/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.13595987]

Why does literature still exist when cinema has succeeded it?

[Anonymous No.13596054]

>>13595987

Read War and Peace.

After that watch the series they made, or any of the movies.

Then come back and make this thread again if you still don't know the answear.

[Anonymous No.13596076]

>>13595987
Cinema is a completely different medium and is better in many ways and worse in others. When writing a film you want to use as little dialog as possible and say things through the visuals and subtext. This is awesome but it removes internal monologues. Then there is the length constraint.

[Anonymous No.13596082]

Preference is like subjective or something

[I Love Harry Potter No.13596085]

>>13595987
Might as well be comparing Eminem and Lil Wayne

[Anonymous No.13596088]

>>13596054
>a work in one medium directly derived from a work in another medium is inferior therefore the whole medium is inferior
hmmmmmm

[Anonymous No.13596090]

Why does cinema exist when GAMING exist? Says alot about society.

[Anonymous No.13596092]

>this shit again

[Anonymous No.13596096]

>>13596054
Watch Youth by Paolo Sorrentino or even simply a music driven movie like Crazy Heart.

[Anonymous No.13596099]

>>13595987
try to make a movie with a typing machine

[Anonymous No.13596101]

>>13596090
>2nd person narrative dependent on human doing the right thing at the right time

[Anonymous No.13596107]

>>13595987
Is this the bresson donkey film?
Was gonna watch that tonight but I watched wim wenders' dashielle hammett film instead
>>13596076
>length constraint
Lab diaz, bela tarr, want bing etc would like a word
>>13596054
Not a good argument really
I could say watch hard to be a god then read the book
>>13596082
Godard is my main man

[Anonymous No.13596109]

>>13596099
>he hasn't heard about screenplays

[Anonymous No.13596114]

>>13595987
Try portraying surreal literature or cosmic horror in a movie. It'll look like shit and the reason to that is that subjective experiences are always stronger than objective ones; in other words, things left to the imagination are better.

[Anonymous No.13596115]

>>13596109
>a screenplay is a finished novie

[Anonymous No.13596116]

>>13596090
I don't know, I think fundamentally the fact that a game must be animated and the experience can't be curated makes elevating video games to an artform above film or literature a very difficult challenge. Not that it's impossible, but I've never played anything that has even come close.

[Anonymous No.13596137]

>>13596114
>things left to the imagination are better
and you think you can't do that in a movie? Strategically denying the viewer sight or sound of a specific scene is one of the most powerful tools a film maker has, and many of the most well regarded film artists use it to full effect: Bresson, Kiarostami, Hitchcock, just to name a few.

[Anonymous No.13596146]

>>13595987
Are you that pajeet of that thread where you started talking about bengali cinema and everybody left?

[Anonymous No.13596159]

>>13596114
on the other hand i couldn't imagine something like say the colour of pomegranates being half as good in literature form
cinema and literature both do surrealism. symbolism, etc very well if done right but they do it in entirely different ways so you can't really say which is superior

[Anonymous No.13596164]

>>13595987
Cinema is a medium of answers. Literature is a medium of imagination. Both have their advantages and particulars.

[Anonymous No.13596168]

best film i've ever seen is the full 5 hour version of until the end of the world

[Anonymous No.13596236]

>>13596137
They can, but my point is you can't effectively translate things like fear, love, when you transfer from your mind to the world.
Art and poems, do this effect better because they are simplest forms of art and can be the most metaphorical of them all.
How can you describe something such as "a creature whose existence the human mind can not grasp understanding." in a medium who relies so much on the senses.
The contemplative forms of art are far superior because they are the most private; incommunicable and mystic.
Am i making a lick of sense ? D:

[Anonymous No.13596395]

>>13595987
for me Au Hasard Balthazar is the best movie of all time

[Anonymous No.13596585]

>>13596395
>>13595987
Whats so good about this movie? My ex-gf used to love Bresson and I've tried watching with her once and fell asleep in the middle. She actually got really mad with me, for two or three days. Then I've forced myself to watch again but it's SO FUCKING BORING. And I like movies with a slow plot, but this one is just a nightmare. I also watched "Les Dames du Bois de Boulogne" and "Mouchette" to give the man another change, but once again he bored me to death. Btw my favorite directors are Kieslowski, Bergman, Hong Sang-Soo, Cronenberg, Truffaut and Michael Haneke.

[Anonymous No.13596802]

>>13596585
>Kieslowski, Bergman, Hong Sang-Soo, Cronenberg, Truffaut and Michael Haneke
Give it another few years and you'll come around to him. Maybe watch some Ozu movies and try to understand why they're so well respected. Be aware: we're currently in a golden age of film. The artists making movies today will go down in history as some of the greatest of all time and spoiler, they are nearly all inspired deeply by Bresson. Tarr and Diaz and Weerasethakul and Costa and plenty of others can all trace their lineage of film making directly to Bresson.

[Anonymous No.13596835]

>>13596585
>Interviewer: What about Robert Bresson? How do you feel about him?
>INGMAR BERGMAN: Oh, Mouchette! I loved it, I loved it! But Balthazar was so boring, I slept through it. Mouchette… is a saint and she takes everything upon herself, inside her, everything that happens around her…. That is my feeling, but this Balthazar, I didn’t understand a word of it, it was so completely boring.
>Interviewer: But, you could almost say the same thing about the donkey, that when the donkey has taken on other people’s suffering…
>IB: A donkey, to me, is completely uninteresting, but a human being is always interesting.
>Interviewer: Do you like animals in general?
>IB: No, not very much. I have a completely natural aversion for them.

[Anonymous No.13596862]

>>13596802
Hmmm ok. This was like two or three years ago. Lately I haven't whatch movies, but I'm going to check some of the directors you mentioned and then give the man another try.
>>13596835
Kek. Bergman gets it. Donkeys are boooring.

[Anonymous No.13596874]

There are no good movies. Change my mind

[Anonymous No.13596877]

>>13596862
I saw an interview with Greta Gerwig where she talked about how she went to Ingmar Bergman's house and he had VHS tapes of Police Academy 1 and 2 and a bunch of other American comedies in his personal collection.

[Anonymous No.13596880]

>>13596116
(you)

[Anonymous No.13596887]

>>13596877
Pretty sure he loved Dallas

[Anonymous No.13597075]

>>13596877
lmao thats kinda based tho. sometimes you just want to watch some dumb shit.

[Anonymous No.13597751]

>>13596096
both very very mediocre films
anon i.....

[Anonymous No.13597798]

>>13596874
you ever watch grand illusion?

