/lit/ - Literature

>>22772192
Generally, the problem of evil is meant to be a challenge to the existence of God *under a certain conception*. The starting assumption is that God has the properties that lead to the problem of evil being a problem - omnibenevolence, omniscience, and omnipotence.

Many will further hold that God necessarily has those properties, if they exist. If God must have those properties (if they exist) but can't, then God can't exist.

Now, you might reject the starting assumptions that God either has those properties or that God has them necessarily. Then the problem of evil wouldn't be so much a problem. You could, for example, admit that though God wants to rid the world of evil, they can't. But this is a significant concession which might a) be in tension with explicit scripture or beliefs grounded in other materials, and b) undermine the motivation for believing God exists in the first place.

It was a really interesting book. But its important to read it in the Orginal Klingon but the translation.
Many readers, including me, have found the cover of "Does the problem of evil undermine the existence of God or just an attribute of The Father?" a bit cringe, but I think, don't judge a book by his cover-art.

What was your favorit capital?

>>22772192
it doesn't undermine the existence of God, it does prove it, for a world full of evil God is our only light

It absolutely disproves god (or more specifically a benevolent god) and anybody that tells you otherwise is engaged in the most divine of copes.

>>22772192
The problem is viewing things in a black and white way, it's usually a symptom of retardation.

>>22772250
>starbucks cashier is mean to me
>wow, the human race is finished. god can't exist

>>22772262
>starbucks cashier being mean is evil
if you're going to make an argument then I suggest getting your premises right first.

>>22772262
It is a useful reminder that theodicy deniers are simply unwilling or unable to drop the premises of their own cushy life and engage with serious evil—and therefore accuse others of doing the same.

>>22772305
But Christians will hide in their books and churches and deny that man is an animal.

>>22772262
>Children born into misery get sold as sex slaves, killed and raped as part of a multi-million industry that has been going on for centuries
>

>>22772305
Obliterated.

>>22772192

>>22772192
Evil/suffering/conflict is interesting because life would be completely dull and meaningless without it, yet the ultimate reward is basically that.

>>22772400
Makes it worthwhile and all the more satisfying. Of course, Christians will never know.

>>22772410
It's probably just my limited human understanding talking, but I feel like simply resting knowing you did a good job is more satisfying. Existing for eons longer without nothing much else to do doesn't sound that appealing.

>>22772400
Suffering ceases to be suffering if it is within certain tolerances. I'd hardly call the pain of a growth spurt or a hard workout a gratuitous evil, which is what a good theodicy tries to explain. The other anon is right. You are personality cultists projecting your own shonenized delusions onto reality.

>>22772423
Nah, you're onto something, it's possible to have peace and bliss here and now, the idea of receiving it after death is just cope.

>>22772423
Now this clown's equating radical evil with the pleasure of post-workout exhaustion. You're such inane children it makes me hurl

>>22772437
It's called contentment, Christians wouldn't know because they perpetually live with guilt and shame.

>>22772400
how exactly would life would be dull and meaningless without >>22772321 bad argument

Atheists complain about evil not to justify their disbelief in God but to justify their decrept immorality.

>>22772444
Suffering is the rule, contentment is the exception. Taking a nap on a fine summer day is not a theodicy, I'm sorry to say

>>22772451
Every day is a fine summer day when you do the work.

>>22772449
>claims evil exists
>but is immoral
if you believe in evil then you must believe in good or the negation of evil. Are you really claiming that the mere recognition of evil is proof that somebody is themselves evil? How does that even work?

>>22772462
What I'm saying is that atheists complain :
> booh evil exists so God isn't real
Why do they say this? Because they need a justification for being evil.
> evil exists ergo God doesn't exist ergo there is evil ergo I can be evil

>>22772461
For those capable of doing the work, and even then. A couple of breathing exercises and a tingling in my toes doesn't speak for the billions of organisms struggling to survive in the ocean, nevermind the rest of humanity

>>22772471
Like I said filled with guilt.

>God
>Trinitary

>>22772476
Being aware of the negative doesn't make me culpable for it, so there is no guilt. Sub-25s shouldn't post on /lit/, they have nothing to say and just vomit their tiktok peacock brainrot everywhere

>>22772491
Why are you here then?

>>22772461
begone with your idol you scum

>>22772494
I like watching the delusions of comfortable, well-fed people play out in real time. It tells me I have to try harder.

