/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.14840588]

Let's get a Catholic /lit/ thread going. What are you lads reading?

[Anonymous No.14840595]

>>14840588
The Confessions by Sarah Ruden, one of the best translators of antiquity alive today. Can be found on libgen :)

[Anonymous No.14840610]

>>14840588
A book on penis anatomy, and then a book by an atheist against religion (sort of). Fun times.

[Anonymous No.14840632]

>>14840588
I'm currently reading a large book of Irish fairy tales so I can hopefully make an animated 2D short film concept out of one of them and celebrate by doing some reading for St. Patrick's Day.

Quite pleased to see references to Christianity in a few of them.

[Anonymous No.14840650]

Ulysses
I'm rather intrested in what you guys think of joyce's question of incest
How wrong is it to proritize those who have raised you and loved you from infancy over the rest of the world? When is it too much?

[Anonymous No.14841126]

>>14840588
The Imitation of Christ, I'm trying to read a little at a time so I can properly digest and understand.

[Anonymous No.14841188]

I’m struggling with the concept of hell and damnation. I think of God as a loving Father who wants nothing but good for His children. But then again, why would he send people to eternal hell, far away from Him? It’s seems like a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
I don’t buy the Protestant alternative, though. Child molesters saved by grace alone? I don’t know about that one.
Any Catholicbros can help me? This is killing me.
I also struggle with the concept of terrible diseases and deformities, especially when they happen to babies and little children.
Help me understand, bros. Please.

[Anonymous No.14841601]

>>14841188

I've struggled with this as well for pretty much my entire life. I've come to accept the revealed truth of hell, and have made peace by trusting in Christ. Think of it this way, every person is created for the purpose of loving God, they have a void which nothing can fill except God. It's a sad reality that most people try to fill that void with everything other than God, and implicitly reject him by devoting their existence towards idolatrous ends. We exist for the purpose of coming into relationship with the creator, nothing else can last once this life passes away, and hell is the final state of a failed soul.

[Anonymous No.14841616]

>>14840588
>What are you lads reading?
4channel. I haven't touched a book in about a week.

[Anonymous No.14841636]

I have St Therese Story of the Soul coming in the mail, I've honestly never read her but her feast day is on my birthday

[Anonymous No.14841637]

>>14840588
McInerny's Ethica Thomistica and MacIntyre's After Virtue

[Anonymous No.14841660]

I'm finishing up Newman's Fifteen Sermons delivered before Oxford.

After this I plan to reread the Divine Comedy, which I first read as an undergrad many years ago. I have the Dorothy L. Sayers translation, which is supposed to be the best Dante in English.

[Anonymous No.14841671]

why is god such a jerk in the old testament?

[Anonymous No.14841682]

>>14841671
You fell for the memes. God is often very kind and merciful in the Old Testament, especially when you consider that he forms an explicit covenant with Israel which Israel repeatedly violates and flouts.

[Anonymous No.14841773]

>>14840610
Is there really a full book on just the penis anatomy? I mean, the sexual reproductioin system as a whole sure I can get, but isnt the penis proper super simple?

[Anonymous No.14841880]

I just purchased Augustine's confessions. I havent had time to crack it open yet. Anything to consider before I do?

[Anonymous No.14841892]

>>14841880
Think of reading it as a huge love letter to God and that Augustine doesn't turn down the heat a bit. Tons of rhetorical questions as well. It's actually funny when you start counting them.

[Anonymous No.14841900]

>>14841671
Do you have any examples? Only thing I can think of is the book of Job, which is a parable of steadfast faith. Even then it was Satan doing the evil not the Lord. Every one who God smote in the old testament earned it.

[Anonymous No.14841904]

So what's the deal with this Esau guy? He seems pretty based. Why did God let that cuck Jacob steal all of his blessings?

[Anonymous No.14841927]

>>14840588
Was reading the works of Justin the Martyr
You can see why pretty much none of the neo-pagans follow Hellenic traditions. The Greek and Roman practices are replied to thoroughly .

[Anonymous No.14841960]

>>14841900
>which is a parable
This. Much like Genesis. It isn't to be taken literally.

[Anonymous No.14842106]

>>14840588
Death on the Installment Plan

I plan to read City of God after I finish it.