[Anonymous No.13597802]

>>13597798
the old guy?

[Anonymous No.13597806]

>>13597075
people like him always have horrible taste really. like those people on rym who listen to obscure music but actually just like playing postal 2.
when orson welles wanted to take it easy he’d listen to mozart and read shakespeare (well he had it all memorized so think shakespeare probably)

[Anonymous No.13597937]

>>13596054
Have you seen the 1966 version?

[Anonymous No.13598019]

Why does cinema exist when TV has succeeded it?
Why does TV exist when video gaming has succeeded it?
Subjectivity only gains vectors, or more accurately, IT only gains IN vectors, never declines. Nostalgia, habit, shame, disgust, all remain or evolve and multiply. Who knows if anything will be able to surpass video games without stereoscopics?

[Anonymous No.13598101]

>>13598019
As a concept TV is better than film and video games are better than both.

[Anonymous No.13599123]

>>13596236
>They can, but my point is you can't effectively translate things like fear, love, when you transfer from your mind to the world.
yes you can but instead of using words you use images, which are more fundamental than words

[Anonymous No.13599126]

>>13597806
>horrible taste
bergman's 11 favourite films:
>Andrei Rublev (Andrei Tarkovsky, 1971)
>The Circus (Charlie Chaplin, 1928)
>The Conductor (Andrzej Wajda, 1980)
>Marianne and Juliane (Margarethe von Trotta, 1981)
>The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Theodor Dreyer, 1928)
>The Phantom Carriage (Victor Sjöström, 1921)
>Port of Shadows (Marcel Carné, 1938)
>Raven's End (Bo Wilderberg, 1963)
>Rashomon (Akira Kurosawa, 1950)
>La strada (Federico Fellini, 1954)
>Sunset Boulevard (Billy Wilder, 1950)
personally i wouldn't call that horrible taste

[Anonymous No.13599130]

>>13597806
>when orson welles wanted to take it easy he’d listen to mozart and read shakespeare
lol so he listened to one of the most popular musical artists of all time and read the most popular playwrite of all time, don't see what's so impressive about that

[Anonymous No.13599133]

oh hey its this thread again

[Anonymous No.13599144]

>>13597806
Postal 2 is great

[Anonymous No.13599146]

>>13595987

war and peace < big momma's house 2

[Anonymous No.13599149]

>>13595987
Is that Viridiana?

[Anonymous No.13599182]

>>13599149
Au Hasard Balthazar

[Anonymous No.13599190]

>>13599130
they're good. that's the whole point, he has good taste

[Anonymous No.13599195]

>>13599190
mozart is no better than madonna

[Anonymous No.13599200]

>>13599126
>Rashomon (Akira Kurosawa, 1950)
only one worth paying any serious attention to

[Anonymous No.13599203]

>>13599200
weak bait

[Anonymous No.13599213]

F O R M
O
R
M

[Anonymous No.13599214]

>>13595987

Why tho? If it inherited anything it's theater and not literature

[Anonymous No.13599217]

>>13595987
The better question would be why music exists when cinema does literally everything it can but more. Literature and cinema are on different sides of the room, don't get caught up in the fact that they both are used to tell stories most of the time.

[Anonymous No.13599219]

>>13599126
me, personally, i would. still that's the point, he chooses a lot of boring crit acclaimed films but what then he likes police academy 1 & 2

[Anonymous No.13599224]

>>13599195
sorry?

[Anonymous No.13599225]

>>13599203
the rest are boring and you know it

[Anonymous No.13599232]

>>13599217
>The better question would be why music exists when cinema does literally everything it can but more.
that's a stupid question

[Anonymous No.13599236]

>>13599203
Alright, Joan of Arc is very very good as well.

[Anonymous No.13599238]

>>13599219
Bergman wasn't a cinephile. He didn't spend all his time tracking down and watching obscure cinema. Before home viewing was a worthwhile experience thanks to the internet and HD screens most people had less interesting tastes because they were limited by rep theaters and festivals.

[Anonymous No.13599240]

>>13599225
sunset blvd isn't really boring. it's not top 11 stuff either though

[Anonymous No.13599245]

>>13599232
Why? Cinema is music with visuals. They're experienced similarly and have the same reliance on rhythm, repetition, and patterns.

[Anonymous No.13599249]

>>13599238
some would consider those films cinephile picks.
and that's not really what i'm getting at.

[Anonymous No.13599250]

>>13599219
no there are some interesting picks like the conductor, marianne and juliane and ravens end
and i'd hardly call the rest of them horrible lol

[Anonymous No.13599252]

>>13599249
what are you getting at?

[Anonymous No.13599261]

>>13599249
Absolutely not. They're all critically acclaimed go-tos like you said. Cinephiles would go for third cinema or direct cinema or the structuralists. Bergman's list is interchangeable with any other artist type living in a big city.

[Anonymous No.13599265]

>>13599240
his own films are way better than those on that list

[Anonymous No.13599268]

>>13599261
cinephiles always go for tarkovsky, no?
>Bergman's list is interchangeable with any other artist type living in a big city.
unless they happen to be a real artist

[Anonymous No.13599270]

>>13599268
You're confusing cinephiles with letterboxd film bros. Again keep in mind the differences the internet and home viewing made to cinemagoing.

[Anonymous No.13599271]

>Tsai Ming-liang / Favourite Films
>Ali: Fear Eats the Soul (1974) Rainer Werner Fassbinder,
>L'Eclisse (1962) Michelangelo Antonioni,
>The 400 Blows (1959) François Truffaut,
>Goodbye, Dragon Inn (2003) Tsai Ming-liang,
>Mouchette (1966) Robert Bresson,
>The Night of the Hunter (1955) Charles Laughton,
>The Only Son (1936) Yasujiro Ozu,
>The Passion of Joan of Arc (1928) Carl Theodor Dreyer,
>Spring in a Small Town (1948) Fei Mu,
>Sunrise (1927) F.W. Murnau.
>Source: Sight & Sound (2012)

[Anonymous No.13599274]

>>13599268
>artists have good taste in art
Very funny.

[Anonymous No.13599276]

>>13599274
course they do

[Anonymous No.13599277]

Ah yes, favorite lists that festival regulars give to big shot film journals. There's no way any of these picks are disingenuous reaches for credibility.

[Anonymous No.13599280]

>>13599250
some of them really are horrible. i'd rather be dead than watch andrei rublev again

[Anonymous No.13599283]

>>13599276
>>13599280
Stick to STEM, fellas. It was foolish to try to double dip with a brain so small.

