Commandment Six

[Anonymous No.15360078]

So what's the consensus, Lads? "Thou shall not kill" or "Thou shall not murder"?

[Anonymous No.15360085]

>>15360078
Kill, the Commandment was obviously meant to be vegan inclusive.
Good Christians do not eat meat

[Anonymous No.15360097]

>christians need a space alien to tell them not to kill

[Anonymous No.15360100]

>>15360078
It's murder, objectively and canonically and hermeneutically.

[Anonymous No.15360116]

>>15360100
Why do the Anabaptists make such a fuss about it then?

[Anonymous No.15360206]

>>15360100
Based and checked

[Anonymous No.15360220]

>>15360100
But how do they distinguish murder from justified killing?

[Anonymous No.15360234]

>>15360078
Obviously murder. In literally the next chapter God commands Moses to kill the unrepentent ox worshippers.

[Anonymous No.15360251]

>>15360100
That's what Jews thought but then Jesus came down and taught them that they were wrong, you're literally never supposed to kill anyone. Even to strike another in retaliation is a grave sin much less to kill them.

[Anonymous No.15360258]

>>15360251
How do you explain the Crusades and the various wars of the Papacy then? And don't try telling me that the Catholic Church was run by heretics.

[Anonymous No.15360260]

>>15360258
Because the Catholic Church was run by heretics.

[Anonymous No.15360264]

>>15360260
Who's the best option then? Asking in good faith btw

[Anonymous No.15360273]

>>15360097
/lit/ is a Christian board desu

[Anonymous No.15360290]

>>15360258
Why would you even try to justify biblical scripture with human action? How does that make sense in your mind?

[Anonymous No.15360302]

>>15360264
Nondenominational biblical fundamentalist internet Christianity. Subscribing to mainstream churches in these Babylonian times is a fools game.

If you're lucky you might have a nice small Calvinist congregation nearby but honestly every church is tainted by men, especially in this age.

[Anonymous No.15360321]

>>15360273
Christianity is a dead religion, it's useless and didn't work out

[Anonymous No.15360326]

>>15360085
fpbp

[Anonymous No.15360348]

>>15360220
if the bible says its a justified killing. pedos, murderers, and gays, to name a few, can be killed.

[Anonymous No.15360385]

>>15360290
I don't know, maybe because that "human action" was ordered and sanctioned by the highest authorities of the Christian faith?

[Anonymous No.15360387]

>>15360097
>retard uses reddit to tell him about Christianity

[Anonymous No.15360468]

>>15360302
How do you feel on the faith v works question? Do you subscribe to the Pastor Anderson school of thought?

[Anonymous No.15360479]

>>15360387
I know more about Christianity than most people on this board, reddit is also right in a sense

[Anonymous No.15360487]

>>15360479
What an achievement

[Anonymous No.15360501]

>>15360479
most people on /lit/ nowadays are election cancer crossposters
needless to say, they don't know anything about Christianity aside from surface level tribalist talking points

[Anonymous No.15360503]

Jesus never killed so I don't see why we should even be trying to redraw any of His lines. Sermon on the Mount.

Jesus spoke to His disciples about what the Kingdom of Heaven is like, who will inherit it and that the violent of the world will try to take it by force.

Jesus is the True Vine!

[Anonymous No.15360505]

What's the best denomination /lit/?

[Anonymous No.15360507]

>>15360505
Lutheranism

[Anonymous No.15360518]

>>15360507
Pls explain

[Anonymous No.15360531]

>>15360518
Non retarded view of sacraments while keeping their importance.
Good music and ceremonies.
Good literature and development of theology (Christ Victor, for example).

[Anonymous No.15360532]

>>15360518
Why do female "priests" always look so clownish? Vestments just look ridiculous on them

[Anonymous No.15360554]

>>15360531
Where to begin with their theology? 93 theses? Bondage of The Will?

[Anonymous No.15360555]

>>15360251
False

>>15360100
>>15360234
This. Christ advocates for aversion to violence, yes, but allows for certain circumstances where it is permissible in accordance with His teachings. In the Acts of the Apostles, Peter himself kills someone by cursing him as he tries to cheat the early Church out of money, this act is seen as sanctioned by God.