[Anonymous No.14842218]

>>14840595
good for a first-time reader? or should i start with a different translation

[Anonymous No.14842232]

>>14840588
fuck off christcuck

[Anonymous No.14842235]

>>14841960
if genesis isnt literal then there was no need for theatonement

[Anonymous No.14842236]

>>14842232
begone, heathen

[Anonymous No.14842241]

>>14842218
Yup. Heavily annotated and the English is very clear and modern.

[Anonymous No.14842257]

>>14842241
cool, will check it out

[Anonymous No.14842322]

Anybody else here like Brideshead Revisited? It's one of my favorite books.

[Anonymous No.14842693]

>* [2:4–23] In face of the threat posed by false teachers (Col 2:4), the Colossians are admonished to adhere to the gospel as it was first preached to them (Col 2:6), steeping themselves in it with grateful hearts (Col 2:7). They must reject religious teachings originating in any source except the gospel (Col 2:8) because in Christ alone will they have access to God,the deity(Col 2:9). So fully has Christ enlightened them that they need no other source of religious knowledge or virtue (Col 2:10). They do not requirecircumcision(Col 2:11), forin baptismtheir whole being has been affected by Christ (Col 2:12) through forgiveness of sin and resurrection to a new life (Col 2:13; cf.Col 3:1andRom 6:1–11). On the cross Christ canceled the record of the debt that stood against us with all its claims (Col 2:14), i.e., he eliminated the law (cf.Eph 2:15) that human beings could not observe—and that could not save them. He forgave sins against the law (Col 2:14) and exposed as false and misleading (Col 2:15) all other powers (cf.Col 1:16) that purport to offer salvation. Therefore, the Colossians are not to accept judgments from such teachers onfood and drinkor to keep certain religious festivals or engage in certain cultic practices (Col 2:16), for the Colossians would thereby risk severing themselves from Christ (Col 2:19). If, when they accepted the gospel, they believed in Christ as their savior, they must be convinced that their salvation cannot be achieved by appeasing ruling spirits through dietary practices or through a wisdom gained simply by means of harsh asceticism (Col 2:20–23).
So why do Catholics read Greek philosophers (and take Aristotle's virtues), read theologians, need the Church, have religious festivals, etc?

[Anonymous No.14842702]

>>14841188
matthew 10:28

[Anonymous No.14842734]

>>14842693
because religion is about union and not ratiocination.

[Anonymous No.14842745]

>>14842693

I don't want to play that game where you pick verses from scripture and rearrange them to your own liking, there's obviously a lot within scripture that confirm the Catholic tradition, and it all needs to be understood within the correct context. One thing for example that's consistent within scripture, and 2000 years of tradition is the Eucharist.

[Anonymous No.14842777]

>>14842745
>catholics are the only church that have eucharist.

there's much more scripture that contradicts much of Catholic tradition, that's one big reason why many Catholics don't read the bible (statistical fact btw), and why it isn't particularly encouraged by Catholic priests and leaders.

[Anonymous No.14842779]

>>14842777
the bible is read at mass

[Anonymous No.14842781]

>>14842779
13.5 percent of the Old Testament (not counting the Psalms)
54.9 percent of the non-Gospel New Testament
89.8 percent of the Gospels
71.5 percent of the entire New Testament

[Anonymous No.14842795]

>>14842779
https://www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/frequency-of-reading-scripture/

more than half of catholics seldom or never read the bible

[Anonymous No.14842800]

>>14840650
If you were to truly prioritise them, you wouldn't be fucking them- which is how every normal person who loves their family thinks and acts.

It isn't difficult anon. Get help.

[Anonymous No.14842802]

>>14842777

>Catholics are the only church that have Eucharist

Yes, as far as I'm aware there aren't any protestant denominations that believe their bread and wine is the body and blood of Christ. Martin Luther himself tried to rationalize how it's just a spiritual symbol, and the other "reformers" only took it much further. We Catholics believe in scripture, but we also believe in a teaching magisterium and sacred tradition in which scripture is put into it's appropriate context and understood. Scripture does not contradict the Church, rather your interpretation of the Church's traditions is wrong, or your interpretation of a scripture passage is wrong.