[Anonymous No.13599285]

>>13599280
feel sorry for u

[Anonymous No.13599289]

>>13599283
that's rich

[Anonymous No.13599290]

>>13599283
ik a computer scientist who watches costa, tarr, HHH, cocteau etc and lots of avant garde stuff

[Anonymous No.13599291]

>>13599285
haven't you ever watched any good films?

[Anonymous No.13599292]

>>13599289
Can't hear you over my superior emotional intelligence and appreciation of aesthetic beauty, you'll need to speak up.

[Anonymous No.13599295]

>>13596874
all art is shit, change my mind

[Anonymous No.13599296]

>>13599292
THAT'S RICH

[Anonymous No.13599300]

>>13599290
Good for him. Those aren't quite the cream of the crop but he sounds like a cool guy with a good brain. Many can manage both sides, but most cannot.

[Anonymous No.13599307]

>>13599296
Much better. I hope rich is a word you use for correct.

[Anonymous No.13599313]

Griffith succeeded Dickens, and destoryed literature

[Anonymous No.13599314]

>>13599290
yeah those are sort they'd go for though, isn't it - experimental films. experimental research is all very well for a scientist, but art can't be called a science. science works on a calm intellectual level w proper safeguards against imaginative freedom.
of course, cocteau was all right.

[Anonymous No.13599325]

>>13599313
Griffith never saw the cinema as replacement for theater or literature, that's why he succeeded. His European contemporaries got caught up in some braindead idea that cinema was an extension of theater and all it did was limit their work. There's a reason Scandinavian cinema of the 1910s is all but forgotten.

[Anonymous No.13599357]

>>13599300
>>13599314
i could mention some of the obscurer stuff too like off the top of my head piavoli, ferdinand khittle, don askarian, john smith, yuri ilyenko, sistiago, guerin, jose val omar, leighton pierce, the list goes on...
>>13599300
>Those aren't quite the cream of the crop
well that's subjective and anyway hhh is as good as it gets for me

[Anonymous No.13599366]

>>13599357
>piavoli, ferdinand khittle, don askarian, john smith, yuri ilyenko, sistiago, guerin, jose val omar, leighton pierce
right, but that's just more of the same isn't it

[Anonymous No.13599371]

>>13599325
i didnt say replace. i said destroyed

[Anonymous No.13599382]

>>13599371
actually you said destoryed

[Anonymous No.13599393]

>>13599366
As costa, tarr, HHH and cocteau? Not really

[Anonymous No.13599400]

>>13599371
Yeah, you said destroyed.

[Anonymous No.13599401]

>>13599393
yeah it is. avant-garde filmmakers.

[Anonymous No.13599403]

>>13599366
They're far less stuck in festival aspirations.

[Anonymous No.13599405]

>>13596835
he's right, Mouchette > Balthasar

[Anonymous No.13599408]

>>13599401
Non-mainstream =/= avant garde

[Anonymous No.13599410]

>>13599403
but i wasn't being snobbish, i said experimental films aren't any good

[Anonymous No.13599419]

>>13599408
oh right sistiaga isn't avant-garde?

[Anonymous No.13599424]

>>13599410
My comment has nothing to do with quality, just intention.

[Anonymous No.13599426]

>>13599245
Music is more enjoyable with no visuals.

[Anonymous No.13599432]

>>13599245
have you ever sat and listened to an album entirely with your eyes closed?

[Anonymous No.13599452]

>>13599424
so your comment was 'i know a computer scientist who watches films that aren't artistic but a lot of cineastes go on about them.'
fair.

[Anonymous No.13599472]

>>13599432
Yes. That's the one advantage music has over cinema. You can choose how much you engage with it. Some works are better as background noise, others can take your full attention. Ever been to the symphony or any other concert without a flashy stage production?

[Anonymous No.13599583]

>>13596107
>Godard is my main man
Fucking pseud. Godard is good and his done some important stuff, but Truffaut is objectively the better director. Shit even Agnès varda is better than Godard.

[Anonymous No.13599589]

>>13599583
You have low testosterone levels.

[Anonymous No.13599607]

Griffith, Eisenstien, Flaherty, von Strohiem..
...the list goes on

[Anonymous No.13599608]

>>13596802
>golden age of cinema
sure thing, capeshit is truly the pinical of cinematic potential. Classic Hollywood was the greatest period of cinema. Then we had some greats like bergman and bresson who were true idiosyncratic authors. The only contemporary director that might have the potential to be truly great is Laszlo Nîmes.

[Anonymous No.13599611]

Can we all agree that modern movies, specially hollywood movies, are totally subversive, satanic and low tier propaganda?

[Anonymous No.13599624]

>>13599583
>Thinking political cinema is more important than the question of the human condition
oook retard, I also was 16 at some point

[Anonymous No.13599632]

>>13599624
Ment for >>13599589

[Anonymous No.13599637]

>>13599611
Nah, they've just stopped striving for aesthetic beauty because they know most people will just watch them on their iPads.

[Anonymous No.13599644]

>>13599624
Filming excerpts from your diary is not exploring the human condition. Truffaut and Varda are just Greta Gerwig with a better sense of mise en scene.

[Anonymous No.13599660]

>>13599637
who's they

[Anonymous No.13599663]

>>13599660
Hollywood.

[Anonymous No.13599669]

>>13599583
godard would beat the shit out of truffaut in a fight

[Anonymous No.13599671]

>>13599663
'they' is a neighbourhood in la?

[Anonymous No.13599673]

>>13599669
Absolutely. He also literally made Varda cry by not answering the door when she came calling hahahaha.

[Anonymous No.13599676]

>>13599671
The mainstream American film industry as a whole is often called Hollywood because most of the major studios are located there. Any other questions?

[Anonymous No.13599691]

>>13595987
Why does cinema still exist when videogames have succeeded it?

[Anonymous No.13599693]

>>13599691
Videogames and cinema have so little in common.

[Anonymous No.13599702]

>>13599693
Sticks and stones have very little in common with guns, yet one has succeeded the other. Their difference is the point, brainlet.

[Anonymous No.13599706]

>>13599702
Throwing stones and shooting guns have the same intention.

[Anonymous No.13599713]

>>13599706
>implying fiction, cinema and videogames don't all have the same intention
shiggy.

[Anonymous No.13599723]

>>13599624
Truffaut is for homos who care about stuff like the human condition in status quo filmmaking. Politics is way more interesting and important. La Chinoise is way more interesting and revolutionary than anything Truffaut ever made. What could you get from him that you couldn't get better from every other director of the time.

