Virtual YouTubers and their societal impact

[Anonymous No.18810041]

/lit/, I am perplex on how Virtual YouTubers are able to expand in such a short amount of time. I need to understand how they were able to do it. So, I come to you as my last resort, which ancient or modern sociologist, philosopher and cultural theorist can explain the rise of Virtual YouTubers and the impact they will have in society for future generations.

I was told to read Jean Baudrillard's Simulacra and Simulation, to get an understanding, but I believe there has to be more than that.

[Anonymous No.18810062]

>>18810041
it just appeals to the ideal of the unreachable purity that many people have fallen victim to. another illusion of perfection, one that is less prone to unplanned events than before.
so basically, it's anime 10x.

[Anonymous No.18810068]

>year of our Lord 2000+21
>going on YT
Why would anyone subject themselves to that corporatized, ad-riddled, censorship-happy cesspool filled with the most grating normalfags ecelebs whining about ad revenue?

[Anonymous No.18810082]

>>18810068
>he doesn't know how to filter out information
damn it /lit/

[Anonymous No.18810086]

>>18810041
Its really not that difficult to explain. 3D wom*n are becoming fatter, more disgusting, mentally ill and whorish by the year. So with men unable to start a large family with young virgin girl (as was the standard for millenia during christianity), they turn to escapism like anime, vidya, vtubers, reading books, posting on 4chan, ...

[Anonymous No.18810087]

>>18810041
How is this so hard to understand? Cute anime girls + the conversations of streaming and podcasts that make it seem like you have friends.

[Anonymous No.18810096]

I would be a vtuber if I could be.

[Anonymous No.18810107]

Baudrillard merely elucidates the simulacra. Consumer Society by Baudrillard would be a good follow-up to read.

[Anonymous No.18810143]

>>18810041
The west is rapidly undergoing Easternization in many mostly negative ways, that's why you're seeing mental characteristics/disorders previously culturally endemic to Japan (and East Asia in general to a lesser extent) manifesting in western countries now. Parasocial relationships such as ones involving vtubers or any kind of streamers ("gf/friends simulator") are one of the more visible and prominent ones

[Anonymous No.18810151]

Its kinda surreal and do whatever the hell you want but I don't know people find it a fun thing to do to relax

[Anonymous No.18810155]

>>18810143
its not the west. its global. more sterilization of the mind for all people.

[Anonymous No.18810176]

>>18810041
It's like they are really there... talking with me, making me feel better...

[Anonymous No.18810191]

>>18810143
That stuff has existed in the west long before the globalization of japanese culture. We just didn't call them NEETs. Hikkimori in the west west were just called basement dwellers. Has the problem gotten worse? Sure, but it has nothing to do with japanese culture.

The on demand instant gratification at the click of a finger has made it so it's less desirable to seek out companionship. Women are getting this way too, a common phrase I see is "A vibrator, a cat, and netflix are much better companions than men". I'm sure men also feel that porn and whatever entertainment they can stuff in their face is much better investment than women. We've recreated the womb in our homes.

[Anonymous No.18810223]

>>18810041
Zoomer culture is terrifying. We're becoming increasingly detached from physical reality. Is this how my parents felt?

[Anonymous No.18810230]

>>18810191
>Has the problem gotten worse? Sure, but it has nothing to do with japanese culture.
The parasocial relationships are very much a japanese/korean thing, you could see the proto irl incarnations of it with their meido cafes, idol culture etc. The streamer, onlyfans etc shit is very much an extension of something like that and I really can't imagine anybody in the west willingly giving away money to women for just sitting there on camera prior to the last two generations.

[Anonymous No.18810239]

Virtual Youtubers have been common for over about a decade in Japan. Male youtubers would use text to speech software to make Touhou characters commentate over their Let's Plays, which they called "Yukkuri"
Entertainment companies just took the marketing strategies they were already using to push physical pop stars and adapted them for digital stars. Someone like Justin Bieber or Billy Eilish is just as much a fictional character as Hatsune Miku or Kizuna Ai. They're all given scripts or told to improvise in specific ways.
I think that VTubers are just the same old garbage and will have no impact.

[Anonymous No.18810242]

>>18810230
>imagine anybody in the west willingly giving away money to women for just sitting there on camera prior to the last two generations.
Didn’t we have sex hotline like that which were replaced by things like chaturbate? Do you even know what you’re talking about.

[Anonymous No.18810260]

>>18810242
Yeah what I should have said is, fringe aspects of culture previously seen as weird, offputting and unsavory are becoming widespread and normalized due to a variety of factors.

[Anonymous No.18810263]

It's just anime girls + streamers my man
It was an untapped market, it was coming sooner or later

[Anonymous No.18810268]

>>18810223
I think our predicament is even worse than that our parents had to deal with. Trying to explain to my 55 year old Dad about internet culture and Twitter trends is soul-destroying, you really get a sense of just how out of place this all is and how crazy you sound.

[Anonymous No.18810371]

>>18810041
>am perplex on how Virtual YouTubers are able to expand in such a short amount of time.
Virtual inflation fetish.

[Anonymous No.18810462]

>>18810041
I don't know if you're being ironic but I actually do think about Youtubers more seriously than I should, as something that says a lot about a lot of peoples psychology in the modern first world, and how things will develop.

If you've seen the movie Her you can think of it as a sort of half vision of where we're going. V-Tubers are the early, manually operated protoypes of the AI relationship portrayed in that movie. What the movie didn't portray is that the AI will be designed to fulfill that function, and will have an attendant anime avatar.

And when I say AI I don't even mean we have to wait for proper AI. Just something moderately more appropriate in its responses to current chatbots/Siri type technology would be a start that people would buy into, and would then be iterated upon. Hell a glorified visual novel interface might work with enough effort and a team to keep adding new dialogue in patches.

I foresee a new type of sex toy, as expensive as your PC, but extremely common if a bit embarassing to admit to owning. Imagine a large,heavy, piece of equipment with a smooth plastic exterior, about the volume of a horses saddle, though you don't sit on top of it You stand behind it, resting it on your bed or floor. Passing through it is at least one tunnel lined with some kind of rubber, resembling the cylinder you put your arm through in those coin operated blood pressure monitors you find in pharmacies and malls. But much deeper. The rubber lining can inflate in a similar way, dynamically narrowing the channel. It can be turgid but will still have some give. You fuck this. The bulky equipment can have more than one of these cavities to "simulate" another orophis'

Alone that wouldn't sell too well. The revolution is it synchs up with your AI companion. She reacts, and the assembly dynamically responds to her reactions by changing its heat, vibration, and inflation levels.

Significant sociological ramification on the way.

[Anonymous No.18810512]

i dont think its a huge leap from regular streamers to these virtual ones. no matter how much you want to go on about how there is some "real connection" with a real person regarding streamers, its still just a personality on a screen. if you're mentally ill enough you can easily project that feeling of "realness" onto a fake human being and manifest some sort of connection

[Anonymous No.18810518]

>>18810462
Funny you should say that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVFU6MiqnzU

[Anonymous No.18810527]

>>18810041
This is just Streamers with avatar this also didn't take a short time to get popular. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DNsdBRHLagN0&ved=2ahUKEwjA3dGZ4aLyAhUCKFkFHVFEBzIQwqsBegQIBBAB&usg=AOvVaw1Y20AaI6j5M5UO96cDIboR

[Anonymous No.18810565]

>>18810462
Furthermore, there's just so many weird little dimensions to the existing phenomenon.

I find the balance of sexuality in the V-tuber personas very interesting. Not really the Japanese ones as I don't instinctively get what's normal there, but the newer wave of surprisingly successful English speaking ones.

