/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.11547252]

Is this man worth reading? If so what? I've becomes curious about him since I saw a quote of his on rationalists and it was great.

[Anonymous No.11547278]

Introduction to the Study of the Hindu Doctrines is good

Guenon is cool and you should definitely read him but most of the people who talk about him are sand niggers in a Muslim cult so be careful about them. Also Guenon himself was a bit nutty, he thought sorcerers were attacking him and shit. In general there is a lot of cult nonsense surrounding him that you have to get through to read his interesting philosophy.

[Anonymous No.11547290]

>>11547252

Yes, he is very good. He is kind of divisive on /lit/ and so in any thread on him half of the people will be posting angry shitposts and rants about him while the other half will be devout fans who've read half a dozen or more of his books. You should just read him and decide for yourself.

It's recommended that you start with his first book Introduction to the Study of the Hindu Doctrines (of which Hinduism only forms about 1/3 of the book), which is very helpful for understanding all of his other books. From there it's generally recommended that you read him more or less chronologically although you can skip his ones on theosophy and the spiritualist fallacy.

You can find all his books online here for free.

https://archive.org/details/reneguenon

[Anonymous No.11547315]

>>11547278
>>11547290
Great! Thank you.

[Anonymous No.11547493]

>Hates Gnosticism
>Doesn't understand Neoplatonism
Overrated

[Anonymous No.11547530]

>>11547493
In what way did Guenon not understand Neoplatonism?

[Anonymous No.11547567]

>>11547530
Such was Schuon's assessment

[Anonymous No.11547586]

read eliade first, he's like a watered down version that will help you understand guenon when you get to him

[Anonymous No.11548304]

>>11547567
I don't really buy most of what Schuon says. Aside from all the weird behavior he also made a number of questionable claims such as where he equates baptism and other Christian rites with initiation by an eastern guru/master. I've read parts of Guenons writings where he refers to the Neoplatonists as being clearly 'Traditional' in the sense of reflecting the perennial metaphysical tradition, although he didn't seem to regard it as being on par with the easterm doctrines; he definitely had studied it though.

[Anonymous No.11548307]

>>11547586
Got a chart?

[Anonymous No.11548366]

>>11547252
He seems like a gay brainlet full of ressentiment and low iq orientalist nonsense

[Anonymous No.11548423]

>>11548366
>able to read Greek, Latin, English, Italian, German, Spanish, Sanskrit, Hebrew, Arabic and classical Chinese
>brainlet

>married a woman and had children with her
>gay

>wrote multiple books pointing out all the mistakes the orientalists made about eastern doctrines
>orientalist

[Anonymous No.11548489]

[Anonymous No.11548560]

>>11547252
I recently finished his Introduction to the Study of Hindu doctrines and enjoyed it, although it can be tedious at points and some of the explanations of the doctrine just went over my head. I'll read more from him soon though to get a better view of him.

[Anonymous No.11548627]

>>11547252
>It’s you! The hero of Kvatch!

[Anonymous No.11548662]

>>11548560
>and some of the explanations of the doctrine just went over my head

If there is anything in particular you didn't get that you wanted to ask a question about, I could probably explain it for you in a way that makes more sense

>t. Guenon and eastern-boo

[Anonymous No.11548693]

>>11548662
Most of my misunderstanding occurred when he was explaining the six different darshanas. The only ones I felt that I understood in any capacity were Nyaya, Yoga, and Vedanta. And by understand, I mean I understood the gist of what Guenon was getting at. But the other ones went over my head for the most part. If you wanted to explain them, that'd be nice. But I know that's a lot to explain and I should probably re-read the chapters on them.

One question you could answer though is whether his Studies in Hindu Doctrines might help me understand it all better or if it'll be too difficult to grasp if I didn't understand some of the introduction.

[Anonymous No.11548980]

>>11548693

Hmm. Unless you had specific questions about them that you wanted answered, I wouldn't really know how to clear up your misunderstanding other posting a mini-essay consisting of everything I know about them which would be pretty time-consuming. Certainly, I would recommend reading primary texts in conjunction with his works. Not only does he help you understand the primary texts better, but when you read primary texts and than go back and read his works it makes Guenon's books make more sense because you know from experience what ideas and concepts he is talking about. 'Studies in Hinduism' would definitely help you understand Guenon's ideas and his view of Hinduism better although from what I remember of reading it the book does not focus much on the Darshanas, its a collection of essays on random aspects of it like Tantra, Kundalini, the Hindu theory of elements, caste etc but the Darshanas are not featured much.

>The only ones I felt that I understood in any capacity were Nyaya, Yoga, and Vedanta

Vaisheshika is similar to Nyaya in that it is a way of classifying and studying phenomena, although where Nyaya concerns itself with the nature of logic, perception, experience etc Vaisheshika focuses mainly on studying natural phenomena, or in the Hindu view various aspects of the divine manifestation that have to more with exterior phenomena and not mental things like logic. It's similar to the Greek naturalistic philosophy like Parmenides or Heraclitus, although that comparison should not be taken too literally as Vaisheshika largely took place within the context of the Vedic teachings and in interaction with other Darshanas, it does not rely on or heavily involve empiricism.

