/lit/ - Literature

>>6936833
They read tumblr quotes and text tattoos and think that's what poetry is like.

>>6936833
Because you have been brainwashed into thinking sexism only applies to one gender.
So "take it like a man", Anon. "Gender equality" actually means "female empowerment" while men must only chance for this purpose.

>>6936860
>>6936842
Come on guys let's not turn it into that kind of thread

I'm not saying the women in my classes are simple, just that they don't really like a lot of the material. It's hard to have an intelligent opinion about a poem that you don't enjoy reading or thinking about.

JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON JOHN MILTON

>>6936833
>>6936878
I don't know, OP. I don't think you'll be able to find a definitive answer here. Best you can do is keep mingling with these women and try to understand their motives and compare them to your own(and that of the one guy who you say seemed to be well-read). Not just the motive but also the understanding of the material and the use of that understanding. Maybe one day you'll come on /lit/ and be able to present an answer to this, you sure as hell won't be able to do it any other place anyhow out of fear of being labeled a "sexist" or "misogynist" or whatever other nonsense term.

>>6936878
You know there is a bias that women are all about poetry while men are about prose.
Don't deny it.

>>6936878
They can't compete with men in STEM related subjects, wherein its more apparent when they're wrong. Subjects like Literature however require the knowledge and skill they lack to recognise their lack of knowledge and skill. The emotional aspect within poetry likely also appeals to them, which is probably why poetry possesses feminine connotations.

>>6936950
What first comes to mind is that poetry is a lot more fluid compared to prose. With poetry, you can focus more on "muh feels" and it doesn't even matter if there's any structure in the poem or any sort of meaning or skill behind it. You've seen those feminist poems or whatever.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4m3AJamQYM

>Non gen-ed class is over 20% female
Your fault for not being socially retarded, physics master race tbh. You asked for this.

>>6936971
wow this is bad

>>6936998
Yeah but it's "art" and "poetry" so it's good, and because it's by feminists and something regarding women or feminism or something it's REALLY good and also important for society and the fight against the evil patriarchy, okay. Take power away from men and give it to women, then we'll have paradise on Earth, okay. Praise vaginas.

>>6936971
Wow these are gud :-D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dntJDOhv8BM

>>6936971
I vomited internally.

>>6936971
i don't get it.

are they saying... not to talk to them at all?

>>6937027
Let's be honest. Do you really want to talk to them after watching that?

>>6937020
how artistically artfully art-ed; brava
>that random finger snapping
>"HMMMMMMH!" *snaps fingers* "HMMMMMH!"
laughed externally

>>6937022
Felt literally raped internally.

Is this the 6th thread in the last 4 hours about women?

Allow me to contribute:

Women are simply not as ontologically 'there' as men. They lead a much more empty and poor inner life, and cannot comprehend the immensity of the human condition.
Their minds aren't as well-developed as men's, which is why they have made no real contributions to society, be it in aesthetics, culture, or politics.

They are feeble-minded and seemingly can only do something if it benefits them narcissistically, if they can attract a man by it or something like that. This is the direct opposite of male nature, which is inherently one of creation, profundity, and spirituality. There's no authenticity in a woman, she's a sham to corrupt men.

If a woman takes a poetry class, it's not for the sake of poetry, insight, aesthetic pleasure etc., it's solely to gain social standing by being able to recount some shit she's heard a smarter male say. She doesn't enjoy poetry in the same pure way that a man does.

>>6936971
I like some slam poets, like this lady.
http://youtu.be/gVEf6jS8GdU

>>6937020

>>6937045
That's a great gif.

>>6937020
lol is she drunk

>>6937054
she's a pathetic feminist whore

>>6936971

>With poetry, you can focus more on "muh feels" and it doesn't even matter if there's any structure in the poem or any sort of meaning or skill behind it.

Get the fuck away from this board.

>>6936971
Lol they don't like metaphors

I'll ask this here because it's not good enough for it's own thread:

I hear all the time that women, on average, have a higher verbal IQ than men. Is this true? If it is, wouldn't you expect women to be better writers and communicators than men?