[Anonymous No.13599726]

>>13599713
Tactile catharsis, visual beauty, and input for imagination are all very different things.

[Anonymous No.13599729]

>>13599713
>anime
>braindead
Why is it always like this? It's a real chicken or the egg situation.

[Anonymous No.13599732]

>>13599295
Same t. trained artfag

[Anonymous No.13599738]

>>13599611
wonder what kind of films she watches

[Anonymous No.13599739]

>>13599732
Anyone dumb enough to blow money on an education in art is only using interest in art as vanity or replacement for personality.

[Anonymous No.13599749]

>>13599738
BMAF pornography with high production value

[Anonymous No.13599756]

>>13599729
This is an anime website you dummie
>>13599726
none of those things are exclusive to videogames or cinema

[Anonymous No.13599772]

>>13599756
Books do not accomplish aesthetic visual beauty, nor do videogames. If you can control the camera the director has given away his chance to build a frame. Videogames and cinema do not feed the imagination in the same way text on a page does. An image, drawing, or model does not stimulate the same part of the brain that interprets text. You should read more about art if you're going to try and have discussions about it.

[Anonymous No.13599795]

>>13599772
>If you can control the camera the director has given away his chance to build a frame
What if within your limitation of camera movement every single possible angle was the directors intended framing.
> do not feed the imagination in the same way text on a page does
My imagination is not that of an artist and I'd rather see what the directors intention was instead of trying to use my own brain.

[Anonymous No.13599807]

>>13597751
They really aren't. Crazy Heart is an excellent contemporary film with plenty of mise en scene, subtext, and a solid message while being consumable enough that the average pleb can understand it. Walking that line is difficult to pull off. And Youth is just delightful and again requires music and visuals with as little dialog as possible that say things without saying them.

[Anonymous No.13599811]

>>13599772
>If you can control the camera the director has given away his chance to build a frame
Also by saying this you are saying virtual reality movies or 3d vr video does not count which I don't believe to be true.

[Anonymous No.13599818]

>>13599200
La Strada is okay too but overall absolutely tryhard

[Anonymous No.13599820]

>>13599795
Compromise has been made by offering multiple angles. The cinema fully utilizes a single frame as well as possible. VR games will be free of the dumb cinema comparisons and people will finally start comparing the medium to architecture, its closest neighbor.
That's why cinema has a reason to exist. Some people prefer or some moods suit a fully curated experience. I'm glad you get the fact that these mediums offer such different experiences.

[Anonymous No.13599825]

>>13599811
They're not cinema, but that's not a mark against them. New technology builds new mediums. VR video is closer to filmed theater finally done justice than cinema.

[Anonymous No.13599826]

>>13595987
Film reduced literature to a niche medium. The fact it's unpopular among the general public attracts a lot of pseud contrarians whose personal taste simply boils down to "popular thing bad, unpopular thing good". Just look at the kind of people who populate this board.

When it comes to why people still produce literature the biggest factor keeping the written word alive is that literature has the lowest barrier of entry of any storytelling medium. Even today, creating a movie simply requires too many resources (cameras, sets, actors, money, etc) and different skill sets (directing, editing, cinematography, etc) for most people to be able to afford. And good luck convincing an actual producer to fund your furry space opera idea. Even comic books require more than books because you either need to be able to draw or have access to someone who can.

With a book though, as long as you can get the words on paper anyone can write about anything. Obviously learning how write well isn't easy, but unlike every other option there is nothing preventing anyone from getting started writing literature. Even quadriplegics have written books.

Eventually (within the next few decades) video games are going to surpass film as the dominant form of storytelling and film is going to get pushed to the sidelines and become a niche interest just like literature did. A lot of the pseuds who fetishize literature will probably jump ship afterwards. People will likely continue to write books that no one reads until a better alternative comes around, though with things like A.I. generated 3D models and language processing it could someday become easy for people to generate their own CGI films and games, at which point there will be no one left to keep literature even partially alive.

[Anonymous No.13599838]

>>13599826
People will always want some kind of passive storytelling. Television will still thrive or audiodrama will come back after cinema is marginalized and videogames become the most popular narrative form.

[Anonymous No.13599848]

>>13599826
How many people engage with videogames as narrative today? It seems most of the best selling games are multiplayer competitive games or sandboxes. Those won't replace the mediums that have had narrative hammered in.

[Anonymous No.13599876]

>>13599676
i think it's lazy blaming these things on 'hollywood'. after all, 'hollywood' doesn't direct films, 'hollywood' has never been cinematographer of a film.

[Anonymous No.13599885]

>>13599691
videogames aren't an art. that's like saying why didn't chess succeed painting

[Anonymous No.13599894]

>>13599691
videogames aren't an art. that's like saying why didn't chess succeed sculpture

[Anonymous No.13599907]

>>13599826
The difference between literature and all other mediums in terms of barriers for entry is very apparent in the endless threads /lit/ gets with people who don't know dick about fuck declaring that they are going to write a book. Never once have I seen someone on /tv/ make a thread declaring that they are making a movie and asking how to do so.

[Anonymous No.13599910]

>>13599885
>>13599894
Good job retard

[Anonymous No.13599917]

>>13599907
You can literally make a full movie with free software and any smart phone.

[Anonymous No.13599919]

>>13599894
Can a chess piece itself be sculpted and be art?

[Anonymous No.13599920]

>>13599894
>art is not art

[Anonymous No.13599932]

>>13599876
Hollywood executives have been taking more and more control of the process since Heaven's Gate. It's entirely up to the people with money how much input their contractors have. Old Hollywood had fat cats with enough sense to only control the stories while granting the hired artists freedom in form and style. Unless we get another Easy Rider that shows executives that unhinged creatives with full control can turn healthy profits, we're going to keep getting weak attempts at four quadrant movies. The chinese film industry is much better because they allow the aestheticians to run wild. Much like old Hollywood all they demand is full control of the content.

[Anonymous No.13599951]

>>13599894
>videogames aren't an art.
Prove it

[Anonymous No.13599998]

>>13595987
>Au Hasard Balthazar
That's pretty much the worst example you could have come up with.

[Anonymous No.13600031]

>>13599919
surely that's just decoration

>>13599951
i think i did, unless you think chess is an art?

[Anonymous No.13600040]

>>13600031
>a specific board game is not art therefore board games are incapable of being art
not that I think there's a lot of art to be seen in board games, but you're a retard

[Anonymous No.13600043]

>>13599919
Sure but using a piece of art in something doesn't make the systems it's used for art.