>>15360258
Because they were just wars. Literally do some of your own research, you're going to find better, objective answers in history books and on good websites than you will in this cesspit. Sacred Scripture had always stood alongside Sacred Tradition.

[Anonymous No.15360626]

>>15360555
To confirm: the Catholic Church is the ONLY Church which contains the fullness of the truth. The greatest minds in Christian history (Augustine, Aquinas) were Catholic, as were the greatest mystics (Theresa of Avila, John of the Cross, Thomas A Kempis) and countless great and beautiful minds. Catholic theology integrates wonderfully with Aristotlean teleology thanks to Aquinas.

The Catholic Church was the ONLY Christian Church until the reformation- we're talking well over 1000 years. Is that what Christ meant? "The gates of hell will not prevail against it, except for like the next 1500 years, then this dude Luther will come along and all will be well". False. The early Church practiced Confession and believed in Transubstantiation (see the Didache and writings of the early Church fathers). WHILE STILL ALIVE, the apostle John, WHO PERSONALLY KNEW JESUS, referred to Peter's successor as the authority on Christian moral dispute.

Martin Luther venerated Mary and believed in many Catholic doctrines. The moronic anti-Catholic rhetoric is a result of a vicious anti-clerical, anti-intellectual fundamentalist movement in the 18th century started by people who were suspicious of the Catholic Church's power. How much sheer pride must you have to think that your interpretation of Scripture is the correct one? There are hundreds of Protestant sects, splintering and sundering, each interpreting a different way, each believing themselves to be the highest authority. Versus ONE Catholic Church. ONE teaching for all her followers. ONE sanctioned interpretation of Scripture, so that God may give us the definitive ruling on the matter and avoid in large part the silly flip-flopping of flawed Protestants. (The Orthodox schism is not related to the interpretation of Scripture).

Everyone should be informed. I recommend ANY protestant read "Why we're Catholic" by Trent Horn, "The Essential Catholic Survival Guide", at the very least some of Fulton Sheen's talks ("Life is worth Living is a favourite of mine, a collection of talks on various aspects of the Catholic Church). As the great Cardinal Newman said, "To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant".

[Anonymous No.15360634]

>>15360290
Modernity is a helluva drug brother

[Anonymous No.15360639]

>>15360555
Of course it’s a jewish religion that’s ok to kill someone if they cheat u out of money

[Anonymous No.15360641]

>>15360626
>The Catholic Church was the ONLY Christian Church until the reformation
What about Orthodox or the Church of the East?

[Anonymous No.15360642]

Sedevacantism is the right one lads

[Anonymous No.15360657]

>>15360642
But Michael Voris told me the SSPX is full of pederasts

[Anonymous No.15360681]

>>15360554
Smaller Catechism
Augsburg Confession

[Anonymous No.15360683]

>>15360657
SSPX is not sedevacantist, SSPV is

[Anonymous No.15360696]

>>15360626
>Again, ``Why does not the pope, whose wealth is today greater than the wealth of the richest Crassus, build this one basilica of St. Peter with his own money rather than with the money of poor believers?''

[Anonymous No.15360699]

>>15360641
Eastern Rites are Catholic. Orthodox still have valid Sacraments, and are extremely close to the RCC, however their teaching on certain moral issues including abortion lead me to believe that they were on the wrong side of the Schism. I still hold out hope that the two may be reunited again someday.

[Anonymous No.15360709]

>>15360555
>Because they were just wars.
That's what I wanted to imply. The guy I responded to said that killing is always wrong, which is obviously retarded.

[Anonymous No.15360720]

>>15360696
Because that would make it a private endeavor. The construction of a basilica or a cathedral is an endeavor of the Church as a whole, and as such it should be funded from the coffers of the Church.

[Anonymous No.15360728]

>>15360720
Christians are to be taught that the pope would and should wish to give of his own money, even though he had to sell the basilica of St. Peter, to many of those from whom certain hawkers of indulgences cajole money.
It is vain to trust in salvation by indulgence letters, even though the indulgence commissary, or even the pope, were to offer his soul as security.
They are the enemies of Christ and the pope who forbid altogether the preaching of the Word of God in some churches in order that indulgences may be preached in others.

