/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.20673547]

I genuinely don’t understand why this book is so controversial

[Anonymous No.20673549]

>>20673547
literally cites a guy who believed intelligence correlates with dick size

[Anonymous No.20673551]

Because one part of one chapter said something out loud that most people suspect. It even seemed to have a margin of error that would imply you shouldn't take it too seriously

[Anonymous No.20673553]

>>20673547
O. K.

[Anonymous No.20673558]

>>20673547
women and blacks cancelled intelligence as outdated

[Anonymous No.20673564]

>>20673547
Because Marxists don't want to accept the reality genetics are more deterministic of society than they want to you to know.

[Anonymous No.20673579]

You ever read the critical reactions in the evolution and psychology disciplines to Kevin MacDonald's Culture of Critique? People who hadn't even read it were doing backflips to denounce shit that wasn't even said in it

Same with Murray, from what I understand the standard narrative on the Murray and scientific studies of race differences was that in the '80s there was a sudden massive push for political correctness, and a new politicization of race that made a lot of race-related stuff suddenly radioactive. Suddenly things like the Moynihan report, "broken windows" theory, etc. were verboten, you weren't allowed to have any discourse on the black community as in any way the cause of its own misfortunes. By the time D'Souza's book The End of Racism came out in the mid 90s, it was a sort of throwback to what had formerly been normal to talk about in the '70s and early '80s (and even more and more common since urban crime has been rising decade over decade)

Either the intro to The Bell Curve or a more recent commentary on it will talk about how psychology and IQ studies people were just as baffled at the bad reception when it happened, because they had been doing it for ages with no problems, and they continued doing it afterward, just more quietly

It basically became symbolic, is all

[Anonymous No.20673602]

>>20673549
Well dick size correlates with a healthy diet when growing up, and so does intelligence, so it's not wrong to so say intelligence correlates with dick size

[Anonymous No.20673606]

>>20673602
lol

[Anonymous No.20673620]

>>20673602
Is it fair to say an all dick diet correlates with negatively with intelligence since you're so stupid?

[Anonymous No.20673629]

>>20673620
>with negatively with
I'll never live this down

[Anonymous No.20673630]

>>20673620
LMAO

[Anonymous No.20673702]

>>20673547
It's written by a Jew and the left is extremely anti-semitic

[Anonymous No.20673707]

>>20673602
This man is at least slightly more likely to have a physically large head and penis than average. I know this with absolute certainty because the magic of science.

[Anonymous No.20674816]

>>20673547
Given that all inventions and innovations have been largely figured out by lone individual Men in any time and place, this kind of refutes the premise that one rabble of retarded people are less retarded than another rabble of retarded people - or that there's any genetic component to this; as if hard work and study aren't 1000% of how Appius invented the road or the heated floor or the aqueduct, etc. Perversely, less educated people ahave more sense in general than 'very educated' people; I meanactually mentally retarded people are mroe easily able to see logic and don't resist common sense when it's explained to them. I know this because I work with people with neurological impairments and find them far more capable than the average person.

[Anonymous No.20674826]

>>20673547
For the same reason some people believe stores can make meat instead of killing animals and harvesting their meat.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B4M98NTH

[Anonymous No.20675267]

>>20673702
the left are unironically anti-semitic, it's a bunch of dysgenic catholics who should have been aborted if not for the fact they made it illegal

[Anonymous No.20675474]

>>20673547
There seem to be three main avenues of criticism. The first involves asserting that race is a social construct and thereby nothing and everything will track however the author wants it to track. The second calls into question the idea of IQ as an operationalized construct measuring intelligence (this can be subdivided into assertions of just what is actually being measured or even a declaration of the nonexistence of what's purported to be measured). The third questions his sources and makes claims about the rigor (note: this can be piecemeal or according to some aspect of the first and/or second avenue). You should be able to see why these critiques are cope just based on how they go about their business (i.e. imposing their own variety of theory-laddenness and refusing to address the work according to its own project).

It was controversial for two main reasons. First, liberals tend to attach a person's humanity to their level of intelligence (e.g. earned "liberal elite" or even how "uneducated voters" are not only always categorized in polls but often a candidate is derided if s/he scores higher in this demographic). Second, The Bell Curve underscores the hypocrisy of the neoliberal/leftwing ideological agenda by rendering its entirely symbolic gestures overtly meaningless and blatantly cherry-picked. More importantly, its evidence of the impossibility of widespread social programmes based on simple "equity" and vague utopianism.

[Anonymous No.20675934]

>>20673547
Yes you do, because you already posted this thread like 2 weeks ago. Kill yourself.

[Anonymous No.20675940]

>>20673549
Autists generally possess above-average penises due to high prenatal androgen exposure.

[Anonymous No.20675963]

>>20673549
Fpbp

[Anonymous No.20676010]

Okay I haven't seen anyone bring up anything substantive, I can safely assume that anyone who automatically goes IT WAS DEBOOOOONKED are propagandised liberals. Thank you desu.

[Anonymous No.20676050]

>>20673551
What part? What did it say?

[Anonymous No.20676117]

>>20673547
Literally worked for the CIA

[Anonymous No.20676383]

>>20676010
>>20675474
You are based, thank you for your efforts.

[Anonymous No.20676692]

>Have pattern seeking brain
>Notice patterns in data that are uncomfortable
>Alert scientific community in hopes dysgenic practices can be stopped
>get called racist by people who are not scientists

Story of our age.

[Anonymous No.20676704]

>>20673547
it's mostly wrong
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBc7qBS1Ujo

[Anonymous No.20676775]

>>20673549
I am both very smart and have a pretty sizable penis so it checks out.

[Anonymous No.20676784]

>>20673547
>>20676692
Except they didn't use a scientific method and the book was actually a way for the author, a Jewish descendant Jew Yorker, to prove Jewish supremacy by using altered and fabricated data.

[Anonymous No.20676791]

>>20676784
stupid catholic, if i wanted to hear your retarded opinion i would go down to the strip club and ask the pope

[Anonymous No.20676799]

>>20676791
>opinion
Fact

[Anonymous No.20676801]

Both leftoids and rightoids confuse IQ for a measure of human value

[Anonymous No.20677041]

>>20676799
go worship the pharaoh somewhere else you degenerate homosexual

[Anonymous No.20677274]

>>20676784
Every single scrap of data points to the same conclusion. You can not deny it for much longer. The only reason one branch of Jews, Ashkenazi, are overrepresented in higher professions is because they took advantage of the German system. No other sub-group of Jews does as well, just the ones that lived off the back of the Rhine. Every scientist, philosopher, writer, and teacher that reaches the uppermost heights is from this group. It is that, nothing else, which explains their success.

