/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.18486270]

What's the modern high literature?

[Anonymous No.18486276]

>>18486270
We'll have to wait a couple hundred years to find out.

[Anonymous No.18486298]

>>18486270
>The blurb about jazz
Lol. So dishonest. Read a little about music history and you'll see how two-faced art academia is about jazz.

[Anonymous No.18486313]

>jazz
>high culture

[Anonymous No.18486319]

Fuck off, neon genesis evangelion is high culture.

[Anonymous No.18486322]

>>18486319
Yeah for illiterate memchildren and neckbeards

[Anonymous No.18486341]

>ToGODshi's literary masterpiece Hunter X Hunter
>Low pop-culture

[Anonymous No.18486365]

>>18486270
>jazz
>high culture
absolute state of mutts

[Anonymous No.18486375]

>>18486276
50 will suffice for some outline

[Anonymous No.18486384]

whats the movie at the bottom?

[Anonymous No.18486386]

>>18486313
filtered

[Anonymous No.18486410]

>>18486270
I love Star Wars and superhero movies. I'm fine being a low culture pleb

[Anonymous No.18486413]

>>18486270
>Yotsuba
>Low Culture

[Anonymous No.18486489]

>>18486386
Jazz is just corrupted classical, you nonce.

[Anonymous No.18486513]

Movie on bottom right of left panel?

[Anonymous No.18486521]

>>18486513
Kagemusha

[Anonymous No.18486565]

>>18486270
>movies
>High culture
Sure, buddy.

[Anonymous No.18486610]

Jazz originated from the mix of black and European music creating a superior form of expression. Jazz is about individual expression through improvisation in a group of other musicians. Everyone is connected and creating while classical is written and thought out by one person. It takes the best musicians to standup to and surpass a composed classical piece. Coltrane is not one of them, please remove him from the chart.

[Anonymous No.18486620]

>>18486270
>OP sneaking Jazz artists into "high culture"
Nice try.

[Anonymous No.18486623]

>>18486270
Stuff like Evangelion has a timeless appeal, same with Star Wars (not the new once), so I would argue that they would be somewhat higher culture

[Anonymous No.18486673]

>>18486270
What does it say about the West that half of the stuff on the right is Japanese kek, Westoids can't even create entertaining pop culture anymore post-9/11.

Western pop culture as of now:
>Did you see BLACK PANTHER?!
>I put a great deal of effort into ensuring that transwomxn of color are represented in my latest fantasy YA series
>other allegories about racism (Harry Potter)
>ayo nah mean bitches on my dick uh sheeeit fuck nigga
>every now and then, something decent

Even low-culture like Evangelion is memorable after 30 years, no one even remember what happened in a Marvel movie 30 minutes after they leave the theater. No one remembers any music post-2000 unless it becomes a meme somehow.

[Anonymous No.18486685]

>>18486610
Individual expression is inherently 'low', please leave this board and never return.

[Anonymous No.18486705]

>>18486685
Yes, expressing every bit of your psyche is low culture. Composition cannot achieve this.

[Anonymous No.18486708]

>>18486623
bait

[Anonymous No.18486808]

>>18486489
Sure

[Anonymous No.18486864]

>>18486319
>>18486623
>>18486708
Look closely, it has the Netflix logo.
The Netflix dub/sub is complete crap, the original (sub, you dubfags) is timeless.

[Anonymous No.18486876]

>>18486319
People overrate how deep literature is. most books beloved on here have a similar level of quality to their themes and aesthetics as Eva does. Even the rebuilds are pretty interesting thematically. Im not saying Eva is deep or complex, but its as deep as Doestoesky or Mishima etc. (simplistic, but resonant and interesting). Evangelion is easily the most "literary" piece of motion picture that ive found, as someone majorly into both art film and Literature ( a few runners up would be The seventh seal and Eyes wide shut)

[Anonymous No.18486897]

>>18486384
assassins creed on the left (awful video game) and Evangelion on the right (legitimately better than any literature released in the last 30 years)

[Anonymous No.18486905]

>>18486489
pseud

[Anonymous No.18486916]

>>18486565
Check out A24 movies.

[Anonymous No.18486918]

>>18486876
Good description and thoughts but there are definitely deeper shows and movies than Eva. Sopranos for one.

[Anonymous No.18486921]

>>18486685
.... you do realize that classical is moreso individual expression than jazz is? Classical = one person Jazz = a group all writing in sync.
Fucking pseud literature fags thinking they're smart enough to talk about music

[Anonymous No.18486924]

>>18486876
Ive seen people trash Eyes Wide Shut, what do you find about it to be literary.

[Anonymous No.18486930]

>>18486918
to be fair I havent seen sopranos. my best friend always wants me to

[Anonymous No.18486948]

>>18486313
>Adorno
>Know something about music

[Anonymous No.18486977]

>>18486270
>Hamlet
Shakespeare sucks, simply put.
>The Iliad
Yeah let's spend a whole chapter listing off boats. Such high culture!
>Paradise Lost
Actually good.
>Statues
I mean it's cool looking but in reality it's just the product of some artist who wanted to make a buck.
>Classical musicians
These are literally just autists who saw music as math problems.
>Plato
Based
>Aristotle
Cringe
>John Coltrane
The opposite of classical musicians, actually good
>Mona Lisa
Is a bad painting with no emotional content whatsoever
>Timeproof
An impossible concept. I look forward to the day when people throw aside their Homer and start reading real poetry like Bukowski. Honestly, I think that you guys are just attracted to the pomp of the "classics" and don't actually care about the quality of the work.
Need I go on?

[Anonymous No.18486990]

>>18486270
I like to think we need perspective to know what will withstand the test of time. Like maybe only 50 years from now we will collectively be able to look back on the works of these decades and judge which are worth being remembered. I am speaking from Ignorance but werent most of the art in the left side of OP's pic really not all that universal for the people who experienced at the time of their conception?

[Anonymous No.18487001]

>>18486977
Ask me how I know youre a nigger. Hahaha.

[Anonymous No.18487009]

>>18487001
Whiter than you, Ahmed

[Anonymous No.18487028]

>>18486990
Epic poetry was a core part of Greek culture. Shakespeare was very popular in his day, as were most of the big names in classical music. If you buy into the jazz = high culture meme, it was Coltrane for example was a huge figure at the time. It should honestly be evident to anyone who cares to look that Western culture is stagnating "bigly". This isn't even old-fogeyism like you might get out of an Adorno type - how often do you see discussion of 21st century literature/film/music beyond when something new comes out (and only then for a few days)?

[Anonymous No.18487075]

>>18486565
most experimental/arthouse cinema is on par with the meme books that get shilled here

[Anonymous No.18487083]

>>18486916
Horrendous bait

[Anonymous No.18487087]

>>18486384
Kagemusha. Not one of Kurosawa's best films IMO, don't know why this one was chosen

[Anonymous No.18487149]

>>18487075
>the absolute state of nu/lit/

[Anonymous No.18487152]

>>18486977
you are such a nigger that your skin absorbs all visible light, you make black holes shit themselves

[Anonymous No.18487154]

>books
>high culture

[Blarty Hongo !H0lVGXJNm6 No.18487171]

>>18486270
Why the hell is Bowie on the right side?

[Anonymous No.18487220]

how far back do we have to go to find the most recent piece of 'high culture' that will 'stand the tests of time'?

[Anonymous No.18487226]

>>18487220
Belle Époque, so nothing published after 1900

[Anonymous No.18487234]

>>18487220
Whenever the reactionary fantasizes about going back to

[Anonymous No.18487236]

>>18487220
It's almost impossible to judge which contemporary works will "stand the tests of time," but I think it's safe to say that >>18487226 is wrong and that, at the very least, some Modernist works will endure.