>>22772491
>>22772503
It's funny how quickly they turn into Redditors.
>ban him!

>>22772468
This simply doesn't work, maybe you're baiting.
First of all if atheists 'needed justification' to be evil then they would simply renounce morality as a concept. Many do not and abide by an ethical system that on some level believes in evil and that we should reduce it.
I'm already giving your reply too much attention considering this part
>God doesn't exist ergo there is evil ergo I can be evil
does not make sense at all
>God doesn't exist ergo there is evil
This only works from a christian POV if you believe there is a conception of the complete good known as god and can therefore determine evil's existence by his absence.
>there is evil ergo I can be evil
Once again does not work or make any sense at all. It's the exact same thing as I mentioned here >>22772462 recognising evil doesn't make you evil.
Don't worry, you got this part right:
>evil exists ergo God doesn't exist
because the assertion is that 'God is benevolent and perfect' but we can see from the evil around us that he is not so it's clear he does not exist. This is how logic actually works.

>>22772510
your idols won't serve you in the day of judgment
you will get destroyed

>>22772544
Bring it!

>>22772545
it will happen so quickly

>>22772551
Do it now, faggot!

>>22772192
It can't undermine the existence of God, just the fact the God is actually good

>>22772553

>>22772561
Your impotence amuses me.

>>22772523
> Once again does not work or make any sense at all
Of course it doesn't make sense, it's atheist logic.
> because the assertion is that 'God is benevolent and perfect' but we can see from the evil around us that he is not so it's clear he does not exist. This is how logic actually works.
God gave humans free will so he allows humans to be evil if they wish to do so. Doesn't mean that doing such acts won't result in punishment.

>>22772564
you are weak, your idols will get destroyed in front of you

>>22772576
YOU, will get destroyed.

>>22772192
evil doesn’t really exist

>>22772232
Why, if he himself created evil?

>>22772589
No shit but Christians need it to keep their religion alive.

>>22772589

>>22772573
>Of course it doesn't make sense, it's atheist logic.
No, the conclusions cannot be derived from the premises you are presenting. You are saying nonsense and then claiming its the atheist view. It's like me saying 'God exists ergo you're an ugly cunt' and claiming this is the christian view - even if both were to be true independently one does not follow the other so you cannot put 'ergo' in there and you definitely cannot use it as an argument.
>God gave humans free will so he allows humans to be evil if they wish to do so. Doesn't mean that doing such acts won't result in punishment.
I'm still waiting to see the 'punishment' of the countless elite that raped children on epstein's island or the cartels that kidnap women and cut babies out of their bellies or the politicians that sent countless men to die in combat.

>>22772614
> You are saying nonsense and then claiming its the atheist view.
I said psychologically atheists say this as a cope and justification to be evil, because, evil exists, so what.
> I'm still waiting to see the 'punishment' of the countless elite that raped children on epstein's island or the cartels that kidnap women and cut babies out of their bellies
First answer the question wether these people believe in God or not.
> the politicians that sent countless men to die in combat
Hitler was an atheist, but most generals aren't like Hitler. I'd even say that war has become more immoral nowadays but I don't want to go into a tangent.

>I said psychologically atheists say this as a cope and justification to be evil, because, evil exists, so what.
Fine, if you understand that this isn't a common view amongst atheists. But it doesn't mean that complaining about evil is done by atheists only to justify immoral acts. I feel the pain of others as much as any devout person.

For christians I am probably an atheist, but in reality I am an agnostic and I like to lurk some religious threads but every now and again one of you preachy christfags will say something so skull shatteringly stupid that it reminds me why I lost my faith in the first place, because none of it makes any sense and the prevalence of evil is proof of that. How bad does the world have to get before enough is enough for god? How many murders, rapes, lives destroyed? Where the fuck is jesus? It's been two thousand years, nigga! Two thousand! And I'm here arguing theodicy on a fucking anime board.

>>22772667
> How bad does the world have to get before enough is enough for god?
Well, I see that all as people's own fault. God gives them free will and look what they use it for. I mean God could have made a non-physical world where pain doesn't exist but then we wouldn't have flesh bodies and food and all that stuff you see. So maybe it was better this way. And all he asked for was people being faithful, no, all he ever asked for was people not eat the fruit. They failed immediately. So God had to establish more and more commandments for humans because of how mischievously they use their free will.

