/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.10394517]

any idea what kind of income an average self-published author make if they produce one novel per year?

[Anonymous No.10394520]

>>10394517
Below the poverty line

[Anonymous No.10394525]

pretty much nothing. absolutely nothing if they don't put in hours self-promoting.

[Anonymous No.10394537]

>>10394517
i like her shoes

[Anonymous No.10394554]

Once you pay for an editor, you'll owe money.

[Anonymous No.10394562]

>>10394517
Who buys your book?
Do they buy it online from places like itunes and the kindle store or do you want it stocked at traditional book stores?
How do these people know that your book is something they should read, how do you advertise it, and what kind of people do you think you should target your advertising at?
How much are you willing to spend on producing, marketing, and distributing the book you've written?

answer these before you try to self publish desu

[Anonymous No.10394582]

>>10394562
A lot of these depend on what country you live in too.
For example in fucking leafland, if you write a piece of fiction, the government will suck your cock if it's even halfway decent and you can expect to get government money and grants as well as plugs in local media.

[Anonymous No.10394593]

i see

well then, what's the realistic path to becoming an author that's paid well enough to have roof & food security?

[Anonymous No.10394599]

https://www.tckpublishing.com/amazon-book-sales-calculator/

Multiply the number by the book’s list price*0.7.

If you are good, you’ll make good money.

If you are shitty, you’ll not make any money.

It’s that simple.

Why is this question even necessary?

[Anonymous No.10394601]

>>10394593
Be good. That’s the only realistic path. The method doesn’t matter. Are you trying to cover up your mediocrity with method? It won’t work.

[Anonymous No.10394604]

There are quite a few who makes good money.

Doesn’t mean you can be one of them, OP.

http://authorearnings.com/report/may-2016-report/

[Anonymous No.10394606]

>>10394593
Oh that is easy get an MFA from Bryn Mawr and become a professor and regularly contribute to the New Yorker and NPR

[Anonymous No.10394616]

>>10394593
Work a job and write in your spare time.
If the book is good, you can quit your job.
Being a skilled writer, or it least imaginative, are necessary.

[Anonymous No.10394627]

>>10394517
Give me the premise of your book and I'll tell you if you have a chance.

[Anonymous No.10394658]

On average? Probably less than a dime.

[Anonymous No.10394688]

>>10394627
>>10394601
>>10394616
i dunno, i'm 19 trying to decide what to invest my energy in long-term...

i come up with neat scenes often though, i guess... i don't want to embarrass myself trying to write it formally so i'll give it to you the best way i know how
>me and my dumbass brother kidnapped some rich guy's 15yo son
>we set up the exchange, simple trade: kid for his money
>kid's face has been all over town, can't risk putting him in the car so we pack him in the trunk
>we get to the exchange point, a desolate field with a river separating us and the father
>i see the father, he has a red duffle bag
>"go do it" i tell my brother
>he gets out and makes his way to the trunk
>it's taking longer than expected for him to be walking over with the boy; what's going on?
>my brother finally comes around, he's nervously shaking while dragging the lifeless body of the boy
>the kid has foam at his mouth, bloodshot eyes, must have died a few minutes ago
>"what the fuck..." i say
>oh fuck, his inhaler, this kid has, or had, insane asthma, we must have packed him without it
>father is on his knees, hands on his head... he knows his son is gone
>my brother is having a mental breakdown himself, all he wants to do is get the boy back to his dad
>"okay my friend, off you go back to your dad now"
>he chucks the boy's body into the river, and away he floats
>"GET THE FUCK IN THE CAR, RIGHT NOW, YOU DUMB FUCK" i scream
ect.

should i start writing?

[Anonymous No.10394692]

>>10394688
holy... i want more

[Anonymous No.10394698]

>>10394688

[Anonymous No.10394700]

>>10394688
amazing

[Anonymous No.10394705]

>>10394688
>"GET THE FUCK IN THE CAR, RIGHT NOW, YOU DUMB FUCK" i scream

what did he mean by this /lit/?

[Anonymous No.10394733]

>>10394688
It's hard to say off one example, but that is a very good setup and payoff. Off that, yes you should consider creative writing as a career.

