/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.14908036]

>blocks your path
>informs you that your paradigm's presuppositions are circular and lead to contradictions
>casually notes how only Orthodoxy can account for genuine knowledge of Truth
>you protest
>he reaches back to his bookshelf and pulls out a 900 page book with a broken spine and six dozen stickynotes spilling from it
>calls you a doofus for not knowing what ecumenical council #15254 decreed regarding the Energy/Essence distinction and begins rambling about how he used to be a Thomist so he knows all about why naive empiricism fails
what is your next move?

[Anonymous No.14908071]

>*ehm* What is truth?

[Anonymous No.14908117]

>>14908071
>Standing right infront of you

[Anonymous No.14908118]

imagine trying to argue about philosophy when you're about to get airborne AIDS

[Anonymous No.14908152]

>>14908036
He's a boring pseud and EO has mediocre theology. Read John Bekkos and accept Thomism, the filioque, and the papacy.

[Anonymous No.14908153]

>>14908117
>*pokes him with my pilum* hmm... so truth is a jewish rabbi, huh? Weren't you just out spitting in people faces a few days ago? I admit it was quite some time since I last read the Greeks but... TO THE CROSS WITH YA!

[Anonymous No.14908180]

>>14908152
>boring
Most definitely.
>pseud
No idea. Tell me about
>John Bekkos

[Anonymous No.14908186]

>>14908118

Maybe if you didn't have aids you wouldn't have to worry about the flu

[Anonymous No.14908190]

>cut off his head and use his skull as a drinking cup
>reach enlightenment and attain magical powers while pissing meself

[Anonymous No.14908193]

>>14908186

i hope coronachan sees this bro

[Anonymous No.14908199]

>>14908190
>Die from rotten meat

[Anonymous No.14908227]

>>14908036
I've watched a lot of Jay and this description is absolutely perfect. My wife enjoyed it too. Thanks for the laugh

[Anonymous No.14908246]

>>14908036
>hurr durr people have confirmation bias therefore god exists

[Anonymous No.14909162]

>>14908036
>You see, actually the ancient Greeks talked about this in bla bla bla

Also, the Transcendental argument destroys atheism

[Anonymous No.14909197]

>>14909162
>the Transcendental argument
what *exactly* do you theists mean by this term?
Is it just Kant's a priori categories and the idea that no worldview is neutral? Because that hardly destroys anything.

[Anonymous No.14909539]

>>14908071
>>14908117
Is this the most 'epic' scene in literature?

[Anonymous No.14909551]

>>14909197
>Kant's
Kant did not exist back when the Church Fathers wrote their retroactive refutations of both him and every other false religion out there.

[Anonymous No.14909565]

>>14908152
>accept Thomism, the filioque, and the papacy
"No".

[Anonymous No.14909591]

>>14908036
Is he able to summarize an argument himself? It's always, "As you'll see in the 58th page of the ecumenical minutes essence and energia are clearly distinct."

[Anonymous No.14909606]

>>14909591
>"As you'll see in the 58th page of the ecumenical minutes essence and energia are clearly distinct."

[Anonymous No.14909625]

Jesus never said you need to be a quantum metaphysics philosopher theologian to follow him, he said "pick up your cross and follow me"

[Anonymous No.14909670]

>>14909625
how does one follow him thought without knowing which Church is true?

[Anonymous No.14909697]

>>14909197
the term transcendental argument is borrowed from Kant by people after Kant but the argument itself goes back the church fathers

[Anonymous No.14909726]

>>14909670
Autistic scutiny of historical theology is less likely to bring you to the truth than picking a church, and loyally trying to follow christ's example within it. As a catholic, I'd rather you be a virtuous baptist that struggles with the contradictions in your own church than to frivolously jump from on based church to another using old arguments to justify your whims.

[Anonymous No.14909758]

>>14909726
>is less likely to bring you to the truth than picking a church, and loyally trying to follow christ's example within it.
this method doesn't work well if you're in an Anglo country dominated by Protestant degeneracy. I don't believe you need to do the autismal amounts of research yourself, or even understand it fully. Thats why you have people like Dyer, and I assume Catholics making similar videos. I believe the only way is to look for which viewpoint is more unrefuted and to pray for guidance with a pure heart.

[Anonymous No.14909926]

>>14909726
you obviously don't need metaphysical dexterity to be a genuine christian and be saved, but christianity itself is the ''incarnation'' of this metaphysical reality

[Anonymous No.14910589]

>>14908036
>what is your next move?
why are you dressed like a coke dealer, bro?

[Anonymous No.14910687]

>>14910589
>private libraries extensive enough to refute Papism and Illuminati-funded Scientism don't buy themselves, bro

[Anonymous No.14910738]

>>14908117
>Falls to the ground and effeminately begs.

[Anonymous No.14910742]

His entire demeanour and actions are as purely American Protestant as you get. The rabid "Debate me bro!" e-celeb attitude and obsession with Chick Tract tier analysis of pop culture is something you simply do not get among those born in orthodoxy.

Once a prot always a prot, no matter what building you bend your knee in.

[Anonymous No.14910758]

>>14908152
Make a deal. When I see every last pedo priest hanging by their necks from the Vatican balcony then, and only then, will I consider what you have to say.

[Anonymous No.14910766]

Hi, guys whats going on in this thread?

[Anonymous No.14910775]

>Leave Jay to me!

[Anonymous No.14910781]

>>14910766
Retroactive refutations of those who deny the Holy Trinity.

[Anonymous No.14910812]

>>14908036
I call him a tribal Fleshling and walk away slowly to see if he might try to refute me. internally I hope he is not so simple to believe that his team knows the truth and other teams know nothing. God is capable of making these rocks worship Him.

[Anonymous No.14910816]

>>14910781
>our greatest strength is not being able to do maths

[Anonymous No.14910822]

Tell him I don't believe in a god and that his sterile rhetoric can't make me.

[Anonymous No.14910929]

>>14910766
>just pray to a statue bro
>you ARE actually God LMAO
no.

[Anonymous No.14910960]

>>14908036
Say he is mostly correct while pretending to be a slightly different Orthodox sect while casually secularizing his concepts until he admits his specific choice in God is arbitrary or gives a translatable reason that isn't an appeal to authority.

[Anonymous No.14910969]

>>14910929
Actually, yes. Its okay though, you clearly care about spirituality so you are on the right path, maybe you will get it in your next life.

[Anonymous No.14910973]

>>14910742
I don't know about protestant part, but Jay is peak burger how he carries himself. Also he seems to spread orthodoxy with a selling point of it being against social engineers and nwo, while christianity itself arguably is social engineering and church wants an world wide orthodox/catholic imperium.

[Anonymous No.14910998]

>>14910969
>Actually, yes.
Nah, I won't fall for your idolatrous tricks.

[Anonymous No.14911002]

>>14910973
>while christianity itself arguably is social engineering
He clearly only opposes degenerate secularist social engineering though.

[Anonymous No.14911010]

>>14910969
>bro... conciousness is like... always there breh. it's eternal... be an NPC like in deep sleep bro! it's GOD bro! you ARE GOD!!
>also, dont forget to pray to this statue of a monkey! itll give you relativistic karma points so you can be an EPIC GOD in your next life!
no.

[Anonymous No.14911024]

>>14910969
>next life
Reincarnation is retroactively refuted by the upcoming resurrection of the dead.

[Anonymous No.14911030]

>>14909606
That's the point, he doesn't say how they are distinct or what the argument is, just that an obscure text says that they are. I could say that Kant says your mother is a whore, but no one would understand why she's a whore without knowing the argument he made.

[Anonymous No.14911036]

>>14909758
If you're searching for the unrefuted waypoint I doubt you'll find Christ.

[Anonymous No.14911218]

>>14911030
>he doesn't say how they are distinct or what the argument is, just that an obscure text says that they are
https://youtu.be/edRYHJYzd0g
https://youtu.be/bxEvoXXc2Dk
https://youtu.be/yx0khK_Qe1w

[Anonymous No.14911224]

>>14910998
>this rice cracker is god

Oops, too late.

[Anonymous No.14911226]

>>14911036
I'd like to see your """"refutation"""" of Christ.

[Anonymous No.14911228]

>>14911010
Absolutely based! Imagine worshipping a dead jew when you could give thanks to a funny monkey.

[Anonymous No.14911232]

>>14911224
Body of God*
Also, we aren't Nestorians so we do not worship His heart or His body.

[Anonymous No.14911233]

>>14911024
lol is there anything more reddit than hoping for a zombie apocalypse lmao

[Anonymous No.14911240]

>>14911228
>dead jew
Christ is Risen.

[Anonymous No.14911253]

>>14911226
There is literally zero evidence for any of the metaphysical claims done by Christianity. The fact that you posted an image of a threat rather than an actual argument speaks volumes

[Anonymous No.14911259]

>>14911253
>There is literally zero evidence for any of the metaphysical claims done by Christianity. The fact that you posted an image of a threat rather than an actual argument speaks volumes
Is that all? Is this supposed to be your actual """"refutation""""? Surely an enligthened skeptic can do better than this?

[Anonymous No.14911260]

>>14911240
Sorry to correct you again but you seem to be labouring under a pernicious misconception about he nature of the soul and being. It seems you have posited a highly fallacious assumption about your prophet! As a matter of fact he died and reincarnated shortly after his death. So although it is correct to say that the atman "has risen again", if you will the person of Jesus Christ, assuming his existence, has not.

[Anonymous No.14911268]

>>14911232
Incredible cope. Christians like you are continually guilty of what you accuse others of doing, except you give it a different term and say "see we use a different word so it isn't the same" when all you have really done is created two a category of "good idolatry", roughly defined as the kind that you engage in, and "bad idolatry" the kind everyone else supposedly does.

Do you like cheese on your Jesus or dip?

[Anonymous No.14911270]

>>14911240
Christ rises every morning, anon, and he goes back to sleep every evening. He is the Light of the World.

[Anonymous No.14911274]

>>14911260
Christianity seems to be the only religion that cares about souls. Everyone else tries to destroy them be they a supposed mystically Enlightened easterner or atheist. Personality/minds is one of the most fundamental parts of reality.

[Anonymous No.14911276]

>>14911259
There is no need for a refutation, because you provide literally zero evidence for any of the supernatural claims you make. It’s literally ‘trust me or go to hell, bro’. That’s literally it.

Just admit it. You can’t present any empirical evidence for your supernatural claims, because you don’t have any. All theology is, is basically trying to circumnavigate this simple truth. You basically don’t have jackshit, and you know it. So all we get are threats, what ifs, language games and sophistry, all to avoid having to draw the painful conclusion that what you believe in is demonstrably a book of jewish fairy tales

[Anonymous No.14911281]

>>14911274
Nobody tries to 'refute' the 'soul', its the just word can mean a dozen different things; culturally or via mistranslation.

Galens book on nutrition for example describes the 'soul' as the actual constitution of the body being helped by minerals and nutrients of some foods and hindered by other minerals.

This is not what religious people have in their mind when they think of an eternal ball of light that never dies, or a hundred other things.

[Anonymous No.14911282]

>>14911276
And yet you are so Superior that you don't even exist. But don't worry, I'm pretty sure that you exist. You just have strange beliefs because everything outside of you has captured you. You're so tough! Wow look at how you face the facts of how you're nothing. The cold hard truth, that is the truth you must accept. One must imagine Sisyphus to be happy. :>)

[Anonymous No.14911283]

>>14911274
This is because Christianity is primarily a psychic religion, and holds little concern for the spirit. Ego and personality are held supreme to the point where these things are absurdly attributed to absolute being. It is a vast edifice built primarily to assuage the fear of ego death.

[Anonymous No.14911285]

>>14911282
This post made absolutely no sense whatsoever. Are you having some kind of schizo breakdown or something?

[Anonymous No.14911286]

>>14911281
so you're telling me that there are different capacities for understanding and therefore what? You say you're better than me and I say I'm better than you. You have your experience and I have mine.

[Anonymous No.14911288]

>>14911282
i'm not the guy you just replied to but..
wow, that is some major projection,
literally everything you said about 'atheists' is said about religious zealots.

[Anonymous No.14911289]

>the last few posts
Cringe.
Repent.

[Anonymous No.14911290]

>>14911283
You think personality and Ego are the same thing. Funny how you're talking to me and yet you pretend you don't exist.

[Anonymous No.14911291]

>>14908036
St. Paul approves of natural theology though:
>For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

[Anonymous No.14911298]

>>14911291
>For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.
Yes, only if you are enligthened by the Holy Spirit. Natural theology assumes the bugman view that you can reason up to theological truths rationally from a bugmanistic "neutral" viewpoint.

[Anonymous No.14911303]

>>14911285
It just shows how far away our experiences and perceptions of reality are from each other. it's hard to always speak as if someone will understand you. Things that are not Eternal do not exist. Creatures are the next closest thing to non-being. They are so steeped in non-existence that it's hard to consider that they exist. I guess it's a humbling experience.

[Anonymous No.14911304]

>>14911286
>so you're telling me that there are different capacities for understanding a
...no, that would be a favorable position for me to give to someone who thinks a soul is a magical ball of light, compared to Galen who produced a scientific work talking about how the soul is the constitution; the health, of the body and how nutrients and good food assist in strengthening the constitution to fight off disease.

What I said that when people talk about 'soul' they're referring to either a dozen different things all at once or a dozen different things individually from person to person, because of the ill-definition of the concept of 'soul' in the first place ... which makes the word a bit useless, and other more precise words exist anyway to refer to these dozen things:

e.g. before we could see DNA and understood how genetics worked you could say that the 'soul' is a persons passed on genetic information : this is, I think, what religious people mean when they describe the soul in terms of reincarnation for example. But that this is not the same as Galens 'soul' where he's speaking of the diet of minerals and vitamins in the body to produce good health.


>You say you're better than me and I say I'm better than you.
I didn't say that, you're projecting your inferiority complex onto other people.

> You have your experience and I have mine.
I am well educated.

[Anonymous No.14911322]

>>14911288
The way I see it is atheist are the type of people known as prickly people as opposed to gooey people. Pricklies tend to rejoice in the virtue of accepting the truth even though it's painful and hard. Religious people on the other hand are accused of coping because they do not accept the cold hard facts of reality. So I was trying to criticize atheist for having to cope by pretending and feeling tough in acceptence of the facts. Because to me it is obvious that they think that their tribe thinks that they are better than the religious because the religious people are weak because they must cope with something that's a "fairy tale" as they always fucking say. They are logical and rational douchebags. Unlike the religious which are a different kind of douchebag.

[Anonymous No.14911335]

>>14911322
OMG! SO MUCH THIS! THE TRUTH IS SOMEWHERE IN THE MIDDLE! BOTH SIDES ARE JUST DELUDED DOUCHBAGS!

[Anonymous No.14911342]

>>14911322
Oh... well I know the types you're talking about haha, but I wouldn't say those types are exclusively even the majority of either side.. I mean, I don't know if you were the guy I replied to about Galens Soul, but that right there is a good and illustrative point that not all people are even on the same page about the same ideas when they're lumped together as either one thing or the other thing.

[Anonymous No.14911343]

>>14911335
but that's true.. that's what Moderation and Balance is all about, guido-san

[Anonymous No.14911344]

>>14911304
I was just expressing to you in a symbol the manner of being that I perceive us to be. if you did not think that you were better than me in your perceptions then you would not hold your perceptions, you would hold mine or somewhat agree with me. But you hold mine to be inferior, which is fine. But I did correctly state this part of being, right? I seriously don't know how else to explain it if you don't get what I said.

[Anonymous No.14911347]

>>14911335
>gif related
what type of demonic influence is this man under?

[Anonymous No.14911349]

>>14911342
Well I'm sorry. I honestly felt like being a jackass and kicking around my feet for a while. It feels good.

[Anonymous No.14911368]

>>14911342
I mean religious people can be prickly too. But I'm not recalling very many gooey atheist people. I'm sure they exist. Nothing is as simple as black and white I know I know. :/

[Anonymous No.14911369]

>>14911344
>But you hold mine to be inferior, which is fine. But I did correctly state this part of being, right?
I do, but that doesn't mean I hold 'you' to be inferior;the information is not complete for you so you wouldn't know otherwise - 'you' would be inferior in logic however if you persist in an error after having the complete information shown to you, and even then it wouldn't make you 'inferior', just stubborn, which is a sort of virtue in and of itself.