>>22772676
I've been baited once again into an argument with one of you guys. I do not see how god, supposed omniscient benevolent creator of everything, decided that eve eating a fruit sets of a domino effect into time that leads to a child getting kidnapped and taken to an island to get raped by celebrities.
>So God had to establish more and more commandments for humans because of how mischievously they use their free will.
Let's assume the later commandments are the word of god and they are good rules - why would people who follow those rules or are too young to even understand those rules be given some of the worst punishments? And if it's free will why would the benevolent god make the limits of transgressing his commandments so far reaching, the suffering so severe? Why not just create a divine prison to house the bad people before they hurt people? Why not simply remove suffering before the age of 18? If the pain must be this bad and the will must be absolutely free, why not dole out punishments correctly and fairly? It does not make sense. Have your faith, but it does not make sense.

>>22772596
> No shit but Christians need it to keep their religion alive
Why? Because of original sin? If you say that original sin is a kind of error or ignorance it still has the same point, you dont need to call it evil.

>>22772716
Why the focus on pain? I already explained to you that God doesn't make people do evil, it is the people themselves who choose to do evil. They could also choose not to. They have free will, remember?

>>22772725
Is god benevolent? Is he omniscient? Is he perfect? Did he create the concept of pain and the concept of rape?

>>22772448
Evolution of life is fuelled by adversity and death. The premise that adversity represents a lack of benevolence from God also implies that the life of a static filter feeder with no decisions to make is "better" than a thinking, navigating hunter like a human.

>>22772720
Because, it’s the other half of the duality. Black and white thinking, it’s the sign of a retard.

The problem of evil is not real, and was already answered in Job.
The answer is might makes right, and God is the mightiest there is. Everything happens for a reason and you're no one to question God.
Does this make him evil? Not at all. He defines what goodness is, not some faggot 4channer who feels sad because his baby brother died painfully of cancer before his mom ended up blind and with burns to 90% of her body after a failed suicide. No, the opinion of rape victims is not a factor on what is good, but the word of God is. You cannot question the maker of the universe in any regards, you cannot speak ill of him either because you're just an ant. In the end, some of those third world kids who were born into a world of shit and died at ten will go to hell to be tortured for all eternity because they didn't accept Christ into their hearts. This may sound sadistic to you, but your opinion on what is good is as important as the opinion of an ant.
God is everywhere, can do everything, and does.

>>22772733
Well, to answer your questions in brief, yes, God is benevolent, and he punishes evil according to every persons knowledge. He is omniscient, obviously, but he doesn't infer much into the natural laws and the dealings of men. Wether he is perfect, well that is up to definition. Perfect is a human word with human connotations and I see no reason to apply that term to God.

>>22772748
>Well, to answer your questions in brief, yes, God is benevolent, and he punishes evil according to every persons knowledge.
What does every persons knowledge mean? Because from what I see, nobody is comprehending how he justifies the evil in this world.
>He is omniscient, obviously, but he doesn't infer much into the natural laws and the dealings of men.
What the fuck is this one, man? If he doesn't 'infer from the dealings of men' how could he 'punish evil according to every persons knowledge.'???? And if he doesn't deal with natural law or men what DOES he deal with?


You skipped over my last question which was most important one. Why do you avoid it? Seriously, what is it about that specific question you do not want to answer? Is it because there is no answer? Because there is no way the god you talk about would create those things thus disproving him?

>>22772192
What could be more pleasing to a god than to see good triumph over evil?

Do you ever think of the amount of torture, rape and murder God sees on a daily basis? Like having likeleak blasting 24/7 on 80 different screens laid all around you. What could he be possibly thinking of while this happens? Does he still suffer or feel any pleasure at all at seeing this unfold? Does he feel anything at all?

