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/lit/ - Literature


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19815980 No.19815980 [Reply] [Original]

#truth. my good bitches.

>> No.19815992
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19815992

>u/snuffles005 - Reddithttps://www.reddit.com › user › >snuffles005
>In my personal experience, California is the most trans friendly. The law is very relaxed, making it relatively easy for trans people to transition. There's ...

>> No.19815997

Regardless, proper English is much more stylish and pleasant to hear than niggerspeak. I don't deny that "finna", "knowmsayin", "yo", and the like are real words; but I do object to their use in civilised society.

>> No.19816015

>>19815997
you sound like a dork!

>> No.19816021

>>19815997
I shouldn't have to rhyme these words for you to know it's a rap, - Marshal Mathers, aka, M&M

>> No.19816043

>>19815980
What a stupid take.
When I say that such and such word doesn't exists, I'm not alluding to some fault or invalidity of their genesis. I'm alluding to the invalidity, inadequacy and repugnant nature of their referential objects.

>> No.19816052

annoying retarded libtard but shes right

>> No.19816054

>>19816043
What a faggatatious view

>> No.19816057

>>19816043
>inadequacy and repugnant nature

you sound like a faggot

>> No.19816061

>>19815980
oftentimes your language reflects your image of reality. that image can be more or less accurate, more or less useful.

>> No.19816064

>>19815980
Dictionaries should in fact be rulebooks, not records. I wonder if Medieval people who used Latin (scientists, etc) saw it that way

>> No.19816070

>>19816061
>less accurate, more or less useful.
Acoording to? For what?

>> No.19816073

>>19815997
This. No one is denying that the human mind can create degenerate creoles and pidgins that basically "work," if by work we mean the bare minimum linguistic functioning to allow deracinated pavement apes to buy corn syrup from one another.

It's like saying "um sweetie, all that paper with the Greek classics written on it? you know that's ummm paper right? sweetie? it can be just as easily used as toilet paper?" Yeah, we know, we're saying don't wipe shit on it, not that you CAN'T wipe shit on it.

>> No.19816085

>>19816070
material reality is real. facts don't care about your feelings. you will never pass. your gender hormones are XY. sex not being gender is a way to sneak tranny ideology into the mainstream as a non-negotiable fact.

>> No.19816086

>>19816064
They did see it as a rule book, one of the big issues with studying the period is that the scientists never could name their findings, just describe them, it really makes it a mess to untangle. Also, you are a moron.

>> No.19816089

I hate white people talking like this so much. It disgusts on a profound level. Wiggers are one thing, stuff like this really makes me want to screech like a chimp and gouge their eyes out

>> No.19816094
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19816094

>>19816089
educate yourself chud.

>> No.19816125

>>19816094
Why do they use exclamation marks at the end of every sentence? I've noticed girls do this a lot online. It's like they're trying to come off as jolly and nice or something, but it's overdone. The effeminate passive aggressiveness as well lmao.

>> No.19816134

>>19816094
While Steve sounds insufferable, he is right, that is pretty much what musicology is and has been since Bartok and his love of peasant music laid the ground work.

>> No.19816138

>>19816086
So basically what you're saying is that my ideal language would be to learn Latin and use it. It would stay forever pure.

>> No.19816140

>>19816073
>bare minimum
what are you even saying retard

>> No.19816151
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19816151

>>19816085
stop thinking about trannies

>> No.19816156

>>19816138
Well yes that's why the Church used Latin exclusively until the 1960s and still has it as its official language. The Latin language is dead so it will never change.

>> No.19816162

>>19816138
No I am saying you are a moron and now you have confirmed it. But if you want your language to be pure just stick to grunting, you are clearly fluent already and you can not get much purer.

>> No.19816164

>>19815980
Leftists inevitably sound stupid and childish when they try to sound wise.

>> No.19816179

>>19816156
The irony here is that Medieval Latin actually changed a lot not only from Classical Latin but even into the Modern period.

In fact, Medieval Latin is actually part of why traditional studies of Classical languages in university strictly forbid novel composition in Latin and Greek.

>> No.19816189

>>19816162
Why so mad?

>>19816179
>strictly forbid novel composition in Latin and Greek.
Why?