> I seriously don't know how else to explain it if you don't get what I said.
Well I get that I told you that the concept of the soul is a concept applied to different things - not that people 'have different ways of understanding the concept but the concept is like buzzword people tend to use for various different things - and that you changed the subject and told me I was calling you 'inferior' which I hadn't even alluded to until you brought it up.


I explained this with Galens Soul as the health of the body, and then talking about genetics and DNA to give you two examples of how the word or concept of 'soul' was and is used to refer to completely different things, which isn't a case of inferior or superior but more of a case of people, 300 yrs ago, not knowing the processes of the body or sciences and trying to make sense of those processes in theological terms that were understandable to a people who had not yet developed the ability to look a DNA under a microscope or who didn't fully understand diet and nutrition.

i.e. it's a 'god of the gaps' fallacy, only the word 'soul' is the 'word of the gaps' in at least these two instances.

>>14911349
meh, that's okay. Debate is fun.

[Anonymous No.14911394]

>>14911369
Our metaphysical assumptions about reality are probably pretty different. with me minds are one of the most fundamental parts of reality. I don't reject science but to me science is concerned about telling me how the graphics look like in the game, but not the point of the game. I see this reality as something to develop an aspect of myself. It's typical gooey stuff, i guess. But I've had actual spiritual experiences that led me to all of this. Anyways it's not really important. But it is true that there is wisdom/divine spark in a person but science minded people can interpret this Within their science-minded Ways. A main point is that there are two main religious types. The priest and the prophet. The op guy is obviously a priest. Most are priest.

[Anonymous No.14911418]

>>14911394
>A main point is that there are two main religious types. The priest and the prophet.
Our Lord Jesus Christ was both a priest and a prophet.

[Anonymous No.14911424]

>>14908036
>only Orthodoxy can account for genuine knowledge of Truth
Is that why there are specific rule with the amount of fingers you need to make the cross?
Or that you must overwhelmingly rely on icons to strengthen your faith?
No wonder the guy can't really decide on a denomination.

[Anonymous No.14911427]

>>14909551
could you go into that?

[Anonymous No.14911428]

>>14911394
>it is true that there is wisdom/divine spark in a person but science minded people can interpret this Within their science-minded Ways. A main point is that there are two main religious types. The priest and the prophet. The op guy is obviously a priest. Most are priest.
Ah, but .. but but but but but.. the error of 'both' the priest and scientist is to adopt a dogmatic stance and close the avenues of inquiry prematurely,that's when scientists annoy religiots and religiots annoy scientists. Insomuch as science is absolutely not supposed to be 'dogmatic' by its very nature; i.e. reason and inquiry and challenging, etc, it's still proves the case that some people, especially when they reach larger numbers, will 'resort to dogma' to close off specific paths for the sake of convenience, but that this itself is not scientific in thinking but religious in thinking, and even more deliciously ironically a religious person looking to critique a dogmatic scientist will be unable to say this without kneecapping their own religious bias in dogmatism lol

I find that to be very funny, as an image; where the religious person 'knows' the science person is guilty of "some sort" logical fallacy but from dissonance can't quite figure out what it is.

What we're really talking about is the rule-maker types; authoritarianists and political types, who just come to anything and want to make rules about it and usually know nothing about the thing itself or want to subvert it for political gain. Nobody likes these people.

[Anonymous No.14911469]

>>14911428
>Ah, but .. but but but but but.. the error of 'both' the priest and scientist is to adopt a dogmatic stance and close the avenues of inquiry prematurely,that's when scientists annoy religiots and religiots annoy scientists. Insomuch as science is absolutely not supposed to be 'dogmatic' by its very nature; i.e. reason and inquiry and challenging, etc, it's still proves the case that some people, especially when they reach larger numbers, will 'resort to dogma' to close off specific paths for the sake of convenience, but that this itself is not scientific in thinking but religious in thinking, and even more deliciously ironically a religious person looking to critique a dogmatic scientist will be unable to say this without kneecapping their own religious bias in dogmatism lol
>I find that to be very funny, as an image; where the religious person 'knows' the science person is guilty of "some sort" logical fallacy but from dissonance can't quite figure out what it is.
>What we're really talking about is the rule-maker types; authoritarianists and political types, who just come to anything and want to make rules about it and usually know nothing about the thing itself or want to subvert it for political gain. Nobody likes these people.

[Anonymous No.14911472]

>>14911290
No, not at all. The disagreement is on what is and isn't eternal. But that isn't a conversation you seem ready to have.

[Anonymous No.14911612]

>>14911472
You can't get rid of mind. How can you grasp what wisdom or love is without being a person?

[Anonymous No.14911671]

>>14908036
anyone else think that jay has become more and more cocky and smug? he used to be neutral and to the point

[Anonymous No.14911684]

>>14908036
Is that Sean Goonan, author of The Foundation for Exploration?

[Anonymous No.14911696]

>>14910758
>muh pedo priest
hello r*ddit

[Anonymous No.14911702]

>>14911469
I uh..
I'm not sure what you mean by that.

Is this dissonance?

[Anonymous No.14911713]

>>14911696
Ah, yes that particular flavour of catholic cope, I haven't tasted it in a while. Good vintage.

[Anonymous No.14911721]

>>14911612
This is very clumsily worded so I am hesitant to answer. What do you mean by getting rid of mind. And what are you alluding to by "grasping" wisdom?

[Anonymous No.14911726]

he is right read leo strauss

[Anonymous No.14911730]

>>14908071
Based

[Anonymous No.14911731]

>>14908036
lel nerd get bent.
anima and virtue over legalism and sophistry any day.

[Anonymous No.14911733]

>>14911253
>>14911276
>present before me empirical proofs of non-empirical reality!
Irredeemable retard

[Anonymous No.14911735]

>>14911721
I think he's saying something like.. his mind is his soul which is his personality and he's implying - I think - that people/we want to remove his brain.

I think he's coming from that line of thinking where his consciousness is something given by magic/god and not rather naturally occurring and innate.

[Anonymous No.14911751]

>>14908036
>h-haha
>w-what a little fool you are Dyer
>btfo

[Anonymous No.14911757]

>>14911276
Theology is a special part of metaphysics, as ancients would say. So it is stupid to think bottom-upwards and not up-downwards. Do yourself a favor and open a book once in your life.

[Anonymous No.14911763]

>>14911721
of course, the irony is that saying that he would've been burned at the stake or beaten to death by his co-religionists in the kind of theocratic society he's arguing in favor of against a secular one which treats him with compassion.

[Anonymous No.14911769]

>>14911757
Not so..

The magical 'metaphysics' word just means "measuring all" (meta) "nature" (physics), e.g. "man the measuruer of all things," so this is really nothing to do with 'Theology' but with the Natural Free Sciences... i.e. there are about 10,000 scientific fields which give us everything and help us do everything on one hand, and then there's a few old bronze age religions on the other hand which give us nothing.

[Anonymous No.14911798]

>>14911769
Have you opened any book written before the 17th century?
By the way the greek word for measure is not meta. It is difficult if you don’t even know what the word means. Not sure if this is just dishonesty.

[Anonymous No.14911802]

>>14911769
ed. also,
>>14911757
>metaphysics,
... this is why the word for "index books" was always biblio, i.e. referance book, so you can see quite clearly how this 'bible' displaced the basic art of learning and the application of sciences, for instance when we say a thing is "biblical" we don't mean "this has been proven by these works of nature sciences, A, B and C, etc," which is what the term "biblios" and "bibliography" means, instead when you hear the term "biblical" is referring to passages in 'the' Bible.

Doesn't that exemplify how religiots tend to have 1 book to learn, and the est of us have 10,000 books to learn?

[Anonymous No.14911807]

>>14911757
>Theology is a special part of metaphysics, as ancients would say.
It's the other way around, actually. No wonder the pagans got this wrong.

[Anonymous No.14911820]

>>14911274

It seems nice, but the immortality of the ego inevitably leads to the morbid conclusion that the majority of people will be damned. Who has a pure holy ego? Nobody, it's all a larp because we're inherently limited manifestations of consciousness. If you're a protestant you believe that Christ covers you if you believe in Jesus as lord, but this means your ego is still imperfect and subjected to eternity. Catholics believe that you must purify your ego by suffering and taking part in mystical sacraments, and the church basically claims to have a monopoly on these ego purifying methods everyone else is damned to eternal torment, which begs the question to the nature of God. Eastern metaphysics is more forgiving, and works better in the real world. When we lose our ego, we're reunited to the source from which all those we love are also a part of and all is unconditional love. Jesus himself preached many things that align with the Eastern idea of God, that within us is the kingdom and salvation is for those who realize this truth that they cannot be separated from that which is their root so to speak. Regardless I feel as if all metaphysical viewpoints are imperfect, that the truth is beyond what we can comprehend.

[Anonymous No.14911826]

>>14911798
>By the way the greek word for measure is not meta.
>. Not sure if this is just dishonesty.

hmm.. in fairness to you there's a few different 'translations' of Meta/Metam/Metus ranging from Beyond (a thing), (the) Goal, Anxiety, etc.

From Meter, however, you find the word Measure and Method, meaning 'measure'; i.e. metaphysics; measuring / "discerning the methods of", physics - which is nature, which arrives at what 'you' mean by Theology/Deology meaning "the logic of everything".

[Anonymous No.14911835]

>>14911802
nope, comes from ta biblia which mean 'the books'

[Anonymous No.14911838]

>>14911769
>"man the measuruer of all things,"
bro, man is made in the form of god. God is a thinking thing, the world are his thoughts. Read Spinoza.

[Anonymous No.14911840]

>>14911802
Yeah and it seems you have never read a single book on ancient people in your life besides “scientific” papers. The Bible is the second book written by God, the first being the World itself (by World I mean Universe, I need to make it clear because you obviously is blinded by this narrow mentality of the current aera) and guess how did the ancients learn? Not blinding themselves into the commandments of “scientific” sects, I warrant you.

>>14911807
In my opinion this distinction is irrelevant.

[Anonymous No.14911841]

>>14911807
>No wonder the pagans got this wrong.
are you crazy? Virtually everything we know comes from 'pagan' Greeks and Romans and Alexandrians.

>>Theology is a special part of metaphysics
I just made a post about how these are the same, but.. lol

I think these are fundamentally different; if you were to look for 'theology' in the old Greeks you'd find the stories of the Gods which had little to do with the sciences and didn't pretend to. I think maybe theology is more an early attempt at psychology; the Gods being the figures in a persons own life; boss, parents, friends, etc.

[Anonymous No.14911856]

>>14911826
Your trying to convey an etymological lie with the word which means exactly the opposite of what you try to convey is lamentable. If you don’t like the word just call it like Plato called: Science.
Anyway, this all seems enough to make more than clear that talking to you is absolutely a waste of time.

[Anonymous No.14911857]

>>14911835
>biblia means the books
...yes, that's what I said. What do you mean "nope"?

lol fucking contrarian.

>>14911838
"read spinoza" lol

>>14911840
>Yeah and it seems you have never read a single book
>The Bible is the second book written by God, the first being the World itself (by World I mean Universe
oh, you are crazy.

Shall I remind you that your conceptions of God come out of a people and place which never even mastered basic engineering or agriculture? Sorry, but a bronze age self-mutilation society has nothing on the achievements of the Greeks, Minoans, Romans, .... etc etc etc.

Carthago delenda est., in fact.

[Anonymous No.14911878]

>>14911856
>Your trying to convey an etymological lie with the word which means exactly the opposite of what you try to convey is lamentable. If you don’t like the word just call it like Plato called: Science.
>Anyway, this all seems enough to make more than clear that talking to you is absolutely a waste of time.
Well I shouldn't have bothered to be fair to you, should I?

No, I'm not wrong, and I gave you a clear proof as to how the word Meter means Measure. Your response to tell me I'm lying and you can't be bothered with me is cute but it doesn't change anything.

Still, I'm not surprised at your obstinacy. People have tried to make a mystical unknowable thing out of the concept of 'metaphysics' for at least a few centuries. You would prefer your meaning because it supports your cloudy-minded mysticism, I prefer 'my' meaning (which happens to be correct) because it supports my clear-headed objectivism: that we 'can' know things, through scientific reason and study, rather than that we 'cannot know anything' because Adam and Eve talked to a snek.

[Anonymous No.14911881]

>>14911857
For someone so educated and progressive, you sure seem dense.
The 'Bible' being a collection of books of poetry, history, theology exemplifies learning no less than any of your super philosophers from the dead. But in the Bible's case, it's not speculative aggregation, but the literal truth.

[Anonymous No.14911884]

>>14911878
>we can know things through science and reason
>bases his whole bullshit on pure semantics

[Anonymous No.14911887]

>>14911857
I’m not referring solely to the old people of the Bible. Abraham was probably from Ur. But the egyptians (from which the greeks revered so fucking much they derived almost everything of their artistic and intellectual productions, just like the Romans did with the Greeks), Sumerians, Ancient Hindus, Iranian people, etc

[Anonymous No.14911896]

>>14911878
>I gave you a clear proof as to how the word Meter means Measure. Your response to tell me I'm lying and you can't be bothered with me is cute but it doesn't change anything.

You only forgot that we were not contending upon the meaning of METER but META.
As I said, I won’t squander time trying to talk reasonably with an unreasonable dishonest person.

[Anonymous No.14911906]

>>14911881
>The 'Bible' being a collection of books of poetry, history, theology exemplifies learning no less than any of your super philosophers from the dead. But in the Bible's case, it's not speculative aggregation, but the literal truth.

But that's nonsense.

The 'Bible' doesn't even pretend to be an instructional text in anything; compared to Galens book on nutrition and the constitution of the body, for example, or any other book before it. And no character in the new testament or old testament comes close to ... any engineer or physician or general, etc, these people you're claiming are "the literal truth" weren't even accomplished in their own lives.

Archimedes vs. Solomon, for example.
Galen vs. Jesus, for example.
Hadrian vs. David, for example.

>you sure seem dense.
Hmm yeah, I'm the stupid one who doesn't know anything.

Did you know that the temple city of Ankor Wat contained more edifices and elaborately crafted architecture and reliefs than all of the cathedrals and churches in Europe?

There's a whole world out there beyond your desert cult. Go learn about it, as Mark Twain said.

[Anonymous No.14911911]

>>14911896
>You only forgot that we were not contending upon the meaning of METER but META.
>As I said, I won’t squander time trying to talk reasonably with an unreasonable dishonest person.
Yeah and I understood that and I tried to explain the point, but you just want to insult me instead... which is fine.. but if you knew anything about linguistics before accusing me of lying and being stupid, you'd understand that the root 'met' is what we look at to discern the word; met; meta, metus, etc. etc. etc.


I am an unreasonable dishonest person.

mm. hhmm.

[Anonymous No.14911919]

>>14911887
>But the egyptians (from which the greeks revered so fucking much they derived almost everything of their artistic and intellectual productions, just like the Romans did with the Greeks),

Greeks and Romans thoughts on the Egyptians?
Uh.. they viewed them as a mindless slave race who were culturally incapable of having achieved a standard of Republican Government and who were laughably superstitious and childlike.

[Anonymous No.14911923]

>>14911841
>Virtually everything we know comes from 'pagan' Greeks and Romans and Alexandrians.
Absolutely everything we know comes from the Logos, both pre and post incarnation.
>I think these are fundamentally different...
Nobody cares lmao

[Anonymous No.14911924]

>>14911919
they held them almost in as a low a regard as they did the Germans, in fact.

[Anonymous No.14911931]

>>14911923
>Absolutely everything we know comes from the Logos
Such as what? Where in these religions does it explain to us about nutrition or engineering or how to plant crops and have them grow in season to maximize the harvest?

Wait.. logo?
Coke or Pepsi?

[Anonymous No.14911939]

>>14911838
>God is a thing
Cringe. God is a person.
>the world are his thoughts
Cringe. Refuted in Genesis 1 where God created the world. Which is an action distinct from the uncreated thoughts of God.
>Read Spinoza.
Uncreated cringe...

