/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.14236662]

https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2019/11/25/notre-dame-students-call-for-the-removal-of-white-authors-from-curriculum/

[Anonymous No.14236670]

>breitbart
Excellent content to prompt a discussion! Totally based!

[Anonymous No.14236671]

>/pol/ is always right

[Anonymous No.14236675]

bloom hasn't even been in the ground a year yet

[Anonymous No.14236684]

>students

Two of them?

[Anonymous No.14236689]

but /lit/ leftists assured me this sort of thing was never going to happen.

[Anonymous No.14236695]

imagine going to (((college))) in the current year

[Anonymous No.14236704]

>>14236662
Why are those drones given books and not sheets of non verbal workflow diagrams for warehouses and call centers?

[Anonymous No.14236712]

People will say that this is just a very few number of students and that they do not represent the opinions of most of the students on campus but as a student myself i can say that these students have the FULL SUPPORT of MANY students at noter dame and i am SO PROUD of them for having the bravery to stand up and fight the colonialist violence perpetuated by this institution and i hope that students like me and other students too and students around the country can eventually be brave enough to stand up like this too im so proud of them!!!!!

[Anonymous No.14236716]

>>14236704
most of us end up as consultants actually

[Anonymous No.14236719]

>>14236695
Delete this Iimmediately!!!!

[Anonymous No.14236766]

>>14236716
Looks like Notre Dame's PR people are here

[Anonymous No.14236769]

>>14236766
check'em, but I am actually a student :-)

[Anonymous No.14236784]

>breitbart
>literally who student calls for something that will never happen
off yourself OP

[Anonymous No.14236852]

students here are such pussies, jesus fucking christ

[Anonymous No.14236898]

https://www.thecollegefix.com/notre-dame-students-demand-to-read-fewer-white-male-scholars/

[Anonymous No.14236903]

>>14236784
This.

It's just wood in the fire for /pol/tards

[Anonymous No.14236919]

>The students are also protesting against rules that prevent students of the opposite sex from spending the night in each other’s dorm room. The practice, which is called “parietals,” forces students to end visits with students of the opposite sex at midnight on weeknights and 2:00 a.m. on weekends. Student protesters contend that the practice enforces a sense of “heteronormativity” that propagates “homophobia” on campus.
What is this absolute autism? Are they living in a monastery?
Also, doesn't it mean that homos can sleep with each other more easily - therefore making the rule quite anti-homophobic?

[Anonymous No.14236927]

>>14236662
>literally who, a member of the group of literally what, said something stupid
let me know if something actually happens
then I will be concerned

[Anonymous No.14236943]

> why, yes I support a diverse range of opinions from authors of diverse background how could you tell?

[Anonymous No.14236958]

>>14236662
>breitbart
>two students

[Anonymous No.14236969]

You can tell all the anons in this thread who haven't read Taleb on the influence of pushy minorities.

[Anonymous No.14236979]

>>14236969
quick rundown?

[Anonymous No.14237028]

>Ten students
>Undergraduates: 8,530
Sounds like they're totes owning the whitey.

[Anonymous No.14237146]

Things like this seem alarmist and paranoid but they don't just go away on their own without countervailing pressure. This is the disastrous assumption of the compassionate conservative, the type that can identify corruption but can't muster the nerve to meet force with force. Just wait until a few employed careerists inevitably decide that the program of the student left at ND can be synthesized with their own career goals. Just wait until some adjunct idiot sees le internet nazi support for Deneen and other conservatives there lol. Happened hundreds of times before

[Anonymous No.14237170]

>>14237028
you would be surprised how much a vocal minority can do if the majority is passive

[Anonymous No.14237194]

>>14236979
Not him, but Talab the Arab has posted some research from network science on how you only need a small percentage of some fanatic group of people to get the entire group to go along with something. Can't remember the number, but it is very small (less than 10% of group size I think).

[Anonymous No.14237224]

>>14237028
>okay students, raise your hand if you want to read more white men and silence the voices of these brave first generation students of color!
Now yuo see...0

[Anonymous No.14237228]

>>14236927
>top 20 university, known for its liberal arts programs
>literally who

haha sure bud

[Anonymous No.14237247]

>>14236689
>It's not happening
>They're just an internet strawman
>You're crazy
>Actually it is happening and its a good thing
>It was always like this

[Anonymous No.14237262]

Thanks for this thread. It's helping me cope with the fact that I'm studying business over literature (my only real passion).