>> No.19816198

>>19816156
lmfao you just proved his point

>> No.19816202

>>19816179
It didn't change that much you can still understand Mediaeval Latin if you know classical Latin. The thing that changed the most is that they used the dative case more instead of the accusative.

>> No.19816207

>>19816189
Does pretending that I am mad make you feel better about being a moron?

>> No.19816212

>>19816198
I was agreeing with him. I know we're on 4chan but that doesn't mean every single post is war.

>> No.19816213

>>19816207
you have such little understanding of language lol you think a language can never change?

>> No.19816223

>>19816212
sorry *has sex with you*

>> No.19816228

>>19816207
You're flinging insults and whatnot but you haven't been able to refute the idea that a static language is a good thing. I think it is.

>> No.19816240

>>19816189
To avoid contamination. Greek and Latin are "dead languages", meaning that nothing new is written in them. They're solvable problems. Eventually, every single scrap of Ancient Greek will be unearthed and pawed over. There will never be anything new in these languages. That means that increasingly minute details are studied. This means that the studies of these languages get increasingly sensitive to increasingly minor details.

But if someone were to write something simple, say a poem, as part of their studies, there'd be no way without incredible labor to determine that it wasn't in fact just some student's poem written today and not an ancient text that has survived on the back of a copy of St. Seetheopolosis homily "On Punishments" about why seeing women naked is gay but assfucking little boys is what Yahweh intended. This can lead to all sorts of enormous problems. Make a grammatical mistake, use the genitive in place of the dative? Now there's a dozen academic papers written on the implications that this poem opens up. What if you used the dual by mistake? Now suddenly there's literary theory out there on Greek polygamy. Invented a word? It's in dictionaries.

And there's ENORMOUS amounts of this stuff. Girls took up the traditional European practice of Cento (taking a poem and rearranging its lines to mean something else) and would write erotica to each other using the works of Homer, Plato, Thucydides, etc. What if any one of there bawdy love poems were to fall into a scholars hands? It's even worse today, as the average Classical scholar today was far less skilled with these languages than the average schoolgirl was two centuries ago (ironically, because today's scholastics, with the exception of Indo-Europeanists, don't actually compose in the languages that they study), so how is he to know?
>okay, so a bunch of time gets wasted, so what?
Time is money. Every second an academic is wasting trying to figure out this shitty exercise poem is hundreds of dollars in grant money down the tubes.

>> No.19816257

>>19816202
First you said
>>19816156
> it will never change.
Now you're saying
>It didn't change that much
So, given that you were also wrong once, why would you not take a minute to learn about the subject at hand instead of risking looking like a dumbass twice?

>> No.19816259

>more proof that trannies value degeneration, decay, degradation, breaking down of boundaries, destruction of form, homogenization of all things

wow thanks i didn't already know trannies were broken people who worship chaos out of cope because chaos destroyed their minds so hard that they willingly consented to destroying their bodies and lives too

>> No.19816270

>>19816257
If you try to read Old English you won't understand any of it. If you try to read Middle English you'll understand a bit but you'll struggle.
If you learn Latin you can read the classical and Mediaeval authors without worry.
Do you understand now?

>> No.19816282

>>19816259
>trannies value degeneration, decay, degradation, breaking down of boundaries, destruction of form, homogenization of all things
Stop it anon you make trannies sound based.

>> No.19816284

>>19815980
Every person I've met that was studying linguistics was a huge lefty. Is that just a coincidence or do you guys have the same experience? It seems odd that a field where you study language would be so politically charged.

>> No.19816297

>>19816284
Everywhere is left wing now. I studied maths and I don't think any of my classmates had right wing views. If I wasn't so arrogant, independently-minded, and narcissistic I probably would have followed the crowd and become like them.

>> No.19816305

>>19816270
Is that your final answer?

>> No.19816311

>>19816043
well put.

>> No.19816313
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19816313

>>19815992

>> No.19816316

>>19816228
You realize we are still constructing new latin words and never really stopped? All those scientific names for animals and the like are not forgotten knowledge or something. The only way a language can be static is if it is forgotten.

>> No.19816322

>>19815980
Nihilist revisionist commie shit, this guy is a criminal. Fucking MiniTrue cunts should be thrown at sea.
t. studied linguistics

>> No.19816335

>>19816322
are linguistics like fish sticks?