[Anonymous No.18487254]

>>18487226
>>18487234
>>18487236
I think that Tolkien's works could stand the test of time, but it seems that Amazon and the Tolkien society will most likely corrupt it beyond recognition

[Anonymous No.18487259]

>>18486319
Knew these types would be in here. NGE is expressing a recurrent theme but is low culture itself. gits is the closest anime to high culture with a conceptually driven story, but it is told from the eyes of the villains. All of the heroes are mercilessly snuffed out by shadow government protagonists. It is destined to last longer because of being rooted in concepts that will only be more relevant as full-blown technocracy takes over. It engages directly with contemporary philosophy, and memes, and psychology, and more importantly, the internet. It lacks some critical high culture elements aside from the wistful major, essentially wrapping any platonic notions, unexplored, into her ghost and person. The ghost in the shell as the cog in the machine.
Unfortunately, it wont stand the test of time because it is going to be rehashed a thousand different ways, each instance selling its immortality. A mouthpiece lauding some contemporary policy and scorching others, gimmicks like "sustainable" warfare in the most recent incarnation. And so all of the elements that would be henceforth timeless are swallowed in appeals to staying hip. Death by a thousand small bites.
I was watching an old Hitchcock film, the man who knew too much. It ends in a shoot out as if it was written like a western or an 80s action flick. Many things that are impressive and sensuously appealing will be reinvented in the context of the times and the old things will be deposed.
What makes something timeless are the stooges that pick it up and carry it forward. This relegation leaves the timeless category in the hands of a very small realm of philosophers, historians, literary buffs, and political pseuds. With high literacy rates and with anyone being able to watch a movie I expect to see some modifications. The classics will be replaced with cult classics, greek values with geek values. A discord for every outcast offering the equivalent of troon grooming to join their club.

[Anonymous No.18487271]

>>18487028
literature is rotting, movies are dead, music was still sort of alive until a few years ago, although classical is long dead

[Anonymous No.18487286]

>>18486270
>fagles translation of the iliad is high culture
>coltrane is high culture
>what the fuck even is that, looks like a netflix anime adaptation

[Anonymous No.18487288]

>>18486977
So you've never read the illiad then? All you do is talk about illiad memes

[Anonymous No.18487468]

>>18486977
Prime example of a midbrow midwit

[Anonymous No.18487474]

>trying not to be drawn into defending evangelion

>>18487259
are you talking about gits the movie or tv show?

[Anonymous No.18487476]

>>18486270
Jazz is Jewish nigger music.

[Anonymous No.18487489]

>sexualized dance music perfect for mass consumption because of how it at the time appealed to the lowest common denominator
>high culture
You know it's not true.

[Anonymous No.18487516]

The Iliad was the pop culture of its time

[Anonymous No.18487539]

>>18486270
leave dark souls out of this

[Anonymous No.18487552]

>>18487539
Demons Souls is genuinely great and creative
Dark Souls was fun and memorable.
Everything after is cringe tho

[Anonymous No.18487557]

>>18486298
Interesting, can you give an exert or any recommendations?

[Anonymous No.18487559]

>categorizing media
you are all retards, fuck you.
only things I like count as high culture

[Anonymous No.18487581]

>>18486876
Eyes Wide Shut isn't even Kubrick's most "literary" film. Fuck off the anime and go watch Barry Lyndon/Paths of Glory pseud.

[Anonymous No.18487589]

>>18486977
>An impossible concept. I look forward to the day when people throw aside their Homer and start reading real poetry like Bukowski.
I actually like Bukowski, but you're such a midwit pseud it's almost unbelievable.

[Anonymous No.18487600]

>>18487581
I love those movies as well...

[Anonymous No.18487607]

>>18487087
Someone answered already. Probably chosen because it's visually stunning and had the widest Western distribution of all of his films (contemporaneously at the time of release).

[Anonymous No.18487623]

>>18487220
twin peaks the return

[Anonymous No.18487624]

>>18486410
>all that shite

[Anonymous No.18487625]

>>18487220
W.G. Sebald's Austerlitz (2001) seems to have been basically canonized already. László Kraznahorkai, Svetlana Alexievich, Olga Tokarczuk, Karl Ove Knausgård, Jon Fosse and Peter Handke are all authors who are still alive and writing and have a good shot at being remembered as some of the greats. Not that it means they will, but it's not like they're the only ones either. And there are some recently dead like Günter Grass and Umberto Eco who might make it.

[Anonymous No.18487629]

>>18487271
>movies are dead
Horror is having a renaissance. As a genre, it tends to attract talent when mass audience schlock has taken over.

[Anonymous No.18487632]

>>18486298
It's a troll bro

[Anonymous No.18487642]

What a horrible thread. I didnt expect this from lit

[Anonymous No.18487769]

>>18487642
/tv/*

[Anonymous No.18487811]

>>18487642
>>18487769
This is EXACTLY the kind of shit thread I expect to see on /tv/.

[Anonymous No.18487830]

>>18487559
2hu is the highest culture

[Anonymous No.18487882]

>>18486319
>Fuck off, neon genesis evangelion is high culture.

[Anonymous No.18487898]

>>18486270
>Dragonball
>Low pop culture
fuck out of here you fucking pseud.

[Anonymous No.18487947]

>>18487171
Because it's a subjective image created by a faggot who wants to validate his own tastes by shitting on anything moderately popular today. I wouldn't even say I like most of the shit on the right, but OP needs to know he's consuming some sort of media that is better than what most people consume to stroke his ego.

[Anonymous No.18487958]

>>18486921
Individual creation =/= Individual expression

[Anonymous No.18488069]

>>18486270
Theroux
Bloom said the Book of Numbers by Joshua Cohen may go on to be one of the great works of Jewish American literature
But it is hard to tell how things will age

[Anonymous No.18488099]

>>18486365
Jazz is extremely popular in Europe and Japan. You don't know what you're talking about.

[Anonymous No.18488211]

>>18488099
That doesn't make jazz good, it just means it spread by osmosis due to American occupation - a tragedy, to be sure.

[Anonymous No.18488224]

>>18486270
>jazz

[Anonymous No.18488401]

>>18487271
Classical is still alive, unless you’re a theorylet

[Anonymous No.18488479]

>>18488224
>>18488211
>>18488099
>>18487476
>>18487286
>>18487028
>>18486977
>>18486921
>>18486620
>>18486610
>>18486489
>>18486365
>>18486313
>>18486298
The thing with jazz is that it’s fans and jazz musicians are so try hard that they want their little hobby to be elevated to the classical greats, it’s certainly higher than all other forms of music, but nowhere near classical, jazz is less about the music than classical is, in Bach’s or Wagner’s music you can just feel how much they care about music, as most jazz musicians don’t really give a fuck and are more about “expression”. It’s not really the musicians as much as it is the pathetic fans of it

[Anonymous No.18488498]

>>18486270
Damn, those bright colours on the right are attracting me.

[Anonymous No.18488521]

>>18486270
>retarded saxophone fan wants to put his music in high culture
I think putting Kurosawa (and any film) in high culture was a stretch, but this is just a joke.

You could have chosen so much more to exemplify non-white high culture, like Noh theatre, or Aztec philosophy, which is at least interesting and culturally important.

[Anonymous No.18488583]

>>18486270
>retarded saxophone fan wants to put his music in high culture
I think putting Kurosawa (and any film) in high culture was a stretch, but this is just a joke.

You could have chosen so much more to exemplify non-white high culture, like Noh theatre, or Aztec philosophy, which is at least interesting and culturally important.

[Anonymous No.18488599]

>>18486270
>gigachad saxaphone
lmfao

[Anonymous No.18488607]

>>18486270
>jazz
>high culture
>evangelion
>low culture

[Anonymous No.18488680]

>>18486977
base-
>>Aristotle
>cringe
cringe

[Anonymous No.18488769]

>>18488479
It’s telling that whenever you press someone on jazz here, they’ll always bring up its complexity and the high level of musicianship it takes to play it. They have no concern for music as a listened experience or the effects it has on the listener, but only on how much it strains the hand of the player concerns. I want to read some of the more of the arguments from the intellectual defenders of jazz (I have Amiri Baraka’s book on music, and I was told to look into Alain Locke and Fred Moten), but I don’t think I’ll be compelled by their arguments.