>>6937041
i don't know m8 i know pretty smart girl in college

guys I'm asking why they take poetry classes, not why you think they're subhuman

I have no trouble imagining that women don't much care for thoroughly masculine and mostly misogynist poetry from 200 years ago. The resulting shallowness is one men would share if they also didn't have a desire to know more about the poetry.

What I don't know is why they sign up to learn stuff they don't like. Is it because our society's assumptions about poetry make it out to be something it's not?

>>6937066
There is no such thing as verbal IQ, it's a ruse developed by cultural marxists to give credence to their subversion of western civilization through 'muh equality'.

You'd have to search long and hard to find a female masterpiece.

>>6937068
I'm friends with some women who are more intelligent than men. This personal anecdote proves that all women are at least as intelligent as the average man and that anon is a lonely virgin tbh

Pic related is my face while formulating this argument

>>6937062
This

>>6937062
How about you learn how to read.

>>6937066

technically women are better communicators, they just aren't better story writers

My English course was like 75% girls and like 75% of them were only there because they thought it was an easy way to become a school teacher.

>>6937101
It is, tbf. Guess they weren't so dumb after all

Men and women are dumb

If you give a number, like 73% of women are dumb

So, having a slogan that's "Not all women are dumb" is less useful than having a mantra that says "Most women are dumb"

The same applies towards men

>>6937079

atlas shrugged is a masterpiece, even if you disagree with its philosophy

>>6937110

And 73% is a very laid-back number, it could be higher once you start getting serious in what dumb means

>>6937101
it frightens me to think how many of them may be waiting for the day when they can out aside the Shakespeare and teach Harry Potter to our children

granted, the average high school teacher butchers Shakespeare

>>6937124
put aside*

>>6937079
>Ayaan Hirsi Ali
Reks Islam on a daily basis, in a foreign language.

>>6937081
If you've taken grad classes in English lit or had lit profs of both genders, you know there's almost as many females as males, and they're just as good at their shit in every way. Undergrads are not worth worrying about.

>>6937106
Yeah, you're right - I ended up a teacher myself, lel. But it was disheartening that they just wanted to do the bare minimum to pass and weren't interested in really engaging with the art we were given. English is a relatively easy subject to bullshit but a difficult one to seriously pursue, imo, and I just wish that my course had contained more people interested in the latter than it did. It was a highly ranked university as well, for the record.

>>6937137
In other words, they took a utilitarian approach to a creative subject, and kind of went against the spirit of the whole thing.

>>6937078
>guys I'm asking why they take poetry classes, not why you think they're subhuman

Death of the Author, pal. Look it up

>>6936971
to be honest, they had me until "ours to joke about"

>>6937020
Hmmm! Hm, hmm.

>>6937239
I honestly liked the bit about slutwalks, but I think that's more because I hate slutwalks than because I liked the poem.

>>6937042
that was very good ,thank you

Most people in the English major don't actually enjoy the classics, men included. They see anything pre-WWII as a history lesson & an obligation, and want to walk out with a diploma as fast as possible. It's contrary to the spirit of an English major, but these days the humanities are considered a feminine pursuit, and you fulfill a certain social quota by being a woman in humanities. + if you're a feminist, which most college-aged humanities majors are, you're destined the read older texts oppositionally & not enjoy them. No such thing as a feminist aesthete.

Ummm wow, ok. Female here. First of all I highly doubt that you listened to everybody in class discuss why they like Milton or poetry in general. I like poetry and not because I browse tumblr. I can tell you're the type of weird guy who never spoke in class except to give his serious "opinion" about the book we were told to read that week. Seriously I know guys like you and if I saw you in person listening into my conversations I'd have my boyfriend deal with you. Seriously.

>>6937284
0/10

I don't know why you are surprised women would be more critical of a piece of canon which definitely is sexist. I also don't now why you think being critical of a text means you can't also enjoy it. Do you think English classes should involve blindly singing the praises of canonical writers?

>>6937284
Jesus Christ this is pathetic, did you even try at all?

