/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.14764162]

What's wrong with Gnosticism?

[Anonymous No.14764173]

>>14764162
Nothing. It's the best religious thought and the one with the coolest lore. Christians are just salty they've been half-worshipping Satan all their lives.

[Anonymous No.14764197]

>>14764162
>Valentinian
based
>Sethian
cringe

[Anonymous No.14764234]

>>14764162
Can someone explain to me the basic tenets of Gnosticism?

[Anonymous No.14764254]

>>14764234
I'm an amateur as well but from a little I've read: The material world is a sort of prison created by the Demiurge (some say to farm the energy from our souls) and our goal is to reach the Monad (the true God) via Gnosis ("knowledge"), which I believe is a form of enlightenment. It goes deeper than that but maybe an expert can guide you more accurately.

[Anonymous No.14764262]

>>14764234
Sophia is the mother of the demiurge and she created mental cool stuff like love and wisdom and understanding. The demiurge, Yaldabaoth (literally son of chaos), considers himself to be the hottest shit around and doesn't recognize Sophia's parentage. So he created the physical world with beings that would only worship him so he can go "lalala there is no Sophia". Sophia however saw how horrible that would turn out if she didn't intervene, so she gave man (which Yaldabaoth may or may not have created to have them worship him) the divine spark so that he may recognize the nature of reality and strive to leave this hellish flesh prison.

Basically anti-materialism.

[Anonymous No.14764269]

>dude what if like God *hits bong* is evil

Gnosticism is the third tier community college dorm-dwelling sophomore of religions.

[Anonymous No.14764273]

>>14764269
The Demiurge is not the true God. The true God is the Monad.

[Anonymous No.14764286]

>>14764273
That's exactly the faggot ass kinda thing I'm talking about.

[Anonymous No.14764302]

>>14764286
And it's correct. Also it explains the massive contradictions between Old Testament and New Testament. And Christ was here to teach us how get closer to God and keep our souls pure but the materialists of his time (the Jews) chose to have him killed. Gnosticism is the final pill of Christianity.

[Anonymous No.14764308]

>>14764302
>seeing the dialectic but picking one side anyways
Not sure if based or just survival-pilled

[Anonymous No.14764315]

The only information we have on it is indirect and a mix mash of papers loosely connect.

Gnosticism today is a recreation that has little to do with Gnosticism in previous era.

Women allowed in clergy.

is usually Christianity for edgelords

[Anonymous No.14764319]

>>14764315
>is usually Christianity for edgelords
I'm sold.

[Anonymous No.14764320]

>>14764262
why is this true and not Catholicism

[Anonymous No.14764321]

>>14764319
>I'm edgy but not edgy enough to maybe risk eternal damnation

[Anonymous No.14764323]

>>14764315
Except all of that is wrong, and you have no idea what you're talking about.

[Anonymous No.14764328]

>>14764302
>Also it explains the massive contradictions between Old Testament and New Testament
so does every single christian apologist

[Anonymous No.14764339]

>>14764162
Jewish mysticism mostly

[Anonymous No.14764341]

>>14764320
>true
I didn't make a judgement on its accuracy. Catholicism is run by the vatican tho, which makes it essentially a pawn of one of the oldest criminal organizations of all time.

Personally I'm not into mongoloid dichotomies like material=evil/spiritual=good, because beer and weed and pussy is a fine ass thing.

Elaborate on how catholicism overlaps and differs from what I wrote.

[Anonymous No.14764344]

>>14764162
It's a lie, a failed Jewish mystical system from the Hellenic transition to Christianity.

[Anonymous No.14764346]

>>14764323
>Except all of that is wrong, and you have no idea what you're talking about.
cope

[Anonymous No.14764348]

>>14764344
>it's a lie because if I consider it true I'm evil in the eyes of my loving god

[Anonymous No.14764355]

>>14764341
>Catholicism is run by the vatican tho, which makes it essentially a pawn of one of the oldest criminal organizations of all time
and this one is true because...?

>Elaborate on how catholicism overlaps and differs from what I wrote.
why be Gnostic over catholic

[Anonymous No.14764356]

Have you read the Dead Sea Scrolls found at the Hagia Sofia? They're a fuckin' snoooooze.

I like the mythos of the universe as some lower God's abortion though. That's pretty hardcore.

[Anonymous No.14764357]

>>14764348
There's nothing incorrect about what I said, and attempts at discrediting me by strawmanning God is really pathetic and possibly dangerous.

[Anonymous No.14764368]

>>14764328
But that's just mental gymnastics. It's more simple and clear in Gnosticism: Old Testament God = the Demiurge. New Testament God = the true God (aka the Monad aka the Absolute). Example: In the OT, God tells Man to be fruitful and reproduce (which goes hand in hand with the Demiurge's intentions), while the NT God tells people not to reproduce (for he despises materialism).

[Anonymous No.14764372]

>>14764357
>possibly dangerous
See?

[Anonymous No.14764375]

>>14764321
Nah. Hell is here. We're already damned. The question is whether you want to stay here or reach Heaven.

[Anonymous No.14764376]

>>14764368
>Old Testament God = the Demiurge
>t. retard

Why do you make that association? Because God does things you don't like? Because you expect him to act a certain way? Read Job and correct yourself or be btfo.

[Anonymous No.14764381]

>>14764341
Are you a nigger? This could explain a lot.

[Anonymous No.14764385]

>>14764372
It doesn't make me evil. God does not will evil big dummy. Evil only comes from good in material form. I.e. from man.

[Anonymous No.14764386]

>>14764162
It's wrong on metaphysical bases.
Why?
It takes Aquinas and his speculation on the Being to understand.
But in the end it's about the necessity to have something that holds the being in itself so that he identifies with the being and by that can create and sustain the existence of other things.
The "I am who I am" of biblical source explained.
Ontology helps to understand the things in play.
From that it takes the creaturalityness of the human being and from that, to follow the right order of the Cosmos, to submit to this truth and follow divine rule.
Gnosticism by negating the true ontology, identify man with God, the old "you will be like God", it does it in different ways, by saying we are divine sparkles, or by saying that we can't lift Maya veil with some process or by some kind of initiation or by acquiring a precise knowledge, it's not that important in the end.
What is important are the consequences you get in reality when a group of fools believes to be God and use its "knowledge" to lead the population to the paradise:a lot of blood, a sea of blood.

[Anonymous No.14764391]

>>14764355
>an organization founded by someone preaching th virtue of poverty
>is simultaneously the richest organization in the world
If you don't see how utterly fucked that is I can't help you.

Also, papal infallibility and divine right of kings is just exoteric speak for
>because I said so, or else

[Anonymous No.14764393]

>>14764344
>system
You've been filtered, pleb.

[Anonymous No.14764398]

>>14764341
>muh vatican is ebil

[Anonymous No.14764401]

>>14764385
>Prime Creator
>didn't create evil

>>14764381
Am I a nigger for not rejecting the material world fully? Well shit, you got me stumped there

[Anonymous No.14764402]

>>14764393
>implying it isn't a system
loooool

you can't filter me i'm the ceo of /lit/

[Anonymous No.14764404]

>>14764376
Because he created the material world and is concerned with material things (some even bugman tier).

