/lit/ - Literature

>>22263944
Jan Assmann

>>22263944
>needs a book

>>22264009
The Price of Monotheism?

>>22263944

>>22264016
That's a follow up to Moses the Egyptian.

>>22263944
>Books against Christianity
The Christian Bible desu.

>>22263944
You haven't even read Antichrist, you are just butthurt from talking to atheists on /his/ that are more intellectual than you

>>22263944
Look no further, my dude.

thinking that nietzsche was against christianity is peak hylic. try reading him again, but this time don't put words in his mouth.

>>22264021
Did it make you respect the Jews more?

>>22264041
I've read it several times.

>>22263944
Some Mistakes of Moses by Ingersoll

>>22264049
>Did it make you respect the Jews more?
Is this the criterion for a piece of literature being good?

>>22264057
Or bad; who knows. I just saw that this guy has a tom of medals and prizes so it has to be that way.

>>22263944
>Books against Christianity Anonymous
There are ancient books critiquing Christianity but frankly the average heresy from years 100-450 is basically as interesting and probably more logically instructive than your average Christian critique. Palegianism is more fascinating than anything else.

>>22264111
Nietzsche does an amazing job at destroying it. I was hoping there was another mind like him that's more recent.

>>22264149
Freud and Assmann
>>22264064
Why are you afraid to read a book, are you so malleable you need to wear a helmet?

>>22264160
>Why are you afraid to read a book, are you so malleable you need to wear a helmet?
Gloves.

>>22264160
>Freud and Assmann
Freud did help but it wasn't his books but secondary sources. Reading directly from him would require gloves as well.

>>22264172
If you're afraid of being contaminated by words you're retarded. There's no shame in being retarded but there is in trying to read above your level. It's not cute past a certain age.

>>22264192
>above your level
Below.

>If you're afraid of being contaminated by words you're retarded

If you underestimate the power of the word you're the slow one. Infected without even knowing.
If you knew you'd know that one has to write at twice the rate that one reads.

>>22264216
If you are too stupid to read without adopting every idea presented to you then you are chandala

>>22264111
>Pelagianism
>Interesting
Seriously? One of the most irritating parts of nearly every Christian heresy is how they simplify theology in order to avoid tackling the incomprehensible ideas of the trinity and original sin. Even the wacky /lit/-brand Gnosticism that people around here subscribe to makes much more sense to the average person than the trinity, which is why it's so easy to trick people who are over confident in their ability to discern the truth into latching onto it. This leads one to the realization that, if the church were really so desperate to just get people in the door, they would reform Christology entirely and adopt every dumb heresy under the sun. It is much, much easier to tell people that they're not tainted by original sin, or that in the case of modalism, that God is merely like water, expressed in three modes, being solid, liquid, and gas, and so on. This brings in the numbers, this brings in the money, and we know this by observing churches which preach Prosperity theology. What is much more difficult in degrees is telling people that a man, who is the Logos, was eternally begotten of his Father, yet is one with his Father, and is fully and truly human and divine simultaneously, and it was, with the help of the Holy Spirit (which proceeds both from the Father and the Son), through his birth by a virgin, that he became human, all so he could die for the sins of mankind, yet he was resurrected three days later (by doing so breaking the chains of death), and ascended into heaven to be seated at the right hand of his Father, yet despite all of this, God is but one ousia in three hypostases.

Pelagianism, by asserting that man is not tainted by original sin, removes the need for salvation entirely, which by extension denies the son, and by further extension, the trinity. Pelagianism, despite not appearing to be a Christological heresy in itself, becomes one by ignoring the very prophecies which Jesus came to fulfill.
>Luke 24:44-47 And he said to them: These are the words which I spoke to you, while I was yet with you, that all things must needs be fulfilled, which are written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. Then he opened their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures. And he said to them: Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise again from the dead, the third day: And that penance and remission of sins should be preached in his name, unto all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
>John 5:46-47 For if you did believe Moses, you would perhaps believe me also; for he wrote of me. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?

>>22264300
>i-it's not obscurantist gibberish it's just 2deep4u
if you're going to do monotheism the Muslims have you cornered with the one god one prophet thing (no need for three persons, that's obvious polytheism carried over from the Greek theology Christians looted), and no country has ever reversed from Islam back to Christianity unless the Muslims were militarily defeated

>>22264322
>that's obvious polytheism carried over from the Greek theology Christians looted
Please, for the love of God, read the Bible.
>if you're going to do monotheism the Muslims have you cornered with the one god one prophet thing
I doubt you've even read the Qur'an; you don't even understand the Muslim stance on this. But once again, a boring simplification, and a really funny one considering:
>Surah 5:68 "Say, O People of the Scripture! Ye have naught (of guidance) till ye observe the Torah and the Gospel and that which was revealed unto you from your Lord. That which is revealed unto thee (Muhammad) from thy Lord is certain to increase the contumacy and disbelief of many of them. But grieve not for the disbelieving folk."