>> No.19816337

>>19815980
how will the world's languages ever survive without nonbinarydemiheteroromantikinochromepolysexual

>> No.19816342

>>19816240
>It's even worse today, as the average Classical scholar today was far less skilled with these languages than the average schoolgirl was two centuries ago (ironically, because today's scholastics, with the exception of Indo-Europeanists, don't actually compose in the languages that they study
So you're saying that people who write in dead languages understand them better than ia just reading?

>> No.19816347

>>19816342
not him but definitely. ever try writing a book? you learn more about grammar from writing a book than reading 100.

>> No.19816349

>>19816342
Correct. At least, for the overwhelmingly vast majority of people. Actually using the language in question to compose novel material makes you better at reading written material and understanding spoken material in that language. It

>> No.19816353

>>19816349
>>19816347
/wg/ would like a word with you

>> No.19816403

Based leftoids can never get mad and pull the buzzword card on me since the language is entirely valid, cope seethe, dilate and ywnbaw sorry this is social progress sweetie

>> No.19816408

>>19816353
i disagree with the other anon about writing a novel. you have to write a non-fiction book trying to convey complex ideas. this is where you really learn about grammar and its importance. and not simply an essay of a few pages, you need to try your hand at stringing multiple ideas together in a comprehensive and coherent explanation. if you're really genuine about literature then you can learn by writing fiction, but writing a sci-fi or fantasy novel is basically a waste of time.

>> No.19816420

>>19816342
I can only speak for myself but my Latin skills really took off when I started practicing prose composition more often. Actively using the language seems the fastest way to cement the grammar structures in your mind.

>> No.19816461

>>19815980
true. anyone who gets assblasted about "proper use" or "definitions" in a colloquial context is inherently lesser.

>> No.19816493

>>19816461
>it's okay to talk like a retarded nigger
>but if you speak properly you're LARPing
kys jew

>> No.19816512

>>19816342
Definitely. If you're composing shit you have to think actively about the rhetorical style of what you're making and pay way more attention to the specifics of tenses and word placement.

>> No.19816553

>>19816420
How did you practice composition? I don't have anyone to give feedback and correct me if I'm building bad or non-idiomatic habits.

>> No.19816555

>>19816493
I did not say, or even imply, either of those things. F for effort there, chief.

>> No.19816599
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19816599

>>19815980
>That word doesn’t exist

>> No.19816653

>>19816553
I got a book called Latin Prose Composition by North and Hillard and just did the exercises until I felt confident with it.
>feedback and correct me if I'm building bad or non-idiomatic habits.
There's a book Latin Phrasebook by Meissner which is handy for that. If ever you're in doubt as to what verb you should use or how to phrase something idiomatically you can just look it up

>> No.19816751

>>19816297
wow you're just so smart man

>> No.19817638

>>19816282
The only thing concerning is the suicide rates

>> No.19817769

>>19815980
Point taken, from now on I'm going to say "that word shouldn't exist" instead.

>> No.19817783

>>19815980
do people really need to study linguistics to understand this?

>> No.19817810

>>19815980
If you ever feel as smug as this man surely does there is a 99% chance that you are about to make yourself look stupid.
In this case Mr. Snuffles 005 makes an extremely trivial statement and in doing so pedantically avoids the actual sentiment expressed by someone when they criticize someone else for not speaking proper English or using "made up" words. Mr. Snuffles 005 deliberately ignores the substantial meaning the phrase "made up words" has: to indicate that specific neologisms are unwelcome or identify the user with degenerate elements.
Words are slowly changing their meaning year by year and people for the most part don't notice it. On the other hand when Bobby spends too much time on the internet and starts talking like a retard the uneducated family member simply identifies his "adapted" verbiage as made-up (not grounded in social practice, therefore not useful for communicating, therefore stupid).

>> No.19817863

>>19816021
That's not the quote.

>> No.19817889

>>19815980
everyone should put their cursor on the one in the photo so we can all be holding hands

>> No.19818481
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19818481

>>19817810
>Mr. Snuffles 005

>> No.19818937

>>19816043
>invalidity of their genesis
What a fucking queer

>> No.19819152

>>19815992
RENT FREE

>> No.19819294
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19819294

>tumblr thread
Hey, this is almost nostalgic!

