Bible Thread; Archangel Michael Edition

[Anonymous No.19988184]

Last time on Bible Thread; >>19973244

[Anonymous No.19988198]

>>19988184
Become Orthodox!
Smash Western Civilization!
Defeat the Great Satan!

[Anonymous No.19988200]

>>19988184
First for not having denominational slapfights

[Anonymous No.19988211]

>>19988198
Boris, I…

[Anonymous No.19988248]

>>19988211
I don’t want smash Western civ, there is no other civ. But I would like to help improve it by first of all leading a Christian life myself and setting an example for others.

t. the real Boris

[Anonymous No.19988266]

>>19988198
I have great respect for the Orthodox and their tradition. It's a shame so many of them are rabidly anti-Catholic.

[Anonymous No.19988272]

>>19988266
I think it's mostly internet converts from the West.

[Anonymous No.19988280]

>>19988184
Lost my virginity yesterday, just received a text saying she wants to meet again. I've been thoroughly commited to Bible study and participated in these threads as well, but it would feel very hypocritical now, so I'm going to take a break for a while, Stay strong, Christian brothers, the Faith we share helped me in many dark hours. I'll come back soon.

[Anonymous No.19988293]

>>19988280
>Faith we share
You sure?

[Anonymous No.19988301]

>>19988280
There's only one Received Text you should be reading.

[Anonymous No.19988345]

>>19988280
She Christian too? Drop anything that doesn't want to marry.

[Anonymous No.19988693]

Something that I did in order to figure out which branch of Christianity is correct was to learn each branch's theological and historical claims and then get in arguments with people online and see how well I could defend it. My results are as follows:

1. Confessional Protestantism (e.g. Reformed, Lutheran) -- this performs well against anti-intellectual branches of Protestantism, such as fundamentalists. It fails against heterodox groups like Anabaptists, as these groups will wantonly reject your definitions and terminology and arguing with them necessitates justifying everything with no prior traditional assumptions, which is beyond the scope of anyone who is not an expert. It fails to Orthodoxy on historical grounds and to Catholicism on the issue of authority.

2. Orthodoxy -- this destructs any form of Protestantism on a historical basis. However the reliance on this becomes a handicap when dealing with Catholicism, as you can no longer rely on generalizations and must wade into the mire of historical minutiae to justify the Great Schism. The arguments here become increasingly abstruse and reliant on mastery of the historical material. The issue of authority can also be brought to bear against Orthodoxy here.

3. Catholicism -- in argument with Protestants they will try to disprove Catholicism via scripture, and the intellectual branches (not the fundamentalists) can press you on some issues, but the problems of history and authority kneecap any Protestant argument from any position. I am not saying they will admit defeat to this, but it renders their systems unjustifiable. With Orthodoxy you have the arcane historical problem I already mentioned, but Catholicism can bring authority and unity to bear against this in a unique way that Orthodoxy can't. Catholicism effectively allows you to bypass the muck of most of these debates and strike at the heart of your opponent's system. It's the only one that can actually be defended well in any circumstance by a normal person, and is the ultimate victor of this exercise.

[Anonymous No.19988705]

>>19988693
>i made up a "how each denomination discusses" while being catholic, and conclude i am right, as expected!
You only claim history and sucession, but you have no proof of it.
Secondly, you do things literally contrary to Scripture, at the most basic interpretation of clear verses.

[Anonymous No.19988717]

>>19988705
>have no proof of it
Not only lack proof but the most clear of the available data is biased against their claims. They tend to rely most heavily on fairly clearly forged letters.

[Anonymous No.19988718]

>>19988705
I'm not going to argue with you about it. These are my experiences from struggling with this problem for years. I think anyone who tries it, legitimately tries it, will find the same thing.
>most basic interpretation of clear verses
No issue that is disputed among Christians has an obvious scriptural solution. The text can be manipulated to mean anything. The point is who can actually refute it when their opponent does it without requiring multiple PhDs.

[Anonymous No.19988747]

>>19988718
Give me reasoning for saint and Marian prayer.
Bonus: the layperson may understand it as worship and has images, which are also forbidden. How can they be allowed to be in error?
Hard mode: don't say "but it's veneration, completely different!"

[Anonymous No.19988754]

>>19988747
I'm good. I've determined the solution and don't need to adjudicate it further. Your opinion on this or that is irrelevant.

[Anonymous No.19988761]

>>19988754
So you can't answer.

[Anonymous No.19988770]

>>19988761
Have you not been told the answer many times in these very threads? Why would I waste my time?
>Hard mode: don't say "but it's veneration, completely different!"
If you don't admit this distinction, which is a normal part of human reality, you cannot be reasoned with.

[Anonymous No.19988785]

>>19988770
Then explain the distinction. I've only heard the phrase being parroted.
If you do it in the same way you pray to God (who we're told to pray to exclusively) how is it different? Would you kneel for an earthly king?
Before you do bring out that argument, Paul did not treat Agrippa any differently.

[Anonymous No.19988800]

>>19988785
This idea that you have, that honoring anyone connotes worshiping them in the same way that you worship God is utterly absurd and you cannot positively justify it either from reality or scripture. This is something that is concocted through anti-Catholicism, and accepted through the abandonment of reason.
>God (who we're told to pray to exclusively)
No such command.
>Paul did not treat Agrippa any differently.
There is nothing in the account to note that he disrespected Agrippa in any fashion, which would be present if he violated the accepted protocols of interacting with a king, nor anything that could serve as a positive injunction to refuse honor to all earthly authorities.

[Anonymous No.19988833]

>>19988800
You're defending not praying only to God. Huh.
John 14:6, 1 John 4:1, Leviticus 26:1, Exodus 20:4, and finally, Matthew 24:24.

he had basic respect. didn't do anything extravagant.
Catholics give normal people who God (allegedly) acted through "powers" and pray to them instead when they need help in that area. It's clear cut paganism.

[Anonymous No.19988836]

Should the Bible's binding be stiff or floppy?

[Anonymous No.19988844]

>>19988836
I'm a flop fan. Feels good on the hand.
If i am to infer also about goatskin bindings, they're probably floppy.
So flop it is. comfy and good.

[Anonymous No.19988870]

>>19988833
>John 14:6
We affirm this. You are not saved by praying to a saint. It is not an alternate pathway but an organic part of the Christian life.
>Leviticus 26:1, Exodus 20:4
Condemns worship of idols. We do not worship the saints.
>1 John 4:1, Matthew 24:24.
This is talking about Protestants for rejecting the apostolic authority of the church and leading men astray through their private interpretations of scripture.
>he had basic respect. didn't do anything extravagant.
You've lost here. If Paul had not behaved in an expected manner, it would be interpreted as disrespecting the authority of the king. You could not be brought before a king (a real one) and treat them with normal behavior and it be acceptable. Since there is no issue it means this did not occur. In other words you are reading your position into the text, when it says nothing about it.
>Catholics give normal people who God (allegedly) acted through "powers" and pray to them instead when they need help in that area.
We pray to them to pray for us. "The prayer of a righteous man has great power in its effects" (James 5:16).

[Anonymous No.19988876]

>>19988844
Goatskin with a lambskin liner. Quite floppy, but probably not suitable for standing upright.

[Anonymous No.19988892]

>>19988876
Yeah, good stuff. Flop>stiff

[Anonymous No.19988899]

>>19988870
But you have images of them. Exactly what that verse is about.

You know what i meant with basic respect. Don't twist my words.

[Anonymous No.19988910]

>>19988870
Also as >>19988717 went on about too, you only claim that.
>we pray for prayer
Check any of those prayers, no mention of that. And, in the most basic Marian one, you ask for salvation.

[Anonymous No.19988939]

>>19988899
I am not attempting to distort your words, but to show that Paul behaved in a manner that was not controversial. In that age not showing the proper respect to a king could lead to death.

Regarding idols, there is an issue of interpretation here, is there not? We understand that
>I am the Lord thy God
>Thou shalt have no other gods before me
>Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image
constitute the first commandment. Protestants interpret
>Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image
to be the second commandment rather than part of the first.

>>19988910
They are all to be understood in the context of asking for intercessory prayer. The language mirrors scripture, for example:

1 Cor. 9:22b
I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.

Paul cannot save a person by his own power, neither can Mary.

[Anonymous No.19988962]

>>19988939
>it doesn't mean what we say
Back to the layperson argument.
The barebones interpretation is "asking Mary for salvation" and the prayer is not explained. How would that ambiguity be solved in their mind?

[Anonymous No.19988986]

>>19988962
"Someone could misunderstand it" does not invalidate anything. Someone could misunderstand Paul, or Jesus himself. Many do all throughout the world. They need to be taught rather than the teaching changed.

[Anonymous No.19988989]

>>19988986
Then why aren't they?

[Anonymous No.19989003]

>>19988989
To clarify, the only time i've ever heard of what you're going on about is right now.
How is something that puts your church in error not fixed?

[Anonymous No.19989006]

>>19988989
They should be. To convert to Catholicism an adult has to go through RCIA for eight months. For a child to be confirmed and partake in the Eucharist he has to take religious education for two years. If they aren't properly taught the faith during this then they were failed by the clergy, who will be held responsible for it before God.

[Anonymous No.19989016]

>>19989006
>the magisterium decides what is the true and correct interpretation
Isn't there a verse about private interpretations of Scripture?

[Anonymous No.19989048]

Today is the sabbath, why don't you catlicks obey God?

[Anonymous No.19989053]

>>19988892
Hmm. Could you just use bookends/other books to hold a floppy Bible upright, or should I stop being autistic and have it lie down?

[Anonymous No.19989062]

>>19989003
>To clarify, the only time i've ever heard of what you're going on about is right now.
What are you referring to?
>>19989016
There is. The magisterium does not teach that a patron saint has magical powers (I assume this is what is being objected to). A patron saint is a saint who has been traditionally assigned as an intercessor for a particular cause, place, etc. It dates back to churches being built over the tombs of martyrs, so Christians in that church would ask that martyr for intercession.