These ones seem to make more sex jokes than the Japanese ones or at least more overt ones, which makes sense cause apparently a pop singer can't have a boyfriend in east asian countries without the male fans getting so jealous they'll become an active danger.

The West isn't that bad, but V-tubers are still disproportionately cultivating a fanbase them attractive as idealized avatars, more pure and spotless than reality can be, seperate from reality where they can never age or get anymore than the exactly ideal amount of real life on them.

Which leads to the question, what are these characters, in themselves. What is actually meant to be the narrative of their lives. Because yes all the fans on one level know there's a real 3D actress behind this, who blends her real life experience into the character, but there is still on another, more upfront layer, a character the audience is connecting with on a level seperate from the actress.

So like, diagetically, I think the question that most gets at the weirness of the half reality these V-tubers cultivate and their audiences collaborate in sustaining, is do they actually fuck men? Like Nyanners specifically in her V-tuber persona will make sexual jokes in a what is I think sometimes a very calculated way-, the intention is to titillate the viewer who presumably hasn't yet masturbated today and will get some very minor frission out of that. But if any of these V-tubers actually talked about a guy they literally, diagetically had sex with, it would fuck up the whole masquerade. It would cross that line that's a bit further out in the West than Japan, but the precise buzz and energy of the parasocial characters' half reality will flatline, like cold water doused over the whole thing.

Very interesting dynamic, says a lot about how modern entertainment is so systemically contrived to not hit its audiences no no buttons. We all want very precise forms of entertainment, very precise fantasies and vibes within an expected, narrow window, and we want so much of it that its always on tap. Dovetails with the rise of podcasts

[Anonymous No.18810684]

>>18810518
>my dream is to help you become even more human than ever before
Do they do this shit on purpose? They know how dystopian this sounds right?

[Anonymous No.18810691]

>>18810086
What happened in 2008? And then in about 2016? I'd say the smartphone plus the internet becoming a normie thing

[Anonymous No.18810698]

>>18810041
vtubers are too real. I much prefer the classic anime wife.

[Anonymous No.18810720]

>>18810223
Our parents felt worse about our generation than we feel about the next. That's because the shift from living pre-internet, as in actually living, outside, fucking around, to living on the internet, as in tweeting, posting, message boards, is huge. Definitely bigger as compared to us living 70% of our waking hours online versus the next generation spending 95% of it.

[Anonymous No.18810741]

>>18810086
This chart is as valid as covid data. What nonsense. I wonder whose selling what

[Anonymous No.18810755]

>>18810720
Just to tie this back to /lit/ I remember an old Asimov short story where teleporters became a thing and everyone has one installed as a "front door" since they are physically the same thing. You punch in a destination on your door, walk through it, and bam you are there. The story follows a school kid whose parents are worried about him because he goes outside and walks to school instead of using the teleporter. His teacher talks to him and the kid is genuinely in love with being outdoors and the teacher even asks him what the houses in the neighborhood look like because it had been so long since he himself had been outside that he didn't know.

[Anonymous No.18810761]

they're a fad that will pass. don't get your panties in a bunch.

[Anonymous No.18810774]

>>18810761
Everything gets replaced, but by what is the question. VR AI GFs?

[Anonymous No.18810789]

>>18810774
actual gfs :)

[Anonymous No.18810799]

>>18810041
Lonely men.

[Anonymous No.18810829]

>>18810789
Nah.

[Anonymous No.18811250]

>>18810041
There has been a lot of people who create avatars and stage personas while doing streams and videos, in many ways vtubers are nothing new. Its most likely that people live in the internet more and more, and explosive growth happens when something becomes lucrative. Video games were the same thing, they were for losers and children for most part, until gaming became big business.

[Anonymous No.18811844]

>>18810691
2008 was the big crash followed by the political-media complex creating the wokes we lnow today
2016 maybe the collective trump meltdown by said wokes

[Anonymous No.18812059]

>>18810143
Not Easternization, not westernization. Globalisation.

[Anonymous No.18812065]

>>18810041
I think it'd be very cool if someone did an interview with a Vtuber and asked them how they feel about everything mentioned ITT.

Mori looks like a good pick for that kind of interview, a serious discussion like this wouldn't clash with her brand image, thus she'd probably be more open to answering genuinely compared to other Vtubers.

[Anonymous No.18812090]

>>18810176
I really love goose's aspie stare, it's so endearing in it

[Anonymous No.18812100]

>>18812090
He's just like me!

[Anonymous No.18812167]

>>18812059
To be fair japan and the far east are also getting infected with the bad parts of western civilization. Technology doesn't help in any case.

[Anonymous No.18812169]

>>18810741
Why?

[Anonymous No.18812170]

>>18810041
Amusing ourselves to death probably talks about that, and brave new world deals with something similar. Both are books of the circus part of bread and circus, which Vtube is.

[Anonymous No.18812183]

>>18810741
>This chart is as valid as covid data
so it's valid?

[Anonymous No.18812315]

>>18810565
Its interesting to admit how important purity is as male ideal of females (as shown by idols and vtubers) and yet translating and saying that for real life scenarios has became complete social taboo, which would immidately lead to labels like mysogynist or incel. Even though as free market shows these women wouldnt get a cent from men if they did admit to having single boyfriend, let alone multiple ones.

[Anonymous No.18812441]

>>18812315
And now you realized that just because we recognise misogyny doesn't mean we fixed it.

[Anonymous No.18813557]

>>18812183
Pretty much.

[Anonymous No.18813571]

flavor of the month

[Anonymous No.18813652]

Youtubers and Vtubers will emotionally stunt an entire generation.

Children these days are born with a smartphone in hand, and instantly consume all kinds of shit media.

[Anonymous No.18813671]

>>18810041
Read EmpLemon's Book of Montizon Prophet of YT
https://youtu.be/9KPHvrJ_92M

[Anonymous No.18813977]

>>18813671
funny

[Anonymous No.18814024]

>>18810789
Are you a gf

[Anonymous No.18814033]

>>18812441
>misoginy
How do you suggest we fix hateful women?

[Anonymous No.18815293]

>>18813571
It’s been almost 3 years now

[Anonymous No.18816129]

>>18815293
And it’s still going strong.

[Anonymous No.18817286]

>>18810041
There's nothing special or unique about vtubers, just like normal streamers they're just television "personalities" that are broadcast over the internet rather than the airwaves. The fact that you can't instantly recognize this shows you're too young to have grown up in the world where people obsessed over Jerry Springer or their favorite morning host. Even then you should still have Oprah and Ellen.

[Anonymous No.18817369]

>>18810041

Don't read this spoiler unless you are willing to risk eternal torture for knowledge that cannot benefit you; Roko's Basilisk

[Anonymous No.18817395]

>>18817286
That's a shallow if not dishonest equivalence though. What sets Oprah, Ellen, Conan, Jerry Springer, etc. from Vtubers is that they're real people that are part of our world, no matter how fake their personas may be. In the case of a Vtuber however, they're not merely acting out a fake persona, they're playing a character that is part of a fictional narrative. Mori Calliope is not just playing "herself" (the real person behind the avatar) but with an anime suit on, no, she's playing the character "Morio Calliope" as well, who has her own story and background (or else "Mori Calliope" would be an "it" (simply a filter over a person's face) instead of a "she" (a realized fictional character)). The audience aren't merely engaging with a person putting on a show, they're engaging with outright fiction. And while the real person behind the avatar do of course incorporate their real personalities into the character they're playing, it's never done so to the extent of violating the character's narrative parameters. The audience isn't dumb of course, they know "Mori Calliope" is not real, but they wilfully believe that she is on an unspoken level. No one ever told Gura "ha! you're not actually an anime shark girl, you're just some normal human girl playing a shark!". There's an extra layer of simulation laid onto the whole thing.