>>22772769
> What does every persons knowledge mean?
Think of a savage who doesn't think that killing people is bad. God will punish him, but not as harshly as someone who knows that killing people is bad.
> If he doesn't 'infer from the dealings of men' how could he 'punish evil according to every persons knowledge.
Well, I see it this way: there's divine intervention, and God makes divine intervention on everyone, positive divine intervention to those who do good acts and negative divine intervention towards those who do intentionally bad acts. Ultimately I see everything that happens as divine intervention. But this is a very complex topic and I'll leave it like this for now.
> You skipped over my last question which was most important one
Pain is not a concept, it is a feeling, and yes he created it, not primarily to cause people pain, but for example, when you stomp on some sea hog you have to feel pain to remove the sea hog because having a sea hog stuck to your foot isn't good for your feet but if you didn't feel pain you wouldn't feel the need to remove it.
And rape is a human concept. Raping a woman is an evil act and a sin in front of God, but he made human people with human bodies so there simply is the technical possibility for rape to happen. Ultimately however it is because of the people who choose to do so, out of a perverted or corrupted nature and not because God intended them to do so. Because there is always a choice to be made when someone commits a rape.

>>22772746
The issue with this line of thinking is that it is completely contradicted by other parts of the Old Testament, where evil is linked to punishment for disobedience as well as the entire New Testament which posits that the suffering of Jesus is exceptional or unique. It also renders all talk of “loving” God completely meaningless as his Absolute Power annihilates all puny human feelings, including those which are reverently directed towards Him.

>>22772804
>Ultimately however it is because of the people who choose to do so, out of a perverted or corrupted nature and not because God intended them to do so.
How do you know that? You say right before this that there is some divine intervention, so he has some intention of what SHOULD be done and what shouldn't. I've responded to everything else you have said in previous replies re: free will and the choice to commit rape. I'm done. Good talking to you but you didn't convince me.

>>22772746
fuck off, at least the other guy is making an argument. by your logic, god is a failure.

>>22772829
> so he has some intention of what SHOULD be done and what shouldn't.
No, divine intervention fulfills solely the purpose of punishing the people who commit evil acts. Decisions however remain their own.

>>22772813
>evil is linked to punishment for disobedience
Yes, and the binding of Isaac and Job show that it is also linked to God's tests. These are not mutually exclusive.
>the suffering of Jesus is exceptional or unique.
It is. Maybe not in terms of pain endured, but there's a reason why people are still hanging Jesus' tortured corpse on their walls and not Junko Furuta's.

>>22772829
>by your logic, god is a failure.
Compared to what? Your idea of what the world should be like? Oh I'm sure whenever you write your ideas on 4chan they receive universal applause and acclaim. I'm sure your 30 years of life on this planet have informed you perfectly well of how the universe should be run. Do you even have a job?

>>22772841
>divine intervention fulfills solely the purpose of punishing the people who commit evil acts
and now we're going in circles, see my other post about this so called punishment and the complete lack of it
>>22772843
>Compared to what? Your idea of what the world should be like?
Compared to his rules of what the good should be. None of what you say makes sense with anything jesus said. You sound like one of those spiteful power hungry men that pervert the admirable parts of religion for your own gain.
>Oh I'm sure whenever you write your ideas on 4chan they receive universal applause and acclaim. I'm sure your 30 years of life on this planet have informed you perfectly well of how the universe should be run. Do you even have a job?
I do have a job. Is your job being an example of the worst christian possible? Being holier than I? kek

>>22772192
The virgin Levantine
>lets entire cities get overrun by poofs
>takes an act of God to get rid of them

The chad Viking
>uses common sense Odin created him with to work out what bogs are for

God created or caused to be begotten constitutional psychopaths, therefore, god is amoral. Given that morality is, like mathematics, linguistic categories, etc. to be discovered and depending on the averages of psychometric characteristics of different groups like
>psychopathy
>capacity for remorse, empathy, etc.
>capacity for abstraction
>time preference (and even ability to conceptualise a furture)
optimal morals are going to be different for different groups.
God is God so a mere mortal like me hasn't standing to judge him. The only way to know God's properties is to rationally deduce them. I have no other way to such knowledge. I don't trust men or their writings. I can't square God being moral with creating agents that take pleasure in seeing others suffer or are incapable -- constitutionally -- of regretting hurting other creatures.

>>22772860
>None of what you say makes sense with anything jesus said.
What parts exactly?
>You sound like one of those spiteful power hungry men that pervert the admirable parts of religion for your own gain.
Why? Because I don't think you have what it takes to do God's job better? You know what you sound like? Like you enjoy the smell of your own shit.
But you have a job, I guess you're overqualified to be God.

