese and Indian culture from the perspective of mainlander with influence of buddhism and chinese culture.
Don't know about island SEA but I heard they were kind of tribal and muslim or something.

[Anonymous No.20875555]

>>20873377
Checked, and this >>20873409
We pay to play the human way.

[Anonymous No.20875604]

>>20868690
No, Technocrats are to my eye mostly soulless, Proto-Caesars maybe. That being said, Napoleon was practically a peasant when he first started, greatness could come from anywhere, we need merely keep our eyes open.

[Anonymous No.20875621]

>>20875604
>That being said, Napoleon was practically a peasant when he first started

the french monarchy granted his family the title of lower nobility when they annexed corciga, so he wasn´t a "peasant", his dad was an important political figure in the island

[Anonymous No.20875702]

>>20875621
Yea I fucked that up lmao

[Anonymous No.20875803]

>>20868819
Life itself

[Anonymous No.20875812]

>what are we supposed to do?
>we
>supposed to
>do
Huh?

[Anonymous No.20875873]

>>20875604
So you think technology will go away before Caesarism or what?

[Anonymous No.20875893]

>>20874838
Faust is a character from old medieval myth, most notably featured in Marlowe’s Dr. Faustus and Goethe’s Faust. The premise is basically that Faust is a striver but bored with normal pursuits so he makes a deal with the devil for otherworldly power. Spengler called it Faustian because he thought Faust encapsulated the tragic essence of Western culture in the same way Prometheus did for the Classical.

[Anonymous No.20875914]

>>20875812
what would ted think about spengler?

[Anonymous No.20875918]

>>20875447
Cultures and civilizations are anthropological concepts that are in flux. During the extensive phase of a civilization, an otherwise foreign land could be blanketed over by another civilization. America is a perfect example. It’s a totally different continent. Another example is Italy. 100 BC Italy was decidedly Classical, but 1000 A.D. Italy decidedly Faustian. At the time of his writing not that much was known about SEA other than at one point or another it had been touched by an extensive Chinese civilization and an extensive Indian civilization. The model, if we can call it a model, is not meant to be comprehensive. You don’t need every plant to observe the basic life cycle of a plant. A few of them will do.

[Anonymous No.20875968]

>>20875893
>because he thought Faust encapsulated the tragic essence of Western culture in the same way Prometheus did for the Classical.

same shit, western civ started in ancient greece

[Anonymous No.20875969]

>>20874249
And Isaac Newton was a lifelong virgin schizoid, what's your point?. Innovative ideas often come from unusual people at the fringes of society.

[Anonymous No.20876106]

>>20875968
https://youtu.be/3fj9A6tjwYQ

[Anonymous No.20876166]

>>20866823
just like kick back and have a great time

[Anonymous No.20876295]

>>20866823
Wait two more centuries to see what kind of transformative processes have befallen western civilization. It hasn't settled down yet at all. Western people have yet to abandon cynic cosmopolitanism and become mature peoples, with a pragmatic ritual and spiritual template. There's still turmoil with global affairs, an uncertain economic model, sustainability issues, striving for new inventions and systems which would combat the still present nihilism.

If you want to know what's next, just talk to a Hasidic Jew, or rural Chinese, Arab, Indian etc etc
These people have all their problems solved yet no novelty factor in their lives. If there is any, it's from the outside.
Until the day white people start forming bride markets like the aforementioned people (which will happen) you can't say it's over

[Anonymous No.20876387]

Reunite with God and manifest your true will. Unless you are a coward and spend the rest of your life living through the eyes of brave men that came before you.

[Anonymous No.20876499]

>>20866843

there is nothing out there tho

[Anonymous No.20876643]

>>20866823
whatever u want brah

[Anonymous No.20876967]

>>20868265
Atheism is quite gay desu.

[Anonymous No.20876990]

>>20874249
>tells us to move on to actual thinkers
>he picks thinkers based on gossip-like scandal from someone venting to their diary, rather than their ideas
You sound like a woman.

[Anonymous No.20876996]

>>20873862
The scientific method can't properly examine all forms of knowledge, and you're a pants-shitting retard for thinking so.

[Anonymous No.20877010]

>>20874249
>Reads like a compilation of some incel board, endless pining for women + self-hate for being weak, shy, boring, cowardly and antisocial.
He is literally like me.