[Anonymous No.10394738]

>>10394517
WHY?! WHY MUST YOU TORMENT ME SO WITH THESE JEZEBELS? My one single wish is to be left to my own asexual devices, free from the thorned grip of perverse tempation, unclouded or swayed in my noble search for intellectual playthings of the mind, yet by your hand I am endlessly titillated by these vixens with their prodigious hips and provocative figures. Can I never satiate this thirst, will I ever know the touch of a woman and enter between her loins? Will these hands ever feel a woman's swaying weight in their open palms? Will I ever know a plump, ruby pair of lips perched betwixt my shoulder and my ear, whispering "I want you, I want you now" in that chocolatey croon I know so well from dreamtime? Will my seed ever drip from her moistened hole, indicating the completed unity of our unhinged sexual impulses?

Life is a constant hell. Day in and out the tired red eyes glaze in some attempt to shield me from these images. I am floating in the blistering heat of my id's vacuum, castrated and blinded by my wretched libido. No wonder I resent women so.

[Anonymous No.10394745]

>>10394688
I can't tell if you're trolling, but I'm actually going to give you advice, because you need help:
>Don't quit your day job.
>Start writing short stories.
>Write lots of them, date them on completion.
>Don't give them to anyone, no matter how good you think they are.
>Go back to them in a year, and see how you feel about them.
>If not, rewrite them or destroy them.
>Repeat this process until you have mostly all pieces you approve of.

[Anonymous No.10394746]

>>10394688
have you considered going to a second-rate film school and becoming a tv writer?

[Anonymous No.10394762]

>>10394688
Yes

[Anonymous No.10394766]

You make shit because it's probably going to be an e-book. Get a backup plan like everyone else who didn't become a failure.

[Anonymous No.10394770]

>>10394692
>>10394698
>>10394700
>>10394733
>>10394762
am i being trolled? i guess i don't value myself that much if not... ty

>>10394745
and then do what with those short stories? try to get a publishing deal for a full novel?

>>10394746
i haven't

[Anonymous No.10394794]

>>10394770
>and then do what with those short stories? try to get a publishing deal for a full novel?
No. Realise how bad they are and how much more you need to learn to write properly.

[Anonymous No.10394799]

>>10394770

You can have an amazing idea and have your story be a complete drudgery to read because it's badly written. Good stories need both good content and good execution. Learning how to make convincing and readable dialogue, description, etc. is something that takes a lot of practice and reflection, years certainly.

There are no shortcuts, you just have to write badly before you can write well. Make mistakes, identify them, don't repeat them, read good authors to see how they solved your problems. Any story you write won't be worth money until you have at least semi-decent writing skill.

[Anonymous No.10394805]

>>10394799
completely agree, but at the same time i don't come from money so i have to start thinking where i put my energy, since i don't want to get trapped in a dead-end job if i have no talent that can be grown

sorry for the cringe but here's something else i wrote a few months back:
https://www.scribd.com/document/367084382/Script-DreamerDavid

was messing around with screenplay writing

i dunno, like i said it's something i want to do and i have a active imagination, albeit dark and often suicidal, but i don't know if it's going to provide a secure future

[Anonymous No.10394812]

>>10394688
Hey anon I like the Coen brothers too

[Anonymous No.10394815]

Here's something I wrote.
Me: Oh baby, yes....
Your mom: OH YESSSs

spoiler: I didn't write that, it happened last night ;)

[Anonymous No.10394819]

>>10394582
Oh shit really? I have like literally four or five unpunlished novels that just collect dust on my harddrive. I’m from leafland. Got any more info? I know anglo canada has a constant culture crises but i didnt know it was this bad.

[Anonymous No.10394824]

>>10394770
I gave you a basic rubric on how to promote skill growth:
>Write short stories.
>Let them gestate.
>Edit or destroy them.
>Keep writing.
>Distill skill.
>Keep writing.
If you write a quater million words in two years, you might be ready for something. Your scenario is crude but interesting enough that with good writing, it could go places. And for God's sakes, make sure your characters act sensible it least somewhat.

[Anonymous No.10394834]

>>10394770
Dude the first thing you write wont be good. Or the second or third or fourth. They’ll be drivel and trash, you have to accept this. You’re going to put hundreds of hours into a book then look at it and see a steaming pile of shit. And it’ll suck, but next time the shit won’t stink as much. And the time after thst it’ll be like one of those polished balls thst those egyptian beetles role around. Maybe the time sfter that, your work will be a rock. Not like peter, just a regular fucking stone on the ground. And that’s inportant because it’s the first step, because someone might get some joy out of kicking it around instead of getting angry that they’ve stepped in shit.