[Anonymous No.20677290]

>>20673564
Why do Marxists get hung up on this? Is it a reaction to natsocs?

[Anonymous No.20677338]

>>20673620
I'm completely right though. You seem to be seething somewhat.

[Anonymous No.20677359]

>>20677290
Because it establishes clear basis for heirarchy, they are against that.

[Anonymous No.20677419]

>>20677359
So you support a jewish-east asian world order?

[Anonymous No.20677432]

>>20677419
Localized heiarchy, why do you immediately assume globalism?

[Anonymous No.20677439]

>>20677419
If math was the most important thing in our life by far, the only thing barely keeping us from all dying horribly I would defer more to east asians than I currently do. I might even want them to have east asian math committees that I largely defer to in these imagined daily math battles.
If subversion was the most important thing...

[Anonymous No.20677523]

>>20673549
Would explain why /lit/ hates it.

[Anonymous No.20677524]

>>20677419
>Maths somehow defeats capacity for organized violence.
>Thats why we all speak Yiddish and Asian languages
>That is why Europe could never defeat foreign powers.

[Anonymous No.20677699]

>>20676704
The only thing that needed to be posted in this thread, but the amount of replies tells you everything you need to know about /lit/

[Anonymous No.20677702]

Then you're genuinely a retard

[Anonymous No.20677708]

>>20673547
people who deny science get really mad when you mention this book

[Anonymous No.20677747]

>>20676704
>>20677699
>shaun
So your source is video-essay by a troon? Pass. At least Taleb has the acumen to talk about the subject.

[Anonymous No.20677779]

>>20677699
Why can't you summarize some criticism? Flipping through it seems like the point of the video is to list all the baddies that believed something bad and also noticed patterns about reality.
>iq tests have cultural bias
Okay but it's a bias towards the kinds of things that are useful in our culture, like being able to understand and follow instructions. The kinds of things we're talking about with the English word intelligence.
It is true that westerner adults score lower than a congolese pygmy child in tests of animal tracking skills. This is not relevant to anything we're talking about like who should be building our bridges.

[Anonymous No.20677798]

>>20676704
>refute this 3 hour youtube video or youre wrong
lmao, i have no clear opinion on the matter so im not a chud but this is stupid

[Anonymous No.20677871]

>>20677779
Am I really going to take time out of my day to condense two hours worth of talking into a comprehensive post so a few retards can feel like they accomplished something by saying >>20677747
>Troon
>>20677798
Or going for the >Words words words
Defense?
If you feel like it watch it, it has timestamps so you can cut it into more digestible parts of 20-30 minutes, if you have a problem with shaun specifically, there are other critiques of the Bell Curve, particularly in Book form which you can read two of which are "Intelligence, Genes, and Success" and "Inequality by Design"
Nice quads btw

[Anonymous No.20677872]

>>20677523

[Anonymous No.20677877]

this is /lit/ not /pol/, pls leave us alone

[Anonymous No.20677876]

>>20673547
When your ideology subsists on lies and deceit, anything revealing the truth is horrendous and opposes your very existence.

[Anonymous No.20677888]

>>20677871
Of course you're not, because you're just lying and attention whoring.

[Anonymous No.20677911]

>>20677888
>answering the question posed in the OP is attention-whoring and lying
lmfao

[Anonymous No.20677932]

>>20677911
You didn't really answer anything, but obviously you're a lying attention whore.

[Anonymous No.20677941]

>>20677932
not even the same person you were originally replying to, but just so you know, you're retarded and a pseud. simple as. no one takes the bell curve seriously that has any background in any related field. the use of stats is flagrantly lazy, there's no part of the book that follows anything approximating the scientific method, and it's just a propaganda piece to cut funding for public programs. cope.

[Anonymous No.20677953]

>>20677911
Retard, you didn't answer shit, you provided a link to a known fabricator and fraud. You have nothing of value to say and likely know nothing about psychometry (Spearman's factor analysis specifically). Your input is worthless, as is the video-essay from a non-statistician/psychologist. Again, see Taleb.

[Anonymous No.20677960]

>reminder that charles murray was at the bilderberg meeting in 2016 and he's a harvard/mit polisci alumnus and a fellow at AEI
no matter what your politics are, unless you're retarded, you won't take this hack seriously

[Anonymous No.20677967]

>>20677953
again, i'm not that person. i think the accusation that the linker was attention-seeking is retarded.

[Anonymous No.20677974]

>>20677941
You are lying, you are fishing for replies because you are seeking attention.

[Anonymous No.20677979]

>>20677974
shit u caught me dude
paranoid retard

[Anonymous No.20677989]

>>20677967
Ok, substitute "you" for "them/they," the point stands. Shaun is not a credible source, and suggesting that his shitty vid constitutes substantive critique is nonsensical.
>troon
Indeed.

[Anonymous No.20678004]

>>20677989
idk who shaun is and idc. simple as. the bell curve isn't science at all, and anyone who defends it is a libertarian retard that just hates any public spending that isn't military

[Anonymous No.20678013]

>>20678004
The left side of the curve sent you this message.

[Anonymous No.20678072]

>>20678013
t. doesn't understand stats enough to know what's wrong with the bell curve
read a real book instead of this drivel, more than anything it's a waste of your time. posting on /lit/ and giving any thought to charles murray is beyond pseud

[Anonymous No.20678080]

>>20678072
Just don't be a retard, it's pretty simple for us real people.

[Anonymous No.20678098]

>>20678080
what confuses me is why this is being discussed on /lit/ of all places. i don't care abt propaganda pieces to push policy, regardless of said policy, and i assumed everyone here, given the flood of nietzsche threads, would at least understand how retarded you would have to be to care at all about this shit.

[Anonymous No.20678099]

>>20677871
You spent the time to make a post. It contained nothing. You could have posted two or three words referencing some part of why you think this video deboonks anything. Something that if I do research I will end up finding the truth of the matter.
Until you say something I'll assume you're not interested in honest inquiry or the truth.
As far as I can tell all the critiques you mention are related to attacking IQ tests as biased or associating the research with baddies. Both is retarded and people doing it don't inspire confidence in their other arguments.