[Anonymous No.20877057]

>>20874125
>>20874431
Latin America is the archetype of the post-cultural ahistoric mode of a civilization, in Spengler. And this is in two different ways.
Modern academics and social scientists are aghast at a Spenglerian perspective (if they were to know what it was), but their relevant research on LatAm more or less agrees with analysis. There really are no 'politics' as we see it. Things happen more or less in aimless cycle and stasis. Criminal classes grow and power, then shrink. Populist outsiders arise, take power, and fail. Problems grow, and they contract (such as gang wars and cartel actions that will rapidly deflate). None of it is really bound to high politics, and corruption is basically constant. There are no political institutions as such, and every attempt to solve problems here inevitably come from outside. A lot of great changes in LatAm are purely external (cartel power and economic export vanishing within years when conditions change outside the country). It's like a machine sometimes, things happen because some outside element pulls the levers right. It's probably why LatAm has had so few interstate wars in its post-colonial history and is impotent at high interstate politics (Falklands).
The Brazilian volunteers in WW2 Italy were impotent, and only made strong by American training.
This exemplifies two different phenomenon: mankind outside of historic time even within the vestige of civilization, and the fellaheen (blown out remains of a dead civilization). The many Indios in deep rural places hold some ancient and often idiosyncratic traditions and metaphysical ideas, petrified from the golden age of mesoamerica and a culture once more mature than European. For this reason, though many of them are genetically European and not even indios, I see LatAm as outside of Faustian civilization.

Stuff certainly happens. It's recorded. But it means nothing, and large swathes of time pass in a nation where nothing noteworthy happens. That is, it is a series of incidents of questionable relations. A lot of Imperial Chinese history is like this too.
This is opposed to the United States. Every year and every presidency is relevant. Everything has policy and socio-cultural implications further down the line.

[Anonymous No.20877102]

>>20875447
High Cultures or civilizations are a certain kind of superorganism. They demarcate what it means for a man to be within history. They're based on the principle of potential and actualization. History is bound up by destiny inasmuch as the potentials exists. Other than Destiny, however, we have Incident. Incidents, though they may be in history inasmuch as they are recorded events, or even if not recorded are still things that happened, are outside of history inasmuch as they are outside of the true drama. They are aimless, whereas those events within the destiny of potential are fateful.
Just because a large gathering of people with language and the implements of civilization exist, and they themselves are as intelligent and capable as those peoples in history, does not mean they will produce much of history or participate in the Destiny idea. This is because the potentials are not there. The reason great art, politics, and science often happens in explosive periods of intensity is because the potentials are there to be suddenly grasped and actualized.
There are incidents in civilization, too. It was purely incidental that Octavian won the civil wars in Rome. It was destiny inasmuch as he was actualizing the potentials, but this could be done by someone else. It already had begun with Sulla much earlier, then proceeded with Caesar, and eventually Octavian. There were nearly a dozen men playing the one role of the "Caesar-man."
Many centuries happened in ancient Germany and Europe where little noteworthy things happened, until they participated in the drama first in Classical civilization, and then through themselves in the birth of Faustian high culture.
This brings us to SEA, or places like Africa. Stuff happens, yes. Books are written, and events take place. But they are aimless (or incidental) and only rooted in destiny if connected to the potentials of a high culture.

[Anonymous No.20877113]

Stop wasting your time. Become an atheist materialist antinatalist and exit this pointless toil and misery. Any of your seethe is cope. Cope and seethe.

[Anonymous No.20877139]

Spengler's morphology should be imagined like a role-playing activity or a theater play. Not surprising, since he was inspired by Nietzsche's Birth of Tragedy. Spengler tried to be a playwright, at some point.
In a play, you have roles and then actors. The roles come from the script, the actors fulfill that role.
In a high culture, certain archetypes arise. Not because they're born, necessarily, but because that culture has certain potentials that are being actualized. When the potential comes for a Socratic man or a Caesar man or an Alexander man, an actor or an individual person might actualize that potential. In some cases, this might be fulfilled by multiple people. And, if they fail in a sense of personality, this potentiality is actualized anonymously.
In our case, we have no true equal to Socrates. We have several types fulfilling that role. We have Rousseau, Voltaire, and other such men. In a sense, we do have a Plato (Goethe) and Aristotle (definitely Kant) and Alexander (Napoleon). But in many cases, this might happen anonymously.
In this sense, we might still have great artists fit for a different age. I'm sure there's someone living that's got the skill of Rembrandt or Beethoven, but the potentiality isn't there for something new, and for that artist to live out that role. It's already been played. And the originality is depleted, the potential exhausted. That great artist is incidental, rather than bound by destiny. This is why high art is essentially finished for the west, and perhaps philosophy, and maybe soon even science and technology.
At least this is true as far as the high culture is concerned. We do each have a private destiny, but this is mysterious and beyond us. That is, Platonic, not Aristotelian. Of Goethe, rather than Kant. To scrutinize it systematically (as in the mathematical world of the become, rather than the becoming) will give us randomness.