[Anonymous No.14911941]

>>14911906
>The 'Bible' doesn't even pretend to be an instructional text in anything
It literally establishes the 10 commandments, sets up ancient laws for the jews, the goes on and on about how the jews didn't follow it and that's why God will punish them severely, but redeem them for God's own glory.
Then ite goes on and on how Jesus argued with the jewish establishment how they usurped God's moral law for their own immorality and established a new kingdom where everyone inherently can learn about God's true moral law through the leaf of Jesus and that you should study it so as not to, spiritually, die.
So no, faget. That's not only not nonsense, but it's nonsense to think it otherwise.
>compared to Galens book on nutrition and the constitution of the body, for example
>no character in the new testament or old testament comes close to ... any engineer or physician or general
You don't open a phone book to learn about gardening. Neither do you opne the Bible to learn about engineering, but moral law and spirituality.
>are "the literal truth" weren't even accomplished in their own lives
lol
I see what you're trying to do by nitpicking at one practicality while ignoring others. So be it, your funeral. I've argued with too many atheist who build a foundation on mythical prehistory that evolved into something wholly new, but shit themselves when the Biblical narrative inspires people in new ways today.
>Did you know that the temple city of Ankor Wat contained more edifices and elaborately crafted architecture and reliefs than all of the cathedrals and churches in Europe?
This glorified shit hole, you mean?
Nah. I'll stick with my Vatican that has air conditioning and no mosquito swarms.
And yeah, you're a dense autist who bitches and moans about how much you think you know, but have zero substance to convince anyone of anything, like previous anons already told you.

[Anonymous No.14911942]

>>14911939
lol two zealots with cringing anime pics are arguing with each other now over their definitions of God.

yeah, I'll stick to Galen, thank you very much
you crazy cultists you, bless your little heads.

[Anonymous No.14911948]

>>14911919
Let me use your own argument.
>hehe retarded greeks and r*mans think they hot shit
>but do they have pyramids?
>I think not

[Anonymous No.14911951]

>>14911911
Why not look at the letter m by your retarded logic?

[Anonymous No.14911957]

>>14911919
Basically all of eminent greeks traveled to egypt and begged for their secret knowledge. Read about Solon, Pythagoras, Thales, Plato.

[Anonymous No.14911960]

>>14911931
>nutrition or engineering or how to plant crops and have them grow in season to maximize the harvest
Read the Bible. It deals with all of these topics. Also, you even being able to conceptualize or speak about such things presupposes the hypostasis of the Divine Logos.

Nutrition:
John 6
>32 Jesus said to them, “Very truly I tell you, it is not Moses who has given you the bread from heaven, but it is my Father who gives you the true bread from heaven. 33 For the bread of God is the bread that comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.” 34 “Sir,” they said, “always give us this bread.” 35 Then Jesus declared, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36 But as I told you, you have seen me and still you do not believe. 37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day. 40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

Engineering:
1 Kings 6
>1 In the four hundred and eightieth[a] year after the Israelites came out of Egypt, in the fourth year of Solomon’s reign over Israel, in the month of Ziv, the second month, he began to build the temple of the Lord. 2 The temple that King Solomon built for the Lord was sixty cubits long, twenty wide and thirty high.[b] 3 The portico at the front of the main hall of the temple extended the width of the temple, that is twenty cubits,[c] and projected ten cubits[d] from the front of the temple. 4 He made narrow windows high up in the temple walls. 5 Against the walls of the main hall and inner sanctuary he built a structure around the building, in which there were side rooms. 6 The lowest floor was five cubits[e] wide, the middle floor six cubits[f] and the third floor seven.[g] He made offset ledges around the outside of the temple so that nothing would be inserted into the temple walls. 7 In building the temple, only blocks dressed at the quarry were used, and no hammer, chisel or any other iron tool was heard at the temple site while it was being built. 8 The entrance to the lowest[h] floor was on the south side of the temple; a stairway led up to the middle level and from there to the third. 9 So he built the temple and completed it, roofing it with beams and cedar planks. 10 And he built the side rooms all along the temple. The height of each was five cubits, and they were attached to the temple by beams of cedar.

[Anonymous No.14911964]

>>14911960
Planting and harvesting crops:
>10 "You shall sow your land for six years and gather in its yield, 11 but on the seventh year you shall let it rest and lie fallow, so that the needy of your people may eat; and whatever they leave the beast of the field may eat. You are to do the same with your vineyard and your olive grove.12 "Six days you are to do your work, but on the seventh day you shall cease from labor so that your ox and your donkey may rest, and the son of your female slave, as well as your stranger, may refresh themselves. 13 "Now concerning everything which I have said to you, be on your guard; and do not mention the name of other gods, nor let them be heard from your mouth.14 "Three times a year you shall celebrate a feast to Me. 15 "You shall observe the Feast of Unleavened Bread; for seven days you are to eat unleavened bread, as I commanded you, at the appointed time in the month Abib, for in it you came out of Egypt And none shall appear before Me empty-handed. 16 "Also you shall observe the Feast of the Harvest of the first fruits of your labors from what you sow in the field; also the Feast of the Ingathering at the end of the year when you gather in the fruit of your labors from the field. 17 "Three times a year all your males shall appear before the Lord GOD.

[Anonymous No.14911967]

>>14911960
This has to be satire

[Anonymous No.14911970]

>>14911911
Still meta and meter imply distinct meanings. Just as there are principles in order to measure a land, there are principles conditioning the Natural World.

[Anonymous No.14911973]

@14911942
You forgot your tripcode, you subhuman tranny.

[Anonymous No.14911979]

>>14911941
>10 commandments
that's old testament, potato brain.

>I see what you're trying to do by nitpicking at one practicality while ignoring others.
No, I'm really not and I gave three comparative examples;

Archimedes vs. Solomon, for example.
Galen vs. Jesus, for example.
Hadrian vs. David, for example.

In the entire canon of old and new testament, including the torah and all related books therefrom, there is no one character who is accomplished in anything we'd consider 'useful' or even has any impressive accomplishments, so it's not exactly likely these people themselves were of any sort of cultural level to be teaching us anything we didn't aready know.

Compare, again, the 10 Commandments to the Roman Tables discussing complex law.. yeah being told not to murder your nextdoor neighbor is so important lol as if anybody doesn't know this already.. it's babyish.

>Nah. I'll stick with my Vatican
lol hey that's fine, you're still bowing to our civilized Greco-Roman Law and you don't even know it. Good for you, Moses! ATABOY haha


>you're a dense autist who bitches and moans

this coming from a guy who just described Ankor Wat as a "shit hole", wow, anon, you're so pious and conscientious and learned and compassionate, you're not at all like the mindless zealots who wander around smashing things at all.
/heavy sarcasm

[Anonymous No.14911980]

>>14911960
>Nutrition
>Then Jesus declared, “I am the bread of life.
Very based.

[Anonymous No.14911982]

>>14911942
>stick to a shitty philosopher
>because he was a good doctor

[Anonymous No.14911987]

>these mental midgets think Logos was a literal jewish guy walking around 2000 years ago
The Greeks are cringing at you guys right now.

Friendly reminder that the anthropomorphising of the concept of Logos into some cringe guy called Jesus is one of the greatest crimes ever committed against philosophy.

[Anonymous No.14911988]

>>14911979
>that's old testament, potato brain.
Who if not Christ did you think gave out the 10 commandments?...

[Anonymous No.14911989]

>>14911948
>>14911951
>>14911957
>>14911960
wow, Autistic meltdown.

>>14911970
I agree, and it's obviously not 1000% clear cut, but these zealots don't even care anyway. They prefer it in the dark.

serving their satan, killing jesus, thinking they're pious.

[Anonymous No.14911994]

>>14911987
>The Greeks are cringing at you guys right now.
They're more likely cringing from the eternal pain they're suffering in hell right now.

[Anonymous No.14911995]

>>14911980
>Very based.
Jesus and his empty carbs. lol

[Anonymous No.14911999]

>>14911994
Anon, if this had been last week I would've kept arguing with you and offering more proofs against you in a probably spiteful way, but I actually do have some compassion for the terror that's going around at this moment in time, so I won't.

Just take it easy on this stuff, eh? Don't fall into a hole.

[Anonymous No.14912003]

>>14911987
>Logos was a literal jewish guy walking around 2000 years ago
Nope. That's a common heresy among you anglos. Logos is a divine person who assumed human nature. There was no 'jewish guy' walking around, it was Jesus Christ the Divine Logos who existed from all eternity.

[Anonymous No.14912006]

>>14911989
>wow, Autistic meltdown.
cope harder lol

[Anonymous No.14912011]

>>14911989
>serving their satan, killing jesus, thinking they're pious.
sounds like a very apt description of the tribe you hail from...

[Anonymous No.14912014]

>>14911999
Coping out so soon since you don't have any vapid arguments left?

[Anonymous No.14912020]

>>14912006
well you just made four posts saying dumb things one after the other that had no bearing on anything and didn't even make sense; like a dog barking.

>>14911988
>Who if not Christ did you think gave out the 10 commandments?...
wa.. wha?... do you even know your own book?

God to Moses on Sinai. That wasn't Jesus.

Hey let me stop you there, if you're advocating for Christianity whilst espousing a Heretical Stance I'm afraid that's not allowed.

Someone call the Inquisition.

[Anonymous No.14912021]

>>14911989
You agree but still don’t seem to understand?

[Anonymous No.14912030]

>>14912020
>well you just made four posts
I made the first two of those only lol
Don't know who quoted the Bible and I don't care.
>God to Moses on Sinai. That wasn't Jesus.
>God
>wasn't Jesus
Guess someone didn't read 'our' book through Paul's letters.

[Anonymous No.14912032]

>>14912020
FROM THE FATHER THROUGH THE SON IN THE HOLY SPIRIT

Christ is in both old and new testament, he is God.

[Anonymous No.14912040]

>>14912020
I mean, you don't even know the basics of Christianity, has not even a superficial reading of the Bible. Just leave this thread, anon.

[Anonymous No.14912041]

>>14912020
>God to Moses on Sinai. That wasn't Jesus.
I have news for you... Jesus IS God... And he spoke to Moses both when giving the commandments and in the burning bush. And even earlier, he speaks to Adam in Genesis.

[Anonymous No.14912044]

>>14912014
"coping out?"
lol none of you have been able to refute anything I've said at all, especially here:
>>14911995
>>14911979
>>14911906

..and so I don't really want to damage your mental state by going on with the conversation in a time of national emergency.
>>14912011
>sounds like a very apt description of the tribe you hail from...
oh .. and now I'm Jewish(!)

oh ok, so you're quoting Logos out of context and when you're disagreed with we must be Jews to disagree with you (even though I obviously think Judea was a crap hole full of do-nothing barbarians) .... so you're a former neo-nazi turned trad-tard, basically. I can already guess your podcast listening list.

[Anonymous No.14912047]

>>14912030
>Guess someone didn't read 'our' book through Paul's letters.
Guess someone's following Paul instead of Jesus.

[Anonymous No.14912050]

>>14912041
>>14912040
>>14912032
lol another autistic meltdown

[Anonymous No.14912052]

>>14912044
>Jewish
No, you're modern "israeli" or at least playing into their diabolical hand with the entirety of your being. Jews do not exist anymore ever since Christ fulfilled the Old Covenant.

[Anonymous No.14912054]

>>14911994
>t-they got theirs in the end!1!
behold the Christian slave moralist.
>>14912003
This is Docetism heresy. Have fun burning in hell. rabbi Yeshoua bar-Joseph can't help you now!

[Anonymous No.14912058]

>>14912047
>Guess someone's following Paul instead of Jesus.
See >>14912032
Jesus Christ spoke through the Holy Spirit directly to Saint Paul.

[Anonymous No.14912060]

>>14912047
guess someone doesn't know that jesus said that those who hear them hear me

[Anonymous No.14912066]

>>14912052
>No, you're modern "israeli" or at least playing into their diabolical hand with the entirety of your being.
hahaha I'm chatting on the internet during my lunch. If that's all it takes to debunk your entire theological stance then, really, literal-God help you, you need it lol

[Anonymous No.14912068]

>>14912054
>This is Docetism heresy.
Nope. That's a completely orthodox viewpoint. You seem to "know" about heresises but don't understand basic theology. Jesus Christ had a fully human nature but was only a divine person from all eternity. There is no human person in Jesus Christ.

[Anonymous No.14912070]

>>14912044
>lol none of you have been able to refute anything I've said at all
Maybe because you didn't say anything of substance?
First you bitched and moaned about your boyfriend Galen whose sole contribution is medicine, which is great, but you went ahead and started to sperg about materialistic principalities when everyone's talking about the spiritual.
Then you went on a tirade about the meaning of meta, which you were wrong about, then trying some backwards logic that you have to look a whole different word because why not?
You honestly don't see why people call you a retard?
>Guess someone's following Paul instead of Jesus.
Besides that Paul was hand picked by the risen Jesus to be his apostle and Paul's letter go hand in hand with Jesus's teachings actually proves that Paul is a heretic.
How very muslim of you to say that.

[Anonymous No.14912082]

>>14912054
>This is Docetism heresy.
ah finally, someone who actually knows the theology, yeah, these zealots here talking to us and espousing their strange notions about Moses being Jesus, etc, these are heretics by their own religion - they don't know what they're even talking about. I'd pass the test on it better than them, I think anybody would.

[Anonymous No.14912087]

>>14912066
>hahaha I'm chatting on the internet during my lunch
That's very unkosher of you! What will your rabbi say concerning such grave violations of your favorite talmudic law?

[Anonymous No.14912091]

>>14912068
Don't care whether you think there was a tiny human being inside Jesus or not. Fact remains that he was a jewish guy walking around and spitting in peoples faces. The absolute subversion and destruction of the beautiful and deep concept of Logos by the Christians will curse them forever.

[Anonymous No.14912101]

>>14912091
>beautiful and deep concept
>bruh... like... what even is truth? all religions are the same LOL!!! lets worship statues... lets worship our fallible intellect bruh... the monad bruh... god is like... a thing you cant speak to... hes like... infinite LOL!!!

[Anonymous No.14912102]

>>14912091
If not for Christians, you whole concept of logos would have remained a stoic larp than would have been handed down to 18th century neomodernist faggots.
That's one of the prime reasons to have a religion at all is that you preserve the bare foundations of the moral law, but if you're too dense to understand the reason why the Logos had to come in flesh and pay for everyone's sins, who the fuck are you to call other jews when you're biggest jew in the room?

[Anonymous No.14912103]

>>14912070
Look, it's a simple point..

I'll put it for you again,
>>14911906
>The 'Bible' doesn't even pretend to be an instructional text in anything; compared to Galens book on nutrition and the constitution of the body, for example, or any other book before it. And no character in the new testament or old testament comes close to ... any engineer or physician or general, etc, these people you're claiming are "the literal truth" weren't even accomplished in their own lives.
>Archimedes vs. Solomon, for example.
>Galen vs. Jesus, for example.
>Hadrian vs. David, for example.

Look you're obviously a kid, so I'll cut you some slack. I don't mind in the least if you insult me and tell me I'm retarded and making "tirades", you just don't know any better.

It's like Jesus said when the Zealots tortured and killed him because they were angry at him for coming to them with truth,
"forgive them, father, they know not what they do."

[Anonymous No.14912111]

>>14912102
>If not for Christians, you whole concept of logos would have remained a stoic larp than would have been handed down to 18th century neomodernist faggots.
but we still would have had spaceships 400 yrs earlier.

[Anonymous No.14912119]

>>14908036
I choose a different path, one where there's less retarded Christcucks getting in my way.

[Anonymous No.14912127]

>>14912087
>my rabbi
There's nothing in Jainism about not eating lunch whilst on the keyboard and discussing world religions.

[Anonymous No.14912137]

>>14912119
amen to that.

These 'religiots' are the least Christ-like people you'll ever meet. I don't for a moment think they represent the religion itself.

[Anonymous No.14912148]

>>14912127
>Jainism
What will you guru say about you wasting your time away on 4channel instead of praying to a demonic snake?

[Anonymous No.14912159]

>>14912119
>I choose a different path
But Christ is the path.
>Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

[Anonymous No.14912166]

>>14912137
>I don't for a moment think they represent the religion itself.
Omg! This! Christianity is all about smoking weed and loving each other regardless of gender!