[Anonymous No.15360729]

>>15360696
The Pope's personal wealth is fairly low. Although the Catholic Church gets a fair bit of money in, it's also the largest charity in the world. A great deal of the Church's wealth is tied up in valuable artwork that was explicitly created for or left to the Church. To compensate the Church allows the public to view these artworks, in many cases for free.

Don't be like Judas- who knew the price of everything and the value of nothing. He said angrily that the expensive perfume that was poured excessively over Jesus feet, the scent of which will have been quickly lost, would be better sold and the money given to the poor. Jesus Himself rebuked him. Why not give the best and finest things we have to God, decorate our Churches in imitation of the splendour and majesty of heaven?

[Anonymous No.15360742]

>>15360729
It's literally "why steal from poor people so we don't spend our church funds on this church expense"? If you are bending over backwards to defend basically stealing from poor believers for a service that is no where found in the scriptures nor justified by sound theology, you are a slimeball.

[Anonymous No.15360743]

>>15360728
A bad Pope does not mean the Catholic Church is without truth. Just as a bad teacher does not devalue education, nor a bad lawyer devalue justice. There are bad men in every organisation in the world, religious or otherwise. However, no matter how bad the Pope, he has never contradicted himself ex cathedra.

[Anonymous No.15360754]

>>15360743
A bad pope, bad practices, bad structure, bad theology, bad practitioners.
Can you believe a church is good when nearly every part of it is generally bad?

[Anonymous No.15360759]

>>15360742
Because the Church is more important than any of us. If the poor wish to give their money, then good, let them exercise whatever little capacity for charity they have in their meagre state. St Peter's is a testament to the glory of God and is presented thus. Every inch of that building is dedicated to glorifying and praising the Most High. What Christian in their right minds would sell it? It's too reductionist to think that everything comes down to money. The poor are often the strongest in spirit. You will never know what it's like to have only two pennies to rub together, and love God with such passion that you will give one of them to the Church.

[Anonymous No.15360773]

>>15360759
>St Peter's is a testament to the glory of God and is presented thus
The church is not a church building. The pope having fancy buildings and a golden toliet seat are not priorities outlined in the scripture.
We are supposed to alleviate the ills of the poor through charity, not create the perpetual poor for the charity of Rome's pockets. You are absolutely rotten in the brain to believe a lick of what you typed.

[Anonymous No.15360776]

Who cares. Abrahamists will find a way to bullshit around it anyway

[Anonymous No.15360790]

>>15360754
>A bad Pope
Now and then, generally good. Just look at the last few.
>Bad practices
False, apart from the indulgences bit, which in the history of the Church is a very small blip. The practice also wasn't as bad as you think, I suggest you read up on it.
>Bad structure
The structure of deacons, Priests, Bishops, Cardinals, Pope is ancient and excellent. The Church has one of the finest organisational structures in the world. The Jesuit and monastic orders especially. They are also the biggest charity in the world and improve countless lives on a daily basis, in part through the great efficacy of their organisation.
>Bad theology
Read a book. Specifically Aristotle, Augustine (Confessions, City of God), Aquinas (introduction by Feser, a shorter summa by kreeft), The Essential Catholic Survival Guide, Catechism of the Catholic Church, Chesterton (Orthodoxy, Everlasting Man)... I mean, I could go on. Liguori, de Sales, Avila, Lisieux, John of the Cross, a Kempis, sayings of the early Fathers. Catholic theology is outstandingly good, and men far sharper than you or I have grappled with it for centuries.
>Bad practitioners
Do you mean laypeople? Well, we're all sinners, aren't we?

[Anonymous No.15360792]

How come only 18% of polled Catholics believe in the Real Presence? Why can't they properly catechise people? Why have they revised doctrine if they're the church that never changes? By their fruits bros

[Anonymous No.15360801]

>>15360776
It's like the case of Theresa. Her charity work amounted to creating abysmal 'homes for the dying' because she had wanted to create more suffering so people would be closer to Jesus. Most of the charity money donated to her just went into church buildings elsewhere.
Or the current case today of clerical abuse victims. The church would rather shuffle clergy members, flip assets from the building the crime took place in, and declare bankruptcy in that building than pay victim settlements. The amount of trickery from a 'good christian' organization makes your head spin.