So looking for the American or European Caesar almost misses the point. Expecting an exact kind of thing to come along to solve or exacerbate the problem misses the point. What happens is the potentials grow. We always have men of certain ambitions, from scientific, to philosophical, to political. The time is coming for a certain potential: that of a Caesar. First had to come the birth of the metropolis.
May this give you hope for freedom. Where is your potential? Must you be a fact-man to live up the destiny of a fact-man? No. See Octavian reading omens at Actium, or Sulla taking heed the words of soothsayers. Play your role, but let the role play the actor. Be Caesar, with the soul of Christ.

[Anonymous No.20877188]

>>20877139
>We do each have a private destiny, but this is mysterious and beyond us.
Why?

[Anonymous No.20877218]

>>20876990
fair enough, it was an ad hominem and meant as such. The problem with Spenglers "ideas" is that theyre self-admittedly arational, unscientific, more like esoteric insights that you either "get" therefore agree with, or dont get therefore criticize.
Discussion of ideas based on arbitrary analogies and guesses of the true nature of being is a pretty pointless exercise. You know, culture is actually like my ass because its based on a unappetizing waste-producing center surrounded and hidden by soft fleshy cushions. If you find that analogy profound, have fun with Spengler.

[Anonymous No.20877269]

>>20877218
>Discussion of ideas based on arbitrary analogies and guesses of the true nature of being is a pretty pointless exercise.
Analogies aren't pointless, and in this case not 'arbitrary,' when they're a principal form of observation. This is especially true of anything which studies life. Words like 'herd,' 'talon,' 'predator,' or 'prey' are words which express analogous function. The fact that you use the word analogy as such tells me enough, that you don't know what you're talking about and if you read the introduction to vol. 1 of the Decline of the West, you certainly didn't process it. Though I'm sure you felt very glib and clever writing your trite critique, such critiques are pointless and arbitrary when you don't possess the simple intellect to process the text you're criticizing.
You think it's about analogies of different cultures throughout time and space. What Spengler is more interested in is homology, like that of Goethe, and he says as much on the difference between the two. The gills of a fish are analogous to the lungs, but they're not homologous. They perform a similar function, but they're not actually the same kind of organs. This applies to a lot about studying the body of organisms, a credible idea Spengler applies to human cultures. And he does so in a way far more clear-headed than what most historians search for in analogy, coming up with arbitrary definitions for ideas like 'culture,' 'city,' 'tribe,' 'religion,' or 'civilization.'

[Anonymous No.20877715]

>>20866843
The real problem with this book is that no one reads it when they are 17. They wait until after they've got the English degree from a State school and $50K in student loan debt.

[Anonymous No.20877735]

>>20877188
In layman's terms, he believes we all have a Destiny, but not everyone feels it, believes in it as such, nor does everyone have a destiny of world-history proportions. He thinks Destiny is the other side of the coin to the causality principle, which is everywhere in natural science, and which like natural science is unknowable but observably imminent in the world.

[Anonymous No.20877785]

>>20875873
No I think the future Caesar will have to wrangle the Technocrats toward a greater goal. It'll be the same shit with bankers, trying to get them to see beyond their greed for the benefit of History, or otherwise forcing them.

[Anonymous No.20877790]

>>20877785
But how would a present-day ruler necessarily not be a technocrat? The job is by nature impersonal as well. It's doubtful a Caesar would lead a charge in person as if he were Teddy Roosevelt, who probably deserved to be mentioned in the book as much if not more so than Cecil Rhodes.

[Anonymous No.20877797]

>>20877790
To my eye a Technocrat is just an industrialist or a financier. It isn't impossible for one to become a Caesar, but the position is de facto against any real unity which is not aimed at opening new markets for exploitation. Even if a Technocrat becomes a Caesar, he'll still have to wrangle with the others who will attempt to stop him since accruing money is not his goal, using it is.

[Anonymous No.20877800]

[Anonymous No.20877803]

>>20877800

[Anonymous No.20877804]

>>20877797
A technocrat ruler would be someone who deploys technical experts to manage the various aspects of society. I don't see how a ruler of this civilization could be anything other than a technocrat.

[Anonymous No.20877808]

>>20877803
Why did he think Hebbel was significant? I had never even heard of him before I read this book.

[Anonymous No.20877822]

>>20877808
retard

[Anonymous No.20877826]

>>20877822
Do you want to at least attempt to answer the question or would that be too difficult?