[Anonymous No.18488794]

>>18486270
>Modern
>High literature

There is none. The only reason the concept of "high literature" even exists is because the old timey rich "intelligentsia" faggots of the world used to be the only ones who could read and write and normie faggots spent every waking minute working or starving to death.

[Anonymous No.18488819]

>>18486270
>Old thing good!
>New thing BAD!

Do you /lit/osexuals ever pull your collective heads out of your asses long enough to take a breath?

Jesus fucking Christ you people are the definition of the word "pretentious"

[Anonymous No.18488829]

>>18488819
In this case new things actually ARE bad though.
Also the whole point of appreciating "art" is to shit on people with worse taste than you to increase your social status.

[Anonymous No.18488878]

As meme-y as it may sound, I don't think NGE really belongs on the left like the rest of those (because they definitely do) but Evangelion has at least a certain amount of philosophical depth to it, even if it really is entry level at best..

I dunno, maybe it's because it was the only animoo I ever actually gave the slightest shit about, but it is quite a bit "deeper" than anything else its being lumped with in that picture.

>TL;DR: LMAO SUCH A NECK BEARD MANCHILD DOOD!! XD

[Anonymous No.18488893]

>>18486270
>>>Idolizing old timey motherfuckers who unironically actually wore makeup/wigs fopshit clothing

Jesus Christ book nerds are fucking pathetic.

[Anonymous No.18488899]

>>18488878
>On the left

Fuck me, I meant on the right.. goddamnit.

[Anonymous No.18488936]

>>18488479
Yeah you haven't talked to a single jazz musician. Nobody thinks like that.

[Anonymous No.18488953]

>>18486270
>jazz
high culture lol

[Anonymous No.18488979]

>>18488829
Hey man, “I know the reason that you talk behind my back/I used to be among the crowd you’re in with”

Art brings you to a higher place, if you see art as a tool to feel superior you are u doing what most artists intended for their art

[Anonymous No.18488994]

>>18488479
Bro u should go to a jazz bar and listen, trust me it is great! It’s fun and vibrant, it also depends on the crowd, but it always reminds me of the scene in Mozart where he is playing upside down and they are all partying

[Anonymous No.18489017]

>>18486270
one piece

[Anonymous No.18489048]

>>18488878
I think it’s because NGE try’s so hard to present itself as the deepest philosophical stuff ever, when the guy who created it more or less said half the stuff was put in to look deep and interesting

[Anonymous No.18489088]

>>18487259
>gits is the closest anime to high culture with a conceptually driven story,
>He hasn't seen Lain, Ergo proxy, LOTGH, and Mushashi

[Anonymous No.18489095]

It's pretty pseud to base the quality of a work on something as indeterminate as a timeframe or medium or genre.

[Anonymous No.18489100]

>>18489048
lol, true. All I know is that Shin Godzilla is fucking shit with all the operations jargon and board meetings of Evangelion and not much of the good Godzilla shit.

[Anonymous No.18489108]

>>18486270
>French neoclassicism
>High culture
lmao, you can tell a retarded burger or an eastern european made this image

[Anonymous No.18489110]

>>18486313
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rbdx-jR3a8U

[Anonymous No.18489115]

>>18487259
meds

[Anonymous No.18489134]

>>18489017
This. The symbolism and childlike wonder captured are kino.

[Anonymous No.18489150]

>>18488769
Instead of reading about jazz I would recommend listening to a variety of performers and basing your own views on that. Good music is ineffable, and I think you would find going to the source more productive than trying to understand it from a second hand perspective.
In the words of the immortal Frank Zappa:
"Writing about music is like dancing about architecture”

[Anonymous No.18489204]

>>18489150
I've listened top all of the all of the major jazz recordings from Louis Armstrong to Kamasi Washington. It certainly is enjoyable music on the surface, but I was unable to continue enjoying it the more I thought about it critically.

[Anonymous No.18489291]

>>18488819
he is literally asking for new good things
there is old pop literature
just look at a list of best sellers from 1900

[Anonymous No.18489305]

>>18489204
>I was unable to continue enjoying it the more I thought about it critically.
Not sure what you mean by this. Sounds like jazz isn't to your taste and that's OK.

[Anonymous No.18489339]

>>18486270
>jazz
no

[Anonymous No.18489353]

>>18487581
>>18487600
Clockwork Orange is based on a book if you didn't know

[Anonymous No.18489356]

>>18487623
love the way Lynch weaves gnosticism and nostalgia together

[Anonymous No.18489358]

>>18489353
I did...

[Anonymous No.18489387]

>>18486270
Jazz is more fun to play than classical, and a great solo is as expressive as any chamber piece for that instrument. Arguments against it either come from pretentious (and typically mediocre) classical musicians or musically illiterate pseuds.
The former: Adorno
The latter: everyone who reads Adorno

[Anonymous No.18489425]

>>18486270
HxH is the most brilliant, greatest piece of fiction of all time. Its' themes are forever relevant and it will still be discussed in universities 600 years from now on.

[Anonymous No.18489501]

>>18488479
A classic snob who don't know a shit about music and the study of improvisation

[Anonymous No.18489514]

>>18486270
>jazz
>high culture

[Anonymous No.18489680]

>>18489425
>I will stay with you forever my king
I mean I like it but it is not the best in it's field
I liked the similar scene with itsuki and sensui more in yuyu Hakusho
There are also just bad parts of hunter x hunter that one where they get trapped inside a video game that just stinks
I think hunter x hunter current arc is much more ambitious but I doubt there will be an ending
It has some great moments but calling it high literature is something I do not agree with

[Anonymous No.18489690]

>>18486270
It's worth pointing out that it's genres/mediums that are classified as high or low art, rather than individual works. So it's not surprising that the best of low art is better than the worst of high art.

[Anonymous No.18489723]

>>18486313
jazz is just an extension of classical music when it is good, when it is bad its some of the worst pop drivel.
All rock music is just pop drivel, though

[Anonymous No.18489737]

>>18489723
>All rock music is just pop drivel
even this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54W8kktFE_o

[Anonymous No.18489758]

>>18489737
especially this. It's faux deep in my opinion. Very hollow and soulless for the sake of tryiing to evoke a feeling that the music itself can't evoke

[Anonymous No.18489767]

>>18486270
I seem to not find any new great literature

[Anonymous No.18489773]

>>18489758
what about this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kUib8lh168

[Anonymous No.18489774]

>>18489767
Wolf Hall by Mantel (2009)

[Anonymous No.18489780]

>>18489773
Fun, but I don't think it has aged/will age well more than to be a cultural oddity. Which is what seperates things that are cultural vs. supra-cultural masterpieces (shakespeare, dante (despite being very specific to his time), bach, mingus)

[Anonymous No.18489788]

>>18489774
I'll check it out

[Anonymous No.18489793]

>>18486276
Kind of this.

Think about Shakespeare. Nobody would deny that Shakespeare is high culture, right? But did Shakespeare's own contemporaries view him as "high culture"? Was Shakespeare recognized as this groundbreaking genius in his own time? It really seems like not. Shakespeare was popular and recognized. The King's Men were the most popular theater troup in England by the time of his retirement from playwriting, and Shakespeare even had a reputation on the continent. But was he considered truly great? Was he considered "high culture"? Or was he merely considered clever and entertaining, and perhaps just a particularly interesting example of the long line of Elizabethan English dramatists, along with Marlowe and the rest?

Basically, even artists who are popular in our own time might not have their true value recognized until some decades have passed, or even some centuries. Shakespeare was absolutely popular in his own day, but he was not really considered "high culture" in his own day. Indeed, when he was alive the tastemakers might have even considered him "low culture" because of how popular his plays were with the common people. He did not become "high culture" until more than a century after his death.

[Anonymous No.18489813]

>>18489793
This is a good point, I think what makes high culture high culture is when it interacts with other cultures.
Seeing how it holds up to new times or new countries. Which is what happened to shakespeare, who has become insanely popular all over the world and not just in his context

Maybe high culture is actually transcending a specific cultural realm to others?

