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17031043 No.17031043 [Reply] [Original]

Any /lit/ to help me understand hedonism as a viable philosophical/life framework? I'm very fucking close to selling all my belongings and becoming a digital nomad alcoholic coomer.

>> No.17031052 [DELETED] 

>>17031043
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...Anonymous
Life is about maxing pleasure (...)12/08/20(Tue)20:16:01No.9995880

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The following argument has made me very nihilistic and depressed, please critique it for flaws.

Everything you do is done with the intention to maximize your experienced pleasure during your lifetime, while minimizing the probability of death.

Because of this, everyone is fundamentally a hedonist, even the stoic and the ascetic deprive themselves of pleasure because they feel like they will be rewarded with greater pleasure in the future. Similarly, a Christian may deny himself the world, but only because he is promised eternal joy and life in heaven if he does so.

What of suicide? Well, in this case, you are basically conceding that the possibility of future pleasure is nil, so the most pleasurable thing to do would be to end you suffering, this is the only time the pursuit of pleasure outweighs the desire to minimize the possibility of death. So even suicide is hedonistic to an extent.
If everything is hedonistic, then all actions are morally equivalent.

tl;dr everything you do is hedonistic, even suicide and (temporary) denial of pleasure.

>> No.17031064
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17031064

>>17031043

>> No.17031076
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17031076

>>17031052
oh fuck

>> No.17031092

Do you consider Bukowski to be viable?

>> No.17031095

>>17031064
ty

>> No.17031100

>>17031043
>love is a dog from hell by bukowski
>any book by hollebeque

>digital nomad alcoholic coomer
im going to to thailand to fuck hookers (i already did ~2 years ago) but the problem is i don't want to work

>> No.17031101

>>17031043
Onfray wrote a book about some of the sensualists, but I don't remember the title.

>> No.17031113

>>17031043
If you recognize you have a problem, why do you need a book to tell you what to do?

>> No.17031116

>>17031043
Hedonism was disproven

>> No.17031134

>>17031043
>I'm very fucking close to selling all my belongings and becoming a digital nomad alcoholic coomer
I doubt you will ever find something that interest you in hedonist philosophy, because what you think hedonism is, is just the caricature catholic intellectuals made of the "hedonism" word/concept.

>> No.17031180
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17031180

>>17031100
>but the problem is i don't want to work
by estimation you could live in Thailand (or the like) VERY comfortably on roughly $1,500/month, probably even less. $20,000 in savings would get you a full year of no work and all play. Drinks, hookers, dates, good food, ample time to read.
>>17031113
I don't have a problem, I want to see what Philosophers™ have to say about the degenerate life
>>17031116
By whom and how?
>>17031134
Is it not vaguely defined as valuing pleasure as the highest good?

>> No.17031199

>>17031100
That isn't what philosophical hedonism is anon

Philosophical hedonism is prioritizing your actions for the maximum pleasure over your lifetime

So for instance, your plan would not be hedonic, as there is far more pain in your lifestyle than there is pleasure. Your pleasure would be of a short and brutish variety, with a high probability of contradicting disease or some other malady.

A philosophical hedonist would be someone who eats beans and rice with MSG so that it tastes good and is nutritious, while saving the most money and avoiding most health complications

>> No.17031247

>>17031199
>A philosophical hedonist would be someone who eats beans and rice with MSG so that it tastes good and is nutritious
what the fuck are you on about, mate?

>> No.17031254

>>17031180
>Is it not vaguely defined as valuing pleasure as the highest good?
Yes, but not like that. Epicurus philosophy is like >>17031199 says:
>A philosophical hedonist would be someone who eats beans and rice with MSG so that it tastes good and is nutritious, while saving the most money and avoiding most health complications

>> No.17031267

>>17031180
The pleasure that hedonist philosophers talk about is the pleasure of having your basic needs fulfilled and not worrying about getting tons of cash or sex
I'd look more into Romantic literature, people like Lord Byron fighting wars for countries they don't care about and getting 18 STDs and dying at age 28

>> No.17031281

>>17031267
>fighting wars for countries they don't care about and getting 18 STDs and dying at age 28
AHEM BASED

>> No.17031293

>>17031180
>By whom and how?
Plato by making a superior case for the good life.

>> No.17031296

>>17031247
Classes I've taken on the subject knucklehead

>> No.17031302
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17031302

>>17031043

>> No.17031322

>>17031293
>Plato by making a superior case for the good life.
How’s that go exactly? That in The Republic?

The negative-hedonism of Epicurus is the good life, but I’d like to see Plato’s

>> No.17031329
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17031329

>>17031302
Butterfly, please help me fulfill my hedonistic life (a life of supreme pleasure) by NEVER POSTING HERE AGAIN!!!

>> No.17031348

>>17031293
>>17031322
>negative-hedonism
So basically don't do X even if it feels kind of good because the outcome could bring greater displeasure than pleasure X initially brought?

>> No.17031355

>>17031329
https://youtu.be/hBWDIzHldPg

>> No.17031373

>>17031180
>1.5k$ month
>being a poorfag eating noodles and fucking beachroad whores
Lmaom dont bother anon. Tip top Gogo bar or hiso hookers go for 120$ and imagine not eating king lobster and wagyu daily at benihana. Take those 20k and live like a king for 3 months instead of like a trekker pleb

>> No.17031384

>>17031348
Or do it in moderation perhaps, yes.