[Anonymous No.20877833]

>>20877804
Men are not machines. That being said, I am under the impression that a Technocrat is himself a technician. Given our highly technologized world and 'the machine' of bureaucracy, 'technical' experts will be indispensable, so in this sense, sure, they'll be a Technocrat. But I don't think it's necessary for the Caesar to be an engineer, though given the current zeitgeist, it wouldn't surprise me.

[Anonymous No.20877846]

>>20877833
Going back to my question though - is there glory in it? There is obviously glory in a Roman emperor that is on the battlefield with his soldiers. Is there glory in a leader that fires off missiles from a secure bunker and has meetings behind a 30-foot table a la Vladimir Putin?

[Anonymous No.20877860]

>>20877846
Glory is at this point, in my opinion, irrelevant. Jedermann will clamour for it, of course, so there will be many propaganda machines convincing them of his greatness, and it may make an appearance in personal motivation, but ultimately I don't care if the Caesar is showered in laurels or not. I only care for the extension of Faustian Man beyond this terran cage, and the obliteration of those who would oppose it. I want to see the Will-to-Infinity manifest.

[Anonymous No.20877864]

>>20877846
>>20877860
Which is to say, success to me is more important than glory.

[Anonymous No.20877877]

>>20877833
>>20877860
The Caesar figure will not present itself in a mere man for that would be un-faustian. The AI singularity will bring faustian technics to its apotheosis.

[Anonymous No.20877885]

>>20877877
Checked and kek'd. I can see it now: Caesar in hyper-reality. Neo?

[Anonymous No.20877910]

>>20877860
But then it's a question of motivation. The Caesar you get could just be another privateer that sees the world as spoil for his, and only his, coffers.

[Anonymous No.20877913]

>>20877885
Am I the only one here who actually read the books?

Faustian technics goes beyond all constraints into infinite and infinitesimal dimensions.

[Anonymous No.20877926]

>>20877913
The essence of Faustianism is also striving for the impossible. Again, the IMPOSSIBLE. Western technics is nearly complete and most of the innovations since the dawn of the internet have been neat tricks but nothing really civilization-changing. Henry Ford made the car a civilization-changing technology. Elon Musk just made a cool electric car. Everything is about power and politics from here and on out and those who don't see that clearly are delusional or romantics.

[Anonymous No.20877949]

>>20877926
In the present phase, new forms are yet to be discovered. Faustian art however, has begun its period of standardization and reduction to mathematical formulas.

[Anonymous No.20877957]

>>20877949
I don't think those forms can or will be technological forms. Art has long been standardized with few exceptions in my mind.

[Anonymous No.20877971]

>>20877957
Music is the exception. Contrapuntal techniques and the properties of harmonic progressions have yet to be catalogued into a complete system.

[Anonymous No.20877976]

>>20877926
>Elon Musk just made a cool electric car.
Elon Musk wants to chip people's brains and make us all techno-telepaths. Will he achieve that, is it even possible? I don't know, but it seems clear to me that his civilization changing idea isn't the electric car. The question is if it is realisable or not.

[Anonymous No.20877985]

>>20877976
It's not. And even these are purely logistic problems. The brain implant sounds innovative until you consider what a smartphone is, and the smartphone sounds innovative until you consider what a computer is. These are innovations along strictly logistical lines. What's left to do is basically work out problems of logistics and efficiency, I think. Real creative innovations have not occurred for a while, but I am ready to admit that I don't have the mind of an innovator. I've never been interested in engineering or business as anything other than money, so I don't speak from personal knowledge, but just my own observations.

[Anonymous No.20877989]

>>20877985
And it's probably worth saying that as you move from a picture of economic prosperity to the economic crisis, logistical problems quickly transform from changing the type of light bulbs to keeping the sort of light bulbs you've managed to get, to simply keeping the lights on.

[Anonymous No.20878008]

>>20877989
Well you seem to be judging the ideas on their seeming spontaneous genesis. If linking people up so we experienced each other's minds was something that ever came about I can't see how that wouldn't drastically alter civilization, probably make it unrecognizable. Just look at the shift in culture that happened from landline to smartphone, then the introduction of apps completely changed our courtship models. And it isn't like there were not antecedents to what Henry Ford did either.

[Anonymous No.20878051]

>>20878008
I see these things as building on previous innovations. I simply believe we're at a point where there is not much left to build, but rather to refine. People working in technological innovation have always been motivated by money, but after the dot com bubble, you see money shift to the main focus. People start software companies, not because they're innovative, but because they get equity and the companies get high valuations. Look at the utter failure Meta is, and this is something that was spoken about in science fiction as an inevitability not that long ago. I just think we're reaching the technical peak. People increasingly are not even interested in these things. They've started to despise them. There is an impulse towards luddism that was not as pervasive as it was even 20 years ago.