So, I suppose the true Torah and Gospels have been eradicated? Or else, why do they ignore the teachings of the Gospels and the words of Jesus the prophet?
>John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
>John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
>Exodus 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
>John 8:57-58 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I AM.
>John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
>John 8:23-23 Then said the Jews, Will he kill himself? because he saith, Whither I go, ye cannot come. And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
>John 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?
>1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
>Colossians 2:8-9 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
>Titus 2:11-14 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.

Regardless, you've done a good job of ignoring the meat of what I said for some weak gotcha, so I guess I'm just "giving that which is holy unto the dogs". But no, orthodox Christology is not "cornered" by the Muslims "with the one God one Prophet thing". There is only one God, true, but that's the god of three persons in one substance. Muslims do not worship God.

>>22264238
Someone got offended.

>>22264516
>the god of three persons in one substance
This is only necessary for you because you have to fit together a hellenized people with an anti-pagan religion, Yahweh doesn't have a murdered son who rises from the dead and serves everyone wine, that's Dionysus. The Muslims can simply declare all of that superseded, just as your own theologians declared the religion of the "old" testament. It is telling the viable alternatives to Christianity are today atheism (the god of monotheism being unbelievable) and Islam (the god of monotheism returning with less deliberate gibberish and a streamlined nomad war-machine of a theology)

dawkins, carl sagan

>>22264557
Good on you for admitting it.

>>22264575
Isn't Dawkins a humanist? Does he know that it's basically Christianity?

>>22264612
You got sand in your cunt still? Let it go man.

>>22264626
>i can only read texts blessed by an ideological authority
small-souled bugman

>>22264641
Blessed by me.

>>22264149
>Nietzsche does an amazing job at destroying it.
Unfortunately not. Nietzsche is just cruel and in contradictions. He is not really a philosophy but more a poet of bad theology which is assuredly provocative and interesting at times but he doesn't dismantle Christianity as frankly he never understood it.
>>22264300
I'm not a pelagian nor a heretic but merely pointing out that discussions of heresies is far more interesting than discussions of Nietzsche who tends to rely on supposedly "contraversial" takes and contradiction. Nietzsche doesn't have much to offer other than a feeling of superiority, in my estimation and personal experience, whereas doctrinal and dogmatic debates are wildly interesting and insightful.

>>22264558
>Yahweh doesn't have a murdered son who rises from the dead and serves everyone wine, that's Dionysus
But he has a prophet who lies and says He is the son of God, right? Isn't that problematic Christ is recognized as a legitimate prophet and a liar?

>>22265127
You sound like a golden retriever. You live with blinders on like all christcucks.

>>22265132
Jesus is an even greater lie than the lie of God. It's the ultimate lie, because to follow Jesus is to deny reality, to slander nature and life, that at least to follow a wrathful and tyrannical Jewish God gives you a heads up at how brutal life can be, but to follow the faggot Christ completely reverses the world - he doesn't save you, he murders you - there is no more malicious a lie - your murderer disguised as your savior.

>>22265292
Is this an insult or an argument?
>>22265319
See - it's obvious you think you "understand" but look at your sentences.
>Jesus is an even greater lie than the lie of God.
These parts of Christianity are wrong
>It's the ultimate lie,
It's wrong
>because to follow Jesus is to deny reality, to slander nature and life,
Saying it's a lie again
>that at least to follow a wrathful and tyrannical Jewish God gives you a heads up at how brutal life can be, but to follow the faggot Christ completely reverses the world
Christianity is wrong again
> - he doesn't save you, he murders you -
-
This is just saying that life is truth and that Christianity is a lie
>there is no more malicious a lie - your murderer disguised as your savior.
Same thing twice. I am reminder of the Psalm, "In the pride of his countenance the wicked does not seek him; /all his thoughts are, “There is no God.”" I am not calling you wicked but you just wrote the sentence "Christianity is wrong," 6-7 times with slightly different words.

After reading Nietzsche’s critique of Christianity you end up in one of a few places. Either you realize that the critique was flawed and Christianity might be literally true but there are nonetheless problems in which case you end up with Heidegger, or you accept that both Nietzsche and Heidegger had flawed critiques and you return to Christian little o orthodoxy, or you accept Nietzsche’s critique wholesale like an unthinking idiot and you move on to some sort of Muslim, orientalist, neopagan, or perennialism delusion. I’ve done all three.

>>22265319
>at least to follow God gives you a heads up at how brutal life can be
>but to follow Christ completely reverses the world
If you'd remove yourself from the bubble you've made for yourself, you'd realize that you're talking about the same exact God here. What are you getting at? You argue like a bitter Jew, but I'd be interested in how you think believing in God, or specifically YHWH, slanders nature and life, because as I see it, you're just trying to sound grandiose, rather than say anything of actual substance. To start, reading the Bible should help you to understand what Christians actually believe, because as I said, it seems like you've formed a bubble around yourself of all these misconceptions and outright lies, and unfortunately, you've begun to believe them. But yes, in a way, following Christ does completely reverse the world, in that transfigures dogs into sons of God, and transforms those who were "called into the adoption of sons" into dogs.
>John 1:11-12 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, he gave them power to be made the sons of God, to them that believe in his name.