>> No.17031403

>>17031384
So only occasionally enjoy burgers and coom

>> No.17031420
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17031420

Everything you do is done with the intention to maximize your experienced pleasure during your lifetime, while minimizing the probability of death.

Because of this, everyone is fundamentally a hedonist, even the stoic and the ascetic deprive themselves of pleasure because they feel like they will be rewarded with greater pleasure in the future. Similarly, a Christian may deny himself the world, but only because he is promised eternal joy and life in heaven if he does so.

What of suicide? Well, in this case, you are basically conceding that the possibility of future pleasure is nil, so the most pleasurable thing to do would be to end you suffering, this is the only time the pursuit of pleasure outweighs the desire to minimize the possibility of death. So even suicide is hedonistic to an extent.
If everything is hedonistic, then all actions are morally equivalent.

tl;dr everything you do is hedonistic, even suicide and (temporary) denial of pleasure.

>> No.17031441
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17031441

>>17031420
okay what do we call this philosophy if Epicurus railed against superfluous pleasure???

>> No.17031468

>>17031180
>1.5k
>comfortably
Go to cambodia peasant

>> No.17031485

>>17031043
Stop caring about your philosophical standing, and living a logically sound lifestyle that can be neatly packaged into a respected philosophy. Just do what you want.

>> No.17031486
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17031486

>>17031468
>$300 on rent
>$800 on food/drink
>$400 on dates and/or prostitutes
What am I missing here?

>> No.17031498

>>17031486
Where the fuck do you live

>> No.17031505

>>17031420
>this is your brain deepfried on youtube videos and /lit/ illiterate posts
The level of anglo degeneracy is beyond control

>> No.17031515

>>17031498
I was referring to living in Thailand- $1,500/month IN THAILAND.

>> No.17031524

>>17031515
Don't do that to yourself. Don't even entertain it.

>> No.17031534

>>17031524
Why? What's wrong with it? It sounds really nice to take a year-long vacation.

>> No.17031567

>>17031534
If you're aware enough to consider your relative standing in other counties, you're probably decently intelligent and introspective. Which means you're perfectly capable of creating a fun lifestyle in the first world country you currently live in (assuming you're American or European). You don't need to downgrade to fucking Thailand to fuck and drink a lot.

>> No.17031576

>>17031534
You cant do shit with it retard. Neither visit top tier rooftops, restaurants, rca valley clubs, islands, top tier gogobars

I blow your monthly budget in a day in thonglor bkk

>> No.17031639
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17031639

>>17031567
>you're probably decently intelligent and introspective
Nicest thing I've ever read on 4chan
>Which means you're perfectly capable of creating a fun lifestyle in the first world country you currently live in
I flirt with roping quite frequently. I think a year long debauchery stint could help- or not.
>You don't need to downgrade to fucking Thailand to fuck and drink a lot.
Maybe not, but I can optimize my spending and stretch out my money. $1,500 in Thailand gets you so much more than $1,500 in [my western country]. Also it's important to note that being 6'3 and White makes you infinitely more attractive in Asia. If I'm a 6 here, I'm an 8.5 there. Really I'm just aiming to optimize my efforts and get as much as I can from life with as little effort.
ty for reading blog.

>> No.17031647
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17031647

>>17031567
there is a reason bangkok is the worlds most visited destination on planet earth you brainlet. fuck your jew infested west

>> No.17031656

>>17031639
>being 6'3 and White

>>17031576
Im this anon. I take this back. If you handsome on top of it you will have much fun in thailand. Load up tinder in bangkok and try to find a rich hiso thai to take care of you. Mine is paying my rent and bought me a z800 bike kek

>> No.17031668

>>17031639
>Nicest thing I've ever read on 4chan
You're welcome. I think it's true.
>Also it's important to note that being 6'3 and White makes you infinitely more attractive in Asia. If I'm a 6 here, I'm an 8.5 there.
That's a bit of a cop out because you *could* become an 8 in your western country with some effort. Or event a 9. Besides, would you rather be a 7 in the states, or 10 in chinkland?

>> No.17031676

>>17031668
>10 in chinkland
Probably this. I am very lazy and have little desire to do much.

>> No.17031683

>>17031676
Well... you've made a decision that's right for you. I would always rather stay in a western country, but you know what's right for you anon. Enjoy

>> No.17031691
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17031691

>>17031683
>Enjoy
I'll try my best. Maybe we'll all make it, Anonz.

>> No.17031695
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17031695

>>17031683
enjoy missing out jew

>> No.17031704

>>17031656
>being 6'3 and White
I am. Not sure why you think I'd lie about this. I already admitted to being a depressed lazy loser.

>> No.17031859

>>17031420
I think you are right. The thing is that people don’t call all types of fulfillment pleasure whereas I’m assuming you do. Even Nietzsche in advocating for suffering in a way only justified it by the height of positive experience you have as a result of that. You can’t escape it. The alternative is ridiculous.

>> No.17031880

>>17031859
I think if we're loose enough with what we call "pleasure" then yea you could basically say any of the basic necessities of life are met out of pleasure-seeking
>You only BREATHE because not breathing would bring pain and displeasure