[joycenigg !!0QXLZ1U+nfs No.20878052]

>>20866823
Endure to get gratificagion, or just stop enduring if you fear pain. You have to chooz

[Anonymous No.20878126]

>>20877913
>>20877926
Sure, infinite expansion, but as the man said there are limits even to this. I visualize the Faustian infinity as a logarithm, stretching toward 0 and yet never reaching it.

[Anonymous No.20878131]

>>20877910
His motivations may very well be entirely irrelevant, all that matters is the function he performs.

[Anonymous No.20878143]

>>20878131
Of course we'll only know if the Genghis Khan that appears is a Caesar afterwards, better start fixing the deck.

[Anonymous No.20878152]

>>20878051
Second religiousness?

[Anonymous No.20878162]

>>20867000
>NOO MY GLOBOHOMO UTOPIA IS ACTUALLY TOTALLY BASED AND FAUSTIAN!!
we do not negotiate with anglos

[Anonymous No.20878172]

>>20878162
Way to misunderstand you nigger. Stop coming here just to shitpost.

[Anonymous No.20878183]

>>20878152
Has nothing to do with technics and lies in the distant future anyway. The second religiousness in Rome was the period from the Imperial cult to the Church Fathers.

[Anonymous No.20878186]

>>20869185
Why would anyone who isn't retarded concern themselves with vapid historicism? Spengler is just sophistic.

[Anonymous No.20878189]

>>20869630
Spengler threads should be banned.

[Anonymous No.20878200]

In my mind, the single biggest problem with Spengler is post-war colonization. Logically, the United States should have expanded its territories.

[Anonymous No.20878206]

I regret the last 4 years so fucking much. This was such a damned mistake.

[Anonymous No.20878216]

>>20877985
isn't the implant mainly supposed to help paraplegics and the development of bionic limbs?

[Anonymous No.20878403]

>>20878200
>Guam
>Puerto Rico
>Panama canal
>Various other islands in the Pacific
Other attempts like Vietnam and Korea as well, though largely failures. Banana republics

[Anonymous No.20878483]

>>20878403
Not colonies

[Anonymous No.20878497]

>>20878200
yeah, look how much Western Civilization controlled before WW2

[Anonymous No.20878500]

>>20878497
How is South America a part of the western civilisation at that time

[Anonymous No.20878502]

>>20878500
because it is

[Anonymous No.20878505]

>>20878502

[Anonymous No.20878511]

>>20878505
present day

[Anonymous No.20878512]

>>20878497
I think you need to look at it on a national basis, but then what you see is the loser(s) of world war 2 are forced to decolonize while winner(s) end up not expanding colonies and in fact embrace and promote decolonization. The United States has expanded its network of military bases but these are not really colonies. An oilfield in Angola is part of a colony. A small naval training facility in Guam is not.

[Anonymous No.20879922]

>>20867564
>What we need is my cringe racist ideas that do not blend with christian thoguht

[Anonymous No.20880270]

>>20878200
Does it have to be on paper or in practice? Because all of Europe is basically an American colony. Same can be said for much/most of the world. Just look from where a nation imports its customs and entertainment. Or look who's their real military.

[Anonymous No.20880276]

>>20880270
In practice, obviously. Colonies were places public men would go to make their wealth. That’s not what Europe is for Americans today. Just because European countries watch American TV and speak English, it doesn’t make them American colonies.

[Anonymous No.20880432]

>>20880276
not the same anon but i see the relationship between the US and Western Europe similar to Macedon and the Greek States after the formation of the Corinth League (their NATO equivalent)

Considering that, you could even argue that Sparta is analogous to Russia

[Anonymous No.20880462]

>>20880432
The timing of the analogy doesn't fit.

[Anonymous No.20880469]

>>20879922
in what way is that racist?

[Anonymous No.20880491]

>>20880462
fuck the timing

[Anonymous No.20880523]

>>20869602
Anglo-Saxons are the most Faustian of Faustian men.

>>20870397
The Internal Proletariat are the men who are true believers in the culture and society that they live in, but reject the specific idiosyncracies of the ruling elite. They seek to create a "Universal Church", which is basically taking the Culture-Civilization and turning it into a full blown religious meme complex. In doing so, they free themselves from the ruling elite: they are no longer members of a S O C I E T Y, but are now True Believers, united by faith. You know how Christians worship Christianity, and the whole point of being a Christian is to interact with Christianity? That is the Universal Church. Christianity itself is the Universal Church of a specific Internal Proletariat that formed in the late Roman Empire. This guy here >>20867564 is doing Internal Proletarianism to a T. Christianity and Socialism (Spengler has a VERY idiosyncratic definition of "Socialism"; the American Revolution was "Socialist") are the reasons why the S O C I E T Y that he lives in sucks, and so he carves off a meme complex of everything that he likes so that he can inhabit that and detach himself from said S O C I E T Y.