The point of writing lots of short stories is to make your first novels a little less shit. You have to sharpen your axe before tou can cut foen a tree, so to speak

[Anonymous No.10394839]

>>10394805
WE GOT THE NEXT MCCARTHY HERE

[Anonymous No.10394840]

>>10394834
Excuse the typoes

T. Alcoholic writer

[Anonymous No.10394854]

>>10394805
>>10394688
Don't listen to ANY of these anons, get into community college under state-aid and talk to any and all advisors there, share your work and take as many writing courses as you can.

Get off 4chan.

[Anonymous No.10394877]

>>10394805

"Don't quit your day job" is endlessly repeated on infinite loop. Story writing is something you do on the side to supplement your income until you get good enough to make it your main career. You should do something else first and then transition into it gradually over time.

You won't get paid meaningful money until you have a big enough fanbase that corporations know that publishing you will be a safe bet to make profit, and building that reader base takes time.

>https://www.scribd.com/document/367084382/Script-DreamerDavid

I read up to the end of page 3. This gives me the impression of self-insertion power fantasy. Mark feels like the protagonist, it focuses on his power and the darkness of his attitude. However the reader cannot 'be' Mark and feel what he feels since I can't identify with him, even if you as the author can. Writing a dark character is fine, but I need to understand why he acts the way he does. He has pent up rage? From what? Otherwise it's just a guy stabbing people for no reason, which generally isn't of interest. If the reader can't identify and perceive themselves as someone in the story, they simply aren't in the story.

>provide a secure future

No matter what happens, you won't regret having money and a stable income. Don't gamble anything you aren't willing to lose. Just play to your strengths.

Secure your future first, write second.

[Anonymous No.10394886]

Less than $500

[Anonymous No.10394889]

>>10394877
DON'T LISTEN TO THIS GUY, /lit/ is full pseudo authors and bitter NEETs. You have real talent, take only this advice:
>>10394854

[Anonymous No.10394890]

>>10394877
>Story writing is something you do on the side to supplement your income
nah cuz, nah. story writing is something you do because you like doing it.

[Anonymous No.10394899]

>>10394877
>Writing a dark character is fine, but I need to understand why he acts the way he does.

[Anonymous No.10394901]

>>10394890
Did you even read the OP? The guy was specifically asking about the pursuing it professionally.

[Anonymous No.10394905]

>>10394901
Yes, and that's dumb.

[Anonymous No.10394906]

>>10394890

True. I was more trying to imply it shouldn't be seen as a first primary source of income.

[Anonymous No.10394920]

>>10394733
>>10394733
Yeh I hope this is trolling...'ideas' are not really as important to fiction as some believe: the 'idea' of the best English novel is a mad Captain wants to kill a big fish and an interracial homosexual couple join him for fun and adventures.

[Anonymous No.10394924]

>>10394805
Well done, I am impressed. I would have read to the end, I hope to be able to one day. Good luck to you!

[Anonymous No.10394952]

ty my friends for the kind words, advice, and criticisms, i appreciate your time...

i'm going to start writing more and try to develop a real schedule instead the normal 'when i feel extremely motivated'... i really need to start reading more too

home life is hard, instead of running into a job to try to move out ASAP i'll beg my uncle to let me stay with him and use his floor while i go to community college

anyway, thank you guys, it means a lot to me... have a great day

[Anonymous No.10394981]

>>10394819
In Ontario especially the OMDC will support you if you are a local writer.

[Anonymous No.10395000]

>>10394688
I'm not impressed but you impressed the plebs on this board, I'd say go for it.

[Anonymous No.10395036]

>>10394517
never self-publish your novels or any of your work for sale, no agent (which is what you absolutely need if you're trying to live off creative writing) will take you seriously if you have done this, and your name will be tarnished

>>10394593
write a full novel, getting a professional editor to give you the final draft, and then submitting a promo package to agents that can get you paid and spread your name

if you don't get a hit, you have to trash the novel and start again or consider another line of work

[Anonymous No.10395040]

>>10394582
>>10394819
>>10394924
I live in Ontario. I read an article in the Toronto Star just last week about some woman who is apparently some kind of star writer because she makes fiction about feminist superheros. It checks all the boxes:
>Predictable "superhero" book
>All members are "diverse"
>Only women can develop superpowers though
>The enemy are "shadow" people.
>Young Adult genre

Not even a deconstruction or anything that elevates it. The author was crooning on and on about how its 100% authentic to the genre (i.e. capeshit) because "women and minorities need representation!"

If you have an angle like that to work and you're not a white male you might have a better chance to get free publicity.

[Anonymous No.10395046]

>>10394688
Not any point in rating unless you actual provide excerpts. The setup "scene" sounds fine to me.

