/lit/ - Literature

>>22379364
>Moldbug = Liberal
In what sense? do you mean Libertarian or something?

>>22379387
In normal parts of the world libertarian means exactly liberal maybe with less obsession with market economics but essentially yes

So is Moldbug aware of the liberal (progressive) dialectic he is part of by being a (neo)reactionary and does he address this anywhere as Moldbug or Yarvin?

You have really bad reading comprehension, but that's expected from a teenaged Marxist. He's "culturally" liberal, or in other words, part of the blue tribe. When he says stuff like that he's not talking about his politics. How is he developing the status-quo? He wants to destroy just about everything. He's even against the Enlightenment for God's sake. Keep reading and actually pay attention.

>>22379364
>he himself acknowledges it, and yet he also considers himself a reactionary to the liberal US order
In other words a Silicon Valley communist, FDR and "zero covid" apologist. He's the sum of his influences and not a step farther; go to the primary sources and leave this goofy faggot's interpolations to rot.

>>22379425
OK mrs tripfage. If he is "just" culturally liberal and as you claim this doesn't really affect his political views, why does he explicitly claim what he proposes is in fact an ideology? You cannot divorce ideology from the historical process of liberalism's progression. He claims to be atheist yet wants a "Mysterious One" to rule over everyone as supreme sovereign. He wants religion without the theology..In other words, he just wants what Nietsche described a religion without a leg, i.e Ideology, a product of 19th century liberalism

Does he address any of this later on, or really, anywhere? I can see the reaction part, but then how is this not proving the Cathedral where its flaws are and subsequently shows it the holes it can actually fill?

Protip: Klaus Schwab pretty much wants to do the same thing as Moldbug, but with other means ofc


>>22379452
I dont want to do that because im exploring what an ante-liberal POV would look like. His primary sources are ofc liberal tradition. I need justifications for going back to before liberalism, without the need for the institution of christianity

>>22379425
Filtered.

>>22379364
>>22379469
Moldbug is a Jew. Jews run the West. Jewish rule is actively harmful to the West. If Jews keep running the West, they'll run it into the ground and face dire consequences. Curtis Yarvin's Moldbug project is to attempt to create alternative political discourse such that Jews can gracefully duck out of running the West without it reforming into something that they cannot inhabit. People have been discussing and pointing out all of the hangups and flaws with ignoring this about his philosophy for literal years.

>>22379421
Just a tip but when discussing things with humans (non communists) try to not just discuss everythign in communist cant.

For example your very first line
>Just started getting systematically into "Unqualified reservations" and Moldbug in general. So, he's a liberal at heart, he himself acknowledges it, and yet he also considers himself a reactionary to the liberal US order, in what from a dialectical perspective would just mean he's developing the status-quo rather than fighting against it
Starts by dividing the world into two categories, communists and liberals.
No one else does this, and you immediately destroy any possibility of sane discussion.

>>22379421
Just a tip, but when discussing things with humans (non communists) try to not just frame everything in communist cant (I know this is impossible)

For example your very first line
>Just started getting systematically into "Unqualified reservations" and Moldbug in general. So, he's a liberal at heart, he himself acknowledges it, and yet he also considers himself a reactionary to the liberal US order, in what from a dialectical perspective would just mean he's developing the status-quo rather than fighting against it
Starts by dividing the world into two categories, communists and liberals.
No one else does this, and you immediately destroy any possibility of sane discussion.

>>22379469
I have nothing to say. I have no idea what you're talking about.

Molding blames the wasps for everything and is quite jewish himself and in his politics. I prefer nick sandz

>>22379493
He exactly pinpoints what the enemy looks like and what its called but any attempt of his to bring the enemy down just results in Liberal/Libertarian means to achieve it but which they cannot exist without the larger liberal ideological order of things. What i got so far is that yes the Cathedral is evil, it can be brought down via free market principles of city-states rulled by CEOs etc, but then how does he plan to enforce this status quo if free market principles, for example, are deeply rooted within liberal ideological tradition?

>>22379520
Since when is thesis and antithesis communist? You are aware of Hegel i hope

>>22379561
Try re-reading what he said and what i said again then. Moldbug either contradicts himself or he cant see his own contradictions

>>22379585
Alright, how does Nick treat the dilemma of going back to an ante-liberal world without the means of liberal ideology?

I've known about this guy for years but couldn't be assed to read him until now.
I'm almost finished with Open Letter to Open-Minded Progressives and his writing style is immensely grating.
His snarky pop culture references, obsession with littering the text with hyperlinks to show off how "smart" he is and his sincere desire to restore the Stuarts and establish a "sovereign corporation" tells me he should have been bullied at school more.

>Restore absolute monarchy
>King Faggot makes misgendering trannies punishable by execution and imports 500,000,000 Africans to displace the native population

>>22379607
His Wikipedia links tells us far more than actual research ever could

>>22379593
I just don't understand your Marxist lingo is all, and your characterization of Moldbug seems off. You keep calling him liberal but his whole shtick is that he is the anti-liberal that wants to return to aristocracy and monarchy.

>>22379593
Capitalist accelerationism via corporatocracy

>>22379621
Royalty don't just get to do whatever they want, y'know.

>>22379677
>What King Faggot wants is the same as what the aristocracy, business owners, and middle class want
Hmm

>>22379644
First of all, why marxist? thesis anti-thesis precedes Marx, i hope you're aware of that. Its actually Hegel's version that make people like Fukuyama so adamant in his interpretation that western history inevitably moves forward because of its built-in contradictions that keep creating flaws it itself then patches up. Its this Whig narrative of history that Moldbug is actually criticizing, but doesn't he realize, that by being anti-, instead of ante-, he is just a cog within the ever evolving (as he himself notices) ever evolutionary adaptive Cathedral he is vehemently against?

What i'm saying is, if he is *just* anti-liberal then his fate is that like any other reactionary currents against liberalism. But he clearly isnt, he is clearly aware of how the system works and how to take it down. My only question is, is he aware that reaching city-state neo-CEO monarchism require a set of otherwise *liberal* free market means, that they need to be enforced in order to bring them about?

If he is aware, does he address this aspect, specifically of being just a pion within the larger cathedral (possibly planted by the cathedral itself) which programmed to poke the System, only offers it an adaptive solution to its perpetual existence? Its from this POV i say he is liberal, but the best description would be a no-so-fully-aware liberal.


Part of me wants to say no, but other than these doubts, his projected world is part of nothing more than theory-fiction ala Land

>>22379673
Alright, that makes sense. Looks ugly though. What about places around the world (like where im from) that has yet to be developed enough to be called Capitalistic societies? How could NRx through Acc make things move, if nothing has yet been created here yet?