[Anonymous No.14842804]

>>14840588
The Massacre of the Cathars by the Pope and his Henchmen

[Anonymous No.14842812]

>>14842795

Historically most Christians have been illiterate, maybe our religion simply isn't dependent upon an individuals ability to read and understand the entirety of scripture. The gospels are taught through the scriptures, but also through word of mouth, iconography, sacred tradition, the examples of the saints, and teachings of the Catholic Church. None of these are in contradiction with each other

[Anonymous No.14842985]

>>14842795
>more than half of catholics
don't even go to mass, shit stats

[Anonymous No.14843038]

I want to be catholic but I am too heretical, I do believe Jesus Christ is the Logos incarnated, but I also want to keep theurgic practices, I consider Plato divine, Plotinus a saint...

[Anonymous No.14843048]

>>14840595
Interior to Outler.

[Anonymous No.14843058]

>>14841188
An insult against infinite majesty deserves infinite punishment. Even if God pardoned them, their hatred for him would make them refuse it because they love their sin more.

[Anonymous No.14843063]

>>14841900
The LORD gave and the LORD taketh away. The chastisements came from God, he allowed them. Not because he hated Job, but because he loved him and knew this would benefit his spiritual welfare.

[Anonymous No.14843328]

[Anonymous No.14843333]

>>14843328
How'd you find this photo of me?

[Anonymous No.14843399]

>>14840595
I'm still progressing through the Greeks, can I pick this up to read on the side. Or will it go way over my head?

[Anonymous No.14843421]

>>14843399
I'd say so. Augustine does use classical sources as well as the Bible but any modern translation will have footnotes to fill in the gaps of knowledge. Jump right in fren but be warned it is pretty dense but still powerful.

[Anonymous No.14843427]

((reason (metascience (natural, science)), faith (Church (supernatural, Scripture)) Truth)

[Anonymous No.14843465]

[Anonymous No.14843479]

>>14843465
i don't hold it against him, no escapes cause and effect, as long as he tries to internal his newfound faith.

[Anonymous No.14843718]

God says he won't do evil things, like turn your hand into a snake or turn gravity into gravy. What's the epistemological implication here? We know something certainly (100% probable chance) about the universe, e.g. gravity won't turn to gravy. Given that can we determine all events following these non-causalities?

[Anonymous No.14844434]

>>14842985
Except when they're giving shit away! I haven't gone to mass on Ash Wednesday in 15 years because I cannot stand how crowded and ignorant people are; genuflecting to the altar and not the tabernacle, holding hands during the Our Father, not bowing before the Holy Eucharist, even playing on their phones during the homily! I pray for them, but it's so irritating watching so many receive communion when they commit a mortal sin every week by not attending mass. Palm Sunday is similarly frustrating.

My favorite masses to attend are Holy Days of Obligation.

[Anonymous No.14844455]

>>14844434
>mortal sin
if they're unwittingly in ignorance their culpability is reduced, most people aren't catechized very well.

[Anonymous No.14844491]

>>14844455
I don't know how people can think attending mass every Sunday is anything but a mortal sin.
>Thou shall keep holy the Sabbath
Is pretty simple. It's also something that's taught in all first confession and first communion classes.

I can forgive not understanding the significance of Holy Days of Obligation, but the priest will usually(i.e. always) announce at mass that it is required to attend mass on those days on the Sunday before.

I am certainly am not as familiar as I would like to be with my catechism, but these are basic things every Catholic, practicing or non, should know.

[Anonymous No.14844665]

>>14841188
Wondering if any Catholics have a take on this related to Dante and his hierarchy of sins in the Inferno.

[Anonymous No.14844683]

>>14844665
Levels of Hell are not church teaching and just Dante taking a dump on some people he disliked. The Divine Comedy is pretty overrated, I think. Paradise Lost is a much better piece of Christian poetry/epic.

[Anonymous No.14844691]

>>14844683
He was initiated into the Christian mysteries. I can see why you think it's overrated. You have a profane view.

[Anonymous No.14844708]

>>14844691
Profane?! I just dislike people taking his artistic visions as dogma. That's my issue. I never hear anyone do that with Paradise Lost which simply inspires and entertains.

[Anonymous No.14844724]

>>14844708
I mean it as
>3. Not admitted into a body of secret knowledge or ritual; uninitiated.
His levels of hell reflect the levels of heaven that are formed in concentric circles. As above, so below.

[Anonymous No.14844769]

>>14841188
Im orthodox read DBH and that all shall be saved. Hell is a meaningless concept.

[Anonymous No.14844773]

fuck off christcucks

[Anonymous No.14844835]

>>14844683
So, do you think it’s overrated because levels of hell are not church teaching?