[Anonymous No.20678122]

>>20678098
>ignore facts because nietzsche

[Anonymous No.20678164]

>>20678098
this. why is this thread here

[Anonymous No.20678169]

>>20678122
>thinks the bell curve is “facts”

[Anonymous No.20678212]

>>20678164
>>20678169
>if i just lie it's propaganda it conveniently becomes propaganda

[Anonymous No.20678217]

Race realism is literally the dumbest cope of all time. Even if we accept IQ as a legitimate measure for competence (which it isn't, at best it measures the lack of intelligence, which is what the military designed it for), this kind of bullshit would at best tell you that races, insofar there even is such a thing as 'race' when it comes to a constantly changing organism such as a human, differ in intelligence. It doesn't tell you why one race is necessarily better than another (very practical people tend to not do well when it comes to dumb puzzles, but that doesn't stop them from picking up trades), and it certainly can't tell you why one race is eternally better than another.

So, all in all, /pol/tard cringe, and white trash cope

[Anonymous No.20678237]

>>20678212
>>if i just lie it's propaganda
jfc read a book, stop shitting up this board
>>20678217
this is somewhat true, i agree with the sentiment. the military did not design iq tests tho, even if they use them for the purpose u describe them
iq tests were created by a french guy to measure which students needed the most help, and eugenicists co-opted them to perfect ze racial hygeine of our peepul

[Anonymous No.20678245]

>>20678237
>oh no you disagree with my spurious, unfounded claims, HOW DARE YOU, you must be shitting up the board and you probably don't even read

[Anonymous No.20678255]

>>20678245
what do you the charles murray's purpose was in writing the bell curve? do tell

[Anonymous No.20678258]

>>20678255
think* my b.

[Anonymous No.20678271]

>>20678255
You don't know it, so how about, and this must be fucking rocket science to you, you stop lying about those supposed motives and focus on the message? Oh, but you're just fishing for attention here, never mind.

[Anonymous No.20678275]

>>20678217
Dumbest cope post of all time. Have you ever talked to a person not made of straw?

[Anonymous No.20678284]

>>20673547
it's philosemitic. Hernstein is obviously Jewish and Murray worships Jews.

[Anonymous No.20678291]

>>20678275
I just know that you one read the first sentence and then immediately went 'Nu-uh YOU'.

[Anonymous No.20678295]

>>20678271
he literally outlines the purpose in the last section of the book before the afterword, fucking retard. did u even read the book ur jerking off in here? he explicitly gives policy prescriptions like eliminating welfare and public spending on helping poor ppl, as they must have a lower iq, according to his rigorous and accurate studies that totally followed the scientific method and weren't motivated at all by a bias to look for this conclusion

[Anonymous No.20678302]

>>20673547
As a whole, the book is about the importance of intelligence in everyday life and how it correlates to societal problems/benefits.
Due to one chapter, the difference in the mean score between white and black americans, a whole political shitstorm brewed.
On one side, you had people calling them racists and on the other you had people calling them based racists. In reality, the authors were just continuing the research that was started in the late 60s to see how we can boost general iqs in the population given that 50 million people in the US are below 86iq but as you may guess this kind of research is verboten due to politics.

[Anonymous No.20678310]

>>20678284
retards deciding whether to like the bell curve cuz it says black ppl dumb, or hate it cuz a jew co-authored it, will never not be the funniest breakdown on /pol/

[Anonymous No.20678315]

>>20678291
I read your post, it's the worst kind of masturbatory pointless nothing. You seriously should never post on any subject. I didn't read Bell Curve, heard it's racist.

[Anonymous No.20678321]

>>20678295
Prove the methods faulty, you fucking lying cocksucker. Not everything going against your ideology is false, you prick.

[Anonymous No.20678327]

>>20678321
LMAOOOOO
someone's getting a little angry

[Anonymous No.20678332]

>>20678310
>jew co-authored it
Charles Murray is even more Jewish than Hernstein despite being white. Read this article he wrote or just skip to the last two sentences.

https://www.commentary.org/articles/charles-murray/jewish-genius/

[Anonymous No.20678347]

>>20678327
And there we go with the attention seeking. You got played.

[Anonymous No.20678348]

>>20678332
honestly murray's probably trolling. he knows his audience is a collection of retarded libertarians and neo-nazis (or whatever they call themselves today), and he's just riling them up. i can't think of any other reason he'd write that drivel. i respect it

[Anonymous No.20678360]

>>20678347
i got played? oh no... guys, i think... i think... i think i got played by someone who didn't even read the book he's masturbating to itt.
my guess is u read the section on ethnic differences in iq and think that's what the whole book is abt. anyway, i gotta go to work, so here's a fun fact: did you know dolphins very rarely give birth to multiple calves at a time? the natural world is a wonder.

[Anonymous No.20678362]

>>20678295
>he explicitly gives policy prescriptions like eliminating welfare and public spending on helping poor ppl, as they must have a lower iq, according to his rigorous and accurate studies that totally followed the scientific method and weren't motivated at all by a bias to look for this conclusion
i don't believe they do, actually, unless you can post a specific quote. I believe they're against affirmative action and for providing a meaningful, productive opportunities within a stable society for the less cognitively gifted - reinforcing marriage and work, rather than incentivising single parenthood and welfare dependency:

"We will not try to elaborate on these arguments here. We leave the income issue with this: As America enters the twenty-first century, it is inconceivable that it will return to a laissez-faire system regarding income. Some sort of redistribution is here to stay. The question is how to redistribute in ways that increase the chances for people at the bottom of society to take control of their lives, to be engaged meaningfully in their communities, and to find valued places for themselves. Cash supplements need not compete with that goal, whereas the social welfare system that the nation has developed in the twentieth century most definitely does. We should be looking for ways to replace the latter with the former."

[Anonymous No.20678366]

>>20678360
Your claimed guess is a lie, because you are just whoring for attention.

[Anonymous No.20678367]

Is he right /lit/?