[Anonymous No.19989070]

>>19989053
Read it so often you don't have to worry about that.
It's better to have it lie down imo.

[Anonymous No.19989091]

>>19989048
Taking Protestant Commandment #2 literally means that God's own commands on how the Temple and the Ark of the Covenant were to be constructed were violations of the commandment since it included images.
>But the images are only bad if you worship them!
That means it's a violation of commandment #1. They're the same commandment about not worshiping anything other than God.

[Anonymous No.19989122]

>>19988870
>private interpretations of scripture
This is *exactly* what the Catholic Chrich is doing. "Only we can properly interpret, no one else". The opposite is public interpretation, which is exactly what Protestantism opened up.

[Anonymous No.19989139]

>>19989122
>The opposite is public interpretation, which is exactly what Protestantism opened up.
Thanks for that!
t. Mormons, JWs, and every modern heresy.

[Anonymous No.19989140]

>>19989122
See, this is why your entire project is a failure. Nothing can mean anything, there is no authority, everything means whatever you personally think it means. All theology, all definitions, every single aspect of Christianity is up for grabs resulting in total fracture of unity. Private doesn't mean individually determined it means having an authority, God didn't want a teacher, he wanted the public to have at it in a free-for-all. Don't think you're fooling anyone other than yourself when you do this.

[Anonymous No.19989148]

>>19989006
>sorry, my Ethiopian eunuch friend, there is no way that I can baptize you into the faith without a minimum of 8 months of classes and services

[Anonymous No.19989158]

>>19989148
The Church through its apostolic authority has instituted this regulation for the good of souls. This is actually a relaxation of the ancient practice which could last for several years.

[Anonymous No.19989165]

>>19989139
There always was, always is, always will be heresies. The irony is that even if you took all of the heresy that has resulted from Protestantism put together it would never amount to as much as a pimple on the ass of what Catholicism holds.

[Anonymous No.19989177]

>>19988301

[Anonymous No.19989178]

>>19989165
Interesting, considering Protestantism itself is a breach of Matthew 18:15-18.

[Anonymous No.19989180]

>>19989158
woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

[Anonymous No.19989190]

>>19989178
>conveniently leaving out Matthew 18:20

[Anonymous No.19989196]

>>19989180
Has nothing to do with making sure that people understand the faith before converting. I suppose it doesn't matter in Protestant theology because grievous sin after your baptism doesn't matter.

[Anonymous No.19989198]

>>19989190
Martin Luther is burning in Hell with Mohammed, Joseph Smith, and all the others who started new religions.

[Anonymous No.19989211]

>>19989048
Their "Church" and "Church Fathers" are more important than God. They twist one verse and claim it validates all of their apostasy. All they have are idiotic foolish semantics arguments and other retardation when you point it out, see: >>19989091

Catholics should be exterminated off the face of the earth.

[Anonymous No.19989216]

>>19989198
Every single dead pope and all of your """Cult Fathers""" are in hell. Peter was not a pope.

[Anonymous No.19989217]

>>19989211
>All they have are idiotic foolish semantics arguments and other retardation when you point it out
Not an argument. You say that commandment #1 means don't worship other Gods but commandment #2 means don't worship other gods (especially if they're images). They're the same commandment.

[Anonymous No.19989220]

>>19989198
Luther was a catholic, and all catholics go to hell.

[Anonymous No.19989223]

>>19989196
Tell it to God whose word tells us of on the spot baptism of believers into the ekklesia as an example for all in Holy Scripture for eternity. If a man tells me he has faith in God and believes on Christ's sacrificial atonement in his place for his sins then who am I to stand in the way of his baptism out of Babylon and into the ekklesia? Gatekeepers will be cast into the fire.
>>19989198
>conveniently leaving out Constantine

[Anonymous No.19989224]

>>19989217
Stop worshipping and praying to Mary against what God and Christ commanded, pedo cultist

[Anonymous No.19989231]

>>19989224
>B-but we're totally the OneTrueChurch™ and the gates of hell won't prevail against us
Bunch of retarded Pharisees, all they do is kvetch like a jew about prots whenever anyone points out their false doctrines

[Anonymous No.19989234]

>>19989223
Who are you? You are not anyone with the authority. Christ gave authority to his apostles and their successors. "Whatever you bind on earth is bound in heaven." They have bound the catechumenate on earth and thus it is bound in heaven.

[Anonymous No.19989238]

>>19989223
Why would St. Constantine the Great be in Hell, you heretic? Because he stopped persecuting the Church?

[Anonymous No.19989251]

>>19989234
Hebrews 5:4
And who are you to claim to have such authority?

[Anonymous No.19989255]

Reminder that literally nothing the Catholic Church has done has been as much of a stain on the faith as the "The Message" translation from Protestantism.

[Anonymous No.19989262]

>>19989251
>For every high priest chosen from among men is appointed to act on behalf of men in relation to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins. 2 He can deal gently with the ignorant and wayward, since he himself is beset with weakness. 3 Because of this he is bound to offer sacrifice for his own sins as well as for those of the people. 4 And one does not take the honor upon himself, but he is called by God, just as Aaron was.
Interesting how you start 4 verses into the chapter in order to obscure the context.

[Anonymous No.19989263]

>>19989251
Christ gave this authority to the apostles, to teach and lead the church, to exercise authority over how it is ordered, and to forgive sins.

Matt. 16:18-19 "And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the powers of death shall not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

John 20:21-23 Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

[Anonymous No.19989280]

>>19989238
>be Constantine
>start new Christianity hijacking religion
>stop persecuting Christians who join your "Chrich"
>go on to persecute countless more Christians for over 1.5 millennia
>murder Christians who try to get the Holy Scriptures into the hands of the people
>only stop when forced by newly Protestant kingdoms
>try to kill newly Protestant king with gunpowder kegs so can go back to persecuting Christian
>get caught, drawn and quartered
>Protestant king commissions the Authorized Holy Bible that becomes the single most read Holy Bible by the most eyes ever henceforth, 400 years and counting

[Anonymous No.19989283]

>>19989280
>Source: dude trust me Muhammad told me in a cave

[Anonymous No.19989360]

Catholic anon here. I've disputed about Catholicism a lot in this thread and I feel like I am derailing it at this point so I am going to stop for a while. I propose a different topic of discussion that is more directly related to the thread topic:

What do you think of historical criticism of the Bible? I feel like a lot of proceeds from distinctly non-Christian or atheistic perspectives. For example, a common argument used in dating the Gospels is to refer to Christ's prophecy about the destruction of the Temple. The Temple was destroyed in 70 AD, roughly 40 years after Christ died, so historical critics will tell us this means that any prophecy of the Temple being destroyed must have been written after 70 AD. It seems to me that if you buy into all of this, that you're assuming before you even begin that Christ cannot have prophesied these things, that his divinity is a later creation by the "Johannine community", blah blah, that you have really cut out the foundation of Christianity within history.

[Anonymous No.19989392]

>>19989360
We already know all of this, welcome to a long time ago.

[Anonymous No.19989401]

>>19989392
I have known it for quite some time myself. Not all Christians agree on this matter, I have even seen some who disagree in this very thread.

[Anonymous No.19989445]

>>19989401
I have not seen any Christians who disagree that atheist scholars claim a text was written later based on the alleged impossibility of prophecy.

[Anonymous No.19989447]

>>19989360
The Ignatius Catholic Study Bible NT bucks the trend of other modern commentaries, etc., and not only defends the early dating for all the Gospels, but defends the authenticity of all the NT books and their authors, even saying that St. Paul as author of Hebrews is a legitimate position to hold--recalling that both the Douay-Rheims and the King James attribute Hebrews to St. Paul. However, it doesn't defend the Johannine Comma, instead deferring to the 1927 Holy Office ruling and saying that one is "not bound to accept the text as part of the original wording of 1 John." It does, however, print the text in the note. The Douay-Rheims has the Johannine Comma in it (both the original 1582 NT and the Challoner revision of 1752), as does Knox Version; the Knox Version actually goes a step further with Knox adding a note to say that, while it doesn't appear in old Greek manuscripts, it's possible the Latin "may have preserved the true text."

[Anonymous No.19989449]

>>19989445
I'm saying there are Christians who are agree with this kind of dating methodology, you mong.

[Anonymous No.19989454]

>>19989447
>Ignatius Study Bible
I wonder if they'll ever finish the OT

[Anonymous No.19989460]

>>19989454
Apparently, and please don't quote me on this because they've delayed for years, but the latest word is Fall 2022 for the complete unit. That news is from summer 2021.

[Anonymous No.19989462]

>>19989449
Citation needed.

[Anonymous No.19989471]

>>19989460
Even if it's delayed more it's good to hear they're still working on it.

[Anonymous No.19989489]

All modern textual criticism rests on the foundation that the Bible must be treated as any other book. It's absurd that this is accepted at all.

[Anonymous No.19989491]

>>19989471
Like with the NT before the final volume was published, they've been putting out paperbacks of the individual books for study groups, so most of the OT material has actually already been published. They're apparently still waiting on imprimaturs for the remaining books and the final editing (presumably trying to figure out how to fit everything into one volume, seeing as the ICSBNT was big on its own).

[Anonymous No.19989497]

watch this gospel video if you are not 100% sure of going to heaven /lit/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpOv_kvk4M8&t=1s&ab_channel=BaptistBiblePreaching

[Anonymous No.19989502]

>>19989491
I wouldn't mind if they made the OT a separate volume.