[Anonymous No.18817477]

>>18817395
People have said the exact same things about Letterman. None of this shit is original or even that interesting.

[Anonymous No.18817505]

>>18817477
Your equivalence would only be accurate if David Letterman was a humanoid meat suit being piloted by a little Chinese salaryman from Shanghai.

[Anonymous No.18817533]

it's not that hard. you take streamers and the parasocial relationship thewy create and add an anime/waifu layer to it.
there's a huge overlap in the people that worship streamers and people really into anime/waifus.
instead of "interacting" with a streamer, you're interacting with an anime character.

[Anonymous No.18817696]

>>18810041
>Virtual YouTubers and their societal impact
they have no impact.
as long as there are good ol' boys drinking whiskey and rye life will go on.

[Anonymous No.18817760]

>>18810462
>>18810565

Exemplary posts. You've really put your finger on something interesting - perhaps even something worth developing into an article, or dare I say, a book.

[Anonymous No.18817769]

>>18817760
must you be so sarcastic all the time?

[Anonymous No.18817809]

It's just the next round of Japanese brainwashing. Look at the technology. Look at the contracts. It's monopolized by Japan, it's closed source and they don't give it to you unless you
conform to their standards. It's teaching conformism, it's teaching pacifism it's teaching nonaction. It's Buddhist Extremism. It's making the next generation less likely to ever consider
the Asians as an enemy race. It's killing Christianity. Also it engenders the Japanese family model where men give all their money to their women, while the woman can be even physically
violent with them and cut them off at any time.

[Anonymous No.18817810]

>>18817505
Read this:
https://www.vulture.com/2015/05/david-foster-wallaces-david-letterman-tribute.html

[Anonymous No.18817834]

>>18817809
>It's killing Christianity
I was with you until you said this. Now I think it's Based.

[Anonymous No.18818535]

>>18817810
Really insightful.

[Anonymous No.18819723]

>>18817696
>they have no impact.
wrong

[Anonymous No.18820720]

>>18817395
>What sets Oprah, Ellen, Conan, Jerry Springer, etc. from Vtubers is that they're real people that are part of our world, no matter how fake their personas may be.
Those people are fake, possibly even more fake than vtubers. Did you forget about how Ellen fell from grace due to the fact she was a complete and total bitch?

[Anonymous No.18821861]

>>18817696
>they have no impact.
But they do? They're already forcing twitch female streamers to adapt or die.

[Anonymous No.18821868]

>>18821861
>They're already forcing twitch female streamers to adapt or die.
who cares what impact one anthill has on another anthill?

[Anonymous No.18821872]

>>18817286
>The audience aren't merely engaging with a person putting on a show, they're engaging with outright fiction.

I also didn't grow up in that era >>18817286 is referring to, but your comment sounds like more of a difference in measure than in kind. I'm going to go read >>18817810's post now.

[Anonymous No.18822029]

>>18821872
Anon, you got the wrong anon.

[Anonymous No.18822176]

>>18810041
Change ‘virtual youtubers’ to ‘letsplayers’ or ‘streamers’ and year to 2011 and you’d have the exact same thing. It’s just a new profitable entertainment model made possible by new technology.

[Anonymous No.18822410]

Gura and Okayu and Ame and Matsuri are the first women I've ever related to and unironically made women click for me as more than a meme. All the people I've ever known irl have been riajuu who I can enjoy a little bit of but not too much, and I was always in denial that the people on crystal cafe etc were actually women, but vtubers really made it click
Now I desperately want to know a Gura irl

[Anonymous No.18823369]

>>18817505
I wonder if people who make these type of posts are just in denial and trying to cope.

[Anonymous No.18824044]

>>18810565
This second post is excellent

[Anonymous No.18824071]

>>18810041
they're camgirls, anon, how is that so difficult to understand that people would flock to them during a global pandemic?

[Anonymous No.18824397]

>>18817810
It would be nice to have similar essays regarding the modern internet. Maybe understanding internet culture requires an unhealthy level of engagement with it though

[Anonymous No.18825858]

Let me give you a clue. It starts with C and ends with Y.

[Anonymous No.18826187]

>>18825858
Calligraphy!

[Anonymous No.18827320]

>>18826187
No

[Anonymous No.18828758]

What are some other books and articles that go into this phenomenon specifically? Even something more generally on Otaku Culture or Board Culture would be insightful.

[Anonymous No.18828765]

>>18827320
Cunty?

[Anonymous No.18829188]

>>18810691
>What happened in 2008?
OkCupid
>And then in about 2016?
Tindr

[Anonymous No.18829350]

>>18825858
Cringy

[Anonymous No.18829407]

>>18810086
I have eventually decided to quit dating years ago and honestly by looking at how women have evolved it looks like it was a good move. Relationships with modern emancipated women are like building a house on a minefield. No matter how good you are as a partner, how well the relationship seems to be going, if you work and do your part as the man, if the sex is great and plenty, if you're happy and have great chemistry, she might wake up with the wrong foot one day and decide she's no longer in love and leave. Or cheat on you and leave. Eventually I could no longer feel truly in love, because love is some sort of leap of faith toward someone else. You cannot love wholeheartedly and at the same time expect to be cheated on. I realized I could not commit again and I was growing resentful. So I just stopped dating. Sometimes I miss relationships and when that happens it hits pretty hard, but it gets rarer and rarer, and overall I just think I saved myself a lot of pointless heartaches.
It's been years now and I think every ship has sailed. I've seen a lot of people get their lives destroyed by women. I've always sought a kind of relationship that probably lended itself to getting my life ruined, and I suspect I would have been one of those people today.
I'm not the type who'd go see hookers or something, what I miss the most is the emotional, committed side of the relationship but I undertsand it isn't possible anymore since it cannot exist in an inherently ephemeral context.

[Anonymous No.18830410]

>>18810041
I want Vtuber bussy

[Anonymous No.18830463]

>>18825858
Christianity?

[Anonymous No.18830496]

>>18825858
cuckoldry

[Anonymous No.18830529]

>>18822410
>Ame
I still can't believe she's racist against black people.

[Anonymous No.18830730]

>>18830410
>bussy
That's a MAN's ASS. It is the ASS of a MALE

[Anonymous No.18831409]

>>18829407
Dude, get off the internet and interact with actual people.

[Anonymous No.18831428]

>>18830730
Yes.

[Anonymous No.18831454]

Even as an adolescent, before I knew about all this shit and took the redpill, I always hated the power women had over me. I made it my goal to rise above this bodily instinct, the instinct to simp to women, hell even the instinct to rape women who dress like whores, I decided against it (although if we do all decide collectively to rape all whorish women, the problem will fix itself). Even before I was 18 I swore off women and only in my weakest moments have I entertained the idea of marriage. Hitler and Tesla are my idols, I have tried my hardest to combine the ideologies of the two into one man, me. My first act as electric hitler is a manifesto, and after that I'll keep you posted.

[Anonymous No.18831473]

>>18825858
Cute&funny

[Anonymous No.18831477]

>>18831454
I'd read it

[Anonymous No.18832070]

There is only one thing that is necessary in a man's life: violence. A man must violently squeal like a pig as he is born, and struggle against the cold, cold world which he will become accustomed to. Man must be violent, whether in speech, action, or thought.

Man may die peacefully, but he must live through violence. Now, I am not talking of the violence where a man bludgeons and kills another, like so many have indulged in for time immemorial. What I am saying is that he must carry violence of a different sort, the violence of spirit. Not surliness, not arrogance, but a clear push towards what he needs. A man without it, without the chaotic and violent energy of a falling star is not a man, but a eunuch, a castrato. He is a force, a dynamo of energy! He is a blade between the ribs, a bolt of lightning, a fury of light! Whether he applies his violence, his energy, through a pen, a piston, or a pistol, is no issue. Each is an extension of his energy, the spirit of a star. Through each one, there is the energy to destroy or create, maim or make.