>>22379585
That’s exactly why I don’t really care for him

>>22379734
I don't think Moldbug endorses the idea of patchwork anymore, those blogs were written in the late 2000's. I'd pay more attention to what he wrote in Gray Mirror. But yes, patchwork operates under the idea of free market competition between microstates. If you want to call that liberalism.

He rightly understands that the progressive project has reached a point of social and economic moralizing that it’s detrimental to Darwinian private enterprise and socio-economic freedom in general. Think of it this way. A classically liberal monarch might treat the nation like it’s a profit-seeking corporation and make life ugly and profane in the process, but he doesn’t necessarily have a need to demand right-think and reparations. The latter is basically what Yarvin’s opposed to and what he really wants is to get back on the progressive track, to slide further into the sort of world where the wealthy entrepreneurs, financiers, and merchants are the aristocracy and Jews can cling to their positions of power and influence in finance and executive government. As for the contradiction which implies one begets the other, he is totally unaware of it and outright lies, maybe even convinces himself of lies, to ignore them.

At the end of the day, he is an unrepentant liberal-progressive and merely understands that the left has lost the plot. That the right treats him like their Lenin is sort of ironic and says a lot about just what had a state the dissident right is. They’re so desperate for intellectual legitimacy and ideas that they’ll actually exalt a Jewish liberal-progressive calling for liberal-progressive autocracy.

>>22379821
Carl Schmitt is an excellent antidote for NRx delusions. For example, Yarvin really thinks his project is as easily achievable as a law nerd startup ceo running for President and just declaring these legal innovations, as if power struggles don’t always and everywhere erupt in civil war. Schmitt makes it clear that’s because liberals confuse the law for the power behind the law. Land is at least smart enough to define power approximately along these lines, and Yarvin might actually concede that when pressed on it but all of his thinking demonstrates that he doesn’t really believe it. He also said on a podcast that 19th century Jewish immigrants to America involving themselves in industry and finance were “aristocratic” so there’s that as well…

>>22379364
Jesus, dude, do you want him to hold your hand too in your political trajectory?
Wanna-be dictator faggot.

>>22379821
Don't you think this is a mischaracterization of Moldbug? How is he a liberal progressive? He believes in aristocracy and monarchy. He also rebukes the idea of eternal progress and equality. That puts him on the right, doesn't it? There is just a disagreement about who exactly these aristocrats are and who the monarch should be. Or are you suggesting Moldbug is a sinister force and aligned with say, Larry Fink? Do you think Moldbug doesn't want to put Larry Fink put in the gallows?

Anyway, I don't think there are any aristocrats today. Aristocrats are a warrior class, and actual war has long since faded away. So the best you can hope for are natural aristocrats, but I don't see any hanging around. I certainly don't think BAP, ZHP Lovecraft, or "Raw Egg Nationalist" qualify. I also don't think it's the tech people either, they are Satanic AI worshippers, and much too narrowly specced. Maybe Musk, but Musk is one person. You should just make me king. I'll sort it out.

>>22379906
No, I don’t. He style himself as a proponent of something like classically liberal autocracy, but if you really know what classical liberalism looks like, what liberal progressivism looks like, and what Yarvin’s vision looks like, it’s pretty clearly the latter and not the former. His only admiration for the Founding Fathers is that they were law nerds. His vision is properly the sort of liberalism that evolved out of the 19th century and the Roosevelt era, not the 18th century and the Washington era. I don’t necessarily think he’s aligned with someone like Larry Fink, who I don’t think can be properly described as a liberal-progressive anyway. But I definitely don’t think he wants to put him in the gallows. I think he actually does have some affinity for characters like Fink and I think a lot of his writing is basically about that and steering the right to his apology for it. Yarvin comes off as worried about what’s going to happen to the people he feels affinity for and he made that clear with his little Tolkien-esque essay imo. If there’s one place we can agree though, it’s that there are no real aristocrats today. It doesn’t mean that what he said is right, however. It’s an outright lie. He’s deploying rhetoric to sort of get people who would instinctually disagree to feel better about themselves and their own inclinations. “You, reader, yes you, you’re an aristocrat because you work in finance and like following politics. Now buy my book.”

But as for that last bit, the aristocracy, that’s why I recommend Schmitt. Schmitt rightly understand that the law is not synonymous with power. What lies behind power is necessarily martial monopoly, which basically defines a true aristocracy. I don’t have a vision for that in the modern world, but I think it’s definitely still true. The major era of the liberal-progressive is that law is his most powerful tool and so believes firmly that power really does reside in the law, and maybe secondarily money. But I think history would have quite a lot to say about that…

>>22379906
I think you have escape this circle of sort of eCeleb writers and thinkers and their tech entrepreneur darlings to even find anything and anyone remotely worthwhile. If this is where you’re looking and what you’re comparing to, you’re so far off the mark that your search is basically hopeless. Your thinking should probably resort immediately to Army colonels, Congressmen, Governors, first and foremost, not eCelebs and tech celebrities. The former can be a poor cohort, but they’re the natural place to look. The latter is not and never will be that cohort, no matter how badly Yarvin and his ilk want it to be. Therein lies the lie.

So I think you’re thinking is just a little spooked here.

>>22379421
Ah so in compass sense and not left right okay.
>>22379425
> He wants to destroy just about everything. He's even against the Enlightenment for God's sake. Keep reading and actually pay attention.
Yarvin is obviously someone who is against the post-enlightenment form of government but I don’t think he truly want to destroy the system but more of a transform it from the inside. If we are going for destroying the system then James Mason is the definition of it which Yarvin dismisses them as false path to gain power aka trying to destroy the system -> the system organize and project you as terrorist -> people won’t joining your group -> you don’t have enough power to destroy it
We see it with various far right groups and media constantly portrays them as evil people already and rarely any of these movement do any damage to the system as a whole.

>>22379387
>In what sense?
Not him, but he does have a disdain for the educated rural he can't get past and thinks an enlightened elite should rule them (the infamous dark elf/hobbit speech)

>>22380022
>>22379796
so wait he doesn’t believes in the whole Neo-Holy Roman Empire political patchwork ideas anymore? What does he even think of nowadays, I have heard the terms dark elf throwing around but never bother looking into his newer writings so I’m kind of clueless here.

>>22379985
No I wouldn't say I'm spooked. I've been disillusioned with the dissident right for years. It started with Spandrell and his sycophantic worship of the Chinese. If I brought up things like gutter oil I would get blocked. It really annoyed me that this guy was supposed to be right wing and was simping hardcore for these sub humans. He married one you know, had a child too.

Uh, anyway. Come on, there's no way you believe that career politicians are viable options for natural aristocrats. I jump to e-celebs because they are one of the few groups of people that actually tell the truth about the state of the world. Honesty is the cardinal virtue in my book, so anyone lacking it is not worthy of consideration. Of course, they are defective in other ways—they are grifting hacks, and they still lie—just about different things.