[Anonymous No.14912169]

>>14912103
Okay, then I;ll put it again for you as well.
>The 'Bible' being a collection of books of poetry, history, theology exemplifies learning no less than any of your super philosophers from the dead. But in the Bible's case, it's not speculative aggregation, but the literal truth.
By your own stubborn admission, boy, the Bible is an exemplary work of extraordinary value to human culture. But you still cling to your specific practicalities even though they're outdated since that's the nature of them, while the Bible is still the prime book for western spirituality, writing and literary study and even archeology to this day.
Then you want to compare a bunch of random dudes with 0 given context. You might as well argue over
Ghandi vs Solomon
Elon musk vs Jesus
Donald Trump vs David
But what are you even arguing about, you silly little goose?
>It's like Jesus said when the Zealots tortured and killed him because they were angry at him for coming to them with truth,
But you don't have truth. You don't even have an argument. You come in, preach materalism then fuck off whenever spirituality comes up since you don't know shit.
Then you brag like some super genius when you do that.
How the fuck do you even function on a daily basis like this?

[Anonymous No.14912170]

>>14911957
Yeah, the emerald tablets, I know all about that. And I think they were credulous as well if people like Plato and Pythagoras really went in for that sort of thing.

I prefer Archimedes and his Laser Cannon, myself. Or the unsung engineers who developed and refined underfloor heating, clean water systems and the bathhouses, theatres, and the countless physicians who healed the sick, etc.

[Anonymous No.14912173]

>>14912111
>but we still would have had spaceships 400 yrs earlier
Yeah. Cyborg elephants too.
That or the greeks would still be fucking boys and swinging swords for another 400 after the differential now.

[Anonymous No.14912174]

>>14912159
>But Christ is the path.
So you're saying we're all genetically homogeneous?

[Anonymous No.14912180]

>>14912101
>b-bruh stop thinking it says so in the bible that he be logos and shieeet now smash your ancient temples and institutions because YHWH be the man now
>>14912102
>If not for Christians, you whole concept of logos would have remained a stoic
Instead it became a poorfag carpenter in rags that died that one time in that one place.

t-thanks Christianity
>why the Logos had to come in flesh and pay for everyone's sins
jesus had to come pay himself off

waow such beautiful Christian theology!

[Anonymous No.14912182]

>>14912170
How about the Catholics who preserved knowledge of the ancients and opened universities to spread it out?
How about the law systems that were developed in Christian Europe centuries ago and that still hold up to this day in every modern nation?
How about the solely Christian ideal of life being sacred and everyone is created equal and deserve God given fundamental rights?

[Anonymous No.14912193]

>>14912180
>Instead it became a poorfag carpenter in rags that died that one time in that one place.
Yeah. Died and came back. Just to prove the transcendent power of logos over death itself.
No problem.
>jesus had to come pay himself off
In which case you will have to pay yourself off before God's throne. Of course you probably don't believe that, there is no objective morality, therefore no objective justice, everything is meaningless and why not just be a hedonist because thinking like that is what builds civilization.

[Anonymous No.14912197]

>>14908036
Thanks ot this thread I have understood that Christ is the Truth. Thank you to all the pagans for making it this simple. Thank you for all the Christanons for explaining more about Him.

[Anonymous No.14912204]

>>14912054
>>14912091
Christ's human nature was just like that of Mary: Immaculate. So yes, neither of their human natures were ''jewish''

[Anonymous No.14912207]

>>14912148
the snek is pleased about it. I just asked it and it did the wiggle dance.

>>14912166
No, I mean, the average Christian is a decent well-to-do person. They're not represented by these crazed fundamentalists. That's what I was getting at.

>>14912169
>By your own stubborn admission, boy,
>you silly little goose?
oh shut up hahahahaha look at this clown

>By your own stubborn admission, boy, the Bible is an exemplary work of extraordinary value to human culture.
I literally said the characters in it are unaccomplished do-nothings who contributed nothing. How in three furies did you read this to mean "the Bible is an exemplary work of extraordinary value to human culture" - you didn't even qualify it with a proof in anything I said. What?

>How the fuck do you even function on a daily basis like this?
I know! Right? How do you?

>But you don't have truth. You don't even have an argument. You come in, preach materalism then fuck off whenever spirituality comes up since you don't know shit.

I "preach materialism" ... well God made the world for us didn't he? "WHERE WERE YOU WHEN I MADE THE STARS?" he says to Job (or Moses?). How can you think you're pleasing God if you don't care to even learn about the world? You're pious and religious because... why? ...because you can call me a retard over the internet? No, you just pretend to be religious to suit your own ego, that's all you do, anon. You wouldn't even be talking to people like this if you were a decent person as you want us to believe.

[Anonymous No.14912211]

>>14912193
>Just to prove the transcendent power of logos over death itself.
Stop replacing jesus with logos. We've caught on to your subversions already.
>In which case you will have to pay yourself off before God's throne
I guess inflation have severely ruined Jesus' payment then if we all have to keep on paying. Sounds like quite the scheme!

[Anonymous No.14912224]

>>14912182
You claim monopoly on these things for your religion which existed before your religion already.

You can't 'not' know that.

Anyway the Laws we have that protect us and our freedoms today came out of the Enlightenment and Renaissances when people were sick of being dictated to by priests and of being told what to do. It's absolutely amazing that a Catholic is completely blind to this portion of their history; for a religion all about guilt you in particular have a lot to be guilty about.

[Anonymous No.14912236]

>>14912204
>Christ's human nature was just like that of Mary: Immaculate. So yes, neither of their human natures were ''jewish''
You only say this because don't want to admit that Jesus in his own words was a prophet-god 'for' the Jews. Like Apollo was a prophet-god 'for' the Greeks.

He even says "go nowhere near the gentiles", which makes sense, because a lot of you are deranged and get things all wrong.

[Anonymous No.14912246]

>>14912207
>oh shut up hahahahaha look at this clown
Nice cope, goose.
>I literally said the characters in it are unaccomplished do-nothings who contributed nothing
Archimedes studied water, but Solomon built a temple and a city.
Galen healed the flesh in his time, Jesus healed souls throughout eternity.
Hadrian inherited an Empire, but David built one.
Satisfied?
Granted, one of the core messages of the Bible is that God takes unaccomplished do-nothings who then go out and save their nation from marauding materialistesqu bandit tribes.
>you didn't even qualify it with a proof in anything I said. What?
Then I repeat. You shit your pants over practical application, but your own aforementioned persons are outdated has-beens while the Bible is, again I shall repeat, the number one book that is a must go to if you're digging in the Middle East.
>How can you think you're pleasing God if you don't care to even learn about the world?
I actually agree with you, and that materialism is necessary, but my point is that you ignore the spiritual in favor for the material though one is finite dust, the other is eternal and transcendent.
>No, you just pretend to be religious to suit your own ego, that's all you do, anon. You wouldn't even be talking to people like this if you were a decent person as you want us to believe.
Wow. Spaztic much?
I'll even agree that an overwhelming majority use religion as ego trips, so too is with science, philosophy more than anything else perhaps, even history. But if you read the Bible, you'd know that the jews did these same things and when Jesus came, he proved the Old Tetsament prophets correct who preached that God, the true truth of the universe, will exact punishment of the wicked and so did Jesus, by openly dying and coming back JUST to prove a point that the truth is the truth and you can't beat it.
So I wish upon you, goose, don't drown yourself, but use your own application and learn how to argue with antisocial trolls on the intenet.
Also cute grammar. Very copeesque.

[Anonymous No.14912274]

>>14911253
>prove the supernatural without appealing to the supernatural

[Anonymous No.14912278]

>>14912211
>stop replacing God with God we on 2 u
Okay.
>I guess inflation have severely ruined Jesus' payment then if we all have to keep on paying
Jesus paid for everything with is dead already. consider it an Obama era bailout, but only if you accept and follow the terms written in the 10 commandments.
>>14912224
No, YOU claim a monopoly on achievements that apparently Christianity had no influence on.
If Christianity wanted to usurp everything before hand, you'd think, them having a literacy monopoly in their early days, would have just rewritten everything.
But lo and behold, they were too lazy to do that and everything you know about Galen is actually because some Christian monk decided to rewrite his works word for word as they were written.
You're welcome for that.
>Anyway the Laws we have that protect us and our freedoms today came out of the Enlightenment and Renaissances
I don't know if you know, but the prime movers of the Renaissances was the Catholic Church. Meanwhile the atheist crowd of the Enlightenment actually helped created the neoliberal nightmares that plague us today, such as communism, the lgbtq+++abc people and the rest of the ilk.
>people were sick of being dictated to by priests and of being told what to do
Now that is a very cartoony thing to say. Not even gonna comment.
>absolutely amazing that a Catholic is completely blind to this portion of their history
I'm not even a Catholic. But you should be the first to thank the Catholic church who preserved all ancient knowledge while also protecting you from muslim savages and pagan insurgents.

[Anonymous No.14912286]

>>14912236
>>14899914

also read the scripture, there are many passages of its revelatory transmission to gentiles. Christ came to fulfill the universality of the divine Logos in order to know the Father

[Anonymous No.14912348]

>>14912246
>Archimedes studied water, but Solomon built a temple and a city.
>Galen healed the flesh in his time, Jesus healed souls throughout eternity.
>Hadrian inherited an Empire, but David built one.
>Satisfied?
not really no because the first is a gross disregard of all Archimedes inventions and studies, the second is one real proof in favor of Galen vs. a mystical interpretation of what Jesus was even talking about or what a soul even is (Galen said it's a persons own nutritional health, that's how he healed the body), and the third is just silly.

But we can all tell you're lying with your first example by how you diminish Archimedes and his wide range of inventions by saying "he studied water". We can also tell how you're lying or how you don't see the point of the comparisons because there are 1,000 more Archimedes, Galens and Hadrians for the 1 Solomon or David.

>Then I repeat. You shit your pants over practical application, but your own aforementioned persons are outdated has-beens while the Bible is, again I shall repeat, the number one book that is a must go to if you're digging in the Middle East.
There's a lot wrong with that statement, not least of all because I said,
"he characters in it are unaccomplished do-nothings who contributed nothing."
and then you said
"By your own stubborn admission, boy, the Bible is an exemplary work of extraordinary value to human culture."

And what the hell do you mean with this,
>You shit your pants over practical application
what? ... oh.. you mean "I'm impressed by inventions and real world accomplishments" yes, well yeah.

>but your own aforementioned persons are outdated has-beens while the Bible is, again I shall repeat, the number one book that is a must go to if you're digging in the Middle East.
I'm sure 'any' books about the history of the region from the Armenians, Egyptians, Phoenicians, Mesopotamians, Bedouins, Libyans, Cyrenians, Arabs (pagan arabs who worshiped the cube god) will also suffice.

Off the top of my head, when last I was interested in this, they never had found any archaeological evidence for the supposed 'empire of david' AKA small kingdom. But I don't even want to get into that now.

>materialism
>I actually agree with you
You don't act as if you do. Calling "the whole world" 'materialism' as if it's secondary to a book 'someone' wrote 'on behalf of God' is a pretty strange way to understand the world and the universe in its complexity. I mean, I don't think the real God would care much whether we worshiped him/her/it/them as Shiva or Buddha or Hercules, so long as we were Good People.

I said,
"You wouldn't even be talking to people like this if you were a decent person"
You said
>Wow. Spaztic much?

proving my point lol

>Also cute grammar. Very copeesque.
English, you need to learn it.

> the truth is the truth and you can't beat it.
then why did the church of jesus do to people what the pharisees did to jesus? lessons not learned?

[Anonymous No.14912354]

>>14912236
>Jesus in his own words was a prophet-god 'for' the Jews
Yes. To Jews and the entire world lol
>Like Apollo was a prophet-god 'for' the Greeks
More like fortune teller god for pederast gypsies lol
>He even says "go nowhere near the gentiles", which makes sense, because a lot of you are deranged and get things all wrong.
Yeah. Don't bother with those dirty gentiles who don't know anything about jewish customs and prophecies lol
Look, thousands of gentile idiots came to me like the jews did before. Ima gonna fool them and feed them exactly like I did to the jews lol
Look at this groveling woman. I told her dogs aint nothing. She said dogs eat crumbs off the floor. What a joker. Ima heal her daughter and let her go lol
Whats this? A gentile Roman legionaire whose daughter is dying? But he likes jews? Yo if he likes mah niggas Ima gonna heal his gentile icky poo daughter then lol
Huh? Who should you preach the gospel? Why only to the jews who definitely don't hate you or anything. Never preach the gospel throughout the world lol. Hey Paul, what are you doing there? lol

[Anonymous No.14912361]

>>14911942
Neither of those
What were Galen's thoughts on god[s] if any?

[Anonymous No.14912365]

>>14912348
I really don't care to circle jerk anymore, anon.
I can literally say the same shit by you dismissing Jesus.
And the rest is just platitudes we've been over already.

[Anonymous No.14912375]

>>14912278
>But you should be the first to thank the Catholic church who preserved all ancient knowledge while also protecting you from muslim savages and pagan insurgents.
Why would I do this when I'm an ethnic Byzantine and your people destroyed their rightful liege and master, the Emperor himself..

And way to go on the racism by the way. As if we don't know that it was the Arabs and Persians who protected half of those ancient books from the rabid mob of early christians.

>Meanwhile the atheist crowd of the Enlightenment
bullshit.

> the prime movers of the Renaissances was the Catholic Church.
bullshit

In England it was Henry, in Holland it was Calvin, in Germany it was Luther.

Keep going if you like. You're baseless in everything you're trying to convince anybody of.

[Anonymous No.14912382]

>>14912170
No I don't mean the emerald tablets. Read a fucking book, you borderline illiterate. Read Plato.

>Or the unsung engineers who developed and refined underfloor heating, clean water systems and the bathhouses, theatres, and the countless physicians who healed the sick, etc.

all of it were derived from Principles upon which these things are sustained and by which are effected. None of them were the sterile, materialistically apart from those Principles, all of them symbolized the divine truths of those Principles.
read. a. book.

[Anonymous No.14912406]

>>14912361
>What were Galen's thoughts on god[s] if any?
Why don't you pick up a copy of Galen and read it? I bet you you'll learn something.

Here's a copy,
https://ryanfb.github.io/loebolus-data/L071.pdf

[Anonymous No.14912410]

>>14912236
Galatians 3:28

[Anonymous No.14912415]

>>14912382
>No I don't mean the emerald tablets. Read a fucking book, you borderline illiterate. Read Plato.
You're talking to me about Plato going to Egypt to study the Hermetic School of which the Emerald Tablet is the no.1 mythology, and you say "no i don't mean the emerald tablets" and then you tell me to "read a fucking book" as if I'm the one who doesn't know what they're talking about. Talk about borderline.

[Anonymous No.14912436]

>>14912406
I have 35 other books I'm supposed to be reading but I will add it to the list

[Anonymous No.14912455]

>>14912436
I haven't found of this ..yet.. since it's interesting to the public health at the moment I'm probably going to try to make a text-to-speech copy of it, if I do I'll share the link on here.

35? lol exams? good luck

[Anonymous No.14912466]

ed.
>>14912455
whoops, I meant:
"I haven't found an audiobook copy of this yet"

[Anonymous No.14912605]

>>14912415
are you too dumb to understand that by Egypt I don't mean muh Hermeticism but the mutho-hieratic tradition of its civilization from which Hermeticism derived? Are you aware of, for example, the countless sebayt writings which are prior to the Emerald Tablets? It is not this that built Egyptian productions, but the opposite. And it is precisely this intellectual tradition that Pythagoras and Plato want to convey in all their teachings and works.

[Anonymous No.14912706]

>>14912204
>Christ's human nature was just like that of Mary: Immaculate. So yes, neither of their human natures were ''jewish''
So I guess all the Jesus genealogy was just waste of ink then.

[Anonymous No.14912811]

>>14912706
no because it is a genealogy of the Faith; Jesus is the fatherless Child in humanity and the motherless Son in divinity.