Toynbee takes a sort of evolutionary angle to this: he argues that Internal Proletariats are animated by a sense of impending doom, and as such do the carving off in order to save some part of their world for future generations.

>>20870460
We might never be able to know. The Mesoamerican Prime Symbol was the all-encompassing jungle, and their architecture was the stepped pyramid.

>>20878200
It did. Global finance rules everything. Again, Finance is the most Faustian discipline there is. It's a massive system of assigning a value to everything in 3D space, all measured by a transcendent linear Time. Every country on the planet exists to buy and sell to the United States. Go look on Google street view at random parts of India or Iran and you will see men in Western dress desperate to buy Western products; they exist to fuel the Western economy, and are ruled by Western technocrats. So firm is the rule over them that they not only cannot rebel, but they don't even want to. Their minds have been conquered. What is the end goal of "making it" in Russia, China, and India?

Living a Middle Class life in LA.

[Anonymous No.20880537]

>>20880523
>Anglo-Saxons are the most Faustian of Faustian men.

anglo cope

[Anonymous No.20880548]

>>20878008
>>20878051
he will blast ads directly into your brain and normies will call you a weirdo for saying that you want it to stop.

[Anonymous No.20880568]

>>20880432
We are far beyond that. The US annexed Europe with the Marshall plan as Rome annexed Greece after the Makedonian Wars. But the classical world was a far more brutal and barbaric civilization than ours. A formal annexation of Europe by the US has never been necessary nor will it ever be. European political structures will simply atrophy and die as the individual states of Europe become increasingly irrelevant in a globalized imperial world. Even in our time the sovereign Westphalian nation state has already become a distant memory just like the polis under the Roman empire.

[Anonymous No.20880572]

>>20875238
There is no Sub-Saharan High Culture for the same reason that there is no Abbo High Culture.

Anyways, the Sumerians are cardinality. The pyramid is a compass. It doesn't point north, as in referencing an absolute north that exists separate from it, it points north, as in north is defined as the direction that it points.

The Chinese see the world as a giant series of twists and turns, yet united in a harmonious whole. It's a monistic thing.

Indians are similar, but rather than focusing on connected parts that make up a whole they notice the illusory nature of the partedness: there are no parts, just a whole. The architecture being festooned with things that don't actually mean anything on their own demonstrates this.

>>20875224
Russian Man underwent Pseudomorphosis during Petrinism. This is when one kind of man wants to LARP as another so hard that he delays the development of the victim. The Russian Monarchy wanted to pretend to be French, and this stunted the growth of Russian Man. They haven't developed their Prime Symbol yet, but I have argued on here before that the Warhammer 40k Tank Church is a good example of what it would look like.

[Anonymous No.20880629]

>>20877057
>>20877057
retard, every time Latin America got close to a relevant political change or act independently from the bigger picture, globohomo intruded and straightened things under their interests

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Rubber
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor

[Anonymous No.20880638]

>>20880629
So literally what he said. Every time Beanoids tried to make something of their own and rise above the muck of ahistoricity, they got smacked down by Faustian Man's whole "infinite expanse of values" thing, which is what finance is.

I don't see why you called him a retard if you are just agreeing with him.

[Anonymous No.20880655]

>>20880629
>>20880638
NTA but it seems pretty clear to me that South America doesn't deserve to be stationed in some sort of post-historical stage. pre-historical makes more sense. but I suppose that's the point of cyclical history, post often folds back into pre. but calling it a dead culture is retarded.

[Anonymous No.20880702]

>>20880655
>>20880638
>angloids thinking that south america is mexico 2.0

oh i´m laughing

[Anonymous No.20880714]

>>20880702
what does Mexico have anything to do with this?

[Anonymous No.20880721]

>>20880714
anglo-americans have a sort of chip in the brain where everything they know about mexico/central america want to apply to the rest of spanish speaking countries even if they´ve never travelled abroad

[Anonymous No.20880757]

>>20880523
That global finance exists does not mean the world is a colony. That's not what a colony is.

[Anonymous No.20880758]

>>20880721
seems like you're projecting friend.

[Anonymous No.20880765]

>>20880758
seems like you don´t have a counter-argument

[Anonymous No.20880797]

>>20880721
I don't know what you're talking about. On Mexico, I think Porfirio Diaz's infamous quote is enough. I don't sense the same kind of potential in Mexico that I do in South America. Mexico's potential will be realized in America over the course of this century anyway.