[Anonymous No.14844865]

>>14844835
Perhaps I read a poor translation of it, but it just never inspired me the way Paradise Lost did. The imagery and emotion just really drug me in. The Divine Comedy felt more like a political cartoon poking fun of intellectual rivals and the ilk.

I also dislike that many people, despite never having read it, reference the Divine Comedy to support their theological views. It's largely uneducated groups, though. The same sort of people that talk about unbaptized babies and Limbo.

[Anonymous No.14844888]

>>14844865
are you trying to refute St. Aquinas?

[Anonymous No.14844955]

>>14844865
I guess I know what you mean though I’ve never actually heard anyone bring it up in defense of their views. I wasn’t invoking it as much as I was noting that it’s relevant to the topic and the theme of the board.

[Anonymous No.14844965]

>>14840588

[Anonymous No.14845098]

fuck off christcucks

[Anonymous No.14845120]

>>14841188
hell is a choice, those who identify more with the sin than with God will get the sin because the God is always merciful and forgiving, he will give you exactly what you ask. The problem is that choosing the sin means that you'll be intrinsically material and that means spiritual suicide.

the same is true with Purgatory btw, there are those who feel very guilty, they feel unclean and unfit to be in front of God. If He were to be authoritarian He would just force them to come back to him but He is not like that, He knows exactly why those people feel that way and therefore is always compassionate, slow to anger and quick to forgive. So those people are allowed as much time as they want to make peace with themselves, and when they feel clean enough to be with the Father, He'll be there for them.

it's very endearing, like that song, "when the Man comes, there will be no no doom"

[Anonymous No.14845161]

fuck off christcucks

[Anonymous No.14845164]

>>14840588
the Bhagvidas Gita as it is. has anyone here read this?

[Anonymous No.14845173]

>>14845120
From whence did you gather this doctrine?

[Anonymous No.14845175]

>>14845164
yes

[Anonymous No.14845190]

>>14842802
Calvinists and some others believe in a "real spiritual presence" which is not the same thing as transubstantiation but still goes beyond "it's just a symbol".

[Anonymous No.14845762]

>>14841904
Esau was careless and the fact that he was so easily cucked by Jacob proves he was unfit to lead. Do not sell your birth right to (((them))) for a bowl of food. Don't take the ticket!

[Anonymous No.14845778]

>>14844683
Paradise Lost is literally heretical. Milton engages in Arianism.

[Anonymous No.14846840]

Has anyone read any of great works of modern Catholic philosophy? Thomistic works are always good, but I've found it interesting how often phenemenology is present in modern theology.

Homo Abyssus and God without Being are both on my list to read, but their influence from heidegger makes them a bit tricky to read. Was wondering if anyone has experience with these texts. God without Being is apparently the most cited work of post modern theology, regardless of denomination. Rather interesting.

[Anonymous No.14847021]

>>14840588
I just finished "silence". It was really good, though the ending was real depressing.

[Anonymous No.14847030]

>>14841126
same. Great book

[Anonymous No.14847050]

I have the augustinian Meditations waiting on my night table. But I ain't grabbing them for a while until I am finished with other books (that aren't about religion).

>>14846840
Spaemann is supposed to be really good. But finding works of his on-line, or physical copis that were in my economic reach, was impossible.

[Anonymous No.14847936]

>>14840588
There have been numerous times where I've considered converting, but each time I can't help but feel as if the whole thing would be inauthentic. This is not to say that Catholicism is, in itself, as such, but more that I have yet found a way to give myself over to it without also sacrificing the remaining vestiges of my youth and upbringing.

[Anonymous No.14847951]

>>14847021
Now read Samurai. The ending is also quite depressing, but enlightening and beautiful. It made me cry, actually.

[Anonymous No.14848239]

We've had two pope saints in the last 500 years and both were post Vativan II, ever think there might be something to that?

[Anonymous No.14848244]

>>14847021
>good goy deny Christ, that's what he would want!

[Anonymous No.14848249]

>>14840595
>Confessions translated by a woman

[Anonymous No.14848251]

>>14840588
Just read "The River" which was very good.

[Anonymous No.14848284]

I ordered Opening the Bible over a month ago but ti got lost in the mail I guess because it never showed up. I may just order a new copy. Any good recommendations for Marian literature?