[Anonymous No.14764407]

Stockholm syndrome: the thread

[Anonymous No.14764408]

>>14764401
>>Prime Creator
>>didn't create evil
pretty sure you meant mover there chief

anyway go back and read Genesis. just the first page is enough. show me where it says he made evil. now look for the part where he makes *everything in the world* and calls it good. take your time.

[Anonymous No.14764412]

>>14764407
"Christians" worship the devil.

[Anonymous No.14764414]

>>14764404
>material world bad

[Anonymous No.14764423]

>>14764414
Yes. Anything far removed from the purest source (which is God) is increasingly defective and therefore bad.

[Anonymous No.14764427]

>>14764408
>you mean mover
The mental acrobatics. Is he not Lord of All That Is And Ever Will Be? Is he not omnipotent and omniscient and self-created?

>read genesis
My favourite part is when god says that man is become as one of 'us' for knowing good and evil, and now he wants to keep us from immortality, lest we usurp anyone.

[Anonymous No.14764431]

>>14764423
>it's only downhill by the logic of linear spacetime
Sad

[Anonymous No.14764433]

>>14764401
>Am I a nigger for not rejecting the material world fully?
Yes. But also because you sound like one.

[Anonymous No.14764436]

>>14764355
Why be catholic over any other christian sect? Why aren't you orthodox? Or lutheran? Or a mormon?

[Anonymous No.14764438]

>>14764346
>we have no gnostic texts, only fragments
>That's not true, we have numerous Gnostic texts in their entirety and there are several still living Gnostic religions that continue the 2200+ year Gnostic religious tradition.
>C-COPE
LARP harder, Brother Demetrious Popadpopuapouppopuoplus, I'm sure the Pope will call a GRUSADE :DDDD anyday now.

[Anonymous No.14764440]

>>14764431
No, I meant increasingly defective as they deviate from the source (God-Demiurge-Man, to make a simple comparison), not through spacetime.

[Anonymous No.14764441]

>>14764433
And yet you haven't killed yourself, have you?

[Anonymous No.14764452]

>>14764441
No, because that's defeat and not the answer.

[Anonymous No.14764453]

>>14764438
good post

[Anonymous No.14764466]

>>14764162
That it's not Advaita

[Anonymous No.14764469]

>>14764452
So... do you sleep on the floor and go out in one layer of loose clothing no matter the weather and work out 3 hours a day and only eat self-grown vegetables and hand-slaughtered animals from your local farmer? Or do you have cheeto dust on your finger right fucking now?

[Anonymous No.14764498]

>>14764162
You have to suck St.Irenaeus's cock to get into heaven. Something like that.

[Anonymous No.14764502]

>>14764469
What on earth is this nig babbling about? I'm sorry you were born like this but take it easy lol SEETHING

[Anonymous No.14764529]

>>14764502
Lol no I was just asking if you're as sig as you pretend to be

[Anonymous No.14764535]

it a bunch of obscuritanical fairy stories

[Anonymous No.14764538]

>>14764535
Still better fairy tales than Christianity, though.

[Anonymous No.14764632]

Gnomic willing and dialectical opposition are consequences of the Fall and are therefore not fully "natural". The gnostic error is to fall into that very dialectical trap and so they throw the baby out with the bath water. Matter isn't inherently bad but it is in need of restoration.

[Anonymous No.14764641]

>>14764632
>Matter isn't inherently bad but it is in need of restoration.
Top Kek

[Anonymous No.14764726]

>>14764641
Yes, this is the significance of the Incarnation. God, by becoming man, recapitulates (sums up) all things in himself and thereby deifies them. In the Fall, man retained the image of God but lost the likeness. Christ restores the likeness on a cosmic scale.

Also, gnosticism makes no sense because Christ is the Logos, the lamb slain from the foundation of the world. It was he who created the world; Christ is demiurge.

[Anonymous No.14764855]

>>14764162
I like proto-Gnostic systems better. The Demiurge being evil, and therefore all material existence being evil, is absent in proto-Gnosticism. That doctrine is what makes Gnosticism so otherworldly and ascetic. I don't like any philosophy/religion/worldview which turns one away from the world in such an extreme degree. Blessed be moderate poverty and this moment, not total rejection of the flesh and uncompromised focus on the life of the world to come.
The Trinity system of proto-Gnosticism is more profound. In that system, the Second Person is the Demiurge (Christ, Logos, the Son of God). The Third Person, Sophia, is the Holy Spirit, the panpsychic field of consciousness which pervades the material universe. There is no room in such a system for a 4th entity, which later Gnosticism introduces.

[Anonymous No.14764857]

>>14764234

There are no basic tenets. It's blanket term for spiritual study.

[Anonymous No.14764862]

>>14764855
The Demiurge is evil in so far as he's concerned with the material world and away from the source. Not "evil" in any faggot moralistic way.

[Anonymous No.14764901]

>>14764234

The Abrahamic God is the Demiurge, the Hebrews are his chosen.

However, he is not the all powerful god, he is a Godlet that is so angry of his limited power he takes it out on us.

[Anonymous No.14764966]

>>14764438
big cope

[Anonymous No.14764999]

>>14764162
There is no one coherent, "gnosticism," but many different strands, only some of which we know the details of. Most records have been lost to time or were obliterated by conciliar Christians. This is arguably one of the exciting things about Gnosticism: it is not so clearly defined as conciliar Christianity, and therefore modern people can build a new gnosticism without the weight of so much history.

However, the key tenets are:

1. The material world is not a "good" creation as described in Genesis. It is either bad, i.e. made unintentionally flawed, or evil, i.e. made as a prison. The creator of the material world is known as the Demiurge, meaning craftsman, to distinguish him from...

2. The One God, in Gnosticism, is a perfectly good and loving entity and entirely spiritual. Emphasis is placed on his one-ness. All other spiritual beings, known as Aeons, emanated from the one God; usually he is not said to have, "created," them, their emanation is simply a consequence of his existence. Note that emanation is found in Neoplatonism as well, and Plotinus fought mightily to distinguish his system from the Gnostics of his day.

3. In most systems of Gnosticism, the human spirit itself is an emanation of the One.

4. The origin of the Demiurge is not so consistent, but some of the extant texts suggest that he is an accidental emanation of a lower emanation named Sophia. In my opinion, this is the least satisfying component of the whole Gnostic system.

5. The Demiurge was a flawed emanation, either cut off from knowledge of the One or willfully rebellious against the One, and hence desired to make his own realm. He made the material Universe, and trapped certain spirits (emanations of the One) into human bodies. He also controls the material Universe through the machinations of his nefarious minions, the Archons, and humans who unintentionally serve him simply by being material minded fools.

6. Fast forward to ~30 A.D., and one of the higher emanations of the One, known to us as Jesus Christ, decides to travel to Earth in order to save the trapped human spirits by offering us enlightenment. He is duly crucified by people who are threatened by his message.

7. The essentials of his message are that the only way to avoid being perpetually trapped in the (comparatively) hellish material world is to obtain Gnosis/enlightenment, but this cannot be gotten through mere intellectual analysis. It simply comes through, "insight."