[Anonymous No.18489820]

>>18486270
>Berserk
>Infinite Jest
>Eva
>Blood Meridian
>Fate/Stay Night: Unlimited Blade Works by DEEN
All I got off the top of my head

[Anonymous No.18489837]

>>18489820
Berserk was unfinished
Infinite Jest is aging pretty poorly imo and pales in comparison to older art
Blood Meridian is pretty neat and I will bet it stays relevant for awhile

[Anonymous No.18489838]

>>18489758
All of Pink Floyd feels like this after Animals, although all the musicians were extremely technically talented. David Gilmour is one of the best guitarists of all time, Roger Waters can suck my dick tho

[Anonymous No.18489843]

>>18489425
Is HxHfags being insanely pretentious about their slightly above average shounen some long-running meme or are they really just that retarded?

[Anonymous No.18489844]

>>18489838
>Pink Floyd feels like this after Animals
Shine on You Crazy Diamond was before Animals

[Anonymous No.18489852]

>>18489723
Calling it an "extension of classical music" is retarded.

[Anonymous No.18489858]

>>18489837
>Berserk was unfinished
Doesn't really matter if it resonates with people and is popular. Miura's death may elevate it to new levels of popularity. The guy, and the work, was already an icon and it genuinely has the artistic depth to stay that way for a long time.
>Infinite Jest is aging pretty poorly imo and pales in comparison to older art
How so? At the very least, discussion of it is still very vibrant as far as modern literature goes and it's been almost 30 years. That should count for something.

[Anonymous No.18489863]

>>18489844
You're right, I meant DSM

[Anonymous No.18489865]

>>18489820
If EVA is on the right, Berserk should be hard right.
BM is canon already, but OP is maybe asking for a recent, 21st century work.

[Anonymous No.18490049]

>>18489793
>But did Shakespeare's own contemporaries view him as "high culture"?
They did. Fuck off

[Anonymous No.18490294]

>>18486916
yeah spring breakers is truly high culture

[Anonymous No.18490405]

>>18486319
>>18486864
Agreed. Netflix NGE is garbo, but the NGE of the 90s with the original dub is kino that can be appreciated forever.

[Anonymous No.18490481]

Please, everybody in this thread, read this book. While there have been a few good posts, everyone either seems to fall into the Weeaboo or Frothing-at-the-mouth-Fox-News-viewer.

The distinction between high and low art doesn't exist anymore, if we're being descriptive. I don't think it should be this way, but after Warhol, anything can be put in a gallery. Anything can be played at a concert hall. Anything can be on stage. What confuses me most is the people complaining about this. This board is, at it's core, a mixing of high and low culture. If a discussion of literature in a Parisian parlour was interrupted by a patrician pulling out a Japanese wood print of woman with strangely big eyes and called everyone else fags, they would be laughed out. Here the mixing and intermingling of culture leads to more interesting discussion. I personally think there should exist a space for high culture.

[Anonymous No.18490514]

>>18490049
Post proof or GTFO.

[Anonymous No.18490546]

>>18490405
The only two television series off the top of my head that deserve to be called "high culture" are Evangelion and Twin Peaks.

[Anonymous No.18490556]

>>18486876
>"Evangelion is easily the most "literary" piece of motion picture that ive found"

[Anonymous No.18490562]

>>18486276
Why? High art is generally recognized within it's own time.

[Anonymous No.18490617]

>>18490481
Parisian salons were themselves about mixing disparate elements, with low forms like opera eventually gaining respect. If anime existed in the year 1750, they would watch it.

[Anonymous No.18490660]

>>18486313
BASED.

[Anonymous No.18490711]

>>18489680
>>18489843
you're either a fucking pleb or wasn't born in an aristocratic family. I spit on you

[Anonymous No.18490726]

>>18490481
The difference between high culture and low culture is revealed by how long it lasts
And THERE IS a meaningful distinction

[Anonymous No.18490787]

>>18487259
>I was watching an old Hitchcock film, the man who knew too much
you need to take your pills anon

[Anonymous No.18490939]

>>18490481
The distinction between high art and low art (as you mean with by invoking parisian parlours) never really existed, its nothing but a bourgeois status LARP. How come the only shared trait between all of high art is not the intellecual inability of the masses to appreciate it but rather the (historical or present) monetary inability to even experience it? Cant read books if youre a illiterate peasent, cant enjoy paintings if theyre in the mansion of their patron or sold off in a action, cant go to the opera if youre working 18 hour shifts in the factory.
The reason the distinction between high and low art is dissappearing is because those barriers are progressively dissappearing (libraries, ebooks, libgen / museums, replicas, google/dvds, streaming) and without them there is no defining feature of "high art".
If you define high art as art that only few select elites have the ability to enjoy then every niche piece of art becomes high art.
If you define high art as art that carries over throughout time then Id argue only high quality art carries over while low quality art is forgotten.
If you define high art as art of high quality then you cant superficially exclude pieces of art like for example a black metal album or in your case a manga illustration on the basis of their artistic medium, should they be of high quality.
There is only good and bad art with both categories being filled with the status-dependant definition of high art and low art. We'll never know how many operas were forgotten due to being shit.

[Anonymous No.18490958]

is posting on 4chan high brow or low brow?

[Anonymous No.18490964]

>>18486270
Music isn't high culture. It's literally just a bunch of sounds stringed together to make something that causes you to feel good. Yet I'm supposed to believe this is better than something like Evangelion or HxH?

[Anonymous No.18491003]

>>18490939
You think manga or black metal are relevant or artistic, because you have no taste and are just looking for some excuse, any excuse to destroy the lingering feeling that you are a failure as a human being. Which you are....

If you had any artistic merit you would for example ask if the French school of comics that Moebius belongs too could be considered artistic, or the ethereal shoegaze of My Bloody Valentine....

Instaid you choose two pseud genres like manga and black metal, showing everyone here you have no taste.

[Anonymous No.18491004]

>>18489852
Is it? Jazz az a serious genre only emerged after it got tangled up with classical music in France during the prohibition era.

[Anonymous No.18491012]

>>18490481
>please read this work of pure ideology

[Anonymous No.18491019]

>>18491003
I chose black metal since most people consider it nothing more than screaming and manga since he used the example of japanese wood prints of woman with strangely big eyes.
Stop projecting.

[Anonymous No.18491031]

>>18486270
Fixed that for you OP.

[Anonymous No.18491056]

>>18491019
Your argument on the merit of popculture is dictated by the opinion other people have? Face it. You have no taste, you could have started your argument talking about King Crimson for example, you did not because you genuinelt have no taste for the artistic and can only appreciate broad generic sweeping genres like bluck metul or munga. The rest is all cope.

[Anonymous No.18491086]

>>18490939
That is my point. I probably should have clarified when I talked about "space for high culture" I did not mean in the traditional sense of inaccessible art.
My intention with invoking Parisian Parlours was to illustrate a space of solely "high art" to contrast with /lit/. /lit/, to me, is trying to replicate at atmosphere of patrician discussion by pretending to enjoy "high art", despite the fact the board is build on a foundation of pop art.

>>18491012
It doesn't mean it doesn't have any merit

[Anonymous No.18491096]

>>18491003

https://youtu.be/IVv1mtH-tdA

Please refrain from talking about bm or shoegaze ever again

[Anonymous No.18491099]

>>18488099
im from europe
nobody listens to jazz
the only person who i know and listened to jazz was a wigger 8th grader who wanted to impress a girl, with his intelligence. he started to listen again to nigger rap afterwards

[Anonymous No.18491130]

>>18487539
>leave dark souls out of this
came here to say this

[Anonymous No.18491140]

>>18491003
>black metal isn't a-

[Anonymous No.18491145]

>>18491056
Shut the fuck up subhuman
There many great black metal albums and your happy dappy progressive bullshit merit is subjective as shit.