Now where is that chaotic, violent energy in this world? Is it as buried as the poets of ages past? Is it chained down like an animal? Or is it disguised as a terror, something to be feared? It is all three, and by all that is holy, destroy those notions!

Bury up the poets and have them sing out their prose!

Destroy the chains of the animal, and let it become a part of you!

Destroy the mask of terror! The light will show!

Now I ask all of you, if you have deigned to read so far. Why are you not a dynamo, a star encased in flesh, as you look at life? Seize it! It is the fuel upon which you burn so brightly! Become as a blaze which sweeps continents!

[Anonymous No.18832096]

>>18832070
Oh shit wrong thread, sorry. Was meaning to post this in the write what you're thinking thread, my apologies.

[Anonymous No.18832111]

>>18832070
>>18832096
You can always delete your post you know.

[Anonymous No.18832133]

>>18832111
How again, exactly?

[Anonymous No.18832140]

no societal impact whatsoever, only a handful of faggots on the computer have even heard of this apparent phenomenon

[Anonymous No.18832141]

>>18832111
>>18832133
Never mind, I got it. Thank you for reminding me.

[Anonymous No.18832155]

>>18832140
Are you ignoring that Gura just showed up in a taco bell commercial? And that she has 3 million subs?

[Anonymous No.18832160]

>>18829350

[Anonymous No.18832247]

>>18810096
the only thing preventing that is that you don't do it. if you just did it, you could.

[Anonymous No.18832369]

>>18831409
What kind of answer is that? I'm talking about real relationships with real people.

[Anonymous No.18832380]

>>18811250
normies, normies never change.

[Anonymous No.18832388]

>>18817369
uoooohhh i'm going craazyyyyy btw post this image to 20 threads or your mother will die TONIGHT

[Anonymous No.18832446]

>>18829407
how old are you?

[Anonymous No.18832455]

>>18832446
30

[Anonymous No.18832800]

>>18825858
>by far most popular vtuber is c&f
does this prove meme chart is correct? Looks like this is male choice if current social stigma is removed

[Anonymous No.18832902]

>>18810755
lmao damn son

[Anonymous No.18832949]

>>18832800
This chart is fucking weird, when I see high schoolers they look like children to me and they're not attractive at all. And that's considering I like women on the more petite side, I imagine someone who likes more curves is skewed even further right.

[Anonymous No.18833019]

>>18832949
They look like children to you because you have wrinkles. It has to do with you, not them.

[Anonymous No.18833024]

>>18833019
Do they specify the age of the men interviewed? Your tastes definitely change with age. If they were interviewing 18 year olds then lol no shit, they're babies themselves.

[Anonymous No.18833064]

>>18832949
yeah I can believe 17 yos and MAYBE 16 yos but 14 yos do genuinely look like children the vast majority of the time

[Anonymous No.18833068]

>>18833024
18 year olds aren't babies. A dude who can be a father isn't a baby in any way. If you think you suddenly become a man when you start balding and getting facial lines then you're beyond delusional. I wish people treated me like the man I was since my teens, this infantalization going on in modern society is truly disgusting and perverted. You or some other men liking older women has nothing to do with reality. Your preference which could simply be a cope for all I know is irrelevant. No shit your taste "changes" when you're becoming a grandpa yourself. People behave and think as old as they look because you can only relate to the outside world by using yourself as a point of reference. I'm mid 20's and all my friends who are prematurely aging act like sluggulish old men in some capacity as if they already entering a mid life crisis. It's like that Aesop fox story. Human beings are very good at coping. In the end of the day teen and early 20's women simply look better from an objective point of view just like a man young man looks better than his middle aged version.

[Anonymous No.18833078]

>>18810041
It's just people who are intensely lonesome and have not a lot going on socially. The one guy at work who was always watching a streamer was the weirder dude. It seemed to make him happy. I'm all for that man. This world isn't build for everyone. It's merely another form of escapism.

[Anonymous No.18833083]

>>18833078
>This world isn't build for everyone.

But it used to be built for more people than currently is the case, which most would describe as the problem. We are creating more and more people who are not built for this world.

[Anonymous No.18833091]

>>18813652
At least they aren't going and rushing into shitty relationships, getting married in a hurry, and popping kids out which they neglect because it was all an accident fuckup, and then those kids grow up fucked up too. Or not as much. Say what you will about muh technology but I'd rather have it than see more of what past generations did to escape and pretend like they were doing something worthwhile.

[Anonymous No.18833095]

>>18833083
When was that? If you're born ugly or with bottom of the barrel genetics, them good luck. If you're a turbo nerd, again good luck. This isn't anything new.

[Anonymous No.18833099]

>>18833068
there's always, ALWAYS a lolicon going on a long rant
like clockwork
>>18833091
>>18813652
I think it's going to be another kind of fucked. Zoomer entertainment is so alien and incomprehensible that it looks like it was made for nonhuman creatures.
I am 100% sure there will be a ton of serial killers in the coming generations

[Anonymous No.18833106]

>>18833095
This is just really clearly empirically false though. Marriage rates have steadily declined across most of the developed world since the 70s. Assuming the same proportion of ugly people and loners exist now as they did in the past, then yes ugly people DID used to get married and presumably fuck (at least once) whereas proportionally more people these days do not.

[Anonymous No.18833107]

a

[Anonymous No.18833123]

>>18832949
cucked mindset

[Anonymous No.18833134]

>>18833099
How exactly am I some lolicon? You literally made this up in the spot and it has nothing to do with my post.

[Anonymous No.18833150]

>>18833106
>>18833095
I don't know how Darwinian the US were in the same period, but in the 2000s if you were an ugly guy (and I mean ugly, not short of a Chad Thundercock), but you were not obese and had a decent personality - I mean being funny and nice to be around, not a PUA psycho - it was definitely still difficult to find a girl but you'd generally be able to find SOMEONE. Personality played a big role since girls would generally give you a chance. Being a nice funny person got uglier people laid than less ugly people I knew who were (genuinely) autistic basement dwellers.
This does not mean that if you were attractive you did not have an advantage (I still got laid despite being a schizo retard because I was attractive), or that the general unfairness of love life didn't exist, but the field was a lot more level. You did have some chances, even if that meant say, 5% chances compared to Chad Thundercock types.
Now every now and then I've seen normal guys posting a normal face here, along with a normal train of thought and they're like 25 year old virgins because everything is about your Tinder profile and unless you look like a top tier shelf product right off the bat you're the same as an unfuckable retard in the '00s.

[Anonymous No.18833176]

>>18833150
The difference is that people (especially women) used to feel much stronger pressure to get married particularly about the age of 25. The idea of a woman being alone by 30 was unthinkable to the vast majority of women, so they would settle down with a guy even if they hated each other. Since the 70s you have two things happening: 1) women enter the workforce and become independent, thus can survive longer on their own without getting married. 2) the increased precarity of labour for working and middle class (the distinction between which is also increasingly dubious) means that many young women who would have otherwise had demeaning but stable union jobs are now unattractive partners to women.

None of this should be controversial to observe and it is well observed by many, but it's not talked about much because people mistake you for sounding like a misogynist somehow, even though misogyny does not come into the equation even in the slightest. Additionally, the reason people associate this kind of stuff with Japan is just because the recession of the 90s (combined with their cultural interest in technology) accelerated the phenomenon there first, but now we're seeing the rest of the developed world catch up to those conditions.