The system is intriguing, but the last part makes it somewhat unhelpful, as we don't know a lot of the particulars of what the ancient Gnostics did to obtain their, "insights."

[Anonymous No.14765019]

>>14764162
Where should I start to read about this stuff?

[Anonymous No.14765040]

>>14764999
>The system is intriguing, but the last part makes it somewhat unhelpful, as we don't know a lot of the particulars of what the ancient Gnostics did to obtain their, "insights."
Astral projection, most likely. The way I actually arrived to Gnosticism was by reading about AP.

[Anonymous No.14765049]

>>14764234

It ultimately comes down to discovering the inner light within, that you have a link to the true God beyond this world and all worlds

[Anonymous No.14765059]

>>14764339
This
If you keep looking into it, you will eventually find some kabbalah shit

[Anonymous No.14765070]

>>14764339
Christianity is more Jewish than Gnosticism. Half the "Christian" Bible is literally the Jewish Bible.

[Anonymous No.14765083]

>>14764339

>Jewish bad

Plebbit opinion

[Anonymous No.14765087]

>>14765019
>High in the ineffable and transcendental world of light there existed a primal pair named Depth and Silence. Together they brought forth a perfect realm of balance and creative power, consisting of 30 archetypal forms of consciousness called Aeons. The youngest and most adventurous of these, called Sophia (Wisdom), fell in love with her own royal progenitor, the great invisible king of all, called Depth, and wished to fathom his perennially inscrutable nature. Confused by her love, she cast her glance in various direction from her aeonial seat in the fullness until in the distance she espied a magnificent light, shimmering with sublime grace. In her bewilderment brought about by love, she could no longer distinguish between the above and below and thus came to assume that the seductive light, which was in reality below her, was non other than the royal effulgence of the great king, her father, who resided at the highest point of the heavens. Thus she descended into the abysmal void, where in boundless and fathomless sea of glass the reflection of the heavenly light beckoned to her.

[Anonymous No.14765285]

>>14765083
Fool.

[Anonymous No.14765290]

>>14765070
New Testament, babybrains. Are you even trying?

[Anonymous No.14765307]

It's neoplatonism's retarded half-brother from a Jewish mother.

[Anonymous No.14765396]

>>14764408
>evil is a substance

[Anonymous No.14765402]

>>14764423
So is the material world created by the demiurge or just a weak emmenation from the Monad? Pick one and stick with it

[Anonymous No.14765413]

>>14764726
Based
the question also follow, if matter is evil then how did Christ come as flesh? What is the significance of his ressurection? Gnosticism is only half conceieved bullshit

[Anonymous No.14765613]

>>14765402
I never said the material world was an emanation from the Monad. I simply said anything that isn't the Monad is "evil" (read: impure, defective). The material world is a creation of the Demiurge.

[Anonymous No.14765619]

>>14765290
That's why I said "half" of it, fetusbrains. Only the NT is strictly Christian.

[Anonymous No.14765634]

>>14764341
>because beer and weed and pussy is a fine ass thing
all of that is disgusting and you are disgusting

[Anonymous No.14765674]

>>14764423
>Anything far removed from the purest source

[Anonymous No.14765681]

>>14765087
what they hell does this mean

[Anonymous No.14765683]

>>14765619
Shitmong. If you’re complaining about the Old Testament, how the fuck can you hail Gnosticism as white thought?

[Anonymous No.14765685]

>>14765285

I used to be Jew paranoid too, but I realized that it's a mental illness just like all forms of xenophobia. Jew's do make a great boogeyman, but in reality they're just a nomadic people who stood out in Christian Europe have often been the scapegoat any time something bad happened.

[Anonymous No.14765687]

>>14765674
>Plotanus
The vomit of Plato.

[Anonymous No.14765694]

>>14765683
Tell me where I said it was "white thought", you colossal faggot.

[Anonymous No.14765696]

>THERE IS DEFINITELY ONE GOD BECAUSE ____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
>LOL HAHAHA

[Anonymous No.14765701]

>>14764162

[Anonymous No.14765702]

>>14765685
>this board has more resident jews than even /pol/
>they type comments like this

[Anonymous No.14765707]

>>14765696
don't you have post to upboat, bugman? why even fag around in a thread you're not interested in? kek

[Anonymous No.14765718]

>>14765396
nigga God is a substance in Western Christianity

[Anonymous No.14765723]

>>14765694
>Christianity is more Jewish than Gnosticism.

[Anonymous No.14765728]

>>14765687
Would you like to hear the same from Trismegistus? Or the new testament? Or from Hegel? Or perhaps Pseudo-Dionysius? Maybe you prefer Shankara or the Rig Veda? Orpheus? Or 4000 year old Egyptian Hymns?
Fuck off heretic of all wisdom, outcast of every revelation.

I am he who makes himself into millions.

[Anonymous No.14765736]

>>14765723
Yes, I meant religiously Jewish. Half the so-called Christian Bible is literally just the Jewish one, why? I don't know.

[Anonymous No.14765737]

>>14765728
holy based...

[Anonymous No.14765739]

>>14765702

I'm not Jewish, I'm a quappa mutt

[Anonymous No.14765741]

>>14765728
delusional faggot

[Anonymous No.14765757]

>>14765741

[Anonymous No.14765760]

Brother, please expand your mind's eye. The perennial Truth shows itself in different ways through different times and peoples. Should you want to walk the path of the Enlightened, Guénon (pbuh) extends his hand for you. The question is, will you accept it?

[Anonymous No.14765789]

>>14765757
>>14765741

[Anonymous No.14765800]

>>14765760

I need to finish introduction to Hindu theology, babby steps..

[Anonymous No.14765805]

>>14765760
>demiurgic worshipping but now with sandniggers
I pass.

[Anonymous No.14765947]

>>14765694
>>14765723
>how Jewish is Christianity really?
This topic is so fucking interesting to me. It's a god damned rabbit hole.

>Satan, evil
from Jewish intellectual circles in the first few centuries BC
from the Babylonian captivity and exposure to Eastern religions
original source: Zoroastrian
>afterlife, active life after death beyond mere darkness and oblivion
adopted from Hellenistic influence, Hades
original source: Greek
>the Son of God is the Logos, the maker of all things seen and unseen
from Hellenized Jewish philosophy in Alexandria in the first and second centuries BC, ex Philo
from Stoic Logos
original source: Greek
>the Trinity
from Stoic physics
the Father = Ousia, Being, passive existence
the Son = Logos, active rational ordering principle
the Holy Spirit = Pneuma, breath of life, soul, consciousness
original source: Greek
>language
New Testament entirely written in Greek
>Jesus's appearance
beard, long hair follow the trope of the Charismatic style of Greek philosopher / wise man
depictions of Jesus in this manner appear in emulation of Greek philosophers, more than two centuries after his death
oldest depictions of Jesus portray him as a beardless youth in the style of a classical Greek hero

[Anonymous No.14765973]

>>14765947
>adopted from Hellenistic influence, Hades
Not sure if the afterlife comes from Greek, though. In Christianity, afterlife means Heaven basically. Hades would be like Hell, which is the opposite.
>beard, long hair follow the trope of the Charismatic style of Greek philosopher / wise man
As we know, the Greeks invented beards.