[Anonymous No.13600049]

>>13600031
surely paintings are just decoration of the wall

[Anonymous No.13600055]

>>13600031
That makes things easy, doesn't it.
>saying x is like saying y lol brainlet
The holocaust never happened, what, are you saying apples aren't a fruit!? ARE YOU SOME KINDA BRAINLET!

[Anonymous No.13600059]

>>13600049
Wallpaper is just decoration on the wall. The fact people use art as wallpaper doesn't make it any less artful.

[Anonymous No.13600066]

>>13600031
Chess is a sport

[Anonymous No.13600070]

>>13599951
https://www.rogerebert.com/rogers-journal/video-games-can-never-be-art

[Anonymous No.13600074]

>>13600070
Ebert was a sweet man but he was also a fat retard who had nothing to say.

[Anonymous No.13600075]

>>13600070
>implying i am going to read all that shit
what is this? some kind of reading board?

[Anonymous No.13600078]

>>13600070
Roger Ebert didn't even understand Gentlemen Broncos. He's too old to make that decision.

[Anonymous No.13600106]

>>13600070
>One obvious difference between art and games is that you can win a game. It has rules, points, objectives, and an outcome. Santiago might cite a immersive game without points or rules, but I would say then it ceases to be a game and becomes a representation of a story, a novel, a play, dance, a film.
Here's where he's wrong. Taking away points, objectives and outcomes from a video game does not reduce it to a facade over another art form. In the same way that La Jetée contains no moving pictures, but is still elevated above and separate from photography as a medium, a video game without the game is not just a video.

[Anonymous No.13600107]

>>13600040
why can't chess be an art if videogames can?

>>13600066
some people consider videogames a sport (esports)
re chess though, you'd think a sport would involve some athletic activity.

[Anonymous No.13600110]

>>13600107
Dota 2 is also a badass sport and is rated as the most toxic online gaming community by the anti defamation league (jews)

[Anonymous No.13600111]

>>13600059
Same could be said for the chess pieces friend, chess is art

[Anonymous No.13600116]

>>13600078

[Anonymous No.13600118]

>>13600111
Chess is a sport not an art. If it were an art then supercomputers wouldn't be the best at it. You probably don't even follow chess or have a favorite player

[Anonymous No.13600120]

>>13600107
>why can't chess be an art if videogames can?
Because chess isn't a medium. Chess is a single example of a board game and there is no artist or intention behind chess to provoke thought or emotion. If you look at chess as art, it is the lens you look through itself which is the art, not chess. Are board games capable of being art? Sure, just as video games are capable of being art, but specific video games may not be.

[Anonymous No.13600124]

>>13600049
no. painting does something different, doesn't it

[Anonymous No.13600136]

>>13600120
well rollercoasters are made to provoke emotion. a stop smoking ad is meant to provoke thought. you wouldn't call those things art

[Anonymous No.13600139]

>>13600118
>If it were an art then supercomputers wouldn't be the best at it.
Just a matter of time, friend. AI is already making great music and paintings. Won't be long until they make shit that's better than anything we can even conceive.
>You probably don't even follow chess or have a favorite player
Fucking nerd, who actually "follows chess"?

[Anonymous No.13600140]

>>13599932
so they say, but then david lynch and refn still make films
>The chinese film industry
not europe?

[Anonymous No.13600141]

>>13600116
He didn't say it was bad. He said he simply doesn't understand or comprehend it. Ebert is only capable of reviewing completely contemporary movies. He had no eye for anything less than contemporary.

[Anonymous No.13600149]

>>13600118
do you mean it's a science?
supercomputers aren't typically good at sports

[Anonymous No.13600157]

>>13600140
Major European studios put out stuff just as aesthetically weak as Hollywood. They have a richer indie camp due to more opportunities for government funding through lotteries and stuff like that though. Interesting American filmmakers still exist and work outside the major studios though. Zahler, Jost, Benning, Wiseman, etc.

[Anonymous No.13600160]

>>13600141
are you using 'contemporary' wrong?

[Anonymous No.13600161]

>>13600139
Ai doesn't make "great" music or paintings. It makes mediocre music and paintings following established rules. Just because walking around the chord wheel is easy and sounds correct doesn't make it good.

I enjoy following chess and dota 2 because it's essentially people with iqs of 180 playing mind games against each other. If you actually follow what they're doing it's incredibly fun to follow. However, now that chess has more or less been solved it has become very boring in classical. This last year was 12 draws in a row between the two top rated players. Blitz and bullet are a lot more exciting because players take risky moves knowing they're bad simply because their opponent can't have that line memorized.

[Anonymous No.13600162]

>>13595987
Costs and consumption of the mediums are fundamentally different.

[Anonymous No.13600177]

>>13600160
No, I'm using it as normal for the time. Gentleman Broncos isn't normal for the time at all. Contemporary means run of the mill for any time. You could say that any movie is contemporary for it's established time if it doesn't break expectations and normality for that time. Ebert only ever could review movies of this nature.

[Anonymous No.13600192]

>>13600149
Play a sports game on max difficulty.

[Anonymous No.13600194]

>>13600161
>following established rules
The whole point of AI is that it doesn't follow established rules. It's not like an algorithm with some randomness thrown in. You don't give it a set of rules to follow and tell it to go. There's no way for us to even tell what "rules" an AI is following and why it is doing what it is doing.

I agree with the rest of what you are saying entirely.

[Anonymous No.13600202]

>>13600192
play tennis with a PC

[Anonymous No.13600206]

>>13600194
Look up the circle of fifths. The ai is absolutely following it. You may need to look up the major scale first to get it but it should be easy to follow if you have basic musical education. Then if you understand that look up a good pop song like Lithium by Nirvana. It does not.

[Anonymous No.13600210]

>>13600177
contemporary generally just means 'of the time'.
& i think you're wrong about that, i don't always agree with him but ebert liked true stories you know, and f for fake.

[Anonymous No.13600213]

>>13600194
>It's not like an algorithm with some randomness thrown in.
You're vastly overestimating AI. All AI at its core is a single mathematical equation which it is trying to optimize. It might seem more complex, but it's not and NEVER will be.

[Anonymous No.13600224]

>>13600202
Again, if you run it within a phyics engine you will lose. The only thing constraining it is actual physical space in which case you need robotics and they are too hard to engineer against millions of years of evolution. However, why don't you try rallying a tennis ball against an air cannon serving at 500fps you pedantic fuck.