Unfortunately the military has been pozzed long ago, and is very bureaucratic, so to get to that level in the current day you must be defective in some way. I read an article that specifically pinpoints below the level of Colonel as being the key group here. The reasoning being that at that level duties are still possibly related to actual combat operations. Being in combat keeps you engaged to reality, it's kill or be killed.

>>22379831
It's bizarre how NRx circlejerkers just took Yarvin's word when he asked them to assume a bunch of baffling premises for the sake of argument.

It makes me wonder if Yarvin really believes all that vomit he wrote or if he's aiming for something else, and his sycophants are useful idiots.

>>22379734
Marxist because you are using a Marxist frame where everyone is either a liberal or some other mystery thing (what might that be)
Also your use of endless Marxist phrases and ideas
Why bullshit? This is the worst part about commies.

>>22379831
I don't think Yarvin believes any of those things.
> liberals confuse the law for the power behind the law.
Yarvin is constantly talking about where the real power lies.

>>22379585
>>22379754
His "critique" of Kevin MacDonald was embarrassing.

>>22379796
> don't think Moldbug endorses the idea of patchwork anymore, those blogs were written in the late 2000's. I'd pay more attention to what he wrote in Gray Mirror

Alright, will do!

>If you want to call that liberalism
Well its hard not to when his frame reference revolves around healthy competition against said city states. Why couldn't one just swallow the other and kill the competition rather than compete? You know, like how it happened with the HRE

>>22379882
>do you want him to hold your hand too in your political trajectory?
He actively discourged armed action and mass popular unrest, hence the question as to how exactly he wants to achieve all his sound ideas. Instead he appeals to the Amendments and US constitution, both products of the liberal-enlightenment, which gives all the more reason to assume he's still a liberal at heart

>>22379906
>He believes in aristocracy and monarchy. He also rebukes the idea of eternal progress and equality.
So he's an enlightened absolute monarchist? Europe had a couple of those around before, Franz Joseph and Alexander the II iirc. And yet even they couldn't stop the liberal order, because they were just "anti-", the planned reactionary error in the greater framework of liberalism's paradigm

>>22380175
First of all im NRx, Enlightenment has all set us back and all its derivadives have caused massive global death and destruction. Marxism isnt opposed to Liberalism, its just its mutated franco-germanified version, a fork if you will. Though i find it hard for western NRx to fully realize how deeply rooted their thinking still is in Liberalism and Enlightenment thinking. Essentially im from a place mostly untouched by liberalism and mostly resembling feudalist societies 200 years ago. Anything ever politically written after the italian reneissance, is simply put, liberalist ideology, man as center of universe, etc etc

>>22380071
I don’t believe they’re viable aristocrats. I know for certain they are the de facto political aristocracy, for better or worse. This isn’t a character judgment. If you really think eCelebs tell the truth, you’re really off the mark. But I agree with you that there problems with the military. Still, I was really clear that these are natural places to look because that’s basically where power resides. This idea that power resides in law nerds and rich startup-minded tech entrepreneurs is a total fantasy. To date the number of Presidents with military experience dwarfs the number with any sort of business experience at all. There’s a reason for that and it’s not merely public perception.

>>22380179
I think he does, but feel free to tell me where exactly Yarvin thinks power resides in your mind.

>>22380230
NRx evolved out of an unholy matrimony of Marxism and classical liberalism. Nick Land himself was arguably a Marxist long before he was a Neoreactionary and Yarvin considered himself a Libertarian (Classical liberal).

>>22379906
Yarvin’s ideal monarchy is a drastic departure from any sort of traditional monarchy. His ideal monarch is basically a rich upper crust bourgeois technocrat in the style of FDR but more techie and pro-business with a “live and let live attitude”. He believes monarchs should let parents feed their kids hormones to transition because “it’s none of your business”.

>>22380230
I’m pretty curious where you’re from. I think it’s a sound assessment. I see NRx as a sort of enlightenment fork, like you described. It basically is the path they wish we had taken. Instead of a slide into Republican-Democratic liberal-progress following the enlightenment that resulted in a woke unraveling they envision a slide into what they call NRx, autocratic liberal-progress they imagine would’ve resulted in space colonization or something.

>>22380235
I'm not being pragmatic, I'm just trying to answer the question of who is a natural aristocrat. In other words who is the best around—that's what "aristos" means.

>>22380230
...What are you Chinese? Some kind of Southeast Asian? Laos? Cambodia?

>>22380065
>so wait he doesn’t believes in the whole Neo-Holy Roman Empire political patchwork ideas anymore
It's more that he says he believes in it, but when the rubber actually meets the road and he has to work with local rural people he can't get past his actual biaes that hold him back from fully realizing the idea leading to bad post facto justifications to avoid cognitive dissonance

>>22380276
I think we’ve gotten off track. My point was not originally about aristocracy, natural or otherwise. I think looking for one is a mistake. My point was rather about Yarvin’s confused conception of law and power.

>>22380327
He says he believes in a lot of things and then expounds on ideas that directly contradict that. It’s practically his M.O.

>>22380244
I am well aware of their origins, but its not that from which my objections come from, rather its why or how exactly could a 100% pure strain of NRx look like without Enlightenment (or any any of its forks) would look like. Basically a political system set to bring about change that precedes the thinking which brough us the idea of revolution, change etc in the first place

Here, "Reset" is a term very well coined by Moldbug, and he is very observant that revolutions generally dont lead to anywhere, but rather make a state stronger and their elites ever more powerful. Moldbug has very impirical conclusions in his political writings, its just how exactly to achieve them without going back to square one ending up with liberal or illiberal governments again, because God only knows how many times its still tried nowadays and each end up being liberal forks again.

>>22380266
Yes, also a sound point he makes. Present day liberal-progress is basically a religion coming from a long line of Whig-Quaker-Calvinist theological tradition. If we scale it back even further, it goes back to when Christianity was institutionalized by the Roman Empire.

What the west truly needs is a new religion. Or, at the very least, a new theological tradition different from Christianity altogether

>>22380322
Im close to Europe lets put it that way. I intend to selfpublish my own NRx newspaper where im from. I must learn from the masters first

>>22380253
Yeah, it took me a while to figure that out actually. I still think Moldbug is a good step along the way. He clears out a lot of clutter regarding the lies that are told about history, completely explains how the modern system of government actually works, and introduces the concept of an authoritarian government that isn't just Hitler LARPing.
>>22379975
>It’s an outright lie
What do you mean? What is he lying about? The Dark Elf thing?

>>22380373
The lie I was mentioning was specifically this notion that 19th century Jewish immigrants working in finance, education, and law were aristocratic simply because they involved themselves in politics. He said this on a podcast. I don’t recall which one. But I consider it an obvious lie.