[Anonymous No.14237319]

[Anonymous No.14237339]

>>14236689
The purge happened over ten years ago. Anyone politically incorrect was #metooed by then, and anyone remaining is just a racketeer.

[Anonymous No.14237425]

>>14237146
>>14237170
This.

[Anonymous No.14237466]

>people go into tens of thousands of dollars in debt which they cant default on and tanks their credit just to spend 4 years in fucking ohio getting taught about how western civ is white supremacist

[Anonymous No.14237472]

>>14236662
>students
you know, nobody goes and finds two coal miners or maids or accountants and pretends as though their opinions deserve a platform. "students" could be anyone, even student clubs are often loosely organized and end up a mouthpiece for a couple people with domineering personalities. and yet... endless fodder for breitbart and company. you can literally find a college student with any opinion, no matter how outlandish, and get a few thousand clicks by acting as though they speak on behalf of an entire demographic.

[Anonymous No.14237485]

>>14237472
Forced diversity classes on a majority of campus, professors are over 90% democrat, ah yes but its da ebol right wing media thats the problem here misrepresenting dem poor innocent students yall

[Anonymous No.14237592]

>>14236662
Isn't this good for lit? Makes you feel more special. That's the only thing you boys care about, no? More elite? I don't care either way, I'll enjoy what I enjoy even if I'm persecuted for it. Universities and academia have been trash for over a century. Best to laugh as their poison their own intellectual legitimacy.

[Anonymous No.14237606]

>>14237472
>you know, nobody goes and finds two coal miners or maids or accountants
probably because coal miners, maids, or accountants aren't part of something that captures the minds of millions unlike higher education
i've yet to see the equivalent of the khmer rouge from a bunch of maids, yet pol pot and his cronies all got their ideas while being at french universities

[Anonymous No.14237622]

>>14237592
>More elite?
You would think so, but the great joke is that the supposedly diverse perspectives of students of color amount to nothing but regurgitating what white liberals were saying 5 years before, but this time more loudly and with more tears

[Anonymous No.14238056]

>>14236769
Nice

[Anonymous No.14238256]

>>14237247
It's happening on campuses all over the US. Dismiss the specifics of this article if you want, but the trend it represents is very much real.

t. guy in creative writing program now with professors operating under and preaching this exact idea

[Anonymous No.14238677]

>>14236898
This exact bullshit narrative is happening at my school, too. It's always "just a vocal minority; nothing to worry about" until one of them gets what they want and other universities follow suit to be PC. People unironically have to stop worrying about looking like fags or getting called racist and stand up to it while making them look dumb to the average normskull. They will only continue to do it with tweaks here and there until they win.

[Anonymous No.14239153]

>>14237194
Can I please get a hyperlink?

[Anonymous No.14239198]

>>14239153
"taleb minority rule"
https://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/02/the-5-per-cent-of-people-who-decide-everything-and-how-to-be-one-of-them/

[Anonymous No.14239223]

>>14236662
If you’re white what’s the point of reading black authors since there will be virtually no instance where your criticism of a POCs viewpoint is valid in the modern public domain. Reading literature without being allowed to critique it is like using a dildo without a shaft.

[Anonymous No.14239410]

>>14236662
White male here
This is unironically based and was very much needed.

[Anonymous No.14239423]

>>14236671
This

[Anonymous No.14239428]

>>14239223
At this point I don't think there's a single thing a white man can say that we haven't heard before. Whatever critique you have, it's been done and we don't need yours

[Anonymous No.14239442]

>>14236927
>>14236784
>>14236684
>>14236958
See
>>14237247
It always starts like this.
I frankly think you are a bunch of dishonest fucks who agree with this shit and are telling everyone that "this is nothing" so that no one opposes it until it happens.

[Anonymous No.14239467]

>>14239428
You’re missing my point. If I read some 400 page novel about a black womans struggle in white America, I can’t discuss it with anyone publicly because there is an a priori assertion that I: cannot relate to her struggle; should not criticise her viewpoints; cannot criticise her stylistic expression. As a result reading becomes less an exercise of aesthetic criticism, debating the merits of the work with my peers, and more a question of ensuring I clap at how brave and incredible the story is. The point of critique is not to “say something new” it’s to fundamentally engage with a work of art. I am not allowed to engage with some art because the appropriate response has already been pre-selected for me.