[Anonymous No.10395080]

>>10395036
here, further...
>>10394688
>>10394805
>i don't know if it's going to provide a secure future
it absolutely won't, you will NEVER have security until you're a best seller-- i don't care how many compliments you get for these short examples, writing a cohesive, marketable, and full-length novel is a mountainous task that few complete, and even FEWER get any exposure for their time-spent

you obviously come from a dark place and have scars you can channel into your work, and i admire that honestly, but you need to start thinking if a large group of people would ENJOY reading a 300 page novel about a mentally ill brother abusing his little brother

you need to find a brighter side to work with as well, dude, if it's all dark and depressing, nothing in your world has meaning, your story needs to be marketable and not just a self-defeating depression fest, a sad ending doesn't work if the entire thing is black

however, 30 is the new 20... you are very young so you have that going for you... if i had to make a judgement call, i'd say go for it my man, see where it leads, reboot at 24 if it's not working out

[Anonymous No.10395127]

>>10394688
>he chucks the boy's body into the river, and away he floats
I laughed hard, good shit dude.

[Anonymous No.10395140]

>>10394593
>translation
>lecturing
>academic research
>editorial work
>writing columns for magazines
All that combined + book sales and you can make a decent living.

[Anonymous No.10395204]

>>10394517

What's the name of the girl in the pic, and her nationality?

[Anonymous No.10395211]

>>10394920
His 'idea' is literally a Fargo ripoff, but he executes the same concept in a very entertaining way, that's how you know he has potential.

[Anonymous No.10395297]

>>10394517
Keep in mind that books are essentially winner-take-all. You're either going to be making very few sales or a metric ton. The mean sales would be misleading here, you want the median.

[Anonymous No.10395334]

>>10394517
I've written 10 books in almost 16 months. Via self-publishing, ghostwriting, and writing custom erotica, I've reached an overall average of roughly $50-60 per month. My best month was about $135. December is a bit slow, only $8.50 or so thus far, but I've got a ghostwriting gig on the go for $75 so already for this month I'm looking at over $80. Going to have a promotional thing around Christmas/New Years with several books going for free and probably a few on discount so I'm hoping for a spike in sales towards the end of the month to maybe tip the scales over $100. If all goes well with this ghostwriting gig, the next one should be $150 since I'm doing this one at half-price as an introductory offer so February just might become my next most profitable month.

Generally speaking, it takes a long time to reach the point in self-publishing where it pays the bills. Most self-published authors don't even make $100 in their first year but I had a 2-month period in which I reached that much before via self-publishing alone (before I got into ghostwriting/custom erotica). If you only produce one novel per year, you had best do a fuckload of work on it, make sure that the structure is utter perfection with utterly consistent characters and a spotless storyline with not a single grammatical error in sight and with minimal paragraphs that a professional editor would suggest you remove entirely.

If it's only one novel per year, I think it'd be worth it to not just pay to get a custom cover made but the book itself should be in a genre that's already a big seller. Something 'young adult', something perhaps with vampires/werewolves, or perhaps a 50 Shades of Gray risque thing with bits of BDSM and such with the male character being extremely rich thus extremely desirable. Shill the fuck out of that book if you want a chance to reach $10 per month, but if you tell a bunch of friends and family about it and all of them buying it results in your first month earning you $50-100, that doesn't count. To this day, to my knowledge, my family still doesn't know that I'm a self-published author and a ghostwriter.

[Anonymous No.10395404]

>>10395204
i don't know her name but she's a HAPA

[Anonymous No.10395519]

>>10394517
>>10395404

She looks somewhat like my gf

[Anonymous No.10395594]

>>10394517
>>10395404
She looks somewhat like this chick I fucked who had a nerdy, book-wormy, limp-dicked "bf" that couldn't properly satisfy her but she dated him out of pity. Laughed my ass off when she shouted "OH ANON YOU FUCK ME SO MUCH BETTER THAN THAT KEK!"

[Anonymous No.10395641]

>>10395594
>>10395519
we're LARPing now boys

[Anonymous No.10395783]

>>10395040
This. In leafland, just slam a couple homos, trannies, and minorities in there and you're off to the races. The best part is you can make them a complete shit show of ironic deconstruction caricatures with a tinge of relatable humanity and the PM of leaf will give you a hand job for your "daring portrayals."

[Anonymous No.10396109]

>>10394688
>ect.
Don't write anymore.

[Anonymous No.10396397]

>>10395404
She's so cute it makes me angry.