[Anonymous No.20678405]

>>20678362
last post itt, i seriously have to go to work lol
i probably should not have used the word "explicitly," as much of the policy prescriptions are implicit. but even in that quote, he argues that the social welfare system should be eliminated (and replaced by cash supplements, although he says he won't elaborate, so... he could mean a lot of things, to say the least).
he acknowledges that redistribution is here to stay (begrudgingly, clearly), and uses some flowery language to advocate for gutting said redistributive systems. i haven't read the bell curve since 2016 when it was memed everywhere, but iirc he pretty much believes, as u said, welfare encourages poor single women to have more babies, and thus is undesirable. he dresses it up in the language of sympathy, but it's pretty clear what his problem is with that. i don't think he cares much about the poors engaging "meaningfully with their communities," and if he does, he wants it far away from him. remember, his thesis is that there is a strong link between genetics and iq, and iq and income, thus between genetics and income. it's modern eugenics he's proposing. if you're into that, cool, but i find it terrifying.

[Anonymous No.20678417]

>>20678366
ok. read a book :)
also, notice how i engaged in good faith when someone responded to me in good faith. really make u think...

[Anonymous No.20678418]

>>20678417
makes* holy shit what is my problem today

[Anonymous No.20678424]

>>20673549
It unironically probably does

[Anonymous No.20678537]

>>20678417
Lying for more attention again.

[Anonymous No.20678686]

>>20678405
your entire post is basically to treat whatever he writes as disingenuous. "he doesn't really mean that" "begrudging" "I don't think he cares". I think he does care. anyone who spends the amount of time he has writing about the poor and lower class must care. it's pretty easy to live in a gated community and ignore the disaster that modern welfare states combined with neo-liberal economics have created - 40% of the working age population not even looking for work, 70% of african americans raised by single mothers etc etc. but its fine.

[Anonymous No.20678756]

>>20673549
big dick, low IQ -> hypergamous society where women mate with the strongest and most charismatic males

smaller dick, high IQ -> society where female reproduction is restricted and high status, high IQ males get first pick

first group: Africans
second group : Jews, East Asians

This is somewhat apparent in apes, with chimps being more patriarchal/have small dicks and bonobos being more matriarchal/have big dicks.

Humans have pretty big dicks for apes.

[Anonymous No.20678785]

>>20678686
cool assumptions, i actually come from a single mother who depended on welfare, which is why i find all of this discussion disingenuous. charles murray is a fellow at AEI, and that alone makes me distrust him. you’re right that i don’t take him at his word, and since you do, we can’t really have a fruitful discussion lol. i appreciate that you’re not just calling me attention-seeking like that other guy tho

last thing i want to say is that welfare is absolutely helpful in the majority of cases, the problem is that it needs to be supplemented by things like work programs and mandatory drug testing, etc, and, at least in the us, this isn’t the case everywhere. i was lucky, my mom had to quit heroin and get a job in order to get welfare, and i was fairly young when this happened, but without the welfare and food stamps, she would’ve been left to the wolves, and my life would not be what is. this is just a personal anecdote, but i’m just trying to say i’m not some white coastal liberal with no skin in the game. from my perspective, murray views me as lesser, genetically, bc of my class and race, so i don’t care for his work. he may not use the word “lesser,” but it’s clear, to me, what he means. ik you disagree, i just wanted to give my perspective as i’m sitting on the bus rn with nothing else to do

[Anonymous No.20678797]

>>20678217
Faggiest post in the threat.
>muh hueman
Whites invented everything relevant because culture is downstream from race.

Wheres that ugandan space program you monkey-brained nigger of everyone is the same why does everyone want to come to white countries.

Get fucked. The time for arguments is over. I want violence. You people will never grow the balls to open your eyes.

Soon.

[Anonymous No.20678800]

>>20678785
Do you think all these broad ideas related to IQ distributions being true rests on the credentials of this guy?
If this guy turns out to be a murderer and rapist will that make congolese pygmies better bridge builders?

[Anonymous No.20678816]

>>20678797
whites aren't a single race. finns didnt invent much and theyre the highest iq in geographical europe, despite not being europeans, who invented much more and were much more cultural. conclusion: culture is stupid, art is stupid. you cant refute it bitch.

[Anonymous No.20678825]

>>20678800
of course not lol, but this thread is abt this one book in particular, and so that’s what i was talking abt.

if there were a thread abt race and iq in /lit/, for whatever reason, i wouldn't post. i have zero interest in the subject. bc i read this particular book, i decided to chime in. as for congolese pygmies… have u ever built a bridge?

[Anonymous No.20678838]

>>20678756
But Jews aren't very patriarchal, at least not in modern times. They're very feminist.

[Anonymous No.20678850]

>>20678825
You talk like a fag and your shits all retarded. Spell out your words if you want people reply to your faggotism. Fucking newfaggotry. My advice is to lurk for 2 years minimum. That means, do not post on this site. Dont open your dumbass whore mouth. Just lurk and learn you dumb nigger.

[Anonymous No.20678877]

>>20678838
Only until very recently. I mean look at the old testament and how orthodox jews love now. Their women only became feminist when they were let out of the Shtetl.

[Anonymous No.20678883]

>>20678877
*live now

[Anonymous No.20678885]

>>20678850
been on this board for years lol and i’ve probably read more than you
you seem angry

[Anonymous No.20678914]

>>20678885
You are lying.

[Anonymous No.20678915]

>>20678877
Even Orthodox Jews have female rabbis now.

[Anonymous No.20678953]

>>20678825
>have u ever built a bridge?
I have enough experience with the relevant engineering and math for a simple bridge. These things are a priority in my culture and my extended family tends to be better at those kinds of things than average. Affinities to skills probably have genetic components and that will come out as the kind of graphs the book presents. The principle we have to work from to explain our differences even from monkeys is small initial genetic differences cause the large perceived differences. I think a lot of the emergent differences in results can be attributed to these kinds of small variations in affinities and preferences.
I wouldn't go to the jungle and presume I should be able to get a job as a tracker. If there was a group of "progressive" pygmies saying I should they would be undermining the pygmy way of life, brain draining my country and not helping anyone. Just like the progressives in the west importing engineers from Africa because "we're all the same".

[Anonymous No.20678963]

>>20678914
I am not.

[Anonymous No.20678981]

>>20678885
And you seem like a CUNT since you use standard male shaming tactics for online discussion.