[Anonymous No.18491275]

Don Quixote has an interesting debate about high and low literature

>if those that are now in vogue, as well those that are pure invention as those founded on history, are, all or most of them, downright nonsense and things that have neither head nor tail, and yet the public listens to them with delight, and regards and cries them up as perfection when they are so far from it; and if the authors who write them, and the players who act them, say that this is what they must be, for the public wants this and will have nothing else; and that those that go by rule and work out a plot according to the laws of art will only find some half-dozen intelligent people to understand them, while all the rest remain blind to the merit of their composition; and that for themselves it is better to get bread from the many than praise from the few; then my book will fare the same way, after I have burnt off my eyebrows in trying to observe the principles I have spoken of, and I shall be ‘the tailor of the corner.’ And though I have sometimes endeavoured to convince actors that they are mistaken in this notion they have adopted, and that they would attract more people, and get more credit, by producing plays in accordance with the rules of art, than by absurd ones, they are so thoroughly wedded to their own opinion that no argument or evidence can wean them from it.

[Anonymous No.18491291]

>>18488479
this is absolutely, completely and utterly wrong. You have clearly never listened to jazz OR classical properly. never post on this website again

t. music PHD

[Anonymous No.18491308]

>>18487220
kubrick films

[Anonymous No.18491353]

>>18491291
>t. seething jazzfag

[Anonymous No.18491591]

>>18486977
Mona Lisa
>Is a bad painting with no emotional content whatsoever
Disagree. Are you aware of the Hockney-Falco Thesis (2001)? Compare da Vinci's Ginevra de' Benci (1474/78) to the Mona Lisa (1503) - notice the transition from hard/linear to soft focus? It's an important painting (certainly not my favorite, or my favorite artist of the period) whose intersubjective emotive appeal is attested to and affirmed by the the intergenerational retinue of museum-goers flocking to it. It's an epochal lodestone, hyperinflated and overvalued, but a lodestone nonetheless.

[Anonymous No.18491703]

>>18491096
Lol instaid of some argument the anon just post some random generic 1 in a 100 bands, proving me right.

[Anonymous No.18491716]

>>18491145
>he man (smokes joint) black metal is just as great as classical, (snorts coke) wut ya say? Art rock? No that all shit! (Shoots krokodil into left eyeball.)

Whatever you say buddy. Good luck listening to dungeon synth and dark woods homo ambient.

[Anonymous No.18491765]

>>18486319
Evangelion is a purely middlebrow work conceived by a horrible self-indulgent pissant.

[Anonymous No.18491770]

>>18486876
>( a few runners up would be The seventh seal and Eyes wide shut)
Faggot ass art ho post.

[Anonymous No.18491774]

I am going to piss on black metal fans even more, most black metal in texture, tone and subject matter but not in feeling, is basically just generic new age muzak, except durk an edgu. Thats it. Thats literally 99% of black metal. Somewhere between dad rock and new age muzak, only durkur an ugiur.

[Anonymous No.18491777]

>>18490546
That's because you're low IQ.

[Anonymous No.18491779]

>>18486623
Lel neither has timeless appeal. Ask anyone who grew up
>>18486319
Eva had to be the most pointless thing to ever watch aside from the robot battles or komm susser todd

[Anonymous No.18491785]

>>18486319
how

evangelion is written for whiny otaku stuck in arrested development by a whiny otaku stuck in arrested development. there's not a single transcendental quality you can find in the entire anime. this coupled with the frankly erotic designs of the teenagers makes further claims of "highbrow" more dubious.

[Anonymous No.18491789]

>>18491779
>komm susser todd
A crappy overrated pop song.

[Anonymous No.18491796]

>>18490546
>>18491765
>>18491777

Honestly, its usually just adolecents who think stuff like this is high culture, when its not.

If anything, I would vote an old cop show like "Streets of San Francisco" above both those shows, because it has engaging character dramas, relatable plots, dramatic development, etc but then again I am no longer a child.

[Anonymous No.18491800]

>>18491765
>>18491779
>>18491785
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rGJ_Kq8qifQ

[Anonymous No.18491817]

>>18486270
What is that at the bottom right of the high culture section?

[Anonymous No.18491823]

>>18486410
>that image

[Anonymous No.18491827]

>>18487552
>>18491130
the average dark souls fan is a mongoloid, why does its placement surprise you?

[Anonymous No.18491833]

>>18486977
le 3pic bo4t meme!!!

[Anonymous No.18491881]

>>18491796
Well, I would argue that animation, as a medium, satisfies a number of the arbitrary criteria defined throughout the thread - not least because it's technical demands require(d) interdisciplinary skill to produce effectively (prior to pipeline, anyway) - irrespective of content or theme. NGE is a series of character studies (the attendant material after EoE not so much) disguised by pseudo-mecha and a penchant for shounen trappings (see >>18491800 for examples of Anno's ASD in action). There's a lot of awkward analysis I could link to justify this point, a majority prior to the rise of the anituber, if you're interested.

[Anonymous No.18491888]

>>18486270
Christ this image sucks. Clearly made by a teenager

[Anonymous No.18491905]

>>18487087
Might not be among his best movies but that dream scene is definetely among his most beautiful scenes.

[Anonymous No.18491911]

>>18486270
Christ this image is based. Clearly made by a Chad

[Anonymous No.18491915]

Normies and low-creative iq nigger are so alike in their pure hatred of jazz and contemporary classical and art. Truly the best filter filter

[Anonymous No.18491932]

>>18491881
Thats some nice gibberish anon.

[Anonymous No.18491939]

>>18486270
>threw in one random nigger that doesn't matter
No, I swear race isn't important guys.
Frankly, I wasn't thinking it until you brought it up.

[Anonymous No.18491945]

>>18491932
Hmmm - I thought I was pretty clear. Whatever.

[Anonymous No.18491974]

>>18487220
The Greeks

[Anonymous No.18491998]

>>18491945
Autistos always think their insane ramblings are clear.

[Anonymous No.18492009]

>>18486413
Why do half the threads descend into Fuuka posting?

[Anonymous No.18492014]

>>18491945
>>18491998
Mate, I'm mocking you. Christ.

[Anonymous No.18492016]

>>18491881
Hmm you've got a point maybe I was wrong.

[Anonymous No.18492024]

>>18489204
>I've listened top all of the all of the major jazz recordings
ALL of them? including Albert Ayler, Sun Ra, Carla Bley, Cecil Taylor, Don Cherry? Louis Armstrong is essential to jazz history but not art music history. Unfortunately a lot of jazz histories kind of end in 1960 and the general consensus of what's important tapers off. That's when it started getting really good though. >>18489501
>study of improvisation
this is obviously essential to approaching jazz critically. You can view jazz as a mutation of classical that began when classically trained creoles were segregated by Jim Crowe laws to fraternize with uneducated blues musicians. The capturing of fleeting improvisations by audio recording technology plays a significant role in its development and proved an alternative to classicals notated composition. It's easy to see much of jazz as an extended experiment to Cage's "chance music", with each recording involving it's own unique set of variables.

[Anonymous No.18492061]

>>18491031
>/a/ is high culture
>Bach is low culture

[Anonymous No.18492070]

>>18486410
>(You)

[Anonymous No.18492091]

Can cookery count as high culture?

[Anonymous No.18492116]

>>18492024
>You can view jazz as a mutation of classical that began when classically trained creoles were segregated by Jim Crowe laws to fraternize with uneducated blues musicians.
It wasnt though, jazz is literally, the Original Dixieland Jazz Band a white outfit, then Whitey Paul Whitman made it respectable. Thats it.

[Anonymous No.18492155]

>>18492061
I mean, have you listened to Bach? It's all counterpoint and no point. At least Vivaldi has flair and Beethoven brooding intensity.

Urusei Yatsura on the other hand has a distinct voice, timeless themes, is steeped in cultural references and parodies, uses complicated visual humor, puns, and a flawless technical execution. Show me anything Bach composed that has even a sliver of the charm Ryunosuke Fujinami does, it can't be done.

[Anonymous No.18492545]

Im 19 so im sure I have fairly juvenile taste and im biased towards things that look pretty and are depressing, both of which Eva pulls off very well. I watched a bit of Eva with my dad (who has good taste) and he found it pretty compelling

[Anonymous No.18492555]

>Evangelion
>low pop culture
I mean, it's not high culture, but it doesn't fit in with harry potter, six nine, and all of these shitty cartoons.