[Anonymous No.14848287]

>>14848284
read the former and you won't have any need for the latter

[Anonymous No.14848384]

>>14841188
When my dear grandfather died a few years ago after nothing but a selfless, Christian life, and I witnessed the suffering it caused myself and those around me, I asked the same questions you did. Why does God let us suffer? In searching for comfort I read these articles. They are all well worth a read, but especially the last one, which I find, for lack of better words, to describe essentially the whole of Christianity. I hope you find something to meditate on in these pieces, if not the answers you are looking for. May peace be with you, Brother.

https://www.catholicstand.com/why-does-god-let-bad-things-happen/
https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resources/apologetics/faith/if-god-why-evil
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/why-bad-things-happen-to-a-good-god

[Anonymous No.14848494]

>>14848239
Actually 5 in the last 500 years and 3 after Vatican II, but you should look at who has canonised who, it tells a lot. Plus Pius X who was raging against modernity is also a Saint.

[Anonymous No.14848645]

>>14846840
>influence from heidegger
OH NO NO NO

[Anonymous No.14848673]

>>14846840
>great works of modern Catholic
>modern Catholic
>great

[Anonymous No.14848846]

>>14841660
>the Dorothy L. Sayers translation, which is supposed to be the best Dante in English.
Is it really? Any other readers care to share their opinions on Dante's translations in English? I have asked this before but it doesn't seem to incite much interest.

[Anonymous No.14848897]

>>14846840
>God without Being
>If God is love, Marion contends, then God loves before he actually is.
Absolutely heretical and confused.

[Anonymous No.14848915]

>>14840588
Reminder if you haven't read Sources of Catholic Dogma by Denzinger you're not a Catholic

[Anonymous No.14848922]

>>14846840
Karl Rahner is probably the best modern Catholic philosopher. Richard Rohr is pretty good too, get his book "The Divine Dance" about the trinity.

[Anonymous No.14848954]

>>14844434
>genuflecting to the altar and not the tabernacle, holding hands during the Our Father, not bowing before the Holy Eucharist,
Does your God really require you to go through all these petty rituals? Does he go mad if you, say, bow to the wrong direction or hold hands when you're not supposed to? Does he promise you eternal life if you duly follow through and tick all these little boxes? In heaven will you have to keep doing this forever, or is it all just to get there?

[Anonymous No.14848962]

>>14844769
What's DBH?

[Anonymous No.14848969]

>>14848962
David Bentley Hart. Don't read him. DBH used to be really good but he's gone full heretic and is now a full on Marcionite.

>You ask if I think the YHVH of the Old Testament was “good.” First of all, there is no single YHVH in the Hebrew corpus. The various texts that the Second Temple redactors collated into the Torah and Tanakh emanate from various epochs in the development of Canaanite and Israelitic religion, and reflect the spiritual sensibilities of very different moments in the evolution of what would in time become Judaism. Most of the Hebrew Bible is a polytheistic gallimaufry, and YHVH is a figure in a shifting pantheon of elohim or deities. In the later prophets, he is for the most part a very good god, yes, and even appears to have become something like God in the fullest sense. But in most of the Old Testament he is of course presented as quite evil: a blood-drenched, cruel, war-making, genocidal, irascible, murderous, jealous storm-god. Neither he nor his rival or king or father or equal or alter ego (depending on which era of Cannanite and Israelitic religion we are talking about) El (or El Elyon or Elohim) is a good god. Each is a psychologically limited mythic figure from a rich but violent ancient Near Eastern culture—or, more accurately, two cultures that progressively amalgamated over many centuries.

https://theopolisinstitute.com/leithart_post/good-god-a-response/

It's a shame. Atheist Delusions and the Beauty of the Infinite are really good books.

[Anonymous No.14849046]

>>14848969
so DBH is an anti-semite now?

[Anonymous No.14849260]

>>14849046
Just a heretic

[Anonymous No.14849558]

>>14843465
Its funny and horrific imagining traditinal christian values are the counter culture now

[Anonymous No.14849802]

"Secrets of the Rosary" by Louis De Montfort. Small Devotional books are one of the best ways to learn about/apply Catholic Theology

[Anonymous No.14849804]

>>14846840
Read Hans Urs von Balthasar

[Anonymous No.14850584]

Bump

[Anonymous No.14850604]

>>14840588
BASED!