>>22380373
I don’t think so. I think the only two things of any value in his writing are 1) the description of “the cathedral”, this alliance between media and academia which is very real albeit maybe less formalized than he likes to imagine and 2) revealing how his circle thinks and acts. Realizing that he and his friends really consider themselves the Elves is probably the single most valuable thing he’s ever written.

>>22379821
>>22379831
>>22379906
>>22379975
>>22380071
>>22380230
>>22380235
>>22380276
I think the biggest issue with Aristocracy that trips right wingers up is they romanticize the concept so hard they can't honestly look at it's origins.

Who were the original men who created the bloodlines of Europe today?

Well.... mostly what we would consider to be organized crime today, made up of Germanic thugs who beat up Roman officials, slowly crept in, and eventually won so hard they just became the actual warlords. All that stuff about noble blood and divine right, and obligation was developed later, as the descendants of these warlords realized they needed to organize and build up their turfs before their rivals crowded in.

>>22380404
You’re just spooked by Marxism. Even if an aristocracy becomes an aristocracy merely by conquest, there’s a certain ethic implied in that, a certain disposition to certain things, to law, to religion, to the state. You want to distill everything down to some dialectical materialist take but real history and real people are not so simple. The fact remains either way that some traits are historically aristocratic and some are not. That’s just indisputable.

>>22380420
Did I ever deny historical traits or implied ethnic traits? The same traits that allowed those original thugs to step up carried over to their descendants, and leadership and morals were cultivated and selected over generations once they focused on those. If anything what ruined aristocracy in Europe was when their bloodlines finally got too removed from their skilled martial pasts, and even then Prussia was going strong until WW1 derailed everything.

>>22380434
I never said anything about ethnicity, but yes, you did. You said they were later innovations, which is simply not true. A certain martial ethic is pretty much a requirement for a martial class that aims to rule by conquest, is it not? How could that be a later innovation? It can’t be. But that is indeed what you said.

>>22380439
I'm saying their ethics about being more cultured or needing to be of a certain status were developed further later and eventually ossified, not that they had no morals. Not to say that there was not status back in those ancient days, but more that said status could be easily decided by extreme fighting skill while absolutist Europe would hem and haw how the skilled fighter is not of noble blood.

>>22380489
Cultures grow and people become cultured over time. What is your point? The cultural elite would obviously uphold a standard of being more cultured than others. But even this misses the full story because in Germanic Europe poetry and music were very much a sort of aristocratic sort of pursuit, along with war and politics. That class was always the cultural elite and it was never otherwise. Odin/Wotan was an aristocrat’s god sand also the god of poetry as well as war. You’ve just accepted this narrative about these people that simply isn’t true for basically no reason at all.

>>22379621
Kill fag king insert non fag king
If fags do the same then civil war
A better system than democracy

>>22379364
This guy is such a dork
Look at that physiognomy lmao
>current year
>reading drivel by tech autists
I am not interested in the opinions of weak men
>>22379607
Only good take ITT

>>22380366
I’m failing to see the empirical evidence for revolutions making existing elites stronger. The state, sure. The particular elites? No. That is as a matter of fact not what happened in America or France as best I can tell.

>>22380366
Have you considered orthodoxy as a viable religion? It’s really the only segment I see strong anti-enlightenment tendencies. Have you read Oswald Spengler at all by chance?

>>22380585
Bit more challenging than that when “fag king” has predator drones and transsexual drone pilots at his disposal don’t you think?

>>22380767
Elites only become stronger after a revolution because they learn to undo ways in which they themselves got into power in the first place, aiming up and kicking down as they say, which inevitably makes the state aparatus more stronger against internal and external enemies, but bloating it with unecessary beauracracy in the process as well, making the burden of people's lives ever so harder. And then the cicle repeats itself again. What good can come out of this chaotic cycle?

>>22380772
Orthodoxy is at best nothing but Catholicism lite (Not called Holy Apostolic Universal i.e Catholic Church for nothing), its literally the same religion that brought about western Enlightenment in the first place, sans heads of rulling it. It didnt reach the consequeces as the west because it was firmly in the hands of the Roman state (inb4 muh byzantines) whereas in the west the pope created all sorts of uncontrolled religious precedents

>>22379421
>In normal parts of the world
I hate America too, but this is a cope. America is the hegemonic power, and they set the the standard in the west.
>b-but in Europe we call right wingers liberals
Europe is an American colony and our politics are play pretend.

>>22380932
And to add, the very first seedlings of Enlightenment came from St.Athanasius's Orthodox theological statement
>God became man so that Man can become God

1000s of years later, 1 reformation and 2 liberal revolutions later, Mormonism claims that humans are descendents of intergalactic space humanoids building their own planets

>>22380943
Tbh i never heard of any major european parties calling themselves Libertarian, because thats what name they use in USA. Doctrinally speaking, its literally the same as classic liberalism of the french revolution
>inb4 collectivistic liberalism vs individual liberalism

>>22379796
Wasn't gray mirror just an attraction sign so he could get a new wife?

Heisman is a better Jewish crypto-liberal-crypto-Nazi than Moldbug. His book is a 2000 page long schizo rant that develops and radicalizes what some of you might be familiar with as the Ultracalvinist Hypothesis and/or Nietzsche's slave morality characterization of Christianity. Dude actually killed himself on Harvard campus after dropping this book, true commitment to his ramblings about Abrahamism being a tool to conquer death and nature.
Most of the blurbs and reviews you can find online are extremely misleading. They get caught up in the free speech introduction. The book is actually about a civilizational battle between Aryanism and Judeo-Christianity. He is far too dependent on Nietzsche but overall his interrogation of the origins of liberalism is pretty unique. The section on the Norman Yoke is brilliant, he basically drudged up a wrongly forgotten ethnic conflict between Anglo-Saxons and Normans and puts it at the center of modern political history. Great stuff. Also it's extremely repetitive and kinda unedited so you can skip around the 2000 pages without much of a problem

>>22381864
>He is far too dependent on Nietzsche but overall his interrogation of the origins of liberalism is pretty unique

Does he identify it with the ancient substrate of christianity?

>>22380327
He never said he can't work with them, just that he's culturally different. He said in an interview that when he was is (IIRC) Portugal as a kid he was one of the few white collar kids who could get along with the more blue collar army kids because he could throw a football.
He advocates a purple monarch who can get along with both and doesn't seek to turn libs into cons or cons into libs.
It's more of a cultural difference that is benign, rather than an active malignant hatred or disdain.