[Anonymous No.18492567]

>>18489088
>Lain, Ergo proxy, LOTGH, and Mushashi
All of these are pure garbage. EVA is a masterpiece.

[Anonymous No.18492627]

>>18486673
Anime has more western values than western modern pop culture.

[Anonymous No.18492670]

>>18490958
>is posting on 4chan high brow or low brow?
new brow
>>18491003
>showing everyone here you have no taste.
why don't you put your fucking diaper back on, take that unearned ego you get from smelling your baby shit and work on your reading comprehension "instaid"

>>18491275
what's the context in the story? I'm still on the first part. It's such a meta book that I can't help but read this as a stylistic parody of both high and low art
>>18491939
>Coltrane
>Rollins
thats two, countlet.
>>18492116
I'm grossly simplifying the origins of 'jass' by implying that was creoles started it all, but you're just being a race cuck. Obviously whitey is going to be allowed in the studio first but that doesn't mean they invented it. Buddy Bolden and Jellyroll were playing in whore houses a decade before ODJB and they didn't invent jass either. If it makes you feel better let me emphasize that classical white culture is a foundation of jazz as we know it and remind that creoles are half white.
>>18492155
His compositions, which were considered too complex, went relatively unappreciated in his lifetime and his fame instead was built on his undeniable keyboard prowess and improvisation. Despite this, he never composed for piano and predated many of the notated dynamic flourishes we are used to in classical music. It leads to a high degree of stylistic variation in interpretation both inspired and not so much. This one moves me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hg_Pj1KrY8g
>Ryunosuke Fujinami
pic rel is the first thing that comes up. It seems impossible to expect serious consideration for every weeaboo cartoon. But if we insist on including anime in the pantheon of 'high art' somewhere next to Dante, Beethoven, and Michelangelo then my vote goes to Perfect Blue. Probably the most interesting statement I've seen on the "male gaze" meme is how Kon toes the line between tantalizing and horrifying during the rape scene with layers of technology, spectacle and performance on top.

[Anonymous No.18492915]

>>18492670, >>18490958
>is posting on 4chan high brow or low brow?
>new brow
ok, no it's unibrow >>18490481

[Anonymous No.18493118]

>>18492024
>Albert Ayler, Sun Ra, Carla Bley, Cecil Taylor, Don Cherry
Ive listened to two at least albums by each of those except Cara Bly. I’ve listened to like fifteen by Sun Ra.
> this is obviously essential to approaching jazz critically. You can view jazz as a mutation of classical that began when classically trained creoles were segregated by Jim Crowe laws to fraternize with uneducated blues musicians.
Jazz was created to facilitate the business activities of red light districts, it’s highly sexualized rhythm is one of its defining characteristics.

[Anonymous No.18493203]

>>18487811
It's unfortunate, I'd really like to see threads on this topic and /lit/ is one of the few boards where people (presumably) have enough intimate knowledge on a wide berth for both categories and the theory for meta discussion but yeah this is just >thing I like: Based >thing you like: Cringe /tv/ shitposting

[Anonymous No.18493213]

>>18490546
Have you not watched Gilmore Girls?

[Anonymous No.18493237]

>>18487898
Dragon Ball is Pomo masterpiece. It has far more artistic credibility than something like Evangellion,

[Anonymous No.18493257]

>>18486270
Evangelion is definitely better than run of the mill low brow pop culture. It’s only middle brow but still.

Anyway, you just don’t see to get that low brow has crowded out everything else so that’s what you’ve got now. Writing high brow in 2021 is an absurdity. Just appreciate the stuff that goes elevates low brow to middle brow.

[Anonymous No.18493267]

>>18486319
It’s low brow elevated to middle brow but that’s fine. You could say the same about McCarthy books.

[Anonymous No.18493277]

>>18486270

It depends on what you mean by high literature.

There's no satisfactory definition really, but you might look at something like the intent and goal of the author. High literature sees itself as being a part of a cultural and literary tradition and has as a goal building upon and expanding it. Paradise Lost is the best example I can think of "To justify the ways of God to Man." Milton is basically trying to write scripture. The issue is you also have to include something like Lord of the Rings, which Tolkien wrote in part to create a mythology that he felt was lost during christianization.

Alternately you can consider the audience, high literature is written for the educated "literary" class of society. Generally not themselves the elite, but usually related to and a hanger on of the actual powers. The "literary gentlemen" of Dream of the Red Chambers shows such people exist across cultures and places. By this definition, high literature is roughly whatever is winning the Booker Prize. The problem here is that the distinction between high and low is rapidly breaking down, as the market that formerly sustained 'low' culture moves elsewhere.

Finally, and referencing Jazz, high literature is whatever the culture of the time considers to be high literature. Remember that Shakespeare's plays were competing against bear bating, once upon a time. High culture is constantly looking back at low culture, scavenging it for parts, and (looking at you Margaret Atwood) pretending that of course you hadn't nicked any ideas from them.

Alternatively and cynically: Depressing.

[Anonymous No.18493318]

>>18487625
Based fellow Sebald poster. I enjoyed Austerlitz and The Rings of Saturn and Sebald’s other two works are sitting on my shelf for the future.

[Anonymous No.18493321]

>>18486977
YOU ARE AN IGNORANT NIGGER.

[Anonymous No.18493335]

>>18487830
The depth of 2hu doujin music always astounds me. Boobhu threads are naturally plebeian and patrician but I feel like the higher quality remixes in any sort of music style you can imagine is something that endears the fanon to me. I wonder how much the lack of corporate involvement in doujin music production [as well as the existence of thousands of remixes of different levels of quality, making someone more comfortable with attempting music] impacts the whole 2hu music scene.

[Anonymous No.18493360]

The only way to know for sure is the test of time.

I think harry potter will survive though, as it is still insanely popular. The best sellers list always include harry potter near the top despite being decades old now.

Video games won't make it, as technology improves it will become harder to keep them running on modern hardware/software. Video games already have a short-shelf life based on graphics continuously improving.

Brands like supreme won't make it, as eventually they'll go bust. All companies eventually go bust.

[Anonymous No.18493383]

Given the content of many classical works one could strongly argue that some hentai count as high art.

[Anonymous No.18493395]

[Anonymous No.18493436]

>>18486270
>>18486270
Here, fixed this for you, OP, no need to thank me.

[Anonymous No.18493487]

>>18486270
Aristotle´s Poetics Page 11

The Origin of the conception of high art vs low art can be seen to have taken place in ancient Greece with Aristotles making a distinction
that original poetry could be divided into two types, one that made its characters / heroes angry, characters that surpassed your typical
person and another who described and showed the attitude of the most vile characters that could exist

[Anonymous No.18493630]

>>18493487
fuck google translation it´s shit, here´s the excerpt in spanish

El Origen de la concepcion del high art vs low art se puede ver que tuvo lugar en la antigua grecia con Aristotles haciendo distincion
que la poesia original se podia dividir en dos tipos, uno que enoblecia a sus personajes/heroes, personajes que sobrepasaban a tu tipica
persona y otro que describia y mostraba la actitud de personajes mas viles que podian existir


sorry for this post >>18493487

[Anonymous No.18493652]

>>18486565

[Anonymous No.18493665]

>>18486876

[Anonymous No.18493681]

>>18487811
>>18487642
blame weebs for this

[Anonymous No.18493686]

>>18488878
>but Evangelion has at least a certain amount of philosophical depth to it

i don´t think so

[Anonymous No.18493754]

>>18490514
No need for proof, now fuck off

[Anonymous No.18493759]

>>18486876
And dragonball z

[Anonymous No.18493762]

>mfw edgy teenagers and weebz destroyed this thread

[Anonymous No.18493783]

Jazz is literally a psyop lmao

[Anonymous No.18493786]

>>18491291
Wtf what is even a music PHD, why do faggots here feel the need to invents themselves Phd whenever someone disagree with them.
>Boring game is bad
>I have a vidya Phd
Fuck off we all know a music Phd isn't a thing.