>I read more than you
Dont fear the person that has read a thousand books, fear the person you has read one book a thousand times

>women
truly the niggers of the sexes

[Anonymous No.20678985]

>>20678953
look i really don’t care, i’ve heard these exact arguments a million times, they’re not original. if an engineer comes from africa, who gives a fuck as long as they’re a good engineer? usually, the argument at this point becomes about muh culture, ditching all the genetic pseudoscience pretense to the racism. i would respect racists or whatever you call yourself today so much more if they admitted they genuinely just don’t want to be around other racists, and dropped all the lazy arguments about culture and genetics. it would save everyone a lot of time, bc no matter what i say, you don’t care, and vice versa.

[Anonymous No.20678987]

>>20678981
take ur meds jesus christ lmao

[Anonymous No.20678996]

>>20678985
other races* sorry my b

[Anonymous No.20679040]

>>20678985
Why are they coming from Africa? Why does that make sense to you more than I going to Congo to become a tracker?
Who gains power from these massive efforts to undermine national sovereignty? Why wouldn't you care about the most evil murderers in history controlling every aspect of your life and you having no representation in any form to counter anything they decree?
How controlled must your brain be to just automatically reject any hints about this process using lazy pejoratives like "racist"?

[Anonymous No.20679086]

>>20679040
like i said, i know exactly what you believe, you’re not exactly blowing my mind with genius insight into how the world works. and i’m sorry, but this is one time where the word “racist” actually applies, you are literally dividing humanity into races, and discriminating (in the literal sense of the word) the ones you find to be undesirable in your utopian world view. i’m sorry, i just have no interest in race at all, i don’t find it a useful tool when looking at the world.

[Anonymous No.20679138]

>>20679086
>you are literally dividing humanity into races, and discriminating (in the literal sense of the word) the ones you find to be undesirable in your utopian world view
By not going across the planet to import people and paying taxes to teach them to build bridges instead of spending the money on teaching the people in my country, my cousins how to build bridges?
I'm proposing preserving my interests and the interests of my extended family in my representative democracy against the globalist corporations that now own everything including probably your livelihood and the only thing you can say is "durr racism".
Your insane premises aren't helping anyone, least of all Africans. I'm not the one who categorized Africans as undesirable in this conversion. You did because you're a dishonest racist.

[Anonymous No.20679143]

>>20679086
>i know exactly what you believe
You know nothing about anything. The fact you say over and over how much you think you know instead of revealing some of that knowledge is just one of the many clues demonstrating this.

[Anonymous No.20679151]

>>20673547
retards don't like being called retards

[Anonymous No.20679162]

>>20679086
i like people like you because they're the first that get culled by rabid niggers
you're the retarded fish that can't swim fast enough to avoid the shark, I love watching all the webms of niggers spraying some random faggot in muttmerica because that random faggot will be you soon

[Anonymous No.20679195]

>>20679138
>>20679143
holy shit i’ve said a million times now that debate on this is pointless, you’re not owning me or whatever you think you’re doing. i have my view, you have yours. simple as. i have explicitly said multiple times i’m not looking for debate. and lol good one abt me actually being the racist, real clever coming from the one sperging out abt congolese pygmies not being able to build bridges or whatever the fuck.

you think the globalists, many of them jews, are intentionally causing mass migration from third world countries to the west in order to create a global population of mindless sheep that will consoom and not ask any questions ever, like npcs. i think that’s paranoid delusion. now leave me alone or explain your own personal, idiosyncratic paranoid delusion, if i was wrong in my description.

[Anonymous No.20679197]

>>20679162
i am a “nigger” you illiterate retard

[Anonymous No.20679198]

>>20679197
>he things I was referring to african americans exclusively
absolute state of westoid subhumanoids, hurry up and suck a barrel faggot

[Anonymous No.20679202]

Retarded WE WUZ coompost. Try reading De Gobineau.

[Anonymous No.20679205]

>>20679195
>you think the globalists, many of them jews, are intentionally causing mass migration from third world countries to the west in order to create a global population of mindless sheep
Why do you do this? You ignore everything I say and replace it with propaganda you heard about what "someone like me would say". That's conditioned mindless prejudice.
You said you knew every detail of my position. When I expanded on what I do think you ignored what I said and pretended your prediction was true. Twice.

[Anonymous No.20679222]

>>20679198
oh my god you’re scaring me so much!! ahhh the edge!! ahh no don’t tell me to suck a barrel!!! no!! you’re so fucking retarded you can’t understand just how retarded you are, it’s unironically hilarious

[Anonymous No.20679224]

>>20679205
that's called a strawman fallacy technically
he doesn't have an argument

PS globalists, many of them jews, are just capitalists who want immigration to increase consumption. any conspiracy is secondary to that primary goal

[Anonymous No.20679226]

>>20679205
where was i wrong? pray tell

[Anonymous No.20679229]

220679222
estrogenic post

[Anonymous No.20679238]

>>20679226
The burden of proof is on you to prove that you were right about your assessment of his position

[Anonymous No.20679239]

>>20679205
>that’s conditioned mindless prejudice
lmao

[Anonymous No.20679243]

>>20679238
i literally restated his position that he had just given, albeit in a hyperbolic way, and then claims i ignored everything he said and accused me of mindless prejudice. i owe this retard nothing

[Anonymous No.20679249]

>>20679243
What was his opinion that he had just given that you literally restated?

[Anonymous No.20679250]

>>20679243
he claims* shit.

[Anonymous No.20679260]

>>20679249
> I'm proposing preserving my interests and the interests of my extended family in my representative democracy against the globalist corporations that now own everything including probably your livelihood
his “extended family” means race, i presume, and previously he talked about having immigrants from africa shipped in for engineering positions.

[Anonymous No.20679278]

>>20679226
There's more to be said but I meant what it said in my post not what you added and replaced. National sovereignty gives me some semblance of representation in the world. Mass immigration undermines that.
You don't think, just apply conditioning. When I was growing up that was the reason given in the propaganda not to be racist. Don't allow conditioning to override reason and individual sovereignty was the message. Now the equivalent anti-racist cartoon propaganda says "fuck u whitey gib gibs u racist cracka".