>>22382780
>turn libs into cons or cons into libs
Or more accurately: urbans into rurals, or rurals into urbans*

>>22379469
>He claims to be atheist yet wants a "Mysterious One" to rule over everyone as supreme sovereign.
Wait until you read his "Early life" section

>>22379607
>restore the Stuarts
He prefers the Tudors to the Stuarts

>>22379364
"NRx" has been already tried and it's exactly what one would expect it to look like. I'd go as far as saying the first NRx thinker was Plato himself with his "Republic", and this itself has taken form into modern day Iran's Islamic Republic because it checks out the requirements
- Doesn't follow progressivism
- Has a philosopher-king as head of state who pulls the actual strings in partisan politics

If a western NRx ever happens, it would look either as Plato's Republic or modern day islamic Iran rather than a patch of city-states ruled by neo-monarch-ceos but who's to say how deterritorialization will look like in the west with the help of capitalism

Nrx is such a shit "movement"

>>22382885
Shut up its still in its developing stage and needs more writers to contribute with a sprinkle of blood by its adherents to solidify it as equal within the ranks of other currents of action-oriented thought

>>22381864
Are le based ayyrians the normans or the Saxons in this conflict?
I could see it both ways.

>>22382835
>deterritorialization
t. tranny

How about y'all start getting systematically into having sex.

>>22379364
Read the Gentle Introduction

>>22380932
They are different elites though.

>>22380932
Low IQ take on Catholicism and Orthodoxy tbqh

>>22382910
NRx is dead, dude.

>>22383248
Is this a joke? It's never had more steam.

I remember when Curtis Yarvin endorsed Joseph R. Biden for President because he thought it would take the wind out of the left’s sails.

This guy really is just another nerd that read too much Machiavelli. Too bad you can’t intellectualize your way to power or victory.

>>22383249
yeah all of those 105 iq youtubers sure are keeping the movement alive!

>>22383249
You are delusional. NRx is totally dead.

>>22383288
It was dead before it started.
Impossible to start a popular movement when Curtis Yarvin, Nick Land, and Peter Thiel are your poster children.
"Intellectuals" have no prayer of starting a popular movement in the modern era. They are too detached from reality, and too incapable of receiving the respect of "men of action".
Movements must be led from the front - thinkers are supposed to be a second thought, not a driving force. The charisma of "men of action" win the masses. "Intellectuals" serve to temper the ideology for the masses who will disagree; to defend $newIdeology amongst the academics and politicians.
The "first followers" are also critical. Movements are built on an ideology, sure, but are grown within the masses by a desire to belong among like-minded people.
NRx failed on this front as well; the first followers were twitter autists and lady-wristed tech nerds.
This is why Trump was so successful - a "man of action" with charisma preached a forming ideology (Trump obviously did not read intellectuals' theories). His first followers were working class men, alienated by the progressive left and the traditional right. (A broad basic group, easy to find commonality with). Then the academics, the media and the intellectuals flowed in, swayed by his rhetoric, ready to dress it up in a neat bow, to present to the press and other shot callers of the GOP.
He built one of the strongest coalitions in US history. They could have had it all if he could have just avoided his narcissism and made it into a cult of personality.

>NRx started as mental masturbation by weak tech dorks, the first followers were 4chan and twitter autists, with not a "man of action" in sight. It's so over.

>>22379364
Moldbug is interesting. His "Nazi Wikipedia" blogpost back in the day blew my mind. He introduced me to Carlyle whose history of the French Revolution is a joy to read. But he should be read as an intellectual curiosity, not as the leader of a movement in the real world. It's just fantasy at the end of the day. His arguments for absolute monarchy are the same as Schopenhauer's which are the same as of any intellectual pre-French Revolution.

>>22379364
Prefer Nick Land these days. Loved UR but Gray Mirror has been a womp-womp party.

>>22383374
This is the tragedy of the particular style of American elitism though. The people who can present themselves as right-wing counter-elites and manipulate votes are fucking tech entrepreneurs with Ivy League degrees and their gay investors that got rich riding the tech bubble, along with Jewish bloggers. Isn’t that pathetic? Just look at how the right has embraced RFK Jr. who would’ve been mainstream California democrat not even two decades ago. If that’s not a big enough of a black pill to shake you out of the delusion that NRx and Curtis Yarvin have anything at all to offer, I don’t know what is.

>>22383374
Members of the working class were not Trump’s early adopters.

More than a hunch tells me that theory and ideology has no practical effect on politics in this day and age and hunch tells me that intellectualism has no practical effect either. Moldbug, Land, and their circles of internet thinkers are more than worthless and all they serve to do is send right wingers spiraling into a series of reading and blogging about ideas while left wingers climb the institutional ranks of universities, government agencies, and even the military. These guys are worse than worthless. They are counterproductive.

Why are you wasting your time reading this chinlet

>>22383247
Low iq how? I was born and raised orthodox

t..op

>>22383604
So what? I went to college. Do I know everything there is to know about higher education, or even my Alma Mater? Obviously, I don’t. Your appeal is a fallacy.

>>22383506
But he's based! He wears a leather jacket! He's gonna own the libs!

>>22383639
The right really is stuck in this weird cycle of exalting left wingers who can intellectually own the libs and watching their YouTube videos religiously, while the libs write real policy for the Department of State…

I watched his Triggernometry interview and I’m now fairly convinced his entire line of thought is nothing more than a concealment of his insecurity over himself and where he comes from. He fashions himself in the style of a Renaissance or Elizabethan aristocratic and proponent of aristocracy and says things like Jewish immigrants involving themselves in politics is “aristocratic” purely because he knows dee down that he is not an aristocrat, not an elf, but just another member of the same middle class that ruined the world.

>>22383973
And the right eats it up because they know that one of the major causes of decline is the loss of aristocracy so they’re obsessed with aristocracy and fashioning themselves as aristocrats, which per Yarvin’s YouTube videos (and not his essays, which they don’t read) aristocrats aren’t anti-Semitic and actually love classica liberalism and laissez-faire attitudes too by the way.

That’s it. That’s the entire project.

>>22383374
communism started with some fat NEET REEing about having to pay rent

>>22383618
How does that refute anything? Catholicism and Orthodoxy are the ancient ancestors of modern day whig-progresivist religion. It was essentially the religious institution of the roman state that deterritorialized and broke off into a gagillion strains of though that got their own life because there was no state aparatus to keep religious Orthodoxy in check.

If you fall back to an ancient institution like Catholic/Orthodox christianity you're a simple reactionary. And a hypocrite above that

>>22384027
You appealed to your experience as a nominal member of the church, which is a fallacy. I’m refuting your point by making that clear, and if it is the case then your point isn’t necessarily true. It could be true, but your claim isn’t true just because that’s your experience. Learn what a fallacy is. All of these takes you have are basically just assertions that you can’t back up. Even lumping the two together is nonsensical because it ignores the very real distinction, which exists for a reason. Your replies are just nonsenseical hot takes and nothing more.