[Anonymous No.19989515]

I went to my first Catholic mass a while ago and left feeling deflated. I think I felt this way because, as an agnostic most of my life, I’d put a lot of hope on this one time I chose to go to a church on my own volition and getting from it some kind of spiritual awakening.
I’ve accepted Jesus as my saviour, however, I’m having real difficulty inside myself trying to find a church to call home…The church I went to seemed very stilted, like there was no genuine interaction to be had which saddened me.
As an aside; Eastern Orthodoxy has interested me a lot but perhaps mainly due to “the bells and smells”. Being English born and bred I don’t feel the connection to it like Catholicism.

TL;DR should I try visiting many different Catholic Churches to see if I find something that feels right or seek another denominational church?

[Anonymous No.19989516]

All I know is that
>Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10.34

[Anonymous No.19989540]

>>19989515
I don't think that you should be putting so much emphasis on achieving a subjective feeling just from attending mass. When you attend mass you receive grace from partaking in the Eucharist, which is something that you cannot do yet. But even then I would not say to look to achieve a particular emotional state as some kind of sign. As a Catholic (I know you have not joined yet but this is worth knowing) you do not have an obligation to attend the nearest mass to your home, so if there is indeed something wrong at the closest parish you can go to another one. So that's something to keep in mind. That being said, what I would tell you is to speak with the priest and enroll in their RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation for Adults) program. This will teach you about the faith and prepare you to join the Church should you decide to do so at the end (you can choose not to).

[Anonymous No.19989570]

>>19989502
They might. There's been mixed messages. One interview, they say two volumes, another, they insist it'll be one. Someone emailed them years ago, and they said two volumes, but right now on their website, it says "the entire Catholic Study Bible will be published in a single volume." The short answer is: Who knows?

[Anonymous No.19989574]

>>19989515
Try finding your local Sedevacantists. They will show you.

[Anonymous No.19989596]

>>19988198
orthodox is the least degenerate christian sect

[Anonymous No.19989629]

>>19989540
>Prots think you can just pick and choose
>we are the One Trve Chrich™
>if you don't like that place just go to another

[Anonymous No.19989696]

>>19989515
Go to a backwoods country Baptish church and join in the hymn singing with humble country people.

[Anonymous No.19989956]

>>19989596
>tithing to the KGB

[Anonymous No.19990243]

>>19989956
KGB=commie police. Communism has made more martyrs for the Church than the prior 1900 years of Christian persecutions combined.

[Anonymous No.19990249]

>>19989516
What does that mean? What do swords do? What is being severed? What is being separated?

Spiritual from the material perhaps? Good from evil? Truth from lies?

[Anonymous No.19990253]

>>19990243
weren't most Orthodox priests informants for the KGB and basically KGB-puppets though? How would that even count as martyrdom when its your """priest""" on behalf of an atheist state causing your death?

[Anonymous No.19990261]

>>19988280
why does God let you sin when all I want is a gf to love and be loved? Do I have the greater sin?

[Anonymous No.19990307]

>>19990253
The Moscow patriarchate which Stalin revived in the 1930s, after some of the most brutal persecutions, was never a real Church. Its a state owned propaganda machine. The real Church is the underground catacomb Church.

pic rel
>Russia’s Catacomb Saints

[Anonymous No.19990311]

>>19990307
>we cant see the church because its underground
Very funny

[Anonymous No.19990312]

>>19990307
Forgot pic

[Anonymous No.19990317]

Jesus

[Anonymous No.19990429]

>>19990317
And?

[Anonymous No.19990623]

Tried going to my local cathedral again today fornthe second time in 13 years. I was put off when I tried last month after the sermon was about how heroic Grace Tame (I had no idea who this was and she made no attempt to explain) was for not smiling in a press photo. This time, I was told we need to stop bullying "LGBTQI and various other genders" and listen to them, "especially if they're non-verbal". This was the result of an allegory about how Putin is bullying "the Ukraine", and how conservative christians are bullies who think they own the church.

[Anonymous No.19990634]

>>19990317
Honestly typically these threads have some good discussion
But then there's the artists that go back and forth and neither convince the other and both are mad

[Anonymous No.19990636]

>>19990623
It is so over

[Anonymous No.19990638]

>>19990623
Weird, my church never has preached on worldly topics at all, just the Bible.

[Anonymous No.19990641]

>>19989696
Yeah if you're looking for something soul stirring and emotional this will do it. People wailing, getting on their knees to pray, shouting, pew jumping, etc.

[Anonymous No.19990650]

>>19990641
That's Pentecostal, not Baptist.

[Anonymous No.19990716]

Any krauts here? What are your thoughts on the Basisbibel, specifically the Psalms + NT version? I'm thinking of getting one as German study material, but I want to know if it's a good translation, if it's too colloquial or more balanced, and just your general thoughts on it.

[Anonymous No.19990738]

>>19990249
My interpretation reading the next 5 verses is that He will be a sword that will divide mankind. I wonder if it could be a prophecy for how divided Christianity has become?

[Anonymous No.19990741]

>>19990638
When I was younger, the sermon was on stuff that would instruct on day to day living.

[Anonymous No.19990769]

>>19990741
Yes that's usually what it amounts to is Biblical understanding for application to every day life and the big picture of human existence in the context of God and eternity. People can take the Biblical knowledge and perspectives and apply the lens however they see fit, which can include worldly events if they so choose.

[Anonymous No.19990821]

What's the best pocket Bible? I frequently go to wet/dusty areas so something with a zippered cover would be ideal.

[Anonymous No.19990851]

>>19990821
Just search "pocket King James Bible".

[Anonymous No.19990869]

>>19990821
You can get keychain bibles for $1 from AliExpress.

[Anonymous No.19990882]

The peak of Bibles.

[Anonymous No.19990884]

>>19990882
Show us Genesis 1 anon

[Anonymous No.19990904]

>>19990738
Most people would rather follow politics than Christ, go figure. The divisions within Christondom Paul was talking about to the Corinthians.

[Anonymous No.19990907]

>>19990884

[Anonymous No.19990932]

Is this the pinnacle of Bible design?
>black leather
>nothing on the front cover
>spine just says Holy Bible, Authorized King James, and CBP, spaced out perfectly
>perimeter stitching
>black ribbons
I used to think it needed to say Holy Bible on the front, but then I realized the quality of the leather let the Bible speak for itself.

[Anonymous No.19990943]

>>19990932
Looks identical to mine other than the text has mostly worn off now.

[Anonymous No.19991499]

>>19990623
>Anime poster
You get the church you deserve

[Anonymous No.19991505]

>>19991499
>anime website
Anyway, I watched the simultaneous service from the mother Catholic church of my diocese but it was pathetic.
>no organ (piano instead, it sounded like a school assembly)
>priest and readers had disgusting bogan accents
>walls were plaster not even stone or bricks
>parishioners were wearing casual clothes t-shirts
No thanks

[Anonymous No.19991510]

>>19991505
What do you think a service looked like in the first two centuries of the church? You're approaching this for the wrong reasons.

[Anonymous No.19991519]

>>19991510
Sorry anon, but a high church service with organ and choirs and buttoned shirts and proper pronunciation for Scriptural readings makes me feel closer to God (and tonthe congregation).

[Anonymous No.19991527]

>>19991519
>If everything conforms to my personal desires then I will get a subjective feeling from it
Non-Christian sentiment. I can understand complaining about actual liturgical abuse, but the things you have complained about are problems for you due to your own pride.

[Anonymous No.19991532]

>>19991527
Sorry anon but if that's all God wants I can just roll out of bed in my PJs and smash out some hymns on the home piano with my family.

[Anonymous No.19991548]

>>19991532
The point of mass is not only to gather with each other but to receive the body and blood of Christ in the Eucharist, which is objective and not affected by your feelings on the liturgy.

[Anonymous No.19991564]

>>19988198
Russia is the king of the north in the bible or/and gog/magog

[Anonymous No.19991585]

>>19991505
>>19991519
>>19991532
I wouldn't get too hung up on aesthetics. I live in a rather romantic part of Germany with absolutely beautiful cathedrals. They have organs, studied liturgists, and dutiful lectors - and the narthexes are still littered with LGBT pamphlets and borderline New Age material. The most faithful Catholic communities are invariably relegated to small, functional, understated buildings.

[Anonymous No.19991602]

Its Sunday morning, and I want to go to Church, but I can’t. Because I haven’t been in a while and my custom is to always call the priest ahead of time. So I’ll call him later and go next week. Meanwhile I’ll go over the offices anyway. Anyone else home from Church this Sunday?

[Anonymous No.19991606]

>>19991564
And Saturn is heavenly Jerusalem?

[Anonymous No.19991612]

>>19991548
Thankfully both services have a Eucharist.

>>19991585
That's the situation I'm describing. I think I'd rather enjoy the 75 minutes of the service that aren't the sermon than mine at all though.

[Anonymous No.19991613]

>>19991612
>Thankfully both services have a Eucharist.
If they are Catholic or Orthodox then they do. No one else does.

[Anonymous No.19991615]

>>19991613
>it's another "papism or get out of the thread" post
Can't you just get behind ecumenicalism for the sake of the quality of these threads if nothing else?

[Anonymous No.19991621]

>>19991615
The anon stated that one of the churches he went to was Catholic but did not clearly state what the other one was, unless I missed it, so I told him the Catholic teaching on the matter. If he's interested in Catholicism he needs to know.

[Anonymous No.19991625]

>>19988184
>Archangel Michael Edition
Did someone call me?

[Anonymous No.19991628]

>>19991621
I'm that anon and the other church is Anglican. It performs a Eucharist, though it's potentially only valid when performed by a man.

[Anonymous No.19991641]

>>19991628
Women cannot be priests, and can neither be bishops. So not only can a woman not confect the Eucharist, she cannot ordain priests, so the "priests" she "ordains" can also not confect the Eucharist since they are not priests, and on and on. The inclusion of women is far more destructive and evil than it initially seems.

