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13800786 No.13800786 [DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Everything we know points toward absolute meaninglessness. Leaving science aside, lets just look at the history of philosophy: how many different kinds of value systems has it both created and destroyed? Values are like gods: if you believe that your christian God or muslim Allah is the only true God then you did not pay attention to history. Pagans would kill and die in the name of their gods, and though you might think that it is you who is right and some ancient greek who is wrong, then you are a brainlet with no capacity of thinking for yourself.

You can cope all you want: believe in God or Allah or any other god for that matter, invent values for yourself or for others, create beautiful art, live a miserable or a rich and profound life, be forgotten or remembered until the end of mankind - all of this is merely a monkey cope. Values cannot be inherent, only human makes them such, therefore humans only matter to themselves, therefore have no value at all, therefore nothing they value have any value.

It could be that antinatalism is the conclusion of philosophy, but it is based in ethics, which also have no value, like human life, suffering or joy. Suffer all you want and make more babies to suffer just for laughs, who cares anyway.

I have heard things like "bby first existential crisis" and other ad hominem shit, but I don't know a single reason why nihilism is wrong. Of course, on a societal scale it can bring total chaos, but it only makes it all the more right.

I don't even want to provoke anyone, I am genuinely interested whether /lit/ can find a decent argument against nihilism that would not be rooted in religion. I hate myself for being a nihilist, but I just can't pretend I'm not one if that's what I find to be true. Not trying to be edgy, just trying to find the truth.

>> No.13800813
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13800813

Probably the wrong board to post this on; just because it's "right" doesn't mean one ought live by it. Seems kind of dumb to live in a manner which affirms the pointlessness of life *especially* if it is actually pointless. If, hypothetically, life is absolutely pointless, there is also absolutely no reason to despair or act in any manner other than that which you are perfectly comfortable living.
Also, obligated: bby's first post on lit despite not having read philosophy! (That title is wack as fuck.)
That being said, you can live in abject despair or commit suicide if that's your thing, just seems kind of pointless to.

>> No.13800828

>>13800786
>he hasn't fucked Tinker Bell yet

>> No.13800858

>>13800813
>makes sad heartfelt album about the extreme suffering he went through after the loss of his wife
>starts fucking and dating months later
what a meme

>> No.13800866

>>13800786
This way of thought may surely be true, and your arguments are fine.
But to me wading through the trenches of shit we walk through every day on our way to work, or school, or to friends, or home is humbling.
And then we can think of it like this, Life holds no meaning, but death holds no meaning either. Simply put, things and thoughts and hopes and dreams and bright lights and sadness all crash down from a waterfall only for their temporary division and individuality to be taken away just as swiftly it was given, into the river you go.
I do not fear death, neither should you if you care so much for nonexistance

>> No.13800868
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13800868

>>13800786

>> No.13800877

>>13800786
It's an American projects his malaise and empty life onto an infinite reality episode

>> No.13800958

>>13800868
>The simplest argument to refute a moral nihilist is to kill them

Kek'd

>> No.13800982

>>13800786
Read Plato

>> No.13801017

>>13800786
This has been discussed many times in here, I think the existential dread you are describing is just a side effect. You are still you, everything that makes you happy is still in this universe, time and space and everything you know is still here, what's the meaning behind "meaninglessness"?, just a fraction of a second that goes away as soon as you start taking action, you are free now from Gods, hell, superstition, dogmas, moral systems, and so on and you choose the drag? C'mon, you still want safety, food, sex, knowledge and things you like and want to do, things that mean something to YOU, because otherwise this shit would be boring as hell.

>> No.13801025
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13801025

>>13800877
America is the prototype for the completely dehumanized society everyone else is copying. It sickens me to visit foreign lands and see them copy our cattle culture