[Anonymous No.20679280]

>>20679260
Nowhere does he say "globalists, many of them jews, are intentionally causing mass migration from third world countries to the west in order to create a global population of mindless sheep" though. That's not an exaggeration but your own projection

The second thing you're talking about is probably this
>I wouldn't go to the jungle and presume I should be able to get a job as a tracker. If there was a group of "progressive" pygmies saying I should they would be undermining the pygmy way of life, brain draining my country and not helping anyone. Just like the progressives in the west importing engineers from Africa because "we're all the same".
He's saying that immigration hurts both the immigrant's nation and the host nation regardless of who does it (ie if he went to pygmies, same applies)

[Anonymous No.20679295]

>>20679278
Tbqh if you are am*rican you don't deserve national sovereignity because you're an immigrant

[Anonymous No.20679311]

>>20679278
so i take it you have no prejudice towards jews at all? that’s unique for someone concerned with mass immigration lmao

look, if you want me to reply honestly and engage, you should probably not be so arrogant and pompous in the future. no one wants to talk to someone that keeps saying shit like “you don’t think, just apply conditioning.” that’s a tip for ya, buddy. also, not everyone that isn’t bought into your worldview is a mindless drone. it’s exhausting dealing with people like you, and not intellectually.

[Anonymous No.20679318]

>>20679311
>that’s a tip for ya, buddy
>it’s exhausting dealing with people like you, and not intellectually.
You're quite arrogant for someone bitching about arrogance
You're either homosexual or a woman

[Anonymous No.20679322]

>>20679295
I have sea borders and can trace my ancestry to the first people of this land in all history. So I have close to the ideal case but the principles apply universally including to African tribes and Israel. Preserving individual and national sovereignty is preferable to global corporate hegemony almost no matter what your goals are. The automatic resistance to anything related to the subject is encouraged by the corporations that make money and power from undermining all other forms of power structures like nations. All media no matter who produces it has to conform to the propaganda guidelines now formalized partly in ESG scores or be blacklisted / bought out.

[Anonymous No.20679323]

>>20679280
it wouldn’t be projection, it would be a false assumption, if i were wrong. maybe the jews part was wrong, that would certainly make his worldview a little more nuanced than i gave him credit for, but i stand by most of my characterization. he’s implying there is mass immigration to his nation, i presume somewhere in the west, from third world countries. if it’s not the globalist corpos doing it, who is? i don’t see a problem with my description, other than the jews part and the hyperbolic consoom part.

[Anonymous No.20679333]

>>20679318
holy shit how are you this retarded. i’m matching energy levels, i’ll respond how i’m treated. if you’re being arrogant, i’ll be arrogant. jfc it’s not rocket science

[Anonymous No.20679338]

>>20679311
I have prejudice towards everyone including Jews and so do you as seen in this thread. I have much more prejudice towards someone that demonstrates a mindless deference to media brainwashing than a random Jew.
>no one wants to talk to someone
Hopefully you'll refrain from posting in the future then. It doesn't help anyone when you don't think and just regurgitate conditioning.

[Anonymous No.20679339]

>>20679322
Yeah no shit

>>20679323
Jews are involved in the sense that they're among the (if not the biggest) capitalists, they have a rich (heh) history in banking
Not sure about some secret agenda to get rid of whiteys but I wouldn't care either way

>i don’t see a problem with my description, other than the jews part and the hyperbolic consoom part
that's your entire description tho kek. although now you're improving it

[Anonymous No.20679350]

>>20679338
>anything that doesn’t agree with me is conditioning
profound, truly

[Anonymous No.20679354]

>>20679350
The position to recoil at criticism of immigration is in fact being conditioned by all the media (owned by the corporations)
so there's a good chance he's right

[Anonymous No.20679365]

>>20678797
>pic
why does this always get brought up. Perhaps coders learning what doctors already know. We need more cross-discipline sharing

Humans don't need an AI to tell the race of a person from their bone structure, forensic workers can already do that

[Anonymous No.20679366]

>>20679339
>that’s most of your description
well, tbqh, we do a lil trolling (but don’t tell him that, pretty please)

[Anonymous No.20679368]

>>20679350
It's not hard to detect. Continuing to talk based on your assumptions instead of what's been said means you're not aware of anything going on, just regurgitating conditioning.
Like a racist who can't fathom the idea of a nigger performing math even when it's happening right in front of him. He'll continue to talk from the assumptions given by the conditioning instead of engaging with what's happening.

[Anonymous No.20679378]

>>20679354
i’m not recoiling at criticism of immigration, i haven’t even shared my views on anything related to immigration. i just think this guy is retarded, he responded to me and started sperging out about congolese pygmies building bridges. had to milk it

[Anonymous No.20679380]

>>20678797
>Whites invented everything relevant because culture is downstream from race.
"white" isn't an actual ethnic group (or ethnic groups). "black" isn't either. You won't find them in any genetic studies, the only two I have encountered them use them to describe the ethnic groups that the US census categorizes as "white", which include many arabs
"white" is used for "caucasian", but "caucasian" isn't real either. it comes from "caucasoid", which is a skull classification and nothing more

>You people will never grow the balls to open your eyes.
"whites" have the biggest lack of balls out of all races anon
>Soon
in two weeks

>>20679365
Actually DNA does it. Bone structure can change over time, see for example skull shape

[Anonymous No.20679383]

>>20679378
Tbqh you both sound autistic so I won't get involved any more else kek

[Anonymous No.20679411]

>>20679380
What is the precise definition of the wavelengths of light that constitute orange and why is it deliminated exactly there and not as slightly more reddish? Why do you make all these demands of these specific categories while using many other categories that are much more loosely defined or context dependent?

[Anonymous No.20679413]

>thinks he’s not racist but uses the word nigger in the same sentence without any hint of irony
dude just embrace being racist lmao. racist ppl still understand that black ppl can do math. this is my whole point, you clearly are racist, and if u just embraced it instead of internally denying it like a little bitch, i’d have so much more respect for u. but u insist on having this moral high ground, and that everything u think is correct and anyone that disagrees is a brainwashed moron. it’s just a childish mentality to have. i genuinely like neo-nazis that want to kill me more than u.

since this is /lit/, do u have a favorite author (of fiction)? just curious

[Anonymous No.20679415]

>>20679413
forgot
>>20679368

[Anonymous No.20679417]

>>20679411
Pilpul
You haven't read a single genetic study in your life

[Anonymous No.20679420]

>>20679413
>without any hint of irony
How do you know? Are you working from conditioned assumptions again instead of engaging with the person you're pretending to engaging with? Have you dehumanized me again and made me into your racist sterotype?
Not everyone that disagrees with me is a brainwashed moron. You could have actually engaged. Instead you behaved like a brainwashed moron.