[Anonymous No.14765988]

>>14765947
So 50% of Christianity is Greek and 50% is Jewish?

[Anonymous No.14765992]

>>14765973
>the Greeks invented beards.
Beard with civilization, yes.
Obviously not counting pre-bronze age dark ages.

[Anonymous No.14766066]

>>14765992
sumerians got you beat
>>14765947
most of those the Greeks took from the ancient Egyptians. They even state this themselves.

[Anonymous No.14766151]

>>14765396
l2read fatty. evil literally does NOT have a substance, because every material thing in creation is Good.

[Anonymous No.14766263]

>>14765988
Pretty much. Jews got Hellenized, became impressed with Greek philosophy and jealous their own cultural traditions lacked such intellectual sophistication, and finally adapted Greek philosophy to their native lore.
By merging abstract philosophy and their native folklore they created a philosophical narrative, a tangible story with human elements which could be retold and developed upon. This is why Christianity was more successful than Neoplatonism or Stoicism.

It's for these reasons I no longer agree that "Christianity is a Jewish religion." The pagan/muslim/atheist/jewish quip against Christians that "you worship a Jew" is also inconsistent with the Christian doctrine that Jesus was God, the incarnation of the Logos, who had existed from the beginning and had created all things. Including Jews.

[Anonymous No.14766298]

>>14766263
>It's for these reasons I no longer agree that "Christianity is a Jewish religion." The pagan/muslim/atheist/jewish quip against Christians that "you worship a Jew" is also inconsistent with the Christian doctrine that Jesus was God, the incarnation of the Logos, who had existed from the beginning and had created all things. Including Jews.

Too big of a brainlet to recognize the dual nature of Christ, and that while he was indeed eternal and divine, he was also born to Jewish parents.

[Anonymous No.14766306]

>>14764173

/thread

Christians have been worshiping evil and decay for the past 2000 years and still dont seem to be able to understand how the world is so fucked up or what part they played in the whole thing. Same goes for jews and muslims, abrahamic religions were a psyop from the start and nobody was the wiser

[Anonymous No.14766361]

>>14765613
So something that is wholly and entirely good in itself produces only evil. Something that is pure goodness can do nothing but evil. Sounds retarded desu

[Anonymous No.14766379]

>>14766151
Then evil was not "created" dumb ass

[Anonymous No.14766380]

>>14766298
ok true
but "your God chose to incarnate himself as a Jew haha" is a blunted insult compared to "you worship a deified Jew"
he is more of a Jewified deity

[Anonymous No.14766388]

>>14766361
The Monad is a plenitude that overflows. the fact that one of the beings that emerged from it chose to do evil doesn't contradict the perfection of the Monad. The Monad isn't a craftsman who plans out and makes things. it is in perfect contemplative repose and that contemplation produces an overflow of power which produces indirectly lower levels of reality. It's fairly similar to Neoplatonist conceptions. The Monad neither begat nor created the evil Demiurge in any sense of those terms.

[Anonymous No.14766393]

>>14766298
Christ's human nature was universal which is the basis for the resurrection of all. He didn't receive his human nature from his mother.

[Anonymous No.14766414]

>>14766393
You're jewish if you come out of a jewish womb. This is their doctrine. Sure, I'll accept the expanding of his person to universality but to deny his jewishness is full cope.

[Anonymous No.14766415]

>>14766388
There doesnt need to be a deliberative and selfaware act of Creating for my point to stand. If all that is not the Monad is evil then all that "overflows" from the Monad is evil. If the nature of the Monad is to be a plentiude which overflows, and the act of overflowing produces nothing but evil, then the act of its Being is evil. This is a contradiction to its characterization of being totally Good

[Anonymous No.14766419]

>>14766393
>He didn't receive his human nature from his mother.
Protestants, everyone.

[Anonymous No.14766438]

>>14766419
I'm Orthodox. This is basic christology. Christ assumed a universal, impersonal human nature. His mother is truly his mother but the nature he assumed has its source in the Logos not another human.

[Anonymous No.14766461]

>>14766438
Jews have a different view. I wonder who is right. The originals or the LARPers.

[Anonymous No.14766466]

>>14766438
Well you are retarded as a Protestant.

Monophysite nonsense. Repent, and speak to a priest so he can educate you and stop you from spreaking about holy things uninformed. Jesus was wholly divine and wholly human. Giving priority to the divine "part" or even suggesting it was "part" of him and not both are equally true is blasphemy and yea buddy enjoy perdition.

[Anonymous No.14766497]

>>14766466
>Jesus was wholly divine and wholly human.
Yes, two natures and two wills in one hypostasis. Nothing I said should suggest otherwise. Read St. Cyril. You're obviously very confused about this.

[Anonymous No.14766565]

>>14766497
There is a sole subject in the person of Christ which is the Logos. There is no man Jesus but the God-man Jesus.

[Anonymous No.14766568]

>>14764302
>massive contradictions between OT and NT
Stop this stupid meme. The God of the NT is just as brutal. No one talks more about Hell than Jesus in the Gospels. In Acts the Holy Spirit kills two people for withholding money from the commonhold. In Revelation Jesus returns WITH A SWORD COMING OUT OF HIS MOUTH and people are so frightened of his wrath that they want the mountains to fall on top of them to hide

[Anonymous No.14766583]

>>14766568
Sounds gay. This is why I became an atheist in the first place.

[Anonymous No.14766601]

>>14766583
>why god mean :(

[Anonymous No.14766637]

>>14766601
No, not God. More like why is the Bible and Christianity so goddamn faggy and contradictory. At least Gnosticism tries to do something cool. Christianity is just half-baked Judaism + pedos in its Catholic branch.

[Anonymous No.14766664]

>>14766637
>At least Gnosticism tries to do something cool.
Only if you have an adolescent taste in "cool"
Its mythology is the most retardedly arbitrary shit imaginable and its theology is like some shit cross over episode.

[Anonymous No.14766672]

>>14765685
>Mental illness
>Philo-semite
Yup, checks out.

[Anonymous No.14766673]

>>14766415
>. If the nature of the Monad is to be a plentiude which overflows, and the act of overflowing produces nothing but evil, then the act of its Being is evil.
Not really. Aeons for instance aren't as defective as the Demiurge. Nor was Christ.

[Anonymous No.14766692]

>>14766673
I'm assuming the premise of this post>>14765613
It says all that is not the Monad itself is evil.
Every Gnostic thread we have I encounter a unique interpretation of the thought and try to work through it. It seems to me that Gnosticism is just an attempt at solving the problem of evil, but from what I've seen so far, it just makes it more complex and elaborate.

[Anonymous No.14766705]

>>14766664
Yet it's still better than (((Christianity))), which is a terrible crossover with Judaism. Gnostic mythology is superior in every way. It aims for holy knowledge as a means for the salvation of your soul, instead of muh flesh sacrifice muh guilt, as if there's merit in that. Christianity is the weak man's religion.

[Anonymous No.14766716]

>>14766692
Gnosticism isn't a system but a collection of ideas and beliefs, just like The Bible isn't a book but a collection of books. Just like Christians have numerous denominations and beliefs, so do Gnostics.

