/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.13934172]

>Marvel movies are the same as Homer
Has postmodernism gone too far?

[Anonymous No.13934179]

He’s wrong, but I don’t know why

[Anonymous No.13934241]

the epics are not just "superhero stories", b a tansmission of cultural values, theology, ideals that people should strive to live to, and a bunch of other shit that i can't even name right now. historical societies wouldn't have functioned without them

the bullshit hollywood movies are basically long toy commercials, with a hint of government propaganda designed to make you even more slavish thrown in. i hate nerds

[Anonymous No.13934274]

>>13934241
Kind this, but less abrassively: The afformentioned tails completely shaped and inspired their respective civilizations. Greeks would often call unto Homer as a prient would a bible and quote a specific verse.

The difference is simply scale. The Seminal works were rather all encompassing and foundational. And while Marvel may have a large claim on the popular market, it really doesnt have the singulaity of the classics. Its also conflated with star wars, transformers, etc.

When one deals with a hard situation most people would not ask "What would tony stark do"

[Anonymous No.13934293]

>>13934274
>When one deals with a hard situation most people would not ask "What would tony stark do"
You'd be surprised

[Anonymous No.13934306]

>>13934172
manchildren should be put down pn sight.

[Anonymous No.13934326]

>>13934293
this is one of the differences between us and Reddit. 4chan's discussion baseline has always been rude and stupid but at least we're not constantly making robe-, space- and capeshit references to prove a point

[Anonymous No.13934332]

>>13934172

It used to be that the term literature referred to writing that was a celebration of the writing itself regardless of its content. So even though Civil Disobedience is a persuasion against paying taxes for slavery, a philosophy of transcendentalism, and an entertainment for gossiping colonialists, it is considered literature because it is written so well, that the words themselves are a celebration.

Yet nowadays literature is like rock-and-roll: a catchall term that changes depending on the circumstance of its use.

IMHO nothing can be literature that isn't read. That excludes oral stories and all stories told on medium that is not written down.

So technically both Gilgamesh and Homer are not literature (being oral), and neither is anything put out by the Marvel universe (Its telling being mixed with illustration). This opinion has nothing to do with any story of the story's catagory, and solely to do with its medium.

[Anonymous No.13934382]

>>13934172
the original Epics were the product of a tribal society based around heroic values- honour and power- that is to say, as far away as one can get from a christian or humanistic perspective. The Illiad marks the first stages of western man's coming to self consciousness, awakened as it were by violent trauma, shock and awe. Today's illiterate or postliterate masses find themselves in a similar predicament, this time around, the shock comes from incomprehensible technological forces: the power to vaporise entire cities in microseconds, the sacrifice of subjectivity to the systemic imperative for total mobilisation. No wonder WWII represented a turning point for the comics industry. Superheroes make the unthinkable comprehensible as myth, representing the sum of the technological powers which were created by man but have been alienated from him. Superheroes are reactive, instead of using their awesome powers to change the world, they react to the external enemy which threatens a banal status quo. Politics becomes a consumer product while consumption is politicised, to be entertained becomes the highest duty of the citizen, the mobilisation, or maybe immobilisation, of the mass is an end in itself.

[Anonymous No.13934511]

>>13934382
the technological carnage of the war in the Pacific, exceedes all attempts for humanistic literary representation. Most of post war pop culture in Japan or in America refers implicitly to the war, see Star Wars, superhero movies or any mecha anime

[Anonymous No.13934700]

>>13934382
>Superheroes are reactive, instead of using their awesome powers to change the world, they react to the external enemy which threatens a banal status quo.
Nice. This is a way of summing up morality in Superhero narratives that I never considered before.

[Anonymous No.13934708]

Is it time to admit the classics are fucking dead?

[Anonymous No.13934717]

>>13934172
>Has postmodernism gone too far?

It hasn't gone far enough.

[Anonymous No.13934722]

>>13934708
makes you feel bad for du Bois, looking at how things turned out

[Anonymous No.13934723]

>>13934717
what do you mean?

[Anonymous No.13934737]

>>13934708
kek fucking plebs yelling at clouds

[Anonymous No.13934905]

The (founding) myths of the American Empire are unironically Star Wars and the Holocaust (I use myth in two different contexts here).

[Anonymous No.13934938]

>>13934905
>I use myth in two different contexts here).

I realized. Very clever.

[Anonymous No.13934974]

>>13934172
No, we have a lot to accelerate yet before Our Lord The Capital finally enters history as we understand it.

[Anonymous No.13934978]

>>13934382
>based around heroic values- honour and power- that is to say, as far away as one can get from a christian or humanistic perspective.

>laughs in martyr

[Anonymous No.13935012]

>>13934172
The Odyssey, Beowulf and The Epic of Gilgamesh are historical documents, not literature. The Iliad has literary worth, but frankly real, transcendental literature didn't arise until the 14th century

[Anonymous No.13935040]

>>13934172

[Anonymous No.13935303]

>>13934241
Most epics certainly come ultimately from or incorporate propaganda. I would argue the major difference between them and comic books is simply literary merit, famous epics are exemplary poetry, whereas comic books and super hero films are very pedestrian art

[Anonymous No.13935316]

>>13935012
You can't read Greek or Old English and are quite wrong if you think Greek drama and Virgil aren't great literature. Those are all extremely fine poems

Gilgamesh I can't judge the quality of the poetry, it is perhaps just an artifact albeit a delightful one

[Anonymous No.13936232]

>>13934179
If there's any connection between the two it's that Superhero films borrow from classical myth to add a veneer of substance to what is a perversely overdeveloped children's fiction. Alan Moore spoke about this, it's really fucking strange and even demented how millions of adult people today consume superhero shit that's fundamentally designed as a means to distract little boys during the 50s and maybe sell some branded cereal.

[Anonymous No.13936241]

What is this retard even trying to say?

[Anonymous No.13936246]

>>13934172
The critical error here is using the word "movies." Marvel and DC COMICBOOKS on the other hand are modern day mythos. Superman is our Odysseus, Batman Aeneas.