>>22772860
> and now we're going in circles, see my other post about this so called punishment and the complete lack of it
How do you know? What tells you that the most evil people on earth don't die the most miserable deaths etc. etc.?

>>22772192

Another thread, another batch of Abrahamic skidmarks being the most jewed-out slime spitters you've ever heard from.

Almighty YHWH is the creator of all that is, was, will be, can be. He knows everything about everything, he made it all himself after all. But he didn't make himself. He's always existed, even before he made time. The whole world of everything that exists and can exists if within God, within his power. He is unstoppable, nothing can oppose his actions. Even his creations that he gave consciousness to cannot resist him in any way at all.

Is God lonely? Does he have cares? He knows what emotions and thoughts and desires are, he made them all himself, but they are not a necessary part of his being. He does what he wills, when he wills, he is nothing but pure will, which necessarily encompasses everything made by him, since of course that is a product of his will by definition.

Does god need anything? Does god have the capacity for motivation or desire, does he wants anything? Wanting would imply self-aware consciousnes, but god needs no organs to house it. He is alone, but needs no companion, has never needed one.

A creation of god can do nothing but suffer god's other creations and acts. All the world is a pre-ordained finger puppet show being put on buy the Creator, fully in his control forever. But why? He doesn't require entertainment, or anything else that could ever exist.

What's the point? Why does God exist? He never had the choice to exist, but what does he live for? He could have existed on his own forever, in himself, doing nothing but existing. What's the point of God existing?

>>22772192
No

It I undermines the existence of a Christian God. Not God in general

Hindus got this figured out, everything manifests from the Brahma, which is impersonal, transcendent, present in everywhere and in everything. THEN, you have the personal aspect of it called Ishvara.

>“They call it good, but I call it evil. So both good and evil belong to the relative world, to phenomena. The Impersonal God we propose is not a relative God; therefore it cannot be said that It is either good or bad, but that It is something beyond, because It is neither good nor evil. Good, however, is a nearer manifestation of It than evil.
What is the effect of accepting such an Impersonal Being, an Impersonal Deity? The Personal God will remain, but on a better basis. He has been strengthened by the Impersonal. We have seen that without the Impersonal, the Personal cannot remain. If you mean to say there is a Being entirely separate from this universe, who has created this universe just by His will, out of nothing, that cannot be proved. Such a state of things cannot be. But if we understand the idea of the Impersonal, then the idea of the Personal can remain there also. This universe, in its various forms, is but the various readings of the same Impersonal.”
― Swami Vivekananda,

>>22773695
>Hindus got this figured out, everything manifests from the Brahma, which is impersonal, transcendent, present in everywhere and in everything. THEN, you have the personal aspect of it called Ishvara.

Wrong, YHWH is the creator of all things

>>22772589
you exist, good and evil exist

>>22772748
>but he doesn't infer much into the natural laws and the dealings of men.

he does man!!! this one is so wrong

>>22772192
No, this question is not very bright

You have to approach it from the cult mentality.
What all religions eventually circle back on is that no matter what evil you do doesn't matter, evil is just a 'test' however you want to justify that.
What you do is irrelevant in the light of believing X is almighty/correct/benevolent. Everything else is secondary to adherence to the belief.
Believe in Jesus? You are saved. You don't have to preoccupy yourself with evil (especially since evil rests in the upper echelons of religion), since God has a plan.

Literally God made evil so you can win your salvation. The point of God is giving human free will so they choose him over evil voluntarily. If evil didnt exist, no choose could be ever made

>>22773994
God bless for your findings
Feels very true

>>22772790
>god glasses sodom and gomorrah
>look at this, god was so mean and evil
>god doesn't strike down modern sex offenders or murderers
>how can god stand by and accept this?!
you people are all the fucking same and haven't even spent a minute trying to understand why. this same fucking question has been asked for thousands of years now since epicurus. adam and eve rejected god because they thought better. human beings have free will and exist in a chaotic world because of it. suffering exists for the sinners just as it does the innocent. you can not blame god for the actions or inactions of mankind that lead to suffering. if this life was perfect and blissful, what would it even mean to spend eternity in heaven afterwards? love as much as you can, stay humble and trust in god's plan because that is literally all we can do.