[Anonymous No.14766719]

>>14766705
>Christianity is the weak man's religion.
lol

[Anonymous No.14766733]

>>14766719
Fools outnumber the wise, just like in democracy.

[Anonymous No.14766737]

>>14766705
>terrible crossover with Judaism.
Its an organic development from it
The rest of your post is a disgustingly ignorant understanding of both Christianity and Gnosticism projected through a lense of an abominably misunderstood Nietzsche, all with the overtones of /pol/ venom. My advice is to read actual theology before making an ass of yourself further

[Anonymous No.14766745]

>>14766716
Thats fine and i'm happy to work through all of them. Whats your opinion on anons statement that "all that is not the Monad is evil"

[Anonymous No.14766819]

>>14764197
this

[Anonymous No.14766829]

>>14764162
Jews.
>don’t reproduce goy, meanwhile Israel subsidizes children

[Anonymous No.14766847]

>>14764162
Absolutely nothing is wrong with gnosticism.

[Anonymous No.14767004]

Jehovah is the demiurge. A satanic machine-like being which is worshipped by robot animal men.

[Anonymous No.14767021]

>>14766829
All this proves is the Jews were tricked by the demiurge. He's their "chosen" people after all.

[Anonymous No.14767031]

>>14766829
This. Daily reminder that Jews have always been promoters of heresy (gnosticism/arianism/islam) for the gentiles. Jews have never at any point in history been sympathetic to Christian orthodoxy.

[Anonymous No.14767045]

>>14766672

>not having an obsession with jew's makes you a philo-semite

Just to let you know I'm also pro Palestine

[Anonymous No.14767049]

>>14767031
Half the faith you so fervently defend is Judaist in nature. If you follow the OT you are JEW'D.

[Anonymous No.14767238]

>>14764262
So is Sophia good deity? And I’ve heard she is the wife of Jesus is that true

[Anonymous No.14767438]

>>14766568
>In Revelation Jesus returns WITH A SWORD COMING OUT OF HIS MOUTH and people are so frightened of his wrath that they want the mountains to fall on top of them to hide
Wow, that's a cool ass imagery if you ask me
>mfw now I wanna read Revelations, kek.

[Anonymous No.14768017]

>>14764262
This is inaccurate, Yaldabaoth isn't intentionally deceptive or rebellious, it's that he himself is ignorant of his true nature.
That's why his symbol is a lion's head with a snake's body.

[Anonymous No.14768041]

>>14765413
Why is this thread so full of retards?
You're accrediting Catholic dogma to gnostics and then claiming their system is half-conceived because it contains contradictions THAT YOU INJECTED INTO THEIR SYSTEM.

[Simon Magus !!B6w9tJAyfF8 No.14768043]

>>14768017
It depends, as people have pointed out in this very thread Gnosticism wasn't a singular movement. Some of the sects viewed the Demiurge as downright malevolent.

[Simon Magus !!B6w9tJAyfF8 No.14768052]

>>14765413
Most of the Gnostic schools reject the notion of Christ being flesh and also of a bodily resurrection.

[Anonymous No.14768062]

REEEE


i need books about!

[Anonymous No.14768081]

>>14768043
That came later after Jesus failed his mission.

[Anonymous No.14768150]

>>14764376
>Read Job
Read Jung's Answer to Job. You've completely missed the point if you side with the old testament God after reading Job. You're comitting the same mistake Elihu and Job's other compatriots made when you defend Him and handwave the immorality of God away with the "He works in mysterious ways" excuse.

YHWH is the antagonist of the Book of Job, Job is morally upright and did nothing wrong. The events of Job eventually culminate in the emergence of Christ. Jesus is the emergent force that compensates for YHWH's amoral, destructive attitude toward man and reconciles it with his desire to remain just in man's eyes.

[Anonymous No.14768195]

>>14768150
morality is a spook
you're talking about how you wish the world was, not how it is.
>Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth?

[Anonymous No.14768241]

>>14768195
I don't get what you're trying to say. Generalities don't help us understand you, anon. Pls elaborate.

[Anonymous No.14768263]

>>14768241
Your analysis is absurd and has nothing to do with reality because you are using moral language to describe a situation that is actually about power, both creative and destructive.
God vs man is not a moral battleground. In fact there are no moral battlegrounds at all. That isn't the type of world this is. The "more moral" isn't owed anything, except perhaps in our hearts. The world as such could not care less.
Thus God has no need to "compensate" for his attitude, least of all in the eyes of his own creation. The entire point of his speech to Job is pointing out that Job (and by extension humanity) is insignificant compared to God.
I've noticed a lot of moralfags tend to try and veil their own hubris with highfalutin language about justice and idealistic nonsense like that. Your ideals of justice and morality are actually evil because it's an underhanded attempt to export your hubris to others and cloud people's eyes from how the world really is.
There's nothing just about this world and God doesn't owe man anything.
This isn't an apology for the state of things, it's simply an acknowledgement of how things are.

[Anonymous No.14768336]

>>14768263
>good faith reply
Honestly impressed. Rare to see genuine engagement on this board. I'm gonna attempt to mount a defense for the point of view I originally set out.
>God vs man is not a moral battleground.
This is apparently your presupposition. The God both in the old and new testament is preoccupied with the moral stance, though much moreso in the OT - which is partly the starting point for Jung's point of view.
>The "more moral" isn't owed anything, except perhaps in our hearts. The world as such could not care less.
Asserting this regarding the OT is in stark contrast to ANY reading of the judeo-christian tradition, save perhaps the gnostics. I think this is plainly false and predicated on your own heterodox reading - which I'm not necessarily against as an idea, but I think has all the evidence mounted against it as an intepretation of the biblical view of reality. It's also an odd choice to point to the Book of Job as evidence of it, when it's much more apparent in Ecclesiastes.
>The entire point of his speech to Job is pointing out that Job (and by extension humanity) is insignificant compared to God.
Then the rationale for saving humanity by way of Jesus' sacrifice disappears. This is addressed by Jung, so I'll let him speak on this point:
>"To take the most obvious thing, what about the moral wrong Job has suffered? Is man so worthless in God’s eyes that not even a 'tort moral' can be inflicted on him? That contradicts the fact that man is desired by Yahweh and that it obviously matters to him whether men speak “right” of him or not. He needs Job’s loyalty, and it means so much to him that he shrinks at nothing in carrying out his test. This attitude attaches an almost divine importance to man, for what else is there in the whole wide world that could mean anything to one who has everything? Yahweh’s divided attitude, which on the one hand tramples on human life and happiness without regard, and on the other hand must have man for a partner, puts the latter in an impossible position."
>This isn't an apology for the state of things, it's simply an acknowledgement of how things are.
Again, this supposed 'acknowledgement' of the 'way things are' is predicated on immorality as a fundamental property of reality. It needs further justification, otherwise the moralist reading is just as valid.