[Anonymous No.14912824]

>>14912375
>As if we don't know that it was the Arabs and Persians who protected half of those ancient books from the rabid mob of early christians.
What the hell are you talking about?
The arabs literally took over your ethnic Byzantine, which was Orthodox Christian already protecting literacy, and then they feigned their so called islamic golden age which still managed to destroy plenty of knowledge due to infighting.
The Persians were long gone by then.
>atheist crowd of the Enlightenment
>bullshit
Indeed. The Enlightenment was bullshit. But the libertine types loved it for some reason.
>the prime movers of the Renaissances was the Catholic Church.
>bullshit
>In England it was Henry
Now that is bullshit. You mean the same Henry that basically destabilized the government with his centralization and turned England into a tyrannical scare house of opression that you atheist types love to pin of the Catholic Church so much?
>Calvin
>Luther
Now that is just bizzare. So now Christians are fighting Christians for what you claim to be an antithetic Christian movement? Give me a break with your gymnastic hogwash.
>Keep going if you like. You're baseless in everything you're trying to convince anybody of
Says a guy who can't muster a coherent argument.

[Anonymous No.14912893]

>>14912348
While I'm at it.
>the first is a gross disregard of all Archimedes inventions and studies
And what about Euclid? What about Pythagoras?
You cling to Archimedes as if he built the whole of western civilization front to back on his own. Meanwhile gladly ignore the foundations before and the structural build up forward. Then you blame Christians for the same shit.
>Galen vs Jesus
Galen is long dead. Jesus is alive lol
But succumbing on your putrid level, you still fight the spiritual with your materialism and fail. To this very day you can have a fully physically fit and nourished person drown in depression and anxiety from a spiritual lack which, coincidentally, get repaired by Christianity when you have plenty of poor, malnourished people who work hard and still live more mentally stable and meaningful lives solely, by theory own admission, because of religion. That is why Galen could have cured flesh alone, but Jesus cured souls throughout eternity. That's just the nature of the spiritual vs materialism.
>there are 1,000 more Archimedes, Galens and Hadrians for the 1 Solomon or David
This is a meaningless statement, because the exact same thing could be said about Solomon and David in a spiritual sense.
>I'm impressed by inventions and real world accomplishments
But you're not impressed by these things at all or else the Bible would be the hottest thing for you.
You just cling to an antithetical worldview solely to bitch your materialistic nonsense as a higher meaning against higher meaning itself. How more contrarian can you get? There is literally no discussion here.
>I'm sure 'any' books about the history of the region from etc.
Yeah. That would bee great if there were any books like that which could hold as much merit as the Bible does.
>they never had found any archaeological evidence for the supposed 'empire of david' AKA small kingdom
When was the last time you were interested in it then? The 18th century? I mean there are still debates if the unified kingdom was a thing, though considering it only survived for two generations before being split apart, no wonder its a daunting task.
Also lets ignore all the cities that were dug up that coincide with the Old Testament, lest call William Mitchell Ramsay a fraud and keep sucking off greek qntiquity because the greek antiquity thing to do.
>Calling "the whole world" 'materialism' as if it's secondary to a book 'someone' wrote
It's not the book, you fucking dimwtitt, it's the theology and metaphysics behind it. Fucking hell man. If you still incline to think that every religious person is a sola scripturalist calvinist creationist, then your loss bro. Keep living in your little mental prison then and reduce everything to materia. See how much you'll preserve.
>then why did the church of jesus do to people what the pharisees did to jesus?
Do you even know how to provide basic context or do you expect everyone to read that dull mind of yours?

[Anonymous No.14912912]

>>14908036
>block your path
>stabs every anglo on this board
>kills every youtube watching zoomer
>decapitates e celebs
>cleanses this pigpen of a place
kill
your
self

[Anonymous No.14912937]

The people that post these
>x DESTRYOED y
posts are unironically against the thing they tend to be arguing for. The same thing occurred with Guenon. He used to be a perfectly average thinker until people began to shill him and the contrarianism took him down for good. If you like an author, whoever he may be, don't even engage with these sort of posts.

[Anonymous No.14913292]

>>14911428
Dogmatism is not their problem, the problem is that supposedly open and candid scientits can be hypocritical dogmatists, as well as their legions of bugmen appealers

[Anonymous No.14913394]

>>14911428
>science is not science if dogma gets in the way
>but religion is bad no matter of dogma or not
Amazing.
Nice reddit spacing, faggot. Did you learn that while skipping grammar class?

[Anonymous No.14913632]

>>14913394
>>science is not science if dogma gets in the way
>>but religion is bad no matter of dogma or not
I agree with this.

[Anonymous No.14913640]

>>14913632
Yeah. Because you're a contrarian faggot.

[Anonymous No.14913745]

>>14912824
>You mean the same Henry that basically destabilized the government with his centralization and turned England into a tyrannical scare house of opression that you atheist types love to pin of the Catholic Church so much?
are you referring to the TUDOR RENAISSANCE?!

MY MAN, pish and posh with your Popery. Methinks ye be some Papal Agent, methinks. Mutton steaks, be your back, sir. At thee, with whip!

>While I'm at it.
do go on,

>>14912893
>You cling to Archimedes as if he built the whole of western civilization front to back on his own. Meanwhile gladly ignore the foundations before
Who? The Minoans? The Etruscans? They rock. You're saying I cling to Archimedes.. no no no you didn't read what I said properly earlier on. I explained this already.

>Galen is long dead. Jesus is alive lol
*slowly nodding, looking around at others, smiles forming*

>But succumbing on your putrid level,
lol

> you still fight the spiritual with your materialism and fail.
I do? I didn't realize that's what I was doing.

To this very day you can have a fully physically fit and nourished person drown in depression and anxiety from a spiritual lack which, coincidentally, get repaired by Christianity when you have plenty of poor, malnourished people who work hard and still live more mentally stable and meaningful lives solely, by theory own admission, because of religion. That is why Galen could have cured flesh alone, but Jesus cured souls throughout eternity.
Possibly, possibly. But the Buddha or Shiva can claim the same spiritual powers for the qualities they supposedly bestow upon their people, which are psychological reactions, of course taking place in the mind.

Galen, as with other physicians, understood that actually focusing upon the diet and nutrition of the body itself s key to maintaining health and avoiding disease. Prayer may be beneficial for the mind in addition to treatment, yes, but the treatment itself is far superior and the results infinitely more tangible.

>This is a meaningless statement, because the exact same thing could be said about Solomon and David in a spiritual sense.
I uh... well okay. Add Alexander and Julius Caesar and Leonidas, and Napoleon, as well to the list of great spiritual gurus and prophets then.

>you're not impressed by (inventions and real world accomplishments) at all or else the Bible would be the hottest thing for you.
> if there were any books like that which could hold as much merit as the Bible does.

.... but then you say,
>It's not the book, you fucking dimwtitt, it's the theology and metaphysics behind it. Fucking hell

when it suits you it's this, when it suits you it's that. I see.


>context
I said,
"then why did the church of jesus do to people what the pharisees did to jesus?"
Referring of course to the fact the Church and Early and Later Christians were going around torturing and killing people for religious crimes just as the Pharisees did to Jesus. Missing the largest point of the story.

[Anonymous No.14913751]

>>14913640
No,I agree with it consistently whether it's popular or not. A contrarian would disagree one day and agree another.

[Anonymous No.14913760]

>>14912824
>You mean the same Henry that basically destabilized the government with his centralization and turned England into a tyrannical scare house of opression that you atheist types love to pin of the Catholic Church so much?
are you referring to the TUDOR RENAISSANCE?!

MY MAN, pish and posh with your Popery. Methinks ye be some Papal Agent, methinks. Mutton steaks, be your back, sir. At thee, with whip!

>While I'm at it.
do go on,

>>14912893
>You cling to Archimedes as if he built the whole of western civilization front to back on his own. Meanwhile gladly ignore the foundations before
Who? The Minoans? The Etruscans? They rock. You're saying I cling to Archimedes.. no no no you didn't read what I said properly earlier on. I explained this already.

>Galen is long dead. Jesus is alive lol
*slowly nodding, looking around at others, smiles forming*

>But succumbing on your putrid level,
lol

> you still fight the spiritual with your materialism and fail.
I do? I didn't realize that's what I was doing.

>To this very day you can have a fully physically fit and nourished person drown in depression and anxiety from a spiritual lack which, coincidentally, get repaired by Christianity when you have plenty of poor, malnourished people who work hard and still live more mentally stable and meaningful lives solely, by theory own admission, because of religion. That is why Galen could have cured flesh alone, but Jesus cured souls throughout eternity.
Possibly, possibly. But the Buddha or Shiva can claim the same spiritual powers for the qualities they supposedly bestow upon their people, which are psychological reactions, of course taking place in the mind.

Galen, as with other physicians, understood that actually focusing upon the diet and nutrition of the body itself s key to maintaining health and avoiding disease. Prayer may be beneficial for the mind in addition to treatment, yes, but the treatment itself is far superior and the results infinitely more tangible.

>This is a meaningless statement, because the exact same thing could be said about Solomon and David in a spiritual sense.
I uh... well okay. Add Alexander and Julius Caesar and Leonidas, and Napoleon, as well to the list of great spiritual gurus and prophets then.

>you're not impressed by (inventions and real world accomplishments) at all or else the Bible would be the hottest thing for you.
> if there were any books like that which could hold as much merit as the Bible does.

.... but then you say,
>It's not the book, you fucking dimwtitt, it's the theology and metaphysics behind it. Fucking hell

when it suits you it's this, when it suits you it's that. I see.


>context
I said,
"then why did the church of jesus do to people what the pharisees did to jesus?"
Referring of course to the fact the Church and Early and Later Christians were going around torturing and killing people for religious crimes just as the Pharisees did to Jesus. Missing the largest point of the story.

[Anonymous No.14913783]

>>14913760
>*slowly nodding, looking around at others, smiles forming*

holy cringe

[Anonymous No.14913784]

>>14912893
>Jesus is alive
are you talking about those hundreds of individuals who appear with wild eyes in Jerusalem every other month and proclaim themselves to have "come back"?

or.. are you referring to that psychiatrists experiment where three Jesus's were put together in a home, and they fought each other?

[Anonymous No.14913787]

>>14913745
>*slowly nodding, looking around at others, smiles forming*
There are actual children posting on this board now, aren't there?
I severely regret making this thread. I just wanted some light-hearted mirth at the expense of e-celeb ortho-sphere. Instead it's just an unsalvageable 'tism fest.

[Anonymous No.14913791]

>>14913783
*holy based.

>>14913784
>that psychiatrists experiment where three Jesus's were put together in a home, and they fought each other?
re:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Three_Christs_of_Ypsilanti

[Anonymous No.14913809]

>>14913787
>I severely regret making this thread.
>tismfest
You sound like a battered spouse. This thread was hilarious fun, the christ-tard neo-nazi racists came out in force but we managed to speak some sense to them and agree on some points here and there. It was educational.

I thank you, OP. For Galens sake.

[Anonymous No.14913834]

>Rokeach got the idea from an article in Harper's Magazine describing two women who both believed they were the Virgin Mary. After being assigned as psychiatric hospital roommates, one of the women recovered from her delusion as a result of conversations with the roommate and was discharged.[2] Rokeach was also influenced by Cesare Beccaria's essay On Crimes and Punishments, concerning the subject of Simon Morin, who was claimed to have been potentially cured in a similar way.[3][4] As a similar study of delusional belief systems, Rokeach brought together three men who each claimed to be Jesus Christ and confronted them with one another's conflicting claims, while encouraging them to interact personally as a support group. Rokeach also attempted to manipulate other aspects of their delusions by inventing messages from imaginary characters. He did not, as he had hoped, provoke any lessening of the patients' delusions, but did document a number of changes in their beliefs.

>While initially the three patients quarreled over who was holier and reached the point of physical altercation, they eventually each explained away the other two as being patients with a mental disability in a hospital, or dead and being operated by machines.[5] The graduate students who worked with Rokeach on the project have been strongly critical of the morality of the project because of the amount of dishonesty and manipulation by Rokeach and the amount of distress experienced by the patients.[2] Rokeach added a comment in the final revision of the book that, while the experiment did not cure any of the three Christs, "It did cure me of my godlike delusion that I could manipulate them out of their beliefs."[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Three_Christs_of_Ypsilanti

[Anonymous No.14913858]

>>14908036
>i’m a devout orthodox
>only recently converted
>was sedevacantist, then apostate from christianity
>still associates with pagans and poses in front of satanic symbols

what a ‘good christian’

[Anonymous No.14913864]

>>14913858
he himself posted this on twitter, too

[Anonymous No.14913887]

>>14913864
what does he say about it

[Anonymous No.14913973]

>>14913760
>no no no you didn't read what I said properly
Nigga I read what you said. If you can't say shit clearly, not my problem.
>*slowly nodding, looking around at others, smiles forming*
Damn man. That's just sad.
>I do? I didn't realize that's what I was doing.
Evidently, since you don't even acknowledge the spiritual, let alone understand it.
>But the Buddha or Shiva can claim the same spiritual powers for the qualities
Buddha never claimed to power, he rejected it, unless you want to read whatever hindu misinterpretation was written centuries after Buddhims was established.
I can't speak for Shiva. Hinduism in general is so far up its own ass that I don't think anyone can make sense of it.
>Galen, as with other physicians, understood that actually focusing upon the diet and nutrition of the body itself s key to maintaining health and avoiding disease.
You'd think with such secret knowledge all those icky poo religious people would have just starved and exhausted themselves out.
>Prayer may be beneficial for the mind in addition to treatment, yes, but the treatment itself is far superior and the results infinitely more tangible.
Which is a more defining trait of well being? A fit body with a rotten mind or a rotten body with a healthy mind?
See, you think I deny materialism, I don't, I accept it and I also accept spirituality. You on the other hand keep fallig on your materialism until your argument runs dry and deny spirituality unless you have to accept it, like you did now.
>Add Alexander and Julius Caesar and Leonidas, and Napoleon, as well to the list of great spiritual gurus and prophets then.
Nigger you literally missed your own point. Tell me something, if Archimedes hadn't written anything down, would he have been remembered? And revered by contrarians like you?
>.... but then you say,
Yeah. Because there are two different context, you utter retard. First you bitch about how materialistic imprint is the most important and I say the Bible has a huge one since it's basically a history book since Mesopotamia.
Then you say that the Bible is still shit no matter what and put it on a materialist pedestal, YET FUCKING AGAIN in an argument about its spiritual influence, which goes beyond it. How the fuck do you call others kids when you literally think like an undergrad?
>when it suits you it's this, when it suits you it's that. I see.
Yeah, we'll the pot calling the kettle black in this case.

[Anonymous No.14913978]

>>14913760
>Referring of course to the fact the Church and Early and Later Christians were going around torturing and killing people for religious crimes just as the Pharisees did to Jesus
Congratulations, you finally gave context. Too bad it's a shit context that draws back to the no dogma for me, all the dogma for you argument.
Do you think me so soft in the brain that I'd argue people can't to evil for religious reasons or do you think your thick skull can muster an argument which would dare claim that science hasn't been used for evil? Here's a distinction for you. Religion, any religion, any good one at least, has a moral foundation that if you stray from, everyone will know. Science doesn't have that one single bit. That's when you have doctors prescribing hormones to little boys to fuck their bodies up so that later on a surgeon with an Archimedes shirt could chop his dick off and leave a festering wound that degenerate Joe could stick his own piercing ridden dick in it.

[Anonymous No.14915126]

>Christ
Based

[Anonymous No.14915154]

>>14908036
Any link to a good summary/hologram of the guys' work?

[Anonymous No.14915206]

>>14908153
based

[Anonymous No.14916758]

>>14908153
>3 days later
>go to the local McIbrahim's
>see this guy with his crew

[Anonymous No.14916770]

>>14913858
He only got admitted into the church within the last 2 years.

Yet he was arguing for orthodoxy since like 2008

[Anonymous No.14916849]

>>14916770
Damn church bureaucracy.
Amiright?

[Anonymous No.14916911]

mister word salad thinks he can just claim any preposition

[Anonymous No.14916943]

>>14913973
>Nigga I read what you said. If you can't say shit clearly, not my problem.
Why do religiots accuse other people of doing this when you've made the mistake?

Look: You said,
"You cling to Archimedes as if he built the whole of western civilization front to back on his own."