>>6937284
lel what can a cuck do to an ubermensch

I think it's more that girls have a much harder time expressing their emotions than men do, that's all, I also wouldn't have sex with anyone in here who I can tell instantly isn't up to date with the tumblrsphere but that's just me, well that's not entirely true you would need to compliment me on wearing my ellen jumper first because she embodies all that is woman.

Women feel emotion easier than men, so they like poetry because it makes them feel.
However, they don't feel emotion as deeply as men, therefore they can't fully appreciate poetry.
That is why they prefer light poetry over the deeper poetry.

Men in love will write a poem about any part of a woman from her toes to her hair, including parts you wouldn't expect like elbows. Finding endearment in her flaws.
A woman, not feeling love as deeply, will always despise a man's flaws.

>>6937308
It's retarded to criticise a work of art for not conforming to an ideology which didn't exist when it was created. That's the problem with feminism: there is no desire to understand, only to judge.

>>6937308
It's one thing to recognize the sexism in a text. It's another thing entirely to be constantly raising your hand and saying what you think about Milton as a human being. Milton's opinions about women are embarrassing; they're also not what I read Milton for. One has to admit them, and even to admit that they're tied inextricably to the kind of piety that animates the poem. But that cannot be the first question in your mind, as it was not the first in Milton's.

There are great opportunities to write about Milton and women. But if that theme is ever-present in your mind as you read Milton, what are you getting out of it? What do you gain by studying Paradise Lost only as a sad relic of a patriarchal worldview? If every bit of Milton's worldview is offensive to you, if you can't try to see how it would have looked to Milton, or if you are so concerned about Eve's dignity that you will misread the text to make it more tolerable to your sensibilities, what are you getting out of his poetry? What meagre joy can you salvage from Paradise Lost?

There are other ways to bring your concerns into a work. Said's essay on Kipling is a great example: while he is pointing out the ways that Kipling is painting a deeply embarrassing picture of desirable imperialism, and that this involves conscious alteration and omission of what he knows to fit his politics, he is also sensitive to why Kipling wants to do so, the extraordinary aesthetic merit of his novel, and the kind of joy it would have produced for Kipling's reader. And he knows what this joy was like because he has read the book and enjoyed it as intended. You don't need to agree with Milton's theology to enjoy Paradise Lost, but you do need to accept it while you read. Once that has been done, you may begin to talk about what's wrong with it. But you can only do that after you've first tried indulging it.

>Women are and remain incurable philistine.

I wish more women would read Wollstonecraft tbh

The point was that women ought to be made more manly, not that we ought to pretend they were always undervalued

>>6937284
>i'd have my boyfriend deal with you

I don't understand why people think this threat makes sense, even in a b8 post. What year is it that people think this still happens? Or what shit kicking school do you go to that this kind of degeneracy is tolerated? This isn't the wild west, nor are we in an 80s teen movie getting picked on by jocks who rule the school.

>someone tried to beat me up in high school for taking his ex to prom
>punched me, threaten to kick my ass
>laugh, tell him it's not the 80s anymore
>tell administration
>he gets suspended
>kek internally

Nobody gives a fuck about Chads anymore.

>>6937696
faggot

>>6936833
What's your teacher's name?

>>6937696
>Nobody gives a fuck about Chads anymore.

Except their doting ex-beauty queen wives who buy them 24 packs of busch lite so they can scream at their flatscreen with other sixty-year old corporate retirees

It's because poetry is femine. You got to be a female or queer to appreciate it.

I noticed something similar with Archaeology and Classics. Certainly in all of my classes it's about 80% girls, and on quite a few different open days I did when I was scoping out unis too.

>>6937828
>S P O O K S
>P
>O
>O
>K
>S

>>6937736
chad/10

>>6937136
>nd they're just as good at their shit in every way.

there arent that many male readers, and there is a stigma associated with poetry/literature, so if a male is into it he is all in. There are two levels: genuine deep interest or hate.

for females, a large readership w/ many levels and no stigma, the shallow surface sexiness of poetry/lit still exists. Thus you have bebs taking these classes while not truly giving a shit.