[Anonymous No.14768366]

>>14764162
esotericism

may as well be trendy flypaper to nihilists

[Anonymous No.14768400]

>>14768336
I am gnostic so that explains why you perceive my reading as such.
And I would say the god of the old testament is preoccupied with the law moreso than any moral stance. How you believe law and morality intertwine is a somewhat different topic but to me there is no necessary relation.
Maybe this is tedious to point out but I am not claiming that reality is immoral I claim that it's amoral. Though sometimes I do wonder...
I also wish to remark that Jung's characterization of Yahweh as abusive yet attached sounds sadosexual to me. It's a very human characterization.

[Anonymous No.14768472]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Marcion, though much of what he apparently said has been discussed in some form.

The Old Testament God, the Demiurge is not the all-knowing, forgiving God of the New Testament, that is Monad. Jesus was a manifestation of Monad who provided a way to escape the Demiurge.

This duality of materialism vs spirituality is played out as Satan vs God in mainstream Chiristianity, but even the carefully chosen books of the NT to avoid the obvious differences of each testament's God, it doesn't quite add up. Both God and Satan's roles are very different, and likewise the Jewish interpretation of Satan not turned completely against God but is more of a neutral questioning figure (like in Job).

Now obviously the Jews aren't going to accept the further gnostic step in that their God is imperfect, not all knowing, wrathful and essentially the real Christian Satan, but his inability to see where Adam and Eve are as he walks about in the garden, his cruelty to Job, his tempting of Abraham, his nonsenical favours to Joshua, Saul vs David, etc all indicate a God fare from omniscient and all forgiving, and more of a materialist relishing his world and his Jewish playthings.

Now obviously Jesus did not care for material posessions, did not care for hierarchy and basically wanted people to accept him and his "Father", try to live good lives not giving in to deeds that will ruin the soul.
Oviously words have been put into his mouth in the Gospels, so that things like churches could be built, traditions could still be kept, people could still keep their wealth etc, but nothing he actually did or the core of the overarching message from all of the gosepls indicates that Jesus wanted a Jewish-supremacist world based on covenants and convulate materialist tradition.

Marcion rejected the old testament and much of the new, because it was there clearly to establish an order, a religion, not actual salvation.

Gnosticism isn't really a set way because we don't know that much about the early steps, but that duality becomes more visible the more you compare the testaments and the bizarre origins of hell and heaven and the modern view of satan, who happens to look like an old Babylonian/Jewish/middle-eastern god like baal or moloch, it's the lost admission that the evil is what people once worshipped.

[Anonymous No.14768561]

>>14768400
>I am gnostic so that explains why you perceive my reading as such.
You should probably do well with Jung, then, if you're interested in material in the intersection of metaphysics / psychology. He incorporates quite a bit of gnostic elements, though a lot of it might come off as heretical if your approach to religion is more dogmatic. I think he has a more prosaic work called "Seven Sermons to the Dead". Haven't read it yet myself, but it apparently expands on gnostic mythology.
>And I would say the god of the old testament is preoccupied with the law moreso than any moral stance. How you believe law and morality intertwine is a somewhat different topic but to me there is no necessary relation.
This doesn't seem to have any bearing on Jung's view whether you call it morality or law - it's an irrelevant property since the relations between man and God, and what he thinks of as the nature of God remain the same.
>Maybe this is tedious to point out but I am not claiming that reality is immoral I claim that it's amoral.
My bad, I meant amoral. Wrong terminology. I was thinking of your objection as "opposing a moralistic reading" and just slapped on the 'im-' without regard for the meaning.
>I also wish to remark that Jung's characterization of Yahweh as abusive yet attached sounds sadosexual to me. It's a very human characterization.
It is human, but for the reason that YHWH is presented as a divine entity with human emotion:
>After the LORD had said these things to Job, he said to Eliphaz the Temanite, "I am angry with you and your two friends, because you have not spoken the truth about me, as my servant Job has. [Job 42:7]
Note the emotional expression - part of what I assume must've been Jung's rationale for the psychologization of God. Not to mention the whole "man being created in the image of God" thing - but interpreted in reverse. The idea of the Biblical God as undertaking an internal dialectical process through the judeo-christian mythos and actually changing His present nature through "time" remains consistent to me.

[Anonymous No.14768573]

>>14768561
ESL nature apparently kicking in, forgive the grammar

[Anonymous No.14768840]

>>14766066
Curly beards don’t count. Beards must be wavy and generally straight.

[Anonymous No.14768888]

Read Etienne Couvert.

[Anonymous No.14769064]

>>14766461
Wasn't Abraham part of pharah's family?

[Anonymous No.14769073]

what happened to the based schizo warasu gnosis poster

[Anonymous No.14769212]

>>14766066
>Obviously not counting pre-bronze age dark ages.
Can't you read or do you not know history?

[Anonymous No.14770223]

Can someone explain the anthropic principle? I don't get it.

[Anonymous No.14770231]

>>14770223
more like the egocentric fallacy

its basically holding the axiom "I exist" and working backwards, therefore any explanation of anything must allow for me to exist

[Anonymous No.14770382]

I see in no way how the chicken snake hermaphrodite of eternity conflicts with Christ's teachings.

[Anonymous No.14771663]

>>14764386
>Gnosticism by negating the true ontology,

because you call it so right, catholic

[Anonymous No.14771670]

>>14764441
>>14764469
Do you understand that suicide isn't the same as enlightenment? You are being ignorant.

[Anonymous No.14771692]

>>14765728
The material world is imperfect therefore removed from the source, which is Fullness, and has no defect.

[Anonymous No.14771705]

>>14766388
>the fact that one of the beings that emerged from it chose to do evil doesn't contradict the perfection of the Monad

The reason you said why is not a justification or argument. So yes, it is.

[Anonymous No.14771715]

>>14771692
How is the material world imperfect?

[Anonymous No.14771732]

>>14771715
The sowing of the spiritual seed into Man caused him to utter things "superior to what his modeling justified", a fullness beyond the ignorance and finite nature of the material.

[Anonymous No.14771754]

>>14771732
What about the Law of Conservation of Mass? Does it destroy gnosticism?

[Anonymous No.14771766]

>>14771754
Why do you think it might destroy gnosticism?

[Anonymous No.14771773]

>>14771766
How is matter finite? The whole thing is about quantity, which is inherently a materialistic concept

[Anonymous No.14771792]

Which Nag Hammadi translation is the best?

[Anonymous No.14771796]

>>14771773
Firstly, I am talking about the nature of impernanence and the fact that the material world is subject to decay. Reality as we know it has no spatial curvature. It is flat and space time is considered infinite. Revelations in science concur with the view of the Gnostics, that appearance is illusion, since Rutherford proved that atoms were majority empty space.

I suggest reading up on the tale of sophia and gnostic cosmogny, it's elucidated much more eloguently than what I can do.

[Anonymous No.14771834]

>>14771796
Thanks for the recommendation. Wouldn't cycles be more appropriate than decay? After all, fungi eat dead plants and give life to new ones by providing fertile ground

[Anonymous No.14771839]

>>14771834
Sure, negative entropy as you might prefer to say.

[Anonymous No.14771854]

>>14764197
No love for this post? Tomberg should be taken more seriously, his theology is about as erudite as they come

[Anonymous No.14771859]

>>14765040
Care to share a bit?

[Anonymous No.14771899]

>>14764162
It's heretical

[Anonymous No.14772160]

>>14771899
You know what else was heretical? Advancements in medicine until the 1600's.