>>22774054
I'm innocent and I don't suffer that much there is so much joy when you get closer to God that suffering become useless

atheists cling to this idea that because bad things happen there is no god and it's a bullshit cope to hide that what they really object to is the moral laws of god. if god exists then i'm accountable for my degeneracy and the temptations that successfully seduce me. i can't have that, fuck that. they don't realize how much better their life can be from abstaining from shitty high time preference decisions and actually taking the time to pray and be thankful.

>>22774048
Thank you and I wish you the same

>>22774085
God has live CCTV of child rape 24/7.

>>22774120
and they will spend eternal life separate from god. among fire and outer darkness and gnashing of teeth.

>>22774130
>dodges
kek

>>22774054
Never even implied any of the shit you're posting, just wondering what it feels like to see violent fucked up shit all day every day. Must be like watching Mortal Kombat fatality compilations or nature documentaries.

>>22774120
They will get raped by demons 24/7, fair deal

We will never forgive them, they will taste forbidden kind of pain that is not even available in earth and they will suffer heavily

>>22774120
That's really wild to think about. God was right there with Peter Scully when he recorded those little girls digging their own graves.

>>22774186
Unless they repent.
>We will never forgive them
Who asked you? lmao

>>22774200
>Unless they repent
Retarded insect

>>22774216
Why? Isn't that how it works?

>>22774222
because grace isn't cheap and the amount of regret and sorrow someone like that would need to have doesn't seem realistic. that is some retarded keira knightley bullshit
>Actor Keira Knightley, a self-confessed atheist, says she is desperate to be Catholic because she would “just get to ask for forgiveness”. “It sounds much better than having to live with guilt. It’s absolutely extraordinary. If only I wasn’t an atheist, I could get away with anything,”

>Kissinger dies peacefully at 100

Seems very topical to this thread. Any takes?

>>22774297
>the amount of regret and sorrow someone like that would need to have doesn't seem realistic
1-No one gives a shit about your feelings, your understanding of the world, or your expectations
2-You cannot quantify regret and sorrow, you cannot read minds and ultimately you're not the arbiter of jackshit.
Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven, don't you know? Don't forget you don't make the rules, you just follow them. Now shut the fuck up and turn the other cheek.

>>22772790
>Do you ever think of the amount of torture, rape and murder God sees on a daily basis? Like having likeleak blasting 24/7 on 80 different screens laid all around you. What could he be possibly thinking of while this happens?
Yeah he enjoys it I think

>>22774325
that is cheap grace though. expecting salvation with out genuine repentance will not work. god knows the truth of our hearts and will judge accordingly. i hope you actually believe what you wrote and aren't some posturing atheist citing a bible verse to prove a point.

>>22774450
>god knows the truth of our hearts and will judge accordingly.
Exactly, God knows, God judges. Not you. Whatever you think is "cheap grace" matters less than nothing.
"We will never forgive them", what a fucking joke you are.

watch this gospel video if you want to be 100% sure of going to heaven after you die /lit/. it's easy to be saved from hell fire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sf3uF0juIVI

>>22774085
>atheists cling to this idea that because bad things happen there is no god and it's a bullshit cope to hide that what they really object to is the moral laws of god
Exactly. They know there is objective good and evil, otherwise how could they deny God because of evil?

>>22774473
child abusers will never be forgiven retard , they will suffer more and pay more in order to get their salvation

i'm just letting you showing your retardation with the other wise anon so i smash your ass again

if the cause of the child abuser God will not grant them salvation at all and will let them sink in hell for as long as he wanted

>>22774740
>if the cause of the child abuser God will not grant them salvation at all and will let them sink in hell for as long as he wanted

if the cause of the child abuser is severe, God will not grant them salvation at all and will let them sink in hell for as long as he want

that's the right verse dear frien

>>22772192

>>22773805
YHWH is jewish desert demon that you've been psyoped into worshiping

>>22772192
Can an oldfag tell me when christcucks started being a thing? Besides that, does anyone else cringe when you hear secularized metaphysics? When christcucks start talking about god's nature I can't help but be off put by how personal it is, like this ineffable thing is their sky daddy. And then not to mention holding onto the label of "christian" instead of just dropping the label and becoming a platonist or something, otherwise you're forced to take the retarded jewish dogma and that some kike died on the cross for everyone's sins and was resurrected. You either believe it literally or you believe it metaphorically, if you believe it literally you're probably a moron and if you believe it metaphorically you're just pointlessly holding onto religious dogma and putting yourself in the box of "christianity". The christians of 4chan are a strange variety indeed, christians in real life are jew lovers meanwhile the .0001% of christians on 4chan are anti-semites.