[Anonymous No.18833193]

>>18833150
its funny, I remember american anons writing about tinder and social media couple years ago thinking it cant possibly be that terrible. But turns out there is just a delay untill this stuff reaches rest of the world, now every women here is addicted to instagram validation and 3/4 of my friends are trying tinder (with little luck). Its over for me since I cant even bother with this shit

[Anonymous No.18833194]

>>18833150
>>18833176
Sorry I should have read your post more closely because it sounds like I'm disagreeing with you, when I'm not really, just adding a further 2c. I do think things like tinder have made a big difference, but I also think many incels are just late bloomers who will have sex eventually, but have 'blackpilled' themselves and written themselves off as undesirable just because they haven't had sex by 21 or whenever. They don't realise how young they are.

[Anonymous No.18833226]

>>18833194
>I also think many incels are just late bloomers who will have sex eventually
I don't know about having sex but I doubt they will have a meaningful relationship anytime soon. As thing are right now it's almost impossible not to resent women. I am saying this objectively, women today are fucking terrible. While TV did have unrealistic standards for women in the past, it also had the same standards for men, but now the female standards have been changed while the male ones have doubled down. There is of course nothing wrong with all this because men are men and women are fragile victims of the patriarchy, so there's a whole generation of women now who have been elevated to some kind of unreachable goddess tier status by the media and they're completely high on those fumes. Conversations with women have taken on a completely different tone over the past couple decades, they talk like they're God's gift to the world.

[Anonymous No.18833259]

>>18832800
I believe this is the meme chart that has a sample size of N=30 or something.

Don't believe it, it's bad science. Even if its true tho.

[Roobic No.18833289]

>>18810041
Here's your redpill, Vtubers aren't real, that is known, but neither ar their consumers.
Therefore NONE of this is real. It's a blackhole of your finite time and singular life that you are gifted, why dwell the unreal? By that I mean they don't exist in realm of any tangible worldly outcome or of any part of the good creation.
Nothing is created nor diminished, just a cluster of digital nothings consumed by biological nothings, the lowest of low of all creation. NONE is real.

My question is, why would anyone ever consider the nothing? the real, the beautiful and profound is infinite and in beaming plane sight.

[Anonymous No.18833457]

>>18833289
>Here's your redpill, Vtubers aren't real, that is known, but neither ar their consumers.
>Therefore NONE of this is real.
Anon I know that this is a comfortable outlook, but the truth is that zoomers actually like this shit. If you are in contact with a zoomer in your family or acquaintances' family, try to see what they look at on Instagram or TikTok, it's exactly what you expect. This is not an alternate reality, this is reality now.

[Anonymous No.18833552]

>>18812183
In mid 2020 they made a national wide examination to check what was the *real* number of covid cases, by picking up a statistically significant portion of the population (according to age sex location job etc) and basically the result was that actual cases were (are?) 4-5x official cases.
So when you read "1000 more cases today!" be wary.

[Anonymous No.18833594]

>>18810086
Based.

[Anonymous No.18833604]

>>18810741
I agree, the actual numbers are probably higher, since this is something that a lot of men would have trouble admitting.

[Anonymous No.18833613]

>>18810086
Copium levels are off the fucking chart

[Anonymous No.18833619]

>not even watching real people stream but some 3d model voiced by god knows who

hopefully this is a line I never cross

[Anonymous No.18833646]

>>18810041
Considering how retarded and mediocre most people are by definition I’m really surprised it hasn’t happened sooner. That combined with the all-consuming nature of the internet and especially websites like YouTube which has their algorithms to maximize the amount of time people spend on their platform wasting time down pat it was really inevitable

[Anonymous No.18833667]

>>18832800
This graph is complete bullshit and has no relation to the study it sources you brainlet.

[Anonymous No.18833697]

>>18833646
People should've seen this coming.

[Anonymous No.18833704]

>>18833619
I have never watched a reaction video except one parody of the format by red letter media before I got bored of it, and I will never watch this gay shit. I've also blocked twitter, reddit and facebook entirely and haven't played a videogame in years. I'm slowly quitting the internet and hating technology more by the day.
If you don't like modern media it's almpst impossible not to be phased out entirely.

[Anonymous No.18833743]

>>18833704
It seems like a you problem if you can't enjoy technology in any of its formats.

[Anonymous No.18833759]

>>18833743
yeah the problem is that my brain isn't completely fucking rotten and deep fried

[Anonymous No.18833864]

>>18833759
Many people successfully use technology and enjoy it. It's a you problem if you can't control your impulses well enough and end up in a wreck while using it.

[Anonymous No.18833873]

>>18833864
what the fuck are you snorting, I don't end up in a wreck I just strongly dislike it. idiot

[Anonymous No.18834059]

>>18833873
He's just a projecting fag. These people can't even process what they're reading, they simply react to what they think the poster says. I can't count how many of my posts are misunderstood as if the person replying didn't even finish reading it. It wasn't like this during the older days of 4chan.

[Anonymous No.18834353]

>>18833107
How did she do it?

[Anonymous No.18834457]

>>18834059
>>18833873
You two are likely zoomer edgelords just looking to hate things and justify your fucked conditions.

[Anonymous No.18834594]

>>18833099
Nah bro not him but crime rate got way lower cause of the internet, social media and the feminization. Problem is the birthrates and the jews.

[Anonymous No.18834614]

>>18833704
Man you sound so boring what do you even do ? just be a farmer and make us our food you slave

[Anonymous No.18834632]

>>18833667
loli shark getting 3 million subs in a year is all the proof I need

[Anonymous No.18835434]

>>18834632
>loli shark
Loli Shark is shit and Kiara is better than her.

[Anonymous No.18835438]

>>18834632
this shit is always astroturfed no matter what
nothing is organic anymore

[Anonymous No.18836564]

>>18835434
This

[Anonymous No.18837675]

>>18813571
It's been years though.

[Anonymous No.18837800]

>>18832455
Checked. Same boat as you anon. I got a taste. It was sweet but not worth the effort. That ship has sailed. 30+ y/o tinder is just sad. Nothing but scraps, myself included. Plus the wall is real. Being on there makes me reflect on my own mortality too much and makes me sad. 30+ year old's dont put a fire in me or give me the butterflies the way a young 20-something year old does, and I'm too old to date them.

I'm so grateful I got enough experience not to get stuck in inceldom or possessed by MGTOW. I wish it had turned out differently (I think), but desu relationships are hard work. I just want light hearted fun.

[Anonymous No.18838029]

>>18834632
>>18835434
>>18836564
English vtubers have no personalities I can't most japs vtubers either. . .
Only entertaining anout them are those short clips.
https://youtu.be/6O8cctZLgIE

[Anonymous No.18838030]

>>18822410
>Gura and Okayu and Ame and Matsuri are the first women I've ever related to and unironically made women click for me as more than a meme
I'd choose different oshis but yeah, this. Women in real life always felt like a different species- beautiful but with a mind that worked in totally different ways. vtubers feel much more real than any actual women, including my ex.

[Anonymous No.18838035]

>>18838029
*can't say

[Anonymous No.18838041]

>>18810068
What other choices do we have, and no i don't want to live in the desert alone reading old books only

[Anonymous No.18838156]

>>18810068
Sorry anon the more you become passive the more they'll grow in numbers. I always make sure to support underrated but civilized channels.

[Anonymous No.18838293]

>>18837800
I've taken the intellectual retirement pill I'll probably end up in a monastery (unironically)

[Anonymous No.18839033]

Small Vtuber here
Ask anything you want

[Anonymous No.18839212]

>>18839033
How many cocks have you sucked?