Half legged right winger ideologists wanting to discredit Yarvin because he's a nerd like what kind of argument is that you honestly expect a leader who will rally you all with a cool sounding horn like in the movies dress up in armor and go fight an epic battle to take down the system? thinking people think, and they realize how stupid gearing up and shooting at politicians with inspiring speeches is you pathetic little brainlets

>>22383505
They countersignal people that want to do irl stuff constantly

>>22384141
That he is intellectual is not the critique of anyone. It’s that he is overly intellectual, to the point of self-sabotage and political sabotage. If he’s wrong, he’s wrong. It doesn’t matter that he thinks, how much, or about what.

>>22383973
>>22383990
You are pretty retarded, just like everyone in this thread. Yarvin has always been anti-intellectual and anti-aristocratic supporter of the monarchy. He always said that the people and monarchy should unite against aristocracy, I have no clue how you came to the conclusion that he supports aristocracy. His elf/hobbit article was just a statement of a fact, not endorsement of elves.

>>22384165
Curtis, please. Don’t do this here.

>>22384165
Try watching the interview. He mentions aristocracy and how he admires it in the first 15 minutes. This is what I mean. Idiots like you eat it up, even though you don’t even get it.

>>22384192
>Some out of context bit from the interview is more important than his books and articles
I though this was /lit/, I thought someone here would read, but no, it's just pseuds who watched a couple of youtube videos and read a wikipedia article.
>how he admires it
Curtis also admires FDR, does that mean that he supports him or his policies?

>>22384263
Yeah, I think him speaking plainly and frankly and stating clearly what he admires and appreciates is quite a lot more telling about his worldview than his internet-lingo laden and obscurantist blogs where he constantly deploys rhetorical tricks to mislead his readers. Yeah, I do believe that. How crazy of me.

Yes, he’s made it clear that he does admire many aspects of FDR’s progressivism as well as his willingness to act as a sort of monarch for life.

>>22384278
>I don't know what his worldview is, but I think I know because he said something in an interview which I incorrectly interpreted, I refuse to seek further knowledge about his worldview and dismiss his books because i'm too dumb to read.

>>22382985
Normans as Aryans/Pharaoh and Anglo-Saxons as Israel in bondage. A bunch of references to early modern Brits larping as Israelites + Puritan escape from England being a second Exodus. Kinda crazy stuff but fun to think about. Makes you start seeing the Puritan roots of the liberal elite in the US pretty clearly

>>22384163
>If he’s wrong, he’s wrong
In what way is he wrong? His conclusions are spot on, in fact there's no other writer prior to him which encapsulated the problem and its name of the modern 21st century global order.

Sure his solutions sound different to what people are used to, but unusual problems like modern 21st century liberal-progressivism require unusual solutions.

Besides, if you have a solution you think is more efficient, go ahead and write about it! I know i certainly will when i'll get a newspaper of my own up and going

>>22379469
Skip to Moldbug's Carlyle essay. Explains the value of a pre liberal writer in great depth. If you find it compelling, check out some od his old reading list posts. He has a few devoted to various old authors discussing various topics.

>>22384022
That fat NEET found common cause with other people because no one likes paying rent.

>>22384359
I knew it.
>Kinda crazy stuff but fun to think about. Makes you start seeing the Puritan roots of the liberal elite in the US pretty clearly
you can read a very funny seething polemic by Thomas morton (who iirc was a guy who tried to start a pagan settlement in the middle of puritan Massachusetts, with feasts to Bacchus and Indian hookers) about the puritans, lamenting the arrival of israel.

>>22384295
You’re just strawmanning me. I do what his worldview is and I’ve made that clear by stating his beliefs, the same beliefs he himself made clear in plain English.

I have just discovered the Pirate Party and it's the first time I feel I can get behind an ideology. However, I admit I'm kind of politically illiterate. So, what's the best lit for an aspiring pirate?

>>22384389
That Jewish immigrants are aristocratic, that anti-Semitism was the opinion of peasants, that there are no bad actors but only mechanical problems, that classical liberalism is good, that the primary cause of our problems is a breakdown in the ideas marketplace, that technocracy is good, that vitalism is a viable political mandate, I really could go on and on. He also said that basically wants is a young tech CEO technocrat to seize power with legal innovations and turn the United States into a giant and highly efficient corporation, albeit a corporation with no left-wing madness but a corporation nonetheless. He most admired corporate-capitalist modernizers like Deng and Lee Kuan Yew. Now, I can admit that last bit is not a critique of some statement as fact when in reality it’s not but I’d rather a value judgement of what would be “good”. But if you think that this is an entirely honest or well-meaning person with truly right wing sympathies, you’ve simply been taken for a fool. It’s one thing to reveal his preferences in a way that people can obviously disagree. He reveals these undesirable preferences all the time. But that’s the latter. It’s another to give takes on history and mechanisms that are just not the case, but do so in a way that you can say them with confidence because you know your audience won’t fact check you or dig around for the truth but will rather just take you at face value if you own the libs. That’s the former and that’s what Yarvin does pretty much constantly.

>>22384521
their wikipedia page and how they are sterile people since they gained power in germany years ago and guess what, they achieved nothing. DO you know hwy? because being part of the bureaucratic class is just strengthening the republic.

>>22383973
>but just another member of the same middle class that ruined the world.
This is something that I think happens to most middle class who realize how fucked things got after the French Revolution. The smartest thing to do is not engage in self-hatred over it, but push forward and do you best to not fall into the usual pitfalls.
t. am middle class

>>22384661
It’s really a character and social type rather than an economic type.

>>22382835
Oh man, please don't insult Plato by comparing him to NRx.
>it would look either as Plato's Republic
We already saw what Plato's Republic would have looked like, it was the Catholic Church during the middle ages.

>>22379585
ok, but how exactly is he wrong about that ?

>>22379364
>Does he address his own contradictions
aside from your weird opinion that Moldbug is a "liberal" when he rejects all forms of republicanism, you do realize that UR is a collection of essays/screeds written over the course of years with plenty of time to develop or change opinions, right?

>>22384922
oh, and there really isn't anything "liberal" in the actual, original sense, about modern America. there is for example no rule of law.

>>22384683
>We already saw what Plato's Republic would have looked like, it was the Catholic Church during the middle ages.
no? are you stupid?

>>22384922
You don’t have to be a Republican to be a liberal. Liberalism is a political theory. It can be Democratic, Republican, Aristocratic, Monarchic, etc.

>>22384051
You're not refuting anything still. How am i wrong exactly? I bet you're one of those McOrthodox converts from the US only they get so defensive when calling the orthodox church(es) on their institutional bullshit. Westerners have only 1 bishop rulling over his part of christianity in the west. Said bishop also claims to be God's representative on earth in place of Jesus.

Easterners have a multitude of bishops that dont make ridiculous political power statements like that. Aside the power factor, there is literally close to no difference between the two traditions. Both venerate the same theological traditions up until the 3rd ecumenical council and the people that put them into writing (Like St.Athanasius, who basically created the orthodox/catholic creed). Yarvin is correct in tracing back progressivism back into a specific christian creed. But go back even further, before reformations, before popes, before the Institution of Christianity of the Roman Empire. Research it all the way backwards till the very end like Yarvin did, and you will find that through the sheer chance of Christianity being adopted as a state religion by the Roman Empire, that the seeds of the Proto-Cathedral were already set in place 1000+ years ago.