That being said, Pope Leo XIII ruled in 1896 that all Anglican ordinations are null and void. Since Anglicanism does not have a particular theology regarding its sacraments and allows its members to believe whatever they want on the matter, it has ceased to follow the apostolic tradition which breaks its succession just as much as female "priests" does.

[Anonymous No.19991658]

>>19991641
Do you have this post saved? Pretty lame pasta honestly lad.

[Anonymous No.19991663]

>>19991658
Tell me a single thing I said that is incorrect.

[Anonymous No.19991672]

>>19991663
Mostly I'm just sick of seeing it in every thread, but since you asked Anglican priests (at least those without women in their ordainment ancestry) maintain apostolic succession whether the Pope likes it or not.

[Anonymous No.19991678]

>>19991672
You would have an argument if Anglicanism actually had a sacramental theology, but it does not.

[Anonymous No.19991681]

>>19991678
Anglicans believe in the real presence of Christ at the Eucharist whether the Pope likes it or not.

[Anonymous No.19991692]

>>19991681
Some of them do, some of them don't. It's open to whatever the individual wants. "Pneumatic presence" =/= real presence. Saying you receive his body, but only spiritually, is gnosticism.

[Anonymous No.19991717]

>>19991672
>Mostly I'm just sick of seeing it in every thread
The only thing that seems to get responses are arguments like this

[Anonymous No.19991734]

Best translation coming through.

[Anonymous No.19991746]

>>19990623
Go to an actual church please. Shake the dust off your shoes when leaving

[Anonymous No.19991749]

>>19990623
This is something that always tempts me towards Islam. LGBT is pure evil and is not something that we should be tolerant to.

[Anonymous No.19991750]

test something something the bible

[Anonymous No.19991754]

>>19991750
test sneed test

[Anonymous No.19991756]

>>19991749
>heresy on the church (which is prophesized to happen) tempts me towards a false religion
Not the way to go.

[Anonymous No.19991760]

>>19991756
I know. There is no Muslim community near me anyway so it's not like I could get anything out of it. It's something that bothers me a lot, though. There's capitulation everywhere.

[Anonymous No.19991774]

Why was Sunni Islam able to maintain some kind of relative cohesion but Protestantism endlessly fractures apart?

[Anonymous No.19991844]

>>19991750
How to be more wiser than serpent and harmless like dove?

[Anonymous No.19992040]

>>19991505
Imagine worshipping Chrich instead of God. You are warped and should go to that church you are "disgusted" by and beg God forgiveness for your pride and idiocy.

[Anonymous No.19992067]

>>19989515
I can speak from my own experience. Never baptised but went to Catcholic schools all my life and tried to attend Catholic mass as an adult and had the same feeling as you. I've recently begun atttending sung Anglican services which feel less stilted and more authentic, and a more natural fit as someone living in England. I would reccommend you attend one and see what you think.

[Anonymous No.19992087]

>>19992040
Christ is God

[Anonymous No.19992094]

>>19992087
Uh, ok, yes, we know that here. This is not a Muslim or JW thread.

[Anonymous No.19992099]

>>19992094
That anon thought you said
>Imagine worshipping Christ instead of God
Because you wrote "church" as "Chrich".

[Anonymous No.19992103]

>>19992099
Yes, I reread the post in context and realized it was a typo afterwards, though.

[Anonymous No.19992116]

>>19992103
That's not a typo, it's what Catholics go to. It is an aspect of "Church™". Lnr2Christianity.

[Anonymous No.19992140]

[Anonymous No.19992231]

>>19992140
>"sinless"
>goes to temple for purification 40 days after giving birth

[Anonymous No.19992242]

>>19992231
>Jesus gets baptized to cleanse sins despite being sinless
What did Jesus mean by this?

[Anonymous No.19992273]

>>19992231
Thomas Aquinas:

Objection 1. It would seem that it was unfitting for the Mother of God to go to the Temple to be purified. For purification presupposes uncleanness. But there was no uncleanness in the Blessed Virgin, as stated above (III:27-28). Therefore she should not have gone to the Temple to be purified.

I answer that, As the fulness of grace flowed from Christ on to His Mother, so it was becoming that the mother should be like her Son in humility: for “God giveth grace to the humble,” as is written James 4:6. And therefore, just as Christ, though not subject to the Law, wished, nevertheless, to submit to circumcision and the other burdens of the Law, in order to give an example of humility and obedience; and in order to show His approval of the Law; and, again, in order to take away from the Jews an excuse for calumniating Him: for the same reasons He wished His Mother also to fulfil the prescriptions of the Law, to which, nevertheless, she was not subject.

Reply to Objection 1. Although the Blessed Virgin had no uncleanness, yet she wished to fulfil the observance of purification, not because she needed it, but on account of the precept of the Law. Thus the Evangelist says pointedly that the days of her purification “according to the Law” were accomplished; for she needed no purification in herself.

[Anonymous No.19992337]

>>19988184
COME AND SEE HOW THE BOOK OF REVELATION IS UNFOLDING AFORE OUR VERY EYES. COVID-19 (WHITE HORSE) CAME IN 2019. NUCLEAR WAR (RED HORSE) IS COMING SOON.

[Anonymous No.19992358]

>>19988184
I sometimes doubt Christianity is true, but seeing how it is a religion that makes entertainment industries, governments, e-celebs, and chosen people seethe, I must shout Christ is king.

[Anonymous No.19992368]

>>19992358
Christianity is the only religion the world truly hates

[Anonymous No.19992370]

>>19992273
>Thomas Aquinas
Opinion as good or worthless as anyone's. Nothing more than a philosopher.

[Anonymous No.19992383]

>>19992370
Ok

[Anonymous No.19992384]

>>19992370
>Opinion as good or worthless as anyone's.
Wake me up when you finally realize this applies to yourself as well.

[Anonymous No.19992448]

>>19992370
*St

St. Thomas Aquinas

[Anonymous No.19992461]

>>19992384
Of course it does, I do not claim infallible, nor do I claim myself to be the authority over other's understanding, only my own. I am my own earthly authority to my best ability to understand submission to the authority of Christ. I share my understanding with others who can take what they find useful and discard the rest in their own seekings of understandings. That's how it works. Thomas Aquinas was nothing more nor less than just another voice in that same process. None of his understandings are Gospel on the merits of his person, nor any other human other than Christ.

[Anonymous No.19992467]

>>19992448
Only God knows if that is or isn't an applicable label. The only label Christ gave us was all being brethren.

[Anonymous No.19992500]

>>19992461
>I share my understanding with others who can take what they find useful and discard the rest
How about you respond to Thomas's argument then? That's what he is presenting, an argument. He was not infallible and he did not view himself in such a way.

[Anonymous No.19992510]

>You don't have to live a particularly virtuous life to be saved, you just have to believe in Christ and it's done, and you can't ever lose your salvation
>Uh no you can't call anyone a saint even if they lived virtuously only God knows so you can't say that shut up stop

[Anonymous No.19992525]

>>19992500
Because he wasn't there with the Apostles and his entire argument is rooted in things that didn't exist at all in the church until it was brought in from mid 2nd century gnostic fan fiction which he didn't know because all he knew was what the Chrich fed him from their fabricated "Tradition™". He can philosophy wank till the cows come home on fiction and it is nothing more than pissing in the wind.

[Anonymous No.19992528]

>>19992368
I've noticed. Muslims in the east do so much illegal/immoral shit and only glowies like Sam Harris calls them out. Christians are laughed at for believing God came to the world in the form of a human and said human resurrected, but Mormons/Scientologists don't get half as much shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3BqLZ8UoZk

[Anonymous No.19992529]

>>19992525
The text from the Summa that I posted was not his proof of the immaculate conception, it was his reply to the supposed contradiction of Mary undertaking purification in the temple while being sinless, which was brought up by >>19992231. If he has demonstrated that there is no contradiction then his argument is correct.

I'll add that this a disingenuous tactic you are using. You (or someone else) say that a doctrine is contradictory for some reason. An argument is presented to show that it is not. You then refuse to acknowledge this because you think the doctrine is still wrong. It shows you were not trying to engage, but just throw up something in the hope that it sticks.

[Anonymous No.19992545]

Does anyone have a Catholic reading list or any recommendations on which books as a Christian (tied to no denomination) I should start with reading?

[Anonymous No.19992546]

>>19992529
No instance of "demonstrating no contradiction" in any way automatically confirms a proposition. Not absolutely proving something to be untrue doesn't prove it to be true. Also Jimmy Akin is a con.

[Anonymous No.19992565]

>>19992546
It proves that the two ideas, Mary being sinless and Mary engaging in the temple purification, are not contradictory, which is the point. The other anon (you?) claimed it is contradictory and Thomas shows it is not. Might as well admit you were wrong on this point since you clearly have no argument. I'm surprised anyone would even make it given the obvious parallel of Jesus's baptism, etc.

[Anonymous No.19992590]

>>19992545
There's a good reading list here
https://www.calledtocommunion.com/library/suggested-reading/

Pic related is a good introductory text. If you don't recognize the name, Josef Ratzinger became Pope Benedict XVI.

[Anonymous No.19992594]

>>19992545
Nicene and Post Nicene Fathers

[Anonymous No.19992597]

>>19992590
Joseph*

[Anonymous No.19992656]

>>19992565
At Jesus' baptism a point was made of it being absurd but Jesus insisted on it being necessary. At Mary's purification there was not even the slightest hint that there was anything noteworthy of it whatsoever beyond the typical. The early church that Matthew nor any other NT writer was in had any elevated views of Mary beyond her having been blessed with the honor of being the earthly mother to Jesus. No NT writer, who were all of the earliest church, period, saw any need to proselytize Marian "veneration" or praying to "her". What some philosopher has to say about fictions is far less valuable than a bucket full of bat dung. Face it, you've been conned by the Roman pagans and government, who were proxies for Satan and Babylon.