>>6937899

this is just pathetic, you might as well have posted "NUH-UH"

>>6937906
>so if a male is into it he is all in. There are two levels: genuine deep interest or hate.
>for females, a large readership w/ many levels and no stigma, the shallow surface sexiness of poetry/lit still exists.
This is true to an extent, but there's also the fact that many more women than men want to become schoolteachers. I hate to be rude about it, but I've never met a schoolteacher who gives a single solitary shit about literature as art, and the ones who do often just don't know their subject well enough. I assume that women at the postgraduate level are interested enough to know their shit.
But yeah, fuck any pre university female teachers. They really don't care about anyone.

>>6937924
>this is just pathetic, you might as well have posted "NUH-UH"

>>6937924

>>6937936

>>6937943
rare...

>women
Literally Reddit: the gender

>>6936972

>"I like dick in my ass: the post"

>>6937078

>What I don't know is why they sign up to learn stuff they don't like. Is it because our society's assumptions about poetry make it out to be something it's not?

people volunatrily choose to study a subjectec and then see its content as boring. that's just how we work mayne. if I had a dollar for everyone complaining uni was boring I'd buy me a steak tbh.

>>6937929

female English teachers wanted to become teachers. male English teachers wanted to become writers and critics

>>6936971
Oh God, what to say.... at least you found it...

>>6937987
Not to fuck with your worldview or whatever, but I'm the OP, and I'm also studying to become a teacher

>>6938031
How would that fuck with his worldview?
>dogs have four legs tbh
>not to fuck with your worldview, but I saw one the other day with only three

>>6938044
and how did eliot "disturb the universe"? so stupid

>>6937987
>sweeping generalizations
>believing genders are inherently one thing or the other
>against literally any counterargument you would have to start with "Well, there are exceptions..."
Never change, /lit/.

>>6938076
there are more "exceptions" to the rule that men and women are equal than to the rule that they are not

>>6938076
>>believing genders are inherently one thing or the other
>inherently

No, I believe that it's cultural. But it's still a thing regardless.

>>6936833
Because you can basically just say your opinion as long as you have the most basic understanding of the material. Source: I completed 3 of my 4 years of English study without reading any of the assigned reading, only listening to the teacher and looking up basic summaries if necessary.

>>6936965
>Subjects like Literature however require the knowledge and skill they lack to recognise their lack of knowledge and skill.

Good point here. A lot of these 'easy humanities' are not so much easy compared to STEM as they are harder to tell if somebody is bullshitting or knows what they are doing.

>>6937034
snapping fingers is clapping when it comes to slam poetry

>>6939017
I know it is, I was just pointing out how dumb it sounds. Same with the
>*HMMMMMMH*
who are they, QT after being attacked by paparazzis?

Because they have to go to college despite any real motivation for it and just pick easy majors in English and Psychology and shit and then get jobs more easily than deserving supreme gentlemen such as myself because employers want to show that they have gender parity to please the social justice brigade.

>>6937130
she should literally be executed for being a traitorous opportunist whore

t. dutch

>>6937866
The spook you're citing here is the spook of masculinity that anon is toting. Just saying.

>>6939080
You should be shot on principle, asap.

>>6936833
You see the world from a curved lense
>I'm not sexist
>but I'll say a bunch of sexist shit
>again, I'm not sexist
>but here's some more sexist shit
>also I'll post this so I can passive aggressively ask people to support my biased opinion

>>6939143
>all these spooks
Well memed, friend

>>6939143
>gee i'm an idiot look at me subscribe for more

>>6936971
God I fucking hate slam poetry.

I'm sure there's good stuff out there, but I'd rather none of it existed.

>>6939535
>God I fucking hate slam poetry.
>I don't buy local chapbooks

YOU ARE THE REASON SLAM POETRY EXISTS.

>>6936833
It's economical, of course.

Women educate themselves in order to make themselves appear an appropriate member of higher and aristocratic classes. So that a rich man will want to marry them, even today this Victorian ideal lingers and hasn't left education for women.