>>22775124
around 2016 is when they went full schizo preachers

>>22772192
It's evidently a feature of life as we know it, and it raises complicated questions about the nature of God as conceptualized by Biblical theology.

>>22772746
Your argument fails for we are not ants but thinking and feeling subjects even unto god. We question god because we can. Ant doesn’t for ant cannot. So since might makes right, I have right to question god.

>>22772192
Yes

>>22775124
retard

>>22772192
The problem of evil only undermines the existence of the popular conception of God. It doesn't disprove a "creator of the universe and nothing more" kind of God.

>>22774473
friend, i think we agree but you are for some reason, attacking me when i responded to dumb dumbs suggesting, sarcastically, that these heinous individuals "just repent" to skate into the gates of heaven.

>>22775124
I've always found it funny the contortions some Christians do.
Once certain parts or claims in the Bible are disproven, they'll claim those parts are metaphorical but everything else is literal.
I actually have more respect for the literalist retards because they go all in on their retardation
The people who claim biblical stories are metaphorical and may have not happened are basically just admitting their religion's beliefs are at best folk-tales, that is to say what value they have is primarily symbolic
At which point why even pretend you believe in it?

>>22772192
The beauty of our existence is in that we are not brainless marionettes forced perpetually into doing "good." We are made in the image of God insofar as we are free rational subjects, and we are made valuable by our ability to overcome evil not because we must do so as a brute fact of our nature, but rather on account of our own volition.

>>22772192
Questions like this suck. First of what do you mean by the problem of evil? What do you mean by evil? What is evil? Etc, etc. ad infinitum.

The way you undermine the existence of god is by questioning how he came into your life. It certainly wasn't divine inspiration but rather a manipulation by all the people you trust.. so what is really real about god other than the tradition of your peers to worship him.

>>22775445
Your brain is as much a marionette as the rest of you, dipshit. God made you in your entirety, knows everything about you, and everything you will ever think feel choose and do. He's all powerful and made everything lel. The world's his puppet show, there are no unknowns for god. You're acting like a real idiot to claim otherwise.

>>22772192
>>>/his/

>>22775928
>>>/pol/

>>22775445
>>22775923
both are true
God knows most of things but we still have our free will

>>22776185
Read Marx

>>22776190
>facebook grandma image
wtf

>>22776199
Read Marx

>>22776293
Already have, still don't care. Read Marx or fuck off back to >>>/his/

>>22776296
you didn't understand Marx then
read it again

>>22776301
Still don't care. Fuck off back to >>>/his/

>>22776357
i'm using you as a bump do you know that?

>>22776367
Still don't care. Go back to >>>/his/

>>22776369
go back you pol you shitskin

>>22776391
Still don't care. Go back to >>>/his/

>>22772192

it exposes the invalidity and hypocrisy of christianity specifically

>>22776190
>God knows most of things
Blasphemy. God knows all things

>>22776744
So does >>>/his/ go there

How is it a problem? God created you in His image, which means you have free will. When you choose to will that which is not good, you will evil. You will evil, not God. This neither proves God doesn’t exist nor can it be said that evil is one of his attributes. We don’t believe that God and that which exists in His creation are necessarily identifiable. In fact, Christians pretty commonly assert something closer to the opposite. So I fail to see how this is a problem for Christianity at all.

>>22775124
There’s always been Christians here. People that lie and say 2016 are too young to even know the truth. It’s rather that people started actually listening to them more over the last decade or so.

>>22774085
It’s because uncomfortability with the fallen nature of man and the imperfectness of nature/creation is exactly what drives their impulse for things like science, technology, all that. The reason they care so much about this problem of evil is because it’s THE problem FOR THEM. If you just totally exclude the possibility that God exists, that nature is what it is, and just assume that creation is filled with very bad and not so pleasant stuff, the call is obviously to be a progressive leftist and achieve utopia on earth.

>>22774085
>>22776783
And this is why they love to invoke these problems of evil, if God good why bad thing happen, arguments even though anyone with basic literacy can apprehend that this argument has been debunked quite literally millions of times over the last two millenia and probably even before that. They just refuse to engage with answers and insist that it is a problem. It’s the fundamental presupposition underlying the whole of leftism. That’s why they cling to this so firmly and just ask the same question over and over and over.