[Anonymous No.13600234]

>>13600210
People who say hurrr this was based on a true story is the biggest mark of the pleb.

Fucking Jaws was based on a true story. Fuck that statement makes me angry. All the biggest retards say that as if screenwriting isn't a general formula that necessitates the sculpting of the narritive. God I fucking hate "based on a true story"

[Anonymous No.13600237]

>>13600224
>The only thing constraining it is actual physical space
sports are primarily concerned with pyhsical space aren't they

[Anonymous No.13600241]

>>13600234
true stories the 1986 film

[Anonymous No.13600244]

>>13600241
great movie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYnNIWKK8sw

[Anonymous No.13600248]

>>13600213
AI will keep progressing until it transcends pleb human intelligence, just you wait.

[Anonymous No.13600253]

>>13600244
good, isn't it. it's like a film an alien would make

[Anonymous No.13600256]

>>13596874

[Anonymous No.13600260]

>>13600118
We are talking a chesspiece not chess.

[Anonymous No.13600269]

>>13600256

[Anonymous No.13600276]

one might argue that film is a young media and still a load of untapped potential meanwhile literature is older than most abrahamic religions and their potential was used in a lot of different ways, but i have yet to see something novel as what Joyce did when he wrote Finnegan´s Wake

[Anonymous No.13600285]

>>13600260
Well that's the fundemental question of whether an ornate tool is art from swords to buildings to pipes.

[Anonymous No.13600287]

>>13599691

[Anonymous No.13600290]

>>13600206
Again, it's just a matter of time. AI is improving.

[Anonymous No.13600296]

the Emily Dickinson of film is alive and making masterpieces on her iphone right now

[Anonymous No.13600309]

>>13600296
>on her iphone right now

[Anonymous No.13600315]

>>13600296
post feet

[Anonymous No.13600327]

>>13600296
She’s Nobody

[Anonymous No.13600378]

>>13600290
Read Jung

[Anonymous No.13600409]

>in today's episode, average /lit/izens pretend to have seen more movies than the oldest film critics in the world combined
>tune in tomorrow when they'll be pretending to have read every book ever written

[Anonymous No.13600410]

>>13600378
W-why?

[Anonymous No.13600434]

>>13600409
where do the /lit/izens do that?

[Anonymous No.13600517]

>>13599998
How could you be on this board and not think Bresson is on of the best film has to offer

[a_poor_sinner !!eiHxl4pZe1i No.13600532]

>>13595987
I love this film.

[Anonymous No.13600558]

>>13600070
That was just embarrassing to read.

>I don't like games therfore they're not art.

Jesus christ what a brainlet.

[Anonymous No.13600574]

>>13596168

wut?

I did not know there was a 5 hr version. I love that film.

[Anonymous No.13600578]

>>13600558
he specifically didn't say that

[Anonymous No.13600609]

>>13600578
if you actually read the article you would know that he did

[Anonymous No.13600627]

>>13600609
does not

[Anonymous No.13600630]

>>13595987
The fact that you ask this displays you haven’t really had an authentic experience with either medium.

[Anonymous No.13600633]

" Why are gamers so intensely concerned, anyway, that games be defined as art? Bobby Fischer, Michael Jordan and Dick Butkus never said they thought their games were an art form. Nor did Shi Hua Chen, winner of the $500,000 World Series of Mah Jong in 2009. Why aren't gamers content to play their games and simply enjoy themselves? They have my blessing, not that they care.

Do they require validation? In defending their gaming against parents, spouses, children, partners, co-workers or other critics, do they want to be able to look up from the screen and explain, "I'm studying a great form of art?" Then let them say it, if it makes them happy."

Of course that this article becomes the main focus of an already lousy thread. Of course that 20year olds who've just found themselves are engaging in this debate. Of course that article of his has 5k comments whereas some reviews don't get half a dozen. Just migrate to /v/ if you think Bioshock, Journey and The Last of Us are to be thought of as art.
Who even cares?

[Anonymous No.13600648]

there's a game called The Beginner's Guide which everyone in this thread should play

[Anonymous No.13600660]

>>13600648
it's rubbish

[Anonymous No.13600676]

>>13600660
that's your opinion, but you cannot disagree that it's a video game as art regardless of whether or not you think it's successful

[Anonymous No.13600699]

>>13596802
>we're currently in a golden age of film

[Anonymous No.13600703]

>>13600699
it's true and none of it is being made in America

[Anonymous No.13600709]

>>13600676
just interactive fiction though isn't it

[Anonymous No.13600716]

>>13600699
the other side of the wind was released last year

[Anonymous No.13600719]

>>13599271
>list of Tsai Ming-liang's favorite films
>incudes one of his own films

It's pretty good though, I'll give him that.

[Anonymous No.13600736]

>>13600719
fellini did the same thing
when you're the best you're the best

[Anonymous No.13600760]

>>13600709
Does that mean it's just a movie with controls or a book narrated at you with a visual aid? It's clearly its own art form. If he got someone else to narrate it that doesn't sound like a nasally white guy it absolutely would be thought of as the first piece of video games as art (maybe second after Shadow of the Colossus), but so many people immediately dismiss it as "pretentious" when in fact it is incredibly sincere.

[Anonymous No.13600897]

>>13599123
Words are images.

I love film as well, and I really don't want to reduce either medium, but I personally move to books more often because have more content in general and are capable of shifting between subjects and sensations without, generally, wasting as much time on exposition. They're also capable of getting away with more, even in pulpier stuff.
Books are also inherently cool because you're invoking hallucinations based from symbols on paper. That, and it generally takes more effort to read and pay attention to a book than watch a film (not to say that films are inherently less meaningful, but that the barrier to entry (and inadvertently, the chances of creating a more observant viewer) are simply lower with film.)

[Anonymous No.13600927]

>>13600897
Same person here, to phrase things more broadly beyond my current preference: Those who complain of films being worse need to watch good films, those who complain of books need to read good books. Where are the good films/books? I don't know. You have to look for them. You have to try.
Studying lit and film in the brief stints of schooling helped me develop skills that work across all these mediums.
I love both Tartovsky and Dostoyevsky. They both do very similar things in vastly different ways. Even being a media slave in the modern world can be pretty interesting.

[Anonymous No.13600933]

>>13600676
Pathologic is dank as fuck.

[Anonymous No.13600936]

>>13600927
I love Tark and I dislike Dosto very much

[Anonymous No.13601281]

>>13600760
yeah. it's a representation of a story. it's like this talk of VR films. theres no real game element. it in no way benefits from interactivity. also it's stupid, pointless & horrible writing.