Mimansa explores the more Confucian aspect of the Vedas, it mostly revolves around correct understanding of and the correct practicing of the Vedic rituals, understanding what the Vedas have to say about codes of conduct, rules, jurisprudence, how one should conduct life and so on. In addition to exploring the correct ceremonial methods it also involves studying dharma and what the Vedas teach about the results of rituals, i.e. about using them to dissipate accumulated karma, to prepare oneself for or to help one attain moksha or heavenly realms etc. Both Mimansa and Vedanta focus specifically on studying the Vedas, although Mimansa concerns itself with the exterior aspects while Vedanta concerns itself with the internal realizations that the Vedic texts (which includes the Upanishads) discuss; hence why Vedanta is sometimes referred to as Brahma-Mimansa (study of/contemplating god).

[Anonymous No.11548984]

>>11548693
>>11548980

Samkhya is in a sense basic metaphysical speculation, it mostly adheres to the Vedas (like all the Darshanas) while at the same time not relying exclusively on them for its speculation. Samkhya is similar to Vaisheshika although it differs from it in that Samkhya concerns itself more with 'cosmological' or 'spiritual' speculation instead of a study of 'things as they appear/natural phenomena'. Samkhya is where detailed ideas about things like Purusha/Prakriti, the theory of the Gunas etc were formalized after taking the portions of the Vedas that briefly mention or hint at them and then developing those ideas further. Samkhya largely focuses on these ideas themselves without putting them into an all-encompassing doctrine that completes the Vedas, this is where Vedanta comes in. Vedanta largely agrees with Samkhya and incorporates most of its ideas, but Vedanta goes further than Samhkya by taking Samhkya's ideas and fitting them into an understanding of the Vedic teaching in its whole, synthesizing all the Darshanas into a common understanding that together complete the Vedic doctrine; as an example of this Vedanta accepts and further fleshes out things like Purusha and the Gunas while understanding that they are just ancillary and complementary ways of approaching how the Vedas teach the path to the final stages of realization and liberation, but that these stages in themselves go way beyond speculation about these things.

I myself have reread certain chapters of 'ITTSOTHD' and understood them better the second time around. Rereading them is definitely a good idea, although it's especially good to do so after you have already read some primary Hindu texts. Some short primary texts that you could read to help you get a TLDR of what Guenon is talking about would be the Atma Bodha, Yoga Yajnavalkya, Ashtavakra Gita and the Bhagavad-Gita. The Bhagavad-Gita is best understood with a really in-depth commentary (like Shankara's) but reading a simple and dumbed-down like Easwarans only takes a little time and helps you see an example of how a bunch of Hindu ideas are combined into one coherent understanding. For the Ashtavakra Gita I'd highly recommend John Richards translation (which is sadly only online and not in any book). Here are some short texts that you can read on your computer or phone.

Atma Bodha (takes 10-20 minutes to read)
http://www.lovebliss.eu/Download/Atma%20Bodha.pdf

Ashtavakra Gita (1-3 hours, very good)
https://realization.org/p/ashtavakra-gita/richards.ashtavakra-gita/richards.ashtavakra-gita.html

[Anonymous No.11548992]

>>11548304
Yes he mentions the "Alexandiran school" (i.e. Neoplatonists) in a number of books, such as Intro to Hindu Doctrines

[Anonymous No.11549041]

>>11547252
What was the rationalist quote, OP?

[Anonymous No.11549050]

>>11549041

[Anonymous No.11549360]

>>11547252
He's a pseud and his views on hinduism is not worth exploring. Skip.

[Anonymous No.11549399]

>>11549360
>t. hasn't read Guenon

[Anonymous No.11549443]

>>11548984
You're awesome, anon. That was pretty helpful. I'll read these links you sent me and find the primary texts (which I wanted to do anyways). I really like Hinduism. It's pretty fascinating stuff, but also super complicated and you helped out a bit.

[Anonymous No.11549468]

>>11549399
>t. hasn't read anything other than Abdul "Geunon" Yahya

[Anonymous No.11550365]

>>11549468
>thinks that mentioning Guenon's adopted Arabic name does anything other than highlight your own lack of serious criticism of him

Adopting a name in the local language is something that regularly happens when people from one culture move to another, not just from west to east and vice versa but even from one part of Europe to another. The only people who would be bothered by him taking an Arabic name would be /pol/-crossposters who don't even read him anyway.

[Anonymous No.11550822]

>>11550365
For that matter, in the ancient world, adopting the local gods was also a matter of course when moving to a new location, espcially since it was readily understood that the gods of other peoples were the same as one's own but clothed in somewhat different forms and called by different names. A Greek who moved to India would have quickly identified Indra as being Zeus.

[Anonymous No.11551206]

>>11550365
>upset that his literary idol cucked himself to a shite islamic order
what makes it funnier is that his real name is a fucking monkey

[Anonymous No.11551213]

>>11548307
read in this order:
>the sacred and the profane
>his three volumes on history of religion
>if you want, the books on yoga and shamanism
all but the last two are quick reads and i think will greatly amplify your readings of guenon

[Anonymous No.11551244]

Crypto fascism general

[Anonymous No.11551503]

>>11551206
>Joining a religion is cucking

[Anonymous No.11551511]

>>11551213
Thanks