And I had said already that there were a 1000 other Archimedes, Galens and Hadrians for your 1 Solomon, David and Jesus. The point as I explained was that there are many many many any examples of highly accomplished people who did things in the real world, vs. your unaccomplished few people who look like cavemen by comparison and had no real accomplishments.


>Evidently, since you don't even acknowledge the spiritual,
It's psychology and brain chemistry which we understand better with psychiatry. Your spiritual is no more than the same fuzzy feeling of togetherness that a colony of baboons might feel after they'd all had sex and gorged on fruit. You can also take drugs to get an even more supercharged feeling of the same and "open your third eye". This is also why schizophrenia, is associated with religious delusion for example.


> icky poo
.......... uh


>See, you think I deny materialism, I don't,
Because you'd have a hard time denying a brick wall that you can see and touch and blocks your path. Your divide and compartmentalization of "The Entire World" into the compartments of Material and Spiritual is unwarranted (and schizophrenic). These are words you don't even understand or know anything about; what do you know about pscyhology or geology or medicine really? And as your own Jesus even said, "the kingdom of heaven is all around us."


>you say that the Bible is still shit no matter what and put it on a materialist pedestal, YET FUCKING AGAIN
> you literally think like an undergrad

lol shaking my fucking head at your projection.. "I'm (the) undergrad"
You're not well mentally: your thoughts don't follow logically, like when I said yesterday I thought that the Christians or Judeans were unaccomplished people (Solomon vs. Archimedes, Jesus vs. Galen, etc) and you said that I was "praising the Bible" and then ignored at least 3 attempts of mine to highlight how your thoughts weren't making any sense.

>you utter retard.
...


> A fit body with a rotten mind or a rotten body with a healthy mind?
Again, "These are (subjects) you don't even understand or know anything about; what do you know about pscyhology or geology or medicine really?" Nothing. Obviously.


>First you bitch about how materialistic imprint is the most important
You're a moron pal. Nobody in the real world is going around "bitching" "about the materialistic imprint"...?! Where are you even coming from? Who outside of 'religion' influence thinks in this fragmented way where the world is broken into "material" and "spiritual"? Nobody. If you're interpreting the world through this false dichomtomy then that's entire your problem.

>that's sad

[Anonymous No.14916945]

>>14913973

you go on,
>>14913978
>Congratulations, you finally gave context.
If your brain wasn't so frazzled and if you'd learned how to read, you'd have been able to read the context for yourself yesterday.


>Too bad it's a shit context that draws back to the no dogma for me, all the dogma for you argument.
Then you're not actually Religious are you, fuckface? No you just masturbate over your own impressions of your favorite pokemon characters (icons) and make up whatever drivel you like which reinforces your own biases, but you still cling to the dogmas 'of' relgion, whether you deny it or not, which we know because those concepts come solely 'from' that religion. But you've actually done no 'above grad' reading on anything at all, otherwise you'd have understood the 1st point in this post, as well as the other one you didn't understand the "context" of...

>you have doctors prescribing hormones to little boys
...and
...you're not actually interested at all in these things you're saying because you're going on a political tirade now, which is interesting that you blame this on 'thinking people':
> a surgeon with an Archimedes shirt could chop his dick off
because in reality the Catholic and Orthodox Churches were still castrating boys as early as 1870/1920, and had been from the beginning. Religion did not stop them but encouraged them. And let's not forget that the Romans tried hard stop the Jews mutilating their own sons genitals.


>Here's a distinction for you.
> a moral foundation that if you stray from, everyone will know.
Like I just said.

And that was also my point about how Christians were doing to people exactly what the Pharisees did to Jesus: brutal torture for 'religious crimes'. That was exactly the point that you missed earlier; you think "everyone will know better than to do bad things" if they become religious: they didn't ever learn those lessons and they don't today, as evidenced by the behavior of religious zealots everywhere and not least of all on here. They merely learn to conceal their desire to be evil to their fellow man by hiding themselves under the cloak of "pious religious person", then they sin and pray and pretend to be forgiven, then they go and sin again and the religion has no manner by which to prevent it - and in the case of Catholicism is already corrupted with Indulgences to provide avenue for evil people to do just that. This is the least of all useful in moral systems, compared to pre-christian Stoicism/Hellenism, Buddhism, Tao, etc.

[Anonymous No.14916963]

>>14913978

ed
.>>14916945
>no dogma for me, all the dogma for you argument.
Oh wait.. what were you saying there? I may have misread that myself ha

You mean:
You are religious and believe in the snek in the garden it but you don't believe in the dogma?

Or:
'I' am the dogmatic one when I 'don't' believe in it?

Not clear.

[Anonymous No.14916973]

>>14913858
Saint Peter's Cross, no?

[Anonymous No.14916993]

>>14908152
The papacy has been near worthless since Vatican 2. Only a return to Traditional Catholicism, including the esoteric dimension, can save the church. Unfortunately this seems extremely unlikely, so it looks like Islam is the only practical choice for a truly spiritual man today.

[Anonymous No.14917024]

>>14916963
Nice reddit spacing.

[Anonymous No.14917049]

>>14916993
>it looks like Islam is the only practical choice for a truly spiritual man today.
or you could just stop worshiping like little slaves and become Adult Humans.

[Anonymous No.14917055]

>>14917024
Way to avoid answering anything for the 100th time.

[Anonymous No.14917110]

>>14916993
>one heresy has shown its true face so it's time to jump to another less degenerated heresy
why though? just begome orthodox. thankfully it's easier for westerners today than it ever was.

[Anonymous No.14917166]

>>14917110
>>14916993
Just for curiositys sake,

What do you guys have against the Church of England? It actually exists and is without scandal or shame, unlike these other cults... Orthodoxy (useless without an emperor) and Catholicism (satans synagogue itself)

[Anonymous No.14917188]

>>14908036
Dyer is well read but ultimately he's just in love with his imagined idea of Orthodoxy, not what the Orthodox Church really is. The real Orthodox Church is a mostly corrupt group of infighting Protestant-like sects that are very ethnocentric. I appreciate his views on theology but no amount of wanking about the essence energies distinction hides the fact that the Orthodox are so divided that without the Pope they haven't managed to hold a single successful ecumenical council in a thousand years.

[Anonymous No.14917198]

>>14917166
>What do you guys have against the Church of England
It's a schismatic group with deluded theology. From the Orthodox point of view, it's basically as far gone as Catholicism or any other form of Westernized Christianity.
>(useless without an emperor)
What makes you think so? You don't need an emperor to establish/enforce dogma. Orthodox theology is not centrally established from a single point like you have in Catholicism. A Byzantium/Russia-style empire is obviously preferable to the current state, but it not existing at this point in time does not refute the religion.

[Anonymous No.14917207]

>>14917198
>You don't need an emperor to establish/enforce dogma.
Except the Orthodox Church has managed to accomplish fuck all since the fall of the Byzantine Empire so...Yeah they kinda do. The only time Orthodoxy was a relevant cultural force was the time when they had a de facto Pope. Really makes you think doesn't it? He even appointed the Bishop. So much for all the Orthodox screeching about Bishops needing approval from the Pope.

[Anonymous No.14917233]

>>14917188
>I appreciate his views on theology
Then you simply cannot hold Catholicism to be the true historical church.
>mostly corrupt group of infighting Protestant-like sects
Sounds very much like ""traditional"" Catholicism...
>ethnocentric
How is this a bad thing? Are you implying that we need to have literal anti-christ-tier global language in every church? Sounds extremely pozzed and non-historical. Also, the amount of Anglo converts (even promiment ones like Seraphim Rose who are loved even in Russia) shows that you do not have to be ethnically from an "Orthodox" country to join. If all of your kind abandonded the rotten ship that is Rome, you could have already had your own jurisdictions with proper liturgy in English.
>Orthodox are so divided that without the Pope
And yet we still somehow exist a thousand years after the schism with unchanged theology... while Rome constantly creates new contradictory dogma to patch up previous inconsistencies or pander to the retarded whims of the secular world.
>hold a single successful ecumenical council in a thousand years
There were many dogmatically/ecumenically binding councils after the schism which were not called "ecumenical councils". e.g. the Hesychast Synods (14th century), Synod of Jassy (1642 so no emperor), Synod of Jerusalem (1672) etc.

>>14917207
>Yeah they kinda do
See above.
>The only time Orthodoxy was a relevant cultural force was the time when they had a de facto Pope
The Russian Empire still existed for a long time after Byzantium until Westerners subverted it.

[Anonymous No.14917251]

>>14917166
>"Church" of (((England)))
>founded by an unironic coomer
>literally headed by a f*male

[Anonymous No.14917256]

>>14917233
>Then you simply cannot hold Catholicism to be the true historical church.
Of course I can. I'm not autistic enough to think that the identity of the true historical Church hinges on whether it accepts Dyers personal preference of accepting the Energies/Essence distinction. Catholicism is the true historical Church because it still has all four marks of the true Church. The Eastern Orthodox sects do not. They even come up with some absolutely hilarious "invisible Church" Protestant level logical leaps by claiming that each of their tiny denominations is in itself fully Catholic and this fulfils the Catholicity requirement which is just adorable.

>Sounds very much like ""traditional"" Catholicism
The lines of Catholicism are very clear. There might be doctrinal disputes within the Church but it is still recognizably one Church. The Orthodox sects have no clear boundaries owing to the fact they're so incompetent they can't manage to gather the Bishops for any kind of dogmatic prononcement.

>How is this a bad thing?
Because the Church isn't supposed to be split among ethnic lines. Ethnophyletism is a sin anon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phyletism

>And yet we still somehow exist a thousand years after the schism with unchanged theology
Most Orthodox sects have varying degrees of changed theology. The fact that they're not dogmas is a testament to the fact that the Orthodox sects can't come together for any kind of council.

>There were many dogmatically/ecumenically binding councils after the schism which were not called "ecumenical councils".
They can't be dogmatically binding without the Pope and they're not ecumenical councils.

[Anonymous No.14917260]

>>14911303
What is 'non-existence' exactly?

[Anonymous No.14917276]

>>14917198
>it not existing at this point in time does not refute the religion.
oh no, it only makes it useless as an institution.

Whereas CofE has its Emperor alive and well.

I mean, when you pray to lord for help, you're asking the emperor to give somemoney or send some troops, so when the emperor is not there anymore... it's kinda useless ...whereas the Monarch of England is still around and has a mailing address.

[Anonymous No.14917363]

>>14917055
>If I repeat the same drivel for a 100th time that already been refuted
>it won't ever be refuted

[Anonymous No.14917383]

>>14917256
>>14917276
I can't tell if you have anglo-induced brain damage or if you're simply trolling.

[Anonymous No.14917385]

>>14917256
The Catholic church changed the creed determined by the councils as what Christians believed. As soon as that changed, they became a different religion and separated themselves from the church. See, the filioque controversy.

[Anonymous No.14917397]

>>14917166
Protestantism in all its forms is anti traditional, materialist nonsense. A true tradition never changes, never "adapts" to modern circumstances, and represents a pillar of stability for society to build around. Prods don't understand religion, they don't understand tradition, and they don't understand God.

[Anonymous No.14917414]

>>14917385
The Filique is the orthodox Christian position:

>"The Holy Spirit is neither the Father nor the Son, but only the Spirit of the Father and of the Son."
-St Augustine


And yet it is not to no purpose that in this Trinity the Son and none other is called the Word of God, and the Holy Spirit and none other the Gift of God, and God the Father alone is He from whom the Word is born, and from whom the Holy Spirit principally proceeds. And therefore I have added the word principally, because we find that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Son also. But the Father gave Him this too, not as to one already existing, and not yet having it; but whatever He gave to the only-begotten Word, He gave by begetting Him. Therefore He so begat Him as that the common Gift should proceed from Him also, and the Holy Spirit should be the Spirit of both.

[Anonymous No.14917421]

>>14917363
"drivel" as in... pointing out at least twenty things that prove your religion is stupid, a few more which prove your religion is evil, and a few things which prove you're borderline schizophrenic..

... drivel of course :)

i.e. when good secular truth is shown to you which you cannot refute your mind goes into seizure and you become violent, what's that gif supposed to be? threatening me with a fist? using two mulattos? lol


But of course look at how you lie. When questions are asked of you and points are made to illustrate your errors and mistakes, you pretend you don't hear them. This just tells everybody that you're a liar; you're undermining yourself and this obvious to anybody the moment you do it.

..but.. I think it tells us also that your idea of God is actually Satan. Because who else in your theological framework can you bow and worship to whilst not caring about truth? If you lie and sin as you do, whilst claiming to 'believe in God' ? That doesn't make sense unless obviously your God is the Devil, else you'd be interested in Truth and you wouldn't be so rude or violent or etc etc. Right?

:)

[Anonymous No.14917426]

>>14917414
Doesn't matter what a single theologian thought. There were tons of different opinions in the early church. What matters is what was determined by the ecumenical councils of theologians, bishops and the holy spirit. Catholics accept the ruling of the councils too, but then change it when it's inconvenient.

[Anonymous No.14917430]

>>14917397
>materialist

Your divide and compartmentalization of "The Entire World" into the compartments of Material and Spiritual is unwarranted (and schizophrenic).

Who outside of 'religion' influence thinks in this fragmented way where the world is broken into "material" and "spiritual"? Nobody. If you're interpreting the world through this false dichomtomy then that's entire your problem.

[Anonymous No.14917453]

>>14917426
Filique was dogmatized at the Second Council of Lyons. An ecumenical council of Bishops guided by the Holy Spirit after the heretical and schismatic Eastern Orthodox sects broke away from Rome.

[Anonymous No.14917457]

>>14917453
>after
It doesn't work like that buddy. You can't just retroactively throw out a council once you've filled one with your own people who already agree with you. That's beyond retarded.

[Anonymous No.14917462]

>>14917256
>Catholicism is the true historical Church because it still has all four marks of the true Church.
>The lines of Catholicism are very clear. There might be doctrinal disputes within the Church but it is still recognizably one Church.
It literally has none of the marks. It's not One or Catholic because you can be Eastern Catholic and somehow "invisibly" have the same theology if you merely formally submit to Rome, even when your theologies blatantly contradict each other on many points . It's not Holy because all of the widespread degeneracy you see (sainted degenerate heretical popes, rampant Jesuit degeneracy, cringe sex-magick-tier female "saints", etc). It's not Apostolic because of all the innovation in doctrine which goes directly against what the Apostles and the Church Fathers teach.
>Because the Church isn't supposed to be split among ethnic lines.
Having different languages and ethnicities in a single church does not split it. If it does, then the existence of Eastern Catholics splits your fake church too.
>they can't manage to gather the Bishops for any kind of dogmatic prononcement.
We're not degenerates who wish to constantly innovate new dogma with countless unnecessary councils. God's providence will convene a true council whenever it is necessary. If you deny this, you're immediately falling into materialist degeneracy by denying the Holy Spirit guiding the Church.
>Most Orthodox sects have varying degrees of changed theology.
Show me a single group that is __Orthodox__ and yet holds to and teaches heresy.
>They can't be dogmatically binding without the Pope and they're not ecumenical councils.
>cannot be Orthodox without accepting all of the councils listed there
>not dogmatically binding
???

[Anonymous No.14917463]

>>14917453
It really took them 600 years to realise?

[Anonymous No.14917464]

>>14917397
>Protestantism in all its forms is anti traditional, materialist nonsense. A true tradition never changes, never "adapts" to modern circumstances
Well you go ahead and be true to what you just said and get off the internet then, moron lol ...you know I think we should have an island somewhere in the north sea where religiots can live exactly as they did in the slummiest times of theocracy, typhus and all, being dragged to pray in the morning and tortured if they don't praise the pope and their noses cut off if they look at a woman.

[Anonymous No.14917477]

>>14917462
>It literally has none of the marks. It's not One or Catholic because you can be Eastern Catholic and somehow "invisibly" have the same theology if you merely formally submit to Rome
There is no theological difference in the Eastern Catholic Churches. They have a different rite, that's it.

>If you deny this, you're immediately falling into materialist degeneracy by denying the Holy Spirit guiding the Church.
The Holy Spirit isn't guiding the Orthodox sects, that's the point. You can't defend your church by claiming that the Holy Spirit just doesn't want you guys to have a council yet, because whether your Church has the Holy Spirit guiding it at all is what is in question. It's like Protestants who say they know the true meaning of scripture because they have the Holy Spirit. it means nothing. The Orthodox sects are stagnant, corrupt and rotten to the core. There is no evangelical zeal and they've been thoroughly co-opted for materialistic worldly and political gain.