[Anonymous No.20679426]

>>20679417
Were the categories defined based on genetic studies?

[Anonymous No.20679443]

>>20673547
Because right wing chuds make things that they like controversial by citing them everytime they want to measure the size of black peoples' skulls. If they just read the book and took ideas from it without citing it, no one would give a fuck. That is assuming they don't completely misunderstand it what they are even reading.

[Anonymous No.20679444]

>>20679426
"white" and "black"? no
population genetics (instead of just reading the dna) are very recent, most aren't even 10 years old
"white" and "black" aren't even accurate terms
many dravidians are darker than many sub-saharan africans, khoisans are pretty light, and there is no literally black skin. there's dark brown
same with "white", there's no actually white skin. you can get porcelain-pink but not white. and an estonian that would be called "white" now was actually olive brown during the bronze and iron age, without his genome changing significantly
They're meaningless terms used in muttmerica only. what's done in genetics is to group people in terms of "genetic profile", such as nordic, west european and so on. the most common ones you'll find are west eurasian and east eurasian, and sub-saharan. these are the "distinct races" but don't always correspond with skull shape or skin color. without genetics we wouldn't know this

[Anonymous No.20679453]

>>20679444
and you of course have ethnic groups, most of which are actually not diverse at all and pretty homogeneous. this is something that older boomer geneticists dismissed but they were proven wrong

[Anonymous No.20679456]

>>20679420
well from the get-go, for the billionth time, i said i was not here to debate. i know reading isn’t your strong suit, but you can scroll up and see that. this whole “conversation” has been you replying to me calling me conditioned and brainwashed for giving you slight pushback on anything you’ve said. now, maybe you’re too autistic to understand irony or sarcasm, but you can read some of my earlier replies, and i promise you, i’ve been making fun of you this whole time, not “debating” or whatever the fuck. this might come as a shock to you, but personally, i’m actually for limiting immigration! not to the extent you are, by any means, but i’m not for open borders or whatever. i just think your arguments are retarded, and i like making fun of retards here. now please, for the love of god, fuck off or talk about literature.

[Anonymous No.20679459]

>>20679456
Boy this takes me back, I used to post like this as well. Then I read The Bell Curve and now I'm no longer retarded.

[Anonymous No.20679468]

>>20679459
>tfw iq is immutable and genetic but reading a book about how iq is immutable and genetic makes you not retarded

[Anonymous No.20679476]

>>20676704
>2:39:46
Holy copium.

[Anonymous No.20679487]

How has David Reich not yet been cancelled? The guy has done more to red pill people on human genetic variation than anyone else in the last few decades.

[Anonymous No.20679499]

>>20679456
>arguing while saying he's not here to argue
Actually give me pushback. I crave it. So far you offered nothing except the most obvious kneejerk reactions and prejudice.

[Anonymous No.20679501]

>>20679487
Because he's literally the best in his field, all eyes are on him and he's strictly being scientific, not taking any position. He's also careful in his discoveries
Furthermore people who want to cancel him find him useful. For example destroying all the myths about the (supposed) indo-europeans which were a big part of the aryanism larp
He effectively baited all the pozzed shitlibs into supporting race realism "to own the chuds" kek
It's also interesting and there's money in it

[Anonymous No.20679508]

>>20679499
who’s your favorite author?

[Anonymous No.20679512]

>>20679444
I don't really disagree with any of that fellow racist.

[Anonymous No.20679514]

>>20679501
He's also careful in how he publishes his discoveries*
when they were researching the initial steppe dna, many archaeologists from his team actually left because some of Kossina's ideas about germans being related to steppe cultures and so on were apparently proven right. He wrote a letter to them and made most come back I think. Not sure what he said
Probably just said that they were nothing like the myths and the most dna from them you can score is like 50% so at most you get a mutt

[Anonymous No.20679516]

>>20679501
>For example destroying all the myths about the (supposed) indo-europeans which were a big part of the aryanism larp

How so? He supports the steppe theory and made Indians cope&seethe by proving the Indo-Aryan invasions also

[Anonymous No.20679523]

>>20679512
Yeah I wasn't arguing, just explaining (if I understood correctly ofc. i'm esl)

[Anonymous No.20679531]

Is the Iwo Eleru skull one of the biggest "hidden in plain sight" red pills in science?

I think the next big game changer in genetics is going to be with Africa. The ghost admixture is going to be very HIGH and very RECENT ;)

[Anonymous No.20679532]

>>20679516
Actually he doesn't. Go check out his most recent lecture.
Also the myths weren't about the steppe dispersal of IE languages, that's a very recent theory spearheaded by that looney feminist Gimbutas and resurrected by the archaeologists Anthony and Mallory 15 years ago

>by proving the Indo-Aryan invasions also
yeah you probably haven't actually read his studies. Sintashta/Andronovo DNA is not the source for the steppe DNA in indians. What he proved was that north indians are very different than south ones, and that there were migrations, but the indo-aryan invasions were actually disproven
https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/13619649

[Anonymous No.20679540]

>>20679531
Could be. We have very little idea so far in the field, there are tens of thousands of samples ready to be processed and we've only have had like 50-100 studies so far with less than 3-4,000 samples total
and there are obviously 100s of thousands left to be excavated or found in general (even a random tooth)

[Anonymous No.20679550]

>>20679532
The Steppe migrations into India is the most likely and supported by most of the data. It matches the linguistic and mythological evidence too.

The Indian forager populations who were living there before the migrations looked like Negrito islanders btw

[Anonymous No.20679555]

>>20679508
A communist named Laxness.

[Anonymous No.20679559]

>>20679550
>doesn't even bother to read Reich himself saying that the data does not actually match the theory
>It matches the linguistic and mythological evidence too
nah, even deities like indra have been found in BMAC. Those come from archaeology and the field is still ongoing.
regarding linguistics a route through iran has also been proposed. you've probably only read steppe hypothesis proponents

[Anonymous No.20679560]

>>20679540
Yeah it is fascinating how much is going on in the field that most "mainstream" (I F'IN LOVE SCIENCE) types are completely ignoring.

For me, the most shocking thing has nothing to do with Indo-Aryans or anything but just how *different* Africa is than the rest of the world. Kind of mind blowing that the groups like the San, Pygmies, Bantu etc are so far from the rest of the global human population.