From Land's perspective, it just accelerated into its natural conclusion into the modern stateless, informal ideology we call progressivism.

Did i mention i tried to become an orthodox monk not once but two times? Claiming to be NRx then leaning back into the creator of the Cathedral as refuge, is like running away from your house on fire into a burning forest. Christianity should be the true enemy of anyone claiming to be NRx. Not to say being an atheist or irreligious, but certainly not of christian religion and certainly not YahWeh of the christian God

>>22385107
You resorted to ad hominem in your second sentence. Just give up.

>>22379425
What ever happened to ‘tripcodes are for jerks’?

>>22385132
Appealing to a fallacy is a fallacy itself

Admit you have no retort and are just a fragile little turtle scared to get out of its shell and confront reality

Patchwork was the most interesting thing he wrote. He seems to have abandoned that though and now just supports a king to rule over all America.

>>22379364
One thing he advocates is an "Antiversity" which is supposed to be a new and respected locus of truth to oppose the modern University. Instead of a long march through institutions, an entirely new institution. He also pretty clearly wants a sort of techno-fascist take over of the united states, but due to his ethno-religious handicap, he has all these neurotic ideas about how to "prevent hitler" because of how much his plan sounds like a hitlerian plan. I suspect he would be just find with a "Schmidtler" who loved his preferred ethnic group but wanted to get rid of some others.

>>22379425
>blue tribe
Indeed.
But he says half.

>>22384450
Communism never struck a chord with the common man.

>>22385591
Is Gray Mirror on sale anywhere yet or is it all through his substack

>>22384165
When he talks about intralexuals he often says they are "good people", citing examples of the Progressive Era, but that they have just been misguided.

>>22386334
Demonstrably false

>>22379364
youre a simple jack full retard if you think the gayfaggot giganiggerstate in power is anything like classical liberalism

>>22385046
Ok, what is "liberalism" in your eyes? Define it. Hopefully in a way that can not also be applied to ancient Rome

>>22385107
Yarvin has said that every society has its own cathedral. In fact, he's using that word less and just says "the system" now

>>22385591
Patchwork was a bit of a pipedream and he admits this.

>>22386731
>In fact, he's using that word less and just says "the system" now
His wife's death really played a number on him huh

Is there any place i can follow his interviews and public appearances other than substack?

I want moldbug's books in physical form not ebook form reeee

>>22384922
Where did he lay down his opinions that changed in time? Specifically his present day opinions after 20 years of UR

>>22384683
What other ancient writer has a systematic explanation and political model completely different to what liberalism eventually came up with? Its as NRx as you could possibly see achieved in real concrete form

>>22386639
He considers intellectuals, aristocrats, etc to be druggies who are addicted to power, and the only way to help them is to take away their power and turn them into subordinates. But unfortunately some retards think that he is a proponent of aristocracy (a form of government where all power is in the hands of aristocracy) because they never opened a book in their lives.

>>22387502
>because they never opened a book in their lives.
Given them a break, man, this is /lit/ after all.

>>22382910
NRx is objectively dead lol. it split into different groups e.g. post-liberals, neoab etc. a few years ago

>>22387525
Are people really that dissappointed in Yarvin's patchwork solution that instead of coming up with different methods ala Marx, they just abandon the thought altogether?

Also where does one begin to follow all the developments of the movement, discord?

>>22386726
Why is that a demand?

>>22385243
I’m not appealing to a fallacy. I’m pointing out that you’ve committed a fallacy.

>>22387502
Nobody ever said he was a proponent of aristocracy. It was said that he was an admirer of aristocracy and that he imagines himself as a sort of modern aristocratic, which is just obviously true. It’s like you people don’t even know how to parse English or read between the lines. No wonder you fall for this huckster.

>>22387747
That is a fallacy

Now why dont we go back to christian religion, and why exactly you dont like it being made fun of

>>22387763
> it’s a fallacy to point out that I’ve committed a fallacy
That’s not a fallacy you idiot.

>>22387781
No, its a fallacy to disregard an argument just because it contains a fallacy, can you not read?

>>22379364
Why did the Meditations on Moldbug guy delete his channel? It was the best secondary source on Moldbug out there. Does anyone have his videos by any chance?

>>22389169
Why didnt anyone tell me there was a channel focused on Moldbug? Why am i hearing this just now? This isnt fair

>>22389399
You missed out. He was the best at systematizing Moldbug's ideas. Just throwing yourself at reading Moldbug's blog is a very chaotic experience.

>>22389434
I first heard of him and Land around 2015ish but only now starting to dive into both. Never knew their ideas had such a loyal following, i thought they were mostly a 4chan thing but now i want to join in too

>Just throwing yourself at reading Moldbug's blog is a very chaotic experience
Tell me about it

>>22383973
>He fashions himself in the style of a Renaissance or Elizabethan aristocratic and proponent of aristocracy
>>22387752
>Nobody ever said he was a proponent of aristocracy

What a fucking clown

>>22387552
>>22387525
NRX as a “movement” is kinda dumb because as other anons have said it’s just an edgy book club for reactionaries and 4chan autists at this point. I say this as someone who quite likes Yarvin’s stuff.
What NRX actually is is more of an analytical framework or mode of analysis. Much of the value in Moldbug’s work (and other dark enlightenment people) is their insights into how realpolitics works in the modern era, their ability to draw a historical continuum, and develop theory (remember, the press called NRX the “intellectual current of the alt right”).
Yarvin’s patchwork meme ideology never really gained traction the same way his analysis of the Cathedral did, and for good reason; he’s great at describing problems, but his prescriptions for them generally suck.

Nobody “abandoned” NRX thought, but people took the foundations of the analytical frame of what “is” and went their own way from there, disregarding Moldbug’s “oughts” because he is a subversive blue tribe elitist jew by nature. (He got a lot of flak for his “overturning roe v Wade is actually bad” hot-take.)

nowadays the movement I’d say is most accurately termed as “post-NRX” since most of the followers of Moldbug have moved *beyond* Moldbug and started to read the people who influenced him in the first place: primary sources like Hoppe, de Maistre, Mosca, Carlyle, et al. Most of them congregate on YouTube and Twitterspace - some of the prominent ones have substacks.

>>22389614
kek

>>22384475
Heh, that's a cool historical tidbit I'd never heard of. I guess that guy was a royalist too. That lines up with the Puritan vs Pagan political topology eerily well

>>22389399
>channel focused on Moldbug
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLdn36Wooon2zcElSdDGiLGpC5Hi2j5kif

Yarvin and Land are completely different. Yarvin believes in monarchy and central control. Land believes in patchwork and Exit. They just totally split in different directions

>>22389931
Any twitters or substacks you recommend?