[Anonymous No.18493797]

>>18493436
Dark souls 2 lmao, you just had to cut and past dark souls 1.

[Anonymous No.18493851]

>>18489048
Do people actually believe this? I think it's really hard to believe that Anno really put a lot of the "deep" stuff (especially christian imagery) in there because he thought it was cool. Maybe it was a genuine accident, but Neon Genesis Evangelion is really the new "good news." I see it more so as a new (modern) take on the gospel, but everything is there: misplaced worship, hardened hearts, and all the failures and alienation that come from sin. In the end, its love, or at least the chance of loving another person again that makes life worth living. I thought it was interesting how Anno wanted to show the death and rebirth that was necessary to live out this new life in living to love other people. I also thought it was interesting how Anno really captured the challenge that comes with loving other people while showing the vanity of pursuing any other option (success, admiration, honor, romance, etc. All these worships totally failed and left the respective believers empty. It's really hard for me to see how people can seriously think Anno made evanglion without at least a strong consideration of Christianity and the gospel's good news.

[Anonymous No.18493861]

>>18493436
demons souls was the kino one

[Anonymous No.18493869]

>>18493851
its an out of context quote thats parroted

[Anonymous No.18493917]

>>18493861
>kino

[Anonymous No.18493942]

>>18493917
I meant... it was the good one. the one that was the least low brow nerd shit

[Anonymous No.18494021]

>>18486924
>people trash Eyes Wide Shut, what do you find about it to be literary
hardly anything. At best it displays sexual obsession in a purely cinematic language.

>>18493360
>harry potter will survive
only as long as it's acts as babys first literature

>Video games won't make it
>short-shelf life based on graphics
it's not just that but that they are inherently vapid. Their worth is in exploiting a false sense of productivity that naturally evaporates when all is completed. All that's left is nostalgia for your blissfully ignorant experience of doing nothing. The absolute peak of video games thus far is a 7/10 compared to so called high art and that's being generous.

[Anonymous No.18494060]

>>18486270

The stuff on the right is being used to 'decolonise' and replace the stuff on the left in American education. Scary.

[Anonymous No.18494525]

>>18488878
The philosophical depth is irrelevant imo. It’s specifically an art of it’s time in the sense that it’s narrative and narrative structure is that epoch articulating and does something very post-modern by taking pop art and making it more than pop art. Intentional or not it did the exact same thing that McCarthy did with Blood Meridian.

[Anonymous No.18494546]

>>18489048
We can’t trust creators to say what they did or didn’t intend.

[Anonymous No.18495389]

>>18486270
High culture side, last pic right side, source?

[Anonymous No.18495398]

>>18495389
Nevermind, I just found it.

[Anonymous No.18495416]

>>18486270
The Iliad and Homer were pop lit, Milton was not. Pic discarded. Most of your "pop" stuff has the flaw of being modern, not pop.

[Anonymous No.18495417]

>>18495398
what is it?

[Anonymous No.18495432]

>>18491827
everything else is a story telling medium except Alegria, but literally no one likes that outside of marketing people

dark souls is a game

[Anonymous No.18495449]

>>18495417
Kagemusha, directed by Akira Kurosawa

[Anonymous No.18495450]

>>18490562
Lol, you really think that there were no god complexed fags like you in the past saying the same shit?

[Anonymous No.18495474]

>>18486270
Tolkien, maybe?

[Anonymous No.18495524]

Shingeki No Kyojin

[Anonymous No.18495585]

>>18493851
Anno literally admits it himself. Look up some of his interviews

[Anonymous No.18495586]

>>18486365
this image is so fucking funny

[Anonymous No.18495595]

>>18493686
Eh, shame I don't care about you or your opinion. :^(

[Anonymous No.18495634]

>>18495585
Yeah and Nabokov denies quite a lot about Lolita. You can’t trust them.

[Anonymous No.18495647]

>>18492670
>what's the context in the story?
The priest and the canon are talking about how chivalry literature is unproductive because it is only intended to entertain, not educate. The ideal literature would be the one that both entertain and educate.

[Anonymous No.18495695]

>>18495647
DQs m.o.

[Anonymous No.18495900]

>>18488479
Unironically listen to Death Grips if you want to find the musicians who "feel the most like they care"

[Anonymous No.18495954]

>>18486270
>popular and new thing bad old thing good

[Anonymous No.18495972]

>>18486270
based. we will salt the earth to fend off the anime scourge.

[Anonymous No.18496159]

The truth is literature has always been first and foremost entertainment. It’s simply that some of them used that medium of entertainment to talk about bigger ideas. The problem is our world has no more coherency with which you can talk about bigger ideas. There aren’t even any bigger ideas to talk about. It’s a big spaghetti-like mess of narratives and ideas that no book or fork could ever make sense out of. That’s why all your literature is low brow commercial lit today.

[Anonymous No.18496223]

>>18486319
> the rustled (thou)bringer
> the replies about caveat in the picture

[Anonymous No.18496320]

>>18493851
> Do people actually believe this?
Yes, people are dumb. They gladly accept the non-answer if it allows them to have a simple explanation.

[Anonymous No.18496806]

>>18496159
>There aren’t even any bigger ideas to talk about
baka, the landscape has just shifted so drastically to this virtual mental institution. it took a few years for the printing press to produce big ideas right?

[Anonymous No.18497080]

>>18489088
Haven't heard of that last Musashi one, how is it?

[Anonymous No.18497251]

>>18486270
>what is modern high literature
Asterix

[Anonymous No.18497263]

what are some high culture vidyas?

planescape torment, spec ops the line?

[Anonymous No.18497273]

>>18486319

The movie sux0r0zed

[Anonymous No.18497529]

>>18497263
Bloodborne

[Anonymous No.18497539]

>>18486270
None. We're currently living in the ideologist "end of history" wetdream where globalhomo megacorps manufacture consent and dialogue and AI writes the lit. Most of what you read is designed solely to fit globalhomo corp approved public relations propaganda. This is defined not only in literature but also music and art. All is consumed by this great hydra and beast. Modern man is incapable of producing beauty that will stand the test of time because he himself is made gradually weaker and more feminine and pathetic from all the poison the globalhomo mega corps put into his food supply and water etc.

[Anonymous No.18497544]

>>18486298
>a bunch of moronic pseudo intellectus blowing sperg noises into trumpets too off beat tempos
>LE HECKIN SO DEEP!!!
when you learn the whole jazz scene was the prelude to the hippies, the drug infused nonsensical mad ravings of weakened and reduced masses of ideologist morons then you understand just how trash jazz really was.

[Anonymous No.18497812]

>>18497539
So It's a parasitic structure that kills its host and then dies?

[Anonymous No.18497823]

>>18489088
>Mushashi
Did you mean Mushishi?

[Anonymous No.18497912]

>>18486270
Animation is the highest culture there is, deal with it

[Anonymous No.18497939]

>>18497539
>Most of what you read is designed solely to fit globalhomo corp approved public relations propaganda
This is true, along with advertising. Someone who read 300 books was complaining about /lit/ how it's all pointless, well There Is No Alternative, as Taleb said everything else is trying to sell you something...poorly.

[Anonymous No.18498060]

>>18486270
>implying there's a distinction beyond what academics and the wealthy like to circlejerk over

[Anonymous No.18498087]

>>18486270
>It can be produced and enjoyed by every ethnicity
East Asian is not every other ethnicity

[Anonymous No.18498096]

>>18491031
Based and Bretty funny desu

[Anonymous No.18498108]

>>18486270
For people who agree with this infographic, what anime comes closest to high culture?

[Anonymous No.18498110]

why was the art world taken over by the talentless spawn of the rich? you can't call it art, and no a paint drip picture is not art

[Anonymous No.18498114]

>>18490481
>Fox news
>Post modernism
Didn't read, boomer joomer

[Anonymous No.18498121]

>>18488878
And this gentleman is who you properly shitpost

[Anonymous No.18498149]

I can tell by the reactions in this thread that OP put eva and dark souls in there just to trigger certain kinds of people.

anyway, OP is still wrong.