[Anonymous No.20880827]

>>20877803
Where can I get clean versions of this anon?

[Anonymous No.20880851]

>>20877808
Maybe it was only describing a type of person and sentiment at that time? Just as we're oblivious to many things that took place in India, we may know too many minor characters in western intellectualism. I'm not acquainted with his works, but it might be the same sentiment as Wagner, despite the difference in impact, importance and/or scale

[Anonymous No.20881146]

>>20866823

[Anonymous No.20881743]

>>20880469
National Socialists from the NSDAP to the DSA are all obsessed with racial hierarchies.

[Anonymous No.20882270]

Bump

[Anonymous No.20882744]

>>20880757
Seems like you don't understand how finance works.

[Anonymous No.20882807]

>>20881743
I'm not

[Anonymous No.20882931]

>>20867000
FAVSTIAN BRÖTHERS...

[Anonymous No.20882991]

>Spengler warns the fatal flaw of Faustian civilization is the endless desire to seek endless amounts of space before exploring space was even imaginable
>anons shilling for space exploration
does nobody see the irony

[Anonymous No.20883022]

>>20882991
can you elaborate?

[Anonymous No.20883079]

>>20874249
>muh sex
tiresome

[Anonymous No.20883413]

>>20877846
You must’ve skipped the passage where Spengler proves at length that Caesar was actually just a shrewd businessman and none of the Homeric springtime “glory” was left in Grecco-Roman culture, it was all just larping and propaganda to cloak their pure economism

[Anonymous No.20883742]

>>20866823
Seethe. Cope.

[Anonymous No.20884093]

>>20867723
>the rise of Silicon Valley exploiters
Those are mostly Indians now. Every race deserves to be self-deterministic and not ruled by another race. These are the people you should be concerned about. Not people whose names you type between three parentheses.

[Anonymous No.20884321]

>>20883413
I must have, so if you can cite the passage I'd appreciate it, but still, I think you miss the point. Both Julius and Augustus were physically present on the battlefield.

[Anonymous No.20884673]

He said America had no Destiny in regard to Western civilization.

[Anonymous No.20884863]

>>20869602
Spengler said double entry bookkeeping and the global finance market are purely Faustian

[Anonymous No.20884922]

>>20867351
you seem to have missed the point entirely

[Anonymous No.20884939]

>>20869178
Yikes. Did you even read the book?

[Anonymous No.20885047]

>>20883079
And yet it's always that, the most important thing, after all, was sex.

[Anonymous No.20885210]

>>20874249
This is a reactionary idea with no backing, just something some retards thought up that historically lead to sexual abuse of young boys in the name of deradicalization. If you're looking to trace everything to sex you can but that doesn't mean it's helpful, especially when you only frame things in that way when it comes to the people you want that to be the case for so it's easier to dismiss their ideas.

[Anonymous No.20885261]

Read The Brigade

[Anonymous No.20885845]

>>20875968
You think that purely because a lot of academics find it useful to start with the basic and popular methods of the Greeks and end with the complex and specialised modern day, perpetuating the Ancient-Medieval-Modern Progressive view of history. As Spengler spends a thousand pages detailing, the West and Classical civilisation have two completely opposed ways of interpreting the world and didn't even temporally overlap.

[Anonymous No.20885882]

>>20866823
Emmigrate to Russia asap

[Anonymous No.20886047]

So is hitler supposed to be the Faustian Hannibal?

[Anonymous No.20886059]

>>20886047
Germany is faustian Rome, Carthage won this time around so we get to enjoy sacrifices to moloch

[Anonymous No.20886064]

>>20868883
Hence why it was the most dynamic and industrious nation in history, but for such a short period of time.
>>20869032
America is the same as it has always been. Sicilians and blacks aren't American.

[Anonymous No.20886229]

>>20884863
i was talking about the obsession about statistics to measure the real world, that´s purely the utilitarian data obsessed angloid in a nutshell

[Anonymous No.20886245]

>>20885845
>As Spengler spends a thousand pages detailing, the West and Classical civilisation have two completely opposed ways of interpreting the world and didn't even temporally overlap.

i see the northern european inferiority complex right there, you can see the continuation of western tradition regarding philosophy, painting, playwrighting, history among others fields which started with the greeks

isn´t a bit ironic too that this same board perpetuates the "starting with the greeks" meme, if West Civilization started in "germany", how come it isn´t "start with the germans" then

who started colonization first? spain or greece? pic related is your faustian spirit

[Anonymous No.20886343]

>>20866823
Do what you must, for I have already won.

[Anonymous No.20886454]

>>20866823
Reminder that faustian culture is derived from classical/roman cultural norms and Early Germanic (NOT GERMAN) customs.