[Anonymous No.19992669]

>>19992656
And for you citybois, a bucket full of bad dung is excellent fertilizer. It used to be brought into this region by the train load from Mexico, back before commercial chemicals. There was a train station out at the plantation just for that purpose. So Thomas Aquinas' opinions are worth far, far less as they are completely useless.

[Anonymous No.19992699]

>>19992590
Benedict's 3-volume Jesus of Nazareth is also great to read afterward.

[Anonymous No.19992728]

>>19992656
Why do Protestants hate the Mother of God so much? I'll never understand it.

[Anonymous No.19992788]

>>19992728
>not swallowing counter Biblical fictions
>hating the earthly mother of Jesus

[Anonymous No.19992793]

>>19992788
She is the Mother of God. If Jesus is God and Mary is his mother then she is the Mother of God. She had God within her womb.

[Anonymous No.19992810]

>>19992242 still hasn't been answered, so we know the autist is just a gnostic and a larper. Possibly a Mohammedan, too, since they think the Trinity is the Father, the Son, and the Mother because they were illiterate like the compilers of the Quran.

[Anonymous No.19992851]

>>19992793
God created Mary, retard.
>>19992810
Baptism is about more than only cleansing of sins. It's also entering the church. Christ was beginning the church as its head, and in the form of one of us, which is a reconciliation gesture.

[Anonymous No.19992864]

>>19992851
>God created Mary, retard.
And? Jesus Christ is God. Everything that pertains to Christ pertains to God. God was conceived in Mary's womb. God was born from Mary. God was crucified and God died and God was resurrected. If you cannot affirm these then you do not believe Christ is God.

[Anonymous No.19992881]

>>19992864
Wrong and retarded. If I already exist and go to a water park and wish to get into a certain pool that is only accessable via a water slide, and I get in the top end and come out in the pool at the bottom, does that make the water slide my mother? No.

[Anonymous No.19992910]

>>19992881
Christ was conceived in her womb and born from her body. This make her his mother. Christ is God. Ergo she is the mother of God. Mother does not mean that she originated him in his totality, as even a normal mother cannot generate the soul of her child.

[Anonymous No.19992919]

>>19992910
Wrong, Jesus' earthly flesh tabernacle dwelling was conceived in her womb. Christ existed from the beginning, He is the Alpha and the Omega. Lrn2John's writings.

[Anonymous No.19992935]

>>19990623
>trad
>anime jezebel posting
Kys

[Anonymous No.19992941]

>>19992919
>Wrong, Jesus' earthly flesh tabernacle dwelling was conceived in her womb.
As a human, you are a soul and a body. When you undertake a physical action, it is not that just your body did it -- you did it. It is why our bodies our resurrected. So it is with Christ, who is fully human. If his body was conceived in Mary's womb then he (God) was conceived in Mary's womb. It does not mean that his existence originated there, as I already said.

This all figures of course, whenever someone objects to the term "mother of God" they have to reject orthodox Christology. This is why the term was used a marker of orthodoxy in the early church.

[Anonymous No.19992960]

>>19992941
>When you undertake a physical action, it is not that just your body did it
You're trying to slip a fallacy by right there. "You" command your physical body as a tool. Your physical body is not "you".
>It is why our bodies our resurrected
When Christ returned from death no one recognized Him physically. He had *a* body, but it had been transformed. The only physically recognizable aspect were His wounds, otherwise people only knew it was Him by things that He said. There is nothing to indicate that our resurrection bodies will be the exact same ones we have now, which would make no sense anyway considering our physical bodies can be destroyed and definitely decay.

[Anonymous No.19992971]

[Anonymous No.19992985]

>>19992960
This is gnosticism. Your body doesn't actually matter and is not "you" but just a flesh machine you're in at the moment. All these beliefs come from anti-Catholicism. You have to find a way to get out of the traditional understanding so this is what you come up with.
>Luke 24:16 But their eyes were kept from recognizing him.
You are twisting the text to justify this as well. As Christ says,
>Luke 24:39 See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; handle me, and see.
As a human being he is united to his body. Your understanding is severely distorted.

[Anonymous No.19993014]

>>19992985
>gnosticism
Pardon my laughing at anyone who was suckered into heretical praying to Ishtar from a gnostic fan fiction influencing the church.
>he
>his
*He
*His

[Anonymous No.19993019]

>>19993014
I accept your concession of defeat.

[Anonymous No.19993154]

I found a book online that was written in Serbia to refute Orthodoxy (from an Evangelical perspective) and was translated into English. It goes through all the various Orthodox doctrines and is fairly long. I skipped to the end where it provides a historical justification of Evangelicalism and it uses the fucking Baptist Trail of Blood. What a disappointment, man.

[Anonymous No.19993172]

>>19993154
Here's the book by the way (it's free)
https://orthodoxy-illuminated.weebly.com/read-online.html

[Anonymous No.19993194]

Going to go searching for old Bibles to save. Would I get my best results at a Church bookstore, Goodwill, or a Church supplies store? I'm looking for Bibles from like the 30s-50s, but don't want to pay eBay prices if I know there are probably stores giving them away for $2.

[Anonymous No.19993201]

>>19993172
>informs people of Ishtar disguised as Mary
The author seems to know exactly what he is talking about, based.

[Anonymous No.19993204]

I'm asking in good faith, how do Protestants explain the angel Gabriel addressing Mary with a royal greeting?

[Anonymous No.19993207]

>>19993194
I've found a pretty good many at Goodwills over the years but haven't looked in the last 12 so no idea if that is still a good resource.

[Anonymous No.19993209]

>>19993201
The Trail of Blood is completely false, though.

[Anonymous No.19993240]

>>19993209
>completely
Definitely not, it's at least significantly true, and Christ Himself mentioned it. Just like the Jews, the Catholics killed many, many true believers because truth and true believing comes into conflict with their "business interests".

[Anonymous No.19993249]

>>19993240
You need to actually work this out historically, though. The groups that are appealed to in this regard (Montanists, Novatianists, Donatists, Albigensians, etc.) are not anything like the contemporary Baptist. Even the 16th century Anabaptists are a fully separate group who now exist as the Amish, Mennonites, etc.

[Anonymous No.19993274]

>>19993249
>work this out historically
>are not anything like
This is all natural worldly and not spiritual paradigms. You're too lodged into requiring specific institutions to have special validity. The seed of Christ's true ekklesia was maintained even by members of the Catholic and "Orthodox™" institutions, but not the institutions themselves. That seed can replant itself anywhere at any time. The Jews had completely corrupted and lost their true "church" and it was restored under Josiah from a spiritual reaction with rediscovery and direct reading of Scripture which contained everything necessary up to that point within God's revelation. God is a planter of seeds, grower of trees/vines, shepherd of sheep, and fisher of men.

[Anonymous No.19993285]

>>19993274
Do you know what the Trail of Blood is that I am talking about? If you want to say the church can be corrupted or lost or it subsisted within Catholicism or whatever, that is not what I'm referring to. It's a specific theory made up by fundamentalist Baptists that the true church (Baptists) existed since the apostolic age and just went under various names (the ones I gave earlier). It falls apart once you actually investigate any of these groups and find out what they believed.

[Anonymous No.19993320]

>>19993285
I'm saying that the essential proposition of the Baptists in that regard is true, but not the specifics. Note also that I said "even by members of", which is not limited to. You also must learn to see beyond the limits of thinking the totality of a seed must be contained only in one individual at a time. Just like http packets, it can be broken up into many bits carried through various individuals then reassembled in others. And like the theoretically ideal internet, it re routes around "damaged" sections and nodes. God is far more grand and wise than we understand.

[Anonymous No.19993863]

>>19993320
BTW, this should also address the common ill of thinking that oneself must hold total and totally correct knowledge on every aspect, which is not only absurd, but impossible to say the very least. All of those who came to be believers when literally face to face with Jesus were just regular people with wide varieties of understandings of the Scriptures and their implications even up to that point of history, and none were blasted with the vast teachings and implications that would come to be recorded into the NT afterwards. All that was required of them was a very basic understanding and an acceptance of Christ as Savior. Even Christ Himself told us of the doctrinally heretical Good Samaritan whom He considered a legitimate member of His Body over the Levite who was literally an orthodox priest.

So, as the seed of Christ's true church can pass through many individuals and institutions in parts and reassemble in varying degrees of whole in certain nodes along the historical way, all that is truly required of a given node, aside from acceptance of Christ as Savior, etc., is the parts of understanding necessary for that particular part of His Body to function according to the Father's will for *it* (the given node, and both believers and institutions can function as types of node), with each member having its own types and arrays of "gifts" and purposes within the Father's greater will.

Let them with ears to hear...

[Anonymous No.19993873]

[Anonymous No.19993909]

>>19988198
>Reject Christ
No thank you heretic, kys russiafag

[Anonymous No.19993972]

>>19991749
I get the pull towards Islam since they feel so much more healthy and alive at the moment, but I just can’t overlook the fact that Islam doesn’t fit with history, the previous Scriptures or the personal experiences I’ve had. Islam is a demonic deception. Stay strong and endure.

[Anonymous No.19994052]

>>19988198
Begone demon, this needless war is killing thousands of Orthodox Christians

[Anonymous No.19994088]

My mother in law says that when she was a girl in Sunday School they used to teach almost solely the New Testament, but now they teach mostly (though not solely) the Old Testament. She says it's a subtle attempt to undermine Christ's message and to make Christianity more Jewish. Is there any truth in this?

[Anonymous No.19994124]

>>19993972
>Islam is a demonic deception
I agree, certainly seems that way. In terms of number of followers, Islam is the most successful heresy to come from the patristic era.