[Anonymous No.14239474]

>>14239428
Can't wait for those "new" critiques that are just rehashed social and political critiques. Truly cutting edge.

[Anonymous No.14239482]

>>14238677
Yes.
Conservatives and moderates need to grow some balls instead of letting the far-left do whatever they want.

[Anonymous No.14239489]

>>14236662
Lmao at the conservatards freaking out over this. Its just two students.

Google "Slippery Slope Fallacy" and know that your views are illogical.

I dont even see a problem with encouraging more PoC Authors either... the field is saturated by whites atm

[Anonymous No.14239494]

>>14239442

[Anonymous No.14239496]

>>14239467
You are allowed to engage, it's just that your peers aren't interested, as you bring nothing to the table that isn't already on the table. When you are used to having your opinion respected and engagement centred due to your whiteness, this change can feel threatening, but it's nothing to worry about. Women and minority groups have dealt with this forever.

[Anonymous No.14239498]

>>14238677
Yes.
Conservatives and moderates should argue against this kind of thing without fear.
They shouldn't be afraid of the "oh, this is nothing, you are a huge crybaby if you complain about this" rhetoric of the far left.

[Anonymous No.14239500]

>>14239489
>>14239494
When it comes to the woke strategy, the slippery slope is not a fallacy. You are being dishonest.
You know very well how woke stuff advances.

[Anonymous No.14239518]

>>14239489
google "fallacy fallacy"

[Anonymous No.14239519]

>>14239500
???
People are becoming aware of the inherent inequality in the education system and are making changes to fix it. so what?

Its not like we are going to start Genociding whites or anything, even though it would be completely justified considering the Genocide of Native Americans

[Anonymous No.14239523]

>>14239519
And australian aborigines

[Anonymous No.14239540]

>>14239496
Judge people by the content of their character you smug venomous piece of shit.

[Anonymous No.14239549]

>>14239496
but why would minorities and women be so afraid of having whites criticise their thought unless there was some threat of exposure?
Are they pre-empting that their worldview may be flawed before the criticism even takes place?

[Anonymous No.14239579]

>>14239519
Try it pussy.

[Anonymous No.14239605]

>>14239489
>>14239494
The crux of the alleged fallacious reasoning is that the steps from initial event to final event are missing. It's right there in your link about "demonstrating the process." It's not really a slippery slope fallacy if you've seen the sequence of events played out before and come up with a plausible construction about how it might go down again. This isn't a very hard thing to do if you factor in the Taleb discussion above (intolerant minorities get what they want), signalling among leftist hipsters (taking whatever the left's thought currently is and making it more extreme to outdo their peers), and the environmental context (academia, which is already mostly left wing so the group are preaching to the choir). Seems plausible that the steps in question could come about.

[Anonymous No.14239625]

>>14239496
>women and minorities have dealt with this forever
Which only proves that the most reasonable thing is gender and racial segregation when it comes to course material because everything else devolves into “you’re just saying that because you’re black!” Or “you’re just saying that cause you’re a white man”. We should have white men engage with art produced by white men and black men with art produced by black men, etc etc.

[Anonymous No.14239720]

Holy shit /pol/ was right again!

[Anonymous No.14239749]

>>14239519
>>14239523
>genociding whites justified
do you really mean that anon, or are you just collecting (yous)?

[Anonymous No.14239801]

>>14237466
>Ohio

Based non American retard

[Anonymous No.14239804]

>>14239625
It doesn't really follow that de-centering whiteness means we must have segregation.
>>14239549
Not afraid, just bored. Those perspectives have been the centre of literary criticism for a very long time, they are played out, and everyone is aware of them.
Literature is a growing living thing, despite the attempt to equate it with a certain conception of whiteness.
It might make it easier for you to understand if you imagine you are Catholic. It's fine to be Catholic, and its fine to have Catholic art, but art doesn't need to be constrained by your Catholicism, and if you are going to bring up your same Catholic conception of art every time, and demand all universities centre Catholicism, and insist only Catholic art is real art, you will be ignored.

[Anonymous No.14239808]

>>14239496
>it's just that your peers aren't interested, as you bring nothing to the table that isn't already on the table
>the entire point is that the person is bringing criticism which nobody else is

[Anonymous No.14239845]

>>14239804
>yaaaawn your ideas are boring
>you can’t ignore our ideas because they are important
White people should have the CHOICE to go to all white colleges and read just white literature and study white science, you cannot violently threaten the freedom to pursue knowledge on the grounds of race any more than upon any other grounds yet that is what the state does. Even if I was a billionaire I would not be allowed to run a college of just white men studying things just white men created. If such a pursuit is inherently disadvantageous compared to a more diverse pursuit why am I not allowed to disadvantage myself?