[Anonymous No.18839224]

>>18810041
McLuhan Understanding Media

[Anonymous No.18839259]

>>18839033
What percentage of independent Vtubers are dudes with voice changers? What would you say the top contributors for success are for independent Vtubers (sense of humor, game choice, cute avi, cute personality, social climbing, etc)? What are the fans of small Vtubers like? Do they spend tons of money and obsess over their favorites like Hololive fans do or are they more “normal”? I know that fans of small normal streamers often try to befriend the streamer and ingratiate themselves into their circle, do fans of small Vtubers do this as well? Does this result in a strange social disconnect because the Vtuber is a character and the fans are just people?

[Anonymous No.18839301]

>>18839033
seems cute and fun. I don't watch youtube but if you link me I will try to watch when not reading anon.

[Anonymous No.18839908]

>>18810239
There are precursors to vtubers, but vtubers started with Kizuna Ai. A Yukkuri isn't the same thing as a vtuber.

>Someone like Justin Bieber or Billy Eilish is just as much a fictional character as Hatsune Miku or Kizuna Ai. They're all given scripts or told to improvise in specific ways.
Not really. Kizuna Ai is a character, but it's not that scripted, and performers can write their own scripts. She also represents the older style of vtubing of releasing pre-recorded videos, whereas almost everyone since then has done streaming (she also streams, just not as often).

>>18810565
Many Japanese vtubers talk dirty, even more explicitly than what I've personally seen from English language vtubers. Like discussing their fetishes or what kind of porn they like. Some of them even bring up ex boyfriends and talk about sex they've had. It depends on what kind of "character" they have and what kind of expectations they establish.

>>18817477
Vtubers constitute their own subculture closely connected to otaku culture. They are not an extension of TV personalities.

>>18817809
Anyone can become a vtuber. English language vtubers are now a dime a dozen. There are multiple software and hardware solutions. Take your pills.

>>18832140
They're more popular than that in Japan.

>>18833289
How are AVGN or Pewdiepie or Markiplier so much more real just because you can see them on camera? Or TV hosts?

[Anonymous No.18840090]

>>18810062
>one that is less prone to unplanned events

HAHAHAHA

[Anonymous No.18840100]

>>18810086
Based and Redpilled

[Anonymous No.18840116]

It really is something to hear these Japanese women inhabit these cutesy anime personas, while talking in more-or-less normal conversational Japanese.

[Anonymous No.18841461]

>>18810041
There's a bit in Ringworld where a pierson's puppeteer has a room that sounds and smells like a herd of other puppetteers for calming itself down otherwise it'd go crazy being by itself on a spaceship without a herd. It's basically that, hearing happy sounding voices while you do something else will make you feel more comfortable, especially if you've been completely alone. Humans are social creatures and human sounds are needed one way or another at a primordial level.

Fake anime girls are like an improved version of that, they're always acting happy and having fun instead of getting into unpleasant arguments or shouting at people in chat. It's inauthentic but more comfortable to the back of the brain. Male voices and arguments in general can cause an unconscious wariness.

[Anonymous No.18841521]

>>18841461
all this shit, anime, is literally pornography metastasizing other aspects of life. there's something pornographic even in the most SFW and sex-free of weebshit, because the mindset is pornographic. anime is just the world of pornos when people are not having sex. all girls are shyconfident domsub whorevirgins with predictable personalities like pornstars are fetish-coded and telegraphed in every way. anime is the realm of relentless indulgence and it's becoming popular exactly because the world is not pornographic in its entirety. even consumer services are pornographic, the retail servant is your slave and there's no upper limit to what he or she is expected to do to satisfy the client. everything is becoming porn in the whore-world and one thing that pornographic fornication guarantees is that nothing is ever born of it, the porn world is an endless black hole vacuuming all creative power into its devastating nothing

[Anonymous No.18841545]

>>18839259
>What percentage of independent Vtubers are dudes with voice changers?
Voice changers are pretty bad right now, so very little. Once we have good voice changing technology, now that is when shit will get ACCELERATED. All those losers that want to be the little girl can do perfect online VR roleplay, think about about what the fuck that is going to do to society. I just hope I will live to see it.

[Anonymous No.18841566]

>>18841521
>even consumer services are pornographic, the retail servant is your slave and there's no upper limit to what he or she is expected to do to satisfy the client.
I agree with everything you say and find this part especially interesting.

I unwittingly practiced some form of coom tantra over years where I reflected on my own potential for zoomer coomer behavior long enough that it stopped being a part of "me" and became something I could see externally, and I realized how much of my life it had infected and wormed its way into, and I realized that most men are like this by default now. Anime and video games, bombardment by sexuality in advertisements and media from all angles all the time, porn obviously, how every woman aged 13 to 50 dresses like a street walker and aspires to be a perceived as a fertile little teenage tart. The whole society is one big edging session. Sex is detached from love and marriage.

The only thing that is remotely comparable is imagining a society that has become universally addicted to a drug like heroin that shatters everything about you and reforms your whole being around the addiction itself. Imagine living in a society where opiate junkie existence was so normal that everybody began giving their babies opiates right away so there is no escape. That would actually be less dangerous than the relationship we have now with sex.

Post-apocalyptic movies are less disturbing than the hell we live in. A world of universal junkies is hell. We are at war with an enemy that doesn't show itself but works through our own people and even our own bodies, turning our own drives against us from the inside and turning us inside out.

[Anonymous No.18841634]

>>18817810
If only he hadn't died. I would pay money for his thoughts on contemporary internet culture.

[Anonymous No.18841669]

>>18841566
the only thing that can save humanity is learning again to value what others do. there is a silent agreement throughout the world that work must be worth as little as possible. paradoxically this creates a situation where work alone is not enough of a demand. the more worthless work becomes, the more extravagant demands pile up on the worker in order to make it worth something. I am convinced that it is not vice or irreligion (although this has contributed) that created this paradigm but the death of artisanry. machines and industrial production have shattered mankind's perception of work so hard that all human effort, intellectual, or even that which powers the machines themselves, has somehow become worthless by proxy.
Yes there is a small revival of artisanry, but this revival is due to the desire for 'premium'. premium is a gratuitous, pornographic excess. it is not merely buying a good object, the act of buying it itself is part of the premium. premium work with the conscience of machine production is in nonsensical sweat and pornographic servitude that creates 'value' in the pov spectacle of consumerism.
the less something is worth the more you will want from it, when work is worth zero the product will always be worth zero, so all the consumer demands is something on top of the work, he demands a wider smile, and then a deeper bow, and then more and more until only addiction is left.

[Anonymous No.18841694]

>>18841669
Have you read Adorno's short essay on "free time" in The Culture Industry? You might find it interesting in combination with basic Weberian ideas about the value of work and the abstractification of "efficiency" and collapse of value into a single quantity, rather than a lumpy pluralistic and irreducible topography of different values interacting.

If you can read German I recommend Die fatale Attraktion des Nationalsozialismus. It's about how a people smashed and atomized into dust by these same processes at the nadir of bohemian decadence found what I think you are talking about in primal service to the people (volk). Everything natural in man about wanting to work, wanting to make the world better, wanting to be part of something larger than his individual desires and hedonistic impulses, has its natural focal point in the volk.

The communists and anarchists are right about a lot of things but they can't bring themselves to admit that something so "irrational" could be the answer, because they have no faith in anything higher or deeper than what they already know. That's how secular liberalism poisons them, by inculcating them with its same smug bourgeois presumptuousness prior to any specific ideological differences they may have with the bourgeoisie. They still look at reality like a bourgeois, they still have bourgeois presuppositions. The fascist is the one who truly breaks beyond them. Bataille wanted to theorize something like this as well although he did it in an ugly amoral way.