[Anonymous No.13601376]

>>13596395
>>13596585
Ingmar Bergman was right, literally who gives a fuck about a donkey
>ooh look it's like a crown of thorns like Jesus or something
fuck off it's a donkey

[Anonymous No.13601385]

>>13596802
>we're currently in a golden age of film
yikes

[Anonymous No.13601395]

>>13601385
if you were paying any kind of attention to anything other than hollywood blockbusters you would agree

[Anonymous No.13601407]

>>13599608
Zvaginstev????

[Anonymous No.13601454]

>>13596585
Lee Chang-Dong is the best Korean director, and Croenberg and Haneke lol...

[Anonymous No.13601466]

>>13600699
Timbuktu, Son of Saul, Poetry, Shoplifters, Leviathan, Loveless, Manchester by the Sea, Boyhood, Columbus, A Separation, Mr. Turner, Hard to be a God, Before Midnight, Amour, 45 Years all came out in the 2010s....

[Anonymous No.13601488]

>>13596236
>a creature whose existence the human mind can not grasp understanding.

Lovecraft consistently used that as a crutch to avoid description. I get what he was going for, though.

[Anonymous No.13601499]

Is it true she slept with pretty much every director she worked with? Bresson was like 50 years older than her, what a weirdo

[Anonymous No.13601508]

>>13601499
Bresson proposed to her and she said no. She then married Godard. French women hardly ever have sex statistically, much less than American women.

[Anonymous No.13601614]

>>13601508
>She then married Godard.
she was a downgrade from anna karina desu

[Anonymous No.13601688]

>>13600574
yh
few different versions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Until_the_End_of_the_World#Versions

[Anonymous No.13601729]

>>13601508
Just because she rejected his proposal doesn't mean they didn't date

[Anonymous No.13601738]

>>13601395
Name 5 worthwhile directors working today (outside of Hollywood of course)

[Anonymous No.13601742]

>>13601614
Anne aged way better

[Anonymous No.13601753]

>>13601738
Zvaginstev, linklater, nemes, lee Chang dong, Andrew haigh, chazelle, koreeda, Jenkins, Cuaron, asgar farhadi, dardenne brothers, mike Leigh, pta

[Anonymous No.13601763]

>>13601753
Debra granik

[Anonymous No.13601769]

>>13601742
Karina is one of the most sexually appealing woman I’ve ever seen, but Anne is more objectively attractive if that makes any sense.

[Anonymous No.13601798]

>>13601753
>Linklater
>Haigh
>Chazelle (really?)
Nemes didn't make anything worthwhile past Son of Saul btw. I feel like you think you made a point but just try to compare these people to the names you would have listed at pretty much any other time in film making history they lose. We are not in anything close to a golden age, we are in the age where people get their art films from A24.

[Anonymous No.13601808]

>>13601769
in the judgement of paris, hera was more attractive, but paris chose aphrodite, the goddess of sex

[Anonymous No.13601831]

Why does Cinema exist when television has succeeded it?

[Anonymous No.13601840]

>>13601831
congratulations on being the 100th person to say that

[Anonymous No.13601916]

>>13595987
>>13596054
you are both retarded

>>13596114
>surreal literature in a movie
see Dreams That Money Can Buy, or anything by Lanthimos, or Brazil

>>13596116
>the fact that a game must be animated
see text adventures
>the experience can't be curated
It's as curated as reading a novel.

>>13596236
>Art and poems, do this effect better because they are simplest forms of art and can be the most metaphorical of them all.
see montage, especially Soviets (formalist theory in "Poetika kino", and films by Eisenstein, Vertov, Dovzhenko, Ilyenko) - film can be insanely metaphorical

>>13599195
further proof!

>>13599826
Narration is not an essential aspect of video games, and is in fact quite unimportant

>>13600194
AlphaGo does not follow established rules, but "AI" that creates music and poetry, for example, is massively constrained. In music it can have some principles such as music theory, harmony, etc., but when it starts smashing words together to make a poem it's painfully obvious it's just randomized crap.

[Anonymous No.13602033]

>>13596835
Do you know where I could read the entire interview?

[Anonymous No.13602076]

>>13599357
>don askarian
Where did you find his stuff?

[Anonymous No.13602126]

>>13596835
>but a human being is always interesting
ingmar bergman isn't

[Anonymous No.13602130]

>>13602126
says anonymous 4chan poster

[Anonymous No.13602140]

>>13602130
says anonymous 4chan poster

[Anonymous No.13602164]

>>13602140
i'm not the one calling one of the most revered auteurs of all time uninteresting

[Anonymous No.13602177]

>>13596116
I think it's getting there very slowly. It has to evolve more before it can become an artform.
I would say BotW showed some potential to become a proto-work-of-art, but it became too caught up in being a "fun" game and selling units to actually get there

[Anonymous No.13602180]

>>13595987
The current state of cinema is a disgrace.

[Anonymous No.13602187]

>>13595987
Mark my words: The future of literature will arise directly out of Borges.

[Anonymous No.13602240]

>>13600648
Lol Nabakov's Pale Fire ripoff that game.

[I Love Harry Potter No.13602262]

>>13599583
>objectively the better director
Dropped. There is no such thing as objectivity when it comes to art.

[Anonymous No.13602275]

>>13602164
what an uninteresting thing to do eh

[Anonymous No.13602281]

All mediums have strengths and weaknesses. Cinema can't be as descriptive or as narrative driven as a novel.

[Anonymous No.13602288]

>>13602281
cinema generally is narrative driven

[I Love Harry Potter No.13602298]

>>13596802
>we are currently in a golden age of film, at a time when major corporations have taken over a huge amount of studios and make movies for the sake of money. An age where Hollywood is filled with pedos and the bourgeois (though it always has been but at least it had some merit suring the earlier years). The festivals and award shows consist of rich people nominating films that depict class struggle as they sip on the finest thousand dollar beverages and kick out the people who aren't dressed in a way they find satisfying (it must be past a certain amount of money to be satisfying) as they turn their shoulders to the homeless man asking for spare change. Ah yes, the golden age of film.

[Anonymous No.13602340]

>>13602298
Maybe consider that exactly when the accolades lose all merit and the money ball has been figured out that art produced for its own sake shines the brightest

[Anonymous No.13602388]

>>13595987
Take Ulysses. The parody, the structure, the POV is all shifting so frequently that it would be impossible to capture to film. If it was, it would be inherently the less

[Anonymous No.13602418]

>tfw wanna get into cinema but the hobby costs like 100€ a day if you wanna watch films all day and piracy is morally wrong

[Anonymous No.13602431]

it hasn't. the best films are not equal to the best works of literature. there just isn't a film equivalent to shakespeare or homer, and you're lying if you say there is. i say this as a huge film buff.