> There is up to now the still-prevailing people-deceiving practice [θρησκεία] of the Ishmaelites, being the forerunner of the Antichrist. It takes its origin from Ishmael, who was born to Abraham from Hagar, and for this reason they are called Hagarenes and Ishmaelites. They also call them Saracens, allegedly for having been sent away by Sarah empty; for Hagar said to the angel, ‘Sarah has sent me away empty’. These people worshiped and venerated the morning star and Aphrodite, whom they themselves called Habar in their own language, which means ‘great’. Therefore they were clearly idolaters until the time of Heraclius, from which time a false prophet appeared to them named Muhammad, who chanced upon the Old and New Testaments, and conversing in like manner with an Arian monk, introduced a sect of his own. And on the pretext of having made himself seem a God-fearing person to the people, he reported that a Scripture was brought down to him from heaven by God. So having put together some sayings in his book, worthy of laughter, he thus handed the object of wonder down to them.
St. John of Damascus

[Anonymous No.19994127]

>>19994088
I don’t think that can be completely counted out. Judaizing is a perennial heresy among Christians, arising when people forget that the Gospels are the pinnacle of the Christian canon.

[Anonymous No.19994130]

>>19994088
Who knows what her specific church is or isn't doing or why outside of those who are there and those who are doing the preaching there. I've been in churches for 5 decades and heard plenty from all through the entire Holy Bible.

[Anonymous No.19994140]

>>19994130
She's talking specifically about education rather than eucharistic readings (which always have both), and she's lived in the 3 biggest Commonwealth Anglo countries.

[Anonymous No.19994175]

>>19994124
Though I am highly critical of Islam, I’m still fascinated by it. It’s exactly what Paul was warning us against. Beware of angels of light preaching another Gospel. And behold, Muhammad is choked out by an ‘angel’ in a cave and is told to preach that every single doctrine of Christianity is false—crucifixion, atonement, trinity, incarnation, even the Bible itself, which is ‘corrupted’. Muhammad then tries to commit suicide but is stopped by the ‘angel’ every time. Looking at the early sources such as St. John of Damascus’ is very interesting, especially in how he correctly identifies it as a heresy from Christianity. This, I think, is even clearer in the earliest sources we have on Islam, which are fascinating. According to according to the Maronite Chronicle, a Syriac Christian source from the mid to late 7th century A.D., Muʻāwiya, the first Umayyad caliph, is depicted as going to Golgotha, visiting Gethsemane and praying at the tomb of Mary. Muslims would have no reason to visit Golgotha or Gethsamane. There is also a purportedly early dialogue where Jacob of Sedreh reports that the ‘Hagarenes’ follow the Torah, and that the Emir was surrounded by learned Jews, and John bar Penkaye who says essentially the same thing. I think that early Islam may have been far closer to heretical branches of Christianity, or was some sort of movement of Ishmaelites who syncretized heretical Christianity and Judaism with various Arab pagan ideas such as jinn, the Kaaba, etc. Other early sources like Sebeos and Sozomen (the latter was pre-Islam) support this, and mention how the Ishmaelites had been becoming conscious of their heritage in the centuries before Islam and were adopting Hebrew practices.

[Anonymous No.19994186]

>>19994140
Sounds like an issue specific to a particular institution. Institutions are pretty much always trouble.

[Anonymous No.19994200]

[Anonymous No.19994530]

>>19994175
There definitely exists an element of intrigue when studying heresiology. Islam is just so alien to the Christian norm, lets take a look at table manners for example, that it seems to me that it absolutely had otherworldly sinister origins. It had to start out as a way to draw people away from Christ before they can get evangelized. The Christian truth is simplicity in living, piety, humility, discretion, discernment, discrimination, between all the various contrasts throughout all of creation, visible and invisible, and so obviously moderation in everything. Faith in Christ leads to a cool calm head in any situation, + we go out of our way for the good of our neighbor. The way Islam spread, so fast and violent, is a clear indication that there are malignant forces out there who want to stay hidden and prevent Christ’s message from being heard. Also I don’t see much happiness or even a proper humane way of living from the ignorant masses across the Muslim populous thinking they serve God. Also since like the Jews and the atheists, they couldn’t expect too much help from the Holy Spirit, the comforter, which is substituted by out worldly, juridical religious practices.

[Anonymous No.19994585]

>>19994530
Good post. I think you’re right when you insinuate that Islam is a worldly religion at its core. Is man even fallen in Islam? Is death a natural part of Allah’s plan? This is the take-away I get. The fall narrative in the Qur’an seems to have no lasting consequences, and Adam himself was created as a ‘khalifa’ or viceregent for Allah on earth to establish Allah’s laws, rule and to worship Allah alone. This world seems to be already good and fine as it is, and can be perfected in this world through Islamic legalism. Again it is basically an inversion of Christianity. This is why I despise and reject the term ‘Abrahamic religions’—I have nothing in common with Muslims and Jews, who do not reject the Son, and thus the Father as well. I pity Muslims in a way though. Most of them will never hear the Gospel due to the nature of totalitarian Islamic societies.

[Anonymous No.19994882]

>>19994585
>the Holy Quran
>homicide isn’t homicide
>bloodmoney
>human shields
wew

And firetrucks? The Bible speaks for itself. If you try proving a single word of it false, you’ll either prove it true or wind up with dogma impossible to prove false. Now if you go ahead and apply the gospel teachings to your everyday life, and pick up the light yoke of Christ and do the will of your heavenly Father, instead of the heavy yoke of doing what you want, you’ll witness the words, the prophecies all coming true, Jesus is your only ticket out of a fallen state of ignorance, corruption, and severe illness of sin. It was Christ who revealed the truth about His Father’s righteousness and benevolence, and very literally there is no way onto the Father without the Son. We know this from practice because God’s grace illumines hearts and minds. And obviously as a Christian on your way, the closer you come to God, the more He reveals His mysteries to you, the bigger of a target you become for all the enemies of God. The deception a Christian should be slicing through, and honestly... ready for martyrdom at any given moment. So I’m definitely willing to pick up the anti-islam polemic and defend it with a simple “my God is the real God, He will tear your god butt into confetti”. But truly a worldly oriented mind is no friend of Christendom. I cannot begin to stress how important it is that Christian dogma be taken seriously, and laid as an absolute foundation for everything else, I don’t see a way to succeed even at mundane day to day tasks without guidance from the uncreated light.

[Anonymous No.19995033]

Brainlet here, I'm reading Romans 7-9 right now and getting filtered hard. Is Paul saying that men have two wills that pull in opposite directions? I've heard the term 'gnomic will' before in Orthodox discussions, is that related?

[Anonymous No.19995793]

>>19994124
Regarding the Quran supposedly being delivered to Muhammad by the angel Gabriel, you can find this incident (pic related) in the Sayings of the Desert Fathers. An odd coincidence, wouldn't you say?

>So having put together some sayings in his book, worthy of laughter,

That is the impression I get from much of the Quran. Take for example this verse, Surah 33:53

>O believers! Do not enter the homes of the Prophet without permission and if invited for a meal, do not come too early and linger until the meal is ready. But if you are invited, then enter on time. Once you have eaten, then go on your way, and do not stay for casual talk. Such behaviour is truly annoying to the Prophet, yet he is too shy to ask you to leave. But Allah is never shy of the truth.

What the fuck is this? It's so obviously uninspired and man-made it's absurd.

[Anonymous No.19995915]

>>19992545
Still here? There's a great chart on the wiki. /Christian/ reading list, or something close to that.

[Anonymous No.19996001]

>>19995033
I understand from it that we're sinful beings, and have to condemn the works of the flesh, and live through the Spirit. Hence Galatians 5:24
We are naturally sinful, but have to act against it, to be free in Christ Jesus.
It's not two wills, but choosing between remaining in the slavery of sin, or fighting to be shown the glory of God.

Romans 8:5
sinful nature, or God's will.

[Anonymous No.19996189]

>When compared with the gods of Roman and Greek mythology, Celsus found the Christian God sadly lacking, and declared that he could not be a god as he was neither all-knowing nor all-powerful. Celsus could deduce no explanation for the actions of the Christian God, such as the floods, natural disasters, and the introduction of evil into the world, except that God wanted to draw attention to his greatness because he felt humanity was giving him "less than his due".[10] Celsus concluded that Christians used the explanation of God "testing" them to disguise the fact that their God was not powerful enough to successfully fight Satan, but was instead "helpless".[11] Celsus wrote that Satan was either a mortal invention used by Christians to frighten others into believing their philosophies and joining them, or if he did indeed exist then he was proof that God was not all-powerful, but rather a weak lesser god and a bad one, for only a vindictive and insecure being would punish mankind for being tricked by an evil that he has been too weak to stop.[12] The apparent "blind faith" of the Christians was bewildering to Celsus, and he used it to further support his claim that Christianity was a false religion. In his opinion, the main tenet of Christianity was "Do not ask questions, just believe" and "Thy faith will save thee".

Still unrefuted.

[Anonymous No.19996449]

Is Hell anything more than second death after having witnessed God and Christ?

[Anonymous No.19996537]

>>19996189
A pagan idolater attacking a strawman. nothing new.

[Anonymous No.19996609]

>>19996449
Jesus warns us that “the worm never dies and fire is never quenched”. So you can be sure of judgement, but the circumstances of which remain a mystery until bodily death. We’re told of a resurrection and the part from Revelation that John was commanded to omit. The Lord tell us many times in His parables that what we do in the life is plant seeds for the next life. Hell/gehenna/lake of fire is pretty much exactly what it sounds like, unsavory.

[Anonymous No.19996673]

Raised Mormon here, it's taken me close to 3 years to fully accept it but I can finally say that I understand and believe in the doctrine of the Trinity. I can't believe I ever believed anything else. If Christ was not fully God and fully man, then the faith is dead. Reading the gospel of John closely was what pushed me over the edge, and now I can't see how anyone can look at it and claim anything otherwise.

[Anonymous No.19996692]

>>19996609
I like Lewis' idea of a part of it. If we fail God, besides all that unsavoryness, you will feel the shame of that failure.
Imagine being eternally tormented by the shame of knowing God turned His face away from you forever, and that it is your fault. weeping and gnashing of teeth indeed.