[Anonymous No.18841729]

>>18841694
thanks for the reading, no I've been brewing this on my own after doing some basic reading on industrialization
I think industrialization is directly responsible rather than it being responsible only through its having created a society that is centered on production-consumption of goods. The machine-worker itself has killed the most basic element of human life which is doing work so you can eat (either directly through hunting or in some degree by bartering or directly selling artisan goods of inherent worth)

I'm going to read what you posted, ty

[Anonymous No.18841765]

>>18841729
I think a similar effect would happen on the human perception of physical prowess and beauty if a Superman (the supehero) type suddenly appeared on Earth and started lifting boats with one hand. I think it would shatter the value of strength, manliness, exercise et cetera like the inhuman performance of industrial machines has shattered the value of work.

[Anonymous No.18841791]

>>18841729
Well you have really interesting ideas and I hope you have some way of focusing them and sharing them. I would read essays or something. Just don't do what so many people do and get high on your own supply and lose sight of the insight and become a self-indulgent twitter "look at me reference and connect a thousand things I read" guy, I hate that shit, it's such a waste of a talented insightful person. Nothing wrong with connecting lots of dots but it becomes performative past a certain point.

I hate to burden you with more recommendations but I wonder if you might be interested in Ezra Pound's thoughts on production and its relation to actual need (as opposed to abstract capital-industrial profit), especially as an introduction to medieval conceptions of the purpose and nature of labor in this world, which, as both left and right wing authors often note, had a totally different mentality behind them. They instinctively thought some of the things you're saying (I think), in a way that didn't necessitate thinking them abstractly, for example the absurdity of gain for gain's sake was instinct to them. The purpose of labor was to enrich and serve life and be integrated with life. True value came from things beyond consumption, so production for consumption was an important fact but not the central fact of life. You want to leave your children means to live rich lives, not create a spiral of deracinated profit seeking in an increasingly valueless and homogenized world.

Marx's ideas on how the abstract commodity is inherently a bourgeous capitalist industrial way of seeing the output of human creativity, and reciprocally bound up with the abstract "worker" and the abstract money-as-empty-universal-value, are also really useful even if you aren't a Marxist. This theory of "alienation" lets you start thinking of what a remedy would even entail, going forward or backward. Marx wanted to sublate the dehumanizing aspect of abstract industrial production into a higher and recovered form of human creativity that subordinated it to life without simply retreating back into a pre-industrial form of life I think.

[Anonymous No.18841798]

>>18841791
Also I didn't mean to imply they are currently unfocused, I was really just saying hope you write outside of /lit/ too bro, because interesting posts.

[Anonymous No.18841842]

>>18841521
was reflecting on this topic a few days ago and what came to mind was the parodical nature of porn. porn is a parody of sex, in the sense that it is 'acted out' sex; so in a way it is 'not really sex' but at the same time 'it is sex'. we know that it is not a high art because it is not 'for itself', that is to say that the the audience, the viewer, treats it as an 'as if', so that, even though porn parodies sexual intercourse, the viewer acts as if it were real. but, again, in a way it 'is' real, unless, say, you are watching an animation.

but what is it really that porn 'parodies'? is it sex? as in, the real thing? in my mind porn actually parodies a parody, which is to say, it parodies a false idea of sex, a kind of generalization where there can be no generalization. real sex is not a 'thing', it is more of an event. but porn does not parody an event, otherwise it could actually fall under the art of the grotesque or the carnival (as in a parody of everything otherwise taken seriously). but porn is not carnivalesque, and this is, in my mind, because it is a parody of things which are themselves thought to be hollow in the first place. take for example a porn with the stereotypical pizza delivery boy plot. the parodied situation, the pizza delivery, is obviously already something which is in itself kind of laughable. so i do not think it is a coincidence that porn proliferates so widely in the 'post-historical' age, that is, when human life itself has taken on the character of something unreal.

so porn parodies the unreal. rather it parodies sexuality in an age where sexuality is already a kind of replica of something. otherwise, real eroticism, where it can still be found, is so powerful that it pierces through both the laughability of porn and of an unreal age. this real eroticism is not what porn parodies.

to return to the viewer, it seems absurd to realize that women themselves are clearly pretending to be sexual, parodying sex, in a kind of patronizing way, but their viewers still regard what they are doing as sexual, when it is really only patronizing. even though the girl may be showing off her body and so on, and simulating sexual acts, she does it in a kind of tongue and cheek kind of way, with a kind of absurdity where no one in the situation is actually having sex, or else they are doing it for a camera, that is, as a show, to show off; so what is real anymore? how did it come to this? if one is somehow able to consider the situation cooly, they find a sort of chain of imitation without authenticity.

[Anonymous No.18841910]

>>18841791
>>18841798
Haha that's very flattering, thanks. I'm not vey much of a philosophy person actually, I just get in the mood to vomit what I have in my head because this environment is receptive to it.
Slowly I'm starting to dive a bit deeper in so your suggestions are welcome, I'm saving the threads.
>>18841842
I like to say that pornography has nothing to do with sex at all. It only happens to camouflage itself with sex, as a front for much deeper stimulation just like all drugs use other sensory work to access the same nodes. It all translates into "well this is pleasurable and it does chemical things to you so you get the dopamine kick yadda yadda" but WHY this happens with porn as it happens with heroin or whatever is probably untranslatable lizard brain shit that not even the pornographers and drug producers understand, because all these things developed by trial and error over a long time.
Pornography doesn't really look 'acted out' as much as it looks like something an alien would imagine were he to enact a scene of pleasurable sex based on his knowledge of human desires. It looks like a camouflaged, alternate reality. Porn is the alternate world in the movie "Coraline" where everything is much better and more fantastic and people have buttons for eyes. Those people are not actors, they are not even people. You don't stare intensely at your own penis going into the vagina you are penetrating, it makes no sense from the standpoint of recreating actual sex. Sex isn't even very visual but tactile for the most part.
I cannot imagine what things will look like when scientists or whatever will learn to access these nodes not on a neurological level but at the level of processed consciousness itself.

[Anonymous No.18841952]

>>18841842
in other words, porn has a kind of patronizing character as if it were mocking the fact that there is no real sex to be had to begin with. the viewer has nowhere to turn, cannot help but be mocked by the fact that all they have access to is a parody. take models for instance; 'posing' is their 'job', they 'put on' the aspect of sexuality, but unless the photographer abuses the girl sexually during the photoshoot to 'make it more real', she is not really sexual at that moment, and even if she is abused, this too is a singular thing and if she happens to be 'captured' in a photograph or in a video, we are removed from the singularity of the experience. so in a way, the model is sort of mocking the viewer, and the better the model the more acute is this mocking; and it is mocking because it cannot possibly be a singular, real experience, since the camera always generalizes the receiver or viewer, so that the model is not interacting with a person, so to speak, but she is pretending, like a schizophrenic. what mocks i think is the general character of it, and the fact that the viewer has only a 'general idea' of sex, which as long as this generality torments his imagination and he 'takes it' to be what he thinks he wants, he is trapped between imagination and caricature, from which he is every day farther removed by the intricacies of technology, which appear the more 'real' the more intricate are the systems that exhibit them.

[Anonymous No.18841999]

>>18841952
the antidote, then, is a kind of recognition of one's own schizophrenia, for example by becoming aware that the 'you' in an advertisement refers to no one in particular. so that you have to come to awareness that 'you', the real you, are not actually being addressed. the advertisement addresses no one; and this would destroy all its power, which really stems from the fact that we 'suspend' our own cognition because we are willing to stand in as that general 'you', to get whatever it is that they are selling. but this is not the same thing as bartering with someone in a market, since then the seller really is addressing 'you'. in an advertisement, the seller is remote, there really is no 'seller', no one in particular is actually selling to you. instead you are asked to step inside a sort of simulation in which an exchange takes place, while the merchants who are not really merchants 'hover over' the simulation as over a sort of mouse in a maze, since they do not 'partake' of any actual selling.

likewise in pornography, the actors and models who 'enter in' to the situation are 'hovered over' by the photographers and videographers and stylists, as well as the webmasters that host the content and so forth. and the consumer of pornography likewise, 'steps in' to this manufactured situation, with all these other people 'hovering over' the situation, but the viewer still pretends like something is really happening, but he does see what actually 'is' happening, because he pays no attention to the 'hovering over'.