Anyway, snowflake is right in this case, except for when it tried to sneak in the idea that one has an obligation to "adapt to an ever changing society" to "keep up with progress".
Just like dictionaries aren't rulebooks, the mere fact that new made-up words come into existence all the time isn't a good reason to replace your old made-up words. Language shapes thought, so if you would like to avoid being continually and subliminally manipulated, don't let weird ideology words into your head without at least thinking about it first. If you use twitter-words routinely, even if you're doing it 'ironically', you have already half-accepted their metaphysical implications.

>> No.19819384

>social progress

lmao

>> No.19819427
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19819427

>>19815980
>recording and analysing organic changes in a given language
you aight
>coming up with artificial elements and trying to force feed the general population without even giving them the time to adapt
die scum
conservative prescriptivism and progressive prescriptivism are two sides of the same retarded coin

>> No.19819449

>>19815980
if (uses.Word.valid == TRUE)
set(opinion) = discarded

>> No.19819456

>>19819294
This. In fact I think we should reverse the clock and go back to purely Anglo-Saxon vocabulary

>> No.19819475

>>19816054
>>19816057
>>19818937
you sound like trannies

>> No.19819509

>>19819384
based

>> No.19819565

>>19819456
>we
nice meme

>> No.19819586

>>19815980
This is cap frfr

>> No.19819845

>>19816240
> But if someone were to write something simple, say a poem, as part of their studies, there'd be no way without incredible labor to determine that it wasn't in fact just some student's poem written today and not an ancient text that has survived on the back of a copy of St. Seetheopolosis homily "On Punishments" about why seeing women naked is gay but assfucking little boys is what Yahweh intended.
Couldn’t you just publish it with a preface and a byline? That would clear things up pretty easily.

>> No.19819861

>>19816240
>Girls took up the traditional European practice of Cento (taking a poem and rearranging its lines to mean something else) and would write erotica to each other using the works of Homer, Plato, Thucydides, etc.
lmao you fell for it

>> No.19820482

>>19816054
kek

>> No.19820799

>>19815997
>>19816073
All I can think of is that Crossed comic Alan Moore did, where people in the future speak a heavily truncated, pidgin style niggerspeak.

>> No.19820801

>>19815997
fr no cap u be cappin

>> No.19820835

>>19819294
>If you use twitter-words routinely, even if you're doing it 'ironically', you have already half-accepted their metaphysical implications.

Good point. Honestly this is why I avoid using such terms, even when mocking them or the people who use them. I don't want to read/hear the terms in the first place, so why would I subject myself to their use even if done in an ironic or mocking tone?

>> No.19820855

>>19816043
Indeed. Very shallow and pedantic

>> No.19821209

>>19815980
The problem with pidgin is no one knows what the fuck the real meaning is. "Cap" is the perfect example. No one can tell you what cap means with absolute certainty. It used to refer vaguely to bullets, but now the Frankenstein phrase cap on a stack has moved the term into total ambiguity.

Pidgin is created by retards who literally have not comprehended meaning because their exposure to or absorption of history is poor. They are mouth grunting noises to express their emotions and literally any word or noise will do. There is no cognizant attempt at meaning because the creators of pidgin lack the depth of experience or knowledge to make foundational comparisons in their expressions. There is a whole framework of language that they ignore out of pure ignorance.

You would say this is based. It is. Pidgin is absolutely based as spoken language. Where intonation can do the heavy lifting and transfigure essentially random grunting into a facsimile of meaning. It does not belong in writing unless it can prove through time to have a mostly clarified meaning like "bae". Writing is a dead act that requires as little ambiguity as possible because it is so famished for other sources of meaning like facial expressions, tone, volume, speed of delivery, etc.

It's still the product of laziness and ignorance though. It's an emanation of the same phenomenon where your common garden variety girl makes literature references to harry potter because that is the depth of her experience with literature. Her interest goes no further and does not engage with the lower building blocks that the foundation of harry potter is built from. This is how pidgin speakers are interacting with language.

>> No.19821270

>>19821209
Don't forget that it's parasitic on living languages. For blacks to be able to live out their perpetual demeaning minstrel show as "the cool kids" in the giant high school that is the world (for them), uncool ordinary languages have to exist to provide unspoiled meanings to distort to create the illusion of emergent complexity. AAVE is a high entropy system that would literally regress to grunts and simple phrases like abo English or BBC pidgin English:
>UAE bin suspend flights from many destinations for Africa afta di emergence of di Omicron variant.
if not for continual subsidies of functional language bits from the "normal" (white) super-language.