With San we are looking at what, 200kya divergence? Wow

[Anonymous No.20679571]

>>20679555
cool, haven’t read much of him (i’ve read part one of independent people and that’s it, couldn’t connect with it all). i assume you’re from iceland?

[Anonymous No.20679572]

>>20679560
Most are actually ignoring it because it's hard to keep up. The average follower or acheogenetics doesn't even read studies, but only blogs and some youtube vids
The big studies early on (Haak 2015, Lazaridis 2017) were widely read and circulated but now big studies not so much. People get info from journalist articles writing about the papers but these are usually kind shit because the writers don't know a lot about it themselves so they just write about the abstract

[Anonymous No.20679583]

>>20679572
The Americas has some good stuff coming up too. The US-based tribes are cowards so all the data is coming from Mexico, Canada, Brazil etc but it showing multiple migration and mixture events. Strong Polynesian signal was detected also.

Lots of stuff was going on before "le eternal Native Red Man watching flying eagle Soar" showed up to drink Listerine topkek

[Anonymous No.20679588]

>>20679583
kek
I find it more interesting to discover the phenotypical differentiation between northern natives and southern ones (like amazon)
southern ones look more traditionally east asian despite having more ANE

[Anonymous No.20679591]

>>20679560
I don't know anything about this but it sounds fascinating. Assuming it's not bullshit of course.

Reading Murray was honestly a massive redpill for me in terms of understanding how important intelligence is to human history, and how little we've been allowed to talk about it. The world makes vastly more sense once you accept that there are massive tangible differences in intellectual capacities between human beings, and that this determines the outcome of historical events.

[Anonymous No.20679597]

>>20679588
Yep, also how relatively recent some of the native groups in the Western US and Canada. The Eskimos only showed up in the Arctic a few centuries before 1492. The Athabaskan speakers are pretty recent arrivals too

[Anonymous No.20679607]

>>20679591
https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reich.hms.harvard.edu/files/inline-files/2021_Lipson_Sawchuk_Nature_AfricanForagers.pdf

https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reich.hms.harvard.edu/files/inline-files/Shum_Laka_published.pdf

https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reich.hms.harvard.edu/files/inline-files/13059_2019_Article_1679.pdf

[Anonymous No.20679614]

>>20679607
Thank you based archaeogenetics anon

[Anonymous No.20679630]

>>20679614
My pleasure.

Another one

https://reich.hms.harvard.edu/sites/reich.hms.harvard.edu/files/inline-files/Skoglund_Cell_2017_1_1.pdf

A book recommendations about Africa that also talks about some of the things uncovered by these papers is "A History of Africa" by JD Fage.

It was written before any of the genetic insights but Fage pretty much got it right in terms of Foragers/San - Pygmys - Bantu/Negro - Eurasian mixed populations

[Anonymous No.20679640]

>>20679591
Also recommend reading David Reich's book

"Who We Are and How We Got Here"

He coves all the basics and it isn't too technical. He is very subtle about not revealing his "power level" but you can get what he is hinting at.

[Anonymous No.20680690]

>>20674826
Wut

[Anonymous No.20680725]

>>20673551
yes, right, because most of the time when a book says something that most people suspect it is a controversial book

[Anonymous No.20680749]

>>20679443
shut the fuck up you stupid catholic

we get it already you want the pope's crook in your mouth

[Anonymous No.20680849]

>>20679380
If you dont know what people mean by white your mind is beyond saving. Usually people mean middle and northern europeans. You know, the ones that ended slavery, invented the printing press, the autombile, planes, trains, radio, classical music..

I was just at the j.s. bach museum in leipzig. Man that was something. Whitest city we saw in germany, cleanest and most chill place too. Fuck brown people tbqhwymf, we do not need them.
They are a net burden on all european countries. Look it up.

[Anonymous No.20681020]

>>20677871
No one's wasting two hours of their life just to hear someone make vague and irrelevant arguments like "race can't be defined" (which is ultimately just as stupid as irrelevant as saying "life can't be defined"), or specious appeals to statistical vagueness, which not only doesn't refute the points made, but shows that the field simply allows for future refinement via future research. The counterarguments given in these sorts of videos are almost entirely predictable, it's always the same things which reverts into appeals to ignorance ("we don't have enough information", "you can't define that", etc.) If it has any actual relevance besides these vagaries you should be able to summarize the main points.
>Am I really going to take time out of my day to condense two hours worth of talking into a comprehensive post
No, you're not, because it would be immediately disassembled and shown for the error it is.

[Anonymous No.20681028]

>>20678295
>he explicitly gives policy prescriptions like eliminating welfare and public spending on helping poor ppl, as they must have a lower iq
This isn't politics, it's just common sense. We should also stop funding medical treatment of hte disabled and elderly, and focus it on enhancing young, virile and productive members of society. Far too much money is wasted on the disabled and retarded. We could be living in a cultural golden age, but instead we squander our resources on the bottom feeders.

[Anonymous No.20681138]

>>20678985
Hmm, that wasn’t very good faith now was it?

[Anonymous No.20681881]

>>20676704
genuinely an evil video designed to defame and misrepresent.
https://www.bitchute.com/video/0Z5CHFUvn1U/

[Anonymous No.20681918]

>>20681020
>vagaries
lmao you don't know what this word means

[Anonymous No.20681943]

>>20681881
Was going to post that:(
I think the main thesis of the book has been lost somewhat due to its controversy; that there might be some issues with egalitarianism in a society that mostly focus on intellectual achievements, as it will drain the "lower" classes of talent and create a cognitive underclass and a hollowed out civil society.
I think this is to some extent happening and has been for quite some while

[Anonymous No.20682325]

>>20675267
disinfo shill

[Anonymous No.20682509]

>>20677290
99% of their stances are "right wing says bad so me like"

[Anonymous No.20682669]

>>20678797
>whites spent millennia living in mud huts and eating raw meat and producing no science or art of note
>other races built civilizations that lasted millennia during that same time
>if this anon lived 800 years ago, he would be arguing for arab, persian, indian, or chinese racial superiority
your world view is simplistic because youre a self obsessed retard who builds his ideological and political views on whatever serves his ego

[Anonymous No.20682910]

>>20673551
Would explain why /lit/ seethes.