>Show me a single group that is __Orthodox__ and yet holds to and teaches heresy.
https://orthodoxyindialogue.com/

[Anonymous No.14917480]

>>14917453
>look at this total agreement with x position because we excluded anyone who disagrees with it
>this totally overrides previous decisions with the people we don't agree with

[Anonymous No.14917493]

>>14917414
>because we find that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Son also
Yes, but not ontologically/hypostatically. He is indeed eternally manifested by the Son, but the Son is not a co-cause of his hypostasis. To say so would be to subvert the unique hypostatic property of the Father as the sole cause of the other hypostases. The Orthodox formula for any action of the Holy Trinity is
>From the Father, through the Son and in the Holy Spirit.

If you're interested, see - https://jbburnett.com/resources/lossky/lossky_img4-process-filioq.pdf

[Anonymous No.14917501]

>>14917493
Thanks for the link, I needed this.

[Anonymous No.14917503]

>>14917493
The Catholic position is that the Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son as by one principle. So why all the sperging? It's the same doctrine.

>Hence, as the person of the Father is one, it would follow that the person of the Son and of the Holy Ghost would be one, having two relations opposed to the two relations of the Father. But this is heretical since it destroys the Faith in the Trinity. Therefore the Son and the Holy Ghost must be related to each other by opposite relations. Now there cannot be in God any relations opposed to each other, except relations of origin, as proved above (I:28:44). And opposite relations of origin are to be understood as of a "principle," and of what is "from the principle." Therefore we must conclude that it is necessary to say that either the Son is from the Holy Ghost; which no one says; or that the Holy Ghost is from the Son, as we confess.

>Hence also the Greeks themselves recognize that the procession of the Holy Ghost has some order to the Son. For they grant that the Holy Ghost is the Spirit "of the Son"; and that He is from the Father "through the Son." Some of them are said also to concede that "He is from the Son"; or that "He flows from the Son," but not that He proceeds; which seems to come from ignorance or obstinacy. For a just consideration of the truth will convince anyone that the word procession is the one most commonly applied to all that denotes origin of any kind. For we use the term to describe any kind of origin; as when we say that a line proceeds from a point, a ray from the sun, a stream from a source, and likewise in everything else. Hence, granted that the Holy Ghost originates in any way from the Son, we can conclude that the Holy Ghost proceeds from the Son.

[Anonymous No.14917522]

>>14917477
>The Holy Spirit isn't guiding the Orthodox sects, that's the point.
Why not? It has the correct theology and all of the marks of the Church, so naturally the Holy Spirit should be guiding it.
>There is no theological difference in the Eastern Catholic Churches.
So Rome accepts the essence-energies distinction and rejects absolute divine simplicity now? That's what I mean by the "invisible" communion you guys have with the Eastern Catholics where you somehow try to make these contradictions reconcile by the mere formal fact of submitting to the Pope.
>The Orthodox sects are stagnant, corrupt and rotten to the core. There is no evangelical zeal and they've been thoroughly co-opted for materialistic worldly and political gain.
Even if we assume this, are you implying it does not hold of the catholic church to an even higher degree?
>https://orthodoxyindialogue.com/
>ecumenical, and interfaith dialogue
>"""Orthodoxy"""
???

[Anonymous No.14917529]

>>14917503
>It's the same doctrine.
lmao. standard ecumenist catholic response. it's funny how catholics ignore distinctions where they appear in clear sight whenever it suits them. they always try to collapse into some delusional monistic conception where obvious inconsistencies are acceptable. truly non-dualistic hinduism/neoplatonism with "Trinity" tacked on as an afterthought.

[Anonymous No.14917534]

>>14917503
>Hence, granted that the Holy Ghost originates in any way from the Son, we can conclude that the Holy Ghost proceeds from the Son.
that's circular, hence fallacious.

e.g. this dinner plate, which i hold in myleft hand created itself, and came from this dinner plate in my right hand, which i was holding just a moment ago in my left.

this
is
garbage.

[Anonymous No.14917537]

>>14917529
lol
now the zealots are telling each other they're delusional.

[Anonymous No.14917548]

>>14917522
>and all of the marks of the Church,
The Orthodox sects are not one, and not catholic. They are a variety of theologically disconnected sects that bear more similarity to the variety of different "Baptist" churches than they do the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.

>So Rome accepts the essence-energies distinction and rejects absolute divine simplicity now?
They're not incompatible with Catholic theology. The essence energies distinction is quite autistic and unnecessary but if someone chooses to conceptualize the immanence of God and the transcendence of God in that way they're free to do so. Divine simplicity is of course a necessary Christian position taught by the Fathers and cannot be denied. Dyers continual misrepresentation of the Catholic position of divine simplicity as somehow being incompatible with divizination (which Aquinas taught) is indicative of Dyers lack of understanding rather than any real blow to Catholic theology. Dyer misunderstands Aquinas and hence he construes an incoherence where there is none.

>are you implying it does not hold of the catholic church to an even higher degree?
The Catholic Church has held to the true faith while holding to the mission to spread the faith throughout all nations while the Orthodox sects have been punished by God for their dereliction of their divinely appointed duty time and time again.

>???
I figured that would be the response. "Show me a heretical Orthodox group where I get to define what constitutes an Orthodox group". Yeah ok. So you just say any Orthodox group that teaches heresy isn't really Orthodox.

For what its worth Kallistos Ware is a far more respected Orthodox theologian than Jay Dyer by many orders of magnitude and he doesn't seem to give a fuck about anything Dyer sperges about like it's absolutely mandatory.

[Anonymous No.14917574]

>>14917501
No problem, anon.

>>14917503
>proceeds from the Father and the Son as by one principle
>It's the same doctrine.
That isn't the Orthodox position. They do not proceed by one principle; instead, the Father begets the Son and spirates the Holy Spirit. These are two truly distinct eternal operations of the Father serving as two truly distinct causes of the respective hypostases. We don't blend the spiration (hypostatic origin) of the Holy Spirit into one action done by both the Father and the Son. This does not mean, however, that the Son is absolutely divided from the Holy Spirit, as He manifests Him eternally. The Son just doesn't provide the origin for His hypostasis, which is the filioquist position that blends the Father's unique role in the Trinity with the Son. Basically the Catholics confuse procession (how the Holy Spirit comes about) with economy (how the Holy Spirit acts in the world).

See pic related (p. 42) from - https://books.google.ru/books?id=DQ75DAAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&hl=ru#v=onepage&q&f=false

[Anonymous No.14917578]

>>14917548
>spread the faith throughout all nations
lmao

[Anonymous No.14917613]

>>14917453
>We're going to throw out the entire tradition of the church because one guy disagrees with it
Absolute retardation.

[Anonymous No.14917616]

>>14917548
>bear more similarity to the variety of different "Baptist" churches
Ok, I concede. I am apostating immediately and joining Francis.
>The essence energies distinction is quite autistic and unnecessary
We are not the ones to decide this. Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit clearly disagreed when they communicated the Scriptures to men. Our common Church Fathers clearly disagreed, do not forget that the Eastern Fathers are your Fathers too.
>They're not incompatible with Catholic theology.
They refute Catholic "theology" by acknowledging REAL distinctions between God's essence and his operations. This is literally what absolute divine simplicity dogmatizes (that God IS his Goodness, he IS his Love, and so on). Divine simplicity and ABSOLUTE divine simplicity aren't the same thing. You cannot have the same theology as Rome while holding to ACTUAL, not "virtual" or merely "perceived due to the limitations of the intellect" differences between God's energies. The only way out is to posit some gnostic invisible communion through submission to Francis.
>far more respected
Materialist respect in this world doesn't matter. He's not a saint or a church father. Anyone who teaches degenerate heresy cannot be Orthodox by definition.

[Anonymous No.14917622]

>>14917613
Meant for >>14917414

[Anonymous No.14917633]

>>14917616
>This is literally what absolute divine simplicity dogmatizes (that God IS his Goodness, he IS his Love, and so on).
All the Church Fathers assert this yes.

>Divine simplicity and ABSOLUTE divine simplicity aren't the same thing
You can't just assert this based on the fact that some people refuse to use your autistic essence energies distinction. Understanding the difference between the transcendental mind of God and the actions of God does not require the essence energies framework. At all. You can use it if you like but it's not a necessary part of Christian theology anymore than Scholastic metaphysics are. They're frameworks to understand certain theological concepts.

>Divine simplicity and ABSOLUTE divine simplicity aren't the same thing. You cannot have the same theology as Rome while holding to ACTUAL, not "virtual" or merely "perceived due to the limitations of the intellect" differences between God's energies
Except this isn't true because Catholic theology does not assert that Gods actions are the same thing as Gods essence despite Dyers retarded assertions to the contrary.

>He's not a saint or a church father
Neither is Dyer, in fact Dyer is a noted denomination hopper and heretic and got taken down by the freaking Dimond Bros of all people to the point he had to hide his head in the sand in shame because they so thoroughly destroyed him.

>Anyone who teaches degenerate heresy cannot be Orthodox by definition.
Ok so why am I listening to you then, heretic?

[Anonymous No.14917634]

>>14917464
Go on you fucking filthy nigger, swallow all the shit and cum that the modern world is feeding you, believe all the lies of the profane establishment and remain ignorant until death.

[Anonymous No.14917638]

>>14913858
people just gonna gloss over this, lmao.
the dude is obviously under influence from bad forces.

[Anonymous No.14917640]

>>14917613
Thats another big problem with Orthodoxy. They desperately try to downplay Augustine so much because Augustine BTFO Orthodox theology on so many points. Once again the Orthodox sects decide to use the Protestant tactic of claiming that Augustine is less authoritative than Maximos the Confessor which is absolutely fucking retarded.

[Anonymous No.14917646]

>>14917638
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRLOQUnw-FY

Dyer got destroyed by the Dimonds.

[Anonymous No.14917659]

>>14917640
>sects
Bro, it's literally the church established in the new testament. Those churches Paul wrote letters to? Yes, some of them still exist in the east.

[Anonymous No.14917665]

>>14917634
>Go on you fucking filthy nigger, swallow all the shit and cum that the modern world is feeding you, believe all the lies of the profane establishment and remain ignorant until death.
You're profane, religiot. God gave you a brain and a pair of hands and you waste it away on absurd stone age religion, preoccupying yourself with the batshit ravings of sad stupid little men who were the crazed establishment of their day.

Do you think this is what the God of a hundred trillion star systems approves of and likes? For you to waste your time utterly?

[Anonymous No.14917673]

>>14917659
>Bro, it's literally the church established in the new testament.
That's the Catholic Church. We're talking about the schismatic Orthodox sects. Also you fucking retards seem to keep forgetting that two of your main sects aren't even in communion anymore. "Hey guys we're the real church! We're One and Catholic!" they say while the fucking Russians decide to split off to make the First Orthodox Protestant Church over worldly political issues. Good one retards.

[Anonymous No.14917678]

>>14917665
>Believing in space
Reddit check?

[Anonymous No.14917698]

>>14917678
hahahaha that's good sarcasm

i mean
it better be sarcasm.. who even knows with these people

[Anonymous No.14917708]

Why are Catholics so convinced that their anti-Christ Babylonian religion is actually true Christianity?

[Anonymous No.14917719]

>>14917698
Science ohmigod daddy fuck my ass so hard ohmigod put the test tube up my boibum. Dadddyyyyyyy yessssss all the upvotes ohmigod I'm gonna cum ohhhhhhhhhhh OHHHH YESSS DADDY FUCK MY BOIHOLE WITH YOUR SCIENCE ROD!!!! HARDERRRRRRRRRR

[Anonymous No.14917725]

>>14917708
btfo

[Anonymous No.14917749]

Unanswered points against the Zealots from yesterday,

Prime: The people in your holy books are unaccomplished do-nothings by comparison to the Greeks and Romans, therefore they have nothing useful to tell us.
>>14912348
>We can also tell how you're lying or how you don't see the point of the comparisons because there are 1,000 more Archimedes, Galens and Hadrians for the 1 Solomon or David.
>Galen, as with other physicians, understood that actually focusing upon the diet and nutrition of the body itself s key to maintaining health and avoiding disease. Prayer may be beneficial for the mind in addition to treatment, yes, but the treatment itself is far superior and the results infinitely more tangible.
Unanswered.


Prima Munda Incorporam:
The Church never learned the lesson of Jesus because they constanstl tortured and killed people for imaginary religious crimes, which is exactly what the Pharisees did to Jesus, therefore the Church (Organized Religion) cannot be said to have even studied properly their own sourcebooks in 1,700 years - or they never really cared about Jesus in the first place.
>>14912348
>then why did the church of jesus do to people what the pharisees did to jesus?
>>14913760
>"then why did the church of jesus do to people what the pharisees did to jesus?"
>Referring of course to the fact the Church and Early and Later Christians were going around torturing and killing people for religious crimes just as the Pharisees did to Jesus. Missing the largest point of the story.
Unanswered.


Derailed into tangent about "Materialism"
and met by insults
>>14913787
>There are actual children posting on this board now, aren't there?

Unanswered response, derailed
>>14913978
>Too bad it's a shit context that draws back to the no dogma for me, all the dogma for you argument.
>>14916963
>what were you saying there?
What was he trying to say? Unanswered.


My last three responses on the thread before derailed into 'materialism' and circle-jerking by religiots,
>>14916943
>>14916945
>>14916963

So far I've been called a Jew and a "Filthy N*gger" :) by Christians on this thread.

>Go on you fucking filthy nigger, swallow all the shit and cum

very christ-like

[Anonymous No.14917752]

>>14917719
Has covid-19 interrupted your medicine deliveries? lmao

[Anonymous No.14917753]

>>14917749
Didn't read lol.

[Anonymous No.14917772]

>>14917698
>‘these people’

O behold the beacon of enlightened tolerance

[Anonymous No.14917774]

>>14908036
>btfo JF
>btfo Matt Dillahunty
>btfo Molymeme
>btfo Malpass

I need someone to find something wrong with TAG. I'm starting to think there really is no way around it and it's either Orthodoxy or solipsism.

[Anonymous No.14917783]

>>14917753
It doesn't matter lol I'm saving the text of this conversation for a book.

:)

I'm just giving you a chance to be civil and defend your ideas..!

[Anonymous No.14917785]

>>14917772
Oh excuse me, hahaha

In this thread I've been debating against so-called Christian Catholics who tell me I'm a Nigger and a Jew, and who don't believe that space exists.

"these people" is right.

I like to call them a basket of deplorables.

[Anonymous No.14917793]

>>14917783
>saving the responses for a book
Translation- posting a screencap on Reddit for my fellow bugmen to wank over.

[Anonymous No.14917817]

>>14917793
>bugmen
Oh you came back! Why don't you have a go at answering the first two points? You bailed on it yesterday.

[Anonymous No.14917831]

>>14917793
Or have a go at answering this one, if you're so interested in talking Materialism.


>>14917430
>Your divide and compartmentalization of "The Entire World" into the compartments of Material and Spiritual is unwarranted (and schizophrenic).
>Who outside of 'religion' influence thinks in this fragmented way where the world is broken into "material" and "spiritual"? Nobody. If you're interpreting the world through this false dichotomy then that's entirely your problem.
Unanswered.

[Anonymous No.14917838]

>>14917774
>>14917774
Attend a liturgy once the virus dies down and see for yourself.

[Anonymous No.14917853]

>>14917749
Are you the same obtuse poster I argued yesterday about the prefix meta-, about how greeks revered egyptians so much and rehashed basically all of egyptian productions? Didn't you leave them unanswered as well?
But don't worry, if you demand an answer about the points you make you'll get an answer as soon as I get home since opening a book seems too torturous to you, right?

>So far I've been called a Jew and a "Filthy N*gger" :) by Christians on this thread.
>Go on you fucking filthy nigger, swallow all the shit and cum
>very christ-like

Open the bible. Open a book for once. It is not the fact of being harsh to such a piece of shit like you that is evil or ''non-christian'' but the fact that you deserve it for this dehumanized behaviour, this dense ignorance you cherish.