[Anonymous No.19996701]

>>19996673
Glad you got out anon. That is the answer to everything, studying the Bible.
Anything you'd like to chat about? Nice to have a brother find truth.

[Anonymous No.19996703]

>>19996673
That is good to hear, anon. Praise God.

[Anonymous No.19996750]

>>19996189
The flood was triggered from how people treat each other, not the lack of giving God "due".

[Anonymous No.19996919]

>>19996692
Basically yes, how can God save you if you don’t let Him? Hell is a choice, Jesus made it real simple for us, we have all the tools we’ll ever need to avoid it, always within us.

[Anonymous No.19997729]

Ok I'm trying to understand sheol vs hell as in OT vs NT
I know in Luke with the story about the rich man and Lazarus it's obviously hell (torment, flames, etc.)
But in the OT, Samuel's spirit for example is called up and surely Samuel would not be in hell so where was he?
I guess a better question is what happens to the soul upon death since resurrection as described in revelation is when the dead are called up and given a new body at the end of this "world" we live in currently? Is the soul basically dormant prior to judgement at the end of the world? If so why is the rich man asking for someone to go warn his family before they die? Wouldn't this mean he was judged already?

[Anonymous No.19997735]

I found peak Ortholarp:
https://youtu.be/xVzLEcrcHUo
Orthodox for 2 months and he's already spent thousands on books.

[Anonymous No.19997779]

>>19997735
holy shit, the eastern europeaness is strong in this larper.

[Anonymous No.19997890]

If Christ (pbuh) knew he was going to be resurrected and enjoy everlasting paradise after his ordeal, then how was his sacrifice genuine?

[Anonymous No.19998284]

>Orthodox considers Jan Hus a saint
>Catholics still seething about Martin Luther

[Anonymous No.19998484]

>>19998284
>>Orthodox considers Jan Hus a saint
I am fairly sure this is not true.

[Anonymous No.19998544]

>>19997735
Hard to watch

[Anonymous No.19998964]

>>19998544
Out of that whole video, I just bought
The Apostolic Fathers: Greek Texts and English Translations by Holmes. Everything else seemed excessive, stuff I already had, or too Ortholarp specific.

[Anonymous No.19999027]

>>19997890
>how was being totally innocent and good but willingly submitting to immeasurably excruciating torture to death for our sins a genuine sacrifice

[Anonymous No.19999072]

>>19999027
Willingly submitting yourself to torture is only a sacrifice if you don't know you're going to enjoy paradisiacal eternity after the ordeal, otherwise it's just a painful inconvenience.

[Anonymous No.19999152]

>>19999072
It's all fun and games when it's only concepts in your imagination.

[Anonymous No.19999654]

>>19992231
Ritual impurity from bodily fluids =/= sin.

[Anonymous No.19999661]

>>19992370
I hate individualism so much it's unreal.

[Anonymous No.19999730]

>>19997735
Must…buy…product…I NEED my icons!

This guy is like an Orthodox paypig

[Anonymous No.19999752]

>>19997735
why is he using an ironing board as a desk?

[Anonymous No.19999761]

>>19999752
Does the Orthodox Church sell desks?

[Anonymous No.19999858]

>>19999730
The weird thing is he bought so many liturgical books and shit that a layman doesn't need. There are plenty of actual practical books you could get.

[Anonymous No.19999870]

>>19999661
>Thomas Aquinas isn't an individual
>what (You) hate matters

[Anonymous No.19999911]

>>19999661
That's what Protestantism is, the apotheosis of the individual. All truth is filtered through the self. Nothing is true unless you approve of it. There is nothing higher than you which can command your authority. You yourself are the ultimate arbiter of all reality. The Protestant God is the Protestant himself.

[Anonymous No.20000174]

Where can I download Scivias? I tried all the usual sites but nothing in English.

[Anonymous No.20000535]

>>19988198
ALL CATHOLICS OUT!
This has been your only warning.

[Anonymous No.20000546]

>>20000535
Can Russia do humanity a favor and spare a nuke for the city that hosts Twitter's servers?

[Anonymous No.20000584]

>>19997729
>no answer
Welp

[Anonymous No.20000640]

>>19999911
>all truth must be filtered through *our* god men
>nothing is true unless *we* approve of it
>there is nothing higher than *us* on earth
>*we* represent God, not you, His Body
>*we* are the ultimate arbiters of all reality
>*our* God is *our* institution itself
>bow before *us*
>kiss *our* hand
>call *us* Father
>who cares what "the Bible" says
>*WE* MADE "THE BIBLE"
>*we* are God
Yeah, I'll take a few quibbling mistakes here and there over your massive piles of gold plated, gem studded dung.

[Anonymous No.20000707]

>>20000546
Only if humanity does Russia a favor.

[Anonymous No.20000728]

>>20000640
The "we" you refer to are the authorities put in place by Christ. He did not leave the church without leadership, he left us with the apostles and their successors. In Protestantism there is no leadership or authority, because there is no possible way that a binding decision can be made about anything. This is the opposite to the early functioning of the church in which issues could actually be settled, for example at the council of Jerusalem in Acts.

[Anonymous No.20000776]

>>20000535
Seems no one was hurt, thankfully. There is a religious component to this war. Russia severed communion with the Ecumenical Patriarch over his recognition of the autocephaly of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine, which had previous been under the Moscow Patriarchate. Not hard to see their anti-western religious sentiment be directed at Catholicism.

[Anonymous No.20000800]

>>19997735
>lots of books bad
The kid is off the streets and got himself a fine hobby. God bless him.

[Anonymous No.20000887]

>>19999911
natural view of a free man as Jesus taught the kingdom is within. other side of the spectrum is bootlicking the hive-mind reddit pope.

[Anonymous No.20000898]

>>20000887
Were the first Christians bootlickers of the Apostles then?

[Anonymous No.20000918]

>>20000898
Christ didn't follow Apostles + Christ is not historiological.

History = refuted by Christ.

[Anonymous No.20000946]

>>20000918
>Christ didn't follow Apostles
Christ is God and the Apostles were his appointed teachers and authorities over the church. No one claims that Christ follows them. Are you retarded?
>Christ is not historiological.
Yes he most certainly is. God became man at a specific point in history, was crucified, died, and was resurrected, all completely literally and within time and space. If you do not believe this you are not a Christian.

[Anonymous No.20000976]

>>20000946
Apostles were witnesses to the Event which opened a path for men to become free, to become themselves. beyond that anything spoken is not truthful but speculations that lead astray.
>If you do not believe this you are not a Christian.
if you say so but it is nothing to me. the Truth is beyond words, labels, allegiances, identities, and all and everything. and that is how I understand Protensantism: Faith is the highest Mystery between your soul and the source of the divine and none shall interfere. all else is utterly disgusting chatter and variations of the wordly abominations that deserve cold-blooded contempt.

[Anonymous No.20000998]

>>20000976
>Apostles were witnesses to the Event which opened a path for men to become free, to become themselves. beyond that anything spoken is not truthful but speculations that lead astray.
False. Christ specifically gave them authority in matters of the faith.

Mt. 16:18-19 "And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the powers of death shall not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

Mt. 18:18 "Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."

Jn. 20:21-13 Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

1 Cor. 14:37 If any one thinks that he is a prophet, or spiritual, he should acknowledge that what I am writing to you is a command of the Lord.

>the Truth is beyond words, labels, allegiances, identities, and all and everything. blah blah...
You follow a religion that have made up within your mind, nothing more. See it here, people, this is what Protestantism is. You can believe literally anything. There is no set truth, no authority, no doctrine. The only limit is what you can conjure up in your brain. Christ can be a metaphor, an allegory, doesn't matter, and who are anyone that he is wrong, because the truth is within himself. This is the road to Hell.

[Anonymous No.20001000]

>>20000998
>and who are anyone that he is wrong
and who are you to tell anyone that he is wrong*

[Anonymous No.20001061]

>>20000976
Faith is not a mystery. I know exactly what I have faith in. In God’s infinite love, grace, and mercy, which outweigh my sins against Him.

[Anonymous No.20001071]

>>20000998
>See it here, people, this is what Protestantism is.
I speak only for my self and my own Protest against an abysmal insolence of any wordly shill-schemes.
>The only limit is what you can conjure up in your brain.
not in my brain but with the capacity of my soul: to the extent of how purified I am -- I am revealed the truth. clear, is it not? either way, communitarian chuds on suicide clock.

[Anonymous No.20001077]

>>20001071
>I am revealed the truth
See? There it is. You are the arbiter of truth. Protestantism in a nutshell.

[Anonymous No.20001081]

>>20001061
that's cool, your Faith is not a mystery. but mine is. can we make peace at that? or will I need to ukraine you. (tell me quick)

[Anonymous No.20001085]

>>20001081
No, because you are a servant of the devil.

[Anonymous No.20001093]

>>20000918
>>20000976
>Jesus wasn't real
Is this extreme protestantism?

[Anonymous No.20001099]

>>20000728
The fruits of the Catholic "Church™" show that it is not of Him. Christ and the Apostles founded an ekklesia, and every individual who makes up that ekklesia walks in His Way. There is no single earthly institution, nor is one needed, but we are members of many earthly institutions. You are blinded to us. You cannot see one of us when we are standing right in front of (You). You think yourself superior to us.

[Anonymous No.20001100]

>>20001077
>You are the arbiter of truth. Protestantism in a nutshell.
my higher soul is, yes. why?
>>20001093
>>Jesus wasn't real
Christ is Real. but he more Real than history written by incel propagandists.
>>20001085
>your the devil-fascist, I will denazify you
>*AAAAAAAGHGHHHH*
every time bros..

[Anonymous No.20001130]

I am on the fence about Christianity. Can you guys help?