[Anonymous No.14850625]

>>14840588
Summa Theologica, Aquinas

[Anonymous No.14850630]

>>14840588
In Defense of Christianity by Chateaubriand, a Romantic going against the edgy Enlightenment atheists.

[Anonymous No.14851537]

>>14843328
>vowed religious
>larping

[Anonymous No.14851847]

>>14841188
Hell is the complete absence of God. He does not send you there. If you completely and wholeheartedly reject God in your life, when you pass from this world you enter hell. For even the worst sinner holds a connection to Him as long as they live. However, if once their life is extinguished they still reject God, the connection is lost and they descend into darkness.

[Anonymous No.14851936]

>>14840632
thats because the monks made most of the myths christian and fairy tales are 'only' a few hundred years old
t. paddy

[Anonymous No.14851947]

>>14845120
lol this definitely isn't catholic dogma

[Anonymous No.14852829]

>>14845120
>slow to anger
reading the OT right now and... yikes

[Anonymous No.14853463]

like 10 books at once. everytime i read scripture I have to cross-reference the verses in Knox, the NOAB RSV, and the NRSV all with study notes.

[Anonymous No.14853487]

>>14841188
Perhaps after you die, you become one with God. If you are a sinner, this oneness is intolerable, agony, or hell. If you are righteous, this oneness is eternal bliss, or heaven.

[Anonymous No.14853499]

>>14840588
Well you guy's certainly aren't reading the Bible
https://youtu.be/cjpLdHCMsCU

1 Timothy 3
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
>must be the husband of one wife, having children

[Anonymous No.14853516]

>>14853499
>Steven Anderson
He's a heretic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lwwfCpvXnc

[Anonymous No.14853519]

>>14843328
Is that leather-bound collection of Aquinas's Summa Theologica?

[Anonymous No.14853703]

I plan on getting Opening the Bible by Thomas Merton. Are there any other essential books for a new believer?

[Anonymous No.14853737]

>>14842781
Within three years or one liturgical cycle, yoy get to read the whole Bible

[Anonymous No.14853779]

>>14848969
>oy vey full on Marcionite.
>not a supercessionist
Ok boomer.

[Anonymous No.14853836]

I'm a Mormon and Catholics were the only church who backed me up despite our differences in HS and college so thank you all

[Anonymous No.14854038]

>>14842802
>Yes, as far as I'm aware there aren't any protestant denominations that believe their bread and wine is the body and blood of Christ
You are so completely wrong that I don't know where you got this idea from. Lutherans, Calvinists, Anglicans, and the vast majority of Methodists and Baptists all believe in the real presence. What they don't accept is the Catholic explanation of how the real presence operates (transubstantiation).

[Anonymous No.14854046]

>>14853779
DBH denies that the God of the Old Testament is the same God of the New Testament. That is literally Marcionism.

>In the later prophets, he is for the most part a very good god, yes, and even appears to have become something like God in the fullest sense.

DBH asserts that the revelation of the Old Testament only "appears to have become something like God" and is not in fact revelation of God. That is not supersessionism because even supersessionism fully agrees that the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is the same God revealed by Christ in his incarnation.

[Anonymous No.14854066]

>>14854038
>What they don't accept is the Catholic explanation of how the real presence operates (transubstantiation).
Pretty dumb because contrary to popular belief the Catholic Church did not dogmatise transubstantiation in the scholastic sense. Transubstantiation is merely the position that the wine and bread of the Eucharist are changed substantially into the Body and Blood of Christ. It's simply the acknowledgement of the real presence, the substance of the bread and wine becomes the substance of Christs blood and flesh. Whether or not you choose to understand that in Aristotlean terms is up to you. To underscore this point the Church Fathers use the exact same language despite not being Thomists themselves.

calledtocommunion.com/2010/12/church-fathers-on-transubstantiation/

You can't really deny transubstantiation and affirm the real presence because they're the exact same thing. If you affirm the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist then you're saying the substance of the bread and wine are changed into the blood and flesh of Christ.

[Anonymous No.14854092]

>>14844491
Historically, most Christians didn't go to church every Sunday, it's a modern development. And the Sabbath isn't Sunday, that's the Lord's Day, the first day of the week (Acts 20:7) because it comes after the Sabbath, the seventh day.

[Anonymous No.14854128]

Does Romans 1:20 support empircism?