>t. mutt

>> No.13801059

>>13800858
chad coping strategy desu

>> No.13801060

just be an optimistic nihilist lmao

>> No.13801065

>>13801025
Stop posting the coom face

>> No.13801069

>>13801065
Fuck you I'm just gonna COOOOOM

>> No.13801076

>>13801069
FFFFUCK IM GONNA COOOOOOOOM

>> No.13801114

people have struggled with this for over 200 years now, and it won't get any better as we progress further on this path of scientism and our obsession with technology.
Many people might not adhere to traditional ideologies as a source of meaning in their lives anymore, but most of them manage to find replacements in their friends, jobs, relationships etc. I think you can only fall into true nihilism once these fundamental structures have collapsed underneath you. Then the reality of our existence becomes painfully obvious, and you try desperately to find anything that will repress this feeling.
I suffer from pretty severe ADD and auto-immune condition, and have lost almost everything due to this.
I simply cannot keep up with our society, where rapid calculation, processing and knowledge integration are in ever rising demand.
I fall behind most of my peers, stuck in my own mental bubble of habits and media consumption whilst they are all off to uni studying STEM and management fields. Every day this realization of my own incompetence becomes more and more apparent. I realize all the activities I'll never be able to enjoy, all the issues I'll have just staying afloat living on my own.
It makes me wanna quit, and yet I have to go on even though I just wanna sleep.

>> No.13801148

>>13801114
>>13801017
>>13800813
>people have struggled with this for over 200 years
>existential dread
>you can live in abject despair or commit suicide if that's your thing
What?
For some reason most people seem to associate nihilism with some kind of crisis, dread, depression etc.
But it's such a dumb association.

>> No.13801151
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13801151

Why do you need a purpose? Aight imma go coom have a good night yall

>> No.13801155

>>13801151
a question only asked by people who already have a purpose they're not even aware of themselves. When you experience true meaninglessness you'll understand why you need a purpose.

>> No.13801169

>>13801148
why? as soon as you're not in despair over it anymore you are an existentialist. I think nihilism and despair go pretty much hand in hand

>> No.13801170
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13801170

>>13801155
2deep4u bruh you wouldn't understand so I'm not gonna explain because I'm 2deep4u, only I can feel this darkness crawling in my skin.
Fuk u danny stop laughing about my royalroad account

>> No.13801172

>>13801151
Is she gonna milk me with her white claw next?

>> No.13801178

>>13801169
>I think nihilism and despair go pretty much hand in hand
Why?

>> No.13801181

>>13801178
cus when you know life is meaningless, but go on regardless, you are creating your own values and you're not a true nihilist anymore.

>> No.13801185

>>13801151
Is being a COOMER the only and true argument against nihilism?

>> No.13801186

>>13800786
> if you believe that your christian God or muslim Allah is the only true God then you did not pay attention to history.

it would certainly be ignorant to say only the Christian experience is valid, but I don't see why there can't be one which is a more accurate depiction of deity

do you deny the law of excluded middle?

>> No.13801193

>>13800786
Nihilism is more poetic than it is "practical" or "obvious". Your post just asserts empty statements with nothing backing it up simply because you can do it.

>> No.13801195

>>13801181
>you are creating your own values and you're not a true nihilist anymore.
Nihilists only deny the existence of OBJECTIVE value and OBJECTIVE morality.
One can define his own SUBJECTIVE values and still be a nihilist just fine.

>> No.13801199

>>13801185
nah once you start balding and delaying your personal art projects, your inner coomer will push you closer to it

>> No.13801204

>>13801195
just a matter of semantics then. well, despair is still a pretty natural and human response to the nihilistic realization I'd say.

>> No.13801207

>>13801195
Moral Nihilism and Moral Subjectivism are two different things for a reason

>> No.13801208

>>13801195
>>13801186

as a follow up. just start applying law of excluded middle to basic questions you think are subjective.

people say art is subjective. if you really believe that then Michaelangelo and my dog are equally good artists. who is to say otherwise, except one is more popular?

if morals are subjective. I am equally as moral as a mass murder. people just like mass murders less.

is this what you really believe?

>> No.13801218

>>13801025
Yup, home of the free, land of the coom

>> No.13801231

>>13800786
convert to Islam and accept the message of Allah

>> No.13801234

I feel like I'm going through the Kubler-Ross stages of grief, after leaving all the ideologies I was entangled in for so many years. I hope the acceptance will come soon cause I'm currently deep in the depression phase.

>> No.13801237

>>13801208
>People say art is subjective. if you really believe that then Michaelangelo and my dog are equally good artists.
Michelangelo is better FOR MY TASTES.
>if morals are subjective. I am equally as moral as a mass murder. people just like mass murders less.
A mass murderer is worse ACCORDING TO MY MORALS.

Yes, any kind of value statement (good/evil, valuable/worthless) is inherently subjective.

>> No.13801240

>>13800868
>>13800958
that's a validation, not a refutation.