Dumb white liberals with college degrees think that blacks walk around going "what's crackin' sneedle-dee" to eachother and inventing new words for "covetous" to express their authentic street culture of being covetous, with a deep vein of tragic irony as they also realise such covetousness is ultimately destroying them.

In reality, blacks who live in truly isolated black areas without any forced interaction with white institutions (school, jobs) talk like full blown mental retards, but without the benefit of it being a secondary creole in addition to their primary language (like abos have). Blacks ONLY have the creole. They really do stand around going "you finna to get dat ding?" "yeah i finna." "ok." until all they know is monosyllabic "ding" words for vital necessities (phones, food, cash) and a few retarded function words like finna, bin, and dun.

Many of them can't understand more than simple tenses (past, future, present). That is a good way to make a slave population, because they literally can't even think of counterfactuals and conditionals and so on. That was the exact goal of Newspeak in Orwell, to create a language that doesn't even have the internal possibility of conceptualising or describing states of affairs other than or beyond the present. One has to accept something if it's the only thing one can think.

>> No.19821295

>>19815992
It's just like wikipedia early life, you just uncover these things. It's sad when you learn that digging one inch deep tells you everything you need to know about a person.

>> No.19821343

>>19816134
I guarantee you that peasant music used to be leagues better and more meaningful than trap. You can’t even convince me

>> No.19821367

>>19821270
Language control is everything. "Problematic", "Empowered", "academic buzzwords". The war of ideas is fought through soundbites. The masses do not have the attention span for anything longer. Our ancestors used to have a working memory the length of a thesis statement. Now that has been shortened down to just a single word. Cognitive dissonance is rampant because single words can terminate a dialogue when one or both of the participants are incapable of comprehending the total meaning of the sentence the loaded word was used in. They only hear the buzzword and its supercharged meaning that transcends strict context.

>> No.19821400

>>19816043
fag

>> No.19821411

>>19821367
I read about Reginald Dunne and Joseph O'Sullivan recently, the two 20ish Irish rural Irish boys who assassinated Field Marshall Henry Wilson in 1922. They both had only a bit of Catholic school, since most of their time was spent in the British army in WW1 or working to support their families in their teen years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reginald_Dunne
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_O%27Sullivan

The speech written in prison by Dunne to give before his execution (he wasn't allowed to give it) still exists, written from a prison cell after no doubt being beaten and probably badly maltreated by English guards. I read it, and it's leagues beyond anything that could be written by a Harvard graduate today in terms of clarity and focus. I can't really explain what I mean, but the focus is more interesting to me than the literary quality. The fact that he can actually think his way through a fucking point and express himself, despite having little formal education and basically being a country bumpkin who is about to die very young for his country. You can't even find professional journalists who can express themselves clearly these days.

Just stuck out to me for some reason. Something is attacking our collective intelligence and spirit and actively trying to degrade us to the point of animals. This has to go beyond simple explanations like TV or Internet causing brain rot. It's coordinated and too efficient.

>> No.19821444

>>19821209
>>19821270

When I replace "black" with Cockney and some of your examples to Cockney slang, I get no evidentiary information as to why this difference in language used between blacks and, I guess, whatever your group is, has anything at all to do with being black.

The only thing you seem to referencing to show this connection is a shared racism.

So what I can gather is that you lack the mental faculties you claim are missing in others, because you seem to have fooled yourself into thinking you have proved something.

I guess when it comes to language, the ability, or lack there of, to speak it has nothing at all to do with whether you are intelligent enough to be able to pick out your own biases.

>> No.19821488

>>19815997
Lmfao you is a dork ass loser fr fr

>> No.19821492

>>19821444
Who said anything about racial determinism? You're the one who saw a race being mentioned and leapt to the assumption that racialism was being posited as a cause, just so you could evangelize your religion of anti-racialism. Nobody cares, faggot.

You are one of the enablers of black suffering with this retarded cult you're in. You are so obsessed with being an anti-racist baby that you don't care if you have to write apologetics for a thousand dysgenic behaviors and distract from projects and ideas that might actually help the black community become independent. Independent from your white savior complex, that is.