[Anonymous No.14772193]

>>14772160
cope

[Anonymous No.14772222]

>>14764162
>What's wrong with Gnosticism?

Taken literally it's nonsensical.

Taken metaphorically it's not isomorphic with reality.

[Anonymous No.14772269]

>>14772222
Quads of truth just demolished the entire thread.

[Anonymous No.14772280]

>>14772222
Holy based...

[Anonymous No.14772281]

>>14772222
>I cant substantiate or explain any claims
>but like dude metaphors lmao

[Anonymous No.14772283]

>>14772222
based post

[Anonymous No.14772333]

>>14772280
>>14772283
>>14772222
cringe cathcucks

[Anonymous No.14772362]

>>14765059
What is kabbalah actually, and does anybody actually practice it unironically

[Anonymous No.14772365]

From the occult thread.

[Anonymous No.14772498]

Harold Bloom essay from the Meyer edition of The Gospel of Thomas:

http://ww3.haverford.edu/religion/courses/222a/BloomGT.pdf

[Anonymous No.14772571]

>>14768561
>>14768400
thanks for the discussion lad
>>14768573
your english is at passing academic-level, so excellent. are you nordic?

[Anonymous No.14772628]

>>14768263
Mfw God is now, Lovecraftian.

[Anonymous No.14772685]

everyone in this thread needs to read maximus the confessor

the end. goodbye.

[Anonymous No.14772780]

>>14772571
>are you nordic?
Yeah lol. Impressive observation (or wild guess?)

[Anonymous No.14772841]

>>14764234
Watch the matrix

[Anonymous No.14772846]

>>14764286
>Plato, Aristotle, Mellisus, and Plotinus are all bongheads
Ok richard dawkind

[Anonymous No.14772860]

>>14772846
Plato literally said the demiurge is the ultimate creator of all and is good by nature you ignorant faggot

[Anonymous No.14772967]

Gnosticism leads you into some rather dark imaginations. God is God and He is a good God. This will try to turn evil into good and good into evil. Also without any kind reconciliation with anything with spiritual reality. The writer of Gnosticism might have been intentionally trying to hurt christian's spiritual lives.

It is heresy by definition. And be careful reading it because it'll frame your imagination into believing it is true. Don't do it, be responsible to yourself.

[Anonymous No.14772969]

>>14772967
>And off the traveled into the dark seas in order to find what they might contain.

[Anonymous No.14772980]

>>14772969

You need to realize also that what doesn't kill you doesn't make you stronger always. It can also weaken/hurt you. Don't risk your mental health.

[Anonymous No.14773400]

>>14772967
>the writer of Gnosticism
You might want to do the mildest of light research before you go around denouncing entire schools of thought.

[Anonymous No.14773477]

>>14764162
Its Scythian/Iranian origins have foreign (Mystery Babylon) elements interpolated into it far too often.

[Anonymous No.14773492]

>>14764234
No suck thing gnosticism is like protestants today, they make some shit up and start to preach it. It's not a uniform belief. Some believe in the demoruge some in Jesus as creation and lots of other heresies that have been discarded long ago.

[Anonymous No.14773669]

fag

[Anonymous No.14773799]

>>14773669
dumbest argument

[Anonymous No.14775188]

>>14764999
>He made the material Universe, and trapped certain spirits (emanations of the One) into human bodies
this is my favourite heretical view of YHWH

[Anonymous No.14775199]

>>14773799
It's not an argument, it's banter to make gnostics seethe, which you are currently doing

[Anonymous No.14775237]

>>14775199
>it's banter to make gnostics seethe, which you are currently doing
based

[Anonymous No.14775245]

>>14764269
Ahem:
>The Devil is the god of this world.
>t. Jesus

[Anonymous No.14775976]

It denys Christ as God but accepts the Gospel which is contradictory.

[Anonymous No.14775997]

>>14772846
>Plato, Aristotle, Mellisus, and Plotinus are all gnostics
You people remind me of perennialists, just claiming any remotely advanced thinker you can

[Anonymous No.14776145]

>>14773400
I don't know if you're implying that there are more than one and that it has its fascets outside of literature but I'm going to assume you are. If your capable enough to the critisize a valid point in an arguement, why are you defending Gnosticism? Suppose you were to analyze the Gnostic system of beliefs. Under what experiences are you listening to? Where do they're conclusions stem from? Whereas in the Bible there is literally archaelogical and astronomical proofs that the events and places happened. The Mt. Sinai is in Saudia Arabia, Ur is in Iran, there are swallowed chariots of the Red Sea. Don't stick to the style, have some principle and pursue the truth.

[Anonymous No.14776156]

>>14764999
Sounds like a fucking videogame or new age Woo.

[Anonymous No.14776181]

>>14765760
What did Guenon think of Plotinus?

[Anonymous No.14776210]

So what is /lit/'s take on perennialism? The idea is what got me interested in religion and philosophy in general, but these days it seems weak and ultimately sterile in a way that doesn't feel right to me. It's not entirely human the way orthodox christianity is. I find Catholic Truth more complete and relevant in day to day life.

[Anonymous No.14776528]

>>14776210
I believe that perennialism could turn political really quick. Also individuals are often focused on one more more aspects of their life at a time. Whereas people who want to be learners yearn for this for others and themselves which is cool. So often I think it dilutes into being a locality structure, which is nice.

[Anonymous No.14776562]

>>14776528
If you take the concept of salvation seriously though, in whatever metaphysical form you want it to take, the rituals and theological particulars of the different religions do matter. Perennialism finds what's commonly true between religions and compresses it into a loosely held picture of the nature of reality. So maybe it has philosophical value, but it seems to contradict salvation according to Faith, and doesn't much seem with anything beyond "spiritual" curiosity. It feels like looking at the code of the simulation more than a guide for living within it. Based on what I've read, there's a lot of crossover between gnosticism and perennialism, particularly regarding the knowable aspects of God.

I guess I'm just not sure what perennialism offers beyond "secret knowledge", it feels indulgent and lacking as a religious outlook.

[Anonymous No.14776564]

>>14776562
doesn't seem concerned with anything beyond "spiritual curiosity"

[Anonymous No.14776820]

>>14776562

What we should dilute from ALL religions is to love others and to love ourselves. There are crossovers of philosophy and spirituality. Like grey areas. These are often fun to discuss. Such as what we constitute in regular lives as good. Prosperity is good, poverty is good, common is good, exceptional is good, ignorance is good, intelligence is good. HOWEVER, we must also aknowledge something beyond the philosophical/ethical. That is the condition of the soul and the subject of Sin. There is only one God who is YHWH. There is none other beside Him. Jesus' sacrifice of his body is the LORD's willingness to give up His Son so that whoever accepts Him will get to see the Holy One. Satan who rules this world is not a creator. He is an adversary against you. Tempting you to chose for yourself what is good and evil and not what God has called good and evil. This is beyond ethics. There is only one reality that we are all in. We are not seperated from eachother. So perennialism is good from an ethical standpoint. But Salvation in Jesus Christ is above the ethical.