[Anonymous No.14854134]

>>14854128
No. It supports rationality. People should be able to view creation and say "Hey this really looks like it's designed so God must exist". Hardline empiricists just say "Muh evidence" over and over while blinding themselves to the truth.

[Anonymous No.14854148]

I thought Jesus said that all disciples should proclaim the Gospel, but the Church says laity should not proclaim the Gospel. Why?
http://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/the-mass/order-of-mass/liturgy-of-the-word/proclamation-of-the-gospel-by-the-laity.cfm

[Anonymous No.14854287]

>>14847936
You have to let go of the entire self, the entire ego, all attachments to anything without the filter of Christ. Christ says you have to hate your own brother, mother, father, to be a true disciple. It is necessary to shed the beastly nature entirely and become a new man, and only then will you be reborn in divine freedom, truly free to love those things without personal attachment

[Anonymous No.14854299]

>>14851847
How can God be omnipresent if hell exists?

[Anonymous No.14854389]

>>14840632
What book is it?

[Anonymous No.14854400]

>>14841188
Not Catholic, but I like to think sin as an RPG stat that stacks and decreases depending on your actions, that's how I think of it. If you unholy fucked up, then you're in Hell, if you've truly redeemed yourself and accept God as a concept then you're in heaven, simple as that. And then there's purgatory if you believe in that.

[Anonymous No.14854592]

Anyone have advice for a layman trying to have a more Christ-centered life?
After being a degenerate for the last 10 years or so I'm trying to change myself because at the moment I feel like I'm a hair away from falling into Hell.
Compounding my situation is the fact that I haven't been to church since November, when I tried to commit suicide and then started feeling a deep sense of shame/guilt whenever I went. In addition I have some serious sins in my past that I have not confessed and which make me feel totally worthless and disgusting to even think about.
One thing I want to try is instituting a simple prayer rule and reading scripture once a week. I have a fairly hectic work week as I'm currently deployed overseas, but I want to discipline myself to prioritize observance of at least these few things despite strange hours or lack of sleep.
An issue I run into frequently is that I will have a period of good prayer and observance followed by double the temptation that I had avoided earlier. Often my worst relapses into sin followed immediately after times of faith. I'm slowly reading a couple works (Unseen Warfare, the letters of Joseph the Hesychast, the Imitation of Christ) in an effort to find better ways to guard myself, but I have trouble applying what I read due to a lack of discipline and because I often despair at ever becoming clean again.
Thanks for reading

[Anonymous No.14854689]

>>14854592
confess. go to church. don't read the bible.

[Anonymous No.14854708]

>>14854592
>Often my worst relapses into sin followed immediately after times of faith
Yes, this happens to me too. It means you're being tested and we're being gifted the humility to know what we need Him.

Also, remember that when you give Satan a foothold, it just makes it easier for him to tempt you. Even the tiniest sin is too much, just don't let it into your life. There is no moderation when it comes to sin, so avoid it completely.

[Anonymous No.14854716]

>>14854592

I'm in a similar situation, I recently relapsed again myself after a period of daily prayer and fasting. It's rough, and we're meant to find a wife, but in my case I'm not exactly in a position where I would be able to support a family.

[Anonymous No.14854752]

>>14852829
yeah he's slow to anger in that as well

>>14854299
he's also omnipotent

[Anonymous No.14854759]

>>14848915
the sources is they just made it up

[Anonymous No.14854760]

>>14854752
>he's also omnipotent
How is this relevant?

[Anonymous No.14854762]

What’s the best Bible to get if I’m interested in Catholicism? Are they all the same?

[Anonymous No.14854805]

>>14854760
pretty sure he can choose not to be somewhere or see something

>>14854762
people will say dhouay rheims but it's a meme literally just a worse KJV, there's not much difference between protestant and catholic bibles, catholic bibles have a few extra books but they aren't read from often or very important. If you want to read those books later you can easily find them online or get a catholic bible, but there's really no problem reading a protestant bible, very little difference

Most bible translations are pretty good honestly, if you want more readable/easy to understand language you oftne lose poetic beauty or the exact meaning.

If you want an academic bible that is very accurate and precise go with the NASB (evangelical), RSV or NRSV (pozzed), academics usually use the latter.

if you want a MUH POETICS bible mainly for litererary reasons go KJV but it has a few dodgy verses that most bibles remove and it is almost certain you will misinterpret parts of it because meanings of some words have changed

If you want the above but updated for modern english and replacing thees and thous while still maintaining most of the poetic beauty and being accurate go for the NKJV which is my favorite.