[Anonymous No.10396861]

>>10394517
Between 0 and 10k. But it ain't no bell curve. Heavily left skewed distribution.

[Anonymous No.10396985]

>>10396861
Only 10k a year for self-publishing? Derek Murphy has shown that he made something like 5-6k in a single month and there's reports that some make 10-15k per month. I don't see why that would be hard to believe. The amount of money to be distributed to self-published authors with KDP Select via the KENP (Kindle Edition Normalized Pages) they amassed in October is 19.7 million US dollars. That's JUST for the month of October, and while that's going to be distributed to so many KENP that only half a penny will be given per page-read that's still almost $20,000,000 up for grabs for whoever ends up getting the most attention on Kindle Unlimited.

I'd like to add that this doesn't take into account actual ebook or paperback sales which undoubtedly is worth many millions more. Now the Kindle market for ebooks is terribly saturated, something like 50,000-100,000 books are self-published each month last I checked. I put my books through CreateSpace first and then send it to Kindle, and the ID for my books on CreateSpace for the first one self-published in October 2016 was 6,6XX,XXX while my latest book self-published just a few days ago is 7,8XX,XXX which suggests that 1.2 million books have been self-published through CreateSpace in a 14-month period. So most people who are just starting out, probably don't have much experience in writing books, probably don't know much about the self-publishing process (I'm still learning too over a year later), and probably don't have many books under their belt (I've written over half a dozen in this time period), you won't be getting much of those millions.

It takes time, effort, and LOTS of determination. Motivation will only last so long, that dwindles and dies in time; it's determination that will take you the rest of the way. You have to keep writing to improve and to expand your bibliography, you have to keep learning, you have to experiment, you have to think outside the box on new things to try, you have to find your voice and your calling, your niche in the market, or otherwise find a niche to fit yourself into if the things YOU'RE interested in just sadly doesn't interest many others.

But anyways yeah, there are people who make a whole lot more than just 10k a year. As for the average, well most self-published authors make less than $100 in their first year.

[Anonymous No.10398345]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starving_artist

[Anonymous No.10398421]

You really need to read Keeping the Aspidistras Flying by Orwell

[Anonymous No.10398909]

>>10394593
>writing for money

go fuck yourself. make some identity politics/virtue signaling/kangz infested feel-good trash. maybe put some buzzwords in the title/premise, maybe even a story about an entrepreneur since the business book reader is like 70% of today's book market (e.g. "ZER STARTUP: a cryptocurrency entrepreneur Tasquasia Abdur-Rahim, a trans latina/black nasty woman who grew up on a Native American reservation creates a cryptocurrency that empowers female entrepreneurs in developing countries and cures cancer, all while duh white man tryna bring zer down" (use the pronouns).

Bare minimum, any publisher who rejects you you can sue for discrimination or make a media storm against, giving you some money and increasing the likelihood of the next publisher to expedite your book to publishing and the media storm would already have marketed your book to a decent enough SJW following, and milking it with social media shit like poetic excerpts using the "zer/zim" pronouns will get enough of a following pre-launch to make your book a best-seller upon release.

[Anonymous No.10398913]

>>10398909
Great we got a pol leak again

[Anonymous No.10399075]

>>10398421
I thought I was the only one on /lit/ who had read that book

[Anonymous No.10399733]

>>10398913
Political incorrectness has never been more factually correct. I've got a book series with a black lesbian who's a complete racist cunt who raped and murdered a redheaded teenage girl and attempted to murder a white man, as well as attempted to rape said white man's woman (who is white) on more than one occasion.

There's also a Muslim 'father and daughter' who turns out to be husband and wife, and also turns out to be cousins. Cousin-marrying is very common in the Middle East, particularly Pakistan. In the UK only something like 5% of births are from British Pakistanis, but around 25-33% of births with degenerative birth defects are from British Pakistanis. This is directly caused by inbreeding, which is why I included not just the underaged child marriage (she's only 12, almost 13), but also the fact they're related. Oh yeah, and he also strikes her and won't allow her to get an education even though the books are set in the west where we allow women and children to seek education, in fact we have so many scholarships and benefits available that MORE women graduate than men.

Now, I don't know what the statistics are of black-lesbian on white-woman rape specifically, but black-on-white rape is ASTRONOMICALLY more common than white-on-black rape in the United States.

[Anonymous No.10399741]

>>10394517
7563,84$

God I hate this board more every day

[Anonymous No.10401002]

Bump

[Anonymous No.10401008]

>>10394517
bump

[Anonymous No.10401009]

>>10394517
0