[Anonymous No.14917854]

>>14917749
Get a load of this looser.

[Anonymous No.14917889]

>>14917785
90 % of the ‘christians’ on here are identity-confused larpers who do not examplify christian virtue. please realize this.

[Anonymous No.14917910]

>>14917853
>Are you the same obtuse poster I argued yesterday about the prefix meta-,
Yes(!)

> about how greeks revered egyptians so much and rehashed basically all of egyptian productions? Didn't you leave them unanswered as well?
We agreed to disagree I think, re: Meta; since the word has more than one meaning. That's not the same as just ignoring the conversation and pretending one or the other "won", as one the people here has done.

I had said,
>>14911878
>People have tried to make a mystical unknowable thing out of the concept of 'metaphysics' for at least a few centuries. You would prefer your meaning because it supports your cloudy-minded mysticism, I prefer 'my' meaning (which happens to be correct) because it supports my clear-headed objectivism: that we 'can' know things, through scientific reason and study, rather than that we 'cannot know anything' because Adam and Eve talked to a snek.

And your response had been, I notice I said,
"Your response to tell me I'm lying and you can't be bothered with me is cute but it doesn't change anything."
Then you said,
>You only forgot that we were not contending upon the meaning of METER but META.
Proving that you didn't know as much as I did about linguistics :p


Re: Hermetic Plato, I just don't care that much about the subject and it's not relevant to this thread. I already said that if those guys were into 'magic' then I think they were credulous.

>Open the bible. Open a book for once. It is not the fact of being harsh to such a piece of shit like you that is evil or ''non-christian'' but the fact that you deserve it for this dehumanized behaviour, this dense ignorance you cherish.
I don't know what you're talking about.

How can you think that you're a good person or an intelligent person or somehow who lives according to Jesus when you're telling me I'm a piece of shit and that my questions are "dehumanizing" and that my reading and knowledge of pre-christian science (etc) s "dense ignorance" ...?

Rather that Galen and Archimedes are densely ignorant by comparison to Jesus and Solomon - that is a bizarre statement that is easily proved by Galens study and application of medicine vs. Jesus's magic, and by Archimedes laser cannon vs. Solomons magic:
i.e. this is science vs. gullibility

and it ties back point 1 that you don't want to answer,
Here: >>14917749
>Prime: The people in your holy books are unaccomplished do-nothings by comparison to the Greeks and Romans, therefore they have nothing useful to tell us.

It just comes across to me that you know all of this already and that's why you're accusing me of the things your guilty of yourself; ignorance and being a piece of shit and never having opened a book in my life, etc, because you expect me to say these things to you because you know they're true about you.

[Anonymous No.14917914]

>>14917889
I know, don't worry.

[Anonymous No.14918053]

>>14917774
Very based.

[Anonymous No.14918208]

>>14917910
>Galens study and application of medicine vs. Jesus's magic
>some nigger who put tea leaves on your wound to stop bleeding vs a guy who spit on your blind eyes and you begin to see
Nice try, sholmo.
>Archimedes laser cannon
4 real? This nigga says Jesus Christ is some stupid myth, then provides a stupid myth as evidence xD

[Anonymous No.14918424]

>>14918208
lol hello low IQ poster
impressed by magic i know
magic is what makes fun happy time

[Anonymous No.14918446]

>>14918208
we could put it in some modern context here,
re: science vs. dumb religious fanatics

like.. you're saying Bin Laden can fly and destroy whole armies by invoking god

and I'm saying orbital bombardment.

murica.

[Anonymous No.14918458]

>>14917910
>How can you think that you're a good person or an intelligent person or somehow who lives according to Jesus when you're telling me I'm a piece of shit and that my questions are "dehumanizing" and that my reading and knowledge of pre-christian science (etc) s "dense ignorance" ...?
Because you are annoyingly insisting on shown errors. And I will respond to you this last time.

Look at your absurdity:
>'metaphysics' word just means "measuring all" (meta) "nature" (physics), e.g. "man the measuruer of all things,"

you jumped from principles of measuring to MAN THE MEASURER OF ALL THINGS.

>this is really nothing to do with 'Theology
How are the Principles of measuring (read: conditioning) fýsis not concerned with the Divine, the SUPRA-natural?
You resort to Greeks and Romans but ignore their own usage of these words?

Every ancient metaphysical tradition was directed at unchanging and eternal principles, ineffable sources and approached ontology by establishing what is fundamental and primary in reality and on which all things depend.
And by tradition it is not meant minor philosophical sects, but genuine traditions, and, spoiler now, Christianity is one of them.

>>People have tried to make a mystical unknowable thing out of the concept of 'metaphysics'. You would prefer your meaning because it supports your cloudy-minded mysticism, I prefer 'my' meaning (which happens to be correct) because it supports my clear-headed objectivism: that we 'can' know things, through scientific reason and study, rather than that we 'cannot know anything' because Adam and Eve talked to a snek.
For the very reasons I have said and I will tel you again: because the Principle of all reality is supra-rational, you cannot comprehend what comprehends everything, I don't even know how to make you understand something so intuitive and basic. We cannot know the Principle, the Ineffable itself but we can attain it through dianoetic anagoge.
The Fall of Man in the Bible represent precisely this disarrangement of one's soul's composition, and that is why we need to reorder and direct our rational faculty to what is above and not to what we see here below in front of us.
My last response to you as well as my last advise: at least read plato and platonists, jesus christ.


>Re: Hermetic Plato, I just don't care that much about the subject and it's not relevant to this thread. I already said that if those guys were into 'magic' then I think they were credulous.
Imbecile, how many times I need to tell you that the Greeks were hugely influenced by the egyptians in ALL intellectual (artistic, mutho-poetic, scientific - in its original sacred sense obviously, medical, etc) areas?

Finally, just check all the impact of christianity in the medieval world.

[Anonymous No.14918566]

>>14918458
>Because you are annoyingly insisting on shown errors.
You don't make sense in anything you say. This sentence does not read in English.

>And I will respond to you this last time.
If you're just going to babble at me and act superior when you're clearly dumb as fuck.. I don't even really want to bother lol

Hey, I debunked your entire religion in this thread. I mean, good luck. Good luck.

now let's see what you've got..


>How are the Principles of measuring (read: conditioning) fýsis not concerned with the Divine, the SUPRA-natural?
Oh ok that's valid - if I understand what you're saying - sure, in Old World terminology Intelligence and e ability to do things; like Hercules for instance, was considered worthy of being Worshiped and so therefore 'Divine', but this is a pre-reason and pre-thought holdover from literalistic religion itself, which is just primitive slave worship of their local chief or priest:
e.g. I like Archimedes, but I don't believe he's the Son of (a) God in order to like his work.

Where you're coming from is from the slave or plebeian mentality, looking up in wonder at the patrician or archon and being amazed at their competency like a little child is amazed with his dad because his dad can built a horse made of wood, or something. When you become an adult and gain some basic skills you're crazy if you want to be worshiped for it; this is vapid celebrityism and it's why we don't have religions based on Galen or Archimedes and think they're Gods, even though their work was truly miraculous because we know how they did things, whereas only with mystification and mystery are the stupider element of society inclined to think magic tricks are impressive; this is why Jesus's miracles are literally circus acts, rather than real inventions or studies.

>Every ancient metaphysical tradition was directed at unchanging and eternal principles, ineffable sources and approached ontology by establishing what is fundamental and primary in reality and on which all things depend.
Which if you take literally and think refers to circus magic gods instead of early attempts at science, you'll never understand. It's like reading a didactic text but reading it as if you're reading a mysterious magical scroll, it's a small childs error.

> by tradition it is not meant minor philosophical sects, but genuine traditions,
Uh huh. Not sure what you're talking about here, are you saying that the Stoic Intellgentisa that ran the academies and trained up Emperors and Commanders were a minor sect, and that a hand-me-down lot of gypsies blindly copying the words of their grandfathers and repeating their magic chanting somewhere in the desert are superior to this?
....

> and, spoiler now, Christianity is one of them.
Really? Never would have guessed(!)

It's also a heretical sect of Judaism, according to the people whose ideas about God the Christians stole for themselves.


... to be continued

[Anonymous No.14918577]

bump

[Anonymous No.14918598]

>>14918458
>the Principle of all reality is supra-rational, you cannot comprehend what comprehends everything, I don't even know how to make you understand something so intuitive and basic.

And this is where we differ, you'e not 'answering' or 'refuting' what I said, you're just restating it, you dumb ass:

You think we cannot know everything, you think something that can know everything must be a God (see last reply), and I say bullshit you're just uneducated and can't be bothered to study the world or its history to learn 'anything' - let alone 'everything'.

i.e. as i said yesterday,
>People have tried to make a mystical unknowable thing out of the concept of 'metaphysics'. You would prefer your meaning because it supports your cloudy-minded mysticism, I prefer 'my' meaning (which happens to be correct) because it supports my clear-headed objectivism: that we 'can' know things, through scientific reason and study, rather than that we 'cannot know anything' because Adam and Eve talked to a snek.

We disagree here, but you're not refuting 'anything' I've said. Just to be clear.


>the Principle of all reality is supra-rational, you cannot comprehend what comprehends everything, I don't even know how to make you understand something so intuitive and basic. We cannot know the Principle, the Ineffable itself but we can attain it through dianoetic anagoge.
The Fall of Man in the Bible represent precisely this disarrangement of one's soul's composition, and that is why we need to reorder and direct o
This is gibberish.

>and that is why we need to reorder and direct our rational faculty to what is above and not to what we see here below in front of us.
Whereas other religions and the pre-christian virtues tell us to know ourselves, know other people and study the world. You're coming from a point of view akin to smoking dope and looking up in wonder at the clouds.

>My last response to you as well as my last advise: at least read plato and platonists, jesus christ.
Read 'em, mastered 'em, know 'em better than you, bored of 'em.

>Imbecile, how many times I need to tell you that the Greeks were hugely influenced by the egyptians in ALL intellectual (artistic, mutho-poetic, scientific - in its original sacred sense obviously, medical, etc) areas?
This is your stagnant view about study: you think a thing must be written down and passed along for it to enter the mind; you don't get that the point of Platos Cave is to leave that mysticism and go out and experience the world for ones own self and 'begin' to learn from experience itself.

This is why you're still into literalistic religion, literal gods, emerald tablets and snobbery.

>imbecile

:)

[Anonymous No.14918632]

>>14918566
Are you an ESL or just illiterate? Because in fact, you can't understand my point. Everytime I need to repeat myself because of your mental obtuseness. As you yourself admitted, you have difficulties in reading a single sentence, I reiterate my point assuming you're a borderline illiterate person.

>are you saying that the Stoic Intellgentisa...
I was very clear, it is not TRADITIONAL. It doesn't have any traditional muthopoetic metaphysics. Is has no profound metaphysical scope, rehashed ethics mainly from Platonic Virtue (which guess what is intimately bound to the Platonic One).

You're so desperate you are always resorting to different subjects in order to defy Christianity.
Oh the greeks, the romans now it is judaism.
You want to discuss about how Judaism is heretic? About Jesus being the Messiah?

>like Hercules for instance, was considered worthy of being Worshiped and so therefore 'Divine', but this is a pre-reason and pre-thought holdover from literalistic religion itself, which is just primitive slave worship of their local chief or priest:

read this:

>Heracles, the paradigmatic embodiment of the true philosopher, is depicted as
sitting and looking down two roads, that of Vice and Virtue, laid out before him.46 The road which
marks advances in moral, intellectual, and spiritual development (for example, those leading from
the realm of images to the realm of archetypes, and from knowledge of the self to knowledge of
God) requires a mystagogue, the guide upon the road.

>Therefore Heracles (sometimes identified as the Egyptian god
Khonsu, the Phoenician Melqart) is considered as the greatest example (paradeigma) of the
philosophical life, demonstrating how a human being can become a god. Those who have been
educated after the pattern of Heracles are called ‘sons of Zeus’ (Dios paidas), transferred
(methastasthai) into the company of the gods, since Heracles, pictured as the ideal warrior, king,
and philosopher, is viewed by Dio Chrisostom as ‘the savior of the world and humanity’ (tes ges kai
ton anthropon sotera).49
Heracles is designated as a heros theos, a hero-god, to be imitated by philosophers and ascetics.
He is regarded as skilled in prophecy, dialectic, and logic, like Philo’s Moses, who was not a Hebrew
Moses, but rather a Middle Platonist,50 a ‘divine man’ (theios aner), or even a god (theos), whose
divinity is understood as a reflection of the divine ruling power (basilike dunamis).

Isn't all this, all my posts clear that you see things in very a superficial manner? That you are a legit intellectual myopic arrogant person?

[Anonymous No.14918645]

>>14918632
>>14918598
>>14918566
>>14918458
Fuuuu... this some ultra autism level shit.

[Anonymous No.14918658]

>>14918566
>It's also a heretical sect of Judaism, according to the people whose ideas about God the Christians stole for themselves.

[Anonymous No.14918720]

>>14918632
>I was very clear, it is not TRADITIONAL. It doesn't have any traditional muthopoetic metaphysics. Is has no profound metaphysical scope, rehashed ethics mainly from Platonic Virtue (which guess what is intimately bound to the Platonic One).
hahahahaha
>It doesn't have any traditional muthopoetic metaphysics. Is has no profound metaphysical scope,
That's why it's SUPERIOR! It departs from mysticism, that's the point. That's where the natural sciences 'begin' when we stop trying to pray away the lightning storms.

>Are you an ESL or just illiterate? Because in fact, you can't understand my point. Everytime I need to repeat myself because of your mental obtuseness. As you yourself admitted, you have difficulties in reading a single sentence, I reiterate my point assuming you're a borderline illiterate person.
projection. next.

>You're so desperate you are always resorting to different subjects
pffft. ignorance. next.

>You want to discuss about how Judaism is heretic? About Jesus being the Messiah?
Ask a Jew. They'll tell you.

Look up the Disputations in Aragon.

>>Heracles, the paradigmatic embodiment of the true philosopher, is depicted as
Didactic allegories for school children to understand... 'not' set-in-stone literal magical tales about literal magical gods.

You're reading these accounts from a literalistic lens, like a little child would, this is your religion. You hear about the winged sandals or the mirror shield and you think it was a real thing, like a child or a tourist would, you don't see the allegory like a theatre goer in athens or capua would.

>Isn't all this, all my posts clear that you see things in very a superficial manner? That you are a legit intellectual myopic arrogant person?
I would say the same for you.

Also, telling me I'm 'english second language' and arrogant and myopic when its clear that you are is just another example of that projection of guilt I was talking about earlier. Proving that you haven't even bothered to study your own Prophet Jesus who tells you not to be like that; "remove the splinter from thine eye" etc. How can you be so fervent about religion when you don't even pay attention to the teachings of it?

>Philo’s Moses, who was not a Hebrew
Moses, but rather a Middle Platonist, a ‘divine man’ (theios aner), or even a god (theos),
Right, so if we take this seriously we find ourselves with a picture of the ancient Greeks worshiping Diogenes, Archimedes etc, as 'sons of god'- obviously they did not. You need to do a fact check on your sources if you think they're advocating or validating your worship or that of the Ancient World to the local engineer in his workshop or doctor in his clinic.

[Anonymous No.14918755]

>>14908036
The only reason you losers want to LARP as Christians now is because a few years ago memes convinced you that atheism is "cringe" and "Reddit-tier".

[Anonymous No.14918823]

>>14918632
Here, one more thing - actually a really simple argument to prove one way or the other:

Which is the most reliable method to count some dried beans that have been laid out on a tabletop?

1) you count the beans with your hands, eyes and brain, using your practical education.

2) you close your eyes and ask for God to give you the answer, using your theological education.


Which is most likely to result in the correct number beans being deciphered in this scenario? And, moreover, which can we be 'absolutely sure' will result in the correct answer?

[Anonymous No.14918831]

(the ape creatures of the Indus have mastered this.)

[Anonymous No.14918957]

>>14917534
Are you implying that god wasn't perfect from the beginning?

[Anonymous No.14919055]

>>14918720
>>14918823
you didn't get the point, after 20 posts you still don't understand anything of what is metaphysics, theology, what is what you call ''mysticism'', what is tradition, philosophy, etc.

I think the problem with you is more serious than I thought.