[Anonymous No.14776841]

>>14776820
pic related

[Anonymous No.14776869]

>>14776210
Perennialism finds commonality where it doesn't exist, It leads to more problems than it solves.

[Anonymous No.14776909]

>>14776145
Which I have done but I appreciate your concern, also the historical veracity of your sources aside, faith and philosophy do not stem their value from what has literally happened on an external plane, it is influenced by it but exists independently from it.

[Anonymous No.14776921]

>>14764262
Thank you

[Anonymous No.14777198]

>>14776820
>YHWH created our souls
Correct, the soul/mind is different from our Spirit, which is uncreated and existed eternally as an emanation of the One
>the subject of Sin
Sin happens because of YHWH imprisoned our divine Spirit in a fleshly prison and a calculating mind, it has nothing to do with a fault in the human (divine) part of us and everything to do with our material condition.
>Jesus's sacrifice of his body is the LORD's willingness to give up his son so that whoever accepts him will get to see the holy one
why not just forgive us?
>Satan who rules this world is not a creator
correct, YHWH is the creator, satan is one of his servants

[Anonymous No.14777231]

>>14777198

Haha I'm not trying to be a jerk but all of those assessments we don't agree with. How do we know that these "secrets" are true?

[Anonymous No.14777309]

>>14777231
Insight can only be gained through authentic experience, that's why it's secret. Even if I spell it out for you it seems like absurdity. Same principle as alchemy.

[Anonymous No.14777374]

>>14764162
Just another dumb cult.

[Anonymous No.14777696]

>>14777309
Care to share yours?

[Anonymous No.14777753]

>>14777309
You do know that the alchemical literature was literally encrypted with myticism to hide the real chemical transmutations of metals LOL. That was the secret.

[Anonymous No.14778924]

>>14766414
>the doctrine of jews is more important than what God says
hi jew

[Anonymous No.14778936]

>>14764234
Here you go, lad
http://montalk.net/PKD_principles.html
>1. The creator of this world is demented.
>2. The world is not as it appears, in order to hide the evil in it, a delusive veil obscuring it and the deranged deity.
>3. There is another, better realm of God, and all our efforts are to be directed toward
>a. returning there
>b. bringing it here
>4. Our actual lives stretch thousands of years back, and we can be made to remember our origin in the stars.
>5. Each of us has a divine counterpart unfallen who can reach a hand down to us to awaken us. This other personality is the authentic waking self; the one we have now is asleep and minor. We are in fact asleep, and in the hands of a dangerous magician disguised as a good god, the deranged creator deity. The bleakness, the evil and pain in this world, the fact that it is a deterministic prison controlled by the demented creator causes us willingly to split with the reality principle early in life, and so to speak willingly fall asleep in delusion.
>6. You can pass from the delusional prison world into the peaceful kingdom if the True Good God places you under His grace and allows you to see reality through His eyes.
>7. Christ gave, rather than received, revelation; he taught his followers how to enter the kingdom while still alive, where other mystery religions only bring about amnesis: knowledge of it at the "other time" in "the other realm," not here. He causes it to come here, and is the living agency to the Sole Good God (i.e. the Logos).
>8. Probably the real, secret Christian church still exists, long underground, with the living Corpus Christi as its head or ruler, the members absorbed into it. Through participation in it they probably have vast, seemingly magical powers.
>9. The division into "two times" (good and evil) and "two realms" (good and evil) will abruptly end with victory for the good time here, as the presently invisible kingdom separates and becomes visible. We cannot know the date.
>10. During this time period we are on the sifting bridge being judged according to which power we give allegiance to, the deranged creator demiurge of this world or the One Good God and his kingdom, whom we know through Christ.

[Anonymous No.14779263]

>>14776820
>There is only one God who is desert demon
Yikes.

[Anonymous No.14780018]

If gnosticism is true, why is there not a single non-cringe gnostic currently spreading the word?

[Anonymous No.14780796]

>>14780018
All true gnostic died out of not reproducing

[Anonymous No.14780803]

Gnosticism preaches anti-natalism. It has therefore an in-built mechanism for self-destruction.

[Anonymous No.14781961]

It's all self-denial and ressentiment. Some seriously batshit slave morality. It makes for a cool science fiction device though.

[Anonymous No.14782006]

>>14764162
Gnosticism? Proto-sissy cult. Don't believe me? From the Nag-Hammadi Library:

>We have seen that the conventional view in antiquity was that women could not be fully rational beings. Their subordination, like that of slaves, was justified in that way. The Gospel of Thomas urges a new project on believers: nothing less than turning women into men! They are to become as ‘one’. By that it is clearly meant that women should be enabled to become rational agents, to recognize that they have the same rational and moral capacities as men. ‘When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner like the outer and the outer like the inner . . . and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male will not be male nor the female be female, then you will enter (the kingdom).’13 That reconstruction of the self, which Paul had urged on his followers, is here tied overtly to a change in the status of women. The implication of the text is that only when women are free can men also be truly free – that the reciprocity which belief in human equality entails is only possible when their shared nature is fully acknowledged.

G/accels/sissies/trannies plagiarized Thomas

[Anonymous No.14782032]

>>14781961
>It's all self-denial and ressentiment. Some seriously batshit slave morality.
NOOOOOOOOOO IT’S ALL THE FAULT OF THE DEMIURGE!!1 I’M A SPIRITUAL PERSON! THOSE FILTHY HYLIC STACIES DON’T EVEN NOTICE HOW SUPERIOR I AM TO CHAD (BUT THEY SHOULD)!

[Anonymous No.14782085]

>>14782006
The portion makes sense to me, but I don't quite agree with g/gender accelerationism.

[Anonymous No.14782196]

>>14782085
Talk to me in 20 years when you're a clinically depressed tranny on a variety of drugs planning to commit suicide. Events set into motion

[Anonymous No.14782555]

>>14782196
I'll only ever change my gender with magic. No hormones, no crossdressing, no such things. However, I do intend to balance out feminine and masculine energies within me.

There is a reason angels, elves and holy beings are depicted as androgynous.

[Anonymous No.14783872]

>>14764162
Everything

[Anonymous No.14783887]

>>14766733
>the religion that helped Europe flourish and defended idiots like you from speaking arabic are weak herr derr

[Anonymous No.14783891]

>>14767049
Someone does not understand Christianity.

[Anonymous No.14784068]

It's a LARP. You could say Christianity in general is a LARP for anyone on /lit/. But you can actually go to church and eat pastries afterwards.

[Anonymous No.14784197]

https://discord.gg/FFwRXKq

[Anonymous No.14784222]

>>14764162
What's right with it?

[Anonymous No.14784292]

>>14764315
>space echos
sorry retard there is no sound in space

[Anonymous No.14784320]

The path is hidden to most...but those who know can find the secrets behind every whisper that slips through the night...

[Anonymous No.14784401]

>>14768150
>Answer to Job (German: Antwort auf Hiob) is a 1952 book by Carl Gustav Jung that addresses the moral, mythological, and psychological implications of the Book of Job. It was first published in English in 1954
>Jung described Answer to Job as "pure poison"
Top kek, this book must be based

[Anonymous No.14784495]

>>14777753
>transmutations of metals
alchemy had nothing to do with anything material retard