[Anonymous No.15360802]

>>15360773
>The pope having fancy buildings and a golden toilet seat
Citation needed. The Pope's personal living arrangements are fairly meagre. You are ignorant and misinformed, and lack charity yourself to insult me so. I also used to think these things of the Church and when I actually began doing my own research I was converted by the Spirit, almost against my will. I can see you're hard at heart on this issue so the only thing I can really do is pray for you to come to the Truth, without bias. Pray the same for me too, brother.

[Anonymous No.15360805]

>>15360078
>Don't beat up your neighbor because he owns a car which thou do not.

[Anonymous No.15360809]

>>15360258
>Why did this apple fall to the ground? And don't try telling me that it was gravity.

[Anonymous No.15360810]

>Law that says "Do not kill/murder" also has rules that order the execution of people who break certain rules
Gee i wonder which interpretation is the correct one.

[Anonymous No.15360811]

>>15360801
The same if not more corruption can be found in Protestant denominations. What's your point? Catholics don't claim that evil doesn't exist in its members. The importance is in the torch we carry, burning with the same fire given us by God Himself to Peter. Not in the person carrying it. Are you also without sin?

[Anonymous No.15360838]

>>15360790
>Indulgence apologist
No thanks. It's bunk, and the church admitted it's bullshit. If it wasn't, it'd be around today.
>it's excellent
You mean full of pedophiles with more corruption than a wall street bank. Great structure there.
>Catholic theology is outstandingly good
No. Take a look into with any sense of a critical eye and their most basic beliefs fall apart. transubstantion, atonement theory, the whole shebang.
They don't really take from church fathers so much as they cherry pick. Half the stuff any one individual father professed they conveniently ignore or handwave away.
>>15360802
The current pope aside, the popes have been living in a 12 room penthouse for close to one hundred years. Including Francis, all their travel and living expenses are covered. Can't help you brother if you aren't willing to look around.

[Anonymous No.15360842]

>>15360805
>don’t burglarize homes and bring a gun to a high school basketball game
>also thou shalt not charge a man with a shotgun

[Anonymous No.15360844]

>>15360811
Cut out the whataboutism. I find it pathetic how you swallow the immense corruption and evil your church commits on a global scale and still call yourself the body of Christ with the same breath.

[Anonymous No.15360850]

>>15360078
If you’re asking you’re probably up to no good.

[Anonymous No.15360853]

>>15360850
sometimes it seems like religious law only exists for sociopaths to abuse

[Anonymous No.15360858]

>>15360842
>thou shalt not hunt down blacks and execute them in self defense

[Anonymous No.15360859]

>>15360853
I’m not sure it’s limited to religious law. I’m kinda pretty sure it’s not.

[Anonymous No.15360865]

>>15360838
>>15360844
I can see there's little point continuing this line of discussion with you both. Ultimately I believe in the Catholic Church with all my heart, mind and soul. I believe it to be the one Church with the fullness of the Truth, and I've come to that belief by sincere seeking over a long time, through reading and through prayer. All I would say to you both is not to mistake the wood for the trees, or throw the baby out with the bathwater. You have to ask if you believe in Christianity, and if so, which Church has the best claim to being authentic. Far greater men than any of us in this thread have decided Catholicism is the way to go. People have believed it so strongly they have died for it. I think it's glib to then wave that away based on the sinful actions of some of its members. Anyway, pray for me and I'll pray for you, too.

[Anonymous No.15360866]

>>15360859
okay, nuns orders too

[Anonymous No.15360884]

>>15360866
(You)

[Anonymous No.15360889]

>>15360858
>implying all blacks are criminals
Wew lad

[Anonymous No.15360959]

>>15360884
>4chan ecumenism be like

[Anonymous No.15361777]

>>15360385
And what exactly does a human organization have on the bible? Do they possess the truth of the bible?
The bible itself is the truth for whoever reads it and believes in it