>> No.19821500

>>19821444
You are correct that it is not just blacks. It is all people who lack an attention span. It is not something I can claim to be race related without evidence. Blacks are cited because the userbase of this website is predominantly american and there is a concerted effort by powerful people with megaphones to exalt and praise black pidgin in particular on no grounds other than the racist fact that it is made by black people.

Also you have provided a perfect example of someone hitting a loaded buzzword tripmine and terminating further thought.

>> No.19821509

>>19815997
>Regardless, proper English is much more stylish and pleasant to hear than niggerspeak
then why did you the word 'niggerspeak' knowmsayin

>> No.19821526

>>19816134
No, Beethoven's work is beyond entertainment, the same can be applied to literature, true art has always been beyond entertainment. If your criteria for understanding art is "I like it", then yes, all art is equally valid, but if your criteria for understanding art is "let's deconstruct such piece" or "what is the innovation here?", or to put it simply, "why is the author truly intelligent here, how does he show his geniality", then no, not all art is equal. That's why YA dies, its just a mediocre product of the age, while authors like Cervantes, Shakespeare, Homer, etc. keep themselves alive, because they offer matter to be analyzed and because they were ahead of the curve in their eras. Trap is another example of something mediocre, and the only justification for their fans is "you can't criticize other people's taste in music", yes I can, Beethoven invented dynamics in piano, trap has no innovation and will only be remembered by their popularity.

>> No.19821579

>>19815980
just because blacks say "axe" or "for real for real"
doesn't make them words or proper grammar.

>> No.19821702

>studies linguistics
>monolingual
>not smart enough to translate ancient texts
>spends all their time hyper-analysing phrases like "disabled people" and concludes you should say "person with a disability"

you should honestly kys my good bitch, tbqhwy sweety senpai

>> No.19821714

>>19821343
Agreed, would rather here shit like this being played on the streets than some little white faggot blasting "uh... yah... yeah... nigga!" through his shitty phone speakers

https://voca.ro/1hIiMzREf3Fv

>>19821526
>Beethoven's work is beyond entertainment
Come on pick a better composer than Beethoven. He was literally the beginning of the end

>> No.19821869
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19821869

>>19821209
Bro “cap” means:
>bullet, as in “bust a cap in yo ass”
>a lie, as in “that’s cap, I saw red in electrical”
>a hat, as in “who the fuck walks outside wearing a Yankees cap”

>> No.19822241

>>19816134
"musicology" is fake and gay. beethoven never did any "musicology"

>> No.19822266

>hillybilly talk
>madjak.png
>nigger talk
>pogjak.png

>> No.19822276

>>19815980
huh????? question is does the people using the word exist?

>> No.19822504

>>19815980
who giv a fuk bout lurnin wurds

>> No.19822729

>>19821869
Then what does "cap on stack" mean?

>> No.19822739

>>19815997
bruh u fr deadass rn??

>> No.19822769

>>19815980
>as someone who studies linguistics
kek this like me saying "as someone who studies math" and then giving my opinion as if I am an expert when all I did was calc 1 on khan academy

>> No.19822813

>>19822729
It’s means “I bet you $1,000 that that’s bullshit”

>> No.19823872

>>19815980
I have no patience for Chomskian bullshit HOWEVER, having studied classical languages and ancient languages and esoteric languages and so called "magical" speech, I can say with certainty that NO language, however "perfect" is immune from basic ugliness, pronounced even moreso in the myriad attempts by later scribes and scholars to "cover-up" the holes and inconsistencies in their grammar of choice. It really stretches back to Russel's paradox...there is no logical system, no language, that can ever totally account for itself; but the impulsion to legitimatize or equalize utterances on a common field is no different from the classicist who insists on perfection, as they are both attempts to cover up the inconsistencies, the illogical and ungrammatical that is inherent to speech and writing, only the former's flaw is admitting any and everything as "valid". There are definitely things people say which are stupid, and there are definitely things that are elevated or excellent and hold a kernel of deeper truth or transcendental beauty, but everything must first be evaluated on its own terms and not through the some great code that determines truth value like a Turing machine!

>> No.19823882

>>19821444
>I MUST DEFEND NIGGERS!

>> No.19823897

>>19821444
Hate nigs, simple as.

>> No.19823902

>>19815980
Self-terminating position. If she is right, then she is also wrong.