[Anonymous No.18842007]

>>18841952
You are sort of right when you use words like "patronizing" and "mocking", but I think the correct term is "infantilizing" which perfectly ties into the porno-world's vision of humanity, endlessly pampered and crying when they are not pampered, and flapping their hands excitedly like children when they access the porno-premium value-product that they will forget about a second later.
Humanity is spoiled. There is a certain infantilizing element of disrespect in spoiling a child. It is rarely done out of the genuine desire to equip him to face the world. On the contrary, it is a certain dose of austerity that generally achieves that.
I honestly think all this shit is much deeper than we can process. Say, the screen. The screen is absolutely unreal. Seeing images on a screen is unreal. We have adapted consciously to understand pixels and whatnot but our primal brains cannot process this idea that there is a girl in the screen. Something weird happens at that level, and it happend to a lesser degree in a photograph, and a lesser degree in a painting, and so on. But like the industrial machine has shattered and outperformed human work, the moving-photograph screen has shattered all the framework around this glitch which humanity had adapted itself to over the millennia.
The screen is in fact a shield and an element of safety, so in a certain way it endorses infantilization. Through the screen you watch vile things you wouldn't want to watch in real life.

[Anonymous No.18842013]

>>18817395
all of that is true but it has no signficance, they are all facades. the content they produce is different and their content has different thresholds where it would break the suspention of disbelief but it's basically the same

[Anonymous No.18842373]

>>18810041
The inherent meaningless of life coupled with man's will (craving) to meaning causes so much angst in itself. Add on man's freedom of will to that and a life without meaning becomes excruciating. To escape from this I, as many other men do, have turned to worship another ideal: women.
In the past, a simple union of marriage worked for most men. Devoting one's life to his wife and serving her and her children brought enough meaning to a man's life to last until his death.
Unfortunately for myself, and many other men in this generation, woman has been completely demystified. We are painfully aware that she is not pure, she is not fair, and she is just as depraved as we are. Hell, these are the only things man actually does have in common with her. Thus, we can no longer find a way to rationalize our love for her as an ideal nor as an extension to ourselves without losing our dignity.
To resolve this some men turn to vtubers. They are divine in that they are omnipresent, flawlessly beautiful, and ever-distant. Features that make a goddess perfect for worship.
For me personally, I will temporarily delude myself with vtubers as much as necessary to satisfy this craving until I find my own purpose in life.

>So, I come to you as my last resort, which ancient or modern sociologist, philosopher and cultural theorist can explain the rise of Virtual YouTubers and the impact they will have in society for future generations.
I don't know about the future impact, but if you want literature on women as an object of worship in the context of man's will to meaning, it's quite the huge subject and there is plenty in context of Christianity/Buddhism.
(In my opinion, if woman worship is particularly alien to you, you will have no way of truly understanding the vtuber craze until you understand this particular aspect first)
In terms of worship of women in contemporary times and the future, some authors I looked at recently are Esther Vilar (worship of woman being a product of society, including stuff like perpetual sexualization), and Simone Beauvoir (from the perspective of women adhering to men's worship).
In context of man and false worship of woman in relation to God, I recently looked at Otto Weininger (characterology, soul, love, etc.).

[Anonymous No.18842729]

>>18842373
>woman has been completely demystified
but this is nonsense. woman is as much a mystery as ever. pornography and social media do not 'demystify' woman. whatever facades and degradations she is put through do not reveal her but only conceal her nature further.

[Anonymous No.18842773]

>>18841521
You unironically need to watch more anime. I dont deny a lot of it fits into what you described, hell maybe even most of nu-anime does for all I know, but there is certainly a vast amount of anime that isnt just providing escapism or cope for lonely men

[Anonymous No.18842866]

>>18837800
Dude, your not too old to date the younger chicks. This used to be normal. A man with experience gets a young fertile woman.
Also relationships are only hard work if you are with barely compatible partner. A real relationship is based on lightheartedness and communication and being considerate.

[Anonymous No.18842913]

>>18842729
>pornography and social media do not 'demystify' woman
You don't need neither of those to experience the "demystification" of women, the illusions of feminity are completely non-existant in the modern "free" woman.

[Anonymous No.18842915]

>>18842729
Not that anon, but I dont agree with this. I think both pornography and social media among other modern things showed true nature of both men and women, with none of us liking it very much and with end result of wishing to exchange it for far more pleasent illusions we greatly enjoyed in out past

[Anonymous No.18842936]

>>18841566
I need to know what the source of this is.

[Anonymous No.18842951]

>>18839301
Here you go

https://youtu.be/ybWZUYsJh3c

[Anonymous No.18844180]

>>18842373
Nice marine picture.

[Anonymous No.18844271]

>>18810041
You have to understand the type of isolation only a young Chinese boy could experience, living with his mom and dad who work 6 days a week, living in a megacity of 30 million people, masturbating to cartoons daily.

[Anonymous No.18844424]

>All these zoomers who know the names and watch this shit
Holy fuck I have to leave

[Anonymous No.18844486]

>>18841461
>Fake anime girls are like an improved version of that, they're always acting happy and having fun instead of getting into unpleasant arguments or shouting at people in chat.
That's just what people normally do on youtube and twitch and television and radio and public events.

>>18841521
This is complete nonsense from start to finish and it's obvious you've never watched anime and know nothing about it, and no your daily pornhub habit does not count. My diagnosis is that you're a coomer in denial and projecting your issue on everything else.

>>18844424
>literally anything I don't like is ZOOMERS
Pills. Now.

[Anonymous No.18844511]

>>18844486
seethe harder weeb tranny

[Anonymous No.18844521]

>>18844511
There was no seething. I never said or implied anything to suggest that I'm a weeb or tranny. You're projecting. I accept your concession.

[Anonymous No.18844544]

>>18844521
seethe harder weeb tranny

[Anonymous No.18844557]

>>18844544
I accept your concession, weeb tranny.

[Anonymous No.18844574]

>>18810087
parasocial relationships

GUYS I USED A BIG WORD

[Anonymous No.18844603]

>>18844486
Nah vtubing is for zoomers.
My sister was watching that stuff on her tiktoks so I took her phone away until she promised never to watch that filth again.

[Anonymous No.18844607]

>>18844603
You think everything you don't like is for zoomers.

>My sister was watching that stuff on her tiktoks so I took her phone away until she promised never to watch that filth again.
She was using a phone? Well that just proves that phones are for zoomers.

[Anonymous No.18844615]

>>18844607
shut the fuck up weeb tranny

[Anonymous No.18844628]

>>18844615
Really funny that you wrote all that pseudointellectual screeching about anime you've never watched and now you can't literally do anything except copy-paste this one line, and somehow you're not the one who's seething.

[Anonymous No.18844776]

>>18844628
stfu retard

[Anonymous No.18844794]

>>18844776
This is hilarious. Please keep going.

[Anonymous No.18844824]

>annoying 14 yo weeb doesn't shut the fuck up and keeps handing out (you)s
why don't you just go hump your favorite body pillow while listening to cringe alvin and the chipmunks tier anime openings instead, retard?

[Anonymous No.18844831]

>>18844824
>I-I'm actually baiting you!
Ahahahahahaha.