I think there is historical validity behind the resurrection of Jesus Christ which is what compels me to look favorably upon it. I also think it helped Europe maintain a functional society for many years.

The reservations I have about it are as follows. It seems to me that morality does not come from God but rather is derived from trial and error. Even Christian morality was derived through trial and error it just was articulated as “God seems to be pleased when I do x” which is equivalent to saying “things tend to go well for people when they do x.”

It seems a lot about Christianity attempts to depreciate life and natural instincts in favor of the suppression of those instincts and an idealized afterlife. It teaches you to deny tribalism in favor of egalitarianism, dominance in favor of submission, indulgence in favor of self-denial, and power in favor of forgiveness. It's main virtue is sympathy which simply makes the misery of suffering contagious to others and promotes a negative view of life. When the West stopped believing in God they were left with this distaste of life that made them fall into nihilism.

I disagree with egalitarianism. I think the liberal acceptance, toleration, and inclusion found in the west today has it's roots in the Christian idea that we all have souls and are therefore equal. Also the originally Christian virtue of sympathy has been perverted into applying to homosexuals and thus making people anti-Christian.

What do you guys think?

[Anonymous No.20001133]

>>20001099
>The fruits of the Catholic "Church™"
The spread of Christianity throughout the world? Haha.
>Christ and the Apostles founded an ekklesia, and every individual who makes up that ekklesia walks in His Way. There is no single earthly institution, nor is one needed
Quite clearly there is. Christ prayed that his disciples would be in unity, that we would all be one (Jn. 17:11). Protestantism is a chaos of disunity. You do not share communion, you do not share beliefs. When you find this or that thing you actually agree on you say, "Oh well this is the essential, the things that we don't agree on are not," as if you have any way to determine such a thing. And then other Protestants disagree with you even on that and will not share fellowship with you. Is this what Christ mean? Don't make me laugh.
>but we are members of many earthly institutions.
You have absolutely zero (0) evidence of this in the text of scripture. It is a post hoc justification that you have created for the current state of Protestantism

[Anonymous No.20001142]

>>19988280
> yeah im just going to go sin for a while, ill be back though!

Fuck off, scum.

[Anonymous No.20001144]

>>20001130
I think you're seeing what happens when people reject God and then blaming God for it.

[Anonymous No.20001147]

>>20000800
This is essentially exactly what I said in the /his/ Christianity gen and no one saw fit to depart from the desire to enjoy judgement for being less than some sort of highest potential ideal. I can't help but wonder how the actualities of their lives compare to either their own projected ideals, or even his simple yet abundant joy found in sperging over books related to God.

[Anonymous No.20001155]

>>20001081
Go ahead Ukraine me

[Anonymous No.20001158]

>>20000800
>>20001147
You have to understand that even in Christian threads this is still 4chan, a bunch of extremely angry young men who are also extremely lonely debating with each other. When they see someone happy they attack him.

[Anonymous No.20001166]

>>20001133
>Christ prayed that his disciples would be in unity
Yes He did, but then the Catholics took on massive tons of heresy and proclaimed themselves the earthly kings of God. Enjoy simping for Pharaoh.

[Anonymous No.20001169]

>>20001147
Frankly I see myself in him. I will not judge him, but I think, generally speaking, that this sort of behavior is an attempt to take on an iidentity through consumerist behavior. If there's something truly good in the video it is that he says he is part of a Church as a catechumen. If he is experiencing the unbalance I am referring to (which he may not be, I do not know), the reality will either heal this or it will drive him out.

[Anonymous No.20001173]

>>20001158
Even on 4chan this is still a Christian thread. So who is ultimately in charge?

[Anonymous No.20001181]

>>20001158
Oh, I understand that quite well. That's why it is so necessary for God to call some of us here to serve as their surrogate fathers and provide them with admonishing guidance in their absence of real dads.

[Anonymous No.20001185]

>>20001166
These things are not unique to Rome. Veneration of Mary, prayer to saints, prayer for the dead, these were ubiquitous all throughout the Christian world. This was the Christianity of Europe, Greece, Russia, Egypt, Ethiopia, Syria, Palestine, Armenia, on and on. The idea that it is not apostolic is Eurocentric and frankly absurd. The Reformers blamed these things on the Popes because they simple didn't know the state of the wider world.

[Anonymous No.20001201]

>>20001181
I grew up without a father. I need a real man to teach me about virtue, about how to be pious and humble. Are you the one anon? Will you be my spiritual elder? Can I call you geronda?

[Anonymous No.20001203]

>>20001169
>Frankly I see myself in him.
Indeed, even if in oddly fitting ways. I just think it's at least preferable to sports stats, porn, video games, obsessions over corporate fantasy properties (Marvel, etc.), on and on and on, the things of this world that people fill their minds and souls with. Even an imperfect approach to God beats all of that mess by a long way.

[Anonymous No.20001219]

>>20001201
No, I'm just using an assholish way of trying to slap some of these faggots down a few pegs in their self superiorities, but growing up without a father or father figure is nothing that I find "funny" in the least, when you get down to reality in this wicked, hard world. God bless and keep (You).

[Anonymous No.20001225]

>>20001201
You can call me Pappy.

[Anonymous No.20001227]

>>20001173
I dont think you understand.

[Anonymous No.20001232]

>>20001219
>in their self superiorities
those holding to superiority are of the satan, true. it is like feeding on a weaker one, it restates the pyramid of injustice.

[Anonymous No.20001235]

>>20001203
It is infinitely better, even if someone is "faking" or truly doesnt feel the call of Christ its still better that he has an interest in Christ at all, rather than turn from the concept of religion altogether and embrace.. i dunno, whatever was said above.. flesh light collections or my little ponies.

[Anonymous No.20001257]

>>20001232
>it is like feeding on a weaker one
Yes, in the desperate attempt to cover their own weaknesses, not only from others, but from themselves. The one most essential thing that "4chan culture" lacks is the realization that only those who exalt themselves should be abased, and the humble should be exalted.
>>20001235
Agreed, even the most surface interest in God is preferable to deep interests in anything else. Also, God is a planter of seeds and grower of trees, there is no telling what it will do within him over time.

[Anonymous No.20001296]

>>20001257
>those who exalt themselves should be abased, and the humble should be exalted.
but do you draw a line between those exalting themselves in an autistic manner and those exalting by submitting others? to me the second is satanic while the first one is alright: a based madman screeching his own autistic truth despite all odds. that is very '4channey' to my taste. I wouldn't even protest if someone standing up declaring himself a Christ (in the last instance). 'alright, man, just do what is right.'

[Anonymous No.20001328]

>>20001201
I hope you find what you are looking for, anon. I also did not have a father, and has various deleterious effects. Frankly I don't know how I would even interact with a man in such a role.

[Anonymous No.20001333]

>>20001296
It sometimes requires a lot of nuance to determine, but an easy example is self exaltation over personally meritless things like genetics, the "post chin" types. There's a lot of belittling others for looking a little "funny" and that sort of thing. When you truly understand that at *least* to the extent of aspects completely out of one's own control, God made you who you are, and them who they are, then you also realize you are belittling God by belittling them. This isn't even touching into the inner beings and how much control or not we have over that via free will, etc. (and even that amount of control is not necessarily uniform among us all).

[Anonymous No.20001335]

>>19988198
>first post in is an ortholarper
Yeah I'm going back to /christian/ on infinity chan.

[Anonymous No.20001336]

>>20001201
I also grew up without a father. What helped me fill the void was national socialism. Read Mein Kampf.

[Anonymous No.20001337]

>>20001335
I havent paid attention 2 it since Tarrant, whats it like now.

[Anonymous No.20001349]

>>20001335

[Anonymous No.20001357]

>>20001336
I’m convinced that everyone who says to ‘read Mein Kampf’ on this website hasn’t read it, because if they did they’d know it’s really not all that interesting or powerful compared to his speeches

[Anonymous No.20001363]

New Thread
>>20001360

[Anonymous No.20001364]

>>20001335
There aren't many of them in this thread, so you are safe.

[Anonymous No.20001367]

>>20001364
Its only you and I brother, the sole true Catholics on /lit/.

[Anonymous No.20001373]

>>20001367
Look at this terrible thread they have made: >>20001363
I want to make a different one but our dear Janny might get upset

[Anonymous No.20001387]

>>20001373
>the natural Catholic instinct to wish full control over the Bible and lament when others are equally stewards of God's word

[Anonymous No.20001413]

>>20001333
triple trips.
>God made you who you are, and them who they are, then you also realize you are belittling God by belittling them.
well said.
uniform amogus is truly sus. at times I feel much love.. bless those who are blessed and let those who suffer be released.

[Anonymous No.20001437]

>>20001387
If you would prefer the threads to not devolve into bickering like this it would be better to make an ecumenical or neutral OP.

[Anonymous No.20001501]

>>20001437
>One Trve Chrich
>yaaaaaas queen

>One True Bible
>noooooooooooo

[Anonymous No.20001509]

>>20001501
Grow up mate

[Anonymous No.20001521]

>>20001509
no not me never

[Anonymous No.20001533]

>>20001521
1 Cor. 13:11 When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child; when I became a man, I gave up childish ways.

[Anonymous No.20001569]

>>20001533
"And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven." Matthew 18:3

[Anonymous No.20001571]

>>20001569
When he said the meant making childish insults on an anime forum.

[Anonymous No.20001895]

>>20001509
Cry more papist heretic.

[Anonymous No.20002032]

>>20001895
t. the prot cries out in pain as it strikes you

[Anonymous No.20002171]

>>20002032
>prot
Wrong

[Anonymous No.20002523]

>>20001144
spot on.

[Anonymous No.20002536]

ITT
>anons having a denominational slapfight
>other anons basically chatting about finding God and following His commandments
Can we do less of the former and more of the latter? It was quite a nice read.