[Anonymous No.18498153]

>>18491275
Uh oh we got a reader here, /lit/
I can't even make out much of that besides the point made about bread from the many and praise from the few

[Anonymous No.18498163]

>>18497812
An assassin does not sip his own poison

[Anonymous No.18498192]

>>18488878
> animangoe
> philosophical depth
You do realize that anime is cartoons for "young adults" (a.k.a schooltards), right?

[Anonymous No.18498236]

>>18493851
See picrel

[Anonymous No.18498238]

>>18486270
>Old thing good
>New thing bad
I bet you can't even define what consitutes "high culture" and "low culture". You are just engaging in reactionary drivel. You are romanticizing a past which never existed.

[Anonymous No.18498359]

>>18497939
>>18497539
Read first editions. Read books published before 1950 (including reprints).

Better if they're not popular books, because it seems like all the "popular" "high brow" books that have survived time are complete schizo rubbish that one can find whatever meaning one wants in (looking at you, Kant).

People have become shallow. Read "The Underground History of American Education" alongside "Titan (Rockefeller)," and "Rockefeller Medicine Man."

Then flip through "The Founder: Cecil Rhodes."

Finally, Quigley's "Tragedy and Hope." A third edition is the latest edition I would read. Anything after has been censored into uselessness.

If one wants to go further, throw away any "soft" ideological works that have been published after the 1840s.

Even further, renounce all authority and forever cast down Plato and Hegel as a bunch of crybabies who couldn't deal with their emotional issues. Throw in Mao Ze Dong, Lenin, Stalin, and Marx into that mix -- as well as any Germanics (truly, they deserve nothing but pity for their heritage).

Now, embrace Thomas Davidson.

The world of literature will open up to you, like never before. You will be able to appreciate it to such a level, that I'm sure you would try and read every old book in existence, trying to connect, and understand, it all.

Evola's books on deciphering hermitcism is the very last level. After internalizing the "code," you will be able to appreciate all art, and come ever nearer to achieving an enlightened ego death.

[Anonymous No.18498360]

Can someone explain the appeal of Evangelion to me?
I don't think kids in robots fighting monsters is worth my time. I got really bored about the whole thing and dropped it in the lava episode.

[Anonymous No.18498382]

>>18498359
Clauswitz's "On War" is a "cherry" on top.

What one finds at the end, is that you cannot separate the human element, nor the author, from his works. They are intertwined and inseparable.

And it makes one sublime when you finally "tap" into the author's wavelength.

[Anonymous No.18498521]

>>18498360
The entire appeal is pretty much End of Eva and like the last 5 episodes

[Anonymous No.18498628]

>>18493118
this is one of the most retarded takes ever. there is more jazz then a promiscuous rhythm.
Why don't you listen to piano solos?
Or listen to something more spiritual like paul horn?

>one of its defining characteristics.
name some more defining characteristics retard

[Anonymous No.18498649]

>this thread
Isekai is high culture, prove me wrong

[Anonymous No.18498684]

>>18493237
ur so retarded man

[Anonymous No.18498709]

>>18486270
This but with Evangelion on the left.

[Anonymous No.18498716]

>>18486270
Just say
>old good, new bad
and move along, chud.

[Anonymous No.18498720]

>>18486270
The only reason the Mona Lisa is famous is because it was stolen, lost and rediscovered. This was made by a fucking midwit who just Googled shit like "painting" and "classical composers".

[Anonymous No.18499313]

>>18488401
most contemporary classical (and by that I don't mean neoclassical schlock) is more "aesthetically complex" than it is theoretically complex

[Anonymous No.18499331]

>>18491012
you know that Jameson is one of zizek's main influences right

[Anonymous No.18499353]

>>18498684
>tongue-in-cheek Pomo retelling of an a medieval Chinese classic is somehow less artistic than a self-indulgent pseudo-existential coming of age story filled with sloppy applied religious imagery and an ending half ripped from Herman Hesse
NGE is closer to every tacky YA novel people here like to complain about than something like Dragon Ball ever could be.

[Anonymous No.18499371]

since when was this board so anti-jazz? did everyone actually buy into the Adorno memes? 60s jazz is some of the best shit ever. np: grachan monchur - evolution

[Anonymous No.18499539]

>>18499371
I think such an attitude is necessary when trying to reject the poptimism that is pushed in the mainstream cultural conversations. No matter who complex or difficult to play jazz may be, it is still popular music, so if you want to reject popular music, you must reject jazz.

[Anonymous No.18499734]

>>18499539
retard, poptimism has to do with glorifying billboard top40 and stan culture, not fucking Coltrane

[Anonymous No.18499905]

>>18498360
The appeal is rote prestige; by engaging with it on hearsay, you have engaged with it on hearsay. You can now profess its depth to neophytes and hylics, asserting as you wish unto them, for the value of Evangelion is axiomatic and thereby retroactively refutes Aristotle. In essence it is as a viral pathogen, for it travels similar vectors and spreads for its own sake.

[Anonymous No.18499981]

>>18498108
>what anime comes closest to high culture?
>Perfect Blue >>18492670
>>18499539
>jazz
>it is still popular music
it's more effective to see the modern musical landscape as a Venn diagram of art, popular and unpopular music. Here's some examples of each:
art: Stravinsky
popular: Madonna
unpopular: your soundcloud
art/popular: TVU now
art/unpopular: TVU then
unpopular/popular: The Shaggs
art/unpopular/popular: TMR,

[Anonymous No.18499998]

>>18499734
The social function of Coltrane’s music is the same as that of the top 40. When you generate the former and disparage the latter, you fall into the same trap that the “rockists” did and which the popitimists correctly criticized them for. Rejecting the popular music requires you to reject its attempts to dress itself up, and that includes Coltrane’s technically impressive toe-tappers or his drug addled hippy spiritualism. Such projects inevitably do more to make challenging musical ideas easily consumable than they do to actively challenge anything.

[Anonymous No.18500001]

>>18499981
>art/popular: TVU now
>art/unpopular: TVU then
>unpopular/popular: The Shaggs
>art/unpopular/popular: TMR,
Rock music has never been art no matter how weird it tries to be.

[Anonymous No.18500060]

>>18500001
>>18499998
you were denied quints as karmic punishment for having your snobbish head your ass. Go ahead and send a memo to any museum exhibiting Warhol to no longer acknowledge the musical extension of his artistic philosophy. You and Adorno are outdated musicologists

[Anonymous No.18500152]

>>18500060
Warhol was clever, but his association with rock music is a good indication at you can’t really call his work art. Unless you claim that consciousness of making consumer crap is enough to qualifying, but I don’t. It’s completely surprising that his two most significant followers were total hacks. Adorno was right, and the takeover of artistic institutions by popular culture has degraded both art and caused a decline in popular culture itself.

[Anonymous No.18500283]

>>18500152
It's degraded if you insist artistic aesthetics never mutate. As class distinctions distort post WWII art tends towards the vulgar. Adorno's criticism is dysfunctional fogeyism. a dead end for hopeless nihilists. the creative spirit is alive just obscured.

[Anonymous No.18500305]

>>18500283
It’s not a hope that they should never mutate, but rather a hope that they mutate for some purpose other than being more conducive to commercialization and mass consumption.

[Anonymous No.18500353]

>>18500305
it sounds like your lamenting the trajectory of society. Art generally only gets to react to and not dictate that trajectory. There's an absurd sadness at the heart of most modern art that is rather exhausting. It's worth engaging in but is toxic in large doses. Over time, the internet may help instigate a sea change from those trends.

[Anonymous No.18500372]

>>18500353
>There's an absurd sadness at the heart of most modern art that is rather exhausting.
It’s that attitude that I think makes modernism such a compelling movement, and why I despise James Joyce for not sharing it.

[Anonymous No.18500504]

>>18499998
if you don't intuitively understand the musical and cultural differences between Coltrane and 6ix9ine, you are retarded

[Anonymous No.18500539]

>>18500504
The musical differences are obvious, but their similarities make their cultural function quite similar. The major difference is that the elements they share make the hip hop far more effective at fulfilling its cultural function than the jazz.