>>22390151
>Land believes

>>22390687
Speaking of, what does Land believe nowadays? Other than fatalistic-AI singularity mono-consciousness, he said he doesn't remember half the stuff he wrote during the years. What are his views now and what's his relation to NRx?

>>22389945
Saved!

>>22379364
This aint /pol/. If you’re interested in politics then read Greek, English, French , German etc philosophy.

>Political philosophy and economics
Plato, Aristotle, Smith, Bakunin, Hugo, Marx, Lenin, Hegel, Kant..

>>22390895
how is NRx not politics

>>22390895
>Bakunin
Kek'd
If you'll be reading leftistslop at least read someone like Bordiga instead of stupid anarchists

>>22379364
>moldbug
can't stand this pseud.

>>22390895
im trans btw

Evola is more interesting, a better writer, and far more based.

>>22389940
he quite literally calls the Americas and Canaan and those who live within it Canaanites. It's a cool tidbit.

>>22390687
So he believes nothing? Maybe that's when I've never been able to into him. It just seems like clever word salad

>>22389931
link some substacks

>>22390600
>>22391298

https://[name].substack.com
>Ndexia
>Endeavour
>Forbiddentexts
>werkat
>fiddlersgreene
>millennialwoes
>morgoth
>charlemagne
>oldgloryclub
>theprudentialist
>auronmacintyre

and of course
>graymirror

Some of these aren’t strictly NRX but are adjacent to that train of thought. I don’t use Twitter but most of the ones I listed have one

>>22391441
>nrx blogosphere

>>22391441
ty for effortposting, I'll check 'em out

>>22389614
Confirmed as an illiterate. You don’t know what “proponent” means.

>>22387820
This is the best level of debate NRx fags can muster.

>>22391441
All these guys just traffick in the same ideas that have been circulating around the alt-right since at least 2016. This shit is like pornography for political reactionaries. You’ll feel like you’re an informed political agent, but eventually you realize this shit is shallow and fake and while you’ve been mentally masturbating with online politics, lefties were engaging with politics for real in the real world. That’s why NRx and all this shit is a total dead end.

>>22389931
>he’s great at describing problems, but his prescriptions for them generally suck.
always been my take on him as well
>He got a lot of flak for his “overturning roe v Wade is actually bad” hot-take
fwiw I think it's right that RvW was overturned but I think the conservative fixation on abortion is impractical and counter-productive. It's an easy issue for voters to get virtuous about but it doesn't really do anything for the health of the nation. Same with gay marriage tbqh.

>>22391541
If the right abandoned its hard line stance on abortion there would be no reason to vote for the right. That would complete the transformation into “the left, but slower” and asking “what is there left to conserve” would not only be legitimate but necessary.

>>22391525
You missed the point of NRx completely if you think its here to engage in "politics" when if doing so will only validate the existence of the Cathedral rather than resetting it
>lefties were engaging with politics
You're fooled by the Cathedral into thinking any of it is "politics". Cathedral politics are just a circlejerk over what's the next most "problematic" thing to be "deeply concerned" about.

NRx is anti-political pragmatism, thats the whole point.

>>22381864
>The book is actually about a civilizational battle between Aryanism and Judeo-Christianity.

There really needs to be a new word to replace "Judeo-Christianity" because it's so fucking forced from the top-down. Even "Antichristianity" or "Nimrodism" would be better.

I get that Heisman doesn't consider ultra orthodox Jews or traditional Christians as actual contenders, but it's still such a clumsy term.

>>22391525
>lefties were engaging with politics for real in the real world
Not really, they are mostly being tooled by bankers, media jews, the Democrat party and silicon valley technocrats.

Media shouts "fire" in the vacinity of leftoids and points at vague "far right" boogeymen. There's no actual fire, but Leftoids hallucinate it and get busy dousing the imaginary fire (in fact random normalfag literal hitlers just going about their daily business.). So "politics" for the rest of us becomes just urgently trying to get the insane delusional leftists to stop causing water damage everywhere, while ruling caste continues to rape and pillage whatever they want.

>>22391525
>All these guys just traffick in the same ideas that have been circulating around the alt-right since at least 2016
I didn't see these ideas in 2016. 2016 alt right was full on wignattery. It has evolved a lot since. nrx being its intellectual wing

conflict theory is objectively true. Biden out time, who writes this shit

>>22392399
Who do you think writes for the New York Times and implements policy for the Department of State? If you want a hint, it’s not Curtis Yarvin, Morgoth, or any of the people who read and listen to their shit.

>>22391634
Enjoy your intellectual circle jerk pretending to be anti-political while you obsess over real politics. This is mainly why NRx is not only retarded but pathetic.

>>22392401
They were there. I was a college student in 2016 and Nick Land, NRx, and especially HVD stuff were all over the internet. It was just drowned out by volume of mainstream WN and MAGA shit.

>>22391624
Maybe this is because you don't really understand the stakes in real terms.
>That would complete the transformation into “the left, but slower”
This still matters.
If you glide into a brick wall at 2mph you'll bump and stop safely. If you collide at 80 mph you'll pancake and die instantly.
More importantly you're still falling for the frame. As if standing firm and hard on a pointless issue just for the sake of some obscure principle of unbending stubborness isn't foolish. While you're clinging to abortion, nobody on the left has been held accountable for the BLM riots they promoted during 2020. None of the prestige media who lied and manipulated the story have suffered anything. The last remnants of American Justice was barely able to prevent corrupt leftists from making Kenosha Kyle a political prisoner for life.

Another round of elections are coming. What do you think the left is going to pull this time? In 2016 they incited minor incidents at Trump rallies that the Media used to associate the campaign with violence and chaos (meanwhile there was actual rioting at the DNC that media did not cover). In 2020 they burned hundreds of buildings in Minneapolis and incited riots across the country. I'm not excited to discover what they have in store for 2024 given how little conservatives even seem to be fucking aware of this kind of thing.

Anyway, sorry this is in fact derailing into actual politics and as others have stated NRX has always been more about philosophy and ideas (which in part requires acceptance of present truth and reality)

>>22392433
Yeah and what do you propose be done about it?
>Just start your own New York Times bro
The left-wing equivalent to NRX bloggers isn't extremely well-connected influencers at the NY Times.

>>22392433
>>22392439

You're saying that as if any of that shit matters

The cathedral creates its own problems so it can then provide its own mind-virus zombie followers to fix it, to perpetuate its existence. Its this existence that makes our lives awful, not lack of NRx people in these positions of power

In fact, trying to change the system from inside is what will make you eventually fail, its what Moldbug writes about. You're no true reactionary either

No more politics. No more political solutions. Only a hard reset.