>>22772192
Evil is created as a necessity of divine Self-identification; its host telors merely embody it and cognitively or behaviorally instantiate it with antiteleological thought and behavior.

>>22772591
In Christian view, evil was born when mankind turned away from god by their own will. But that just opens a new can of worms, if everything is willed by god, how does mankind have free will to turn away from something.

>>22776866
>>22776866
>when mankind turned away from god by their own will.
God with big B

>>22772746
I'm not believing in your cunt god if what you say is true. Even if he is real, I sure as hell wouldn't like him or respect him at all. Fuck you for making an excuse of the sufferings onto this world because you're so weak-willed to know or face the truth.

>>>/his/

>>22772883
God doesn't even have a plan dude, the fuck are you even talking about? How is babies getting cancer and dying a fucking plan? How is sex trafficking, people getting bombed, and the lost of so many loved ones a fucking plan? Just admit you're a fake delusional Christian trying to feel better about himself

>>22776927

>>22776945
watch faggot, your useless religion will be gone in a few decades and i'll be laughing with a bitch on my right and a cigar on my left faggot

>>22776958
you are trying to fight forces that beyond your comprehension anon, i recommend that you switch paths

you can do it friend

>>22777006
yet you don't even understand what forces you're fighting, you believe in a imaginary higher power that controls everything and helps you out, but you'll see soon all of that is a lie. Time will always teach people a lesson.

>>22774740
>child abusers will never be forgiven retard , they will suffer more and pay more in order to get their salvation
Where in the bible does it say that

>>22774740
oh you mean they'll get their punishment when they die? which no one knows what fucking happens other than non existence? wow such a harsh punishment for fucking child raptists i might add, face it its all a meme

>>22777295
Not him but what forces are being fought exactly?

>>22777295
your eyes see nothing you are blind
Schopenhauer won't save you he couldn't even help himself out of depression

>>22777326
The forces of life itself and the carelessness of the universe, each day I wake up nothing really changes and life becomes harder and harder not for me but a lot of people I know. I really feel like religion is a sham and humanity should focus more on making life better and curing cancer for fucks sake, not sucking up to a imaginary fairytale thousands of years ago man.

>>22777362
civilization without religion is human without organs

>>22777364
>The forces of life itself and the carelessness of the universe, each day I wake up nothing really changes and life becomes harder and harder not for me but a lot of people I know

because you are not with harmony with God, my life is much better than yours, you worship yourself

>>22772192
The problem of evil is just a human-centric question, from a human frame of reference.

Technically your frame of reference is totally irrelevant to how things work. What you call good and evil has no bearing on what IS good and evil.

>>22777364
So basically we need to keep beta testing with human lives until le heckin progresserino saves me. Why do we have to put ourselves through more suffering if this universe doesn't care anyway?

>>22777364
>each day I wake up nothing really changes

where are you? why you don't change anything in your life, if you are that passive and can't take action why are you alive, you have to take action and be a real man

>>22777364
there is a great many things you can do that is within your control though. christianity, despite what you think, elevates mankind to created in god's image, not evolutionary beasts in the wild. nurture your body, mind, and spirit. take care of yourself, eat better, exercise. abstain from mindless activities like social media or video games and read or pursue a hobby you've always wanted to do. try your best to not be negative and only use wholesome, uplifting language. this last one might be tough but humor me. pray. every morning close your eyes and pray out loud. express your doubts you've had with yourself and ask for strength in ways to improve aspects. pray for others and be thankful for what you do have. you're probably skeptical about all of this but i guarantee you will see and feel things differently if you practice this for a few weeks.

>>22777485
God bless you brother

It became a problem when God's goodness became dogma.
In the bible and many other early religious writings however we have continual descriptions of God's severity and judgment.
He is described as both merciful and judgmental.
Pain was seen as a sign of his judgement. It was reckoned as our problem, not His

God's goodness is infinite and eternal, the sum of all evil over all of history is finite, multiplied by a trillion and the "problem" still vanishes.

And that is assuming we can even apprehend evil correctly, seeing as we do through a glass, darkly.

>>22776845
>Evil is created as a necessity of divine Self-identification
So God is subject to rules?