[Anonymous No.14239855]

>>14239749
???
White people killed countless numbers of blacks during the colonisations, of course it wopuld be justified. Dont you white people have something in your religion like "an eye for an eye"?

[Anonymous No.14239879]

>>14239855
Fuckin based! And all that was justified because Africans and the Muslim world had white european chattel slaves! I'm justified in killing them :DDD this is awesome, retard
brb

[Anonymous No.14239965]

>I am absolutely OUTRAGED at this Dailymail/Breitbart article. What is going on with this country.

>What do you mean Ngubu isn't really British? Fuck off ya racist cunt.

[Anonymous No.14240099]

>>14239442
Two
Students

[Anonymous No.14240113]

>>14240099
This is how the woke shit always starts.

[Anonymous No.14240133]

>>14238677
Also worth pointing out that a lot of the time history and changes are a result of a minority. The majority is disengaged and indifferent.

It's time to defund universities.

[Anonymous No.14240157]

>>14240113
Slippery slope fallacy.

[Anonymous No.14240174]

>the real problem is actually two students who said something

[Anonymous No.14240180]

>>14240157
It is not how it works in woke causes, because that is the modus operandi of woke activists.
Just like their supporters (like you) also have their modus operandi. Which goes:

>It is just a few students, no one pays attention to them
>It is just in one university, there is always crazy activism in universities
>It is just in academia, it won't affect you. They don't want to change you, they only want to be heard too
>You need to pay attention to what they are saying and only nod your head respectfully
>You are a bigot if you disagree with them and you should lose your job

[Anonymous No.14240235]

>>14239428
What exactly is the oppoaite saying that hasnt been heard or said before either? Critique isnt a race to be the most original, or unique. Originality barely even exists anymore

[Anonymous No.14240379]

>>14239519
Be less obvious next time

[Anonymous No.14240394]

>breitbart

shoo shoo!

[Anonymous No.14240400]

>>14239519
Gee, I wonder who could be behind this post...

[Anonymous No.14240586]

says the guy who wears a caricaturesque obama mask lmao

[Anonymous No.14240911]

Historic homelands of white people (Europe) should centre white people in their literary studies, even if alongside that they also do other stuff/critique it

[Anonymous No.14240927]

>>14236662
Only colored women and Trans authors should be allowed anyway.

[Anonymous No.14240935]

How do these types reconcile 4chan-types liking Mishima, Kawabata, or hell, even Murasaki Shikibu's Genji Monogatari? She's neither white nor a man. Why don't we get a cookie for that? How about the Pillow Book lady?

[Anonymous No.14240971]

>>14236662
The Brietbart article leads to some literally-who website which in turn leads to an Instagram page: https://www.instagram.com/endhateatnd/

The account has 5 posts whining about stuff and all the comments are telling them to fuck off.

The ABSOLUTE STATE of right wing media. Aren't you people ashamed to be like this?

[Anonymous No.14241782]

I'm ok with this, these mongrels don't deserve the knowledge of superior beings

[Anonymous No.14242564]

>when you're trying to be an Ivy so hard you go full Yale mode

[Anonymous No.14242716]

>>14236662
I don't think this single case is as big a deal as Breitbart, go figure, or any of the other reactionary right-wing clickfarm sites are making it out to be. I don't think taking white authors out of the curriculum is the right answer necessarily, but I also don't think continuing to focus solely on white authors is right either. Ideally, material is included in a curriculum because of its quality, not its lineage. Again, this is the ideal, not the reality.

That being said, I also agree that the growing sentiment against the established canon is disconcerting. It's one thing to tear down a statue or rename a day because of "muh oppression,"; it's another to try and systematically extirpate the literature of those you deem dangerous or radical. Which, ironically and unsurprisingly, fits into the textbook definition of oppression.

[Anonymous No.14242824]

>>14242716
>but I also don't think continuing to focus solely on white authors is right either. Ideally, material is included in a curriculum because of its quality
I've noticed that anybody that argues for this Utopian fantasy never actually gives any examples.

[Anonymous No.14242878]

Reminder that the most "fringe" views among radical liberals at any time T are Basic Decency at time T+10.