If you want the most common, generic translation that loses some of the magic and is slightly pozzed go for the NIV.

[Anonymous No.14854819]

>>14854805
If God can not be somewhere then he isn't omnipresent by definition.

[Anonymous No.14854825]

>>14853836
Based. What did they do specifically?

[Anonymous No.14854830]

>>14854819
if god must be everywhere then he's not omnipotent, also the bible never says he's omniprescent, it says he knows everything and even then he often asks questions he should know the answer to (he might have been testing people though)

[Anonymous No.14854850]

>>14854830
Omnipresence is scriptural. Nobody can flee God's presence, Psalm 139:7. Solomon states that even heaven cannot contain God in 1 Kings 8:27, and it says in Jeremiah 23:23-24 that God fills heaven and earth. Hell as you defined it doesn't make any sense if God is omnipresent.

Omnipotence is the ability to anything that is possible, meaning God can't contradict himself or logic by making a squared circle. If God is omnipresent then he can't contradict himself by not being somewhere.

[Anonymous No.14854855]

>>14854850
if god can see everything he can choose to close his eyes and not see it, simple as

[Anonymous No.14854861]

>>14854855
We're not talking about seeing you equivocating fuck

[Anonymous No.14854872]

>>14854861
Oh thought you said omniscient, anyway God can be present but remotely watching and shiet, he did that when Jesus was on the cross and turned away from him

[Anonymous No.14854886]

>>14840588
Just finished Brother Lawrence's guide to God's Presence.
Could not recommend more to anyone who is looking at ways to improve their quality of life in everyday affairs.

[Anonymous No.14854887]

>>14854872
You're an idiot, dude. You don't know what omnipresent is but you're still trying to talk. God is said to be present in a sense even at the crucifixion. He has to be because he's omnipresent, meaning present everywhere. Hell cannot be the "total and complete absence of God" if God is present everywhere. Either the concept of hell is wrong or God isn't omnipresent, which contradicts scripture.

What the fuck happened to Catholics on this board? There used to be a better class of people.

[Anonymous No.14854912]

>>14854887
I wasn't the guy talking about hell. Anyway purgatory or whatever isn't biblical and I reckon the souls just go into hell and get incinerated and destroyed since that's the language Jesus in verses like matthew 10:28, don't think it's eternal torture

[Anonymous No.14854981]

>>14854912
Yeah you don't want to talk about hell but you respond to a guy asking a question about hell. Piss off.

[Anonymous No.14854991]

>>14854981
Matthew 5:22 my friend

[Anonymous No.14854995]

Georges Bernanos
Francois Mauriac
Julien Green

3 great catholic French writers from 1st half of 20 century

[Anonymous No.14855001]

>>14854991
I'm not a Christian so why should I care what it says?

[Anonymous No.14855291]

>>14853703

opening the bible is a fantastic work and you will become better than 99.98% of all christians in being able to understand scripture. merton in general is a titan of 20th century catholic thought, the trad larpers on this board can't engage with him because he's lightyears ahead in terms of theology and mysticism. look into karl rahner and cardinal von balthasar too

[Anonymous No.14856062]

>>14854762
Depends on your reading comprehension. If you have a much easier time reading and understanding modern English than quaint English, I'd recommended "The Ignatius Bible: Revised Standard Version - Second Catholic Edition." 22$ on Amazon, which is nothing. If you can understand more flowery langague (thous, thys, ect) Get the Douay-Rheims. Under no circumstance get any Protestant Bible since they removed very important Christian books.

[Anonymous No.14856757]

>>14841188
>>14844665
My personal belief is hell, purgatory, and heaven are plains that can be traversed and that with will and virtue one can work their way from damnation to the kingdom of God. It could take eons to move from a sinner to heaven but you're not eternally dammed. Some may never move from hell to even purgatory because they have no will or desire to atone and progress

[Anonymous No.14856766]

>>14843465

[Anonymous No.14856776]

>>14844769
thanks for demonstrating that you guys are nothing more than fancy protestants and not the true church

[Anonymous No.14856866]

>>14854592
Read Introduction to the Devout Life by Francis De Sales. It was written for laypeople who want to live a more holy life.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Introduction_to_the_Devout_Life