>> No.13801248

>>13801237
And even though this is true, it is still important to uphold those statements we value as a society. Otherwise things get apocalyptic real soon.

>> No.13801260

>>13801248
Of course. I've never said otherwise.

>> No.13801284

>>13801248
depending on the society of course. history has taught us not all societies value certain things in appropriate amounts.. (and yes I am aware that in my usage of "appropriate" is already entangled the assumption that our western ideals are the most morally righteous ones)

>> No.13801294

>>13801284
let's just say we should strive to have as little people as possible live in misery or die before they've even had a chance to create a life for themselves. seem reasonable?

>> No.13801306

just imagine Sisyphus happy dipshit
You could also go the pantheism route if you want

>> No.13801308

>>13801294
in your usage of "reasonable" is already entangled the assumption that our western ideals are the most morally righteous ones

>> No.13801323

>>13801237
>Michelangelo is better FOR MY TASTES.
Because humans and certain other species find symmetrical patterns more attractive than asymmetrical ones, maybe?

>A mass murderer is worse ACCORDING TO MY MORALS.
And for people we call "sane" too, because species tend to seek self preservation? Idk, it doesn't sound "inherently subjective" to me, we are still attached to our bodies.

>> No.13801324

>>13801308
well, there's no escaping it i guess.

>> No.13801336

>>13801185
>should I kill myself or COOOOOM

>> No.13801358

>>13801323
>people are inherently opposed to killing other people
Tell that to the hundreds of millions of people who were killed in countless wars. And the people who did the killing are celebrated as heroes.

>> No.13801380

>>13801358
Species tend to seek self preservation, doesn't mean people are inherently opposed to killing other people, we want to preserve our people and kill our enemies, that's the thing.

>> No.13801393
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13801393

>>13800786
Bump. I feel you op. Curious for decent answers

>> No.13801420
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13801420

SHUT THE FUCK UP BITCH NIGGA.
EMBRACE THE ACT OF LIVING AS THE PURPOSE OF LIFE - BITCH.
STFU AND CRUSH SOME PUSSY. BE A REAL G KNOW WHAT IM SAYING?
GO OUT AND TAKE THE SHIT YOU WANT FROM THIS WORLD LIKE MY HOMIE DAQUAN WHEN HE FUCKED THIS OTHER NIGGA’s BITCH.
AYO FUCK THIS BULLSHIT IMMA GO LIVE ON A BIG ASS MOUNTAIN FOR A DECADE AND TAK WITH THE SUN ‘N BIRDS ‘N SHIT DAWG.
KEEP IT REAL
- BIG NIGGA NIETZSCHE

>> No.13801454

>>13800786
Your body tries very hard to persist for some reason. It also produces feelings that get you to do stuff. The talking thing is like Earth compared to the infinity of space

>> No.13801464

>>13801380
>we want to preserve our people and kill our enemies, that's the thing.
But the definitions of "our people" and "enemy" have changed wildly over history.
In XXI century "western" culture it's considered outrageous to kill people simply because they worship another god, or belong to a different race. But doing so was commonplace for the vast majority of human history.

>> No.13801570

>>13800786
Complete brainlet wrong on all accounts.
It doesn't matter How long You roleplay a scenario in which "God is Dead". God is alive. Religion is alive. Just outside of your hugbox.
I'll pray for you.

>> No.13801637

>The wish to aquire meaning is ultimately the loss of all meaning
This is either really deep or absolutely retarded.

>> No.13801649

>>13800786
Nihilism isn't a blueprint to sadness, it's a blueprint to freedom and joy. Life can be meaningless, this doesn't mean the brain and it's dopaministic and serototonergic urges are without response to pleasure. The objective to life is to pleasure your mind through positive impact on both yourself and other's minds. A humanity without intrinsic meaning does not mean you cannot experience and share happiness. In fact, to not share joy or at least attempt to share joy would obviously mean you have created less joy in the chemical sense of the word, which, in turn, makes you a douchecunt faggotnigger.

>> No.13801658

>>13801637
kinda like schopy's argument that the mere existence of boredom proves that life has no inherent meaning.

>> No.13801675

>>13800786
Science will eventually cure our misery and make us into a God.

>> No.13801683

>>13801649
Is this Epicureanism, or already Utilitarianism?

>> No.13802137

>>13801207
>what is a fictionalist

>> No.13802144

>>13800786
>I have heard things like "bby first existential crisis" and other ad hominem shit
I don't think you know what ad hominem means

>> No.13802156

>>13801170
He's right.