[Anonymous No.14243157]

>>14236670
Hey guys so apparantly it's not true because it's Breitbart. Everyone go to sleep there is nothing at all to see here I guess. Anyway, now back to my Buzzfeed.

[Anonymous No.14243577]

>ducks, newburyport
>winner of booker prize
>run by the Man Group, a financial firm
>provides a range of funds for institutional and private investors globally and is the world's largest publicly traded hedge fund company, reporting $103.5 billion in funds under management as of September 2017
>has dealings in china, aka the guys killing a bunch of schoolchildren in hong kong
>started by booker group
>operated the sugar industry in Guyana (British Guiana before independence in 1966), running five Booker Line ships, until it was nationalised around 1970. After six months, Booker was called back to market the sugar. Booker had a long history of exploitation of sugar workers through the indentured labour system during the 19th and 20th centuries. At its peak, it controlled 75% of the sugar industry in British Guiana and was so powerful that a common joke was to refer to the country as "Booker's Guiana"

>Idk guys, the Booker Prize sounds awfully problematic to me. It would be a shame if twitter found out how exploitative and colonialist its foundation is. Think of all those innocent black children forced into slavery and destitution in the sugar production. Not to mention how white and male these companies are.
>Funny that they're marketing this "feminist" white woman of privilege who engages in stereotypical gender roles like baking cookies.
>Sounds awwwwful problematic to me.

I wonder if breitbart knows about this.

[Anonymous No.14244146]

>>14243577
checking the numerology and endorsing this post. there's some fun messaging to be had.

[Anonymous No.14244161]

>>14242716
But non-whites haven't contributed anything of importance to the Western Canon. No, Pushkin doesn't count as a negro.

[Anonymous No.14244177]

>>14243577
Fucking based.

[Anonymous No.14244193]

>>14243577

[Anonymous No.14244198]

>>14240400
This one probably isnt the Jews

[Anonymous No.14244207]

>>14236766
>>14237466
>>14237622
>>14238677
>>14239500
>>14239855
>>14240099
>>14240133
>>14240400
>>14240911
>>14243577
>>14244177

So many digits in this thread

[Anonymous No.14244214]

>>14236662
There are 5 (max) white authors worth reading and 3 of them are fucking Irish.

[Anonymous No.14244279]

>>14239845
Based.

[Anonymous No.14244341]

>>14240157
>t. "Fallacy!" fallacy

[Anonymous No.14244366]

>>14239804
It's hard to imagine that anyone actually thinks like this.
Equating some nebulous idea of "whiteness" to a well defined and contained normative system like Catholicism is frankly silly, even bordering on delusional.
To lump Marx, Nietzsche and Aquinas in the same mix just because they're part of western culture, and dismiss them as being "boring" by virtue of them being white is just bizarre tbqh.
I'm still yet to see what these theorized diverse perspectives look like, from the supposed examples I've seen it all just looks like a bastardization of Derrida but written by black women. Hardly seems to be "breaking out of the western sphere of whiteness", it is more like a repurposing of it while ignoring any criticism.

[Anonymous No.14244376]

>>14244341
t. conservatards need to make fallacys to prove their point so they accuse the concept of fallacy itself to be a fallacy

[Anonymous No.14244431]

>>14239489

I used to be a slippery slope fallacy fellater like yourself, but now I see how it is. A story like this

https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2019/april/second-drag-queen-story-hour-reader-in-houston-exposed-as-a-convicted-child-sex-offender

would have been called a fever dream if it was predicted even ten years ago. I know, because I saw the same slippery slope comments on 4chan for predictions just like this. Also, notice how even this article won't include a picture of the individual in it.

[Anonymous No.14244441]

>>14244376

You can't triple stamp a double stamp, Lloyd.

[Anonymous No.14244448]

>>14239428
White males are perhaps might be the only ones who can say something new. “Oppression” as theme is a homogenizing force. Reading works based on these relations inevitably feels like doing taxes: there’s only so much variation possible.

[Anonymous No.14244467]

>>14244376
I say we arm all paranoid schizophrenics so they can be less paranoid. You say we shouldn’t because they’ll kill people? Slippery slope fallacy sweetie

[Anonymous No.14244510]

>>14240157
Not all slippery slope arguments are invalid, conditional arguments can be valid with enough facts, or drawing off of past information. A basic propositional logic course will teach you this.