[Anonymous No.13602462]

>>13595987
Unironically the best modern lit is in mystery, thriller, and fantasy/sci fi. Harry Potter will be read at LEAST on the level of Dickens in the future.

Literature is a bit of a slush pile too; time will tell what is actually enduring.

Film's okay. Books and video games will always be better because they require you to engage your brain to consume the entertainment. Film is more event-based than literature or vidya, which are the superior artforms.

[Anonymous No.13602534]

>>13602418
>piracy is morally wrong
Just go to the library and borrow DVDs from there then, and visit arthouse cinemas (they're really cheap).
Also, what the fuck, why would you watch films all day, I doubt even the most obsessive cinephiles can bear to watch more then 2/day.

[Anonymous No.13602569]

>>13602534
i watched 2 films a day for like half a year, loved it

[Anonymous No.13602593]

>>13602462
>Books and video games will always be better because they require you to engage your brain to consume the entertainment.
don't really understand why you think that doesn't apply to film too unless all you watch are superhero films
if you turn your brain off and watch a tarr or tml film you will get nothing from it

[Anonymous No.13602598]

>>13596107
>dashielle hammett
You make him sound like a black chick

[Anonymous No.13602612]

>>13602593
Tarr? Tml?

[Anonymous No.13602681]

>>13602612
bela tarr
tsai ming liang

[Anonymous No.13602691]

>>13602598
lmao
was a decent film 2bh

[Anonymous No.13602699]

>>13595987
>succeeded
What did he mean by this?

[Anonymous No.13602761]

>>13601831
name ONE good television series

[Anonymous No.13602769]

>>13602761
the sopranos

[Anonymous No.13602830]

>>13602761
The Prisoner

[Anonymous No.13602851]

>>13602761
Dekalog

[Anonymous No.13602854]

>>13602761
Planet Earth

[Anonymous No.13602875]

>>13602761
mad men

[Anonymous No.13603027]

>>13602761
james burke's connections
(only true patricians will know this)

[Anonymous No.13603033]

>>13603027
orson welles had that idea in 1982. can you imagine how good that tv show would've been

[Anonymous No.13603049]

>>13595987
Movies are just a series of appearances.

[Anonymous No.13603075]

>>13603049
so is reality brainlet

[Anonymous No.13603182]

>>13602769
>>13602830
>>13602851
>>13602854
>>13602875
>>13603027
None of these are good

[Anonymous No.13603186]

>>13603182
no one saw that coming

[Anonymous No.13603200]

>>13602569
I've been watching at least 2 films a day for the past couple of months
There's just so many fucking films to watch lol

[Anonymous No.13603201]

The one thing I envy film is the ability for a group of people to enjoy it together.

[Anonymous No.13603205]

>>13603182
Have you seen James Burke's connections?

[Anonymous No.13603219]

>>13603201
desu that's how literature was consumed in the past too, it was recited to a group of people

[Anonymous No.13603243]

>>13603182
>he didn't like Kieślowski's Dekalog
you either haven't watched it or you are a philistine

[Anonymous No.13603959]

>>13601798
Sunset was good; he's only made two movies. A24 is mostly terrible, but The Florida Project, Moonlight, Lady Bird, Eighth Grade, Krisha and 45 Years were all relatively good. We're not in a golden age, but there's about 5 good to very good films a year that are enjoyable and Mr. Turner, Hard to Be a God, Leviathan, and Boyhood are some of the best films I've ever seen. Blockbusters have been absolutely terrible with the exception of Mad Max Fury Road and the several enjoyable Pixar movies like Inside Out and the Toy Story sequels.

[Anonymous No.13603981]

>>13603201
Watching films alone is an inherently superior experience

[Anonymous No.13603983]

>>13603219
Yes I'm sure Hippocrates writings, Plotinus, and Aristotle were read out loud among friend groups . Nice try pleb

[Anonymous No.13603986]

>>13603981
Agreed. Seeing the new Tarantino movie alone in a practically empty theater was a great experience. I usually hate his films too and actually thought this one was great.

[Anonymous No.13604385]

>>13596835
Anyone who cannot sympathize with the donkey in Au Hassard Balthazar should be executed outright, and I would gladly take the role of the executioner.
Ingmar Bergman is a little overrated to me besides a few of his films. I also thought Fanny and Alexander was trash, and I honestly liked that antisemitic pastor more than the creepy occult Jew living in the attic. Reflecting over that whole film kind of disgusts me for some reason, as if it came from the fever dream of a despicable Jew with a kind of Peter Pan syndrome. Also, Wild Strawberries is complete trash.

[Anonymous No.13604390]

>>13603983
Aristotle's work was mostly lecture notes genius

[Anonymous No.13604414]

>>13604385
>Wild Strawberries is complete trash
>but Au Hasard Balthazar is good
yikes
Fanny and Alexander did suck though I'll give you that

[Anonymous No.13604448]

>>13596835
Bergman fucking protestant existentialist faggot that's why he hated animals because he hated the physical world and existence itself he only loved the pain of the kierkeegardian tragedy of man with the Calvinist concept of an unjust world. Fuck him.

[Anonymous No.13604453]

>>13604448
unjust God* sorry. Fucking Lutheran bitch.

[Anonymous No.13604495]

>>13604414
>>13604385
> Random anons on an anime forum agree the best director of all time's best film is bad
Can't make this shit up. The fucking state of /lit

[Anonymous No.13604504]

>>13595987
>cinema has succeeded it
lmao, kino is tresh

[Anonymous No.13604516]

>>13604495
Fanny and Alexander is not his best film...

[Anonymous No.13604520]

>>13595987
>you on lit board
>- i prefere cinema over books
than why you here? go fuck youre self or some thing

[Anonymous No.13604525]

>>13604520
ya we lit board is good word smarts we dont need youre self here

[Anonymous No.13604533]

>>13603983
tasty b8

[Anonymous No.13604546]

>>13604525
that what im talking about, thy you here still?

[Anonymous No.13604718]

>>13603182
watch Gantz or ill piss in your ear

[Anonymous No.13604773]

VR porn had ascended all media

[Anonymous No.13605107]

>>13604495
what? no one mentioned welles

[Anonymous No.13605423]

>>13595987
Except that film is shit and only women like it.