[Anonymous No.20886475]

>>20886047
Both were the last stumbling block in the road to the creation of the universal state in their respective high cultures.

[Anonymous No.20886543]

>>20886245
>painting
>started with the Greeks
Find for me the use of perspective in Greek landscape paintings.

[Anonymous No.20886568]

>>20886543
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apelles#Legacy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeuxis_(painter)#Painting_contest

>At the end of the Roman Empire, Greek art continued to spread in the East (600 AD). Much like the Ancient Romans, Britain duplicated Greek art in architecture and claimed to be the successor to Ancient Greek civilization. Art from antiquity was soon unearthed and rediscovered. Forgotten for centuries, in the 1500’s these fractures of masterpieces inspired Renaissance painters and sculptures like Leonardo da Vinci and Michelangelo. The art of the Renaissance spread the influence of Greek art throughout Europe. During the 1600’s the influence of Greek art extended beyond sculpture and painting. Creating movement, drama, human figurative form, and action of life and living flesh. Artist Peter Paul Rubens has depicted and had been directly influenced by ancient greek art and kept art alive in new forms for centuries of its kind.

https://www.theartstory.org/movement/classical-greek-and-roman-art/

i´m pretty sure there are more examples out there

[Anonymous No.20886624]

>>20886568
Anon that's not what I asked for. I asked for examples of Greek perspective and/or in landscapes. The painters you've linked didn't do this and the 3d paintings in their Wikipedia articles were created by modern Westerners.
Spengler explains that near the end of a culture's spring time there comes a point where the culture realises it's fate and tries to resist it, he cites the Dionysus cult for the early Greeks and for the Renaissance he explains that that since Faustian and Apollinian cultures were so mutually polar to one another, the West took on the aesthetics of Greece and Rome in attempt to resist the motifs of the gothic period. But just because we have roman facades it doesn't mean that we are a continuation of Rome, it means we've taken the outer skin of Classical civilisation and wrapped it around our own culture.
We've also done this because Faustian culture loves old things, we look back at Rome and wish to replicate it not because we ARE the descendants of Rome but because we want a connection to something far older.
I'll ask you again to find me evidence that the Greeks used perspective (the roman perspective doesn't count because none of the angles meet at a single point) and/or landscape painting, as is so common in the West with our obsession with the distant horizon. Not sure when this thread is going to close though.

[Anonymous No.20886649]

>>20886047
In a way, yes. Both Germany and America had the chance to become the Faustian imperium and America won. But our obsession with Hiter also makes him some sort of Sulla, in the sense that he taught our Caesar what tactics work to get the plebs on your side, but also, and most importantly, what kind of excesses should be avoided.

[Anonymous No.20886668]

>>20886624
it´s meaningless your inquiry since most ancient greek art is lost, but the few that remained clearly had an impact in medieval europe and onwards, you can cope with your "they just copied the outer layers" or some bullshit like that, it´s clearly a northern european, specifically german nationalist bias that clouded spengler´s view, same as his opinion that we shouldn´t strive for high art because he himself was a failed artist, a failed playwrighter to be more specific, backed by this book >>20871471


at least someone like Neetszche, a failed pianist/composer, even a failed human being if you view by the lenses of his then contemporaries didn´t take the coward´s way out in projecting his deficiences onto his philosophy and worldview, ironic considering that spengler viewed him as one of his influences

[Anonymous No.20886729]

>>20886668
If you want to accuse me of coping then do as you please, but don't follow it up with "Muh bias" and cite a book you haven't read.
I'm not saying there weren't inherited aspects from hundreds of years prior, monasteries preserved knowledge from the Romans, but by the point where it became useful to village farmers there was a completely different mindset within them that was influenced heavily by the land they were on.
10th century farmers would be spending their resources far more wisely to build small classical temples instead of giant cathedrals, innovating on arch shapes and glass mosaic and unreasonably tall spires. Yet they chose to build the cathedral over the temple. Why? Because they had a different worldview to the Greeks, they saw the world as infinite and ripe for the taking, whilst the Greeks viewed the world as a small cosmos that was held together by indivisible atoms. They weren't aware of this but it was embedded in their psychology.
The Westerner created massive nations stretching across the land whilst the Greek created small city states. The iconic art form of the Westerner is music, which is rarely a point of discussion for the Greeks, whose iconic art form was statue, but even within the Western and Greek depiction of statuary, you can see that a statue like David has a clear facial expression whilst many Greek statues like Phidias' Athena are stoic and emotionless in appearance. These aren't aesthetic differences or improvements they are tied to the existential worldview of the culture that created them.