>> No.13802160

>>13801114
Based left behind by modernity poster. Iktfb

>> No.13802170

Easy. There is no reason to have no reasons.
If nihilism is true, everything is equal and there is no reason not to be a nihilist.

>> No.13802185

>>13801148
re: you can just commit suicide if that's your thing
Yeah I more-so meant that if you feel like doing that there isn't really any particular reason not to other than it being a shittier in feel-good points... So, basically, agreed.

>> No.13802532
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13802532

>>13801658
Life doesn't posses meaning. It is the meaning.

>“Not how the world is, but that it is, is the mystery.”

>> No.13802790

>>13800786

After nihilism comes willing. Deciding what you want.

>> No.13802827

>>13801017
God, save this man from making any more banal statements.

>> No.13802837

>>13800786
"Thinking for yourself" always means an aboslute dogma to materialist atheism. It is so asinine. Think for yourself, you might find God, or not.

>> No.13803453
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13803453

>>13800786
>>13800813

The fact that such a large number of people believe that the pain and despair of nihilism to be natural or desirable is a testament to how effective the Satanic deceptions have been. For indeed it is Satan and his followers who seek to disconnect humanity from our Lord, Creator, the Giver of Life. For with Life comes joy and peacr but without Life comes pain and death.

Come, brother, and know the joy of Life, Truth, and the pursuit of Virtue!

>> No.13803614
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13803614

>>13800786
>>13801151

I hate to say it, but this one is actually on the Jews.

We were all living happy doing human shit before one o' them said "Thou must serve God, or God will cuck thee." So that was the goal of your life. Why are you alive? To serve God, and be good, and help your friends. And the Jews made all of us believe this when we were kids, so when you grow up, read 4chan and you're like
>lol god doesn't even

You still have the mindset that you need to serve something. It's what you've been doing all your life, even if God doesn't exist, you still have serving ingrained in ya.

It's like when the slaves were freed in the south, and they were pissed at the north, cause they didn't what the fuck to do next.

Stop being a slave is what I'm saying. I think Nietzsche said something to the extent of: "Smell the roses bro. You're a human machine, as long as you do what a human is supposed to do, you'll feel right. You don't always need to feel happy, but it'll feel right."

>> No.13803617
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13803617

>Existence is all that anybody has ever known
>lol dude it's just nothing 420 blaze it lmao
Why do people do this /b/ros?

>> No.13803622

>>13800786
I have been down and through nhilism.

It's interesting.
So I'm going with the Google definition: the rejection of all religious and moral principles, in the belief that life is meaningless.
The issue here is meaning. Meaningless is just as arbitrary as meaning. So why should I envalue it?
In Cathr Liggotti gives no reson to choose his brand of negative thought. He just says why not choose me over them?
In my perspective both are just the dreams of a monkey who'll be gone soon enough.
What do your thoughts matter? Why envaule or disregard the errant electric signals of entropy?
You can be happy sad or the other. More likely you'll hold a variety of contradicting views perhaps similateously. And what of when you aren't thinking and the body is running itself? Why envaule the thinking part over the animal?
Should I care I think because allegedly there a records a Greek man fucked boys two thousand years ago?
I am just executing per the greater blackness.

>> No.13803636

>>13803453

Cosmic cope and cringepilled

>> No.13803667

>>13800786
lmao who cares
why do you need meaning to enjoy life?
just live for the prose of your story

>> No.13803686

The problem I have always had with nihilism is that in order to speak about it, you must have the notion of meaning in the first place. And all of us obviously know what is meant by meaning, so how can we claim its absence when we are able to intuit it?

>> No.13803782

>>13803453
>Come, brother, and know the joy of Life, Truth, and the pursuit of Virtue!

I want to, brother, but I constantly fail in my pursuit. Every relationship I have ends in disaster and I always end up harming my loved ones despite my best intentions. What's the point?

>> No.13803782,1 [INTERNAL] 

>>13800786
>different beliefs and philosophies coexist so all of them must be false
its like saying that there is no answer to a math question because its multiple choice test. Yes its true that many people will underline "2+2=7" or "2+2=5" answer .So what ? 2+2=4 and thats it . truth exist despite the infinite existence of lies and infinite amount of poeople beliving in them. Someday you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.

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