Men are much more practical, as is masculine, they educate themselves in order to bring value to a society and thus gain a position.

Women can't stand poverty, they can not simply accept being poor, they still cling to men as their benefactors instead of asking for structural change. Not to knock them, you can't get the latter without some of the former.

#GiveYourMoneytoWomen

>>6936833
You haven't heard all the women at least once comment on the subject matter so you're missing valuable information to make your assessment, the assessment being relative to the male population in the class.

The male population is much smaller and with a smaller population you constantly get more extreme results either way. A fact of statistics.

>>6936842
I hate seeing all that aphoristic s--- on the Web. My teen son shows it to me: wannabe deep caca, all of it. Narcissistic BS.

Poetry requires DELVING in, not just reading a ten-word shallow quote from the mind of a greeting-card writer (GCW). Note, the GCW does valuable work in his genre, but it's not /lit/.

I took a class that was titled "British Landscape Writing". Turns out the professor was the head of the English department.

Show up day one, saw the list of the readings we'd be doing. Gibbon, Virgin, Milton, Pope, Coleridge, Woodsworth, Keats, Shelly, Tennyson, and that's all I can remember off the top of my head.

That class really introduced me to poetry, and I think that the women in the class actually contributed a nice perspective. Things that I would have imagined as having a more combative nature could be interpreted by them as being more remorseful.

life's imperative for men historically
>do or die
for women
>spread em or die

imperative for men today
>do or die
for women
>do or die, but if things don't work out, spread em

if you took away that last clause, women would quickly reach the achievements made by man. nothing essential here, just path of least resistance played out many many times

>>6936833
unrelated but I just went to my uni's orientation and in the briefing thing for English majors it was like 95% girls, is this normal

>>6936833
Maybe it's because they actually really like it?

>>6937284
notevenrated/10

>>6937696
8/10 gud jub made me kek

>>6939945
tru

>>6939945

>>6939945
>if you took away that last clause, women would quickly reach the achievements made by man.

Why'd you take until the end to show yourself to be retarded?

>>6936833

>Why do so many women take poetry?

Short answer: because STEM is for future husbands.

>>6939651
This is an interesting post. Is this metamodernism, or just postmodernism?

kinda related
>senior year
>need an elective for credits, take english lit
>should've just called it poetry because that's what it was
>99% of the class is female
>ask teacher about curriculum, she says it gets better around the end
>mfw she lied just so I couldn't drop the course

>>6937027
No, they want you to rape them. Women crave it. They actually do. They say there is a difference between a rape fantasy and actually being raped, but there isn't.

They just want to be raped

>>6936833
AND HIS NAME IS JOHN MILTON

>>6937020
so she just wants to be schizophrenic?

>>6937122
>masterpiece
It reads like a speed fueled rant by a genre fiction writer. Oh wait...

OP the most likely scenario is that they're thinking 'this guy's talking to me about the course poetry? What a nerd.' etc. You can't just bowl up to people and ask their interpretations of poetry.


>>6938285
>>6936965
No you just have to have more of an imagination and be sensitive and creative to study literature. Stem is for autists.

>>6940787
>Yfw

>>6940824
>They say there is a difference between a rape fantasy and actually being raped, but there isn't.
No. There is a difference.
And "they" are never of one mind, shithead.

>>6940919
I bet you'd be happy if any guy decided to touch you.

>>6940927
She's a lezzo, pal

>>6940919

>getting triggered by such obvious bait

Butter you have been here long enough you should know better by now.

>>6936833
I suggest you ask each of them individually why they're taking the class. Even if their reasons aren't satisfactory for you, it'll at least make for a much more interesting interaction than this thread.

Obviously if you join the class of the majority, you'll disagree with their opinions, or at the very least have a different opinion from them


Women go batshit crazy when men don't agree with them since they have a shit time, almost always, to provide rational sane arguments.

>>6939651
>Note, the GCW does valuable work in his genre, but it's not /lit/.
>implying

>>6940647

woman detected